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Message no. 1
From: Tony Rabiola <rabiola@**.NETCOM.COM>
Subject: Powered Wheelchair
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 10:54:13 -0600
I have a player that is wanting to play a paraplegic and wants to
develop a powered wheelchair to putter around in. Anyone got a workup
of such a beast hanging around? How difficult would it be to
construct with R2 rules?

Thanx in advance.

Tony Rabiola
rabiola@**.netcom.com
Fourth and Sixth World Adept
(still working on the Fifth)
Proud owner BABY #972
Message no. 2
From: Kevin Langevin <kevinl@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Powered Wheelchair
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 12:42:38 -0500
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Tony Rabiola [mailto:rabiola@**.NETCOM.COM]
> Sent: Saturday, December 12, 1998 11:54 AM
> To: SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET
> Subject: Powered Wheelchair
>
>
> I have a player that is wanting to play a paraplegic and wants to
> develop a powered wheelchair to putter around in. Anyone got a workup
> of such a beast hanging around? How difficult would it be to
> construct with R2 rules?
>
> Thanx in advance.

I once built a very cool hoverchair from a large smikker drone. It was
rigged and had some bells and whistles, and cost around 24,000 nuyen. I'd
made it for a paraplegic decker I'd made up, but never used the character.
If you're interested, I'll send you the stats once I can dig them up. The
chair was made using the R2 rules.

-Kev
Message no. 3
From: Starjammer <starjammer@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: Powered Wheelchair
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 12:50:33 -0500
At 10:54 AM 12/12/98 -0600, you wrote:
>I have a player that is wanting to play a paraplegic and wants to
>develop a powered wheelchair to putter around in. Anyone got a workup
>of such a beast hanging around? How difficult would it be to
>construct with R2 rules?
>
>Thanx in advance.
>
>Tony Rabiola

Unless the player in question specifically wants some kind of high-speed,
all-terrain armed and armored uber-wheelchair, I wouldn't bother with
vehicle stats. Just determine the basics of the beast (Quickness, Body,
Barrier rating if any, battery life, etc.) and go from there. You can
probably find specs on electric wheelchairs through the web, probably from
sales info for the companies that sell them.

If the person *does* want such a super-chair, then I'd start with a large
drone chassis and add on a passenger seat, and work from there.
Alternately, you could heavily modify a motorcycle sidecar.

Just out of curiosity, I assume we're talking about someone in a team
support role here? Not that I don't think someone in a chair could kick
serious butt on a run (especially a high-power rigged chair with mounted
weapons and armor), but it's not exactly the way to keep a low profile,
y'know?

Starjammer | Una salus victus nullam sperare salutem.
starjammer@**********.com | "The one hope of the doomed is not to hope
Marietta, GA | for safety." --Virgil, The Aeneid
Message no. 4
From: Tony Rabiola <rabiola@**.NETCOM.COM>
Subject: Re: Powered Wheelchair
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 13:29:08 -0600
>>I have a player that is wanting to play a paraplegic and wants to
>>develop a powered wheelchair to putter around in. Anyone got a
workup
>>of such a beast hanging around? How difficult would it be to
>>construct with R2 rules?
>>
>Unless the player in question specifically wants some kind of
high-speed,
>all-terrain armed and armored uber-wheelchair, I wouldn't bother with
>vehicle stats. Just determine the basics of the beast (Quickness,
Body,
>Barrier rating if any, battery life, etc.) and go from there. You
can
>probably find specs on electric wheelchairs through the web, probably
from
>sales info for the companies that sell them.
>
>If the person *does* want such a super-chair, then I'd start with a
large
>drone chassis and add on a passenger seat, and work from there.
>Alternately, you could heavily modify a motorcycle sidecar.
>

I think this is the direction he is leaning towards, he is doing a
mage, so it should be an interesting concept.

>Just out of curiosity, I assume we're talking about someone in a team
>support role here? Not that I don't think someone in a chair could
kick
>serious butt on a run (especially a high-power rigged chair with
mounted
>weapons and armor), but it's not exactly the way to keep a low
profile,
>y'know?


Yeah, there is that, going to be some definite role-playing challenges
involved here. I am looking forward to giving them to him!

Tony Rabiola
rabiola@**.netcom.com
Fourth and Sixth World Adept
(still working on the Fifth)
Proud owner BABY #972
Message no. 5
From: "D. Ghost" <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Powered Wheelchair
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 14:13:33 -0600
On Sat, 12 Dec 1998 10:54:13 -0600 Tony Rabiola <rabiola@**.NETCOM.COM>
writes:
>I have a player that is wanting to play a paraplegic and wants to
>develop a powered wheelchair to putter around in. Anyone got a workup
>of such a beast hanging around? How difficult would it be to
>construct with R2 rules?
>
>Thanx in advance.

Well, does your player mind cyber? you can always put a bucket seat in
wheeled drone (and put some mechanical arms so it can pick the char up
and help him/her in to the chair ... but that'll get expensive fast...).

--
D. Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, RuPixel)
"Coffee without caffeine is like sex without the spanking." -- Cupid
"A magician is always 'touching' himself" --Page 123, Grimoire (2nd
Edition)

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Message no. 6
From: Mike Bobroff <Airwasp@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Powered Wheelchair
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 16:28:28 EST
In a message dated 12/12/98 11:57:48 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
rabiola@**.NETCOM.COM writes:

> I have a player that is wanting to play a paraplegic and wants to
> develop a powered wheelchair to putter around in. Anyone got a workup
> of such a beast hanging around? How difficult would it be to
> construct with R2 rules?

A powered wheelchair would be easy to make. Use the wheeled or tracked drone
from the R2, and just add in a seat for fun. Plus, if the player and you get
extra zany, you could do some really cool things with a wheelchair. And
another thing, a wheelchair would also be something that could conceal a
firearm (like a shotgun) if anyone here remembers Alien Resurrection at all.

-Mike
Message no. 7
From: Paul Gettle <RunnerPaul@*****.COM>
Subject: Re: Powered Wheelchair
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 18:28:06 -0500
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

At 04:28 PM 12/12/98 -0500, Mike wrote:
>another thing, a wheelchair would also be something that could
conceal a
>firearm (like a shotgun) if anyone here remembers Alien Resurrection
at all.

Ah, but was that the wheelchair, or was that poor security procedures
on the part of the military man who's duty it was to check the chair?
:)

And don't forget that chemsniffers are fairly common in Shadowrun, so
you'd better keep your shotgun shells in an airtight container. :)

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--
-- Paul Gettle, #970 of 1000 (RunnerPaul@*****.com)
PGP Fingerprint, Key ID:0x48F3AACD (RSA 1024, created 98/06/26)
C260 94B3 6722 6A25 63F8 0690 9EA2 3344
Message no. 8
From: Paul Gettle <RunnerPaul@*****.COM>
Subject: Re: Powered Wheelchair
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 18:22:14 -0500
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

At 10:54 AM 12/12/98 -0600, Tony wrote:
>I have a player that is wanting to play a paraplegic and wants to
>develop a powered wheelchair to putter around in. Anyone got a
workup
>of such a beast hanging around? How difficult would it be to
>construct with R2 rules?

Off the top of my head, I'd suggest crawler drone chassis, and put
enough of a load Rating on there to allow for a bucket seat, with a
person sitting in it. Why a crawler? Better mobility. (In fact, today,
there is a powered mobility chair that has tank treads to allow it to
climb stairs/curbs and operate in off-road conditions... it's
expensive though.)

If you get a chance, rent a tape of Alien Resurrection (Alien 4), and
take a look at the chair one of the characters uses. It's good for a
few ideas at least.

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--
-- Paul Gettle, #970 of 1000 (RunnerPaul@*****.com)
PGP Fingerprint, Key ID:0x48F3AACD (RSA 1024, created 98/06/26)
C260 94B3 6722 6A25 63F8 0690 9EA2 3344
Message no. 9
From: K in the Shadows <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Powered Wheelchair
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 23:10:38 EST
In a message dated 12/12/1998 11:57:50 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
rabiola@**.NETCOM.COM writes:

>
> I have a player that is wanting to play a paraplegic and wants to
> develop a powered wheelchair to putter around in. Anyone got a workup
> of such a beast hanging around? How difficult would it be to
> construct with R2 rules?
>
> Thanx in advance.

I know we don't actually have on ATM, as the player we had who was a
paraplegic (or was she a Quad Mike??) is no longer with us.

Stupid git of a broad was a Dwarf who LOVED Klingon Opera (would love to see
that character translated to SR3) and play it through the simrig/assist
interface of the rig system she was using.

As for how hard would it be using R2 rules? Not at all actually. I would
suggest using the Wheeled Drone (Electric) rules actually, and then reinvest
the room for the seating and such. If you have ever seen Aliens:
Resurrection, there is a character in there that comes to mind.

-K
Message no. 10
From: "D. Ghost" <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Powered Wheelchair
Date: Sat, 12 Dec 1998 22:39:16 -0600
On Sat, 12 Dec 1998 23:10:38 EST K in the Shadows <Ereskanti@***.COM>
writes:
>In a message dated 12/12/1998 11:57:50 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
>rabiola@**.NETCOM.COM writes:
>
>>
>> I have a player that is wanting to play a paraplegic and wants to
>> develop a powered wheelchair to putter around in. Anyone got a
workup
>> of such a beast hanging around? How difficult would it be to
>> construct with R2 rules?
>>
>> Thanx in advance.

<SNIP>
>As for how hard would it be using R2 rules? Not at all actually. I
would
>suggest using the Wheeled Drone (Electric) rules actually, and then
reinvest
>the room for the seating and such. If you have ever seen Aliens:
>Resurrection, there is a character in there that comes to mind.

Query: Does it still count as a drone (for final price multiple)? If you
want standard controls, how do you put them in? Same as secondary
controls?

--
D. Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, RuPixel)
"Coffee without caffeine is like sex without the spanking." -- Cupid
"A magician is always 'touching' himself" --Page 123, Grimoire (2nd
Edition)

___________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html
or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
Message no. 11
From: Paul Gettle <RunnerPaul@*****.COM>
Subject: Re: Powered Wheelchair
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1998 00:15:39 -0500
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

At 10:39 PM 12/12/98 -0600, D.Ghost wrote:
>Query: Does it still count as a drone (for final price multiple)? If
you
>want standard controls, how do you put them in? Same as secondary
>controls?

I know I give my "rideable" drones the drone price mulitiple, but I
give the riders a much harder time of it if they get into a crash.

As for standard controls, how about a hardwired remote control deck
(the pre-2058 style that still had manual controls)? It wouldn't have
to be a high level RC deck, since it only has to control one drone.


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--
-- Paul Gettle, #970 of 1000 (RunnerPaul@*****.com)
PGP Fingerprint, Key ID:0x48F3AACD (RSA 1024, created 98/06/26)
C260 94B3 6722 6A25 63F8 0690 9EA2 3344
Message no. 12
From: Mongoose <m0ng005e@*********.COM>
Subject: Re: Powered Wheelchair
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1998 02:00:30 -0600
:>As for how hard would it be using R2 rules? Not at all actually. I
:would
:>suggest using the Wheeled Drone (Electric) rules actually, and then
:reinvest
:>the room for the seating and such. If you have ever seen Aliens:
:>Resurrection, there is a character in there that comes to mind.
:
:Query: Does it still count as a drone (for final price multiple)? If you
:want standard controls, how do you put them in? Same as secondary
:controls?


I'd say if it caries passengers and / or has onboard controls, its not a
drone. Doubly tru for wheel-chairs; passenger comfort is a BIG issue with
wheelchairs, as the users can not always do simple things, like shift in
their seat, maintain balance, etc.
I'd expect a bigger markup and some negative quality factors, based on
current wheelchairs on the market (which I know a bit about, my boss
having just shopped for one). They tend to be overpriced, undertested,
hard to maintain and get parts for, and (not quite so much anymore) poorly
constructed. They are made in small batches and subject to continual
advancement in SOTA but little market pressure. This is changing, but it
will take legislation (which isn't gonna happen in SR), a larger and more
assertive consumer base (possible), or universally better design and
manufacture methods (alos possible) before wheelchairs catch up with what
people want them to be.
Todays top of the line electric wheel chair costs in excess of $15,000,
and is still is stopped by a curb. (The tank tread / stairclimber is
more, and such a capability is useless to most people who need an electric
chair due to the balance required). Those supplied by Medicare cost about
$3,000, and break down a lot.

Mongoose
Message no. 13
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Powered Wheelchair
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1998 12:12:20 +0100
According to Kevin Langevin, at 12:42 on 12 Dec 98, the word on
the street was...

> > I have a player that is wanting to play a paraplegic and wants to
> > develop a powered wheelchair to putter around in. Anyone got a workup
> > of such a beast hanging around? How difficult would it be to
> > construct with R2 rules?
>
> I once built a very cool hoverchair from a large smikker drone. It was
> rigged and had some bells and whistles, and cost around 24,000 nuyen. I'd
> made it for a paraplegic decker I'd made up, but never used the character.
> If you're interested, I'll send you the stats once I can dig them up. The
> chair was made using the R2 rules.

That's more or less the same as I was about to suggest -- use a drone
chassis (I'd go for a wheeled one, though, not a skimmer) that's just
capable of having a bucket seat installed in it. I would probably not use
any other chassis than a drone's, for the simple reason that using another
tends to give a wheelchair capable of 50 to 100 km/h and with a Body of 3
or more :)

Unless the player wants to have a remote-controlled wheelchair, you could
remove the points cost of the remote control interface and rigger
adaptation to lower the costs a bit, too. Then add normal controls
(probably best to use the costs for secondary controls), and you might
also remove the drone modifier, because it's not a drone anymore --
although OTOH that would lead to a very expensive wheelchair, so you might
want to keep it anyway.

Another option, instead of "secondary" controls would be to install a
remote control deck in the wheelchair and run a cable from it to the
remote control interface (thus eliminating jamming problems and the rather
ridiculous matter that you would be using radio waves to control something
installed half a meter away from the transmitter).

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
What do you mean, "let it"? How can you stop it?
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 14
From: K in the Shadows <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Powered Wheelchair
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1998 08:10:03 EST
In a message dated 12/12/1998 11:47:10 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
dghost@****.COM writes:

>
> Query: Does it still count as a drone (for final price multiple)? If you
> want standard controls, how do you put them in? Same as secondary
> controls?

All of which are good questions (It's just too bad I'm up this early, won't
guarantee a good answer ;).

I would personally say that NO, it does not count as a drone any longer for
that final mark-up modifier. I saw one of the other posts concerning taking a
"Sidecar" and heavily modifying it. It would a good option, except that the
R2 rules gives you squat when it comes to "adding an engine" into the design
of a vehicle. Using the "Secondary Controls" option might be a good way to
start though, especially if the chair isn't going to be, what was that word?
Uber-Chair? ;)

-K
Message no. 15
From: Tony Rabiola <rabiola@**.NETCOM.COM>
Subject: Re: Powered Wheelchair
Date: Sun, 13 Dec 1998 09:19:31 -0600
Thanx for all the input, guys! Gave me a table full of food for
thought on how to work it, depending on how fancy the player wants to
make it. IIRC, he wants to make it very mobile and use levitation on
it when in a bind. secondary controls for the team riggers might be a
good idea as well.

Always knew I could count on you all to provide ideas!

Tony Rabiola
rabiola@**.netcom.com
Fourth and Sixth World Adept
(still working on the Fifth)
Proud owner BABY #972
Message no. 16
From: Micheal Feeney <Starrngr@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Powered Wheelchair
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1998 03:47:02 EST
In a message dated 98-12-12 11:58:17 EST, you write:

> I have a player that is wanting to play a paraplegic and wants to
> develop a powered wheelchair to putter around in. Anyone got a workup
> of such a beast hanging around? How difficult would it be to
> construct with R2 rules?
>

That really depends, Tony. Do you want just a wheelchair for like getting him
aruond the house, or the wheelchair from ehck cause he has to travel through
the DMZ to get to the store sort of thing?

--
Starrngr -- Now with an UPDATED webpage:
Ranger HQ
<A HREF="http://hometown.aol.com/starrngr/index.htm">;
HTTP://hometown.aol.com/starrngr/index.htm</A>;

"You wear a Hawaiian shirt and bring your music on a RUN? No wonder they call
you Howling Mad..." -- Rabid the Pysad.
Message no. 17
From: Tony Rabiola <rabiola@**.NETCOM.COM>
Subject: Re: Powered Wheelchair
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1998 03:11:23 -0600
>
>> I have a player that is wanting to play a paraplegic and wants to
>> develop a powered wheelchair to putter around in. Anyone got a
workup
>> of such a beast hanging around? How difficult would it be to
>> construct with R2 rules?
>>
>
>That really depends, Tony. Do you want just a wheelchair for like
getting him
>aruond the house, or the wheelchair from ehck cause he has to travel
through
>the DMZ to get to the store sort of thing?


Well, some of everything. He is going to be a PC mage, so he will
need some mobility under less than ideal circumstances.

Tony Rabiola
rabiola@**.netcom.com
Fourth and Sixth World Adept
(still working on the Fifth)
Proud owner BABY #972
Message no. 18
From: Mike Bobroff <Airwasp@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Powered Wheelchair
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1998 19:07:05 EST
In a message dated 12/12/98 6:39:00 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
RunnerPaul@*****.COM writes:

> At 04:28 PM 12/12/98 -0500, Mike wrote:
> >another thing, a wheelchair would also be something that could
> conceal a
> >firearm (like a shotgun) if anyone here remembers Alien Resurrection
> at all.
>
> Ah, but was that the wheelchair, or was that poor security procedures
> on the part of the military man who's duty it was to check the chair?
> :)

It was poor security procedure on the part of the mil-police chummer, which
begs something, have you ever been stared down by someone who is forced to
move around in a wheelchair because they are not able to walk? Trust me, it
is a very umiliating experience.

> And don't forget that chemsniffers are fairly common in Shadowrun, so
> you'd better keep your shotgun shells in an airtight container. :)

True, chemsniffers are always common, but there are ways to get around them.

-Mike
Message no. 19
From: Mike Bobroff <Airwasp@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Powered Wheelchair
Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1998 19:13:04 EST
In a message dated 12/12/98 11:47:10 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
dghost@****.COM writes:

> >As for how hard would it be using R2 rules? Not at all actually. I
> would
> >suggest using the Wheeled Drone (Electric) rules actually, and then
> reinvest
> >the room for the seating and such. If you have ever seen Aliens:
> >Resurrection, there is a character in there that comes to mind.
>
> Query: Does it still count as a drone (for final price multiple)?

No, the price would be as if it were a normal vehicle.

> If you want standard controls, how do you put them in? Same as secondary
> controls?

I would probably say so, besides, you could stick in Rigger Adaption with a
datajack and thereby have no reason for ever requiring any form of controls at
all. Although, you could install the secondary controls, and just have it in
the shape of a joystick / mouse / trackball of some sort on one of the arm
rests of the wheelchair.

-Mike

Further Reading

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