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From:	Ereskanti@*.com Ereskanti@*.com
Subject:	SR Vs. "The Matrix" (Re: Deciper press release link)
Date:	Thu, 9 Sep 1999 01:41:35 EDT

Message no. 1 In a message dated 9/8/1999 9:57:13 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
abortion_engine@*******.com writes:

> > But. In the first 12 months, SR3 outsold Battletech. The ENTIRE line.
> There
> > is a line of Shadowrun jewelry. A movie was made out of the game (I know,
> I
> > know, The Matrix was not directly from Renny's story, but we have been
> > confirmed that the initial idea was exactly that and the movie went into
> > another direction after some *problems*). As Mike said, the public
> awareness
> > of the game is growing at an amazing rate. I wouldn't call this a
> failure...
>
> Only one point: does anyone else have corroborating evidence of this
> Matrix/SR link?

Yes, Yes I do. And you know what, it should be enough to suffice for most of
you to know that the *LINK* between the two did/does exist, and live with it.
In the end, the *final* draft of "The Matrix: The Movie" was NOT the
original draft story idea that *DID* have to go past the watchful eyes of
FASA's SR/Corporate staff and Lawyers. In fact, it was at *LEAST* the third
or fourth draft for the story idea, unless I have completely forgotten
everything. As it stands now, "THE MATRIX" as a motion picture entertainment
will remain in the hands of those that have it now, and know that the "the
Matrix" (copyright by FASA Corporation) is something else from now on.

As it was said, you are not likely to see any "Matrix Action Figures" or
"Matrix Trading Cards" or anything similar because of the copyright conflicts
that exist. This even extends, so I'm to understand, to the idea of a
"Matrix Video Game" based upon the movie.

I'm not lying, nor am I incorrect in what I'm relaying to any whom read this
posting. The MVG I mention there at the end is the *ONLY* place where *I* am
not certain. I am more than certain that the people at FASA Corporation do
know however.

-K

From:	caelric@**.com caelric@**.com
Subject:	SR Vs. "The Matrix" (Re: Deciper press release link)
Date:	Thu, 09 Sep 1999 07:25:12 -0700

Message no. 2 At 01:41 AM 9/9/99 EDT, K wrote:
>> Only one point: does anyone else have corroborating evidence of this
>> Matrix/SR link?
>
>Yes, Yes I do. And you know what, it should be enough to suffice for most
of
>you to know that the *LINK* between the two did/does exist, and live with
it.

Um, could you please not say things like that? That rather smacks of big
brotherism, saying'you don't need to know, oh little one' If you are
restrained from saying what you know due to legal reasons, or
confidentiality agreements, or just because the person that told you asked
you not to pass it on, ok, then just say so, or don't even mention it at
all. But I get somewhat irate when someone tells me I don't need to know
something.

This is not meant to inflame, although I'm sure it could be taken that way.
If you know more about the Matrix/SR link, and you are able to say, please
do so.

Thanks

Dave

Blaming guns for violence is like blaming spoons for overweight people

From:	runnerpaul@***.com runnerpaul@***.com
Subject:	SR Vs. "The Matrix" (Re: Deciper press release link)
Date:	Thu, 9 Sep 1999 10:48:11 -0400 (EDT)

Message no. 3 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

At 01:41 AM 9/9/99 -0400, Ereskanti@***.com wrote:
:As it was said, you are not likely to see any "Matrix Action
:Figures" or "Matrix Trading Cards" or anything similar because of
:the copyright conflicts that exist.

Maybe not trading cards, but Diamond Select, the toy manufacturing
division of comic book uber-distributer Diamond Comic Distributors,
Inc., _is_ putting out a limited release line of Matrix movie action
figures due out in November. Neo, Morpheus, Trinity, Cypher, Switch,
and yes, Agent Smith. Check out p.419 of the September '99 Previews
Catalog, or the following URL:

http://www.diamondcomics.com/toychest/toys/99_09/matrix.htm

Apparently, someone's lawyers at Warner Brothers is of the opinion
that action figures are kosher, even with the trademark/copyright
issues involved, and licensed Diamond to put them out.

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--
-- Paul Gettle, #186 of 1000 (RunnerPaul@*****.com)
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From:	Mark Fender markf@******.com
Subject:	SR Vs. "The Matrix" (Re: Deciper press release link)
Date:	Thu, 9 Sep 1999 10:09:47 -0500

Message no. 4 > > Only one point: does anyone else have corroborating evidence of this
> > Matrix/SR link?
>
> Yes, Yes I do. And you know what, it should be enough to suffice for most
> of
> you to know that the *LINK* between the two did/does exist, and live with
> it.
>
So, all of us are too stupid to accept the truth and must be told it by you?
That's interesting. I'm not sure what you're trying to say here.

> In the end, the *final* draft of "The Matrix: The Movie" was NOT the
> original draft story idea that *DID* have to go past the watchful eyes of
> FASA's SR/Corporate staff and Lawyers. In fact, it was at *LEAST* the
> third
> or fourth draft for the story idea, unless I have completely forgotten
> everything. As it stands now, "THE MATRIX" as a motion picture
> entertainment
> will remain in the hands of those that have it now, and know that the "the
>
> Matrix" (copyright by FASA Corporation) is something else from now on.
>
> As it was said, you are not likely to see any "Matrix Action Figures" or
> "Matrix Trading Cards" or anything similar because of the copyright
> conflicts
> that exist. This even extends, so I'm to understand, to the idea of a
> "Matrix Video Game" based upon the movie.
>
That's interesting, because Matrix Action Figures are coming out. Previews
listed them in their current catalog (including pictures of said figures).

> I'm not lying, nor am I incorrect in what I'm relaying to any whom read
> this
> posting. The MVG I mention there at the end is the *ONLY* place where *I*
> am
> not certain. I am more than certain that the people at FASA Corporation
> do
> know however.
>
> -K

From:	Rat winterhawk@*********.net
Subject:	SR Vs. "The Matrix" (Re: Deciper press release link)
Date:	Thu, 09 Sep 1999 10:06:54 -0700

Message no. 5 From: Ereskanti@***.com

> As it was said, you are not likely to see any "Matrix Action Figures" or
> "Matrix Trading Cards" or anything similar because of the copyright
conflicts
> that exist. This even extends, so I'm to understand, to the idea of a
> "Matrix Video Game" based upon the movie.

I don't know about video games or trading cards, but I saw Matrix
action figures just yesterday.

http://www.diamondcomics.com/searchdata/toychest/toys/99_09/matrix.htm

--Rat

=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>=>
Rat - winterhawk@*********.net http://www.magespace.net
Winterhawk's Virtual Magespace - Shadowrun Fiction and More!
DOD#1211 1999 K1200RS - "Dunkelzahn"
"The pickles are staring at me..."
<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<=<

From:	Schizi@*.com Schizi@*.com
Subject:	SR Vs. "The Matrix" (Re: Deciper press release link)
Date:	Thu, 9 Sep 1999 13:17:19 EDT

Message no. 6 In a message dated 9/9/99 1:43:03 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Ereskanti@***.com
writes:

> I'm not lying, nor am I incorrect in what I'm relaying to any whom read
this
> posting. The MVG I mention there at the end is the *ONLY* place where *I*
> am
> not certain. I am more than certain that the people at FASA Corporation
do
> know however.
>
<snicker> think of it like this, FASA licensed bideo game rights to MS.
Imagine now, that MS has matrix video games copywrited.... :-)
As for Matrix being such story, the screenplay was not written by the author
of the short story with Renny.
Could it have been based on the story, rewriten by someone else, sure..but
it also could have been any other cyberpunk inspiration. <shrug>

From:	Ereskanti@*.com Ereskanti@*.com
Subject:	SR Vs. "The Matrix" (Re: Deciper press release link)
Date:	Thu, 9 Sep 1999 15:13:38 EDT

Message no. 7 In a message dated 9/9/1999 9:37:20 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
caelric@****.com writes:

>
> Um, could you please not say things like that? That rather smacks of big
> brotherism, saying'you don't need to know, oh little one' If you are
> restrained from saying what you know due to legal reasons, or
> confidentiality agreements, or just because the person that told you asked
> you not to pass it on, ok, then just say so, or don't even mention it at
> all. But I get somewhat irate when someone tells me I don't need to know
> something.
>
> This is not meant to inflame, although I'm sure it could be taken that way.
> If you know more about the Matrix/SR link, and you are able to say, please
> do so.
>
> Thanks

Okay, I'll apologize for coming off in such a manner. Let me try this again.

Yes, there is a connection between FASA:SR and "THE MATRIX: The Movie". The
list archives from that time probably give some of this information as well.
Anything beyond this I just don't feel like saying on the list. And I am
sorry that I came off as "Big Brotherish", as that wasn't really my
intention. I was really wanting to say/be perceived as the Jerk I know I can
be.... ;-P <J/K>

For the future movies surrounding "THE MATRIX" (yes, Keanu Reaves and a few
others of the cast have signed on for more), the storyline is likely to have
nothing to do with SR in any way, hence there won't really be any connections.

However, if we see a magician or a metahuman, expect the fireworks to start
up again.

-K

From:	Ereskanti@*.com Ereskanti@*.com
Subject:	SR Vs. "The Matrix" (Re: Deciper press release link)
Date:	Thu, 9 Sep 1999 15:17:10 EDT

Message no. 8 In a message dated 9/9/1999 9:49:11 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
runnerpaul@*****.com writes:

<snip>
> http://www.diamondcomics.com/toychest/toys/99_09/matrix.htm

Yep, could be fun to watch....

-K (who dons his multi-chroma color-switching shades and leather hat to
watch)

From:	Ereskanti@*.com Ereskanti@*.com
Subject:	SR Vs. "The Matrix" (Re: Deciper press release link)
Date:	Thu, 9 Sep 1999 15:21:03 EDT

Message no. 9 In a message dated 9/9/1999 12:18:21 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
Schizi@***.com writes:

> <snicker> think of it like this, FASA licensed bideo game rights to MS.
> Imagine now, that MS has matrix video games copywrited.... :-)

Yes, I know I've thought of that one myself.

> As for Matrix being such story, the screenplay was not written by the
> author
> of the short story with Renny.
> Could it have been based on the story, rewriten by someone else,
sure..but
> it also could have been any other cyberpunk inspiration. <shrug>

You are of course correct, it could have been. It wasn't.

-K

From:	Bull bull@***********.com
Subject:	SR Vs. "The Matrix" (Re: Deciper press release link)
Date:	Thu, 9 Sep 1999 19:03:34 -0400

Message no. 10 At 10:06 AM 9/9/99 -0700, Rat wrote these timeless words:
>From: Ereskanti@***.com
>
>> As it was said, you are not likely to see any "Matrix Action Figures"
or
>> "Matrix Trading Cards" or anything similar because of the copyright
conflicts
>> that exist. This even extends, so I'm to understand, to the idea of a
>> "Matrix Video Game" based upon the movie.
>
>I don't know about video games or trading cards, but I saw Matrix
>action figures just yesterday.
>
Actually, Eraskanti kind of missed something, methinks.. (Sorry K :))

FASA owns, according to Mike Mulvhill, the "Game Rights" to the term "THE
MATRIX". Game rights, AFAIK, do not cover Comics, trading cards, or action
figures. It DOES include CCG's, RPGs, and Video Games, however. And Video
games was the specific example Mike used at one of the seminars at Gen Con.

Now, if whoever put out the movie "THE MATRIX" wishes to -PAY- FASA for the
rights to use that term on a Video game, well... Gee, FASA makes a bundle
of cash for nothing other than a License :] Nice, eh? ;]

So this is not to say that you WON'T see a Matrix video game based on the
movie, but chances are real good that if you do, FASA's making some cash
off the deal, or someone's about to get sued :]

Oh yeah, also, this is why you will see a productcalled "The Matrix" coming
out for SR next eyar some time :] And it has nothing to do with the movie :]

Bull
--
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bull@*******.net == bull22@***********.com == bull@***********.com
http://shadowrun.html.com/users/bull
ICQ: 35931890
====================================================== =
= Order is Illusion! Chaos is Bliss! Got any Fours? = =
======================================================
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From:	Airwasp@*.com Airwasp@*.com
Subject:	SR Vs. "The Matrix" (Re: Deciper press release link)
Date:	Fri, 10 Sep 1999 17:03:31 EDT

Message no. 11 In a message dated 9/9/99 9:37:20 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
caelric@****.com writes:

> At 01:41 AM 9/9/99 EDT, K wrote:
> >> Only one point: does anyone else have corroborating evidence of this
> >> Matrix/SR link?
> >
> >Yes, Yes I do. And you know what, it should be enough to suffice for most
> of
> >you to know that the *LINK* between the two did/does exist, and live with
> it.
>
>
> Um, could you please not say things like that? That rather smacks of big
> brotherism, saying'you don't need to know, oh little one' If you are
> restrained from saying what you know due to legal reasons, or
> confidentiality agreements, or just because the person that told you asked
> you not to pass it on, ok, then just say so, or don't even mention it at
> all. But I get somewhat irate when someone tells me I don't need to know
> something.
>
> This is not meant to inflame, although I'm sure it could be taken that way.
> If you know more about the Matrix/SR link, and you are able to say, please
> do so.
>
> Thanks
>
> Dave

Dave,

The beginnings of Matrix has to deal with the short story of Renny and Dr.
Halbersteim in the original Virtual Realities sourcebook from many years ago.
The screenwriters went too far in some of their interpretations and FASA
decided that they no longer needed to collaborate. As such, the
screenwriters had to come up with something else along the way and hence the
movie that was seen in the theatres.

As for other more in depth information, I would suggest that you contact FASA
directly and inquire with them.

-Mike Bobroff

From:	Dvixen dvixen@****.com
Subject:	SR Vs. "The Matrix" (Re: Deciper press release link)
Date:	Fri, 10 Sep 1999 14:28:41 -0700

Message no. 12 >The beginnings of Matrix has to deal with the short story of Renny and Dr.
>Halbersteim in the original Virtual Realities sourcebook from many years ago.
> The screenwriters went too far in some of their interpretations and FASA
>decided that they no longer needed to collaborate. As such, the
>screenwriters had to come up with something else along the way and hence the
>movie that was seen in the theatres.

>As for other more in depth information, I would suggest that you contact FASA
>directly and inquire with them.

Or listen to the Secrets Seminar from Adam's site. ;) I recall Mike had a
few things to say about that during the seminar. :)
(shadowrun.html.com/tss i hope....)
--
Dvixen - dvixen@****.com =-=-= Gallery - http://members.home.com/dvixen
Herkimer's Lair - http://shadowrun.html.com/hlair
"What's your sign?" - "Trespassers will be shot."
Comments/Questions accepted, flames dropped into the abyss.

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