| From: | Tzeentch tzeentch666@*********.net |
|---|---|
| Subject: | Supercavitation Torps in Shadowrun (Paul J. Adam anyone?) |
| Date: | Tue, 29 Aug 2000 20:08:07 -0700 |
> > Nasty implications, judgement aside. BUT,
> there's a lot of open ended
> > speculation involved there regardless of the
> truth.
And we sure as hell can't rely on the Russian Navy giving a straight account
of what really happened. Hell I doubt even their own government really knows
what happened. Hence the contradictory statements and flat out lies being
told.
By the way, where did Paul J. Adam vanish off to? I really miss his
commentary on this sort of thing.
> Yes, and I would say that this technology, though
> very good has it's one drawback when it comes to
> maneuverability. At short ranges this technology
> would be devastating as a weapon, but at longer
> ranges it could be avoided much more easily.
The unit can essentially only travel in a direct line. As
http://www.syninfo.com/ian/PRIVATE/2000/07/26/2000072620555105.html notes:
"There was one problem: with only the nose of the craft actually touching
the water, conventional propellers wouldn't work, so an entirely new form of
underwater propulsion was called for. The solution was simply to mount a
rocket motor on the back. Rockets work in empty space, so having no water to
push against isn't a problem. They also provide an immensely powerful kick."
So you in essence have a direct fire underwater rocket. Now, I'll admit it
can be a DAMN fast underwater rocket, according to the article Navy
researchers have achieved supersonic speeds using supercavitating "bullets."
I would like to point out that the MADCAP torpedo from Cyberpirates (p. 181)
has a speed of 177 knots, roughly equivalent to the Shkvel. Just ignore the
bogus description that it travels at 75 knots.
> One way perhaps to make this thing work better at
> long ranges is to think of this tech differently.
> Instead of the rocket being the main engine, it is
> just a booster rocket. It gets the main torpedo
> closer to it's target before the target can
> maneuver fast enough. The rocket engine then cuts
> out and the torpedo is then released. The
> cavitation torpedo thereby becomes two-stage
> weapon and capable of greater manevuerability.
I doubt this could work, especially if you postulate a really high speed
projectile. That is unless you somehow provide a way to safely decelerate
the unit until it can release its submunitions without flatening itself upon
release. Which sort of defeats the whole point of having a damn fast
underwater weapon since while its slowing down you can bet your ass enemy
supercavitating countermeasures are moving in to splat the incoming warhead.
As above so below neh?
> In SR, these torpedoes would exist. The larger
> navies of the world may have them stockpiled
> (UCAS, Japan, United Kingdom). I can see Tir
> na'Nog having them on their blue water navy
> (coastal) as it would fit their zenophobic
> attitude towards the rest of the world.
Well, that's assuming that the SR militaries actually used half of the
available technology of today ;) I think you would have a hard time arguing
against the theory that most SR writers knoq jack squat about modern weapon,
don't give jack squat about modern weapons, and will in the future continue
to know jack squat. There is also the problem of refitting these weapons
into Shadowrun without making it seem they just sort of showed up one fine
day. After all, with supercavitation tech you have to really rethink a lot
of naval technology and strategy. It appears obvious from Cyberpirates that
this is clearly NOT the case. Shadowruns military technology is clearly
stuck in the 1980s with a few anomolous units (ANDREWS for example). I
sincerely hope Jon and whoever writers for the next Rigger books makes an
attempt to retrofit some real-world tech into the mix but there are a lot of
factors involved that sort of muddy the waters.
I guess you have to ask yourself if adding real-life technology without any
backstory or thought as to impact is better then the "Shadowrun Tried and
True" method of simply saying "what technology?"
For those who are too lazy to look the websites heres a list of some
relevent information sources. Have fun, don't detonate an FAE in your pants.
GENERAL SUPERCAVITATION
http://www.newscientist.com/features/features_224813.html
http://www.virtualairforcecommand.com/users/gir/GIR_This_Tuesday.htm
<--Good news, including the human head found in a codfish. Yummy.
http://www.mediacen.navy.mil/pubs/allhands/aug98/augpg39.htm <--Nice pic of
a supersonic underwater projectile
http://www.nap.edu/books/0309069270/html/12.html
SHKVAL INFORMATION
I could not find too much info on the shkval I'm afraid, seems the Russians
like naming a lot of things with the same name ;)
If you have access try http://www.milparade.com/catalog/pdf/510.pdf
I did find out it is made by Region State Research and Production Enterprise
in Moscow. Their number is (095) 111-4152 so give them a ring!
http://www.hazegray.org/faq/smn7.htm#G10
"Shkval is a recently-developed rocket torpedo which a submarine is expected
to fire back when it detects an oncoming weapon. The cone-shaped Shkval
travels within a supercavitating bubble which it produces with its own
exhaust. It is fired as a conventional torpedo, and ignites its rocket after
travelling 50 m from the submarine. Range is given as 6 nm at 200 knots.
Running depth is 400 m. Dimensions: 53 cm x 8.2 m. The warhead is nuclear,
with a preset burst range. The published designations are VA-111 and M-5."
http://popularmechanics.com/popmech/sci/9812STMIM.html <--Concrete
submarines firing vertical-launch Shvals. Pics and everything.
http://rcaam.milparade.ru/9d/03_04.htm
Not directly related but still interesting:
http://www.nuwc.navy.mil/hq/misc/present/index.html
http://www.mediacen.navy.mil/pubs/allhands/aug98/augpg24.htm
And in the "WTF!!?? News department:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A21948-2000Aug25.html
http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_45335.html <--I think they still have
openings for those that want to apply ;)
