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Message no. 1
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Rebuilding R2: part 1: Engines
Date: Mon, 11 May 1998 20:58:43 -0500
Okay, lets start this R2 project with the powerplants ...

Can anybody get me the volumes of some engines in RL as well as the work
(in a Physics sense) they do or the force they exert... whatever. Also
can someone work out a gear distribution for exchanging speed and load
based on the type of engine (ie Crankshaft/piston, turbine, Jet, etc...)?

(would acceleration change as you exchange Load and speed?)

Also, any suggestions on how econmy should be figured into this? a ratio
between three parties?

All this ought to make choosing powerplants *much* easier ... ( now ya
can have the rocket bike you always wanted ...)

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum)

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Message no. 2
From: Wafflemeisters <evamarie@**********.NET>
Subject: Rebuilding R2: part 1: Engines
Date: Tue, 12 May 1998 14:12:33 -0500
> Rebuilding R2: part 1: Engines (Alfredo B Alves , Mon 20:58)
>
> Okay, lets start this R2 project with the powerplants ...
>
> Can anybody get me the volumes of some engines in RL as well as the work
> (in a Physics sense) they do or the force they exert... whatever. Also
> can someone work out a gear distribution for exchanging speed and load
> based on the type of engine (ie Crankshaft/piston, turbine, Jet, etc...)?

I would assume volume was about 30-100 percent that allowed for other
uses (IE, max CF)- making the vehicle form 1/6 to 1/2 engine. This would
depend greatly on vehicle type.

>
> (would acceleration change as you exchange Load and speed?)

I'd expect load x accelration = speed, or at least, thats a crude
aproximation.

>
> Also, any suggestions on how econmy should be figured into this? a ratio
> between three parties?
>

Thats a toughy, because power plants have difernt "ideal conditions"-
some designs work well for heavyloads and low speed, others justthe
opposite,econom,ywise. I'd say, genrally, econmy would decrese at least
as the square root of max speed- fast plants guzzle gass at all speeds,
compared to slow ones. Load would DIRECTLY affect economy- decreasing
weight is the BEST way to save fuel, genrally.



> All this ought to make choosing powerplants *much* easier ... ( now ya
> can have the rocket bike you always wanted ...)

HAH. Not me, chummer. I like to keep my bones in large chunks.

-Mongoose
Message no. 3
From: Airwasp <Airwasp@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Rebuilding R2: part 1: Engines
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 00:47:25 EDT
In a message dated 5/12/98 6:44:46 PM !!!First Boot!!!,
evamarie@**********.net writes:

> > Rebuilding R2: part 1: Engines (Alfredo B Alves , Mon 20:58)
> >
> > Okay, lets start this R2 project with the powerplants ...
> >
> > Can anybody get me the volumes of some engines in RL as well as the work
> > (in a Physics sense) they do or the force they exert... whatever. Also
> > can someone work out a gear distribution for exchanging speed and load
> > based on the type of engine (ie Crankshaft/piston, turbine, Jet, etc...)?

Ok, I am going to pipe in something really quick. I understand the
dissatisfaction some people have with the game, in particular with the R2 for
this post / thread, but I have to say this.

Work with the system. If you want something that carries a larger load, do
what I did.

I hated the limitations on electric engines in terms of load, as I thought
they were sort of pissantish (?!?). So, working with what was in the rules, I
modified the power plants to be able to carry a heavier load. This had a
price though, the engine cost trebled and the signature of the vehicle dropped
by two.

So, for those of you who want to bring RL things of the complexity of vehicle
engines into the game, think of taking something that is in the system already
and just perform the mods you need and be reasonable with the cost of the
"new" engine.

As for completely changing the R2, I believe that Jon Szeto has done a
wonderful job with making something that can work within the SR system and
even have room to enhance just about everything else within the gaming system.

Has anyone considered applying any of the vehicle options onto other things ?
Like Mil-spec armor ? Long Coats, Watches ? Arrows ?

There is one thing that is also something I enjoy about the R2, although it is
mostly a rulebook (which a lot of people hate), I consider it as the most
useful book for non-mages of all of the books (although deckers need VR2 just
as badly.

Guys, IMHO, bringing RL stuff into the games to get something realistic into
the games is something that is going to take you a very, and I mean very, long
time to do. And I wish you the best of luck.

But I'm gonna stick by my the R2 book, as it is canon, and perhaps one of the
best sourcebooks to have come out.

Mike (bowing to the great god Szeto)
Message no. 4
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Rebuilding R2: part 1: Engines
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 02:06:15 -0500
On Thu, 14 May 1998 00:47:25 EDT Airwasp <Airwasp@***.COM> writes:
>In a message dated 5/12/98 6:44:46 PM !!!First Boot!!!,
>evamarie@**********.net writes:
<SNIP>

>Ok, I am going to pipe in something really quick. I understand the
>dissatisfaction some people have with the game, in particular with the
R2 for
>this post / thread, but I have to say this.
>
>Work with the system. If you want something that carries a larger load,
do
>what I did.
<SNIP Sugesstion>

>So, for those of you who want to bring RL things of the complexity of
vehicle
>engines into the game, think of taking something that is in the system
already
>and just perform the mods you need and be reasonable with the cost of
the
>"new" engine.
>
>As for completely changing the R2, I believe that Jon Szeto has done a
>wonderful job with making something that can work within the SR system
and
>even have room to enhance just about everything else within the gaming
>system.

I don't wanna change the system so much as change any stats that I think
are wrong ... (no offense, Mr Szeto :)

>Has anyone considered applying any of the vehicle options onto other
things ?
>Like Mil-spec armor ? Long Coats, Watches ? Arrows ?

Hmmm... Do you mean the Quality Factors? Yes, the thought occured to me
... as well as applying it Bio/Cyberware ... (anybody interested in a
Prototype Move-By-Wire system? <EG>)

>There is one thing that is also something I enjoy about the R2, although
it is
>mostly a rulebook (which a lot of people hate), I consider it as the
most
>useful book for non-mages of all of the books (although deckers need VR2
just
>as badly.

It's great rulebook but I think some of the stats are off ... It's my
favorite SB, second only to VR 2.0

>Guys, IMHO, bringing RL stuff into the games to get something realistic
into
>the games is something that is going to take you a very, and I mean
very, long
>time to do. And I wish you the best of luck.
>
>But I'm gonna stick by my the R2 book, as it is canon, and perhaps one
of the
>best sourcebooks to have come out.
>
>Mike (bowing to the great god Szeto)

It'll be work and I'll have more time for it during the summer but, IMO,
it'll be worth it :)
I'm using RL physics to figure out the stats then I'll switch em to R2
and maybe modify a game mechanism or 2 ... I'll try not to as much as
possible though :)

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum)

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
Message no. 5
From: Airwasp <Airwasp@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Rebuilding R2: part 1: Engines
Date: Thu, 14 May 1998 05:07:46 EDT
In a message dated 5/14/98 7:12:24 AM !!!First Boot!!!, dghost@****.COM
writes:

> >As for completely changing the R2, I believe that Jon Szeto has done a
> >wonderful job with making something that can work within the SR system
> and
> >even have room to enhance just about everything else within the gaming
> >system.
>
> I don't wanna change the system so much as change any stats that I think
> are wrong ... (no offense, Mr Szeto :)

Okay, I thought you were going to rewrite the thing ...

> >Has anyone considered applying any of the vehicle options onto other
> things ?
> >Like Mil-spec armor ? Long Coats, Watches ? Arrows ?
>
> Hmmm... Do you mean the Quality Factors? Yes, the thought occured to me
> ... as well as applying it Bio/Cyberware ... (anybody interested in a
> Prototype Move-By-Wire system? <EG>)

No, I mean apply vehicle mods to other things. Like applying Suncell onto
Mil-Spec Armor. Like putting Structural Agility into a Long Coat to be able
to make the thing move on it's own. Like putting RAM onto a long coat. Like
putting Sensors I into a Long Coat or something similar. This is what I mean.

> >There is one thing that is also something I enjoy about the R2, although
> it is
> >mostly a rulebook (which a lot of people hate), I consider it as the
> most
> >useful book for non-mages of all of the books (although deckers need VR2
> just
> >as badly.
>
> It's great rulebook but I think some of the stats are off ... It's my
> favorite SB, second only to VR 2.0
>
> >Guys, IMHO, bringing RL stuff into the games to get something realistic
> into
> >the games is something that is going to take you a very, and I mean
> very, long
> >time to do. And I wish you the best of luck.
> >
> >But I'm gonna stick by my the R2 book, as it is canon, and perhaps one
> of the
> >best sourcebooks to have come out.
> >
> >Mike (bowing to the great god Szeto)
>
> It'll be work and I'll have more time for it during the summer but, IMO,
> it'll be worth it :)
> I'm using RL physics to figure out the stats then I'll switch em to R2
> and maybe modify a game mechanism or 2 ... I'll try not to as much as
> possible though :)

Hmm, perhaps consider the mods you are making to be more of an advancement in
SOTA for the engines. This way the engines in the book are still available,
it is just that newer, more expensive engines are also available that are able
to do more. What do you think ?

Mike

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