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Message no. 1
From: Rick J Federle <griffinhq@****.COM>
Subject: Sleep Deprevation
Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 02:09:08 -0500
Here's a question I need help with:
How long can a PC last before feeling the effects of lack of
sleep and what should those effects be?

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Message no. 2
From: Bull <chaos@*****.COM>
Subject: Re: Sleep Deprevation
Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 02:05:40 -0500
At 02:09 AM 1/14/99 -0500, Rick J Federle wrote these timeless words:
> Here's a question I need help with:
> How long can a PC last before feeling the effects of lack of
>sleep and what should those effects be?
>
Speaking from personal experiance... You can go 36 hours with no real
effect. 48 Hours with some adrenaline and/or lots of caffeine and food.
After that, you're pretty out of it and easily distracted, probably
equivelant of being kinda drunk.

After 72 hours, your likely to start hallucinating...

I don't think it's even possible to go more than about 80 hours before the
human body will just shut down, and if kept awake with drugs or otehr
stimulants, it could cause some brain damage, and will definately make you
heavily distracted and hallucinate.

Bull -- Who watched a man do a swan dance through a bank parking lot in 20
Degree (F) weather, screaming "La La La" after playing cards and studying
for finals for three straight days.
>___________________________________________________________________
>You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
>Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html
>or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
>
>
--
Bull -- The Best Ork Decker You Never Met
chaos@*****.com ===== bull22@***********.com
http://shadowrun.html.com/users/bull

=======================================================
= =
= Order is Illusion! Chaos is Bliss! Got any Fours? =
= =
=======================================================

"I may be crazy enough to take on Batman, but the IRS? No way!"
-Joker, "Batman, The Animated Series"
Message no. 3
From: Robert Watkins <robert.watkins@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Sleep Deprevation
Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 17:18:28 +1000
Rick J Federle writes:
> Here's a question I need help with:
> How long can a PC last before feeling the effects of lack of
> sleep and what should those effects be?

I simulated this by making the characters resist Stun attacks.

Base damage of L.

Power level = 2 + 2 * (number of 12 hour blocks without sleep)

Resist hourly.

So, from 12 hours to 24 hours with no sleep, resist 4L every hour. Pretty
easy if you've got a body of 4 or more, and even with less than 4, it's
still a minimum of 10 hours before you get knocked out.

From 24 to 36 hours, you're resisting an 6L. A far bit harder, and you'll
start to accumulate the stun damage at that level.

From 36 to 48 hours, you're resisting an 8L. So on and so forth.

Stimulants (e.g. caffiene) give dice equal to their power level in reducing
the effects. A cup of coffee, in my game, has a power level of 3, for one
hour, culumative (so, two cups of coffee = 6 dice).

--
Duct tape is like the Force: There's a Light side, a Dark side, and it
binds the Universe together.
Robert Watkins -- robert.watkins@******.com
Message no. 4
From: Lady Jestyr <jestyr@*******.COM.AU>
Subject: Re: Sleep Deprevation
Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 17:28:26 +1000
> Here's a question I need help with:
> How long can a PC last before feeling the effects of lack of
>sleep and what should those effects be?

* Feelings of 'dissociation', like you're just watching what's happening to
your body; hence, grossly slowed reaction times.
* Mild to severe hallucinations (as an example, once I go past 20 hours
without sleep, strangers' voices start sounding like my friends'.)
* Physical palsy
* Sleepiness (duh!) at inappropriate moments
* Extreme sensitivity to drugs (of ALL kinds, caffiene nicotine and alcohol
included)

Note that one of my friends managed to stay awake for 7 days straight,
without hallucinating, and only passed out on the eighth day after a vodka
frenzy at my birthday party the night before. He was relatively sane and
seemed pretty normal, too. I still don't know how he did it.

Lady Jestyr

"A true beanie should have a propellor on the top." -- Terry Pratchett
- jestyr@*******.com.au URL: http://www.geocities.com/~jestyr -
Message no. 5
From: Bruce <gyro@********.CO.ZA>
Subject: Re: Sleep Deprevation
Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 10:12:20 +0200
-----Original Message-----
From: Lady Jestyr <jestyr@*******.COM.AU>
To: SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Date: 14 January 1999 09:26
Subject: Re: Sleep Deprevation

<snip other symptoms all pretty accurate BTW)

>* Extreme sensitivity to drugs (of ALL kinds, caffiene nicotine and
alcohol
>included)


I've experienced exactly the opposite. The longer I stay up past the
50 hour mark the less it helps to take stimulants. They keep you awake
but you get none of the "fun" effects :)

>Note that one of my friends managed to stay awake for 7 days
straight,
>without hallucinating, and only passed out on the eighth day after a
vodka
>frenzy at my birthday party the night before. He was relatively sane
and
>seemed pretty normal, too. I still don't know how he did it.


Physical and mental fitness.


-- BRUCE <gyro@********.co.za>

<hard@****>

Step from my tables as I start to chop
I'm a lumberjack DJ Adrock
If you try to knock me you'll get mocked
I'll stir fry you in my wok

Beastie Boys - Intergalactic
Message no. 6
From: Andreas Wagner <Andreas.Wagner@****.AGRAR.TU-MUENCHEN.DE>
Subject: Re: Sleep Deprevation
Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 10:47:07 +0100
> Here's a question I need help with:
> How long can a PC last before feeling the effects of lack of
> sleep and what should those effects be?
>
Depends on what the PC spends his time on. If the PCs are doing
some surveillance from a nice,warm flat with a coffee machine and
aome video games they would probably last 20 hours or morr
without any effects, after that some tiredness will come to their
minds: higher perception targets, less pool dice (loss of flexibility),
reaction penalties and so on. Of course, if the PCs are fleeing a
pach of Hellhounds through a mountain wilderness this process is
bound to accelerate a bit :)

Andreas Wagner
Message no. 7
From: K in the Shadows <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Sleep Deprevation
Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 08:55:23 EST
In a message dated 1/14/1999 2:16:40 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
chaos@*****.COM writes:

>
> Speaking from personal experiance... You can go 36 hours with no real
> effect. 48 Hours with some adrenaline and/or lots of caffeine and food.
> After that, you're pretty out of it and easily distracted, probably
> equivelant of being kinda drunk.
>
> After 72 hours, your likely to start hallucinating...
>
> I don't think it's even possible to go more than about 80 hours before the
> human body will just shut down, and if kept awake with drugs or otehr
> stimulants, it could cause some brain damage, and will definately make you
> heavily distracted and hallucinate.

Actually Bull, your personal experiences are open to very wide interpretation.
I *used* to be able to go that kind of distance when I was your age, but (as
anyone who I hung around with at Gencon last year can testify) I am not really
capable of doing that consistently now.

There are reports and documented files concerning sleep deprivation on the
Web, some of them are really pretty interesting. But, there are rules
concerning "exceding a work limit (time)" found within the SR sourcebooks. I
keep recalling Rigger 2 and SR Comp having variations on this. For that
matter, one of the magically oriented texts does as well.

Me personally, I'd give it a number of hours equal to "6" plus the average of
a person's Body/Willpower (and round down against the person), before some
kind of fatigue test orientation starts to set it. Certain mindsets (read as;
Mental Edges) could help in this regard as could various types of magic (see
the "Awaken" spell).

I have heard of instances where the individual has remained awake for times in
excess of 10 days or more, but the research done indicates that the person has
begun to develop new/internalized recuperation techniques, not all of which
are entirely healthy for the individual's psyche (mental shutdown modes, even
though some functions outwardly seem to be continuing, for example).

In truth, I am not sure that SR could come up with feasible rules for this.

-K
Message no. 8
From: A Halliwell <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Sleep Deprevation
Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 15:29:37 +0000
And verily, did Bull hastily scribble thusly...
|
|At 02:09 AM 1/14/99 -0500, Rick J Federle wrote these timeless words:
|> Here's a question I need help with:
|> How long can a PC last before feeling the effects of lack of
|>sleep and what should those effects be?
|>
|Speaking from personal experiance... You can go 36 hours with no real
|effect.

Speak for yourself. I was starting to see things after 36 hours.


--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
| Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
| Finalist in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
| Computer Science | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
Message no. 9
From: Oliver McDonald <oliver@****.SPYDERNET.COM>
Subject: Re: Sleep Deprevation
Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 11:37:51 -0800
On Thu, 14 Jan 1999 02:05:40 -0500, Bull wrote:

>At 02:09 AM 1/14/99 -0500, Rick J Federle wrote these timeless words:
>> Here's a question I need help with:
>> How long can a PC last before feeling the effects of lack of
>>sleep and what should those effects be?
>>
>Speaking from personal experiance... You can go 36 hours with no real
>effect. 48 Hours with some adrenaline and/or lots of caffeine and food.
>After that, you're pretty out of it and easily distracted, probably
>equivelant of being kinda drunk.
>
>After 72 hours, your likely to start hallucinating...
>
>I don't think it's even possible to go more than about 80 hours before the
>human body will just shut down, and if kept awake with drugs or otehr
>stimulants, it could cause some brain damage, and will definately make you
>heavily distracted and hallucinate.

Actually Bull, the effects of sleep deprivation vary from individual to individual, and
tend
to degrade with age. In my earlier years I could easily do 72 hours without stimulants,
and 96 hours with. Hallucinations tended to start at about 115 hours.

The US Military did a series of experiments, that indicated that the average soldier
(assumed to be in close to peak physical condition) could function reasonably well to 80
to 85 hours awake. The key word here is average, there were some that were as I was,
and some were less.
Message no. 10
From: Oliver McDonald <oliver@****.SPYDERNET.COM>
Subject: Re: Sleep Deprevation
Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 11:39:50 -0800
On Thu, 14 Jan 1999 17:18:28 +1000, Robert Watkins wrote:

>Rick J Federle writes:
>> Here's a question I need help with:
>> How long can a PC last before feeling the effects of lack of
>> sleep and what should those effects be?
>
>I simulated this by making the characters resist Stun attacks.
>
>Base damage of L.
>
>Power level = 2 + 2 * (number of 12 hour blocks without sleep)
>
>Resist hourly.
>
>So, from 12 hours to 24 hours with no sleep, resist 4L every hour. Pretty
>easy if you've got a body of 4 or more, and even with less than 4, it's
>still a minimum of 10 hours before you get knocked out.

Sleep deprivation resistance rolls should be based on will power, not body.
Message no. 11
From: Oliver McDonald <oliver@****.SPYDERNET.COM>
Subject: Re: Sleep Deprevation
Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 11:41:28 -0800
On Thu, 14 Jan 1999 17:28:26 +1000, Lady Jestyr wrote:

>> Here's a question I need help with:
>> How long can a PC last before feeling the effects of lack of
>>sleep and what should those effects be?
>
>* Feelings of 'dissociation', like you're just watching what's happening to
>your body; hence, grossly slowed reaction times.
>* Mild to severe hallucinations (as an example, once I go past 20 hours
>without sleep, strangers' voices start sounding like my friends'.)
>* Physical palsy
>* Sleepiness (duh!) at inappropriate moments
>* Extreme sensitivity to drugs (of ALL kinds, caffiene nicotine and alcohol
>included)
>
>Note that one of my friends managed to stay awake for 7 days straight,
>without hallucinating, and only passed out on the eighth day after a vodka
>frenzy at my birthday party the night before. He was relatively sane and
>seemed pretty normal, too. I still don't know how he did it.

Again, variation in human norms. 7 days is pretty amazing though.
Message no. 12
From: Robert Watkins <robert.watkins@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Sleep Deprevation
Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 08:51:38 +1000
Oliver McDonald writes:
> >So, from 12 hours to 24 hours with no sleep, resist 4L every hour. Pretty
> >easy if you've got a body of 4 or more, and even with less than 4, it's
> >still a minimum of 10 hours before you get knocked out.
>
> Sleep deprivation resistance rolls should be based on will power,
> not body.

Nope. Ability to function without sleep is largely dependant on _physical_
things, such as fitness. The effects of fatigue are physical in nature, not
purely mental.

If you wish, make it an average of the body and willpower, but let me assure
you that the body is more important here.

--
Duct tape is like the Force: There's a Light side, a Dark side, and it
binds the Universe together.
Robert Watkins -- robert.watkins@******.com
Message no. 13
From: Paul Gettle <RunnerPaul@*****.COM>
Subject: Re: Sleep Deprevation
Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 17:37:46 -0500
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

At 05:28 PM 1/14/99 +1000, Lady Jestyr wrote:
>> Here's a question I need help with:
>> How long can a PC last before feeling the effects of lack of
>>sleep and what should those effects be?

>* Mild to severe hallucinations (as an example, once I go past 20
hours
>without sleep, strangers' voices start sounding like my friends'.)

Not to mention bouts of _very_ odd thought patterns.

In my freshman year of college, I came up with the following concepts:
Negative Sleep, and Imaginary Sleep. (These ideas hit me while in the
middle of the usual freshman sleep derivation.)

Negative Sleep is fairly straight forward. Given that the average
person _should_ get 8 hours of sleep per night, if a person gets less
than that, they have a sleep deficit, or as I liked to refer to it:
"Negative Sleep". For example, if someone only gets 7 hours of sleep
one night and just 6 hours the next, over that two day period, they
have 3 hours of Negative Sleep.

Imaginary Sleep is a bit more difficult to understand.

In order to be able to solve certain complex mathematical equations,
mathematicians needed to be able to find the square root of a negative
number, which was an imposible task until they created an abstract
concept, called Imaginary Numbers, to represent the answers to their
unsolvable problems. Imaginary Numbers are represented as multiples of
a constant, called "i". "i" is the square root of negative one.
Conversely, any negative number can be represented as a multiple of
"i^2" (aka "i" squared).

Esentially, the concept of Imaginary Sleep is very similar to Negative
Sleep, except that you represent the number of hours in multiples of
i^2. In all other respects, the concepts are the same. How do you know
when to call the sleep deprivation Imaginary Sleep instead of Negative
Sleep? This is purely at the discretion of the sleep deprive-ee; past
a certain point of lack of sleep, the whole concept of Imaginary Sleep
begins to make absolute, clear, perfect rational sense to the sleep
deprive-ee, and that's when the Imaginary Sleep kicks in.

As you can see, the above two concepts make absolutely no sense unless
you're under the effects of sleep deprivation. :)

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--
-- Paul Gettle, #970 of 1000 (RunnerPaul@*****.com)
PGP Fingerprint, Key ID:0x48F3AACD (RSA 1024, created 98/06/26)
C260 94B3 6722 6A25 63F8 0690 9EA2 3344
Message no. 14
From: Micheal Feeney <Starrngr@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Sleep Deprevation
Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 00:07:25 EST
In a message dated 99-01-14 02:08:58 EST, you write:

> Here's a question I need help with:
> How long can a PC last before feeling the effects of lack of
> sleep and what should those effects be?
>

Hmm. I'd give a +1 to all target numbers after a full 24 hours of being
awake, and add another +1 per additional day(s). If the roll is really
important I would allow them a open willpower check vs a target number of the
#of days without sleep times two, which reduces that modifier by the number
of successes... but just for the task in question. Hmmq.

In fact, I would go so far as requiring to BURN a karma point to be allowed to
make the will check... which will keep people from abusing it...

anyone else have a better idea? and I worry WHAT it is Rick has planned that
he needs to know....

--
Starrngr -- Now with an UPDATED webpage:
Ranger HQ
<A HREF="http://hometown.aol.com/starrngr/index.htm">;
HTTP://hometown.aol.com/starrngr/index.htm</A>;

"You wear a Hawaiian shirt and bring your music on a RUN? No wonder they call
you Howling Mad..." -- Rabid the Pysad.
Message no. 15
From: Rick J Federle <griffinhq@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Sleep Deprevation
Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 00:58:10 -0500
On Fri, 15 Jan 1999 00:07:25 EST Micheal Feeney <Starrngr@***.COM>
writes:
>In a message dated 99-01-14 02:08:58 EST, you write:
[snippity, snippity, snip]

>
>anyone else have a better idea? and I worry WHAT it is Rick has
>planned that
>he needs to know....
>
[Evil GM grin]

___________________________________________________________________
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Message no. 16
From: Micheal Feeney <Starrngr@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Sleep Deprevation
Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 03:13:21 EST
In a message dated 99-01-15 00:56:30 EST, you write:

> >he needs to know....
> >
> [Evil GM grin]

THATS NOT HELPING, RICK!!!!!

--
Starrngr -- Now with an UPDATED webpage:
Ranger HQ
<A HREF="http://hometown.aol.com/starrngr/index.htm">;
HTTP://hometown.aol.com/starrngr/index.htm</A>;

"You wear a Hawaiian shirt and bring your music on a RUN? No wonder they call
you Howling Mad..." -- Rabid the Pysad.
Message no. 17
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Sleep Deprevation
Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 11:23:58 +0100
According to Robert Watkins, at 8:51 on 15 Jan 99, the word on
the street was...

> If you wish, make it an average of the body and willpower, but let me assure
> you that the body is more important here.

Or perhaps allow Willpower as a complimentary "skill." This would
necessitate increasing the "damage" from sleep a bit, as otherwise
everyone will stage it down too easily.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Kleiduivenmelker
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
->The Plastic Warriors Page: http://shadowrun.html.com/plasticwarriors/<-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 18
From: "Blair A. Monroe" <bmonroe@******.FSU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Sleep Deprevation
Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 14:36:24 -0500
At 05:37 PM 1/14/99 -0500, you wrote:
>-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>
>At 05:28 PM 1/14/99 +1000, Lady Jestyr wrote:
>>> Here's a question I need help with:
>>> How long can a PC last before feeling the effects of lack of
>>>sleep and what should those effects be?
>
>>* Mild to severe hallucinations (as an example, once I go past 20
>hours
>>without sleep, strangers' voices start sounding like my friends'.)
>
>Not to mention bouts of _very_ odd thought patterns.
>
>In my freshman year of college, I came up with the following concepts:
>Negative Sleep, and Imaginary Sleep. (These ideas hit me while in the
>middle of the usual freshman sleep derivation.)
>
>Negative Sleep is fairly straight forward. Given that the average
>person _should_ get 8 hours of sleep per night, if a person gets less
>than that, they have a sleep deficit, or as I liked to refer to it:
>"Negative Sleep". For example, if someone only gets 7 hours of sleep
>one night and just 6 hours the next, over that two day period, they
>have 3 hours of Negative Sleep.
>
>Imaginary Sleep is a bit more difficult to understand.
>
>In order to be able to solve certain complex mathematical equations,
>mathematicians needed to be able to find the square root of a negative
>number, which was an imposible task until they created an abstract
>concept, called Imaginary Numbers, to represent the answers to their
>unsolvable problems. Imaginary Numbers are represented as multiples of
>a constant, called "i". "i" is the square root of negative one.
>Conversely, any negative number can be represented as a multiple of
>"i^2" (aka "i" squared).
>
>Esentially, the concept of Imaginary Sleep is very similar to Negative
>Sleep, except that you represent the number of hours in multiples of
>i^2. In all other respects, the concepts are the same. How do you know
>when to call the sleep deprivation Imaginary Sleep instead of Negative
>Sleep? This is purely at the discretion of the sleep deprive-ee; past
>a certain point of lack of sleep, the whole concept of Imaginary Sleep
>begins to make absolute, clear, perfect rational sense to the sleep
>deprive-ee, and that's when the Imaginary Sleep kicks in.
>
>As you can see, the above two concepts make absolutely no sense unless
>you're under the effects of sleep deprivation. :)
>

I love it!

"Bouts of _very_ odd thought patterns" is definitely a side effect of sleep
deprivation in my experience. My primary gaming group in college also
double as dorm night receptionists. The combination of school, night shift
jobs and gaming resulting in frequent experiences with long term sleep
deprivation. This in turn resulted in our own home grown theories that
physicists have this whole light/lack-of-light thing reversed and that
sleep was an addiction. The longer one is "on" sleep, the more of it you
seem to need as the years go by. Also as you began to get over your sleep
habit, you would begin to experience withdrawal symptoms such as headaches,
shakes, hallucinations, lack of perception and eventually loss of
consciousness. Needless to say, we did everything we could to kick our
evil sleep addictions, but alas, thus far none of us have managed to break
free from sleep's iron grip.

-- Blair
------
Blair A. Monroe Phone: (850) 644-8114
Web Systems Administrator / Sr. Web Developer Fax: (850) 644-6253
School of Information Studies E-mail: bmonroe@******.fsu.edu
Florida State University
101 Louis Shores Bldg.
Tallahassee, FL. 32306 http://www.fsu.edu/~lis
Message no. 19
From: Robert Watkins <robert.watkins@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Sleep Deprevation
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 1999 08:45:24 +1000
Gurth writes:
> Or perhaps allow Willpower as a complimentary "skill." This would
> necessitate increasing the "damage" from sleep a bit, as otherwise
> everyone will stage it down too easily.

Perhaps. I'm still to get SR3 (no urgency + no money = no book), so I don't
know the complimentary skills rules.

--
Duct tape is like the Force: There's a Light side, a Dark side, and it
binds the Universe together.
Robert Watkins -- robert.watkins@******.com
Message no. 20
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Sleep Deprevation
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 1999 12:04:55 +0100
According to Robert Watkins, at 8:45 on 18 Jan 99, the word on
the street was...

> > Or perhaps allow Willpower as a complimentary "skill." This would
> > necessitate increasing the "damage" from sleep a bit, as otherwise
> > everyone will stage it down too easily.
>
> Perhaps. I'm still to get SR3 (no urgency + no money = no book), so I don't
> know the complimentary skills rules.

It's quite simple: you roll a test using the complimentary skill against
the same TN as the basic skill. Then you halve your number of successes,
rounding down, and add that to the successes of the base skill

For example, to use Aura Reading skill (which is complimentary to
Intelligence for -- you guessed it -- reading auras), if you roll 4
successes on your Intelligence and 5 on Aura Reading, you have a total of
6 successes (4 + 5/2, rounded down).

In the situation of Body and Willpower being used against sleep
deprivation, IMHO the Power Level should be increased by +1 or +2 or so in
order to accomodate the extra successes that are likely with the Willpower
test.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
And that's as far as the conversation went.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
->The Plastic Warriors Page: http://shadowrun.html.com/plasticwarriors/<-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998

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Thwap!