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Message no. 1
From: Jonas Bolander <Jonas.Bolander@****.SE>
Subject: Other literature (Re:Shadowrun novels)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 16:21:40 +0200
While it's nice to read Shadowrun novels to get a 'feel' for the world
there's quite a lot of other 'cyberpunk' literature out there that can
be used as inspiration for a GM. I thought I should recommend some of
my favorites and maybe get some recommendations in return :

'NeoAddix' by Jon Courtenay Grimwood
Nanotech, ancient cults and boosted assassins. I don't want to say too
much but the term 'Immortal Elves' came to my mind when I read this book.

'Mindstar Rising' by Peter Hamilton
Biotech inducing/amplifying psychic powers (I can already hear my players
chant 'Gimme!Gimme!'), well at least the drawbacks are quite substantial.
Quite a nice use of a space probe. ;)

'Snow Crash' by Neal Stephenson
One of the best (and funniest) books I have read. Gives an example of
the ultimate Cortex bomb and gave me a lot of ideas regarding extra-
territorial land. Immortalized the comment "I'm sure they'll listen to
Reason." among me and my friends. Read it!

'Hardwired' by Walter Jon Williams
So you wanna take on a corporation? Read this one. Also a good book for the
Riggers out there. Talsorian made a sourcebook for CP2020 out of this book.

'Voice of the Whirlwind' by Walter Jon Williams
What do you do when you wake up as a clone with a memory transfer 10 years
old, especially when your former 'incarnation' was recently murdered?
Well too little knowledge may be as dangerous as too much.

'When Gravity Fails', 'A Fire in the Sun' and 'The Exile Kiss'
by George Alec Effinger
Something as unusual as an arabic 'Cyberpunk'-setting. Many good ideas
for variants of BTL-chips and subtle intrigues. Another series of books
that has its own CP2020 sourcebook.


/Jonas Bolander

--
Jonas Bolander
Message no. 2
From: GRANITE <granite@**.NET>
Subject: Re: Other literature (Re:Shadowrun novels)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 09:16:39 -0700
> While it's nice to read Shadowrun novels to get a 'feel' for the world
> there's quite a lot of other 'cyberpunk' literature out there that can
> be used as inspiration for a GM. I thought I should recommend some of
> my favorites and maybe get some recommendations in return :

Cyber Way [Alan Dean Foster]

--------------------------------GRANITE
"Rock Steady"
===============================================
Lord, Grant Me The Serenity To Accept The Things I Cannot Change,
The Courage To Change The Things I Can,
And The Wisdom To Hide The Bodies Of Those People I Had To Kill
Because They Pissed Me Off.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ShadowRunner's Serenity Prayer
Message no. 3
From: Mike Sapp <cynner29@******.NET>
Subject: Re: Other literature (Re:Shadowrun novels)
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 01:47:16 -0400
I'm currently 90% finished with Stephenson's "The Diamond Age". No need
for spoilers I won't say anything. Although it lacks action, it's still an
interesting lead and offers great insights for GM's as to where the
Cyberpunk genre is leading. It offers a chance to reverse engineer some of
his assumptions so you get an idea of what needs to occur in a Cyberpunk
world to get to the next level.
It's not a thrill a minute but it's definitely better written than "Snow
Crash" meaning it flows more smoothly. Like all the other Stephenson
books,however, except Zodiac, it starts to bog toward the end as if he'd
rather drag it out than stop writing about it.
Message no. 4
From: 96sp080 <96sp080@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: Other literature (Re:Shadowrun novels)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:14:23 -0700
On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Mike Sapp wrote:

[speaking of Diamond Age]

> It's not a thrill a minute but it's definitely better written
>than "Snow > Crash" meaning it flows more smoothly. Like all the other
>Stephenson > books,however, except Zodiac, it starts to bog toward the end
>as if he'd > rather drag it out than stop writing about it.
>
>

really? god... I like Snow Crash much more that I did Diamond age. I
found Diamnond age had some interesting ideas but every time he got some
where I liked he'd leave it to die.

it was really frustrating.

Mike
Message no. 5
From: Tony Glinka <glinka@**.NETCOM.COM>
Subject: Re: Other literature (Re:Shadowrun novels)
Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 23:19:03 -0700
Jonas Bolander wrote:

> While it's nice to read Shadowrun novels to get a 'feel' for the world
> there's quite a lot of other 'cyberpunk' literature out there that can
> be used as inspiration for a GM. I thought I should recommend some of
> my favorites and maybe get some recommendations in return :

<bis snip>

Has anyone mentioned William Gibson yet? I found his books like Neuromancer,
Count Zero, and Mona Lisa Overdrive to be very good. Some people have complained
that Shadowrun basically ripped off Gibson and that he should get credit
somewhere.

Tony
Message no. 6
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Other literature (Re:Shadowrun novels)
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:50:01 +0100
Jonas Bolander said on 16:21/11 Sep 97...

> 'Mindstar Rising' by Peter Hamilton
> Biotech inducing/amplifying psychic powers (I can already hear my players
> chant 'Gimme!Gimme!'), well at least the drawbacks are quite substantial.
> Quite a nice use of a space probe. ;)

There's also a follow-up called A Quantum Murder, which is basically a
murder investigation by psionics. Mindstar Rising is better, IMO.

> 'Snow Crash' by Neal Stephenson
> One of the best (and funniest) books I have read. Gives an example of
> the ultimate Cortex bomb and gave me a lot of ideas regarding extra-
> territorial land. Immortalized the comment "I'm sure they'll listen to
> Reason." among me and my friends. Read it!

It's got the ultimate in extraterritoriality: a one-man nation state with
nuclear capability :)

> 'Hardwired' by Walter Jon Williams
> 'Voice of the Whirlwind' by Walter Jon Williams
> 'When Gravity Fails', 'A Fire in the Sun' and 'The Exile Kiss'
> by George Alec Effinger

The *(@$^&@#% library here hasn't even heard of the authors' names :(

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Go see the profiteer
-> NERPS Project Leader & Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-

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Message no. 7
From: Mike Sapp <cynner29@******.NET>
Subject: Re: Other literature (Re:Shadowrun novels)
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:40:23 -0400
At 11:14 PM 9/11/97 -0700, you wrote:
>[speaking of Diamond Age]
>
>> It's not a thrill a minute but it's definitely better written
>>than "Snow > Crash" meaning it flows more smoothly. Like all the
other
>>Stephenson > books,however, except Zodiac, it starts to bog toward the end
>>as if he'd > rather drag it out than stop writing about it.
>>
>>
>
>really? god... I like Snow Crash much more that I did Diamond age. I
>found Diamnond age had some interesting ideas but every time he got some
>where I liked he'd leave it to die.
>
>it was really frustrating.
>
Well, actually I liked Snow Crash better as well, but it wasn't as finely
crafted as the Diamond Age. It's more a matter of construction than
content, in The Diamond Age it was easier to identify with the characters
and follow the flow of action during scene changes, at the same time I
enjoyed the content of Snow Crash much more. Which is the better book?
That's a matter of taste, the truth is that Snow Crash was written by a
budding author, and The Diamond Age was writting by a more experienced one.
And yes I agree, he did let things die far too soon, though I think he
just had so much that he was trying to cover that he couldn't dwell on one
aspect too long.

Cynner -
Message no. 8
From: "Wendy Wanders, Subject 117" <KGGEWEHR@******.ACS.MUOHIO.EDU>
Subject: Re: Other literature (Re:Shadowrun novels)
Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 20:13:45 -0500
You wrote:
> Has anyone mentioned William Gibson yet? I found his books like Neuromancer,
> Count Zero, and Mona Lisa Overdrive to be very good. Some people have complained
> that Shadowrun basically ripped off Gibson and that he should get credit
> somewhere.
No, SR borrowed from the entire cyberpunk genre, of which Gibson is just an
important part. Cyberpunk prolly comes a lot closer to Gibson's writing, and
is still far away in imprtant ways.

losthalo
Message no. 9
From: Tony Glinka <glinka@**.NETCOM.COM>
Subject: Re: Other literature (Re:Shadowrun novels)
Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:49:44 -0700
Wendy Wanders, Subject 117 wrote:

> You wrote:
> > Has anyone mentioned William Gibson yet? I found his books like
Neuromancer,
> > Count Zero, and Mona Lisa Overdrive to be very good. Some people have
complained
> > that Shadowrun basically ripped off Gibson and that he should get credit
> > somewhere.
> No, SR borrowed from the entire cyberpunk genre, of which Gibson is just an
> important part. Cyberpunk prolly comes a lot closer to Gibson's writing, and
> is still far away in imprtant ways.

I agree that SR borrowed from a lot of sources not just Gibson. To say otherwise
would be a discredit to other great writers out there. I was just making reference to
a major "discussion" on the list that nearly resulted in a flame war a while
back on
this subject. People were calling for Gibson's name to be placed in the credits and
all other kinds of stuff.
I should have been a little more specific in my previous post. I definitely don't
want this to turn into a thread arguing over who had the biggest influence on SR. I
was just trying to point out that Gibson's work would be a great place to look for
atmosphere for SR as some people would go so far as to say he was ripped off by the
game.

Tony
Message no. 10
From: "Wendy Wanders, Subject 117" <KGGEWEHR@******.ACS.MUOHIO.EDU>
Subject: Re: Other literature (Re:Shadowrun novels)
Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 09:28:25 -0500
You wrote:
> I should have been a little more specific in my previous post. I definitely
don't
> want this to turn into a thread arguing over who had the biggest influence on SR. I
> was just trying to point out that Gibson's work would be a great place to look for
> atmosphere for SR as some people would go so far as to say he was ripped off by the
> game.
Well, don't worry, I think SR's setting is unique enough within the CP genre
that citing any author as a strong reference wouldn't make sense.

losthalo

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