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Mailing List Logs for ShadowRN

Message no. 1
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Roleplaying in 205X (was Re: Fashion in SR (was Re: armored
Date: Tue, 23 Jun 1998 17:30:51 -0400
At 04:07 PM 6/23/98 EDT, you wrote:

>Well, here's a little bit of NERPS to play with... what would role-playing be
>like in 205X? After all, while simsense would be fun, it doesn't have the
>level of choice that make most of our games Hell on Earth. What kinds of
>games will be popular when the guy down the street _can_ cast a fireball at a
>troll (if he doesn't mind getting arrested for 1st degree murder, of course)?

Heh. The sort of discussion I like...

Well, I think you covered a few of the main points, such as striving for
some amount of realism in their magic systems.

I'm not sure if paper-and-pencil RPGs would even really still be around
though.

Imagine, if you will...

A simsense-like experience (i.e., near-total immersion) in a hybrid of
something like Doom (for the POV) and Shadowrun for the complexity and
variety of possibilities that is also fully networked so you can interact
with your buddies/teammates.

Sure, there are games now that allow you to be certain character classes,
but none of them allow the deep level of complexity and capacity for PC
uniqueness that an old-fashioned paper-and-pencil allows.

I guess I'm trying to say that Matrix games with the proper output devices
should allow someone in SR 2059 to play a game, especially an RPG, just as
if he was living it. Like a lucid dream almost.

That, of course, would be the province of the wealthy I'm sure.

For the less-fortunate? Remove the simsense-like experience but retain the
RPG complexity and make network play optional (but strongly suggested) and
you've got a generic game machine.

For the really-unfortunate? Probably no better that what is currently
available to those that lack food, clean water, shelter, clothing,
electricity and so on. In other words, it's back to old-fashioned stick
ball for those times when the gangers are being really quiet and
hide-and-hope-no-one-seeks when the gang or someone else goes on a rampage.

You can see the parallel's among many of the kids today. Many many
children that grew up with video games just don't get, for a variety of
reasons, the paper RPGs that we play. Their concept of a RPG is Final
Fantasy 7 for the Playstation. Which, while an extremely cool game, ISN'T
a ROLE-PLAYING game. But try telling the average 15-yr old that.

Erik J.

Power comes to them that enjoy the thrill of fear -Cop Shoot Cop
Message no. 2
From: Iridios <iridios@*********.COM>
Subject: Re: Roleplaying in 205X (was Re: Fashion in SR (was Re: armored
Date: Tue, 23 Jun 1998 23:22:34 -0400
Erik Jameson wrote:
Tue, 23 Jun 1998 17:30:51 -0400

> Imagine, if you will...
>
> A simsense-like experience (i.e., near-total immersion) in a hybrid of
> something like Doom (for the POV) and Shadowrun for the complexity and
> variety of possibilities that is also fully networked so you can interact
> with your buddies/teammates.
>
> Sure, there are games now that allow you to be certain character classes,
> but none of them allow the deep level of complexity and capacity for PC
> uniqueness that an old-fashioned paper-and-pencil allows.
>
> I guess I'm trying to say that Matrix games with the proper output devices
> should allow someone in SR 2059 to play a game, especially an RPG, just as
> if he was living it. Like a lucid dream almost.
>
> That, of course, would be the province of the wealthy I'm sure.

It would not necessarily need to be for only the wealthy, imagine a startup
company offering VR LARP open systems with expert system design utilities... A gm
could sign up and begin "building" a world from "stock" parts maybe
even tied to a
more convential game. Then his players could pay a modest access fee to be able
to play. This fee could be kept to a minimum due to "mandatory" advertisement
segments at the beginning of each session. And on the darker side, with it being
in VR/Simsense, a less scrupulous company/advertiser could program in subliminal
suggestions making the game and the advertised products slightly addictive.

--"Any science, sufficiently advanced is indistinguishable from magic."
--Arthur C. Clarke

Iridios
iridios@*********.com
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9489
http://members.theglobe.com/Iridios

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b+ DI++ !D G e+@>++++ h--- r+++ y+++
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Message no. 3
From: Robert Watkins <robert.watkins@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Roleplaying in 205X (was Re: Fashion in SR (was Re: armored
Date: Wed, 24 Jun 1998 13:29:37 +1000
*chuckle* Thinking about Roleplaying in a Roleplaying game always makes me
think of "Papers and Paychecks" (for all those respected elders out there,
spot the reference. :) Hint: Not a FASA product)

--
Duct tape is like the Force: There's a Light side, a Dark side, and it binds
the Universe together.
Robert Watkins -- robert.watkins@******.com
Message no. 4
From: Nexx Many-Scars <Nexx3@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Roleplaying in 205X (was Re: Fashion in SR (was Re: armored
Date: Wed, 24 Jun 1998 00:02:16 EDT
In a message dated 23/06/98 22:47:09 Central Daylight Time,
robert.watkins@******.COM writes:

> *chuckle* Thinking about Roleplaying in a Roleplaying game always makes me
> think of "Papers and Paychecks" (for all those respected elders out there,
> spot the reference. :) Hint: Not a FASA product)

I may not be a respected elder (hell, I'm as old as my first edition Monster
Manual), but I got the idea from leafing through my old DMG to look something
up... then running across that precise cartoon... my seguing mind did the
rest.

Nexx, who thinks about Shadowrun even when thinking about AD&D
Message no. 5
From: Brett Borger <bxb121@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: Roleplaying in 205X (was Re: Fashion in SR (was Re: armored
Date: Wed, 24 Jun 1998 10:15:53 +0000
> Well, here's a little bit of NERPS to play with... what would role-playing be
> like in 205X? After all, while simsense would be fun, it doesn't have the
...
> I think we can safely assume that a game like Shadowrun would definitely be
> out there (just like Top Secret SI and Ninja's and Superspies are... or were

One of the novels (Just Compensation, I believe) has a character
doing just that...playing a shadowrun role-playing game (jacked in to
his computer, I don't remember if it was matrix play or not)

(ittsy-bittsy spoiler)

It's actually a really great scene, 'cause the book starts with it.
So I'm reading this, and I'm thinking "Man, what a cheezy story, I
hope it gets better. No _real_ run would go like this" then it turns
out that the whole thing (only a few pages) was the RPG. The main
character logs out, and rejoins his corporate society, while his
mother rants abut not understanding how he can play such trash. :)
Been there, done that.

-=SwiftOne=-


Brett Borger
SwiftOne@***.edu
AAP Techie
Message no. 6
From: Paul Gettle <pgettle@********.NET>
Subject: Re: Roleplaying in 205X (was Re: Fashion in SR (was Re: armored
Date: Wed, 24 Jun 1998 11:33:22 -0400
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At 01:29 PM 6/24/98 +1000, Robert Watkins wrote:
>*chuckle* Thinking about Roleplaying in a Roleplaying game always
makes me
>think of "Papers and Paychecks" (for all those respected elders out
there,
>spot the reference. :) Hint: Not a FASA product)

That sounds so familiar, but I can't place it.
Usually though, when I think of RP in an RPG, I think of the Black Dog
Game Factory. (But then, White Wolf Game Studio had to go and ruin the
concept by making Black Dog an imprint of their game line, making them
'real' in this world too.)
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--
-- Paul Gettle (pgettle@********.net)
PGP Fingerprint, Key ID:11455339 (RSA 1024, created 97/08/08)
625A FFF0 76DC A077 D21C 556B BB58 00AA
Message no. 7
From: Randy Nickel <RANNIC@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Roleplaying in 205X (was Re: Fashion in SR (was Re: armored
Date: Wed, 24 Jun 1998 08:37:54 -0700
<<It would not necessarily need to be for only the wealthy,
imagine a startup company offering VR LARP open systems with expert
system design utilities... A gm could sign up and begin "building" a
world from "stock" parts maybe even tied to a more convential game.
Then his players could pay a modest access fee to be able to play. This
fee could be kept to a minimum due to "mandatory" advertisement segments
at the beginning of each session. And on the darker side, with it being
in VR/Simsense, a less scrupulous company/advertiser could program in
subliminal suggestions making the game and the advertised products
slightly addictive.>>

Just reading this has given me a few ideas for runners against
such a company.

It could be the Invae's next plot for world domination (or
whatever their goal really is), or say the Yakuza want to try out a new
BTL without introducing it to their clients first so they open up a new
"simsense" game and then let kids go at it.

There are a lot of possibilities with this.

- Eclipse

Further Reading

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These messages were posted a long time ago on a mailing list far, far away. The copyright to their contents probably lies with the original authors of the individual messages, but since they were published in an electronic forum that anyone could subscribe to, and the logs were available to subscribers and most likely non-subscribers as well, it's felt that re-publishing them here is a kind of public service.