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Message no. 1
From: WILLIAM FRIERSON <will1am@*****.ASU.EDU>
Subject: Rigging Question
Date: Fri, 14 Jul 1995 04:32:54 -0700
I have a question about riggers that isn't too clear in the books (SR II, RBB,
FoF). When a rigger has a drone with the other characters, and is not fighting
other vehicles, when do they gp in the turn sequence?

Do they make a position test against the bad guys? The way I handled it this
last weekend was to let the rigger run his drones at the normal initiative
count, and every 10 counts after that, as if the rigger was using a weapon
instead of a drone (otherwise, why get high levels of vehicle control rigging).

What's the official ruling, since it's not too clear.

Thanks.


--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
William Frierson Internet: WILL1AM@*****.asu.edu
Message no. 2
From: Duke Diener <DukeDragon@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Rigging Question
Date: Fri, 14 Jul 1995 14:22:08 -0400
In a message dated 95-07-14 12:50:52 EDT, you write:

>I have a question about riggers that isn't too clear in the books (SR II,
>RBB,
>FoF). When a rigger has a drone with the other characters, and is not
>fighting
>other vehicles, when do they gp in the turn sequence?
>
>Do they make a position test against the bad guys? The way I handled it this
>last weekend was to let the rigger run his drones at the normal initiative
>count, and every 10 counts after that, as if the rigger was using a weapon
>instead of a drone (otherwise, why get high levels of vehicle control
>rigging).
>
>What's the official ruling, since it's not too clear.
>
>Thanks.

I think you handled that correctly. You only make position tests if you are
in vehicle combat (ie fast moving combat). Otherwise do a little math and
figure out how much a drone can move per turn and let the rigger run it like
normal character combat (except people are shooting at the drone and it is
firing back instead of the rigger). There's a penny and a half of my mind.

Duke
Message no. 3
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Rigging Question
Date: Sat, 15 Jul 1995 12:35:46 +0200
>I have a question about riggers that isn't too clear in the books (SR II, RBB,
>FoF). When a rigger has a drone with the other characters, and is not fighting
>other vehicles, when do they gp in the turn sequence?

I'd say they can go everytime they've got an action, as you explained below.

>Do they make a position test against the bad guys?

Don't think so. I just let the rigger move the drone up to its MAximum Speed
in meters.

>The way I handled it this
>last weekend was to let the rigger run his drones at the normal initiative
>count, and every 10 counts after that, as if the rigger was using a weapon
>instead of a drone (otherwise, why get high levels of vehicle control rigging).



Gurth@******.nl - Gurth@***.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
It's the bald man's dream to grow hair, baby
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Shadowrun Guru :)
Message no. 4
From: Sebastian Wiers <seb@***.RIPCO.COM>
Subject: Re: Rigging Question
Date: Sat, 15 Jul 1995 20:00:13 -0500
>
> >I have a question about riggers that isn't too clear in the books (SR II, RBB,
> >FoF). When a rigger has a drone with the other characters, and is not fighting
> >other vehicles, when do they gp in the turn sequence?
>
> I'd say they can go everytime they've got an action, as you explained below.
>
> >Do they make a position test against the bad guys?
>
> Don't think so. I just let the rigger move the drone up to its MAximum Speed
> in meters.

I'd free movement (ie move+fire) only at cruising speed, max movement (with a
handling test) for maximun speed. Our maybe some analog of the running test.
By the way, what is maximum speed for? it doesn't affect position tests. Is it
just for figuring how long it takes to get somwhere? (Given that there are no
stoplights or obstacles)
Message no. 5
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Rigging Question
Date: Sun, 16 Jul 1995 11:52:24 +0200
>By the way, what is maximum speed for? it doesn't affect position tests. Is it
>just for figuring how long it takes to get somwhere? (Given that there are no
>stoplights or obstacles)

I think so. And for seeing how fast you can outrun walking people :) I find
this whole position test business a bit abstract; I know it's intended that
way, but I'd much rather have a clear situation where you can really see
where the cars are, the distance between them, and so on.
I remember the first time we used the SR2 vehicle rules, after five seconds
we decided it was just too hard to keep in mind where everybody was so we
took out some toy cars and set those up on the floor. Made it all much
clearer :)


Gurth@******.nl - Gurth@***.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Not so alone...
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Shadowrun Guru :)
Message no. 6
From: Mark Steedman <RSMS@******.EEE.RGU.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Rigging Question
Date: Mon, 17 Jul 1995 10:08:50 GMT
> From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>

> >By the way, what is maximum speed for? it doesn't affect position tests. Is it
> >just for figuring how long it takes to get somwhere? (Given that there are no
> >stoplights or obstacles)
>
> I think so. And for seeing how fast you can outrun walking people :) I find
> this whole position test business a bit abstract; I know it's intended that
> way, but I'd much rather have a clear situation where you can really see
> where the cars are, the distance between them, and so on.
>
Maximum speed is maximum movement in a full combat round, you CANNOT
move more than that and if you don't roll enough success on the
position test you only move (position sucess * combat move). Result
you move the lower of these two. Generally it is easier to ignore the
vehicle combat rules unless both sides have transport and treat
drones as characters with the riggers VCR'ed initative (position
tests for a skilled rigger in fight mode are a waste of dice rolling
unless there are some heafty penalties). I rember one case of whole
party on jet skis (we 'borrowed' them off the cops who sank the
lifeboat we were using for getaway transport) where virtually no one
got an action due to no success on position tests, it made combat
with a 'log' (cannot remember name of critter - big thing likes
water PNANA) much longer - it would have lasted about 1
spell/decent gunshot on land as it was it was actually dangerous.
So use when you think it might affect matters it can be worth it, the
response of PC's to being told they needed to spend 1 action a round
'controlling horse' at HB a fistfull of Karma to avoid a crash test,
most did!

> Gurth@******.nl - Gurth@***.nl -
> http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html

Mark
Message no. 7
From: Ioannis Pantelidis <jpante@******.COMPULINK.GR>
Subject: Re: Rigging Question
Date: Mon, 17 Jul 1995 22:55:58 +0300
On Mon, 17 Jul 1995, Mark Steedman wrote:

> > From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
>
> > >By the way, what is maximum speed for? it doesn't affect position tests. Is
i
> t
> > >just for figuring how long it takes to get somwhere? (Given that there are
no
> > >stoplights or obstacles)
> >
> > I think so. And for seeing how fast you can outrun walking people :) I find
> > this whole position test business a bit abstract; I know it's intended that
> > way, but I'd much rather have a clear situation where you can really see
> > where the cars are, the distance between them, and so on.
> >
> Maximum speed is maximum movement in a full combat round, you CANNOT
> move more than that and if you don't roll enough success on the
> position test you only move (position sucess * combat move). Result
> you move the lower of these two. Generally it is easier to ignore the
> vehicle combat rules unless both sides have transport and treat
> drones as characters with the riggers VCR'ed initative (position
> tests for a skilled rigger in fight mode are a waste of dice rolling
> unless there are some heafty penalties). I rember one case of whole
> party on jet skis (we 'borrowed' them off the cops who sank the
> lifeboat we were using for getaway transport) where virtually no one
> got an action due to no success on position tests, it made combat
> with a 'log' (cannot remember name of critter - big thing likes
> water PNANA) much longer - it would have lasted about 1
> spell/decent gunshot on land as it was it was actually dangerous.
> So use when you think it might affect matters it can be worth it, the
> response of PC's to being told they needed to spend 1 action a round
> 'controlling horse' at HB a fistfull of Karma to avoid a crash test,
> most did!
>
> > Gurth@******.nl - Gurth@***.nl -
> > http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
>
> Mark
hehe thanks for telling me bexause my rigger drove his ford canada bison
with speed of 0,8 mach
Message no. 8
From: elventear@***********.net.pe (Pepe Barbe)
Subject: Rigging Question
Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 16:40:31 -0500
Hi,

Does a character Rigging with only a Datajack suffer from the Dumpshock
effects when rigging vehicles (Getting Dumped from a RC, Vehicle taking
Serious Damage, Vehicle Taking Deadly Damage, etc).

Thank you,
Pepe
Message no. 9
From: ValeuJ@*************.navy.mil (Valeu John EMFA)
Subject: Rigging Question
Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 08:55:16 -0800
>Does a character Rigging with only a Datajack suffer from the Dumpshock
>effects when rigging vehicles (Getting Dumped from a RC, Vehicle taking
>Serious Damage, Vehicle Taking Deadly Damage, etc).

AFAIK, yes. Unless they're using one of the Torpedo/Missile options
available in Rigger 3 (wear you can Ride/Guide a missle to the target, then
get kicked just before impact, or till the wire runs out, which ever happens
first). But even then, they take a smaller amount.

EM3 John Valeu
-AKA- TimeKeeper, Nocren
Message no. 10
From: maxnoel_fr@*****.fr (Max Noel)
Subject: Rigging Question
Date: Thu, 14 Nov 2002 23:15:25 +0100
---------------------- multipart/mixed attachment
At 16:40 14/11/2002 -0500, Pepe Barbe wrote:

>Hi,
>
>Does a character Rigging with only a Datajack suffer from the Dumpshock
>effects when rigging vehicles (Getting Dumped from a RC, Vehicle taking
>Serious Damage, Vehicle Taking Deadly Damage, etc).
>
>Thank you,
>Pepe

I'm not sure... I'm too tired to check R3 right now but I seem to
recall that no, they don't. They only suffer from ASIST backlash from
electrical damage, ANDREWS and the likes... which also applies when they're
R/Cing, by the way...
I think they also take damage from R/C network disruption... But
I'm not sure on this one. Can somebody confirm?

--
Wild_Cat


maxnoel_fr@*****.fr
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Message no. 11
From: J.Szeto@*********.com (Jonathan Szeto)
Subject: Rigging Question
Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 00:14:23 -0500
> From: shadowrn-bounces@*****.dumpshock.com
> [mailto:shadowrn-bounces@*****.dumpshock.com]On Behalf Of Pepe Barbe
> Sent: 14 November 2002 16:41
>
> Does a character Rigging with only a Datajack suffer from the Dumpshock
> effects when rigging vehicles (Getting Dumped from a RC, Vehicle taking
> Serious Damage, Vehicle Taking Deadly Damage, etc).

Nope. Just the regular disorientation and such from ordinary dumpshock.
Damaging effects like Vehicle Taking Damage, ASIST Backlash, etc only occurs
when both the wetware (ie, the VCR) and the black box (a rigged vehicle or
drone) are present and connected. Ya pays yer Essence, ya takes yer chances.
:)

IMO.

-- Jon
Message no. 12
From: York.GA@******.gc.ca (York.GA@******.gc.ca)
Subject: Rigging Question
Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 08:17:27 -0500
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Pepe Barbe [mailto:elventear@***********.net.pe]
>Sent: Thursday, 14, November, 2002 16:41 PM
>To: shadowrn@*****.dumpshock.com
>Subject: Rigging Question
>Does a character Rigging with only a Datajack suffer from the Dumpshock
>effects when rigging vehicles (Getting Dumped from a RC, Vehicle taking
>Serious Damage, Vehicle Taking Deadly Damage, etc).
>
>Thank you,
>Pepe

Rigging with a datajack is like Decking in turtle mode. I think it only
gives you either +1 dice to your roll or maybe -1 to the target number on
control tests. Either way I can't see you taking full backlash damage
without a VCR interface. At most I would probably give the character light
or moderate stun. After all, they have enough to worry about with the
vehicle disintegrating around them. I would remove the bonus they get for
the datajack on their final crash test though. There is no way that they
are going to maintain a connection to the vehicle while it suffers a deadly
hit without the emersion that comes with a VCR.

Coyote
Message no. 13
From: loneeagle@********.co.uk (Lone Eagle)
Subject: Rigging Question
Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2002 12:54:56 +0000
At 04:40 PM 14/11/2002 -0500, Pepe wrote:
>Does a character Rigging with only a Datajack suffer from the Dumpshock
>effects when rigging vehicles (Getting Dumped from a RC, Vehicle taking
>Serious Damage, Vehicle Taking Deadly Damage, etc).

I assume you're talking about the so called "Virtual Dashboard" system
granting you either +1 die or -1 TN for vehicle tests (although for the
life of me I can't remember which). I'd say no, You can run virtual
dashboard even if your only piece of cyberware is a datajack. If it
required that you had an ASIST converter fitted I'd require dumpshock but
without that it would have to be a very low level interface, one where
damage to the vehicle is almost nothing to you.


--
Lone Eagle
"Hold up lads, I got an idea."

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