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Message no. 1
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Danyeal De La Luna)
Subject: Seattle DMV
Date: Sun May 13 14:50:01 2001
I need to do a run on the Seattle DMV to snag some plate numbers and their
corresponding transponder codes...including shut-down codes if at all
possible. What I would like to know is if anyone might know what I might be
facing?

Lunatec
Message no. 2
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Easy-Action Music)
Subject: Seattle DMV
Date: Sun May 13 22:35:01 2001
-----Original Message-----
From: Danyeal De La Luna <lunatec@**.mediaone.net>
To: shadowrn@*********.com <shadowrn@*********.com>
Date: Monday, May 14, 2001 4:55 AM
Subject: Seattle DMV


>I need to do a run on the Seattle DMV to snag some plate numbers and their
>corresponding transponder codes...including shut-down codes if at all
>possible. What I would like to know is if anyone might know what I might be
>facing?
>
I can't help, but on the subject, I would like to know what it takes to
register a car in the 60s. Probably a number plate with a barcode as well as
readable letters, and maybe some kind of transmitter for Lone Star to check?
Message no. 3
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Tommy Lindner)
Subject: Seattle DMV
Date: Mon May 14 02:55:01 2001
Easy-Action Music schrieb:

> I would like to know what it takes to register a car in the 60s. Probably a
> number plate with a barcode as well as readable letters, and maybe some kind
> of transmitter for Lone Star to check?

I can't remember properly but in theLone Star Sourcebook there is either a
device that is able to read the bar code stamped on every car or it was
mentioned in context of crime investigation concerning cars. Maybe both.
Anyway, Lone Star has definetely a Database of car bar codes and is using it at
least for all sorts of traffic things.

Tommy
Message no. 4
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Graht)
Subject: Seattle DMV
Date: Mon May 14 09:50:01 2001
At 12:32 PM 5/14/2001 +1000, Easy-Action Music wrote:

>-----Original Message-----
>From: Danyeal De La Luna <lunatec@**.mediaone.net>
>
> >I need to do a run on the Seattle DMV to snag some plate numbers and their
> >corresponding transponder codes...including shut-down codes if at all
> >possible. What I would like to know is if anyone might know what I might be
> >facing?

Really long lines ;)

To Life,
-Graht
ShadowRN Gridsec, Nice Guy Division
--
Message no. 5
From: shadowrn@*********.com (BD)
Subject: Seattle DMV
Date: Mon May 14 10:55:01 2001
> I can't remember properly but in theLone Star Sourcebook there is either
> a
> device that is able to read the bar code stamped on every car or it was
> mentioned in context of crime investigation concerning cars. Maybe both.
> Anyway, Lone Star has definetely a Database of car bar codes and is using
> it at least for all sorts of traffic things.
> Tommy

Perhaps correct but now outdated! Rigger 3 talks about how they tried
barcodes but found a computer could easily read standard license plate
letters, so went back to those. No barcodes.

But transponders, yes! Each car's got one, it sends a signal to
GridGuide, Lone Star can track it, and even shut the car down through a
chip or something. My book's unavailable, so I can't be more precise.

====-Boondocker

__________________________________________________
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Message no. 6
From: shadowrn@*********.com (smUgE)
Subject: Seattle DMV
Date: Mon May 14 14:40:01 2001
Yes, there are license plates. There are transponders that tell the grid
where you are, how fast you are going, and who to charge when you get in a
fender bender. The star can access and manipulate the grid to their
advantage (tracking individual cars and rerouting traffic). As a separate
thing, there is a shutdown code for each transponder so cops can make you
pull over and lock you in (to combat car-jacking).

As a Decker, where are the DMV records located. What security should he
expect. Who has access to them. What lower security "ins" can you use to
sneak in.

I think that was what Raven was getting at. That is the problem of player
with intelligence of 3 playing a character with intelligence of 7. Hehe.

Who has access to DMV?
If it is run by UCAS- it would be the UCAS Records. There would be access
to UCAS branch offices to add, edit, and remove records. The star would
have access to the data. GrideGuide is a separate system that would have to
interface with that data. The star would have unfettered access to the
data. Who else might have access to DMV records? Is there any public
access to some of the records that would just need a push to get at the more
juicy records?

Who, in 2001 has a legit reason to look at those files and would that carry
over to SR 2060?

What do you think?
Message no. 7
From: shadowrn@*********.com (shadowrn@*********.com)
Subject: Seattle DMV
Date: Mon May 14 16:10:01 2001
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In a message dated 5/14/01 2:49:01 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
smuge@*************.com writes:


> If it is run by UCAS- it would be the UCAS Records. There would be access
> to UCAS branch offices to add, edit, and remove records. The star would
> have access to the data. GrideGuide is a separate system that would have to
> interface with that data. The star would have unfettered access to the
> data. Who else might have access to DMV records? Is there any public
> access to some of the records that would just need a push to get at the more
> juicy records?

Wrong. The federal government (UCAS) does NOT run any sort of DMVish thing.
That's a state function. Remember, in the US/UCAS, unless you explicitly hear
otherwise, you can assume power is held by the states or lower.

DMV....usually, only people who can grab those records are police or other
law enforcement agencies, the military (they grab the data for
recruiting/selective service purposes), voter registration (motor-voter
program, which is a service that lets you automatically register to vote the
same time you renew your license.), and...that's pretty much it. Otherwise,
they don't really hold any juicy data that you couldn't get by stealing a
copy of someone's license. Disgusting thing is that they're a universal form
of ID these days; If you're too blind to drive, you're screwed.

John

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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2>In a message dated
5/14/01 2:49:01 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
<BR>smuge@*************.com writes:
<BR>
<BR>
<BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid;
MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">If it is run by UCAS- it
would be the UCAS Records. &nbsp;There would be access
<BR>to UCAS branch offices to add, edit, and remove records. &nbsp;The star
would
<BR>have access to the data. &nbsp;GrideGuide is a separate system that would
have to
<BR>interface with that data. &nbsp;The star would have unfettered access to the
<BR>data. &nbsp;Who else might have access to DMV records? &nbsp;Is there
any public
<BR>access to some of the records that would just need a push to get at the more
<BR>juicy records?</FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=3
FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial"
LANG="0"></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BR></FONT><FONT COLOR="#000000" SIZE=2
FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial" LANG="0">
<BR>Wrong. The federal government (UCAS) does NOT run any sort of DMVish thing.
<BR>That's a state function. Remember, in the US/UCAS, unless you explicitly hear
<BR>otherwise, you can assume power is held by the states or lower.
<BR>
<BR>DMV....usually, only people who can grab those records are police or other
<BR>law enforcement agencies, the military (they grab the data for
<BR>recruiting/selective service purposes), voter registration (motor-voter
<BR>program, which is a service that lets you automatically register to vote the
<BR>same time you renew your license.), and...that's pretty much it. Otherwise,
<BR>they don't really hold any juicy data that you couldn't get by stealing a
<BR>copy of someone's license. Disgusting thing is that they're a universal form
<BR>of ID these days; If you're too blind to drive, you're screwed.
<BR>
<BR>John</FONT></HTML>

--part1_29.14c16b07.28319651_boundary--
Message no. 8
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Graht)
Subject: Seattle DMV
Date: Mon May 14 16:25:01 2001
At 04:13 PM 5/14/2001 -0400, DemonPenta@***.com wrote:
>Disgusting thing is that they're [Driver Licenses] a universal form
>of ID these days; If you're too blind to drive, you're screwed.

Not so. You can get a State ID that's as valid as a picture ID as a Driver
License. Of course, not everyone knows what to do when confronted by a
State ID... You can also really mess with a retail worker's head when you
present a State ID as a second form of identification with your Driver
License instead of a credit card ;)

To Life,
-Graht
ShadowRN Gridsec, Nice Guy Division
--
Message no. 9
From: shadowrn@*********.com (shadowrn@*********.com)
Subject: Seattle DMV
Date: Mon May 14 16:35:01 2001
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In a message dated 5/14/01 4:33:47 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
davidb@***.100.100.99 writes:


> Not so. You can get a State ID that's as valid as a picture ID as a Driver
> License. Of course, not everyone knows what to do when confronted by a
> State ID... You can also really mess with a retail worker's head when you
> present a State ID as a second form of identification with your Driver
> )

That 'not knowing what to do' thing is the problem. I'm 17. I SHOULD be able
to drive, but I'm half blind. So I can't. I would get a State ID, but I tried
that....that ALWAYS ends out with me having to explain, to EVERYBODY I have
to show it to, that it's legit. 90 percent of them don't believe me.


--part1_d9.146e6fa4.28319bd4_boundary
Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT SIZE=2>In a message dated
5/14/01 4:33:47 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
<BR>davidb@***.100.100.99 writes:
<BR>
<BR>
<BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid;
MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Not so. &nbsp;You can
get a State ID that's as valid as a picture ID as a Driver
<BR>License. &nbsp;Of course, not everyone knows what to do when confronted by a

<BR>State ID... &nbsp;You can also really mess with a retail worker's head when
you
<BR>present a State ID as a second form of identification with your Driver
<BR>License instead of a credit card ;</BLOCKQUOTE>)</FONT><FONT
COLOR="#000000" SIZE=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF" FACE="Arial"
LANG="0">
<BR>
<BR>That 'not knowing what to do' thing is the problem. I'm 17. I SHOULD be able
<BR>to drive, but I'm half blind. So I can't. I would get a State ID, but I tried
<BR>that....that ALWAYS ends out with me having to explain, to EVERYBODY I have
<BR>to show it to, that it's legit. 90 percent of them don't believe me.
<BR></FONT></HTML>

--part1_d9.146e6fa4.28319bd4_boundary--
Message no. 10
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Simon and Fiona)
Subject: Seattle DMV
Date: Mon May 14 19:40:01 2001
-----Original Message-----
From: Tommy Lindner <tommy.lindner@********.de>
To: shadowrn@*********.com <shadowrn@*********.com>
Date: Monday, May 14, 2001 5:00 PM
Subject: Re: Seattle DMV


>Easy-Action Music schrieb:


By the way, sorry about the name change, completely accidental. It was in
fact me, Simon. At least I didn't use my porn queen identity this time.
Message no. 11
From: shadowrn@*********.com (smUgE)
Subject: Seattle DMV
Date: Mon May 14 23:50:00 2001
Ok, it may not be the UCAS- it is the government, right? No one has
knowledge that it has been outsourced to some company?

You don't think employers use DMV records for criminal background checks?
(perhaps requesting the information rather being let in to get it whenever
they want)

How about insurance companies?

smuge

ps- You think Seattle local gov is not controlled by the feds? hehe
Message no. 12
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Danyeal De La Luna)
Subject: Seattle DMV
Date: Tue May 15 05:00:01 2001
Conspiracy theories abound, but what if a guy (or girl, or other) wanted to,
just hypothetically, break in and steal these codes for the transponders and
such, hypothetically, where would be a safe place to start this kind of
hack? Would disguising yourself and standard traffic from, say, an insurance
company be the best way? Or would a simple smash and run method be the most
effective? Would they have Black IC or Gray IC? What would you rate their
system? This is just hypothetical, not that I would EVER do such a nasty and
illegal think as to steal data and sell it for a considerable amount of
money, that would be wrong. I was just thinking because my sick grandmother
has always wanted to know, and being the nice, law abiding grandson, I feel
that it is my duty to research these things...<Evil Grin>

Any and all info is deeply appreciated.


Lunatec <00.165.66.1677.0393>
Message no. 13
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Danyeal De La Luna)
Subject: Seattle DMV
Date: Tue May 15 23:15:01 2001
Ok,
I am going to try this one last time. My character needs to break into the
DMV for a run, but neither my GM nor myself is sure how to rate that system,
what kind of IC to use, and how big the files and system should be. Any
ideas?

Lunatec
Message no. 14
From: shadowrn@*********.com (BD)
Subject: Seattle DMV
Date: Wed May 16 00:55:00 2001
> Ok,
> I am going to try this one last time. My character needs to break into
> the
> DMV for a run, but neither my GM nor myself is sure how to rate that
> system,
> what kind of IC to use, and how big the files and system should be. Any
> ideas?
> Lunatec

I was pretty sure someone had responded to you, man. Might want to check
the logs.

Anyway, if I had to pull something out of my ass (Zoooop!) I'd say it was
a Red-Hard system with non-lethal IC... lots of trace IC and some scout IC
to help out the deck-damaging proggies. I'd figure this is, igf not a
public host, than a host often in the public eye. I'd litter the system
with Average rating security deckers, too, guys 'n' gals that fly-by every
now and again, checking for vandalism.

That help any?

====-Boondocker

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices
http://auctions.yahoo.com/
Message no. 15
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Graht)
Subject: Seattle DMV
Date: Wed May 16 10:00:01 2001
At 10:25 PM 5/15/2001 -0700, Danyeal De La Luna wrote:
>Ok,
>I am going to try this one last time. My character needs to break into the
>DMV for a run, but neither my GM nor myself is sure how to rate that system,
>what kind of IC to use, and how big the files and system should be. Any
>ideas?

Lessee...

As far as database goes it would....

Wait a sec, would DMVs still exist now that everyone has a SIN? Don't SIN
IDs double as Driver Licenses (if you're qualified to drive). I'd think it
would be the DoS (Department of SINs). Anyhoo.. :)

The database would contain the usual ID information: name, address, basic
physical characteristics, license class, picture, SIN, birth date, and
expiration date. I also suspect that everyone issued a license would have
their DNA signature in the database (currently most states take your finger
prints when you get a Driver License or State ID). That DNA signature
would bump of the size of the database significantly.

In addition to ID information the database would also include vehicle
registration information which is pretty much all text.

In addition to that the database would also include records of any traffic
violations and criminal history.

The database would be well organized (so that law enforcement can access it
easily and quickly).

I suspect that the system would be pretty tough, and Orange at least if not
a Red. I also think there would be serious IC, but no Black IC. I also
think there would be some Lone Star IC protecting the system (see the Lone
Star sourcebook).

To Life,
-Graht
ShadowRN Gridsec, Nice Guy Division
--
Message no. 16
From: shadowrn@*********.com (BD)
Subject: Seattle DMV
Date: Wed May 16 10:20:01 2001
--- BD <l3oondocker@*****.com> wrote:
> Anyway, if I had to pull something out of my ass (Zoooop!) I'd say it
> was
> a Red-Hard system with non-lethal IC... lots of trace IC and some scout
> IC
> to help out the deck-damaging proggies. I'd figure this is, igf not a
> public host, than a host often in the public eye. I'd litter the system
> with Average rating security deckers, too, guys 'n' gals that fly-by
> every
> now and again, checking for vandalism.

I TOTALLY thought you were asking about the GridGuide system here. I
thin kthat all applies to the SIN registry, but moreso: add some lethal
(perhaps psychotropic) IC at the really high levels of security, and go
with Graht on the Lone STar deckers idea. The SIN registry is a huge
database, and I'd imagine that a hell of a lot of havoc could be caused by
breaking in there. They'd protect it. I do think it warrants lethal
countermeasures, too; it's not a public database at all, and if you're int
there and not supposed to be, you're gonna be a criminal.

====-Boondocker

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Auctions - buy the things you want at great prices
http://auctions.yahoo.com/
Message no. 17
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Keith Duthie)
Subject: Seattle DMV
Date: Wed May 16 11:20:01 2001
On Wed, 16 May 2001, BD wrote:

> I TOTALLY thought you were asking about the GridGuide system here. I
> thin kthat all applies to the SIN registry, but moreso: add some lethal
> (perhaps psychotropic) IC at the really high levels of security, and go
> with Graht on the Lone STar deckers idea. The SIN registry is a huge
> database, and I'd imagine that a hell of a lot of havoc could be caused by
> breaking in there. They'd protect it. I do think it warrants lethal
> countermeasures, too; it's not a public database at all, and if you're int
> there and not supposed to be, you're gonna be a criminal.

It may not be a publically accessible database, but it's a government
database, and there are IIRC laws against black IC. Now, this may be a
near future dystopia, but the public would still kick up a fuss if it
heard that the government was breaking its own laws[1]. And it probably
wouldn't be an easy secret to keep in this case.

[1] although it may be a corporate court law, so amend that phrase as
appropriate.
--
Understanding is a three edged sword. Do you *want* to get the point?
http://www.albatross.co.nz/~psycho/ O- -><-
Standard disclaimer: Opinions expressed in this message are unlikely to
be mine, let alone anybody elses...
Message no. 18
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Gurth)
Subject: Seattle DMV
Date: Wed May 16 13:35:01 2001
According to Graht, on Wed, 16 May 2001 the word on the street was...

> Wait a sec, would DMVs still exist now that everyone has a SIN? Don't SIN
> IDs double as Driver Licenses (if you're qualified to drive). I'd think it
> would be the DoS (Department of SINs). Anyhoo.. :)

So perhaps the DMV keeps track of who has a driver's licence (that is, which
SIN has a license associated with it), who owns which vehicle, when a
vehicle last had its routine check-up, whether it's insured or not, etc.
etc. etc. Just because the organization might not have to do one of its
present-day tasks doesn't mean it becomes unnecessary.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Who needs that now?
-> NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Triangle Virtuoso <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://plastic.dumpshock.com <-

GC3.12: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+@ UL P L++ E W-(++) N o? K w+(--) O V?
PS+ PE(-)(+) Y PGP- t@ 5++ X(+) R+++(-)>$ tv+ b++@ DI- D+ G+ e h! !r y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 19
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Graht)
Subject: Seattle DMV
Date: Wed May 16 18:00:01 2001
At 07:25 PM 5/16/2001 +0200, Gurth wrote:
>According to Graht, on Wed, 16 May 2001 the word on the street was...
>
>Just because the organization might not have to do one of its
>present-day tasks doesn't mean it becomes unnecessary.

lol

I can just imagine upper management for the DMV (or just about any other
government agency) using that argument to perpetuate their beaurocracy.

Are you sure you don't work for the DMV? ;)

To Life,
-Graht
ShadowRN Gridsec, Nice Guy Division
--
Message no. 20
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Danyeal De La Luna)
Subject: Seattle DMV
Date: Wed May 16 18:15:01 2001
Thanks all for the input... I, unfortunately because I have to do this run,
agree with your logic. With any luck, I'll give you all the gritty details
when we finish this. <I gotta renegotiate the price now :)>


Lunatec
Message no. 21
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Graht)
Subject: Seattle DMV
Date: Wed May 16 18:30:01 2001
At 05:27 PM 5/16/2001 -0700, Danyeal De La Luna wrote:
>Thanks all for the input... I, unfortunately because I have to do this run,
>agree with your logic. With any luck, I'll give you all the gritty details
>when we finish this. <I gotta renegotiate the price now :)>

If I was making a run on the DMV I'd go after the weakest security link:
one of the employees working there. The poor people take crap from people
all day (when they don't find a convenient errand to get away from their
desk to leave people standing in line for hours on end that is ;) and I
don't think they're paid very much. It would be much easier to bribe an
employee to get the information you need.

To Life,
-Graht
ShadowRN Gridsec, Nice Guy Division
--
Message no. 22
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Gurth)
Subject: Seattle DMV
Date: Thu May 17 06:55:01 2001
According to Graht, on Thu, 17 May 2001 the word on the street was...

> >Just because the organization might not have to do one of its
> >present-day tasks doesn't mean it becomes unnecessary.
>
> lol
>
> I can just imagine upper management for the DMV (or just about any other
> government agency) using that argument to perpetuate their beaurocracy.

To be honest I have no idea what the task description of the US DMV is; I
was mostly going by the Dutch equivalent, which does a lot more than hand
out driver's licenses (in fact, I even think they _don't_ hand those out :)

> Are you sure you don't work for the DMV? ;)

Not last time I checked :)

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Who needs that now?
-> NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Triangle Virtuoso <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://plastic.dumpshock.com <-

GC3.12: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+@ UL P L++ E W-(++) N o? K w+(--) O V?
PS+ PE(-)(+) Y PGP- t@ 5++ X(+) R+++(-)>$ tv+ b++@ DI- D+ G+ e h! !r y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 23
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Graht)
Subject: Seattle DMV
Date: Thu May 17 10:10:01 2001
At 12:39 PM 5/17/2001 +0200, Gurth wrote:
>According to Graht, on Thu, 17 May 2001 the word on the street was...
>
> > >Just because the organization might not have to do one of its
> > >present-day tasks doesn't mean it becomes unnecessary.
> >
> > lol
> >
> > I can just imagine upper management for the DMV (or just about any other
> > government agency) using that argument to perpetuate their beaurocracy.
>
>To be honest I have no idea what the task description of the US DMV is; I
>was mostly going by the Dutch equivalent, which does a lot more than hand
>out driver's licenses (in fact, I even think they _don't_ hand those out :)

Ah, that explains it :)

As near as I can tell the number one requirement for a DMV employee is the
ability to manage people waiting in line, and to be able to control a line
so that people have to wait at least an hour to move through the line. You
must also be able to work as part of a team to accomplish this goal by
working with others to find something to do other than helping people in
line when the line starts moving to quickly.

If you're really, really good, you get transferred to the New Mexico State DMV.

:)

To Life,
-Graht
ShadowRN Gridsec, Nice Guy Division
--

Further Reading

If you enjoyed reading about Seattle DMV, you may also be interested in:

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