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Message no. 1
From: Daniel Waisley <DJWA@******.UCC.NAU.EDU>
Subject: Railgun
Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1993 13:16:20 -0700
Ok, I do not know for sure, but I that the whole concept of railgun is that it
has NO friction. Its like the gauss cannon in battle tech. If fact I have seen
people make primative railguns. They took a LARGE magent, wrapped it in copper
wire, stuck a piece of metal on one end and then plugged the sucker in. Well
lets just say you don't want to get in its way.

Ok my idea of a rail gun - take one ferous metal rod - ammo.

now you have a tube. at one end is a magnet wrapped in wire. at the other
is an opening. all the way along the shaft are circular magnets wrapped in wire
also. You charge Mag 1 metal moves forword. then you successively charge the
other magnets (like a people mover but quicker) and it moves forward more.
there is no rubbing and no explosion. All you need is LOTS of power.
But hey - this is shadowrun - they have fussion (not fission) plants.
theres lots of power about.
Message no. 2
From: Cysgod ac dwr melys <MHILLIARD@******.BITNET>
Subject: Re: Railgun
Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1993 21:06:42 -0500
> concept of railgun is that it....s like the gauss cannon in battle tech.

No, it *IS* the Gauss Cannon in Battletech. They're just two words for the
same thing. The weapon is named (for those who don't know) for Dr. Erwin
Gauss, a 15th century mathmatician who experimented with magnetics.

>Ok my idea of a rail gun - take one ferous metal rod - ammo.
>now you have a tube. at one end is a magnet wrapped in wire. at the other
>is an opening.

I'm assuming you're muzzle-loading it (no mention of a breech). How heavy
is the ammo? If it takes two trolls and a dragon to load the damn thing,
it's not gonna have much of a ROF. And iron is pretty heavy...
Also, a plain old hardware-store steel rod is gonna tear the hell out o'
the bore.

>all the way along the shaft are circular magnets wrapped in wire
>also. You charge Mag 1 metal moves forword. then you successively charge the
>other magnets (like a people mover but quicker) and it moves forward more.

Uh, my conception of fizzhics is pretty fuzzy, so thwap me if I'm wrong,
but:
Won't the ammo lose kinetic energy between magnets? I think the magnets
would have to be pretty close together for each one to smoothly "grab" onto
the ammo.

>All you need is LOTS of power. But hey - this is shadowrun - they have fussion
>(not fission) plants. theres lots of power about.

And that's about as much power as you need.

=]
Phelan
Message no. 3
From: "Robert A. Hayden" <hayden@*******.MANKATO.MSUS.EDU>
Subject: Re: Railgun
Date: Fri, 1 Oct 1993 11:50:36 -0500
For my senior Physics project, me an another woman built a miniature rail
gun. It would shoot 1/2 steel balls.

The 'gun' consisted of four 200lb (pull) electro-magnets and four
photogates. The 'bullet' fit snugly into a rail created by two metal
rods and roll down the rods.

How it worked is such: when the power was turned on, all four magnets
were set to north (the ball has a south charge). The ball would race
down its rails attracted by the four magnets. As the ball passed each
magnet, it would trip a photogate which would order the Apple II
computer to reverse the charge in the magnet (thus pushing the ball
instead of pulling it). This would happen for each of the four magnets.

It sorta worked. When it did work, it would propel the steel ball at
sevel hundred feet-per-second (at least with enough intertia to bury
itself about an inch into a chunk of pine or heavily dent a 1cm slab of
steel). unfortunately, the whole setup weighed about 80 lbs and was very
bunky (the 'barrel' was about 4' long). Accuracy was also nil. We also
had a problem with the gun attracting everything metal for about 5'
around it (for example, the tube of iron filings that someone tipped over).

It also used A LOT of power.

We were going to make one that was 8' long with 10 or 12 magnets, but we
couldn't get the harware necessary for the computer to flip 12 photogates.

{[> Robert A. Hayden ____ <[} Question Authority
{[> \ /__ <]} -=-=-
{[> aq650@****.INS.CWRU.Edu \/ / <]} Finger for PGP 2.3a Public Key
{[> hayden@*******.mankato.msus.edu \/ <]} # include <std_disclaimer.h>
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Message no. 4
From: Todd Montgomery <tmont@****.WVU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Railgun
Date: Fri, 1 Oct 1993 13:26:25 -0400
From Hayde:
> It sorta worked. When it did work, it would propel the steel ball at
> sevel hundred feet-per-second (at least with enough intertia to bury
> itself about an inch into a chunk of pine or heavily dent a 1cm slab of
> steel). unfortunately, the whole setup weighed about 80 lbs and was very
> bunky (the 'barrel' was about 4' long). Accuracy was also nil. We also
> had a problem with the gun attracting everything metal for about 5'
> around it (for example, the tube of iron filings that someone tipped over).
>
> It also used A LOT of power.
>
> We were going to make one that was 8' long with 10 or 12 magnets, but we
> couldn't get the harware necessary for the computer to flip 12 photogates.

Hayden, you got me thinkin'. ANd that is a dangerous thing to have happen.

I assume when you say photogates, you mean something like a PhotoTransistor
or such. Correct?

Well, if so, then you could, if you really wanted to work on it again,
use a simple latch to flip the current loop in the electromagnet. This
is what a project did last year in one of the senior design projects
here. There project was a mag lev train miniature and it came down to
one week to go. They needed to get it running, so they just took out
the computer speed control and used a simple circuit like this.....
The only problem was the train would not stop. And the speed could
not be controlled. But the damn thing had 200 magnets, a 25 ft. track and
could attain speeds of about 200 mph (scaled of course).

Enough babble.

-- Quiktek
-- Todd Montgomery
tmont@****.wvu.edu
tmont@***.wvu.edu
un032507@*******.wvnet.edu
Message no. 5
From: What's this button do? <GRAFF85@********.CORTLAND.EDU>
Subject: rail-gun
Date: Fri, 8 Apr 1994 11:40:55 -0400
I'm looking for som e input on this one...i remeber seeing a blurb about the
stonewall mbt having a railgun. Just curious how does a rail gun work i have
the basic principals down...



@ = object with conductive strip on back
------- = negative rail
+++++++ = positive rail

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ^
@ i-x f-> b-| by lorentz's laws i think
-----------------------------

can someone tell me how the forces boil out and are reconciled

--Phlatline
----v^---v^---v^---v^---v^---v^---v^---v^---v^---v^---v^---v^---v^---v^---v^-
David Graff | GEEK CODE v1.0.1
339 Randall Hall | GS(CS)@ d+(---) p(-p+) c+(+++) l u- e* m---(*) s !n(n---)
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607.753.2783 |
--------------------------------------------------------Phlatline-------------
Message no. 6
From: "J. Long" <LONG2469@********.BITNET>
Subject: Re: rail-gun
Date: Fri, 8 Apr 1994 15:12:34 -0500
>I'm looking for some input on this one...i remeber seeing a blurb about the
>stonewall mbt having a railgun. Just curious how does a rail gun work i have
>the basic principals down...



>@ = object with conductive strip on back
>------- = negative rail
>+++++++ = positive rail

> +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ^
>@ i-x f-> b-| by lorentz's laws i think
> -----------------------------

>can someone tell me how the forces boil out and are reconciled

>--Phlatline

Phlatline:

Give me a little time, and I'll dig up some exact info for you. I will
most likely be using the "Fire Fusion & Steel" supplement for Traveller,
The new ERA, as my basis. This game is a 90% hard science based game,
almost all the technology, aside from starship thrust and jump-space travel
is based on hard facts. Perhaps the most exacting game I know of. I play it
when I want to play a game where pure reality rules, and I play SHADOWRUN when
I want to let fantasy take my technology as far as it can go. I'll get back
to you on satyrday the nineth with the data you need.

Stay Frosty,

Neuromancer
LONG2469@******.CC.PLATTSBURGH.EDU
Message no. 7
From: Matthew McCormick <mcormick@*****.COLOSTATE.EDU>
Subject: railgun?
Date: Fri, 8 Apr 1994 15:20:51 -0700
Speaking of railguns, I have an additional question about them. Do they
incur the same recoil that standard chemically propelled firearms do?
this has been a subject of debate amoung my friends and I, so all you
physics people out there, solve the debate for us.

thanks

your friend and physics idiot, Matt Mc.
The Grand Poobah!
Students for War & Oppression
@@@@ @ @ @@@@ Counter productive, highly destructive!
@ @ @@ @ @ @ ---
@@@@ @ @@ @ @ @ Celebrating the occurrences of War &
@ @ @@ @ @ @ Oppression since the dawn of time
@@@@ @@@@ @@@@ -- Even the planets were born in turmoil... --
Message no. 8
From: Gian-Paolo Musumeci <musumeci@***.LIS.UIUC.EDU>
Subject: Re: rail-gun
Date: Fri, 8 Apr 1994 18:38:22 -0500
IMHO, railguns eat _waaaaay_ too much power to be feasable without carrying
around a small fusion reactor =)
Message no. 9
From: Gian-Paolo Musumeci <musumeci@***.LIS.UIUC.EDU>
Subject: Re: railgun?
Date: Sat, 9 Apr 1994 13:31:54 -0500
I wouldn't think railguns have got recoil, especially not if they're being
magentically levitated.

ie:

+++++++++++++++++++++++++

>>>

_________________________

Item (>>>) is being suspended, magnetically or otherwise.
------------------------------------------------------------- /// ///
Gian-Paolo Musumeci caris9-4@****.edu \ // / /
University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign \ //// _/ /
\_ //// /
Nine megs for the secretaries fair, seven megs for the \___/ /
hackers scarce, five megs for the grads in smoky lairs, / \_
Three megs for system source; /,)-_( \_ \
One disk to rule them all, one disk to bind them, one disk (/ \\ /\\\\
to hold the files and in the darkness grind 'em. //
((`
Message no. 10
From: A cohort's CoHort <cohort@******.CONNECTED.COM>
Subject: Re: rail-gun
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 1994 07:44:19 -0700
On Fri, 8 Apr 1994, Gian-Paolo Musumeci wrote:

> IMHO, railguns eat _waaaaay_ too much power to be feasable without carrying
> around a small fusion reactor =)
>
What??? A common car battery can get off several (decently sized) shots
off a Gauss Gun today! By decently sized, I mean one of those concrete
"bricks" that are so common here in the US.

cohort@******.connected.com
-----=====-----
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
When all else fails, read the manual.
Message no. 11
From: A cohort's CoHort <cohort@******.CONNECTED.COM>
Subject: Re: railgun?
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 1994 08:00:48 -0700
On Sat, 9 Apr 1994, Gian-Paolo Musumeci wrote:

> +++++++++++++++++++++++++
>
> >>>
>
> _________________________
>
> Item (>>>) is being suspended, magnetically or otherwise.
This is an incorrect diagram. A more correct one falls below.

------||-------||-------||-------||-------||
>>> || || || || ||
------||-------||-------||-------||-------||
^^ ^^
Electromagnetic coils
The coils serve to pull the object (>>>) "forward" out the end. The
object must be made, at least in part, of a ferrous material. Mind you,
this can be as little as a steel "sheath" that discards after leaving the
barrel (DS round - leave the final coil "on" for longer than is neccesary).

cohort@******.connected.com
-----=====-----
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
When all else fails, read the manual.
Message no. 12
From: "Robert A. Hayden" <hayden@*******.MANKATO.MSUS.EDU>
Subject: Railgun
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 1994 13:21:26 -0500
To follow up on my last message:

We did not measure recoil, but the laws of inertia and motion state that
there must be SOME recoil, because the ammunition has mass. Thus, at the
same time the magnets pull the mass forward, the forces of the mass will
be pulling the magnet back (same for pushing).

Now, it is a very tiny mass, and most of the recoild will come from the
change in velocity, not so much from the mass itself.

In any cast, there must be recoil, unless mechanisms were built into the
weapon to absorb the recoil.

____ Robert A. Hayden <=> hayden@*******.mankato.msus.edu
\ /__ -=-=-=-=- <=> -=-=-=-=-
\/ / Finger for Geek Code Info <=> Political Correctness is
\/ Finger for PGP 2.3a Public Key <=> P.C. for "Thought Police"
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
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Message no. 13
From: Gian-Paolo Musumeci <musumeci@***.LIS.UIUC.EDU>
Subject: Re: rail-gun
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 1994 17:41:30 -0500
>> IMHO, railguns eat _waaaaay_ too much power to be feasable without carrying
>> around a small fusion reactor!

> [CoHort comments that a car battery can drive a gauss cannon]

I meant on the scale of a 155mm artillery piece, not a handheld thing.

If you've ever built one, contact me please -- I can get superconductive
materials, etc. and would like to experiment with said.
------------------------------------------------------------- /// ///
Gian-Paolo Musumeci caris9-4@****.edu \ // / /
University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign \ //// _/ /
\_ //// /
Nine megs for the secretaries fair, seven megs for the \___/ /
hackers scarce, five megs for the grads in smoky lairs, / \_
Three megs for system source; /,)-_( \_ \
One disk to rule them all, one disk to bind them, one disk (/ \\ /\\\\
to hold the files and in the darkness grind 'em. //
((`
Message no. 14
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Subject: Re: railgun?
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 1994 20:52:11 -0400
>>>>> "Matthew" == Matthew McCormick
<mcormick@*****.COLOSTATE.EDU> writes:

Matthew> Speaking of railguns, I have an additional question about them.
Matthew> Do they incur the same recoil that standard chemically propelled
Matthew> firearms do?

We have Sir Isaac Newton to thank for the answer to this one: for every
force there is an equivalent counterforce in the opposite direction. To
accelerate a projectile requires the application of a force in one
direction. Newton's third law states that there must be a force of
equivalent magnitude but opposite direction. It doesn't matter how the
force is applied, the counterforce /must/ be there.

The difference between a railgun and a chemical propellant is that the
chemical propellant exerts maximum force at the initial stage of
acceleration whereas the force applied by a railgun (or coilgun, much more
efficient than a railgun) is steady and constant. It's much like launching
a rocket at 15 gravities acceleration for one minute followed by coasting
versus a 1g acceleration for 15 minutes (as a guestimate; these numbers do
not add up). The same total force is applied, with the same final velocity,
but the magnitude of the forces involved is literally orders of magnitude
different.

--Rat, speaking as a (former) engineering student and son of a physics
teacher :).

|||| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | ||||
| Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> WWW Page: http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox |
| One likes to believe in the freedom of baseball. --Geddy Lee |
|||| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | ||||
Message no. 15
From: What's this button do? <GRAFF85@********.CORTLAND.EDU>
Subject: Rail-Gun
Date: Mon, 11 Apr 1994 00:22:56 -0400
Ok here i go i started this thing:

Rob: I would love to see the plans for this railgun. I am interested in it. I
like the idea of the photo gate but there has to be a better way of timing it.

Rest o' the gang:
Rail gun works on Lorentz's force. From what i remember there are _no_
electromagnets involved. It creates 2 _basic_ magnetic fields. one of which is
created by the rails. (use the left-hand rule for this one..this is where i am
having trouble figuring out the e/m fields) the other is created by a
conductive strip on the back of the projectile which is a chunk of plastic in
the shape and approximate size of a rubic's cube with a conductive strip on the
back. The cube is placed just behind the "rail" and is slightly started by a
compressed gas such as argon or other inert gas. When the strip contacts the 2
charged rails it is then propelled by the above mentioned force, by which it is
gently acclerated (read as given a real kick in the *ss).

The demo that i saw a few years ago was during the huge stink about
SDI. The demo consited of a test firing into a momentum barrier of some
unkonwn mass that also was filled with 30 or so San Diego(probably as big as
the new york yellow pages :) phone books. When fired at point blank the
barrier (which was suspended from a rack that allowed movement) was kicked a
full meter and all that was see was flaming leaves from the phone books. The
cube was to say the least a bit of a mess. If anyone can dig up the dirt on
this one i would appreciate it.

--Phlatline (up to no good with this one....:)
----v^---v^---v^---v^---v^---v^---v^---v^---v^---v^---v^---v^---v^---v^---v^-
David Graff | GEEK CODE v1.0.1
339 Randall Hall | GS(CS)@ d+(---) p(-p+) c+(+++) l u- e* m---(*) s !n(n---)
Cortland, Ny 13045| h* f+(--) g++ w+++ t++(---) r(++) y+
607.753.2783 |
--------------------------------------------------------Phlatline-------------
Message no. 16
From: "Robert A. Hayden" <hayden@*******.MANKATO.MSUS.EDU>
Subject: Re: Rail-Gun
Date: Sun, 10 Apr 1994 23:44:02 -0500
On Mon, 11 Apr 1994, What's this button do? wrote:

> Ok here i go i started this thing:
>
> Rob: I would love to see the plans for this railgun. I am interested in it. I
> like the idea of the photo gate but there has to be a better way of timing it.

For the crudity of the equipment, photgates provided the best way to
automatically change the polarity of the coils within a fraction of a
second that it tood the projectile to go from being pulled to being pushed.

____ Robert A. Hayden <=> hayden@*******.mankato.msus.edu
\ /__ -=-=-=-=- <=> -=-=-=-=-
\/ / Finger for Geek Code Info <=> Political Correctness is
\/ Finger for PGP 2.3a Public Key <=> P.C. for "Thought Police"
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
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n-(---) h+(*) f+ g+ w++ t++ r++ y+(*)
Message no. 17
From: What's this button do? <GRAFF85@********.CORTLAND.EDU>
Subject: Re: Rail-Gun
Date: Mon, 11 Apr 1994 00:45:00 -0400
>For the crudity of the equipment, photgates provided the best way to
>automatically change the polarity of the coils within a fraction of a
>second that it tood the projectile to go from being pulled to being pushed.

I thought that would have been taken into account there. With today's computers
do you think it's possible to measure the amount of accell and time taken to
reach point b and cascade a timer to do the reversing of polarities?

--Dave
Message no. 18
From: Nightfox <DJWA@******.UCC.NAU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Rail-Gun
Date: Mon, 11 Apr 1994 20:47:45 -0700
>>For the crudity of the equipment, photgates provided the best way to
>>automatically change the polarity of the coils within a fraction of a
>>second that it tood the projectile to go from being pulled to being pushed.
>
>I thought that would have been taken into account there. With today's computers
>do you think it's possible to measure the amount of accell and time taken to
>reach point b and cascade a timer to do the reversing of polarities?

Yes - you should be able to calculate how much time each thing part takes.
Right now in physics lab we have been using the computer to get
Displacement
Velocity
Acceleration
Force
Period (of a pendullum)
Speed (of a pendullum)


You would need to find out what type of software and hardware would be required,
but it is out there.



BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!
Daniel Waisley + SCA - March of Ered Sul - Flagstaff AZ
DJWA@******.UCC.NAU.EDU + Nau fencing club.
"Nightfox" + Brotherhood of the Cryptic Demesne -household
BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!
GE - d+(-) -p+@ c++(++++) !L u(--) e+(*) m+ s+/ !n+(-) h* f+ g+ w+++ t+ r+ y+
"infinity = zero" - Daniel Waisley "Nightfox"
BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!
Message no. 19
From: What's this button do? <GRAFF85@********.CORTLAND.EDU>
Subject: Re: Rail-Gun
Date: Tue, 12 Apr 1994 10:00:36 -0400
cool i like that i dea

--Daev give me a hollar if y ou have any ideas on ibm/compat software

--Dave

Further Reading

If you enjoyed reading about Railgun, you may also be interested in:

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