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From:	Robyn King-Nitschke <rking@********.COM>
Subject:	Question about spell locks 'n' barrier spells
Date:	Fri, 29 Mar 1996 09:28:08 -0800

Message no. 1 Heyo,

I'm new to the list (I was on it a long time ago, but had to
leave due to the traffic...)

Anyway, my GM has interpreted the rules for spell locks to
say that if you put a barrier spell in one of them and the
barrier is breached, the spell lock is either destroyed or the
spell is down to level 0 and therefore useless. I say this is
kinda silly, since examples of characters in the sourcebooks
and novels with barriers on spell locks abound, and anybody would
be a fool to do this under those circumstances.

Can someone point me to a place in the rules where it discusses
what happens to a barrier on a spell lock when it's gotten through?
GM has told me he will consider changing his mind if he sees it
in writing or if he hears it from an actual FASA person.

BTW, just a little relevant background on our campaign: it's low
lethality (we like character development over high power, but so far
it hasn't hurt our ability to get through punched-up versions of the
standard FASA modules), no Initiation is allowed (I finally got GM
to make up a set of severely modified Initiation rules, but they're
nothing like the ones in the book), and power levels are strictly
controlled (very little stuff from Shadowtech/Cybertechnology yet,
no bioware--one character just learned about Dikote after about a year
and a half of game time). GM is slowly introducing stuff in from the later
sourcebooks, but long-term playability is our prime concern.

Thanks a lot,
--Rat
(My SR page: http://www.best.com/~shadorat/shadorun.htm)

PS: My British mage PC, Winterhawk, takes great offense at the
comment about London being full of "stuck-up snobs." :-)

From:	TopCat <topcat@******.net>
Subject:	Re: Question about spell locks 'n' barrier spells
Date:	Sun, 31 Mar 1996 19:07:43 -0600

Message no. 2 >Heyo,

Heyas...

>I'm new to the list (I was on it a long time ago, but had to
>leave due to the traffic...)

Go digest, it's easier to keep up with if you don't have the time to go over
every message.

>Anyway, my GM has interpreted the rules for spell locks to
>say that if you put a barrier spell in one of them and the
>barrier is breached, the spell lock is either destroyed or the
>spell is down to level 0 and therefore useless. I say this is
>kinda silly, since examples of characters in the sourcebooks
>and novels with barriers on spell locks abound, and anybody would
>be a fool to do this under those circumstances.

Interesting question. I personally have never had to deal with it (hate
spell locks & foci), but I'll see what I can dig up...

No answer could be found in the Grimoire, Awakenings, or SRII. So here's my
take, if the spell is breached (not fired through, but fired at or attacked)
then the spell goes to a 0 rating. The spell lock isn't destroyed though.

>Can someone point me to a place in the rules where it discusses
>what happens to a barrier on a spell lock when it's gotten through?
>GM has told me he will consider changing his mind if he sees it
>in writing or if he hears it from an actual FASA person.

If you can wait a while, you might want to toss the question at FASAMike
<FASAMike@***.com>. As you might guess he's one of the official people to
ask questions to. But like I said, it'll take a while (he gets quite a bit
of mail).

------------------------------------------------------------
* Bob Ooton -- <topcat@******.net> *
* Golden Tiger Association -- Submission Fighting Team *
------------------------------------------------------------
* With the speed of a striking cobra he pulled his machine *
* pistol and jammed the muzzle against Mozart's nose. "I *
* put my gun on rock and roll, there nothing left of you *
* but ears, man." -- "Mozart in Mirrorshades" *
------------------------------------------------------------

From:	"Damion Milliken" <dam01@***.edu.au>
Subject:	Re: Question about spell locks 'n' barrier spells
Date:	Tue, 2 Apr 1996 21:08:04 +1000 (EST)

Message no. 3 Robyn King-Nitschke writes:

> I'm new to the list (I was on it a long time ago, but had to
> leave due to the traffic...)

Hi there and welcome back. I know the feeling about the volume. :-(

> Anyway, my GM has interpreted the rules for spell locks to
> say that if you put a barrier spell in one of them and the
> barrier is breached, the spell lock is either destroyed or the
> spell is down to level 0 and therefore useless. I say this is
> kinda silly, since examples of characters in the sourcebooks
> and novels with barriers on spell locks abound, and anybody would
> be a fool to do this under those circumstances.
>
> Can someone point me to a place in the rules where it discusses
> what happens to a barrier on a spell lock when it's gotten through?
> GM has told me he will consider changing his mind if he sees it
> in writing or if he hears it from an actual FASA person.

Well, I'm afraid that you're out of luck. Unless the point is taken up in
Awakenings (which I haven't got yet), then there is no official answer to
it. Barrier spells instruct us to treat them like barriers, but they are
also sustained. Now, when a normal barrier is penetrated (such as by passing
bullets or vehicles), it's Rating is reduced. When we apply this to Barrier
spells, we run into a problem - what happens when the Rating of the Barrier
spell gets down to zero? Well, you've got me, there is nothing that
explains what happens. Does the spell 'regenerate' back up to full Rating?
Does it gain Rating points back over time? Or is the spell simply destroyed
when the Barrier Rating reaches zero? I personally play the last, in that
the spell is destroyed if it's Rating gets all the way down to zero. So by
extension, I would rule the same as your GM if one of my players were to
spell lock a barrier spell.

By no means is this a difinitive answer.

--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong E-mail: dam01@***.edu.au

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From:	"Mark Steedman" <M.J.Steedman@***.rgu.ac.uk>
Subject:	Re: Question about spell locks 'n' barrier spells
Date:	Thu, 4 Apr 1996 12:30:10 GMT

Message no. 4 "Damion Milliken" writes

>
> Well, I'm afraid that you're out of luck. Unless the point is taken up in
> Awakenings (which I haven't got yet), then there is no official answer to
> it. Barrier spells instruct us to treat them like barriers, but they are
> also sustained. Now, when a normal barrier is penetrated (such as by passing
> bullets or vehicles), it's Rating is reduced. When we apply this to Barrier
> spells, we run into a problem - what happens when the Rating of the Barrier
> spell gets down to zero? Well, you've got me, there is nothing that
> explains what happens. Does the spell 'regenerate' back up to full Rating?
> Does it gain Rating points back over time? Or is the spell simply destroyed
> when the Barrier Rating reaches zero? I personally play the last, in that
> the spell is destroyed if it's Rating gets all the way down to zero. So by
> extension, I would rule the same as your GM if one of my players were to
> spell lock a barrier spell.
>
> By no means is this a difinitive answer.
>
The info that exists is in the main book, near the 'ganger, bike and
mana barrier example'. I rule force reduced as other barriers. The
FASA info ammounts to 'spell collapses if force ever reaches zero'
and 'spell refreshes to full on each of casting magicians actions',
that does not cover if it's locked quickened etc but using the
actions of the guy its on, elemental sustaining it or if all N/A
30,20,10 (same as FoF falling rules) should work.

Mark

Yes i have been lurking rather a lot. Very nearly back up to date, i
had some 850 odd messages over 10 days i was not reading the list to
catch up on, and they still keep comming in!

From:	seb@***.ripco.com (Sebastian Wiers)
Subject:	Re: Question about spell locks 'n' barrier spells
Date:	Sun, 7 Apr 1996 12:23:25 -0500 (CDT)

Message no. 5 {

On the cast{ng mages action, a sustained barrier spell is
automatically restored to full strength. This is explicitely stated in the
rules, the SRII book i believe, i'll ge{ back with a p#.
--
--Seb

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