Back to the main page

Mailing List Logs for ShadowRN

Message no. 1
From: Simon and Fiona sfuller@******.com.au
Subject: SR tech here today
Date: Tue, 29 Feb 2000 15:52:44 +1100
-----Original Message-----
From: Allen Versfeld <moe@*******.com>
To: shadowrn@*********.com <shadowrn@*********.com>
Date: Monday, September 04, 2000 5:15 PM
Subject: Re: SR tech here today


>Zebulin Magby wrote:
>>
>>
>> Seriously, though, is there any concrete evidence to support the theory
that
>> violent video games make people [more] violent?
>
>The most convincing evidence that I've heard is from my own father. He
goes on about how, in the army, you're given human shaped targets on the
shooting range, so that you're less likely to hesitate when ordered to shoot
another human being - you're more likely to simply treat your enemy as a
target. He reckons that 3D shooters have the same effect. You're
effectively training a gut reaction. Human-shape = open fire.
>

I heard that, but you forgot to add that since they changed the shape of the
targets, wartime shootings of hugely fat men in circle pattern t-shirts has
gone right down. Why else do you think tie-dye shirts came back after all
those years?
And I like the way you say "He goes on about..." Talk a lot, your dad? :?)
Message no. 2
From: Simon and Fiona sfuller@******.com.au
Subject: SR tech here today
Date: Sat, 26 Aug 2000 11:40:26 +1000
-----Original Message-----
From: SyphonAC@***.com <SyphonAC@***.com>
To: shadowrn@*********.com <shadowrn@*********.com>
Date: Friday, September 01, 2000 2:53 AM
Subject: Re: SR tech here today


>In a message dated 8/31/00 5:03:55 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
>james.dening@****.co.uk writes:
>
>> Pitikhate Sooraksa of King Mongkut's Institute of Technology
>> in Ladkarabang, Bangkok, however, is already planning "improvements"
for
>> his creation and stresses that he has password protected the "fire"
>> command for operating Roboguard over the Internet. Phew...
>
>Oh good, so all it would take would be someone who can get around that and
>they could go on a killing spree....wonderful, Hope it won't be anyone that
>doesn't like me....
>
Since a definition of a hacker is a quiet loner that doesn't fit well into
society, and the number of doom/quake/whatever engines that everyone is
addicted to, it's only a matter of time, really. People really are stupid.
Message no. 3
From: Simon and Fiona sfuller@******.com.au
Subject: SR tech here today
Date: Sun, 27 Aug 2000 13:15:45 +1000
-----Original Message-----
From: Zebulin Magby <zebulingod@*****.com>
To: shadowrn@*********.com <shadowrn@*********.com>
Date: Friday, September 01, 2000 6:49 PM
Subject: Re: SR tech here today


><griffinhq@****.com> wrote:
>>
>> On Thu, 31 Aug 2000 21:56:22 -0700 "Zebulin Magby"
<zebulingod@*****.com>
>> writes:
>> > I hope you aren't suggesting that violent games make people violent
>> > themselves?
>> >
>> A number of people have. They state that the influence of the games
>> make people more likely to result to violent solutions to their problems.
>>
>
>Mmmm, doesn't say much for those of us who play Shadowrun, then does it? I
>mean, it's a violent game (at times). I'd like to stress, however, that
>playing it has not made me any more "bloodthirsty" or prone to solve
>problems with violence. Personally, I think this is a big TV scam to turn
>attention away from all the violence children are soaking up from the time
>their parents decide to let the TV teach their children...
>
>(No, I am not paranoid.....much. :)
>
>Seriously, though, is there any concrete evidence to support the theory
that
>violent video games make people [more] violent?
>
It is the same as the "Heavy metal makes you commit murder/suicide"
argument. On the whole, simulated violence helps to release tension and
actually helps reduce violence, but if you are predisposed to that sort of
behavior, especially if you are a young child still learning behavior, then
they can influence you. The real problem is gun simulators that increase a
persons firearm skills immeasurably. They don't make you into a psycho but
they train existing psychos very well. That is what I meant by the doom
engine comment, Roboguard would be very simmilar and one step removed from
face to face real murder, so anyone wanting to strike out has the ways,
means and training.
Message no. 4
From: James Dening james.dening@****.co.uk
Subject: SR tech here today
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 10:03:51 +0100
FYI,
J.

NEW SCIENTIST WEEKLY NEWSLETTER
No 49, 2 September 2000

Trained to kill and incapable of compassion this law enforcer makes
Robocop look like a soft touch. Called "Roboguard", the robot security
guard comes complete with infrared sensors for tracking people and a gun
which it can fire at will or on the orders of a human controller via an
Internet connection. Leading cyberneticists have not welcomed this
gun-toting sentinel with open arms. Chris Czarnecki describes Roboguard
as "quite horrific", whereas Kevin Warwick fears that "things can always
go wrong". Pitikhate Sooraksa of King Mongkut's Institute of Technology
in Ladkarabang, Bangkok, however, is already planning "improvements" for
his creation and stresses that he has password protected the "fire"
command for operating Roboguard over the Internet. Phew...
http://www.newscientist.com/nlc/0902/robocop.html
Message no. 5
From: SyphonAC@***.com SyphonAC@***.com
Subject: SR tech here today
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 12:52:56 EDT
In a message dated 8/31/00 5:03:55 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
james.dening@****.co.uk writes:

> Pitikhate Sooraksa of King Mongkut's Institute of Technology
> in Ladkarabang, Bangkok, however, is already planning "improvements" for
> his creation and stresses that he has password protected the "fire"
> command for operating Roboguard over the Internet. Phew...

Oh good, so all it would take would be someone who can get around that and
they could go on a killing spree....wonderful, Hope it won't be anyone that
doesn't like me....

Syphon
Message no. 6
From: Tzeentch tzeentch666@*********.net
Subject: SR tech here today
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 09:53:23 -0700
From: <SyphonAC@***.com>
> > Pitikhate Sooraksa of King Mongkut's Institute of Technology
> > in Ladkarabang, Bangkok, however, is already planning "improvements"
for
> > his creation and stresses that he has password protected the "fire"
> > command for operating Roboguard over the Internet. Phew...

Oh man imagine the press when this thing eventually backfires on their dumb
asses. All it takes is one hacker with an attitude to make this thing the
areas worst nightmare. If we're lucky they will bulletproof it so that until
the cops break out an Anti-Material rifle it can shoot up anything it wants.
If we're REALLY lucky it has speakers so you can shout "Exterminate!
Exterminate! Exterminate!"

Kenneth
"On two occasions I have been asked, 'Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the
machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out?' I am not able to
apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a
question."
-- Charles Babbage
Message no. 7
From: Zebulin Magby zebulingod@*****.com
Subject: SR tech here today
Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 21:56:22 -0700
"Simon and Fiona" <sfuller@******.com.au> wrote:
>
> Since a definition of a hacker is a quiet loner that doesn't fit well into
> society, and the number of doom/quake/whatever engines that everyone is
> addicted to, it's only a matter of time, really. People really are stupid.
>
>

I hope you aren't suggesting that violent games make people violent
themselves?


-Zebulin-Magby-
ICQ: 21932827
SRGC: SR1 SR2++ SR3+++ h+ b+++ !B UB IE+
RN+ STK++ W- dk+ ri++ m-(d++) gm++ M- P++

"The splendor of the Universe pales in comparison to that of a fine woman."
-Me '2K
-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version: 3.1
GU d- s+:+>: a22 C++++ UL-- P L+(--) E? W+++ N++ o? K- w+ O---- M-(--) V?
!PS PE Y+ PGP t+ 5++ X+ R+++>$ tv b+++>$ DI++++ D++ G+ e* h--- r+++ z+++
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------



__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger.
http://im.yahoo.com
Message no. 8
From: Allen Versfeld moe@*******.com
Subject: SR tech here today
Date: Fri, 01 Sep 2000 07:53:44 +0200
Simon and Fiona wrote:
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: SyphonAC@***.com <SyphonAC@***.com>
> >
> >Oh good, so all it would take would be someone who can get around that and
> >they could go on a killing spree....wonderful, Hope it won't be anyone that
> >doesn't like me....
> >
> Since a definition of a hacker is a quiet loner that doesn't fit well into
> society, and the number of doom/quake/whatever engines that everyone is
> addicted to, it's only a matter of time, really. People really are stupid.

This reminds me of a Bastard Operator from Hell episode, where he links the hated managers
electric wheelchair to a video game, and passes the console to a hated co-worker...
"Hahah, I can make the little robot guy go down stairs! ah, damn, he's gone down a
manhole. How do I get another life?"
--
Allen Versfeld
moe@*******.za.net

"As a computer, I find your faith in technology to be quite amusing"
Message no. 9
From: griffinhq@****.com griffinhq@****.com
Subject: SR tech here today
Date: Fri, 1 Sep 2000 03:31:38 -0400
On Thu, 31 Aug 2000 21:56:22 -0700 "Zebulin Magby" <zebulingod@*****.com>
writes:
> "Simon and Fiona" <sfuller@******.com.au> wrote:
> >
> > Since a definition of a hacker is a quiet loner that doesn't fit
> well into
> > society, and the number of doom/quake/whatever engines that
> everyone is
> > addicted to, it's only a matter of time, really. People really are
> stupid.
> >
> >
>
> I hope you aren't suggesting that violent games make people violent
> themselves?
>
A number of people have. They state that the influence of the games
make people more likely to result to violent solutions to their problems.

*************************************************************************
Griffin Industries
"A Shadowrunner's Corp."

http://www.angelfire.com/oh2/Griffin/index.html

________________________________________________________________
YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit:
http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
Message no. 10
From: Zebulin Magby zebulingod@*****.com
Subject: SR tech here today
Date: Fri, 1 Sep 2000 01:49:34 -0700
<griffinhq@****.com> wrote:
>
> On Thu, 31 Aug 2000 21:56:22 -0700 "Zebulin Magby"
<zebulingod@*****.com>
> writes:
> > I hope you aren't suggesting that violent games make people violent
> > themselves?
> >
> A number of people have. They state that the influence of the games
> make people more likely to result to violent solutions to their problems.
>

Mmmm, doesn't say much for those of us who play Shadowrun, then does it? I
mean, it's a violent game (at times). I'd like to stress, however, that
playing it has not made me any more "bloodthirsty" or prone to solve
problems with violence. Personally, I think this is a big TV scam to turn
attention away from all the violence children are soaking up from the time
their parents decide to let the TV teach their children...

(No, I am not paranoid.....much. :)

Seriously, though, is there any concrete evidence to support the theory that
violent video games make people [more] violent?

-Zebulin-Magby-
ICQ: 21932827
SRGC: SR1 SR2++ SR3+++ h+ b+++ !B UB IE+
RN+ STK++ W- dk+ ri++ m-(d++) gm++ M- P++

"The splendor of the Universe pales in comparison to that of a fine woman."
-Me '2K
-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version: 3.1
GU d- s+:+>: a22 C++++ UL-- P L+(--) E? W+++ N++ o? K- w+ O---- M-(--) V?
!PS PE Y+ PGP t+ 5++ X+ R+++>$ tv b+++>$ DI++++ D++ G+ e* h--- r+++ z+++
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------



_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @*****.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
Message no. 11
From: griffinhq@****.com griffinhq@****.com
Subject: SR tech here today
Date: Fri, 1 Sep 2000 05:43:53 -0400
On Fri, 1 Sep 2000 01:49:34 -0700 "Zebulin Magby" <zebulingod@*****.com>
writes:
>
> Seriously, though, is there any concrete evidence to support the
> theory that
> violent video games make people [more] violent?
>
If by concrete you mean studies, then yes. There are studies that
suggest that.
But studies and reports, much like anything else, can be oriented in the
direction of the researcher's biases. It's simply a matter of choosing
the right group of test subjects.

*************************************************************************
Griffin Industries
"A Shadowrunner's Corp."

http://www.angelfire.com/oh2/Griffin/index.html

________________________________________________________________
YOU'RE PAYING TOO MUCH FOR THE INTERNET!
Juno now offers FREE Internet Access!
Try it today - there's no risk! For your FREE software, visit:
http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.
Message no. 12
From: Jill jmenning@***********.com
Subject: SR tech here today
Date: Fri, 01 Sep 2000 06:43:47 -0500
At 04:43 AM 9/1/00, griffinhq@****.com wrote:

> > Seriously, though, is there any concrete evidence to support the
> > theory that
> > violent video games make people [more] violent?
> >
> If by concrete you mean studies, then yes. There are studies that
>suggest that.
> But studies and reports, much like anything else, can be oriented
> in the direction of the researcher's biases. It's simply a matter of
> choosing the right group of test subjects.

They can show that there is an increasingly violent trend to television and
an increasingly violent trend in juveniles, but they have not been able to
prove that there is any relationship beyond coincidence.

Jill
Message no. 13
From: Scott Simmons s.c.simmons@*****.com
Subject: SR tech here today
Date: 1 Sep 2000 07:39:42 -0700
This is the part that really scares me ...

"Sooraksa says Roboguard might be of interest to private companies, but sees the
armed forces as a more likely buyer. "We'd like to show it to the military," he
says. "It should be in good hands." "

Do you think they'd be more effective than the battle droids in SW1:TPM?
Message no. 14
From: Allen Versfeld moe@*******.com
Subject: SR tech here today
Date: Mon, 04 Sep 2000 08:14:55 +0200
Zebulin Magby wrote:
>
>
> Seriously, though, is there any concrete evidence to support the theory that
> violent video games make people [more] violent?

The most convincing evidence that I've heard is from my own father. He goes on about how,
in the army, you're given human shaped targets on the shooting range, so that you're less
likely to hesitate when ordered to shoot another human being - you're more likely to
simply treat your enemy as a target. He reckons that 3D shooters have the same effect.
You're effectively training a gut reaction. Human-shape = open fire.

*shrug* I don't care either way. I don't own a gun, and I enjoy the games, and if it's
true, it'll make me better at paintball *g*
--
Allen Versfeld
moe@*******.za.net

"As a computer, I find your faith in technology to be quite amusing"

Further Reading

If you enjoyed reading about SR tech here today, you may also be interested in:

Disclaimer

These messages were posted a long time ago on a mailing list far, far away. The copyright to their contents probably lies with the original authors of the individual messages, but since they were published in an electronic forum that anyone could subscribe to, and the logs were available to subscribers and most likely non-subscribers as well, it's felt that re-publishing them here is a kind of public service.