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Message no. 1
From: shadowrunnerdingo@*****.com (Dingo)
Subject: Question Regarding Perception
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 13:02:23 -0700 (PDT)
Hey everyone.

I have been running Shadowrun for several years and
one thing that always brings a heated debate to my
gaming table is Astral Perception. Not just the
Physical Adept power, but the natural Dual nature of
some creatures and spirits. The debate is simply this:

What is the TN to see someone, Magically Active or
not, from Astral Space?

I would really like to hear how it is dealt with in
other games because we have a good deal of
disagreements regarding this subject.

Thanks

Dingo

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Message no. 2
From: dandrews67@*****.com (Donald Andrews)
Subject: Question Regarding Perception
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 17:33:59 -0700 (PDT)
--- Dingo <shadowrunnerdingo@*****.com> wrote:

> Hey everyone.
>
> I have been running Shadowrun for several years and
> one thing that always brings a heated debate to my
> gaming table is Astral Perception. Not just the
> Physical Adept power, but the natural Dual nature of
> some creatures and spirits. The debate is simply
> this:
>
> What is the TN to see someone, Magically Active or
> not, from Astral Space?
>
> I would really like to hear how it is dealt with in
> other games because we have a good deal of
> disagreements regarding this subject.
>
> Thanks
>
> Dingo
>


The only modifier I am aware of is a +2 to all
perception tests while on the astral. To perceive
those who are magically active I believe (and use) the
target's magic attribute is the base target number.

I simply add the +2 to all normal mods on the physical
plane.
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Message no. 3
From: maxnoel_fr@*****.fr (Max Noel)
Subject: Question Regarding Perception
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 03:03:20 +0200
On 13 Aug 2005, at 02:33, Donald Andrews wrote:

> The only modifier I am aware of is a +2 to all
> perception tests while on the astral. To perceive
> those who are magically active I believe (and use) the
> target's magic attribute is the base target number.
>
> I simply add the +2 to all normal mods on the physical
> plane.
>


The main difference between the physical and astral planes is
the way lighting works. In the astral, all life forms are light
sources -- magically and/or astrally active brighter than normal.
Where there are no life forms, I imagine the astral plane a dull,
nearly-uniform grey -- ever died in World of Warcraft? That would be it.

What this means in terms of rules is that I apply all normal
modifiers except for lighting, add a +2 if the character isn't dual-
natured, then slap a -2 on top of it if the target is astrally
active, and possible glare mods if there's a lot of background astral
activity or a large crowd (e.g. a concert).

-- Wild_Cat





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Message no. 4
From: tjlanza@************.com (Timothy J. Lanza)
Subject: Question Regarding Perception
Date: Fri, 12 Aug 2005 21:55:28 -0400
At 08:33 PM 8/12/2005, Donald Andrews wrote:
>The only modifier I am aware of is a +2 to all
>perception tests while on the astral. To perceive
>those who are magically active I believe (and use) the
>target's magic attribute is the base target number.

That's backwards. Characters with more Essence and/or Magic are /easier/ to
see on the Astral, not tougher. 10 - Magic, if you were establishing a TN,
but not equal to Magic.

--
Timothy J. Lanza
"When we can't dream any longer, we die." - Emma Goldman
Message no. 5
From: loneeagle@********.co.uk (Lone Eagle)
Subject: Question Regarding Perception
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 04:06:54 +0100
At 09:02 PM 8/12/2005, Dingo wrote:
>I have been running Shadowrun for several years and
>one thing that always brings a heated debate to my
>gaming table is Astral Perception. Not just the
>Physical Adept power, but the natural Dual nature of
>some creatures and spirits. The debate is simply this:
>
>What is the TN to see someone, Magically Active or
>not, from Astral Space?

I have always stated that the TN for perception tests in the Astral is 4 in
the same way as for the meat world (and IIRC the +2 is for doing things in
the meat world while astrally perceiving if not Dual natured).
Modifiers for cover (it doesn't matter if you're a light if you're hidden
under a bushel), stealth and such apply as normal (while living things may
be lights I do not see them as shedding light - as Yoda said, "Luminous
beings are we, not this crude matter" - otherwise you would be dazzled by
the microorganisms everywhere) and even lighting modifiers under specific
circumstances (if the bad guys have turned off the light in their office
specifically because it conceals them then that emotional reliance will
cloud one's view of them, similarly with smoke thrown as concealment
(though not the smoke of a house fire for example) although astral
perception, projection...etc is counted as having natural low light vision
to mitigate that.
Regardless of the amount of magic a person has the amount of light they
emit is the same, black shadows of cyberware will rarely make it difficult
to see someone... etc.
And finally - to detect technological devices their object resistance is
the base target.

Note that these are the rules we use, they aren't far from cannon IIRC and
they work for us, it's easy enough to appraise a situation but you don't
have the mages investigating every dark or occluded area because the +2
penalty is better than the penalty the Samurai's eyes give him. YMMV of course.


--
Lone Eagle
"Hold up lads, I got an idea."

www.wyrmtalk.co.uk - Please be patient, this site is under construction

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Message no. 6
From: weberm@*******.net (Ubiquitous)
Subject: Question Regarding Perception
Date: Fri, 09 Sep 2005 05:23:28 -0400
At 09:55 PM 8/12/2005 -0400, you wrote:
>At 08:33 PM 8/12/2005, Donald Andrews wrote:

>>The only modifier I am aware of is a +2 to all
>>perception tests while on the astral. To perceive
>>those who are magically active I believe (and use) the
>>target's magic attribute is the base target number.
>
>That's backwards. Characters with more Essence and/or Magic are /easier/ to
>see on the Astral, not tougher. 10 - Magic, if you were establishing a TN,
>but not equal to Magic.

Did the rules change? I thought those who were magically active were
quite obviously so when assensed.
--
"Ted, sweetheart...somebody's left a wicker basket with a little baby in it
on our front doorstep."
"Just leave it out there on the stoop, honey. The cats'll get it."
- Red Meat http://www.redmeat.com/redmeat/

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