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Message no. 1
From: kidchameleon@*********.net (Ken' Horner)
Subject: Phosphorous (was Diff's between Shadowrunners and Pro-criminals)
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 19:50:12 -0500
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> >Whit phosphorous shot? That works? Sounds pretty hot to me (for the
> >guy shooting the shotgun).
>
> I've heard of it in the real world (although whether it really exists or
not
> I couldn't say) presumably if you encapsulate the phosphorous in a very
> frangable material it wont have the chance to ignite until it his the
> target.

Oh yes, there are three types of phosphorous: red, white and black. They
all have different molecular structures, giving them different properties.
Black is the least reacitve, then red then white. White will burn at 30°C
in moist conditions, lower temps in drier air.

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Message no. 2
From: ahz@*****.com (Danyeal De La Luna)
Subject: Phosphorous (was Diff's between Shadowrunners and Pro-criminals)
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 21:05:37 -0500
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Ummm...why am I recieving 2 of every message?



Lunatec

-----Original Message-----
From: shadowrn-bounces@*****.dumpshock.com
[mailto:shadowrn-bounces@*****.dumpshock.com]On Behalf Of Ken' Horner
Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 7:50 PM
To: shadowrn@*****.dumpshock.com
Subject: Phosphorous (was Diff's between Shadowrunners and Pro-criminals)



> >Whit phosphorous shot? That works? Sounds pretty hot to me (for the
> >guy shooting the shotgun).
>
> I've heard of it in the real world (although whether it really exists or
not
> I couldn't say) presumably if you encapsulate the phosphorous in a very
> frangable material it wont have the chance to ignite until it his the
> target.

Oh yes, there are three types of phosphorous: red, white and black. They
all have different molecular structures, giving them different properties.
Black is the least reacitve, then red then white. White will burn at 30°C
in moist conditions, lower temps in drier air.

---------------------- multipart/alternative attachment
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Message no. 3
From: loneeagle2061@*******.com (Lone Eagle)
Subject: Phosphorous (was Diff's between Shadowrunners and Pro-criminals)
Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 09:15:07 +0000
>From: "Ken' Horner" <kidchameleon@*********.net>
> > I've heard of it in the real world (although whether it really exists or
>not
> > I couldn't say)
<Snip™>
>Black is the least reacitve, then red then white. White will burn at 30°C
>in moist conditions, lower temps in drier air.

Just to clarify, I know that white phosphorous exists, it's whether white
phosphorous is used as a shotgun load. Grenades exist (or at least accounts
of the Falklands conflict mention their use) but whether it can be contained
appropriately for use in shotgun shells I don't know.

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Message no. 4
From: Gurth@******.nl (Gurth)
Subject: Phosphorous (was Diff's between Shadowrunners and Pro-criminals)
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 11:36:24 +0200
According to Lone Eagle, on Wed, 09 Oct 2002 the word on the street was...

> Just to clarify, I know that white phosphorous exists, it's whether white
> phosphorous is used as a shotgun load. Grenades exist (or at least
> accounts of the Falklands conflict mention their use) but whether it can
> be contained appropriately for use in shotgun shells I don't know.

WP was used in combat grenades, as well as artillery shells, rockets, bombs
and lots more, for most of the 20th century. Its main use was creating
smoke, but it also has incendiary effects (though these aren't as great as
those of, say, napalm or thermite). As a smoke-producer, though, it's been
replaced by red phosphorus in at least western countries since about the
1980s because the white kind is a lot more toxic.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
I know all this and more
-> Probably NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Triangle Virtuoso <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://plastic.dumpshock.com <-

GC3.12: GAT/! d- s:- !a>? C++(---) UL+ P(+) L++ E W--(++) N o? K w(--)
O V? PS+ PE@ Y PGP- t- 5++ X(+) R+++$ tv+(++) b++@ DI- D+ G+ e h! !r y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 5
From: loneeagle2061@*******.com (Lone Eagle)
Subject: Phosphorous (was Diff's between Shadowrunners and Pro-criminals)
Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 11:08:24 +0000
>From: Gurth <Gurth@******.nl>
>WP was used in combat grenades, as well as artillery shells, rockets, bombs
>and lots more, for most of the 20th century. Its main use was creating
>smoke, but it also has incendiary effects (though these aren't as great as
>those of, say, napalm or thermite). As a smoke-producer, though, it's been
>replaced by red phosphorus in at least western countries since about the
>1980s because the white kind is a lot more toxic.

The way I've heard its use described it sounded more like an anti-personel
grenade, a particular example that comes quickest to mind was I believe a
Scots Guard NCO on Tumbledown, he managed to maneuver above a well dug-in
Argentinian machinegun position and proceeded to use High explosive and
white phosphorous grenades from behind cover to open it, his description was
slightly beyond the credible due to the number of grenades he stated he used
which IIRC was about 20, that seems to me to be rather a lot for one NCO to
carry.

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Message no. 6
From: Gurth@******.nl (Gurth)
Subject: Phosphorous (was Diff's between Shadowrunners and Pro-criminals)
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 19:24:42 +0200
According to Lone Eagle, on Wed, 09 Oct 2002 the word on the street was...

> > Its main use was
> > creating smoke, but it also has incendiary effects (though these aren't
> > as great as those of, say, napalm or thermite).
>
> The way I've heard its use described it sounded more like an
> anti-personel grenade

Quite possible because of the burning particles, but the official view
seems to be (or was in the 1960s, for which I base myself on a 1968 US
Army/Navy/Air Force manual on aircraft bombs) that it's a smoke and
incendiary weapon. Which doesn't mean you can't use them to inflict
casualties, of course, like you described.

> his description was slightly beyond the credible due to the number of
> grenades he stated he used which IIRC was about 20, that seems to me to
> be rather a lot for one NCO to carry.

Depends... German stormtroopers in the latter parts of WWI typically
carried around that number, for example, about half of them stick and half
egg grenades -- but then, they used grenades as their primary weapon.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
I know all this and more
-> Probably NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Triangle Virtuoso <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://plastic.dumpshock.com <-

GC3.12: GAT/! d- s:- !a>? C++(---) UL+ P(+) L++ E W--(++) N o? K w(--)
O V? PS+ PE@ Y PGP- t- 5++ X(+) R+++$ tv+(++) b++@ DI- D+ G+ e h! !r y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 7
From: loneeagle2061@*******.com (Lone Eagle)
Subject: Phosphorous (was Diff's between Shadowrunners and Pro-criminals)
Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 11:16:14 +0000
>From: Gurth <Gurth@******.nl>
>Depends... German stormtroopers in the latter parts of WWI typically
>carried around that number, for example, about half of them stick and half
>egg grenades -- but then, they used grenades as their primary weapon.

I stand corrected. I assume that some of them will have carried fewer in
order to carry IIRC "Flower petal" stick grenades, the cans from six
grenades attached around a grenade with the stick left intact like a childs
drawing of a flower, effectively a field expedient light anti tank weapon
(although I believe that versions were actually manufactured like that...)

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