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Message no. 1
From: gurth@******.nl (Gurth)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 2006 21:38:03 +0100
This is OT, I know, but I just came across this when browsing the web
site of UK game store, Spirit Games:
http://www.spiritgames.co.uk/rpgsin.php?UniqueNo€8

That is to say: Cyberpunk 2020 v3.0, noted as "in stock" and with a
cover that doesn't look like the old 2nd edition from almost 15 years
ago at all (it actually reminds me of first edition Traveller books ...)
so what I'm wondering is whether this is actually the long-promised
Fuzion-powered game, or a simple repackaging of 2nd edition? Talsorian's
own site doesn't even mention it, so I thought maybe someone here is
more clued-in than I am :)

--
Gurth@******.nl - Stone Age: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Years come three for the price of one.
-> Former NAGEE Editor & ShadowRN GridSec * Triangle Virtuoso <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Site: http://plastic.dumpshock.com <-

GC3.12: GAT/! d- s:- !a>? C++(---) UB+ P(+) L++ E W++(--) N o? K w-- O
M+ PS+ PE@ Y PGP- t- 5++ X(+) R+++$ tv+(++) b++@ DI- D G+ e h! !r y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 2
From: gurth@******.nl (Gurth)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 2006 21:41:15 +0100
According to Gurth, on 28-1-06 21:38 the word on the street was...

> Talsorian's
> own site doesn't even mention it, so I thought maybe someone here is
> more clued-in than I am :)

Sorry, slight correction: I just saw that it does -- but not on the
CP2020 page as you'd expect, only in the News section (which, naturally,
I don't check if I'm looking for news on the CP2020 front :)

--
Gurth@******.nl - Stone Age: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Years come three for the price of one.
-> Former NAGEE Editor & ShadowRN GridSec * Triangle Virtuoso <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Site: http://plastic.dumpshock.com <-

GC3.12: GAT/! d- s:- !a>? C++(---) UB+ P(+) L++ E W++(--) N o? K w-- O
M+ PS+ PE@ Y PGP- t- 5++ X(+) R+++$ tv+(++) b++@ DI- D G+ e h! !r y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 3
From: u.alberton@*****.com (Bira)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 2006 19:58:55 -0200
2006/1/28, Gurth <gurth@******.nl>:
> That is to say: Cyberpunk 2020 v3.0, noted as "in stock" and with a
> cover that doesn't look like the old 2nd edition from almost 15 years
> ago at all (it actually reminds me of first edition Traveller books ...)
> so what I'm wondering is whether this is actually the long-promised
> Fuzion-powered game, or a simple repackaging of 2nd edition? Talsorian's
> own site doesn't even mention it, so I thought maybe someone here is
> more clued-in than I am :)

Cyberpunk v.3 (I think they dropped the 2020) is the new
Fuzion-powered version. I didn't actually buy it or read it, but it
has been getting a lot of mixed reviews, mainly because of the art.

Judging from the comments, it seems to be a pretty solid game, altough
the setting is quite different from that of the previous edition. The
difference seems to be larger than the one from SR3 to SR4.


--
Bira
http://compexplicita.blogspot.com
http://sinfoniaferida.blogspot.com
Message no. 4
From: anders@**********.com (Anders Swenson)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 2006 14:59:56 -0800
On Sat, 28 Jan 2006 21:38:03 +0100
Gurth <gurth@******.nl> wrote:
> This is OT, I know, but I just came across this when browsing the web site
> of UK game store, Spirit Games:
> http://www.spiritgames.co.uk/rpgsin.php?UniqueNo€8
>
> That is to say: Cyberpunk 2020 v3.0, noted as "in stock" and with a cover
> that doesn't look like the old 2nd edition from almost 15 years ago at all
> (it actually reminds me of first edition Traveller books ...) so what I'm
> wondering is whether this is actually the long-promised Fuzion-powered
> game, or a simple repackaging of 2nd edition? Talsorian's own site doesn't
> even mention it, so I thought maybe someone here is more clued-in than I am
> :)
>
I have a copy, any questions I cn answer?
--Anders
> Gurth@******.nl - Stone Age: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
> Years come three for the price of one.
> -> Former NAGEE Editor & ShadowRN GridSec * Triangle Virtuoso <-
> -> The Plastic Warriors Site: http://plastic.dumpshock.com <-
>
> GC3.12: GAT/! d- s:- !a>? C++(---) UB+ P(+) L++ E W++(--) N o? K w-- O
> M+ PS+ PE@ Y PGP- t- 5++ X(+) R+++$ tv+(++) b++@ DI- D G+ e h! !r y?
> Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 5
From: maxnoel_fr@*****.fr (Max Noel)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 00:43:56 +0100
On 28 Jan 2006, at 23:59, Anders Swenson wrote:

> I have a copy, any questions I cn answer?
> --Anders

There was a CPv3 preview somewhere on the 'Net a while ago, and
something about it made me think it was actually some sort of April's
Fools joke: all of its artwork consisted of photographs of GI Joe/
Action Man/[however you call them] action figures.

Is that the case in the actual book? (and if so, who the hell thought
this would be a better idea than no artwork at all?)

-- Wild_Cat





___________________________________________________________________________
Nouveau : téléphonez moins cher avec Yahoo! Messenger ! Découvez les
tarifs exceptionnels pour appeler la France et l'international.
Téléchargez sur http://fr.messenger.yahoo.com
Message no. 6
From: bulletraven@***********.com (Peter Mellett)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 2006 23:51:29 +0000
Max Noel wrote:
>
> On 28 Jan 2006, at 23:59, Anders Swenson wrote:
>
>> I have a copy, any questions I cn answer?
>> --Anders
>
> There was a CPv3 preview somewhere on the 'Net a while ago, and
> something about it made me think it was actually some sort of April's
> Fools joke: all of its artwork consisted of photographs of GI
> Joe/Action Man/[however you call them] action figures.
>
> Is that the case in the actual book? (and if so, who the hell thought
> this would be a better idea than no artwork at all?)
>
> -- Wild_Cat
>
>
>
>
>
> ___________________________________________________________________________Nouveau
> : téléphonez moins cher avec Yahoo! Messenger ! Découvez les
tarifs
> exceptionnels pour appeler la France et l'international.
> Téléchargez sur http://fr.messenger.yahoo.com
>
>
Unfortunately this is apparently so.

Sad times

-Pete
Message no. 7
From: ClassifiedTSBBR@*****.net.nz (Classified TS/BBR)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 13:02:17 +1300
----- Original Message -----
From: "Gurth" <gurth@******.nl>
To: "Shadowrun Discussion" <shadowrn@*****.dumpshock.com>
Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 9:41 AM
Subject: Re: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?


> According to Gurth, on 28-1-06 21:38 the word on the street was...
>
>> Talsorian's own site doesn't even mention it, so I thought maybe someone
>> here is more clued-in than I am :)
>
> Sorry, slight correction: I just saw that it does -- but not on the CP2020
> page as you'd expect, only in the News section (which, naturally, I don't
> check if I'm looking for news on the CP2020 front :)
>

Note that it _is not_ CP2020 any more than CP2020(v2.0) was CP2013(v1.0)

CP v3.0 is the long-promised 3rd edition & update of the timeline to after
the 4th Corporate War & CyberGeneration 2e.

Whilst I haven't seen it myself yet, the official description back when I
last looked at "what it was going to be" was very, perhaps excessively
transhumanist rather than Cyberpunk (IMAO).

That, the decision to use Fuzion, & the wait for the product means I
probably won't get around to looking at it until the corebook is offered as
a freebie at DTR (not that I want to rip RTG off, I'll pay for it's
worthwhile, but I don't expect it to be).
Message no. 8
From: gurth@******.nl (Gurth)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 11:15:03 +0100
According to Classified TS/BBR, on 29-1-06 01:02 the word on the street
was...

> Note that it _is not_ CP2020 any more than CP2020(v2.0) was CP2013(v1.0)

True, but it's still odd that Talsorian didn't update their web site to
reflect this. If you go to http://www.talsorian.com and click on the
Cyberpunk link on the left, you'll get a picture of the CP2020 cover and
text that could refer to any edition, but most likely to second.

> CP v3.0 is the long-promised 3rd edition & update of the timeline to
> after the 4th Corporate War & CyberGeneration 2e.

That's what I thought, but it's been so long since it was announced (I
think I've mentioned once that I played a demo of it in 1997 ...) that I
figured I'd ask before I check it out, to make sure :)

> That, the decision to use Fuzion, & the wait for the product means I
> probably won't get around to looking at it until the corebook is offered
> as a freebie at DTR (not that I want to rip RTG off, I'll pay for it's
> worthwhile, but I don't expect it to be).

I'll probably buy a copy, but I must say that what's been said on this
list so far doesn't sound too encouraging ...

--
Gurth@******.nl - Stone Age: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Years come three for the price of one.
-> Former NAGEE Editor & ShadowRN GridSec * Triangle Virtuoso <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Site: http://plastic.dumpshock.com <-

GC3.12: GAT/! d- s:- !a>? C++(---) UB+ P(+) L++ E W++(--) N o? K w-- O
M+ PS+ PE@ Y PGP- t- 5++ X(+) R+++$ tv+(++) b++@ DI- D G+ e h! !r y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 9
From: gurth@******.nl (Gurth)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 11:15:34 +0100
According to Anders Swenson, on 28-1-06 23:59 the word on the street was...

> I have a copy, any questions I cn answer?

I'm just looking for general impressions, I guess -- how does it compare
to CP2020, that sort of thing.

--
Gurth@******.nl - Stone Age: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Years come three for the price of one.
-> Former NAGEE Editor & ShadowRN GridSec * Triangle Virtuoso <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Site: http://plastic.dumpshock.com <-

GC3.12: GAT/! d- s:- !a>? C++(---) UB+ P(+) L++ E W++(--) N o? K w-- O
M+ PS+ PE@ Y PGP- t- 5++ X(+) R+++$ tv+(++) b++@ DI- D G+ e h! !r y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 10
From: tjlanza@************.com (Timothy J. Lanza)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 11:37:27 -0500
At 05:15 AM 1/29/2006, Gurth wrote:
>According to Anders Swenson, on 28-1-06 23:59 the word on the street was...
>
>>I have a copy, any questions I cn answer?

I have a copy as well.

>I'm just looking for general impressions, I guess -- how does it compare
>to CP2020, that sort of thing.

For starters, Fuzion is a metasystem. Somewhat like D20, each Fuzion
setting tends to have some small differences in how the core rules are
interpreted. I would have to say that CPv3 is quite possibly the worst
implementation of Fuzion I have seen... and it tries the hardest to stay
close to core.

Honestly... There isn't much to like about the game. The classic cyberpunk
game has turned into post-apocalyptic game wearing cyberpunk-colored
glasses - more Mad Max than Johnny Mneumonic. I'd rather take CP2020 and
swap out the underpinnings for Fuzion myself. CPv3 took the best part of
CP, the style and ambiance, and threw it out the window. To compound it,
they took what was left and slapped it on top of a poor implementation of
Fuzion. That's two strikes.

And the artwork would be the third strike. CPv3 is /out/.

Personally, /I/ was hoping for a revitalization of RTG, allowing them to do
a new Fuzion version of Mekton Zeta. It is clear to me that RTG just isn't
worth the time anymore. Instead of restoring my faith in RTG, CPv3 has just
given me more motivation to continue work on my own Fuzion Mekton system.

--
Timothy J. Lanza
"When we can't dream any longer, we die." - Emma Goldman
Message no. 11
From: gurth@******.nl (Gurth)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Mon, 30 Jan 2006 11:26:48 +0100
According to Timothy J. Lanza, on 29-1-06 17:37 the word on the street
was...

> Honestly... There isn't much to like about the game.

:(

Although I hardly ever play the game, I've always liked CP2020, so I had
some hopes for the third edition.

> And the artwork would be the third strike. CPv3 is /out/.

Probably reason enough for me to buy it right there, just to see if it's
as bad as people say ;)

--
Gurth@******.nl - Stone Age: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Years come three for the price of one.
-> Former NAGEE Editor & ShadowRN GridSec * Triangle Virtuoso <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Site: http://plastic.dumpshock.com <-

GC3.12: GAT/! d- s:- !a>? C++(---) UB+ P(+) L++ E W++(--) N o? K w-- O
M+ PS+ PE@ Y PGP- t- 5++ X(+) R+++$ tv+(++) b++@ DI- D G+ e h! !r y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 12
From: anders@**********.com (Anders Swenson)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Mon, 30 Jan 2006 08:30:17 -0800
On Mon, 30 Jan 2006 11:26:48 +0100
Gurth <gurth@******.nl> wrote:
> According to Timothy J. Lanza, on 29-1-06 17:37 the word on the street
> was...
> > Honestly... There isn't much to like about the game.
> :(
> Although I hardly ever play the game, I've always liked CP2020, so I had
> some hopes for the third edition.
>
> > And the artwork would be the third strike. CPv3 is /out/.
> Probably reason enough for me to buy it right there, just to see if it's as
> bad as people say ;)
> --
I didn't see the actual art in my copy of CP3 as especially atrocious, just
uninspiring. Sorta like the art in SR4. At least the drawings in CP3 looked
like the artist had finished them.
--Anders
Message no. 13
From: tjlanza@************.com (Timothy J. Lanza)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Mon, 30 Jan 2006 17:18:59 -0500
At 11:30 AM 1/30/2006, Anders Swenson wrote:
>On Mon, 30 Jan 2006 11:26:48 +0100 Gurth <gurth@******.nl> wrote:
> > According to Timothy J. Lanza, on 29-1-06 17:37 the word on the street
> > was...
> > > And the artwork would be the third strike. CPv3 is /out/.
> > Probably reason enough for me to buy it right there, just to see if it's as
> > bad as people say ;)
>I didn't see the actual art in my copy of CP3 as especially atrocious, just
>uninspiring. Sorta like the art in SR4. At least the drawings in CP3 looked
>like the artist had finished them.

You didn't notice? There is no art. The primary "artwork" is photographs of
dolls.

--
Timothy J. Lanza
"When we can't dream any longer, we die." - Emma Goldman
Message no. 14
From: ldillon@*******.com (Lance Dillon)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 2006 19:12:16 -0600 (CST)
>
> For starters, Fuzion is a metasystem. Somewhat like D20, each Fuzion setting
> tends to have some small differences in how the core rules are interpreted. I
> would have to say that CPv3 is quite possibly the worst implementation of
> Fuzion I have seen... and it tries the hardest to stay close to core.
>

I usually just lurk here, but this reminded me of something. Some years
ago I believe Fuzion came out that was going to be the next version of
Champions, or something like that. It was supposed to "unify" some of the
rules or something like that, but it just seemed to be a poor man's Hero
System. I looked at it, but didn't like it; I'd rather stick with Hero.
If this is what CPv3 uses, I wouldn't use it for that reason alone.
Message no. 15
From: tjlanza@************.com (Timothy J. Lanza)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 2006 20:37:24 -0500
At 08:12 PM 1/31/2006, Lance Dillon wrote:

>>For starters, Fuzion is a metasystem. Somewhat like D20, each Fuzion
>>setting tends to have some small differences in how the core rules are
>>interpreted. I would have to say that CPv3 is quite possibly the worst
>>implementation of Fuzion I have seen... and it tries the hardest to stay
>>close to core.
>
>I usually just lurk here, but this reminded me of something. Some years
>ago I believe Fuzion came out that was going to be the next version of
>Champions, or something like that. It was supposed to "unify" some of the
>rules or something like that, but it just seemed to be a poor man's Hero
>System. I looked at it, but didn't like it; I'd rather stick with Hero.
>If this is what CPv3 uses, I wouldn't use it for that reason alone.

Fuzion was intended as a commingling of Hero and Interlock. It was too
Interlock for the liking of most Hero players. It works just fine for CPv3,
and plenty of other things. I run a Robotech game in it. I have a friend
that does Stargate. I've run a fairly successful Bubblegum Crisis campaign,
too (that ended because two-thirds of the players moved in rapid succession).

You have to remember that it's a metasystem. It's got some core guidelines,
but is meant to be altered. It really is about the implementation, rather
than the system itself. With more thought, I'm sure Champions could have
taken off, too.

--
Timothy J. Lanza
"When we can't dream any longer, we die." - Emma Goldman
Message no. 16
From: gurth@******.nl (Gurth)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Wed, 01 Feb 2006 11:06:17 +0100
According to Lance Dillon, on 1-2-06 02:12 the word on the street was...

> I usually just lurk here, but this reminded me of something. Some years
> ago I believe Fuzion came out that was going to be the next version of
> Champions, or something like that. It was supposed to "unify" some of
> the rules or something like that, but it just seemed to be a poor man's
> Hero System. I looked at it, but didn't like it; I'd rather stick with
> Hero. If this is what CPv3 uses, I wouldn't use it for that reason alone.

AFAIK (not owning any books using the system), Fuzion is essentially a
tweaked version of the rules Cyberpunk has always used: attribute +
skill + 1D10 vs. TN. If I'm right in thinking this, then it wouldn't be
a problem for CPv3, even though I can see how it would be for Champions,
which had _completely_ different rules before.

--
Gurth@******.nl - Stone Age: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Years come three for the price of one.
-> Former NAGEE Editor & ShadowRN GridSec * Triangle Virtuoso <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Site: http://plastic.dumpshock.com <-

GC3.12: GAT/! d- s:- !a>? C++(---) UB+ P(+) L++ E W++(--) N o? K w-- O
M+ PS+ PE@ Y PGP- t- 5++ X(+) R+++$ tv+(++) b++@ DI- D G+ e h! !r y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 17
From: anders@**********.com (Anders Swenson)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Wed, 01 Feb 2006 08:50:30 -0800
On Wed, 01 Feb 2006 11:06:17 +0100
Gurth <gurth@******.nl> wrote:
.
>
> AFAIK (not owning any books using the system), Fuzion is essentially a
> tweaked version of the rules Cyberpunk has always used: attribute + skill +
> 1D10 vs. TN. If I'm right in thinking this, then it wouldn't be a problem
> for CPv3, even though I can see how it would be for Champions, which had
> _completely_ different rules before.
>
> --
But don't forget that under the original Fuzion, there was an option for 3D6
instead of the D10, and that steers it nicely in the direction of Champions.
Personally, I would prefer either a variant of D20 or Basic Roleplaying for
all my games, game mechanics shouldn't alter the game experience of a well
developed world. Now Deadlands, where you wind up playing a game of poker
with cards and chips over the course of an evening...
--Anders
Message no. 18
From: gurth@******.nl (Gurth)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Wed, 01 Feb 2006 19:07:19 +0100
According to Anders Swenson, on 1-2-06 17:50 the word on the street was...

> But don't forget that under the original Fuzion, there was an option for 3D6
> instead of the D10, and that steers it nicely in the direction of Champions.

I wouldn't know, because like I said, I don't own any Fuzion-based games
or rulebooks :)

> game mechanics shouldn't alter the game experience of a well
> developed world.

IMHO, it does -- the rules should fit both the game world and the
desired style of play. You're not going to tell me that playing SR will
feel the same if you use the normal game world but with Warhammer
Fantasy rules, or that, say, Feng Shui will be the same experience if
you use Millennium's End rules for the same setting.

> Now Deadlands, where you wind up playing a game of poker
> with cards and chips over the course of an evening...

Do you mean that you think that's good or bad?

--
Gurth@******.nl - Stone Age: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Years come three for the price of one.
-> Former NAGEE Editor & ShadowRN GridSec * Triangle Virtuoso <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Site: http://plastic.dumpshock.com <-

GC3.12: GAT/! d- s:- !a>? C++(---) UB+ P(+) L++ E W++(--) N o? K w-- O
M+ PS+ PE@ Y PGP- t- 5++ X(+) R+++$ tv+(++) b++@ DI- D G+ e h! !r y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 19
From: anders@**********.com (Anders Swenson)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Wed, 01 Feb 2006 12:26:13 -0800
On Wed, 01 Feb 2006 19:07:19 +0100
Gurth <gurth@******.nl> wrote:
> According to Anders Swenson, on 1-2-06 17:50 the word on the street was...
> >
> > Now Deadlands, where you wind up playing a game of poker
> > with cards and chips over the course of an evening...
>
> Do you mean that you think that's good or bad?
>
It's cute, that's all. You need extra periphenalia to play, I had to buy a
deck of cards in addition to rustling up some dice. For some reason, Serenety
has a similar game mechanics feel to Deadlands, I wonder if that was a subtle
tribute to the other wild west genre?

No, I'd feel comfortable playing either Feng Shui or Deadlands in D20 or BRP
and would probably have as good a time. BTW, I'm currently playing both of
those games!
--Anders
Message no. 20
From: gurth@******.nl (Gurth)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Thu, 02 Feb 2006 10:46:11 +0100
According to Anders Swenson, on 1-2-06 21:26 the word on the street was...

> It's cute, that's all. You need extra periphenalia to play, I had to buy a
> deck of cards in addition to rustling up some dice.

I admit that I had to somehow get hold of poker chips in order to play
Deadlands (they're not all that easy to get hold of) but I don't see
this kind of thing as a problem -- it adds to the feel of the game, I think.

> No, I'd feel comfortable playing either Feng Shui or Deadlands in D20 or BRP
> and would probably have as good a time.

I have a feeling I wouldn't enjoy it as much as I would using a
dedicated rules set, but that's everyone's personal preference, after all.

--
Gurth@******.nl - Stone Age: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Years come three for the price of one.
-> Former NAGEE Editor & ShadowRN GridSec * Triangle Virtuoso <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Site: http://plastic.dumpshock.com <-

GC3.12: GAT/! d- s:- !a>? C++(---) UB+ P(+) L++ E W++(--) N o? K w-- O
M+ PS+ PE@ Y PGP- t- 5++ X(+) R+++$ tv+(++) b++@ DI- D G+ e h! !r y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 21
From: pasquires@*****.com (Paul Squires)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Thu, 2 Feb 2006 10:09:46 +0000
> According to Anders Swenson, on 1-2-06 17:50 the word on the street was...
> IMHO, it does -- the rules should fit both the game world and the
> desired style of play. You're not going to tell me that playing SR will
> feel the same if you use the normal game world but with Warhammer
> Fantasy rules, or that, say, Feng Shui will be the same experience if
> you use Millennium's End rules for the same setting.

Indeed...

I've often argued this point. Starting from a pure game mechanics view
- if a task is easier then it is more likely to be attempted and this
can have a knock-on effect even at simple levels such as "how far can
I leap?"

Combat rules will determine the lethality and this will affect the
game-world and style of play - it's ridiculous to say that a
game-world is grim, dark and lethal when the realities of the
mechanics mean that no-body ever gets hurt for any reason. PCs become
more gung-ho, which will generally lead to an escalation of
violence... I recall playing SR1 and encountering that situation (this
was before we had the concept of legality in the game). WFRP has the
same with the naked dwarf syndrome - unarmoured, but tough, characters
have a pretty good chance of surviving anything /normal/ that is
thrown at them. This does not a grim, perilous, world make. CP2020 -
when I first played it - inspired absolute fear about combat - one
lucky shot WILL kill.

That's the reason why I don't like the idea of games changing too much
- it really does change the world.

Not that I'm making a reference to a certain game we all know and love(d).





--
Paul Squires
pasquires@*****.com | OpenPGP Key ID: 0x423003E0
MSN: pa_squires@*******.com | ICQ: 318471677
Message no. 22
From: l-hansen@*****.tele.dk (Lars Wagner Hansen)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Thu, 2 Feb 2006 17:39:49 +0100
From: "Gurth" <gurth@******.nl>
> According to Anders Swenson, on 1-2-06 21:26 the word on the street was...
>
>> It's cute, that's all. You need extra periphenalia to play, I had to buy
>> a
>> deck of cards in addition to rustling up some dice.
>
> I admit that I had to somehow get hold of poker chips in order to play
> Deadlands (they're not all that easy to get hold of) but I don't see this
> kind of thing as a problem -- it adds to the feel of the game, I think.

Poker chips can be bought in any supermarket in Denmark. It's all the rage
atm...

Lars
Message no. 23
From: gurth@******.nl (Gurth)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Thu, 02 Feb 2006 19:15:42 +0100
According to Lars Wagner Hansen, on 2-2-06 17:39 the word on the street
was...

> Poker chips can be bought in any supermarket in Denmark. It's all the
> rage atm...

I haven't seen any here; game stores will probably sell them, if they
stock regular playing cards, but I actually had to buy mine at a game
convention.

--
Gurth@******.nl - Stone Age: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Years come three for the price of one.
-> Former NAGEE Editor & ShadowRN GridSec * Triangle Virtuoso <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Site: http://plastic.dumpshock.com <-

GC3.12: GAT/! d- s:- !a>? C++(---) UB+ P(+) L++ E W++(--) N o? K w-- O
M+ PS+ PE@ Y PGP- t- 5++ X(+) R+++$ tv+(++) b++@ DI- D G+ e h! !r y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 24
From: sfeley@*****.com (Stephen Eley)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Thu, 2 Feb 2006 13:38:24 -0500
On 2/2/06, Gurth <gurth@******.nl> wrote:
>
> I admit that I had to somehow get hold of poker chips in order to play
> Deadlands (they're not all that easy to get hold of) but I don't see
> this kind of thing as a problem -- it adds to the feel of the game, I think.

Interesting cultural variation. Here they're in every drugstore and
most gas stations.

--
Have Fun,
Steve Eley (sfeley@*****.com)
ESCAPE POD - The Science Fiction Podcast Magazine
http://www.escapepod.org
Message no. 25
From: gurth@******.nl (Gurth)
Subject: [OT] Cyberpunk 3rd edition?
Date: Thu, 02 Feb 2006 20:06:02 +0100
According to Stephen Eley, on 2-2-06 19:38 the word on the street was...

> Interesting cultural variation. Here they're in every drugstore and
> most gas stations.

That's because poker is "the" American card game, whereas "the" Dutch
card game is probably a game that's similar but not completely
identical to the American game hearts
<http://www.gamecolony.com/hearts_game_rules.html>; -- which doesn't
involve betting, and so has no need of markers.

--
Gurth@******.nl - Stone Age: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Years come three for the price of one.
-> Former NAGEE Editor & ShadowRN GridSec * Triangle Virtuoso <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Site: http://plastic.dumpshock.com <-

GC3.12: GAT/! d- s:- !a>? C++(---) UB+ P(+) L++ E W++(--) N o? K w-- O
M+ PS+ PE@ Y PGP- t- 5++ X(+) R+++$ tv+(++) b++@ DI- D G+ e h! !r y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998

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Thwap!