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Message no. 1
From: LXR LXR@***.net
Subject: Skill Tests, Specialization and defaulting
Date: Sat, 17 Jul 1999 20:08:12 +0200
How do you resolve a skill test if a specialization is required but the
character hasn't the required specialization but only the base skill (e.g.
Etiquette(Street) required but character has only Etiquette) or the
character has a different specialization (e.g. Etiquette(Street) required
but the character has only Etiquette(Corporate))?

Hhmm...rereading the above written I wonder if you know what I mean. Sorry
but my english isn't the best.
Message no. 2
From: Michael & Linda Frankl mlfrankl@*****.msn.com
Subject: Skill Tests, Specialization and defaulting
Date: Sat, 17 Jul 1999 15:34:07 -0400
LXR asked:
>How do you resolve a skill test if a specialization is required but the
>character hasn't the required specialization but only the base skill (e.g.
>Etiquette(Street) required but character has only Etiquette) or the
>character has a different specialization (e.g. Etiquette(Street) required
>but the character has only Etiquette(Corporate))?
>
>Hhmm...rereading the above written I wonder if you know what I mean. Sorry
>but my english isn't the best.


The way I interpret the rules on specialization's (based on what I've read
in the main SR3 rules) you handle them one of two ways. In the majority of
the time if you have the general skill (Pistols for example) it covers all
specialization's of that skill (Savalette Guardian), which is why it is more
expensive. However in the case of Etiquette this changes. Etiquette is
generally OK, but in specific situations where the specialization is
something that no general skill can cover (Troll Thrash Bar Etiquette) you
actually add modifiers because of the lack of specialization. I don't care
what people argue about etiquette being a general skill it can't cover every
situation. I base this on what it says about adjusting target numbers on the
top of page 87 in SR3 Core.

;)

Smilin' Jack
Message no. 3
From: Sebastian Wiers m0ng005e@*********.com
Subject: Skill Tests, Specialization and defaulting
Date: Sat, 17 Jul 1999 18:29:44 -0500
:How do you resolve a skill test if a specialization is required but the
:character hasn't the required specialization but only the base skill (e.g.
:Etiquette(Street) required but character has only Etiquette) or the
:character has a different specialization (e.g. Etiquette(Street) required
:but the character has only Etiquette(Corporate))?


The general skill ALWAYS covers all specializations of that skill. In
the above case, you could ust use Ettiquette, since Ettiquette (Street) is
just a sub-speciality of Ettiquette.
. The specialization is never "required"- its just that, if you have
it, you use it in the appropriate situations, because if (generally) has a
higer rating than the base skill.

Mongoose
Message no. 4
From: Schizi@***.com Schizi@***.com
Subject: Skill Tests, Specialization and defaulting
Date: Sat, 17 Jul 1999 19:49:05 EDT
When a test is called for with Ettiquette<Matrix> it means that the spec
mentioned is the one applicable tot eh situation. If you don't have it, use
the general skill, if you have a different spec, use the general skill.
Message no. 5
From: LXR LXR@***.net
Subject: Skill Tests, Specialization and defaulting
Date: Sun, 18 Jul 1999 09:41:44 +0200
> The general skill ALWAYS covers all specializations of that skill.
In
> the above case, you could ust use Ettiquette, since Ettiquette (Street) is
> just a sub-speciality of Ettiquette.
> . The specialization is never "required"- its just that, if you have
> it, you use it in the appropriate situations, because if (generally) has a
> higer rating than the base skill.

BUT in Rigger 2 for example you sometimes suffer target modifiers if you
don't have the specialication (e.g. p. 60, if you don't have Indirect Fire
Concentration (specialization in SR3) you can use gunnery skill but suffer a
+2 modifier).
Message no. 6
From: Gurth gurth@******.nl
Subject: Skill Tests, Specialization and defaulting
Date: Sun, 18 Jul 1999 11:14:46 +0200
According to LXR, at 20:08 on 17 Jul 99, the word on
the street was...

> How do you resolve a skill test if a specialization is required but the
> character hasn't the required specialization but only the base skill (e.g.
> Etiquette(Street) required but character has only Etiquette) or the
> character has a different specialization (e.g. Etiquette(Street) required
> but the character has only Etiquette(Corporate))?

You roll the base skill dice. For example, if the character has Etiquette
(Corporate): 4 (6) but must roll an Etiquette (Street) test, you roll four
dice, not 6.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Cooking with the devil, frying down in hell.
-> NAGEE Editor * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
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Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 7
From: Da Twink Daddy datwinkdaddy@*********.com
Subject: Skill Tests, Specialization and defaulting
Date: Sun, 18 Jul 1999 09:20:12 -0500
----- Original Message -----
From: LXR <LXR@***.net>

> > The general skill ALWAYS covers all specializations of that
skill.
> In
> > the above case, you could ust use Ettiquette, since Ettiquette
(Street) is
> > just a sub-speciality of Ettiquette.
> > . The specialization is never "required"- its just that, if
you have
> > it, you use it in the appropriate situations, because if
(generally) has a
> > higer rating than the base skill.
>
> BUT in Rigger 2 for example you sometimes suffer target modifiers if
you
> don't have the specialication (e.g. p. 60, if you don't have
Indirect Fire
> Concentration (specialization in SR3) you can use gunnery skill but
suffer a
> +2 modifier).

I have also seen may house rules the require
specializations/concentrations for certain things. IMVHO, this _must
be_ wrong. Why? Because under SR3 rules, once the base skill exceeds
the concentration you lose the concentration hence, the base skill
includes _ALL_ aspects of any concentration under it. [Which is why,
IMC, Martial Arts are all separate base skills. No single skill can
even _hope_ to cover all the Martial Arts Styles.]

I would throw out the little Rigger 2 comment, or I'd simply make
Indirect Fire (or even something like Remote Control) have a global
modifier. This reflects the 'fact' that these things are unintuitive
to everyone. Those that concentrate on that still find it unintuitive
but they still get the normal benefits of the concentration. [Extra
Dice.]

Da Twink Daddy
bss03@*******.uark.edu
ICQ# 514984
Message no. 8
From: Sebastian Wiers m0ng005e@*********.com
Subject: Skill Tests, Specialization and defaulting
Date: Sun, 18 Jul 1999 13:15:55 -0500
:> The general skill ALWAYS covers all specializations of that skill.
:In
:> the above case, you could ust use Ettiquette, since Ettiquette (Street)
is
:> just a sub-speciality of Ettiquette.
:> . The specialization is never "required"- its just that, if you have
:> it, you use it in the appropriate situations, because if (generally) has
a
:> higer rating than the base skill.
:
:BUT in Rigger 2 for example you sometimes suffer target modifiers if you
:don't have the specialication (e.g. p. 60, if you don't have Indirect Fire
:Concentration (specialization in SR3) you can use gunnery skill but suffer
a
:+2 modifier).

When I read that, I just ignored it. If you have the general skill, you
have all aplicable specializations. That's what having a general skill
MEANS. It just didn't make any sense to me.
On the other hand, it is fully the GM's (and apparently a writters)
perogative to make a test EASIER on a character if they do have an
appropriate specilization. Generally this would be a role playing reward-
if you have "ettiquette (street)" you probably have street contacts,
knowledge, and a matching background, so it makes sense you'd do better on
the streets than sombody with an equally high base etiquette.
I'd never seen this applied to combat before, but I guess that "Indirect
Fire" bit is an exeption. Of course, in Sr3, Gunnery covers diffrent
things, and "Launch Weapons" has the "Spotter" specialization, so its
a
tough call as to just how you would do indirect fire- I myself can afford to
wait for the Cannon Companion, cause inderect fire isn't an issue in our
games...

Mongoose
Message no. 9
From: Chris Maxfield cmaxfiel@****.org.au
Subject: Skill Tests, Specialization and defaulting
Date: Mon, 19 Jul 1999 13:01:21 +1000
At 13:15 18/07/99 -0500, Sebastian Wiers wrote:
> When I read that, I just ignored it. If you have the general skill, you
>have all aplicable specializations. That's what having a general skill
>MEANS. It just didn't make any sense to me.

I completely agree. I think the strange idea is used in several other
places - I think Underwater Combat is described as a specialization of
Unarmed Combat but a character cannot use the Unarmed skill for Underwater
Combat without penalties.

> On the other hand, it is fully the GM's (and apparently a writters)
>perogative to make a test EASIER on a character if they do have an
>appropriate specilization. Generally this would be a role playing reward-

Same here. I'd only consider doing that if they have some good in-play or
well described story-line experience above and beyond just buying the
specialization. In truth, I either define these strange specializations as
separate base skills or treat them as standard specializations off the base
skill.

>if you have "ettiquette (street)" you probably have street contacts,
>knowledge, and a matching background, so it makes sense you'd do better on
>the streets than sombody with an equally high base etiquette.

For me, these factors are no longer directly part of Ettiquette (x) in SR3.
Contacts are acquired at character creation or in game-play (where a good
Etiquette skill does help), and the knowledge comes from an appropriate
Knowledge Skill. I think its possible to have a character with good street
knowledge (theoretical) and good contacts (money or luck) but a low
Ettiquette (Street) because, in action, he's a social klutz.



Chris

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