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From:	Robert Nesius <nesius@******.COM>
Subject:	Question about Barriers
Date:	Mon, 25 May 1998 00:31:56 -0700

Message no. 1 Greetings all,
I have YAFQ - Yet Another Question. :)

This time the topic is regarding the Physical Barrier spell. Is it
possible to cast a physical barrier in the "wall form factor," and then
move that barrier around? I think what the player has in mind is
dropping down an elevator shaft, and throwing a phsyical barrier
up against the wall where the doors are and sliding his barrier
down the wall as he decends in case the doors pop open and people with
assault rifles are standing there.

The description for the spell in the BBB describes the spell manifesting
as either a "dome" or as a "flat wall." A "personal physical
barrier"
obviously moves around it's caster (right?) - but what about the big full
blown version?

What is the correct interpretation of this?

Thanks!
-Rob

From:	Cobra <wgallas@*****.FR>
Subject:	Re: Question about Barriers
Date:	Mon, 25 May 1998 09:47:36 +0200

Message no. 2 >This time the topic is regarding the Physical Barrier spell. Is it
>possible to cast a physical barrier in the "wall form factor," and then
>move that barrier around? I think what the player has in mind is
>dropping down an elevator shaft, and throwing a phsyical barrier
>up against the wall where the doors are and sliding his barrier
>down the wall as he decends in case the doors pop open and people with
>assault rifles are standing there.
>
>The description for the spell in the BBB describes the spell manifesting
>as either a "dome" or as a "flat wall." A "personal physical
barrier"
>obviously moves around it's caster (right?) - but what about the big full
>blown version?
>
>What is the correct interpretation of this?

Nobody can give you the correct interpretation but rather interpretation
with some arguments.

At first, the personnal barrier only means that you can only cast the spell
on you. That means that it is linked to you (since centered on you doesn't
apply with a wall). This doesn't allow you to cast it on a friend.

Then, I would state that an area effect spell moves with the target at
which it is cast. If you center the spell on you, it moves with you. If you
cast it on someone else or on a place, it moves with him or it.
Since barrier isn't a classical area effect effect spell, you need to
consider the objective of the caster. If the caster wants a wall before
him, the wall will be linked to him. If the caster wants a wall behind the
door, then the wall will be linked to the door.

- Cobra.

From:	Fade <runefo@***.UIO.NO>
Subject:	Re: Question about Barriers
Date:	Mon, 25 May 1998 10:23:42 +0000

Message no. 3 > >This time the topic is regarding the Physical Barrier spell. Is it
> >possible to cast a physical barrier in the "wall form factor," and then
> >move that barrier around? I think what the player has in mind is
> >dropping down an elevator shaft, and throwing a phsyical barrier
> >up against the wall where the doors are and sliding his barrier
> >down the wall as he decends in case the doors pop open and people with
> >assault rifles are standing there.
> >
> >The description for the spell in the BBB describes the spell manifesting
> >as either a "dome" or as a "flat wall." A "personal
physical barrier"
> >obviously moves around it's caster (right?) - but what about the big full
> >blown version?
> >
> >What is the correct interpretation of this?
>
> Nobody can give you the correct interpretation but rather interpretation
> with some arguments.

True. Here's my take on it.

Personal Barriers are simply barriers that must be cenetered on the
caster at the time of casting. Just like ordinary barriers it is not
mobile, it has a certain radius, etcetera. It may not be cast as a
wall as it must be cetered on the caster.

Reasoning:
AOE spells has not been mentioned as mobile, except in a special
case, hypersense spells. So ordinary barriers can therefore
be assumed to be immobile.

The personal modification means it may only be cast at the caster.
This is not expanded upon anywhere, and is open to interpretation,
but appears intended for spells like heal, combat sense, and so on.
Since it doesn't alter how the spell works other than where it can be
cast, it is therefore reasonable to assume the barrier spell works as
per the original description, except that, having to be centered on
the caster, it can only take the spehroid form and not the wall
shape.

We've been through this recently, I seem to recall. We didn't reach
any big conclusion... I might be wrong. Have a nice day!

--
Fade

And the Prince of Lies said:
"To reign is worth ambition, though in Hell:
Better to reign in hell than to serve in heaven."
-John Milton, Paradise Lost

From:	Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject:	Re: Question about Barriers
Date:	Mon, 25 May 1998 11:58:48 +0100

Message no. 4 Robert Nesius said on 0:31/25 May 98...

> This time the topic is regarding the Physical Barrier spell. Is it
> possible to cast a physical barrier in the "wall form factor," and then
> move that barrier around? I think what the player has in mind is
> dropping down an elevator shaft, and throwing a phsyical barrier
> up against the wall where the doors are and sliding his barrier
> down the wall as he decends in case the doors pop open and people with
> assault rifles are standing there.

We had a big discussion about this some months ago, brought up by me
asking opinions about a similar question. From that one, I can say the
opinions vary -- some people will agree with the above and allow the mage
to do what you describe, while others (like me) won't allow it.

My view on barrier spells is that they leave holes where obstacles are,
and if those obstacles are removed, the hole is instantly filled as far as
possible. IMHO the barrier can move with the caster, but only if there are
no obstacles blocking its path.

The barrier extends to its full size, even if that means it goes out of
LOS of the caster. In your example, the wall would probably extend out of
both sides of the elevator shaft, and so would stop descending with the
magician as soon as it encounters a floor outside the elevator shaft. The
caster would keep going down, though.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
"You haven't given me a headache. I like you."
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

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From:	Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject:	Re: Question about Barriers
Date:	Mon, 25 May 1998 12:35:26 EDT

Message no. 5 In a message dated 5/25/98 2:35:55 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
nesius@******.COM writes:

> This time the topic is regarding the Physical Barrier spell. Is it
> possible to cast a physical barrier in the "wall form factor," and then
> move that barrier around? I think what the player has in mind is
> dropping down an elevator shaft, and throwing a phsyical barrier
> up against the wall where the doors are and sliding his barrier
> down the wall as he decends in case the doors pop open and people with
> assault rifles are standing there.

This sounds like a Patrick, but I'm probably wrong... :)

> The description for the spell in the BBB describes the spell manifesting
> as either a "dome" or as a "flat wall." A "personal
physical barrier"
> obviously moves around it's caster (right?) - but what about the big full
> blown version?

This is where the confusion between two game systems come up. IIRC, the
actual, factual "Full Blown Version" (aka, non-personal) doesn't move around
at all. Once it is cast, it is cast, and that's it. No mobilities. Now is
that how I have played it in the past? No, but I do believe that is what is
actually is.

For some reason I remember this "Barrier" Conversation coming up before.

> What is the correct interpretation of this?

The -correct- interpretation is whatever works the best to help the game move
along. In that method, even the BBB is wrong fairly consistently.

-K

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