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From:	Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject:	Purpose of the Otaku
Date:	Fri, 13 Feb 1998 12:58:21 -0500

Message no. 1 I think those that are advocating the ability of the Otaku to mimic
cyberware (munchkinous or not) are forgetting something critical.

The Otaku are not physical adepts. FASA never intended them to be combat
monsters. They are bizarre loners, the ultimate computer geek, living in a
trash-infested room, eating day-old pizza and drinking Jolt cola, spending
every waking hour connected to their computer. No one like that is going
to be a combat monster. Hell, no one like that is ever even likely to
focus any part of their talents on the physical realm (how many super-geeks
do you know that go to the gym on a regular basis; their arrogance is in
their intelligence, not their body), confident in the fact that while you
might be able to beat the crap out of them, they can destroy your bank
account, set creditors on you, and generally make your life miserable by
manipulating data. THAT'S what the Otaku are. To them, the physical realm
isn't important. That's why they have penalties to their physical attributes.

So I don't see that it really matters that much whether or not the rules
can be bent or shifted or whatever to allow an Otaku to create a non-cyber
Move-By-Wire system in himself. It simply goes against the spirit of what
the Otaku were intended to be by FASA. If you want that sort of character,
create a physical adept. Hell, if you want, you can rationalize them as
the Otaku of the physical world (which might make for an interesting
character). But that's not really what FASA had in mind.

That's my $0.02 anyway.

Erik J.

From:	David Buehrer <dbuehrer@******.CARL.ORG>
Subject:	Re: Purpose of the Otaku
Date:	Fri, 13 Feb 1998 14:49:11 -0700

Message no. 2 Erik Jameson wrote:
/
/ The Otaku are not physical adepts. FASA never intended them to be combat
/ monsters.

True. However, as the Otaku evolved, a new class of human may evolve
that can emulate cyberware in much the same way that an Otaku
emulates a deck.

An Otaku hybrid could evolve with a sympathetic reaction to
cyberware. If he hangs around a person with wired reflexes long
enough he gains the benefits. Or maybe if he just handled cyberware
(the son of a street doc) he could mimic it. It could also be some
form of physical adept with a reliance on technology.

It would take some work to game balance it, but I could accept the
possiblity.

-David
--
"By the way, this may look like a slab of liver
but it's an external brain pack."
- Ratbert
--
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/1068/homepage.htm

From:	Matb <mbreton@**.NETCOM.COM>
Subject:	Re: Purpose of the Otaku
Date:	Fri, 13 Feb 1998 17:09:28 -0800

Message no. 3 Erik Jameson wrote:

> I think those that are advocating the ability of the Otaku to mimic
> cyberware (munchkinous or not) are forgetting something critical.

Well, it gets worse than that.

First, you have an Otaku spend the (months/years/decades) needed to redo
his 'personal OS' - upgrade to a cyber-less Wired Reflexes 3. That's
already an *immense* advantage over the samurai, who has to pay for his
in Nuyen, Essence, and probably high-placed favors -- and still have to
worry about it breaking, needing maintenance, and other disasters.

Well, now we're left with _Wired Reflexes as Computer Code_ -- meaning
our friendly Otaku can upload the "Form" to the Matrix where all and
sundry DL it, spend a lot less (months/years/decades) tweaking it to
their personal system... and voila.

Free cyberware with barely a fraction of the drawbacks of the "real"
stuff.

See why this is munchkinous crud?

-M

From:	Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject:	Re: Purpose of the Otaku
Date:	Fri, 13 Feb 1998 17:17:20 -0500

Message no. 4 At 02:49 PM 2/13/98 -0700, you wrote:

>True. However, as the Otaku evolved, a new class of human may evolve
>that can emulate cyberware in much the same way that an Otaku
>emulates a deck.
>
>
I think the key word here is "evolved." The Otaku just got here; they've
only been around in the SR world and RL for only a few years as best we
know. They just barely "evolved" into what they are now; they (and I don't
see anyone else capable of this yet) haven't had any time to evolve into
something else.

Of course, this argument assumes two things that I'm not sure we can take
for granted. The first is that it would be possible to gain the sort of
mastery over one's body that could emulate cyberware. I suppose with the
amazing things that current yogis and some monks can do, it might be
possible. Probable? I doubt it.

The second thing that you, and others, assume is that the Otaku evolved,
that they are an evolutionary step up, or sideways perhaps, from the normal
human. It's really not clear how the Otaku came into being. They may be
genetically engineered, they may have been "touched" by a "net.spirit"
or
it could be that they normally would be physadepts or magicians, but
because of circumstances, their talents were forced in another direction -
the Matrix. No one really knows for sure.

Let's also remember who the Otaku are; Matrix geeks. The Otaku themselves
wouldn't "evolve" in the physical direction; they seem to regard RL will
total disdain so there isn't the motivation. If they were to "evolve"
further, it would likely be deeper into the Matrix (maybe looking something
like those stereotypical "Grey" aliens? Big heads, tiny bodies?).

I still also maintain that Otaku with "cyberforms" simply goes totally
against the spirit of what FASA intended. I'm one of those that will
gleefully make or break rules, as long as I believe it is still in the
spirit of the game and what FASA intended.

But to wrap up, I can see valid points to your argument. Possible? Yes.
Probable? I simply don't see it. In the rules of the current game? No.
In the house rules for a game set in 2158 (or sometime in the future)?
Sure, why not. By then your "evolve" argument would have enough time to
work and take place.

Until we meet again...

Erik J.

"This slab of liver has an MBA from Harvard, you pointy-hair fool!"
- Ratbert

From:	"J. Keith Henry" <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject:	Re: Purpose of the Otaku
Date:	Fri, 13 Feb 1998 23:28:39 EST

Message no. 5 In a message dated 98-02-13 17:10:24 EST, mbreton@**.NETCOM.COM writes:

> Erik Jameson wrote:
> > I think those that are advocating the ability of the Otaku to mimic
> > cyberware (munchkinous or not) are forgetting something critical.
> Well, it gets worse than that.

I do so love it when Mr. Breton get's involved like this :)P

> First, you have an Otaku spend the (months/years/decades) needed to redo
> his 'personal OS' - upgrade to a cyber-less Wired Reflexes 3. That's
> already an *immense* advantage over the samurai, who has to pay for his
> in Nuyen, Essence, and probably high-placed favors -- and still have to
> worry about it breaking, needing maintenance, and other disasters.

Really, not even in our games is Wired a possibility, and we were saying that
MBW was a -possibility- because of how it worked.

> Well, now we're left with _Wired Reflexes as Computer Code_ -- meaning
> our friendly Otaku can upload the "Form" to the Matrix where all and
> sundry DL it, spend a lot less (months/years/decades) tweaking it to
> their personal system... and voila.
>
> Free cyberware with barely a fraction of the drawbacks of the "real"
> stuff.

Yes, but in your own words, look at what you would have them involved, were
even we allowing for it.

> See why this is munchkinous crud?

No M, I don't. I see where it's a suggestion and once again you (clipped
phrasology)...

-K

From:	"J. Keith Henry" <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject:	Re: Purpose of the Otaku
Date:	Fri, 13 Feb 1998 23:35:41 EST

Message no. 6 In a message dated 98-02-13 17:21:49 EST, erikj@****.COM writes:

> I still also maintain that Otaku with "cyberforms" simply goes totally
> against the spirit of what FASA intended. I'm one of those that will
> gleefully make or break rules, as long as I believe it is still in the
> spirit of the game and what FASA intended.
>
Replying to just this part...

Why is that everyone is making the leap into Bodyware and the like? We, Mike
and I, were stating the possibility of "Neural Cyberforms", stuff that
emulated a select areas, stuff you could readily see as additional "mods" to a
cyberdeck...stuff that many of the deckers we have in the games, RIGHT NOW do
frequently.

Deckers get bored with life, and PC Otaku are somewhat outcastish from the
-standard- Otaku anyway. They may want to emulate the world, find out that
you can interact with it both in and out of the Matrix.

That is a possible effect of the "DEEP RESONANCE" as they mention briefly in
VR2.

Yes, I am very frustrated because in MY definition, mbreton and others, are
immediately leaping into the "POWER MAD" shit that makes a combat monster. We
are more interested in making something that is team coordinator, like many
deckers and/or riggers turn out to be anyway. We are automatically assuming
that someone who gets into this is wanting to "develop the character" more.
AND, as we all know, playing a decker is difficult and often needs help.
Playing an "Otaku" variation would be even harder if the "cliche
outline" of
an Otaku were followed, such as what Erik is suggesting (which, for NPC's is
perfectly fine). But a PC is something entirely different, as I know we are
all aware of.

THAT is what makes a Munchkin, someone that immediately skips the development
and goes straight for the abuse. And that is a definition that a LOT of
people support, instead of something that is .... I don't know what.

Besides, that is what makes a game develop, the desire to test stuff. Some of
it works, some of it doesn't. Even we accept that (Oh if you only knew what
Durand and I whisper about behind all of your electronic backs - AND NO
Durand, please do NOT say anything).

-K

From:	Mike Bobroff <AirWisp@***.COM>
Subject:	Re: Purpose of the Otaku
Date:	Sun, 15 Feb 1998 06:40:28 EST

Message no. 7 In a message dated 98-02-13 16:48:41 EST, you write:

dbrueher wrote ...

> / The Otaku are not physical adepts. FASA never intended them to be combat
> / monsters.
>
> True. However, as the Otaku evolved, a new class of human may evolve
> that can emulate cyberware in much the same way that an Otaku
> emulates a deck.

I agree completely ...

> An Otaku hybrid could evolve with a sympathetic reaction to
> cyberware. If he hangs around a person with wired reflexes long
> enough he gains the benefits. Or maybe if he just handled cyberware
> (the son of a street doc) he could mimic it. It could also be some
> form of physical adept with a reliance on technology.

Actually, I see an Otaku being associated with a street doc as being something
any otaku should have ... it would allow them access to the cyber that they
would want to duplicate as a form later on down the road ..

> It would take some work to game balance it, but I could accept the
> possiblity.
>

Cool ...

Mike

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