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Message no. 1
From: "XaOs [David Goth]" <xaos@*****.NET>
Subject: 'Ronin' and 'Urban Legends'
Date: Tue, 22 Sep 1998 22:10:36 -0500
After perusing some of the previews for movies that are coming out this
upcoming weekend, I've decided to watch these movies for a Shadowrun
perspective.

Originally, I wasn't impressed with early previews of 'Ronin', but then I
got the idea of the main characters being a group of shadowrunners. This
suddenly became interesting. On top of the fact that it's hard to go wrong
with DeNiro.

Anyway, if anyone is interested in movies, I offer 'Ronin' as a suggestion
for this weekend.

As a stretch, I could possibly see plot ideas springing from 'Urban Legends'
into the Sixth World. Considering the fact that it appears to have been
FASA's design to say that some (if not all) of the legends of human myth are
true events from a previous cycle of magic. Modern day urban legends seem to
be a great inspiration for what may become truth in 2060. Unfortunately, I
think this one is from the person who will also be bringing us "I Seem To
Recall Something Silly That You Did A Few Summers Back, Perhaps In 1979, And
Could Come Back To Haunt You".

'Blade' turned out to be pretty good from a Shadowrun perspective, but I
think 'Ronin' shows a lot of promise, not only as a movie on it's own, but
also as mood of the Shadowrun setting.

Anyone?

-XaOs-
xaos@*****.net
-David Goth-
Message no. 2
From: bryan.covington@****.COM
Subject: Re: 'Ronin' and 'Urban Legends'
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 1998 08:21:07 -0400
> Originally, I wasn't impressed with early previews of 'Ronin', but
> then I
> got the idea of the main characters being a group of shadowrunners.
> This
> suddenly became interesting. On top of the fact that it's hard to go
> wrong
> with DeNiro.
>
Not just yes, but HELL yes! Also stars (forgive my lack
of recall) the fellow from "The Professional", and "La Femme Nikita".
He
appears to be DeNiro's right hand man.
This is pure Shadowrun.
"I want 100k now and 100k when we get the case." Come
on! This IS shadowrun. Anyone wanna take bets on whether or not the
Johnson screws them?

Also if you like DeNiro and SR, and you were in a cave
in the Alps living on goat cheese or something, check out "Heat". KILLER
movie. I was literally shaking by the end of the movie. An excellent
example of how a top notch crew would operate, disregarding the fatal
flaw which made the movie interesting.
Message no. 3
From: Patrick Goodman <remo@***.NET>
Subject: Re: 'Ronin' and 'Urban Legends'
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 1998 09:33:01 -0500
From: <bryan.covington@****.COM>
Date: Wednesday, September 23, 1998 7:22 AM

>> Originally, I wasn't impressed with early previews of 'Ronin', but
>> then I got the idea of the main characters being a group of
>> shadowrunners. This suddenly became interesting. On top of the fact
>> that it's hard to go wrong with DeNiro.
>
> Not just yes, but HELL yes! Also stars (forgive my lack of
>recall) the fellow from "The Professional", and "La Femme Nikita".
He
>appears to be DeNiro's right hand man.

The name you're reaching for is Jean Reno. If RONIN turns out to be any
good, I might just forgive him for appearing in GODZILLA.

--
(>) Texas 2-Step
El Paso: Never surrender. Never forget. Never forgive.
Message no. 4
From: One Ronin <ronin@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: 'Ronin' and 'Urban Legends'
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 1998 10:52:43 PDT
>Originally, I wasn't impressed with early previews of 'Ronin', but then
I
>got the idea of the main characters being a group of shadowrunners.
This
>suddenly became interesting. On top of the fact that it's hard to go
wrong
>with DeNiro.
>
>Anyway, if anyone is interested in movies, I offer 'Ronin' as a
suggestion
>for this weekend.

<<<<SNIP>>>>

>'Blade' turned out to be pretty good from a Shadowrun perspective, but
I
>think 'Ronin' shows a lot of promise, not only as a movie on it's own,
but
>also as mood of the Shadowrun setting.


I think Ronin has a ton of potential. In fact, I would urge many
Shadowrun PCs to watch this movie. One thing that I got from the
previews of "Ronin" is that these guys looked and acted like a TEAM of
PROFESSIONALS. In my experience, a lot of players don't even have those
words in their vocabulary. We will see what the movie has to offer once
it opens, but I'd be willing to bet that it's going to be a "must see"
for Shadowrun fans.
Incidently, my most favorite Shadowrun-esque movie is "The
Replacement Killers". Here you have a couple of runners (Chow Yun Fat
and Mira Sorvino) who are pursued by both the cops and a chinese crime
boss (possibly Triad?) and have to deal with their mistrust of one
another because they are both criminals....in a sense of the word.
Excellent John Woo movie and Shadowrun inspiration. If you like that
one....try watching "Hard Boiled." IMNSHO, the best running gun fight
(at the end when the main characters are in the hospital) ever.



Mai mentsu konna mai kikyo.


______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
Message no. 5
From: Michael vanHulst <Schizi@***.COM>
Subject: Re: 'Ronin' and 'Urban Legends'
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 1998 14:12:36 EDT
In a message dated 9/23/98 10:54:05 AM Pacific Daylight Time,
ronin@*******.COM writes:

> Incidently, my most favorite Shadowrun-esque movie is "The
> Replacement Killers". Here you have a couple of runners (Chow Yun Fat
> and Mira Sorvino) who are pursued by both the cops and a chinese crime
> boss (possibly Triad?) and have to deal with their mistrust of one
> another because they are both criminals....in a sense of the word.
And I just love the MP-5 briefcase, which is actually in their LEO catalog,
imagine my surprise :-) Now I just need to save some money and get me an
MP-5K, hmmmm.
Message no. 6
From: bryan.covington@****.COM
Subject: Re: 'Ronin' and 'Urban Legends'
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 1998 14:26:10 -0400
> Incidently, my most favorite Shadowrun-esque movie is "The
> Replacement Killers". Here you have a couple of runners (Chow Yun Fat
> and Mira Sorvino) who are pursued by both the cops and a chinese crime
> boss (possibly Triad?) and have to deal with their mistrust of one
> another because they are both criminals....in a sense of the word.
> Excellent John Woo movie and Shadowrun inspiration. If you like that
> one....try watching "Hard Boiled." IMNSHO, the best running gun fight
> (at the end when the main characters are in the hospital) ever.
>
I hate to drift from the stated topic but this must be
said. "Replacement Killers" was NOT directed by John Woo. He produced
it. I can only assume he found some hack sleeping in the dumpster behind
the studio to direct it, since it was AWFUL!
Hard Boiled, The Killer, and Better Tomorrow I & II are
classic John Woo and kick much ass, unrealistic as they are.
Hell even Broken Arrow was pretty cool.

Sorry. RK blew. It lured people in with John Woo's name
and then gave them 90 minutes of suck.
Message no. 7
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: 'Ronin' and 'Urban Legends'
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 1998 14:41:48 -0400
At 08:21 AM 9/23/98 -0400, you wrote:

> Not just yes, but HELL yes! Also stars (forgive my lack
>of recall) the fellow from "The Professional", and "La Femme
Nikita". He
>appears to be DeNiro's right hand man.

Jean Reno. Very cool actor.

> This is pure Shadowrun.
> "I want 100k now and 100k when we get the case." Come
>on! This IS shadowrun. Anyone wanna take bets on whether or not the
>Johnson screws them?

I seem to recall in one of the previews or commercials that they are indeed
sold out...

I'm thinking of catching it this weekend also.

Erik J.
Message no. 8
From: bryan.covington@****.COM
Subject: Re: 'Ronin' and 'Urban Legends'
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 1998 15:01:51 -0400
> > This is pure Shadowrun.
> > "I want 100k now and 100k when we get the case." Come
> >on! This IS shadowrun. Anyone wanna take bets on whether or not the
> >Johnson screws them?
>
> I seem to recall in one of the previews or commercials that they are
> indeed
> sold out...
>
<Foghorn>
That's a joke son!
</Foghorn>

Wouldn't be a good movie if everything went as planned.
I mean it'd be neat to see but all in all it would be very short and to
the point. Remember the opening scene in Heat? That went pretty well.
They even had a screwup, recovered and moved on. Whole thing took about
five minutes.

Actually that movie was one of my favorites because it
really pointed out that the "bad guys", while cool, were still stone
killers. I ended up rooting for the cops. I was a bit torn, but still
came down on the cops side.
This is also a good movie to illustrate Erik's points
about killing corp security. This movie definitely emphasizes that
people are dying, innocent or no. The main characters tend to only shoot
at people attacking them (cops mostly) but you see every cop that gets
shot take the bullet. I at least was definitely turned against the main
characters by the end of the movie.


> I'm thinking of catching it this weekend also.
>
I'm beyond that point. I WILL see it this weekend. :)
Message no. 9
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: 'Ronin' and 'Urban Legends'
Date: Wed, 23 Sep 1998 17:30:38 -0400
At 03:01 PM 9/23/98 -0400, you wrote:

> <Foghorn>
> That's a joke son!
> </Foghorn>

Uhh...uhh...uh, okay. Didn't see any emoticon, so I couldn't tell. Oh well.

> Wouldn't be a good movie if everything went as planned.
>I mean it'd be neat to see but all in all it would be very short and to
>the point. Remember the opening scene in Heat? That went pretty well.
>They even had a screwup, recovered and moved on. Whole thing took about
>five minutes.

True enough. Curious fact about Ronin; apparently DeNiro did an uncredited
rewrite of the script to give it more snap and generally make it better.
Supposedly the story is still rather confused and convoluted, but the
action, the dialogue and the characters are supposedly all very good.

> Actually that movie was one of my favorites because it
>really pointed out that the "bad guys", while cool, were still stone
>killers. I ended up rooting for the cops. I was a bit torn, but still
>came down on the cops side.

Oh yeah, I was torn. I so badly wanted DeNiro to get away. The ending
sucked in my mind, simply because I wanted him to get away and be able to
start over with the new woman in his life. I didn't find Pacino very
sympathetic at all.

> This is also a good movie to illustrate Erik's points
>about killing corp security. This movie definitely emphasizes that
>people are dying, innocent or no. The main characters tend to only shoot
>at people attacking them (cops mostly) but you see every cop that gets
>shot take the bullet. I at least was definitely turned against the main
>characters by the end of the movie.

Thanks. Great film that had a fairly accurate depiction of life and how
people react. No real heroes, and except for the long-haired
scumbag-psycho, no real bad guys either. DeNiro and this crew were family
men for the most part, even though some were more flawed than others. And
Pacino could keep his home life in order (far too common for cops). They
were people, like any of us, and many of them died.

I'm in a major rambling frame of mind, so I'll quit now...

>> I'm thinking of catching it this weekend also.
>>
> I'm beyond that point. I WILL see it this weekend. :)

Well, I'm going to at least make an effort. It depends on what else I have
to do over the weekend other than see Massive Attack play on Sunday. I'll
see it eventually though.

Erik J.


http://www.fortunecity.com/rivendell/dungeon/480/index.html
The Reality Check for a Fictional World
Message no. 10
From: "Ratinac, Rand (NSW)" <RRatinac@*****.REDCROSS.ORG.AU>
Subject: Re: 'Ronin' and 'Urban Legends'
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 1998 09:39:42 +1000
> Also if you like DeNiro and SR, and you were in a cave
> in the Alps living on goat cheese or something, check out "Heat".
> KILLER
> movie. I was literally shaking by the end of the movie. An excellent
> example of how a top notch crew would operate, disregarding the fatal
> flaw which made the movie interesting.
>
Okay, speaking of movies, time to get on to my favourite SR-type movie.
Anyone seen Assassins? I mean, really! It has a couple of assassin cum
street samurai types (one cool and professional, one wild and crazy and
semi-professional) and a decker/rigger! If you disregard the
assassinations that's exactly how I think things should be done by
shadowrunners. But then, I go for the 'keeping things quiet' school of
operations and unprofessional players give me the creeps (I just KNOW
they're gonna get my character into trouble).

Doc'
Message no. 11
From: John Velasco <decor.consulting@***.SERVICOM.ES>
Subject: Re: 'Ronin' and 'Urban Legends'
Date: Thu, 24 Sep 1998 10:27:30 +0200
At 22:10 22/09/98 -0500, XaOs wrote:

>After perusing some of the previews for movies that are coming out this
>upcoming weekend, I've decided to watch these movies for a Shadowrun
>perspective.
>
>Originally, I wasn't impressed with early previews of 'Ronin', but then I
>got the idea of the main characters being a group of shadowrunners. This
>suddenly became interesting. On top of the fact that it's hard to go wrong
>with DeNiro.

SNIP

I haven't been able to see Ronin yet as it hasn't been released here, but I
have seen another film by David Mamet recently which I recommend.

The original title is The Spanish prisoner, it's not an action movie so
don't expect to see impressive gunfights, explosions etc. What you will see
(IMHO) is an excellent film that can teach you a lot about paranoia and has
a lot to do with the thread "Johnsons & being screwed".


BioNick.


-----------------------

If only you could see what I have seen with your eyes!

Further Reading

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