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Message no. 1
From: Ubiquitous <weberm@*******.net>
Subject: Re: [SR2] physical damage from the astral
Date: Tue, 10 Sep 1996 15:56:52 -0400 (EDT)
At 10:57 AM 9/10/96 -0700, GRANITE wrote:

>This got me thinking..You know it should be impossible for the damage to
>appear as it occurs to the astral form as there is no link between the astral
>form and the meat body..all the physical damage should appear the instant an
>astral form returns to the body..If the mage knows he would instantly
>die..Hmmmm I would delay until my meat got taken to a nice safe place where
>treatment could be administered before I jumped back into my body...

Actually, there is a link, but you can't see it. Cf. "laws of repercussion"
in the Grimoire(?).

--
"I dyde shyte thre grete toordes." Fables of Aesop,
Caxton translation,
V15 1484
Message no. 2
From: GRANITE <granite@**.net>
Subject: Re: [SR2] physical damage from the astral
Date: Mon, 16 Sep 1996 16:38:46 -0700
Ubiquitous wrote:
> Actually, there is a link, but you can't see it. Cf. "laws of repercussion"
> in the Grimoire(?).
>

How did you guys like the way I brought this topic up and then just sort
of dissappeared for a week?? Anyway, My point is/was this..There is a
conflict in the rules I never thought of before..In one place the rules
say there is no link to a person's body and thus an astral mage does not
know when his meat is damaged or moved or whatever..And then there is the
reflection of heavy damage suggesting that there is some sort of link
back to the mage's body..but how could that be if..ect..If there is a
link an astral mage should be able to use it in order to find his meat if
it gets moved..It is one of those you can't have it both way deals..I
kind of like the idea of all the physical damage manifesting as soon as
the astral form returns to it's body...But of course this isn't the way
it is written..

Loki said:
> Yes...my library tends to be in easy reach. It also helps when I
> can remember where I saw something...


So does mine..And everyone sure does like to reitterate a point around
here..

Gurth said part of this:
%> No link, huh... hmm, mind if I throw this fireball spell at your
%astral > form?
%I don't think people near the magician's physical body would like
that...

Only problem is the astra bridge needed to ground a spell is somewhere
else..The astral form, during astral projection, Leaves the meat behind
and goes elsewhere..Thus no spells could be grounded into the astral
form's meat body..Astral combat would however, occur...The only point
where this would be possible is when a mage is entering or leaving the
body and is still partly in contact with it..

Could a spell be cast on a body when the astral form is in absentia?? I
doubt it..It is kind of hard to sink with the aura when the astral form
is miles away..Of course I could be wrong...Well???
--
-------------------------------GRANITE
=================================================================
Lord, Grant Me The Serinity To Accept The Things I Cannot Change,
The Courage To Change The Things I Can,
And The Wisdom To Hide The Bodies Of Those People I Had To Kill
Because They Pissed Me Off.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ShadowRunner's Serinity Prayer
Message no. 3
From: Loki <loki@*******.com>
Subject: Re: [SR2] physical damage from the astral
Date: Mon, 16 Sep 1996 23:06:04 -0700
GRANITE wrote:
<SNIP section about library mania and karma awards for books>
> Gurth said part of this:
> %> No link, huh... hmm, mind if I throw this fireball spell at your
> %astral > form?
> %I don't think people near the magician's physical body would like
> that...
>
> Only problem is the astra bridge needed to ground a spell is somewhere
> else..The astral form, during astral projection, Leaves the meat behind
> and goes elsewhere..Thus no spells could be grounded into the astral
> form's meat body..Astral combat would however, occur...The only point
> where this would be possible is when a mage is entering or leaving the
> body and is still partly in contact with it..
>
> Could a spell be cast on a body when the astral form is in absentia?? I
> doubt it..It is kind of hard to sink with the aura when the astral form
> is miles away..Of course I could be wrong...Well???

I went looking for the rules we all seem to bring up about grounding a
spell thru a projecting mages body and couldn't find it. I know they
mention it in the novels and everyone else seems to have gotten it from
somewhere too. Where is it?


@>-,--'--- Loki

CLARKE'S THIRD LAW:
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.

*********************************************
Poisoned Elves
http://www.netzone.com/~loki/
*********************************************
Message no. 4
From: "Sascha Pabst" <Sascha.Pabst@**********.Uni-Oldenburg.DE>
Subject: Re: [SR2] physical damage from the astral
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 1996 10:23:19 +0000
On 16 Sep 96 at 16:38, GRANITE wrote:
> Ubiquitous wrote:
> > Actually, there is a link, but you can't see it. Cf. "laws of
repercussion"
> > in the Grimoire(?).

> Anyway, My point is/was this..There is a
> conflict in the rules I never thought of before..In one place the rules
> say there is no link to a person's body and thus an astral mage does not
> know when his meat is damaged or moved or whatever..And then there is the
> reflection of heavy damage suggesting that there is some sort of link
> back to the mage's body..
Well, let's see...
There CAN'T be a link, because
* The projecting magician can't follow this link back to his body

There HAS TO BE a link, because
* the "law of repercussion" does apply,
* you can ground a spell through the magician and it arrives at the mgician's
body,
* you can heal the physical body of a projecting magician and the astral body
is affected.

> but how could that be if..ect..If there is a
> link an astral mage should be able to use it in order to find his meat if
> it gets moved..
...unless, of course, it's a kind of link that cannot be asse3nsed, like radio
can't be seen.

> It is one of those you can't have it both way deals..I
> kind of like the idea of all the physical damage manifesting as soon as
> the astral form returns to it's body...But of course this isn't the way
> it is written..
But with this ruling you
* disable the threat of having spells grounded into the meat body,
* disable the possibility of healing the projecting magician, and
* are assuming the physical body is absolutely dead, with no aura remaining.
Then the physical Body would look and react like, say, a desk. How should
the astral Body (the "aura" return into such an inanimate object?

I suggest going with the "invisible link" theory, since it violates no rules
at all, sounds as if it's possible, and you wouldn't have to change the whole
concept of astral travel, like you had to with your "no link" theory.

Sascha
--
+---___---------+----------------------------------------+--------------------+
| / / _______ | Jhary-a-Conel aka Sascha Pabst |The one who does not|
| / /_/ ____/ |Sascha.Pabst@**********.Uni-Oldenburg.de| learn from history |
| \___ __/ | | is bound to live |
|==== \_/ ======| *Wearing hats is just a way of life* | through it again. |
|LOGOUT FASCISM!| - Me | G. Santayana |
+------------- http://www.informatik.uni-oldenburg.de/~jhary -----------------+
Message no. 5
From: "Sascha Pabst" <Sascha.Pabst@**********.Uni-Oldenburg.DE>
Subject: Re: [SR2] physical damage from the astral
Date: Tue, 17 Sep 1996 10:23:19 +0000
On 16 Sep 96 at 23:06, Loki wrote:
[snip]
> I went looking for the rules we all seem to bring up about grounding a
> spell thru a projecting mages body and couldn't find it. I know they
> mention it in the novels and everyone else seems to have gotten it from
> somewhere too. Where is it?
Nowhere at all. Although I handled it this way, and will continue to use this
rule, it is a house rule (although I didn't think so so far).
SRII pp. 149-150 says: "Foci and astral perception both create bridges between
the physical world and the astral plane that can be exploited by spellcasters
in astral space." and then continues about the different effects of mana and
physical spells.Then comes "The same requirements for line-of-sight hold for
the spell's effect as if the spell had been cast normally from physical
space."

Drek, this rule takes too much fun out of the game (say both player and GM in
me). But that's by-the-book :-(
Anyone here found an other rule? Please?

Sascha
--
+---___---------+------------------------------------+------------------------+
| / / _______ | Jhary-a-Conel aka Sascha Pabst |Things that try to look |
| / /_/ ____/ |Sascha.Pabst@ | like things often do |
| \___ __/ | Informatik.Uni-Oldenburg.de | look more like things |
|==== \_/ ======|*Wearing hats is just a way of life*| than things. Well known|
|LOGOUT FASCISM!| - Me | fact. - E.Weatherwax |
+------------- http://www.informatik.uni-oldenburg.de/~jhary -----------------+

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