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Message no. 1
From: David Visser <davidv@*********.net>
Subject: SR vs. SR2
Date: Fri, 12 Jul 1996 05:54:20 -0700
Alatar wrote:
>
> On Sun, 30 Jun 1996 13:18:23 +0100 you wrote:
>
> >Did everyone who wanted this get a copy? After I accidentally sent it to
> >the main list, I forgot to check that those who asked for it actually
> >saw it.
> >
> I would like a copy of it, it accidentally got deleted :(
> Send it private e-mail, please.
>
> jager@***.randomc.com
>
> When I die, I want to go in my
> sleep, like my grandfather...
> Not screaming like the rest of
> the passengers in the car!!!This may be a stupid question....but is there a document
available
indicating the differences between SR and SR2? If so where could I get
this?

I am new at SR and all of my material is comprised of SR and SR2.
Message no. 2
From: "Mark Steedman" <M.J.Steedman@***.rgu.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: SR vs. SR2
Date: Fri, 12 Jul 1996 13:04:34 GMT
David Visser writes

> This may be a stupid question....but is there a document available
> indicating the differences between SR and SR2? If so where could I get
> this?
>
Not simply. The SR2 main book presents the new system and lists the
required stat changes to bring the equipment in SR1 sourcebooks up
to date.

Having not read the 1st edition.
They changed the dice pools and what you can use them on.
1st - 2nd ed conversion see 2nd ed rules calulate the things.
Karma got changed, basically they added karma pools and made auto
success a lot less easy to get and attractive.

weapon codes.
the first ed ones are number letter number
2nd ed number letter
1st - 2nd as SR2 is 'the one 2nd ed number = both 1st ed added
together' as a vauge guide.
not brilliant but they list them all in SR2 anyway typically the
above is a bit less deadly than the true 2nd ed code. The last number
of 1st ed the staging is ALWAYS 2 in 2nd ed so is ignored.

lots of minor changes, eg now compare success then stage rather than
1st ed stage up then stage down, physad powers are now bonus dice etc.

> I am new at SR and all of my material is comprised of SR and SR2.
>
Most of us simply play 2nd ed though there are a few folks that seem
to prefer 1st. Once you have played the game for a while though
converting between the two becomes fairly easy, i upgrade NPC's out
of the old adventures at 30 second a go. (a few quick dice pool
calculations is all usually)

Mark
Message no. 3
From: Damon Wilson <damontw@****.com>
Subject: Re: SR vs. SR2
Date: Fri, 12 Jul 96 09:37 MDT
At 01:04 PM 7/12/96 GMT, Mark Steedman wrote:
>David Visser writes
>
>> This may be a stupid question....but is there a document available
>> indicating the differences between SR and SR2? If so where could I get
>> this?
>>
>Not simply. The SR2 main book presents the new system and lists the
>required stat changes to bring the equipment in SR1 sourcebooks up
>to date.
>
>Having not read the 1st edition.
>They changed the dice pools and what you can use them on.
>1st - 2nd ed conversion see 2nd ed rules calulate the things.
>Karma got changed, basically they added karma pools and made auto
>success a lot less easy to get and attractive.
>
>weapon codes.
>the first ed ones are number letter number
>2nd ed number letter
>1st - 2nd as SR2 is 'the one 2nd ed number = both 1st ed added
>together' as a vauge guide.
>not brilliant but they list them all in SR2 anyway typically the
>above is a bit less deadly than the true 2nd ed code. The last number
>of 1st ed the staging is ALWAYS 2 in 2nd ed so is ignored.
>
>lots of minor changes, eg now compare success then stage rather than
>1st ed stage up then stage down, physad powers are now bonus dice etc.
>
>> I am new at SR and all of my material is comprised of SR and SR2.
>>
>Most of us simply play 2nd ed though there are a few folks that seem
>to prefer 1st. Once you have played the game for a while though
>converting between the two becomes fairly easy, i upgrade NPC's out
>of the old adventures at 30 second a go. (a few quick dice pool
>calculations is all usually)
>
>Mark
>
FASA also incorporated First Edition Grimoire into the 2nd Edition Shadowrun
mainrule book. Magic was changed just enougn to make you re-read the rules
again. Things like spell stacking are new. The combat section also expanded
on the "what can my character do in a turn?" section. They added Free,
Simple and Complex actions. As for firearms, they used the Optional Fireamrs
rules from the back of the Rigger Blackbook. Multiple shot bursts are
modified into a single "shot" for damage purposes rather that shooting each
bullet in First Edition.

A little off topic, but I think the hardest conversion is from Virtual
Realities 1.0 to Virtual Realities 2.0. I have been playins Shadowrun since
mid 1990 and running it since 1991. It took me about a month or so to
"foregt" all of the old Matrix rules. What really helped me was to sit down
with my Decker player and he and I ran systems just to see what would
happen. It took us about 3 runs to work out all of the kinks and now he and
I can run a system in about 15 minutes (this includes rolling up a random
system).

In all I think FASA wanted to streamline the game. They made combat go a
little faster. and DRASTICALLY cut down on the netrunning time. IMHO I think
FASA wants to put a little more emphasis on ROLE-playing than ROLL-playing.

Damon Wilson

damonwt@****.com

My typos are on purpose, they are part of my charm ;)
Message no. 4
From: Ubiquitous <weberm@*******.net>
Subject: Re: SR vs. SR2
Date: Fri, 12 Jul 1996 12:36:51 -0400 (EDT)
At 09:37 AM 7/12/96 MDT, Damon wrote:

>FASA also incorporated First Edition Grimoire into the 2nd Edition Shadowrun
>mainrule book. Magic was changed just enougn to make you re-read the rules
>again. Things like spell stacking are new.

Spell stacking is not new. The team's mage tried it when Queen Euphoria
first came out.


--
"I remember my first sexual encounter because I kept the recipe."
- Jeff Dahmer
Message no. 5
From: "Gurth" <gurth@******.nl>
Subject: Re: SR vs. SR2
Date: Sat, 13 Jul 1996 11:06:20 +0100
David Visser said on 5:54/12 Jul 96...

> This may be a stupid question....but is there a document available
> indicating the differences between SR and SR2? If so where could I get
> this?
>
> I am new at SR and all of my material is comprised of SR and SR2.

You have both the SR1 and the SR2 rulebooks? Sounds a bit unnecessary to
me (says someone who also has both of them :) but anyway, the main
differences are in that the magic system was completely overhauled (by
installing lots of rules from the original Grimoire into the basic rules), the
combat rules were streamlined, the Damage Codes were slightly altered, and
th decking rules were updated so they are a simplified version of those in
Virtual Realities.

BTW, if you want to play a decker, buy Virtual Realities 2.0 before you
even start making a character, and forget you ever read the rules in the
main book.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
The trick relied on the laws of physics failing to spot the flaw until
the journey was complete.
-> NERPS Project Leader & Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Character Mortuary: http://huizen.dds.nl/~mortuary/mortuary.html <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version 3.1:
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE
Y PGP- t(+) 5+ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
Message no. 6
From: "Mark Steedman" <M.J.Steedman@***.rgu.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: SR vs. SR2
Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 08:47:54 GMT
Damon Wilson writes

> FASA also incorporated First Edition Grimoire into the 2nd Edition Shadowrun
> mainrule book.
only the main magic rules parts, bugs, initiation etc were still left
for GR2.

> A little off topic, but I think the hardest conversion is from Virtual
> Realities 1.0 to Virtual Realities 2.0.
Big change. Having got VR1 and well the SR2 rules were supposedly
compatible its easier. Big bonus is with VR2 you can easily throw
hosts together without worrying about having a vaugely sensible
architecture, its also far quicker ( i agree with below) not that i
use matrix rules more than once in forever.

> What really helped me was to sit down
> with my Decker player and he and I ran systems just to see what would
> happen. It took us about 3 runs to work out all of the kinks and now he and
> I can run a system in about 15 minutes (this includes rolling up a random
> system).
>
> In all I think FASA wanted to streamline the game. They made combat go a
> little faster. and DRASTICALLY cut down on the netrunning time. IMHO I think
> FASA wants to put a little more emphasis on ROLE-playing than ROLL-playing.
>
> Damon Wilson
>
Mark

> My typos are on purpose, they are part of my charm ;)
>
thats what they all say :)
Message no. 7
From: "Gurth" <gurth@******.nl>
Subject: Re: SR vs. SR2
Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 12:32:33 +0100
Mark Steedman said on 8:47/16 Jul 96...

> > My typos are on purpose, they are part of my charm ;)
> >
> thats what they all say :)

That line would be more appropriate underneath one of Mark's messages,
though... :)

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Desolate and without purpose.
-> NERPS Project Leader & Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Character Mortuary: http://huizen.dds.nl/~mortuary/mortuary.html <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version 3.1:
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE
Y PGP- t(+) 5+ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
Message no. 8
From: "Mark Steedman" <M.J.Steedman@***.rgu.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: SR vs. SR2
Date: Tue, 16 Jul 1996 16:19:26 GMT
Gurth writes
>
> > > My typos are on purpose, they are part of my charm ;)
> > >
> > thats what they all say :)
>
> That line would be more appropriate underneath one of Mark's messages,
> though... :)
>
Thanks :)...

I suspect i make a lot of typo's what happens when i try to type far
too fast as i'm trying to read and reply to the list during coffee.
This does not typically leave time to proof read messages :(

Further Reading

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Thwap!