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Message no. 1
From: "Frank R. Glinka" <fglinka@***.UNI-KASSEL.DE>
Subject: Riggers & Drones
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 14:13:04 +0100
Hmmm .... I have some problems with the rigger in our group.
In his point of view his job is to control a Steel Lynx, sitting in his
armored car and firing with Panther Assault Cannons, while the Sams
(after having their breakfast) are collecting enemy weapons etc.
My Questions :
- What IS the riggerïs job in SR ?
- Which drones can be controlled rigged / fully rigged by him ?
- What is the availibility code of MilTec / Security drones ?

Sorry about my English.

Feel free to answer in German (hehe).

-- =

(( If you`re in doubt, empty the magazine ))
(( -------------------------------------- ))
(( Frank Glinka, GM der "Nachtw”lfe" ))
(( Kassel, Germany ))
Message no. 2
From: Peter David Boddy <pdboddy@****.CARLETON.CA>
Subject: Re: Riggers & Drones
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 11:53:36 EST
Frank R. Glinka writes:
>
> Hmmm .... I have some problems with the rigger in our group.
> In his point of view his job is to control a Steel Lynx, sitting in his
> armored car and firing with Panther Assault Cannons, while the Sams
> (after having their breakfast) are collecting enemy weapons etc.
> My Questions :
> - What IS the riggerïs job in SR ?
> - Which drones can be controlled rigged / fully rigged by him ?
> - What is the availibility code of MilTec / Security drones ?

The riggers job can be whatever job he can do using his skills. Some
riggers are more mechanics than others, some are combat riggers, others
are chauffeurs, and some just control buildings. You can't expect all
riggers to be able to shoot and fight like Sams, just like you can't
expect Sams to be able to drive, fix and fight with all types of vehicles.

Any drone can be rigged by any rigger, providing the drone has the right
equipment, and the rigger has the right Remote Operations skill (though he
can default though other skills).

As for the availability costs, I dunno, a friend of mine is borrowing some
of my SR books, can't find my Riggers Black Book.

Pete

Pete aka Spitfire
Test your might...
at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/8920/index.html
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Peter David Boddy
Carleton University
Email address: pdboddy@****.carleton.ca
Email address: bx955@*******.carleton.ca
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 3
From: Edward Poe <hedley@********.COM>
Subject: Re: Riggers & Drones
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 21:25:32 -0600
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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[big snip]

> As for the availability costs, I dunno, a friend of mine is borrowing
some
> of my SR books, can't find my Riggers Black Book.
>
> Pete

As for the availability of MilSpec hardware, my players can only get to it
if they have a military/mercenary background and have a dealer contact. A
dealer is the merc's equivalent to a fixer.

I got this from the Fields of Fire sourcebook.

Edward Poe
Shadowrun GM
Senior Systems Engineer, PC Net, Inc. (read corp decker)
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<html><head></head><BODY
bgcolor="#FFFFFF"><p><font size=2 =
color="#000000" face="Arial">[big
snip]<br><br>&gt; As for the =
availability costs, I dunno, a friend of mine is borrowing some<br>&gt; =
of my SR books, can't find my Riggers Black Book.<br>&gt; <br>&gt; =
Pete<br><br>As for the availability of MilSpec hardware, my players can =
only get to it if they have a military/mercenary background and have a =
dealer contact. &nbsp;A dealer is the merc's equivalent to a =
fixer.<br><br>I got this from the Fields of Fire =
sourcebook.<br><br>Edward Poe<br>Shadowrun GM<br>Senior Systems =
Engineer, PC Net, Inc. &nbsp;(read corp decker)</p>
</font></body></html>
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Message no. 4
From: GRANITE <granite@**.NET>
Subject: Re: Riggers & Drones
Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 21:20:16 -0700
> From: "Frank R. Glinka" <fglinka@***.UNI-KASSEL.DE>
> Hmmm .... I have some problems with the rigger in our group.
> In his point of view his job is to control a Steel Lynx,

First question..What is he doing with this drone?? Is he some kind of
Merc?? If he's not close down the supply line to this sort of
weaponry...
Now I do realise that if you know where to look you can litterally
find anything..Heck I know right where to go here on the Web to
purchase milspec vehicles..But that is beside the point..If the
character doesn't have the proper background -Don't- make this sort
of equipment available..

> sitting in his
> armored car and firing with Panther Assault Cannons, while the Sams
> (after having their breakfast) are collecting enemy weapons etc.

If you don't like this take his cacoon away from him..I'll wager he
doesn't have a portable remote control deck..Fire a couple of armour
peircing missles at the guy's cacoon and catch it on fire..then he
will have to get physically involved..Now having said that I play a
Rigger in much the same way as you discribe..

> My Questions :
> - What IS the riggerïs job in SR ?

IMHO- To provide support to the team..I accomplish this by Remote
controlling drones of all types..If your player is a little too
dependant on one type of drone don't give him situations where the old sta=
nd
by will be able to work..force him into growth..He'll thank you for
it later..
I as a Rigger try never to leave my vehicle on a run..Afterall who
will drive the getaway van?? The Rigger that's who..So in order to
stay in the game I use Drones..And in this manner I am able to stay
apart of the action..
And because my meat has to hang out in the van..It of course is
heavily armoured..But -do not- forget about what happend to the
rigger if he is still actively controlling a drone when it gets
damaged..FeedBack! OUCH..THis is the damaging balance to the game for
a Rigger..Nobody simply gets to sit back and watch the
action..Everyone has the potential to get Fragged at any time...

> - Which drones can be controlled rigged / fully rigged by him ?

All drones and Most vehicles..And to the more creative All vehicles
:)

> - What is the availibility code of MilTec / Security drones ?

Extremely high!!! Security drones are much easier to get than
MilDrones..

> Sorry about my English.

Nothing wrong with your english that I spotted..Don't be sorry...!

> Feel free to answer in German (hehe).


It would not be pretty....[shudder]...It has been -many years since I
tried to leard German...And I never was any good at it..I was much
better at Spanish and Russian was fun..But I never mastered those
either..
-------------------------------GRANITE
==========================
==========================
===============
Lord, Grant Me The Serenity To Accept The Things I Cannot Change,
The Courage To Change The Things I Can,
And The Wisdom To Hide The Bodies Of Those People I Had To Kill
Because They Pissed Me Off.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ShadowRunner's Serenity Prayer
==========================
==========================
===============
Message no. 5
From: Mark Steedman <M.J.Steedman@***.RGU.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Riggers & Drones
Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 11:27:40 GMT
GRANITE writes

> > From: "Frank R. Glinka" <fglinka@***.UNI-KASSEL.DE>
> > Hmmm .... I have some problems with the rigger in our group.
> > In his point of view his job is to control a Steel Lynx,
>
> First question..What is he doing with this drone?? Is he some kind of
> Merc?? If he's not close down the supply line to this sort of
> weaponry...
>
And then theres lonestars likely response to seeing a milspec drone
rumbling down the street (ok it has uses like immune to most NPC's
but!)
Also try firing things like netguns at the beastie, if it cannot move
its no threat and i'd like to see it get itself out :)

> > sitting in his
> > armored car and firing with Panther Assault Cannons, while the Sams
> > (after having their breakfast) are collecting enemy weapons etc.
>
> If you don't like this take his cacoon away from him..I'll wager he
> doesn't have a portable remote control deck..Fire a couple of armour
> peircing missles at the guy's cacoon and catch it on fire..then he
> will have to get physically involved..Now having said that I play a
> Rigger in much the same way as you discribe..
>
Simply the best way. If you don't have to get shot at don't!
Do however use lots and lots of drones so you can see whats going on,
a drone on high survalence over the target is generally stealthier
than an astral mage, and its a free action fot the rigger to switch
to being the steel lynx backing up the penetration phase, now the
astral mage cannot usually pull that one! [unless he wants to leave a
very vulnerable body lying about]

> > - What IS the riggeris job in SR ?
Recon and heavy support, plus transport, if iuts in the riggers van
chances are the cops cannot see it :)

>
> IMHO- To provide support to the team..I accomplish this by Remote
> controlling drones of all types..
not just the ones with the big guns on them.

> And because my meat has to hang out in the van..It of course is
> heavily armoured..But -do not- forget about what happend to the
> rigger if he is still actively controlling a drone when it gets
> damaged..FeedBack! OUCH..THis is the damaging balance to the game for
> a Rigger.
unless you know the bit of bioware that makes you immune :)

Mark
Message no. 6
From: Mark Steedman <M.J.Steedman@***.RGU.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Riggers & Drones
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 08:37:05 GMT
Granite writes

[for some reason only i got it?]
Could be the same problem as before the newer list software does not
always set the reply to field to the list address, check other fields.

> > And then theres lonestars likely response to seeing a milspec drone
> > rumbling down the street
>
> Absolutely..Increase the LS force response..Instead of simply sending
> a patrol car [which should be enough to scare off any sensable
> ShadowRunner]
Where theres one copper there can rappidly be a small army. Sure you
can drop one nissan patrol 1's worth in a complex action, what about
the two swat teams that will show up to investigate?

> send in a couple of Helos...
>
'F series upgrade yellowjackets' seem to have the desired effect, for
some strange reason i haven't had to decide (on the rare occasion one
gets seen) on the standard size cannon carried yet, 'you can hear
choppers' is often enough.
I take a similar approach when playing 'you said ...... is comming, i
dive for cover!', now whats going on.

> > Also try firing things like netguns at the beastie, if it cannot move
> > its no threat and i'd like to see it get itself out :)
>
> Or better yet use a Monowhip against one of the things legs..Of
> concentrate some weapons fire on one of those itty bitty tires..If it
> gets a blow out or three maneuverability will be greatly reduced...
>

> I started out on Magic users and really liked them..But when I
> discovered Riggers I found that I liked them even better..
>
> > >But -do not- forget about what happens to the
> > > rigger if he is still actively controlling a drone when it gets
> > > damaged..FeedBack! OUCH..THis is the damaging balance to the game for
> > > a Rigger.
>
> > unless you know the bit of bioware that makes you immune :)
>
> HHmmmm..Are you talking about..damage compensators,
> pain Editor, Trauma Damper.
Thats the right one i think. Immune to feedback from exploding
drones, as that only does an L stun and -1 box stun off that is
nothing.

>.None of them maake a body imune..they
> simply allow the user to continue to function at least for a
> while..But the damage is still there...And there is no getting past
> that ..except of course with either time or magic :)
Oh theres no immunity to damage, though a nice thick wall between you
and the problem helps :), and if you have half a body full of cyber
even magical healing can be next thing to useless.

Mark
Message no. 7
From: GRANITE <granite@**.NET>
Subject: Re: Riggers & Drones
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 23:12:00 -0700
> From: Mark Steedman <M.J.Steedman@***.rgu.ac.uk>
> [for some reason only i got it?]

My mailer grabbed the wrong line..I will have to be more careful...

> ....., what about
> the two swat teams that will show up to investigate?

[Shiver]..That brings back bad memories...Some of the guys on my team
got uneasy..and ended up attacking a LS cruiser..Blew it all the
pieces..But ended up getting tagged be a drone and SWAT X2 showed up
on our doorstep shortly there after...UGH! My character ended up
doing 3 years..1 with good time...

> ..... 'you can hear
> choppers' is often enough.

Funny how that works isn't it :)

> > HHmmmm..Are you talking about..damage compensators,
> > pain Editor, Trauma Damper.

> Thats the right one i think. Immune to feedback from exploding
> drones, as that only does an L stun and -1 box stun off that is
> nothing.


I personally don't like any of these so called improvements..They are
all too damgerous..A PC can croak and not even realise he is injured
in the first place...No thanks...

> Oh theres no immunity to damage, though a nice thick wall between you
> and the problem helps :),

In the short term perhaps...It might get a body through a single
conflict..But if they have to go on dialasys because they got bullet
holes in both kidneys..It doesn't really make for a good trade off..

> and if you have half a body full of cyber
> even magical healing can be next thing to useless.

Or any other kind for that matter..unless they are specialists..And
that of course means more -Y-
-------------------------------GRANITE
=================================================================
Lord, Grant Me The Serenity To Accept The Things I Cannot Change,
The Courage To Change The Things I Can,
And The Wisdom To Hide The Bodies Of Those People I Had To Kill
Because They Pissed Me Off.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ShadowRunner's Serenity Prayer
Message no. 8
From: Mark Steedman <M.J.Steedman@***.RGU.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Riggers & Drones
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 12:31:58 GMT
GRANITE writes
>
> My mailer grabbed the wrong line..I will have to be more careful...
>
seems to be a common problem, but thankfully the only one with he
present list software. We haven't had any 'sorry it crashed' reports
form Mark recently so i assume everything else is good.

> > ....., what about
> > the two swat teams that will show up to investigate?
>
> [Shiver]..That brings back bad memories...Some of the guys on my team
> got uneasy..and ended up attacking a LS cruiser..
1st lesson, the cops have backup!

> Blew it all the
> pieces..
no suprise

> But ended up getting tagged be a drone and SWAT X2 showed up
> on our doorstep shortly there after...UGH!
who ignored lesson 1, there lots more cops where those 2 came from!

> My character ended up
> doing 3 years..1 with good time...
>
Sounds like you just got caught in the roundup, but the way you tell
it you wern't responsible for the actions in the first place.

> > ..... 'you can hear
> > choppers' is often enough.
>
> Funny how that works isn't it :)
>
they get wise, or some just are sensible in the first place.

> I personally don't like any of these so called improvements..They are
> all too damgerous..A PC can croak and not even realise he is injured
> in the first place...No thanks...
>
Thats why you stick to the ones that reduce actual damage, not really
deadly kit like pain editors. Now those are silly, so far i have
pursuaded players to leave them alone, i mean, your hit. No you roll
dice the character knows nothing, no you haven't a clue if you dodged
it yet, like to spend some more karma!

> > Oh theres no immunity to damage, though a nice thick wall between you
> > and the problem helps :),
>
> In the short term perhaps...It might get a body through a single
> conflict..But if they have to go on dialasys because they got bullet
> holes in both kidneys..It doesn't really make for a good trade off..
>
Thats why you use thick walls, what they cannot hit cannot get hurt.

Mark
Message no. 9
From: GRANITE <granite@**.NET>
Subject: Re: Riggers & Drones
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 21:21:20 -0700
> From: Mark Steedman <M.J.Steedman@***.RGU.AC.UK>
>...... We haven't had any 'sorry it crashed' reports
> form Mark recently so i assume everything else is good.

That is true..All of the recent outages can be atributed to line
problems not software probs..I suppose we should count ourselved
fortunate...

> 1st lesson, the cops have backup!

And lots of it...

> > But ended up getting tagged be a drone and ......
> who ignored lesson 1, there lots more cops where those 2 came from!

Yup..And with huge bugets for all the gadgets and gear they want...

> Sounds like you just got caught in the roundup, but the way you tell
> it you wern't responsible for the actions in the first place.

Right..When they announced come out with your hands up..My character
was one of the first out..Some stayed to die in a hail of lead...2
died in a fight in prison..yes they role played it out..
All they had to do was -wait- but they got antsy..then they over
reacted..and all hell broke loose..My character freaked out..But by
the time he was able to start to do something about it..things had
gone too far...

> Thats why you stick to the ones that reduce actual damage, not really
> deadly kit like pain editors. Now those are silly,

To say the very least..It is like the combat drugs..Take them and
die..Hmmm..sounds like something to avoid...

>...... i mean, your hit. No you roll
> dice the character knows nothing, no you haven't a clue if you dodged
> it yet, like to spend some more karma!

LOL..Exactly my point...

> Thats why you use thick walls, what they cannot hit cannot get hurt.

That is the way I like to play a Rigger..nice and snug in a metal and
ceramic cocoon.. :)
-------------------------------GRANITE
=================================================================
Lord, Grant Me The Serenity To Accept The Things I Cannot Change,
The Courage To Change The Things I Can,
And The Wisdom To Hide The Bodies Of Those People I Had To Kill
Because They Pissed Me Off.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ShadowRunner's Serenity Prayer

Further Reading

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