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Message no. 1
From: The Digital Mage <mn3rge@****.AC.UK>
Subject: Ork Underground
Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 21:22:02 +0100
Those of you in the UK will know what I'm talking about when I say that
wouldn't it be cool to model teh ork underground off Neil Gaiman's
Neverwhere?

All with little fiefdoms, ratspeakers and so forth.... :)


The Digital Mage : mn3rge@****.ac.uk
"Life is a choice, Death....an obligation."-Me
Shadowrun WWW site at http://www.bath.ac.uk/~mn3rge/Shadowrun
Message no. 2
From: A Halliwell <u5a77@**.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Ork Underground
Date: Tue, 15 Oct 1996 13:47:56 +0100
|
|Those of you in the UK will know what I'm talking about when I say that
|wouldn't it be cool to model teh ork underground off Neil Gaiman's
|Neverwhere?
|
|All with little fiefdoms, ratspeakers and so forth.... :)

Hmmmmmm.
I keep missing that. I saw the first 3 and then.....
--
______________________________________________________________________________
|u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk | |
|Andrew Halliwell | "ARSE! GERLS!! DRINK! DRINK! DRINK!!!" |
|Principal subjects in:-| "THAT WOULD BE AN ECCLESIASTICAL MATTER!...FECK!!!!|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | - Father Jack in "Father Ted"
|
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ 5++ |
|X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! >*SULK*<|
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Message no. 3
From: GRANITE <granite@**.NET>
Subject: Re: Ork Underground
Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 02:03:29 -0700
The Digital Mage wrote:
> Those of you in the UK will know what I'm talking about when I say that
> wouldn't it be cool to model teh ork underground off Neil Gaiman's
> Neverwhere?
> All with little fiefdoms, ratspeakers and so forth.... :)

Can't say as I know what your talking about..But did you know the
underground is a real place in Seatle...Unfortunately..The one time I was
in seatle I didn't..Hell It was before I knew anything about SR
either..However, I read an article in a Mag called Heartland all about
the underground in Seatle..It has been a while since I read it but..It
had something to do with raising the streets so folks could safely walk
fron place to place..or some such and eventually they raised the
sidewalks too..Sealing shops and such underground..They give tours..I
think they start out at a pub and then give a 2 hour tour..I will have to
look the article up..

--
-------------------------------GRANITE
=================================================================
Lord, Grant Me The Serinity To Accept The Things I Cannot Change,
The Courage To Change The Things I Can,
And The Wisdom To Hide The Bodies Of Those People I Had To Kill
Because They Pissed Me Off.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ShadowRunner's Serinity Prayer
Message no. 4
From: The Digital Mage <mn3rge@****.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Ork Underground
Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 15:20:39 +0100
On Thu, 17 Oct 1996, GRANITE wrote:

> The Digital Mage wrote:
> > Those of you in the UK will know what I'm talking about when I say that
> > wouldn't it be cool to model teh ork underground off Neil Gaiman's
> > Neverwhere?
> > All with little fiefdoms, ratspeakers and so forth.... :)
>
> Can't say as I know what your talking about..But did you know the
> underground is a real place in Seatle...

Yes I did, I first encountered it in that wonderful film The Night
Strangler (sequal to the Nightstalker :)

The Digital Mage : mn3rge@****.ac.uk
"Life is a choice, Death....an obligation."-Me
Shadowrun WWW site at http://www.bath.ac.uk/~mn3rge/Shadowrun
Message no. 5
From: Mike Buckalew <mike_buckalew@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Ork Underground
Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 12:20:10 -0700
Granite said
>Can't say as I know what your talking about..But did you know the
>underground is a real place in Seatle...Unfortunately..The one time I was

Hey, there's a really cool old episode of "The Night Stalker", the one
with the reporter Kolchak who always ends up hunting down supernatural
villains, where they go to Seattle's Underground. I forget what sort of
monster he was chasing, but I do remember it was a totally cool setting.
I wonder why we haven't seen more of this.


Buck
(Mike Buckalew)
buck@******.com

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Message no. 6
From: A Halliwell <u5a77@**.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Ork Underground
Date: Thu, 17 Oct 1996 20:29:48 +0100
|
|Granite said
|>Can't say as I know what your talking about..But did you know the
|>underground is a real place in Seatle...Unfortunately..The one time I was
|
|Hey, there's a really cool old episode of "The Night Stalker", the one
|with the reporter Kolchak who always ends up hunting down supernatural
|villains, where they go to Seattle's Underground. I forget what sort of
|monster he was chasing, but I do remember it was a totally cool setting.
|I wonder why we haven't seen more of this.

It was the bloke who had to kill people for their glands every 20 years in
order to create a new batch of elixyr or youth. (If memory serves).

Oh, and it was called "The night strangler".

The sequal to the original film.

(I'm not sure if this was before the series was made or after though...)

--
______________________________________________________________________________
|u5a77@**.keele.ac.uk | |
|Andrew Halliwell | "ARSE! GERLS!! DRINK! DRINK! DRINK!!!" |
|Principal subjects in:-| "THAT WOULD BE AN ECCLESIASTICAL MATTER!...FECK!!!!|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | - Father Jack in "Father Ted"
|
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ 5++ |
|X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! >*SULK*<|
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 7
From: Loki <loki@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: Ork Underground
Date: Fri, 18 Oct 1996 11:26:00 -0700
> Can't say as I know what your talking about..But did you know the
> underground is a real place in Seatle...Unfortunately..The one time I was
> in seatle I didn't..Hell It was before I knew anything about SR
> either..However, I read an article in a Mag called Heartland all about
> the underground in Seatle..It has been a while since I read it but..It
> had something to do with raising the streets so folks could safely walk
> fron place to place..or some such and eventually they raised the
> sidewalks too..Sealing shops and such underground..They give tours..I
> think they start out at a pub and then give a 2 hour tour..I will have to
> look the article up..

Been on the tour a couple of times. At first the streets were raised above
the sidewalks and shops to help with flooding and such. The when a massive
fire hit, followed by some flooding and areas sinking into the mud, they
just built a new Seattle over the top of the old. Presto, underground city.

It's pretty cool, and can give you some serious ideas for you ork
underground in the game. Check out the tour if you have a chance.

@>-,--'--- Loki

CLARKE'S THIRD LAW:
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.

*********************************************
Poisoned Elves
http://www.netzone.com/~loki/
*********************************************
Message no. 8
From: dhinkley@***.ORG
Subject: Re: Ork Underground
Date: Thu, 24 Oct 1996 11:58:06 +0000
> Date: Fri, 18 Oct 1996 11:26:00 -0700
> From: Loki <loki@*******.COM>
> Subject: Re: Ork Underground

[Snip]

>
> Been on the tour a couple of times. At first the streets were raised above
> the sidewalks and shops to help with flooding and such. The when a massive
> fire hit, followed by some flooding and areas sinking into the mud, they
> just built a new Seattle over the top of the old. Presto, underground city.
>
> It's pretty cool, and can give you some serious ideas for you ork
> underground in the game. Check out the tour if you have a chance.
>
A friend visting Seattle picked up a tourist ad pamphlet on the tours
of Seattle underground. I doesnt have a lot of information but the
little it does have is of intrest. The pamphlet implys that the
underground is located in the Pioneer Square Area. The tour starts at Doc
Mynards Public House 610 1st Street. ThePioneer Square area is
between South King and Yesler Way and Alaskan Way and 2nd Street.
It would definatly be a interesting area to game in execpt for one small
problem, FASA put the Renracku Arcology there. This creates a
interesting conflict as the discription of the Ork Underground on
page 23 of Seattle Sourcebook implies that the Seattle underground
is where the Ork Underground started. The Text reads:

"The Seattle underground first came into being in the 19th century
when a wave of renovation paved over sections of the city. I was not
until this century that the city's first Orks, Trolls and Dwarfs
[sic] took control of the forgotten basements and paved over
streets,..." ( page 23, Seattle Sourcebook, FASA, 1990)

This sounds like the discriptions and pictures of the underground
that are included in the pamphlet and in other discriptions reported
on the list. This invites the question did FASA move the underground
and if so where or was the oridginal stating point of the Ork
underground distroyed by the construction of the arcology's 20
basement levels? Any thoughts?



David Hinkley
dhinkley@***.org
******************************************************
They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a
little temporary safety deserve niether liberty or
safety.
Ben Franklin
Message no. 9
From: Sven De Herdt Sven.DeHerdt@***********.be
Subject: ORK Underground.
Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 11:10:46 +0100
I am GM-ing a team of 4 ork players and they all have their backgrounds
linked to Ork underground.

When looking for further information I only found that there are 22
known entrances and a bunch of secret passage ways. However only 2
entrances were actually mentioned, one of them being 'Big Rhino's'.

Can anyone tell me if the other 20 public passage ways are specified
somewhere or is this up to the GM discretion?

Sven ;-)
Message no. 10
From: Tommy Lindner tommy.lindner@*******.de
Subject: ORK Underground.
Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 13:38:20 +0100
> Can anyone tell me if the other 20 public passage ways are specified
> somewhere or is this up to the GM discretion?

Read the "never trust an Elf" novel again, there is a lot of information in
the middle part when Kham hides there. You find info about the leader and I
guess some on the structure as well. Also the DNA/DNO adventure contained
some info about OU + some entrances. I remeber one at the Tacoma docks.

Hope that helps
Tommy
Message no. 11
From: Paul Gettle RunnerPaul@*****.com
Subject: ORK Underground.
Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 10:49:06 -0500
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

At 11:10 AM 2/12/99 +0100, Sven De Herdt wrote:
>I am GM-ing a team of 4 ork players and they all have their
backgrounds
>linked to Ork underground.
>
>When looking for further information I only found that there are 22
>known entrances and a bunch of secret passage ways. However only 2
>entrances were actually mentioned, one of them being 'Big Rhino's'.
>
>Can anyone tell me if the other 20 public passage ways are specified
>somewhere or is this up to the GM discretion?

There's an entrance from a Renraku Arcology Parking Garage, but
depending on if you use FASA's timeline and what timeframe your game
is set in, it really isn't an option. (Besides, even before the Arc
locked it's doors, I'm not sure if it would count as a "Known
Entrance" or a "Secret Passageway")

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--
-- Paul Gettle, #970 of 1000 (RunnerPaul@*****.com)
PGP Fingerprint, Key ID:0x48F3AACD (RSA 1024, created 98/06/26)
C260 94B3 6722 6A25 63F8 0690 9EA2 3344
Message no. 12
From: Mark A Shieh SHODAN+@***.EDU
Subject: ORK Underground.
Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 14:59:53 -0500 (EST)
Paul Gettle <RunnerPaul@*****.com> writes:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>
> At 11:10 AM 2/12/99 +0100, Sven De Herdt wrote:
> >I am GM-ing a team of 4 ork players and they all have their
> backgrounds
> >linked to Ork underground.
> >
> >When looking for further information I only found that there are 22
> >known entrances and a bunch of secret passage ways. However only 2
> >entrances were actually mentioned, one of them being 'Big Rhino's'.

New Seattle, p. 58

"Many entrances lead to the Underground's maze of tunnels,
basements and chamgers. The only safe ones ... the basement of the
old Seattle Utilities Building, inside the Big Rhino Restaurant, and
in the basement of Lordstrung's Department Store on 5th and Pine."

> >Can anyone tell me if the other 20 public passage ways are specified
> >somewhere or is this up to the GM discretion?

I'd say it's heavy GM discretion. You might be able to dig up
more passageways listed in novels and adventures, but as Paul points
out, there's no way for anyone to really know whether it's a known
entrance or a secret entrance.

> There's an entrance from a Renraku Arcology Parking Garage, but
> depending on if you use FASA's timeline and what timeframe your game
> is set in, it really isn't an option. (Besides, even before the Arc
> locked it's doors, I'm not sure if it would count as a "Known
> Entrance" or a "Secret Passageway")

Mark
Message no. 13
From: Gurth gurth@******.nl
Subject: ORK Underground.
Date: Sat, 13 Feb 1999 13:34:08 +0100
According to Sven De Herdt, at 11:10 on 12 Feb 99, the word on
the street was...

> I am GM-ing a team of 4 ork players and they all have their backgrounds
> linked to Ork underground.
>
> When looking for further information I only found that there are 22
> known entrances and a bunch of secret passage ways. However only 2
> entrances were actually mentioned, one of them being 'Big Rhino's'.

And the other one? The main characters in one of the novels go into the
Ork Underground, but I don't remember if it's actually mentioned where
they enter it. There's also the one (rumored to be) in the Renraku
Arcology's basement.

> Can anyone tell me if the other 20 public passage ways are specified
> somewhere or is this up to the GM discretion?

GM's discretion, IMO. Just keep them in the area of the Underground, which
is mostly below downtown Seattle (the SR1 rulebook had a rough map that
could be compared to the downtown street map to show exactly where the
Underground is).

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
If it's no use pretending, then I don't want to know.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
->The Plastic Warriors Page: http://shadowrun.html.com/plasticwarriors/<-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

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Further Reading

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