Back to the main page

Mailing List Logs for ShadowRN

Message no. 1
From: Mongoose <evamarie@**********.NET>
Subject: [SR3] reflex triggers and intiative passes
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1998 10:45:15 -0700
A thought about reflex triggers (and similar effects) in SR3:
A reflex trigger takes a free action to activate, right? That action
is sometimes going to be taken AFTER initiative is rolled. Does anybody
else think it would be cool to allow the activation of a reflex trigger to
add its appropriate effects right away, at the end of the initiative pass
it is activated in? In SR3, this makes some sense; wounds decrease your
initiative, and there's no reason your next pass initiative couldn't be
HIGER than the previous. The same could be done if a spell or drug had a
similar effect.

Example: Sam and Magus are chillin' out at Ed's bar and grill. As usual,
a fight erupts. Sam and Magus roll their initiative, each 1d6+5- they
were relaxing, wires and spells turned off. Say they both roll 9's.
On their actions, Sam whacks some jerk with a chair than turns on his
wires (level 2), and magus casts "increase reflexes +3" successfully on
himself.
Next initiative pass, neither would normally get to act; they both
have an initiative of -1 (assuming they were not hurt). But Sam gets to
add 2 dice +4 to his initiative, and Magus can add 3 dice. That will
likely give them more actions, and maybe even allow them to act before
other folks who, until this point, were faster. Assuming all the dice
come up 4's, they would both act that pass on 11.

Cool or lame? I personally think this would make for fun play. It
allows reflex triggers to be used for more than just fooling guards, and
creates a cool "afterburner" feel, as well as maybe making combat even
more unpredictable.

Mongoose
Message no. 2
From: Sean McCrohan <mccrohan@*****.OIT.GATECH.EDU>
Subject: Re: [SR3] reflex triggers and intiative passes
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1998 11:54:26 -0400
On Fri, Oct 02, 1998 at 10:45:15AM -0700, Mongoose wrote:

<Snipped: Text and example of reflex trigger kicking in immediately>

> Cool or lame? I personally think this would make for fun play. It
> allows reflex triggers to be used for more than just fooling guards, and
> creates a cool "afterburner" feel, as well as maybe making combat even
> more unpredictable.

Sounds good to me. In SR 2, it would have been too unwieldy to be
worth doing, but with the SR3 initiative rules, it works fairly well.
Now, to get a REAL 'afterburner' effect, you'd need some sort of
system with a limited duration - say, it's triggered at will, as a free
action, but can only stay on for 5 rounds, and then has to recharge for
an hour or so. This might be a tailored gland that produces a modified
form of Kamikaze - gives the initiative boost, but not the stat boosts,
and doesn't have the debilitating effects (though it'd probably still be
/psychologically/ addictive, even if it wasn't physically addictive). The
gland takes, say, 10 minutes to produce a 1-round dose of the drug, and
feeds into an implanted reservoir with a conscious-trigger release. The
reservoir has a maximum capacity of 5 rounds worth of drug - the drug
itself is rapidly broken down within the body and fades quickly.
This would be a LOT cheaper than Wired - you only have to do surgery
in one place, and you don't have to muck about with nerves as much. It'd
also be cheaper Essence-wise...though it'd be a judgement call as to whether it
was cyberware or bioware. The downsides, of course, are lower effectiveness
and limited duration.

--Sean
--
Sean McCrohan (mccrohan@**.gatech.edu) | "He uses his folly as a stalking
Grad Student, Human-Computer Interaction | horse, and under the presentation
Georgia Institute of Technology | of that he shoots his wit."
http://www.lcc.gatech.edu/~smccrohan | _As You Like It_, Act 5 Sc 4
Message no. 3
From: Fixer <fixer@*******.TLH.FL.US>
Subject: Re: [SR3] reflex triggers and intiative passes
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1998 12:44:39 -0400
On Fri, 2 Oct 1998, Mongoose wrote:

-> A thought about reflex triggers (and similar effects) in SR3:
-> A reflex trigger takes a free action to activate, right? That action
->is sometimes going to be taken AFTER initiative is rolled. Does anybody
->else think it would be cool to allow the activation of a reflex trigger to
->add its appropriate effects right away, at the end of the initiative pass
->it is activated in? In SR3, this makes some sense; wounds decrease your
->initiative, and there's no reason your next pass initiative couldn't be
->HIGER than the previous. The same could be done if a spell or drug had a
->similar effect.
<snip example>
-> Cool or lame? I personally think this would make for fun play. It
->allows reflex triggers to be used for more than just fooling guards, and
->creates a cool "afterburner" feel, as well as maybe making combat even
->more unpredictable.

I like it and plan on implementing it, but only rolling the
additional dice and adding in the additional reaction bonuses. However,
as most of my PCs and most of my players' PCs don't have Wired Reflexes
(either Bioware or magical or adept reaction increases usually), a reflex
trigger isn't often in place and the magic is usually sustained.

Fixer --------------} The easy I do before breakfast,
the difficult I do all day long,
the impossible only during the week,
and miracles performed on an as-needed basis....

Now tell me, what was your problem?
Message no. 4
From: Mongoose <evamarie@**********.NET>
Subject: Re: [SR3] reflex triggers and intiative passes
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1998 13:48:26 -0700
:<Snipped: Text and example of reflex trigger kicking in immediately>
.
:
: Sounds good to me. In SR 2, it would have been too unwieldy to be
:worth doing, but with the SR3 initiative rules, it works fairly well.
: Now, to get a REAL 'afterburner' effect, you'd need some sort of
:system with a limited duration - say, it's triggered at will, as a free
:action, but can only stay on for 5 rounds, and then has to recharge for
:an hour or so.

Well, the Adrenal Pump does boost reaction, and could just as easily
be activated in the middle of a combat turn as a reflex trigger or spell.
It lasts a few turns, takes like 15 minute to re-charge, and causes stun
damage when the effect wears off. I'd say this is even more useful for
adrenal pumps than reflex triggers.
The "drug pump" idea ,which I snipped> isn't an "afterburner; its
Nitrous oxide, and is about as likely to wreck your "engine". But it is
certainly possible that somebody would use kamikaze, jazz, or some other
speed boosting combat drug in the middle of combat, instead of before.

Mongoose
Message no. 5
From: "D. Ghost" <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: [SR3] reflex triggers and intiative passes
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1998 15:49:58 -0500
On Fri, 2 Oct 1998 11:54:26 -0400 Sean McCrohan
<mccrohan@*****.OIT.GATECH.EDU> writes:
>On Fri, Oct 02, 1998 at 10:45:15AM -0700, Mongoose wrote:

><Snipped: Text and example of reflex trigger kicking in immediately>

>> Cool or lame? I personally think this would make for fun play.
It
>> allows reflex triggers to be used for more than just fooling guards,
and
>> creates a cool "afterburner" feel, as well as maybe making combat even
>> more unpredictable.

> Sounds good to me. In SR 2, it would have been too unwieldy to
be
>worth doing, but with the SR3 initiative rules, it works fairly well.
> Now, to get a REAL 'afterburner' effect, you'd need some sort of
>system with a limited duration - say, it's triggered at will, as a free
>action, but can only stay on for 5 rounds, and then has to recharge for
>an hour or so. This might be a tailored gland that produces a modified
>form of Kamikaze - gives the initiative boost, but not the stat boosts,
>and doesn't have the debilitating effects (though it'd probably still be
>/psychologically/ addictive, even if it wasn't physically addictive).

<SNIP>

The Adrenal Pump ins Shadowtech (page 19) is very similar to this. If
you still want more or something different, the Adrenal Pump is a good
basis/reference for your design. (Perhaps a level 3 Adrenal Pump [+3Q,
+3S, +3W, +6R, 3.75 BI, 200k nuyen]?)

--
D. Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, RuPixel)
"Long hair eliminates the need for barbers" -- Einstein

___________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
Message no. 6
From: "D. Ghost" <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: [SR3] reflex triggers and intiative passes
Date: Fri, 2 Oct 1998 15:44:24 -0500
On Fri, 2 Oct 1998 10:45:15 -0700 Mongoose <evamarie@**********.net>
writes:
> A thought about reflex triggers (and similar effects) in SR3:
> A reflex trigger takes a free action to activate, right? That
action
>is sometimes going to be taken AFTER initiative is rolled. Does anybody
>else think it would be cool to allow the activation of a reflex trigger
to
>add its appropriate effects right away, at the end of the initiative
pass
>it is activated in? In SR3, this makes some sense; wounds decrease your
>initiative, and there's no reason your next pass initiative couldn't be
>HIGER than the previous. The same could be done if a spell or drug had
a
>similar effect.

<SNIP>

> Cool or lame? I personally think this would make for fun play. It
>allows reflex triggers to be used for more than just fooling guards, and
>creates a cool "afterburner" feel, as well as maybe making combat even
>more unpredictable.
>
>Mongoose

That's exactly how I play it. :) Except I give the reflex trigger as a
freebie. IMO, the above (combined with perception tests to notice wires'
effects) encourages people to turn off their wires. :)

--
D. Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, RuPixel)
"Long hair eliminates the need for barbers" -- Einstein

___________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
Message no. 7
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: [SR3] reflex triggers and intiative passes
Date: Sat, 3 Oct 1998 13:42:10 +0200
According to Mongoose, at 10:45 on 2 Oct 98, the word on the street was...

> Cool or lame? I personally think this would make for fun play. It
> allows reflex triggers to be used for more than just fooling guards, and
> creates a cool "afterburner" feel, as well as maybe making combat even
> more unpredictable.

I feel it's a pretty good rule, provided you subtract the appropriate
amount from the new initiative to reflect the current pass (as you
suggested). I don't really see any problems with it.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
"Nobody's going to murder anyone here even if it means I have to
kill someone!" --Kane, detective/rigger
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998

Further Reading

If you enjoyed reading about [SR3] reflex triggers and intiative passes, you may also be interested in:

Disclaimer

These messages were posted a long time ago on a mailing list far, far away. The copyright to their contents probably lies with the original authors of the individual messages, but since they were published in an electronic forum that anyone could subscribe to, and the logs were available to subscribers and most likely non-subscribers as well, it's felt that re-publishing them here is a kind of public service.

Thwap!