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Message no. 1
From: MATrickett@***.com MATrickett@***.com
Subject: ShadowRun-EarthDawn Correlations
Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 16:40:56 EDT
Hi there.

I was given this list address to see if anyone had any thoughts, previous
postings, etc., on the points of correlation between FASA's EarthDawn milieu
and the ShadowRun milieu. I heard a *long* time ago that they were
interconnected and only a number of possibilities spring to mind (as I said,
a long time ago)...

* The dragon that owns/runs a corporation (Saeder-Krupp?) and in "Never
Trust an Elf"? Apparently equivalent to Mountainshadow in ED?
* One of the elven princes (well, princess?), or at least the rulers of Tir
Tairngire is equivalent to Alachia, the Blood Queen out of ED? Except that
she's had some form of gene therapy to remove the 'blood thorns...'
* A Neoanarchists Guide to North America - net version I believe - had a
story with Harlequin in it, with a character that seemed to be an ED Passion
and with reference to "Is it time already," i.e. the coming of the ED Horrors.

I'd appreciate any information and, if the thread is done-and-dead with the
list or would otherwise by 'killed,' any private e-mails are more than
welcome.

In advance, thanks for the help and information.

***
MAT
Message no. 2
From: Dvixen dvixen@****.com
Subject: Shadowrun-Earthdawn Correlations
Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 13:47:11 -0700
>I was given this list address to see if anyone had any thoughts, previous
>postings, etc., on the points of correlation between FASA's EarthDawn milieu
>and the ShadowRun milieu. I heard a *long* time ago that they were
>interconnected and only a number of possibilities spring to mind (as I said,
>a long time ago)...

My only comment today. It's Shadowrun (small 'r') and Earthdawn (small 'd')
(And of course, Battletech (big 'T') and MechWarrior (big 'W'))

End of nitpick. ;)
--
Dvixen - dvixen@****.com =-=-= Gallery - http://members.home.com/dvixen
Herkimer's Lair - http://shadowrun.html.com/hlair
"What's your sign?" - "Trespassers will be shot."
Comments/Questions accepted, flames dropped into the abyss.
Message no. 3
From: abortion_engine abortion_engine@*******.com
Subject: ShadowRun-EarthDawn Correlations
Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 17:03:16 -0400
> * The dragon that owns/runs a corporation (Saeder-Krupp?) and in "Never
> Trust an Elf"? Apparently equivalent to Mountainshadow in ED?

Lofwyr. It is never SAID that he is Mountainshadow, but it's never SAID that
Icewing is Dunklezahn, either... :)

> * One of the elven princes (well, princess?), or at least the rulers of
Tir
> Tairngire is equivalent to Alachia, the Blood Queen out of ED? Except
that
> she's had some form of gene therapy to remove the 'blood thorns...'

Actually, Alachia is alove and well, but she's no longer in direct power.
She advises. Which means she runs the show until someone decides she's gone
too far. In BOTH Tirs, actually. She seems to have lost the thorns in
between, sometime. [Six thousand years, even a rose will die...]

> * A Neoanarchists Guide to North America - net version I believe - had a
> story with Harlequin in it, with a character that seemed to be an ED
Passion
> and with reference to "Is it time already," i.e. the coming of the ED
Horrors.

Nearly every book has some references. NeoAG to NA, yes. Also both Tirs,
Aztlan, Cybertech [sort of], Awakenings...both Harlequin adventures...Worlds
Without End, Scars, Little Treasures [the latter two only available in
France, of all places...]

First, read ALL of the 1st ed. sourcebooks you can get your hands on.
Second, read Worlds Without End [a novel] by Caroline Spectre. Third, e-mail
me off-list if you'd like to discuss this more. [esp. if you can't get those
books!] This thread is usually unwelcome here. [Everyone else has heard
enough!] And when it comes to ED/SR crossover, I'm your man. [And I'm not
even kidding. This time.]
Message no. 4
From: Wordman wordman@*******.com
Subject: ShadowRun-EarthDawn Correlations
Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 17:11:25 -0400
> I was given this list address to see if anyone had any thoughts, previous
> postings, etc., on the points of correlation between FASA's
> EarthDawn milieu

See the ShadowFAQ for starters, question R9:

http://shadowrun.html.com/shadowfaq/ShadRLFAQ.html#R9

There are some links there which answer these questions.
Message no. 5
From: Paolo Marcucci pmarcucci@******.com
Subject: ShadowRun-EarthDawn Correlations
Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 14:18:54 -0700
>And when it comes to ED/SR crossover, I'm your man. [And I'm not
>even kidding. This time.]


Except for one little thing: the author of the Dragon book (Earthdawn) is
Mountainshadow. He often characterize himself as "interested in humans".
Dunkelzahn has the same interest.

And the human servant (or whatever) of Mountainshadow is called Darktooth.
Seems like they're never seen together, at the same time. I'll leave as an
exercise to the reader to find the german translation of Darktooth... :)

But it's all old theoretical stuff anywas, the real truth, as always, is at
http://shadowrun.html.com/archive/ArchiveShowArticle.php3?ID32

(I know, I know, I posted this link at least 29 times in the last year, but
why you people don't realize the TRUTH?!)

:)

-Paolo
Message no. 6
From: Andrew Murdoch toreador@***.bc.ca
Subject: ShadowRun-EarthDawn Correlations
Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 14:19:12 -0700 (PDT)
On Thu, 23 Sep 1999 MATrickett@***.com wrote:

> Hi there.
>
> I was given this list address to see if anyone had any thoughts, previous
> postings, etc., on the points of correlation between FASA's EarthDawn milieu
> and the ShadowRun milieu. I heard a *long* time ago that they were
> interconnected and only a number of possibilities spring to mind (as I said,
> a long time ago)...
>
> * The dragon that owns/runs a corporation (Saeder-Krupp?) and in "Never
> Trust an Elf"? Apparently equivalent to Mountainshadow in ED?
> * One of the elven princes (well, princess?), or at least the rulers of Tir
> Tairngire is equivalent to Alachia, the Blood Queen out of ED? Except that
> she's had some form of gene therapy to remove the 'blood thorns...'
> * A Neoanarchists Guide to North America - net version I believe - had a
> story with Harlequin in it, with a character that seemed to be an ED Passion
> and with reference to "Is it time already," i.e. the coming of the ED
Horrors.

There was a unique trilogy of novels dealing with Harelequin to some
degree... unique in that the first two books of the trilogy were
Earthdawn and the third was Shadowrun. Titles escape me at the moment,
unfortunately. Bottom line: The two worlds were the same, several thousand
years separate.

--
Raven
Sometimes known as Andrew C. Murdoch
toreador@***.bc.ca
http://members.xoom.com/corvisraven
Message no. 7
From: Daniel Brace dbrace@**********.com
Subject: ShadowRun-EarthDawn Correlations
Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 17:27:21 -0400
>First, read ALL of the 1st ed. sourcebooks you can get your hands on.
>Second, read Worlds Without End [a novel] by Caroline Spectre. Third,
e-mail
>me off-list if you'd like to discuss this more. [esp. if you can't get
those
>books!] This thread is usually unwelcome here. [Everyone else has heard
>enough!] And when it comes to ED/SR crossover, I'm your man. [And I'm not
>even kidding. This time.]

That was wonderfully put A-E. What a wonderful and respectful way of
handling a question that so often sets off the masses. It's nice to see a
response that encourages new list members not to fear asking questions. My
praise, which isn't easily earned.

BlackWidow-
"You finish sixteen Runs and what do get?
Another bullet wound and a lot more ta fret."
-Phantom
Message no. 8
From: Number Ten Ox number_10_ox@**********.com
Subject: ShadowRun-EarthDawn Correlations
Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 14:44:05 -0700 (PDT)
---abortion_engine <abortion_engine@*******.com> wrote:
>
> > * The dragon that owns/runs a corporation (Saeder-Krupp?) and in
"Never
> > Trust an Elf"? Apparently equivalent to Mountainshadow in ED?
>
> Lofwyr. It is never SAID that he is Mountainshadow, but it's never SAID
that
> Icewing is Dunklezahn, either... :)

Icewing is not Dunkelzahn. Mountainshadow is Dunkelzahn, as evidenced by
personality, outlook, and, well.... MountainShadow's "human servant" (who
is obviously MS himself in human form) is called DarkTooth.
DarkTooth in German is Dunkelzahn.

Lofwyr does not appear in ED: his brother, Alamaise, is the former ruler
of Blood Wood.

> This thread is usually unwelcome here. [Everyone else has heard
> enough!]

Very true, and a crying shame, too.
An almost-definitive cross-reference of ED and SR can be found on Max
Rible's page, at http://www.amurgsval.org/shadowrun/earthdawn.html and
http://www.amurgsval.org/shadowrun/GreatDragons.html.

P.S. That, I think, is the difference between Dowd's "style" and
Mulvihill's. Dowd may have gone overboard with it -- in fact, he did --
but the link to Earthdawn gave players the sense that there was something
more out there, something cleaner and purer than the grim realities of
running. A sense of history, if you will, and a sense that there were
always mysteries left in the world to uncover. I haven't -- so far! --
seen much of that in Mulvihill's work. Who knows, maybe he'll manage to
come up with something just as good.

--Number 10.
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @*****.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
Message no. 9
From: Dvixen dvixen@****.com
Subject: Shadowrun-Earthdawn Correlations
Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 18:00:47 -0700
>There was a unique trilogy of novels dealing with Harelequin to some
>degree... unique in that the first two books of the trilogy were
>Earthdawn and the third was Shadowrun. Titles escape me at the moment,
>unfortunately. Bottom line: The two worlds were the same, several thousand
>years separate.

Except for the fact that Caroline's first two books in the series never got
printed in English....
--
Dvixen - dvixen@****.com =-=-= Gallery - http://members.home.com/dvixen
Herkimer's Lair - http://shadowrun.html.com/hlair
"What's your sign?" - "Trespassers will be shot."
Comments/Questions accepted, flames dropped into the abyss.
Message no. 10
From: NightRain nightrain@***.com.au
Subject: ShadowRun-EarthDawn Correlations
Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 15:16:29 +1000
----- Original Message -----
From: abortion_engine <abortion_engine@*******.com>
To: <shadowrn@*********.org>


> Actually, Alachia is alove and well, but she's no longer in direct power.
> She advises. Which means she runs the show until someone decides she's
gone
> too far. In BOTH Tirs, actually. She seems to have lost the thorns in
> between, sometime. [Six thousand years, even a rose will die...]

Sorry for the ED specific (ie non SR related) answer...

Basically the thorns that the blood elves were covered in were part of a
ritual that focused around protecting Blood Wood and the elves. As Blood
Wood no longer exists in SR times, it is entirely conceivable that the
thorns went with it...

NightRain.

+--------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Whatever you do, don't vote! |
| It will only encourage them. |
| ============================== |
| http://nightrain.pagehub.com |
| http://earthdawn.pagehub.com |
| email:nightrain@***.com.au |
+--------------------------------------------------------------------+
Message no. 11
From: Gurth gurth@******.nl
Subject: ShadowRun-EarthDawn Correlations
Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 10:38:28 +0200
According to MATrickett@***.com, at 16:40 on 23 Sep 99, the word on
the street was...

> I was given this list address to see if anyone had any thoughts, previous
> postings, etc., on the points of correlation between FASA's EarthDawn milieu
> and the ShadowRun milieu. I heard a *long* time ago that they were
> interconnected and only a number of possibilities spring to mind (as I said,
> a long time ago)...

They are (were?) connected, but it's something the current FASA SR staff
don't seem to appreciate all that much.

> * The dragon that owns/runs a corporation (Saeder-Krupp?) and in "Never
> Trust an Elf"? Apparently equivalent to Mountainshadow in ED?

You're thinking of Lofwyr, but it's Dunkelzahn who used to be
Mountainshadow, as witnessed by his "human agent" Darktooth.

> * A Neoanarchists Guide to North America - net version I believe - had a
> story with Harlequin in it, with a character that seemed to be an ED Passion
> and with reference to "Is it time already," i.e. the coming of the ED
Horrors.

That's in the Neo-Anarchists Guide to Everything Else 6
(http://shadowrun.html.com/plasticwarriors/nagee), and the story
originally appeared in a 1993 FASA flyer. It is also in Harlequin's Back,
though slightly modified.

> I'd appreciate any information and, if the thread is done-and-dead with the
> list or would otherwise by 'killed,' any private e-mails are more than
> welcome.

I would advise you to take a look at the list archives at
http://jackpoint.org, as this thread has been discussed a number of times
in the past.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Vraag niet om de terugkeer
-> NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
->The Plastic Warriors Page: http://shadowrun.html.com/plasticwarriors/<-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 12
From: abortion_engine abortion_engine@*******.com
Subject: ShadowRun-EarthDawn Correlations
Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 08:31:59 -0400
> >And when it comes to ED/SR crossover, I'm your man. [And I'm not
> >even kidding. This time.]
>
> Except for one little thing: the author of the Dragon book (Earthdawn) is
> Mountainshadow. He often characterize himself as "interested in humans".
> Dunkelzahn has the same interest.
>
DOH! I realized last night as I was going to bed that I had it backward.
Icewing is Lofwyr. Dunky is Mountainshadow. I'm an idiot.

Thanks, Paolo.
Message no. 13
From: Blair A. Monroe bmonroe@******.fsu.edu
Subject: ShadowRun-EarthDawn Correlations
Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 09:03:44 -0400
At 08:31 AM 9/24/1999 -0400, abortion_engine wrote:
>> >And when it comes to ED/SR crossover, I'm your man. [And I'm not
>> >even kidding. This time.]
>>
>> Except for one little thing: the author of the Dragon book (Earthdawn) is
>> Mountainshadow. He often characterize himself as "interested in
humans".
>> Dunkelzahn has the same interest.
>>
>DOH! I realized last night as I was going to bed that I had it backward.
>Icewing is Lofwyr. Dunky is Mountainshadow. I'm an idiot.
>
>Thanks, Paolo.
>

You are right on Dunklezahn having been Mountainshadow, but according the
Lou Prosperi, the ex-line developer for Earthdawn, Icewing is not Lofwyr.
Lofwyr is Alamaise's mysterious brother and is referred to as being off
somewhere in Vasgothia (germany) I believe. IIRC, Icewing never showed up
in Shadowrun according to 'official' sources. Of course, you are free to
throw that out the window, I beleive a number of other people have as well.

-- Blair
------
Blair A. Monroe
Web Developer / Information Professional / Gamemaster
bmonroe@******.fsu.edu
http://mailer.fsu.edu/~bmonroe/

SRGC v0.1 SR1 SR2+ SR3++ h o++ d+(-) s+ m++ r RN+ B915
Message no. 14
From: abortion_engine abortion_engine@*******.com
Subject: Shadowrun-Earthdawn Correlations
Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 09:00:45 -0400
> >There was a unique trilogy of novels dealing with Harelequin to some
> >degree... unique in that the first two books of the trilogy were
> >Earthdawn and the third was Shadowrun. Titles escape me at the moment,
> >unfortunately. Bottom line: The two worlds were the same, several
thousand
> >years separate.
>
> Except for the fact that Caroline's first two books in the series never
got
> printed in English....
>

Yes. <grumble grumble grumble> And I have receive confimation from FASA that
they won't ever be. Not even on the net. Not even through photocopies
smuggled out of the office.

Does anyone else think this sticks? I mean, I'd pay US$20 each for the
chance to go to the FASA offices and read the manuscript. It wouldn't take
me that long, and they could have someone watch me the whole time to make
sure I didn't take it with me...

Oh, god; I'm pathetic. But if I die, and I haven't read Scars and Little
Treasures, I'm going to be unhappy.
Message no. 15
From: abortion_engine abortion_engine@*******.com
Subject: ShadowRun-EarthDawn Correlations
Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 09:17:48 -0400
> >> >And when it comes to ED/SR crossover, I'm your man. [And I'm not
> >> >even kidding. This time.]
> >>
> >> Except for one little thing: the author of the Dragon book (Earthdawn)
is
> >> Mountainshadow. He often characterize himself as "interested in
humans".
> >> Dunkelzahn has the same interest.
> >>
> >DOH! I realized last night as I was going to bed that I had it backward.
> >Icewing is Lofwyr. Dunky is Mountainshadow. I'm an idiot.
> >
>
> You are right on Dunklezahn having been Mountainshadow, but according the
> Lou Prosperi, the ex-line developer for Earthdawn, Icewing is not Lofwyr.
> Lofwyr is Alamaise's mysterious brother and is referred to as being off
> somewhere in Vasgothia (germany) I believe. IIRC, Icewing never showed up
> in Shadowrun according to 'official' sources. Of course, you are free to
> throw that out the window, I beleive a number of other people have as
well.
>
Hey! What's this Lou Prosperi guy know anyway!? I'm tired of people telling
me I'm wrong just because they happen to be the people who had the idea in
the first place! I hate other people telling me I'm wrong just because I
really am! I'm gonna find this Lou Prosperi guy and I'm going to poke him in
the eye with a sharp stick, and THEN I'm gonna paint his feet and forehead
bright red and NEVER TELL HIM WHY! <...stupid line developers...i'll get
them...i'll show those guys who's icewing...grumble...grumble...grumble...>

Whew...

So, anyway, thanks, Blair. I prefer being corrected to being wrong any day
of the week and twice on Sunday. [I actually do appreciate it. This time,
I'm not being sarcastic. But only this time.]

:)

--ae
Message no. 16
From: Andrew Murdoch toreador@***.bc.ca
Subject: Shadowrun-Earthdawn Correlations
Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 06:19:08 -0700 (PDT)
On Thu, 23 Sep 1999, Dvixen wrote:

> >There was a unique trilogy of novels dealing with Harelequin to some
> >degree... unique in that the first two books of the trilogy were
> >Earthdawn and the third was Shadowrun. Titles escape me at the moment,
> >unfortunately. Bottom line: The two worlds were the same, several thousand
> >years separate.
>
> Except for the fact that Caroline's first two books in the series never got
> printed in English....

English versions of the entire trilogy, Earthdawn and Shadowrun combined,
were advertised in last year's FASA catalog. Whether or not you can still
get them, given FASA's dropping ED is anyone's guess.

--
Raven
Sometimes known as Andrew C. Murdoch
toreador@***.bc.ca
http://members.xoom.com/corvisraven
Message no. 17
From: Rat winterhawk@*********.net
Subject: Shadowrun-Earthdawn Correlations
Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 09:19:18 -0700
> From: "abortion_engine" <abortion_engine@*******.com>

>
> Yes. <grumble grumble grumble> And I have receive confimation from FASA that
> they won't ever be. Not even on the net. Not even through photocopies
> smuggled out of the office.
>
> Does anyone else think this sticks? I mean, I'd pay US$20 each for the
> chance to go to the FASA offices and read the manuscript. It wouldn't take
> me that long, and they could have someone watch me the whole time to make
> sure I didn't take it with me...
>
> Oh, god; I'm pathetic. But if I die, and I haven't read Scars and Little
> Treasures, I'm going to be unhappy.


Couldn't one of our friendly English-speaking German chummers
be persuaded somehow to post a detailed summary of these two
novels for the starved non-German-reading masses?

Does such a summary exist? I'd love to read the books, but if
I can't do that, I'd at least like to know the plot summaries...

--Rat

=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>
Rat - winterhawk@*********.net http://www.magespace.net
Winterhawk's Virtual Magespace - Shadowrun Fiction and More!
DOD#1211 1999 K1200RS - "Dunkelzahn"
"The pickles are staring at me..."
<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<
Message no. 18
From: Number Ten Ox Number_10_Ox@**********.com
Subject: Shadowrun-Earthdawn Correlations
Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 09:38:53 -0700 (PDT)
--- abortion_engine <abortion_engine@*******.com> wrote:

> Yes. <grumble grumble grumble> And I have receive confimation from FASA
> that they won't ever be. Not even on the net. Not even through
photocopies
> smuggled out of the office.

Makes perfect sense, actually. FASA *probably* bought from Caroline First
North American rights and First International Rights. They lost money by
paying her: they'd lose even more by publishing the books for a dead game.
And they *can't* publish it on the net -- they don't have rights to
electronic publication.

If the books were published in Russian I'd offer to translate them, but
seeing as I know neither French nor German...

> Oh, god; I'm pathetic. But if I die, and I haven't read Scars and Little
> Treasures, I'm going to be unhappy.

Heh. I'd like to read them, sure: but I must admit I was awfully
disappointed by Worlds Without End. I kept expecting a Tim Powers-esque
treatment of the conspiracy aspects, and it never materialized.

But hey, I got a couple of cute plotlines out of it. My group's Decker
(who's a bit of a conspiracy buff) got contacted by a group called the Sons
of Mortimer. They're an offshoot of Humanis, who believe that the world has
for milennia been under the control of immortal negroes.

Not only that, but since Queen Elizabeth was Alachia, I've been idly
playing with plotlines that involve Francis Walsingham's network of spies
having been recruited for downcycle dragon hunts, with the assistance of
John Dee. You didn't really want to know the Voynich Manuscript is written
in T'Skrang, did you? :) :)

--Number 10.

====--Number 10 Ox.
"It's a big yellow rubber ducky."
"Is it rigger-driven?"


__________________________________________________
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Message no. 19
From: Penta cpenta@*****.com
Subject: Shadowrun-Earthdawn Correlations
Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 15:49:39 -0400
Number Ten Ox wrote:

> Not only that, but since Queen Elizabeth was Alachia, I've been idly
> playing with plotlines that involve Francis Walsingham's network of spies
> having been recruited for downcycle dragon hunts, with the assistance of
> John Dee. You didn't really want to know the Voynich Manuscript is written
> in T'Skrang, did you? :) :)

<blinks> Explain, please.

John
Message no. 20
From: Andrew Murdoch toreador@***.bc.ca
Subject: Shadowrun-Earthdawn Correlations
Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 13:47:47 -0700 (PDT)
On Fri, 24 Sep 1999, Number Ten Ox wrote:

> --- abortion_engine <abortion_engine@*******.com> wrote:
>
> > Yes. <grumble grumble grumble> And I have receive confimation from FASA
> > that they won't ever be. Not even on the net. Not even through
> photocopies
> > smuggled out of the office.
>
> Makes perfect sense, actually. FASA *probably* bought from Caroline First
> North American rights and First International Rights. They lost money by
> paying her: they'd lose even more by publishing the books for a dead game.
> And they *can't* publish it on the net -- they don't have rights to
> electronic publication.

In which case, the sticky legal question of the day becomes: Who does? If,
indeed, the books weren't published in English (despite the catalog entry
I mentioned earlier), then, does Caroline have the right to publish her
own work on the 'net? Were it simply any other novel, then the answer is
yes, but, the sticky legal part of this is the fact that while her writing
is her own, it's based on someone else's idea.

Unless, of course, having gotten all the money she will out of them, she
puts 'em on the 'net under a disclaimer that she's not making money off
them in this form...

Quick! We need Caroline's email address and a copyright lawyer... =)

(Note to FASA: Sorry, guys... just the fanboy in me trying to find a way
to find books. Bibliophilia is an ugly condition sometimes...)

> Not only that, but since Queen Elizabeth was Alachia, I've been idly
> playing with plotlines that involve Francis Walsingham's network of spies
> having been recruited for downcycle dragon hunts, with the assistance of
> John Dee. You didn't really want to know the Voynich Manuscript is written
> in T'Skrang, did you? :) :)

Not having ever really seen ED, I must ask: T'Skrang?

--
Raven
Sometimes known as Andrew C. Murdoch
toreador@***.bc.ca
http://members.xoom.com/corvisraven
Message no. 21
From: Number Ten Ox Number_10_Ox@**********.com
Subject: Shadowrun-Earthdawn Correlations
Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 14:23:42 -0700 (PDT)
--- Andrew Murdoch <toreador@***.bc.ca> wrote:

> Not having ever really seen ED, I must ask: T'Skrang?

One of the two races that didn't make it into Shadowrun from Earthdawn.
Basically, lizardmen with a swashbuckling outlook on life. Pity, really,
although I may introduce them into my game once the party heads down New
Orleans way.

(My players have "speculated" that the Big Blocks o' Stuff hanging over
Crater lake are nothing more than T'skrang fireboats modified to handle
Astral Space, filled to the brim with Panther-cannon-wielding T'Skrang,
looking down and going "So, do we fuck with'em now or later?")

--Number 10 "Mr. Laverty, there're some lizards here to see you..." Ox. :)


====--Number 10 Ox.
"It's a big yellow rubber ducky."
"Is it rigger-driven?"


__________________________________________________
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Message no. 22
From: David Yiannakos yiannako@*******.edu
Subject: Shadowrun-Earthdawn Correlations
Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 17:34:54 -0400
Being a relative newcomer to Shadowrun, I have to ask:

| One of the two races that didn't make it into Shadowrun from Earthdawn.
| Basically, lizardmen with a swashbuckling outlook on life. Pity, really,

I thought three races from Earthdawn were left out of Shadowrun - Tskrangg,
Windlings and Obsidimen. Is there something I don' t know about?

---Dave ('s not here man)
Message no. 23
From: Number Ten Ox Number_10_Ox@**********.com
Subject: Shadowrun-Earthdawn Correlations
Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 14:50:03 -0700 (PDT)
--- David Yiannakos <yiannako@*******.edu> wrote:
> Being a relative newcomer to Shadowrun, I have to ask:
>
> | One of the two races that didn't make it into Shadowrun from Earthdawn.
> | Basically, lizardmen with a swashbuckling outlook on life. Pity,
> really,
>
> I thought three races from Earthdawn were left out of Shadowrun -
> Tskrangg,
> Windlings and Obsidimen. Is there something I don' t know about?

Yep. Windlings appeared in the SR timeline in about 2065. Check the
description of the "Sprite" in "Paranormal Animals of Europe".

> ---Dave ('s not here man)
--Number 10.

====--Number 10 Ox.
"It's a big yellow rubber ducky."
"Is it rigger-driven?"


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Message no. 24
From: Lady Jestyr jestyr@*********.html.com
Subject: Shadowrun-Earthdawn Correlations
Date: Sat, 25 Sep 1999 08:13:13 +1000
>| One of the two races that didn't make it into Shadowrun from Earthdawn.
>| Basically, lizardmen with a swashbuckling outlook on life. Pity, really,
>
>I thought three races from Earthdawn were left out of Shadowrun - Tskrangg,
>Windlings and Obsidimen. Is there something I don' t know about?

Paranormal Animals of Europe lists a race of "Sprites"... they appear to be
Windlings, though whether they're sentient is another issue.

Lady Jestyr
~ Hell hath no fury like a geek with a whippersnipper ~

* jestyr@*****.com | URL: http://www.geocities.com/~jestyr *
Message no. 25
From: Sommers sommers@*****.umich.edu
Subject: Shadowrun-Earthdawn Correlations
Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 18:22:58 -0400
At 05:50 PM 9/24/99 , Number Ten Ox wrote:
>--- David Yiannakos <yiannako@*******.edu> wrote:
> > Being a relative newcomer to Shadowrun, I have to ask:
> >
> > | One of the two races that didn't make it into Shadowrun from Earthdawn.
> > | Basically, lizardmen with a swashbuckling outlook on life. Pity,
> > really,
> >
> > I thought three races from Earthdawn were left out of Shadowrun -
> > Tskrangg,
> > Windlings and Obsidimen. Is there something I don' t know about?
>
> Yep. Windlings appeared in the SR timeline in about 2065. Check the
>description of the "Sprite" in "Paranormal Animals of Europe".


Wow, that's pretty cool. Considering that the current timeline is running
around 2060, I'd love to see which book quotes 2065. :)

I think it was more like 2054-55.


Sommers
Insert witty quote here.
Message no. 26
From: vocenoctum@****.com vocenoctum@****.com
Subject: ShadowRun-EarthDawn Correlations
Date: Sat, 25 Sep 1999 20:34:35 -0400
On Fri, 24 Sep 1999 15:16:29 +1000 "NightRain" <nightrain@***.com.au>
writes:

>
> > Actually, Alachia is alove and well, but she's no longer in direct
> power.
> > She advises. Which means she runs the show until someone decides
> she's
> gone
> > too far. In BOTH Tirs, actually. She seems to have lost the thorns
> in
> > between, sometime. [Six thousand years, even a rose will die...]
>
> Sorry for the ED specific (ie non SR related) answer...
>
> Basically the thorns that the blood elves were covered in were part
> of a
> ritual that focused around protecting Blood Wood and the elves. As
> Blood
> Wood no longer exists in SR times, it is entirely conceivable that
> the
> thorns went with it...

Actually, teh thorns that grew from the elves were caused by teh plant
spirits tied to teh elves, though you are right in the over all scheme.
Eventually, they just unbound the spirits fromt eh elves I assume, or
maybe the cycle grew too light to preserve the magical contstructs?


Vocenoctum
<http://members.aol.com/vocenoctum>;

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Message no. 27
From: Rand Ratinac docwagon101@*****.com
Subject: Shadowrun-Earthdawn Correlations
Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 05:19:35 +0100 (BST)
> >I was given this list address to see if anyone had
any thoughts, previous postings, etc., on the points
of correlation between FASA's EarthDawn milieu and the
ShadowRun milieu. I heard a *long* time ago that they
were interconnected and only a number of possibilities
spring to mind (as I said, a long time ago)...
>
> My only comment today. It's Shadowrun (small 'r')
and Earthdawn (small 'd') (And of course, Battletech
(big 'T') and MechWarrior (big 'W'))
>
> End of nitpick. ;)
> Dvixen - dvixen@****.com

Isn't that BattleTech, DVix...errr...Dvixen...

*Doc' wonders if he should have left that alone...*

====Doc'
(aka Mr. Freaky Big, Super-Dynamic Troll of Tomorrow)

.sig Sauer
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