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Message no. 1
From: "Ratinac, Rand (NSW)" <RRatinac@*****.REDCROSS.ORG.AU>
Subject: Senses and recoil.
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 1998 13:41:06 +1000
Hoi, y'all,

This is it - a milestone...my first (three) questions for ShadowRN. :)

First - I've never seen this one addressed anywhere. What's the
consensus on the Improved Physical Senses physad power? Are they treated
as 'natural' senses, or 'enhanced' (equivalent of cyber) senses? This
one's mainly important when dealing with low-light and thermographic
vision. In the vision modifiers table in SRII and SR3 (I don't know
about SRI), natural low-light and thermo offer better modifiers than
enhanced low-light and thermo. (i.e an elf's natural low-light or a
dwarf's natural thermo is better than a human sammie's bought low-light
and thermo.) So - what do the physad powers qualify as? Personally, I
lean towards 'natural' senses - but IS there an official ruling on this
one?

Second, a roleplaying issue. How many GMs out there have ever had a
sammie (or maybe a physad) roleplay being confused when he switches on
all his enhanced senses? I mean, this isn't ever covered in the rules,
and I don't think it needs to be, but as far as I know the human brain
isn't really designed to deal with high and low band hearing, amplified
hearing, spatial recognition, and thermo and low-light and magnified
vision all at once! I suppose it's reasonable to assume that all the
cyber has bits of programming that help you deal with all the extra
information, but I also think it's reasonable to assume that someone
with maxed out sensory enhancements would likely be dealing with
information overload (somewhat similar to the Overstimulation spell,
perhaps) at the very least for a few seconds, if they switch everything
on all at once. I don't think it would apply so much to a physad,
because (as I see it) magical powers are more 'natural' and are easier
to deal with. I don't know about you guys, but I think if I ever had a
player who roleplayed something like that I'd give him or her bonus
roleplaying karma. Anyway, what do you think? WOULD that be an issue? Or
what?

Finally, the high strength and recoil modifiers rule from FoF. You know,
the one that lets you absorb one point of recoil for every two points of
strength above 3. Now, I've always used that since I got FoF (lovely
rule I think), but I was just reading SR3 and I noticed this hasn't been
included as a mainstream rule. Am I to assume that this is still an
optional rule and may or may not be used, depending on what the GM
thinks?

Well, sorry about the length of this, but I'm too busy to bother with
separate posts. :)

Doc'
Message no. 2
From: Nexx <nexx@********.NET>
Subject: Re: Senses and recoil.
Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 22:53:00 -0500
----------
> From: Ratinac, Rand (NSW) <RRatinac@*****.REDCROSS.ORG.AU>
>
> First - I've never seen this one addressed anywhere. What's the
> consensus on the Improved Physical Senses physad power? Are they treated
> as 'natural' senses, or 'enhanced' (equivalent of cyber) senses?

As we said... I think it was last week... they're counted as natural.

> Second, a roleplaying issue. How many GMs out there have ever had a
> sammie (or maybe a physad) roleplay being confused when he switches on
> all his enhanced senses?

Since the physad's powers are natural, I would say they have no real
confusion about the input from their advanced senses (even the funky ones,
like motion detection), though they might have trouble putting it into
words ("How did you know that guy was behind you, Fred?" "Well, Sam, I
just felt him... there was a tingling behind me... you know what I
mean...")

> included as a mainstream rule. Am I to assume that this is still an
> optional rule and may or may not be used, depending on what the GM
> thinks?

Yes.

***************
Rev. Mark Hall, Bard to the Lady Mari
aka Pope Nexx Many-Scars
*
Is this the real life?
Is this just fantasy?
Caught in a landslide,
No escape from reality.
Open your eyes, Look up to the skies and see,
I'm just a poor boy, I need no sympathy,
Because I'm easy come, easy go, Little high, little low,
Any way the wind blows doesn't really matter to me, to me
-Queen "Bohemian Rhapsody"
Message no. 3
From: "Ratinac, Rand (NSW)" <RRatinac@*****.REDCROSS.ORG.AU>
Subject: Re: Senses and recoil.
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 1998 16:46:15 +1000
> > From: Ratinac, Rand (NSW) <RRatinac@*****.REDCROSS.ORG.AU>
> >
> > First - I've never seen this one addressed anywhere. What's the
> > consensus on the Improved Physical Senses physad power? Are they
> treated
> > as 'natural' senses, or 'enhanced' (equivalent of cyber) senses?
>
(Pope Nexx Many-Scars)

> As we said... I think it was last week... they're counted as natural.
>
I missed that one - thanks, Nexx.

> > Second, a roleplaying issue. How many GMs out there have ever had a
> > sammie (or maybe a physad) roleplay being confused when he switches
> on
> > all his enhanced senses?
>
> Since the physad's powers are natural, I would say they have no real
> confusion about the input from their advanced senses (even the funky
> ones,
> like motion detection), though they might have trouble putting it into
> words ("How did you know that guy was behind you, Fred?" "Well, Sam, I
> just felt him... there was a tingling behind me... you know what I
> mean...")
>
Okay, I agree with that one myself. But what about a sammie? Has this
issue ever come up anywhere? And if so, how have you dealt with it? And
if not, how do you think you WOULD or SHOULD deal with it?

Doc'
Message no. 4
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Senses and recoil.
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 1998 12:20:16 +0200
According to Ratinac, Rand (NSW), at 13:41 on 16 Sep 98, the word on the street was...

> First - I've never seen this one addressed anywhere. What's the
> consensus on the Improved Physical Senses physad power? Are they treated
> as 'natural' senses, or 'enhanced' (equivalent of cyber) senses?

I treat them as natural ones, because I see them as the equivalent to the
vision enhancements that metahumans get.

> Second, a roleplaying issue. How many GMs out there have ever had a
> sammie (or maybe a physad) roleplay being confused when he switches on
> all his enhanced senses?

I've never seen anyone do that (being confused, that is, not swithc them
all on at the same time). It might be interesting to add it in sometime,
though.

> Finally, the high strength and recoil modifiers rule from FoF. You know,
> the one that lets you absorb one point of recoil for every two points of
> strength above 3. Now, I've always used that since I got FoF (lovely
> rule I think), but I was just reading SR3 and I noticed this hasn't been
> included as a mainstream rule. Am I to assume that this is still an
> optional rule and may or may not be used, depending on what the GM
> thinks?

Anything that isn't overruled by a new book stays on, IMHO, and even if a
new rule is made you can still use the old one -- like I'm doing for
things like astral space (you _cannot_ move through living things in my
game) and most likely grounding.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
On a wave of mutilation...
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 5
From: Tim Flowers <tflowers@****.NET.AU>
Subject: Re: Senses and recoil.
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 1998 23:33:13 +0800
> > Finally, the high strength and recoil modifiers rule from FoF. You know,
> > the one that lets you absorb one point of recoil for every two points of
> > strength above 3. Now, I've always used that since I got FoF (lovely
> > rule I think), but I was just reading SR3 and I noticed this hasn't been
> > included as a mainstream rule. Am I to assume that this is still an
> > optional rule and may or may not be used, depending on what the GM
> > thinks?
>
> Anything that isn't overruled by a new book stays on, IMHO, and even if a
> new rule is made you can still use the old one -- like I'm doing for
> things like astral space (you _cannot_ move through living things in my
> game) and most likely grounding.
>
> --
> Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
> On a wave of mutilation...
> -> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
> -> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
> -> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-
>
> GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
> PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
> Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998

Well...In My campaign...I use a house rule i dredged off the net...It uses a Strength
test
TN varies according to weapon type and Fire mode of course...Each success equals one point
of recoil nullified...It makes trolls with HMGs kinda nasty...

And another one I haven't used yet but think I will when i run another game...
Blackjack's "maximum Firepower"rule...Simply put it states that you can fire a
SS or SA
weapon as many times as you have the relavant skill(firearms/Gunnery etc)...you incur
pretty horrendous recoil penalties but who cares?It looks cool when you fire a dozen
rounds at someone in the space it takes to sneeze*L*...It sounds like a cool addition to
a SR2/3 game...if you like John Woo that is*L*
Message no. 6
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Senses and recoil.
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 1998 12:44:51 -0400
At 01:41 PM 9/16/98 +1000, you wrote:

>Second, a roleplaying issue. How many GMs out there have ever had a
>sammie (or maybe a physad) roleplay being confused when he switches on
>all his enhanced senses?

Nope. I'd guess that in many, if not all cases, there would be a period of
adjustment as the person adjusts to having those new senses. For 'ware
installed after initial character creation, you might do a bit of RP for
it, but I'd guess most of the time there would be some training and
*working* to get used to the new abilities.

I'm not sure I've ever had anyone try to use *all* their senses anyway;
most of the time it was "I switch to low-light, do I see anything? Okay,
I'll switch over to thermographics, now do I see anything?" I haven't had
anyone try to use all their senses all at one time.

Erik J.


http://www.fortunecity.com/rivendell/dungeon/480/index.html
The Reality Check for a Fictional World
Message no. 7
From: David Foster <fixer@*******.TLH.FL.US>
Subject: Re: Senses and recoil.
Date: Wed, 16 Sep 1998 14:27:16 -0400
On Wed, 16 Sep 1998, Erik Jameson wrote:

->At 01:41 PM 9/16/98 +1000, you wrote:
->
->>Second, a roleplaying issue. How many GMs out there have ever had a
->>sammie (or maybe a physad) roleplay being confused when he switches on
->>all his enhanced senses?
->
->Nope. I'd guess that in many, if not all cases, there would be a period of
->adjustment as the person adjusts to having those new senses. For 'ware
->installed after initial character creation, you might do a bit of RP for
->it, but I'd guess most of the time there would be some training and
->*working* to get used to the new abilities.
->
->I'm not sure I've ever had anyone try to use *all* their senses anyway;
->most of the time it was "I switch to low-light, do I see anything? Okay,
->I'll switch over to thermographics, now do I see anything?" I haven't had
->anyone try to use all their senses all at one time.

Me either. Although, if anyone would ask me, I'd probably say
their firmware refuses the attempt and shunts them to normal vision. If
they messed with the firmware (<EvilGM grin>, I could only wish they'd be
that silly) to allow it, I'd say the worst of the penalties would apply,
because of the really freaky overlay (unless, like Thermo & normal for a
Troll, their race was used to having both on at the same time).

Fixer --------------} The easy I do before breakfast,
the difficult I do all day long,
the impossible only during the week,
and miracles performed on an as-needed basis....

Now tell me, what was your problem?
Message no. 8
From: "Ratinac, Rand (NSW)" <RRatinac@*****.REDCROSS.ORG.AU>
Subject: Re: Senses and recoil.
Date: Thu, 17 Sep 1998 09:49:07 +1000
> Nope. I'd guess that in many, if not all cases, there would be a
> period of
> adjustment as the person adjusts to having those new senses. For
> 'ware
> installed after initial character creation, you might do a bit of RP
> for
> it, but I'd guess most of the time there would be some training and
> *working* to get used to the new abilities.
>
> I'm not sure I've ever had anyone try to use *all* their senses
> anyway;
> most of the time it was "I switch to low-light, do I see anything?
> Okay,
> I'll switch over to thermographics, now do I see anything?" I haven't
> had
> anyone try to use all their senses all at one time.
>
> Erik J.
>
>
> http://www.fortunecity.com/rivendell/dungeon/480/index.html
> The Reality Check for a Fictional World
>
Yeah, but did you have a guy with Thermo, Low-Light (of which he'd
probably be using one), Vision Magnification, Hearing Amplification,
Spatial Recognition and High and Low Frequency Hearing? In a full on
dark combat situation, someone who's got all those is likely to have
them all (or pretty much all) activated at once. I know I would.
Anything to get an edge. :)

Ah well. Guess it wouldn't really be a common problem.

Doc'

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