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Message no. 1
From: "Fakereszt (Endreffy Janos)" <ayes@****.SCH.BME.HU>
Subject: Usefulness of Physical Adepts
Date: Sun, 9 Apr 1995 05:34:36 +0200
It seems to me that everyone is out to make
>phys adepts more powerful than they already are, I don't think this is
>warranted or neccessary, the character types seem perfectly balanced as they
>are.

>Just a gripe of my own, I have to say that phys adds are just about the
>weakest bang for the buck, so to speak. If I put priority B in tech
>instead of magic I could make a Sammie who could easily out perform an adept
>any day of the week. How often do you really run across spirits who have
>Immunity to Weapons? I mean, the adept might kick ass v.s spirits, but he
>looses ALOT in the performance area.
>
>Sean

Well two weeks ago the whole party I was GM-ing was struck dead by some
spirits. They didn't complain about that too much tough: Immunity to Weapons
can be amazing using high-force spirits(say 8): a full-auto burst of 15
bullets just passes thru them harmlessly. This power also extends to
explosives, so it doesn't matter if you're using air-timed attack
grenades, the result will be similar: nothing.
Don't tell me that spirits are rare: if there is magician in the opposition,
there well be spirits as well. And if there isn't a magician in the
opposition, but the party has got some, then they won't stand a chance: this
was explicitly stated in the Grimthingy 2, and I agree with that.
Okay, enough about that. Just a little <grunt>-ing. I love spirits.

Wooden Cross

Ps: not only spirits have Weapon Immunity...
Ps2: that party did NOT have a physad...
Message no. 2
From: Jettero Heller <heller@*****.CBA.CSUOHIO.EDU>
Subject: Re: Usefulness of Physical Adepts
Date: Sat, 8 Apr 1995 23:57:43 -0400
> >Just a gripe of my own, I have to say that phys adds are just about the
> >weakest bang for the buck, so to speak. If I put priority B in tech
> >instead of magic I could make a Sammie who could easily out perform an adept
> >any day of the week. How often do you really run across spirits who have


weakest bang for the buck? huh? wait a sec? your kidding? First of all
healing a street sam with that kind of essense magically is gonna
be really hard. And they don't more essense so you can't really get
more cyberware. but since Phys ads can become Initiates they can
add to their magic and then buy more stuff.

** Heller
Message no. 3
From: Bob Ooton <topcat@**.CENCOM.NET>
Subject: Re: Usefulness of Physical Adepts
Date: Sun, 9 Apr 1995 01:32:49 -0500
> Well two weeks ago the whole party I was GM-ing was struck dead by some
>spirits. They didn't complain about that too much tough: Immunity to Weapons
>can be amazing using high-force spirits(say 8): a full-auto burst of 15
>bullets just passes thru them harmlessly. This power also extends to
>explosives, so it doesn't matter if you're using air-timed attack
>grenades, the result will be similar: nothing.

How many spirits (that a mage can get power over) are there that are...

a) Force 8
b) Possessing Immunity to Normal Weapons

I'm also curious as to what spirit of yours had this power? (doesn't
remember any spirits that had it...)

>Ps2: that party did NOT have a physad...

So? No mages with spells to cast or even a weapon focus? (likes to point
out that mages can use weapon foci too) And one of the things that most
runners who are faced with that situation like to do (or at least should
consider doing) is leaving! Go somewhere where the spirit has no influence.
(i.e. don't play in the swimming pool when the water spirit is angry...)


-- Bob Ooton <topcat@******.net>
Message no. 4
From: Bob Ooton <topcat@**.CENCOM.NET>
Subject: Re: Usefulness of Physical Adepts
Date: Sun, 9 Apr 1995 01:40:22 -0500
>weakest bang for the buck? huh? wait a sec? your kidding? First of all
>healing a street sam with that kind of essense magically is gonna
>be really hard. And they don't more essense so you can't really get
>more cyberware. but since Phys ads can become Initiates they can
>add to their magic and then buy more stuff.

Sure it's harder to heal a samurai, but it REALLY sucks to take a
serious/deadly wound as a phys ad or a mage. Also there's those stim
patches and trauma patches that work wonders for the magically challenged.
Slap a stim patch on the party's mage? Not if you ever want him to back you
up again. And yes, Phys Ads/Mages have that wonderful initiation thing
(it's a good idea, really. I am >NOT< being sarcastic) but samurai can get
alpha/beta/(gamma & delta are out there somewhere...) grade cyberware. And
yes, Phys Ads can use cyberware too (look at Teachdaire in Prime Runners)
but they're probably better off without it. Yes, Phys Ads can add to their
magic through initiation and buy "more stuff" but there's a limit on all
that stuff and karma just doesn't grow on trees.


-- Bob Ooton <topcat@******.net>
Message no. 5
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Usefulness of Physical Adepts
Date: Sun, 9 Apr 1995 12:43:29 +0200
>How many spirits (that a mage can get power over) are there that are...
>
>a) Force 8
>b) Possessing Immunity to Normal Weapons

All manifest spirits have Immunity to Normal Weapons. The Force 8 bit would
be more difficult, though...

>Go somewhere where the spirit has no influence.
>(i.e. don't play in the swimming pool when the water spirit is angry...)

Not very useful if you're facing an elemental. With nature spirits it would
work (unless it's a great form...)


Gurth@******.nl - Gurth@***.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
he's not trying to catch your eye; he's just trying to get a life
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Message no. 6
From: Jettero Heller <heller@*****.CBA.CSUOHIO.EDU>
Subject: Re: Usefulness of Physical Adepts
Date: Sun, 9 Apr 1995 09:12:44 -0400
> Sure it's harder to heal a samurai, but it REALLY sucks to take a
> serious/deadly wound as a phys ad or a mage. Also there's those stim
> patches and trauma patches that work wonders for the magically challenged.
> Slap a stim patch on the party's mage? Not if you ever want him to back you
> up again.

True. . .

> And yes, Phys Ads/Mages have that wonderful initiation thing
> (it's a good idea, really. I am >NOT< being sarcastic) but samurai can get
> alpha/beta/(gamma & delta are out there somewhere...) grade cyberware. And
> yes, Phys Ads can use cyberware too (look at Teachdaire in Prime Runners)
> but they're probably better off without it. Yes, Phys Ads can add to their
> magic through initiation and buy "more stuff" but there's a limit on all
> that stuff and karma just doesn't grow on trees.

Indeed, phys ads can use cyberware, but why? about the only thing they
would want is some kind of radio headware, or a smartlink, everything
else (low light eyes, high freq ears, etc. . .) they can get.
As for a limit, not if your a good enough roleplayer to get enough
karma. and have a campaign that's long enough.

** Heller
Message no. 7
From: Bob Ooton <topcat@**.CENCOM.NET>
Subject: Re: Usefulness of Physical Adepts
Date: Sun, 9 Apr 1995 15:49:13 -0500
>Indeed, phys ads can use cyberware, but why? about the only thing they
>would want is some kind of radio headware, or a smartlink, everything
>else (low light eyes, high freq ears, etc. . .) they can get.
>As for a limit, not if your a good enough roleplayer to get enough
>karma. and have a campaign that's long enough.

Karma is only a part of the problem. Check out my reply to Damian's post
for the basics on that...

And samurai get karma for good roleplaying too, remember? (I'm sure it's in
the rules somewhere...)


-- Bob Ooton <topcat@******.net>
Message no. 8
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Usefulness of Physical Adepts
Date: Mon, 10 Apr 1995 11:18:45 +0200
>Indeed, phys ads can use cyberware, but why? about the only thing they
>would want is some kind of radio headware, or a smartlink, everything
>else (low light eyes, high freq ears, etc. . .) they can get.
>As for a limit, not if your a good enough roleplayer to get enough
>karma. and have a campaign that's long enough.

Well, to get reflex boosts it would be more Magic-effective to get wired
refs instead of the power that duplicates it. Think about it: Wired
Reflexes-1 gies +2+1D6 Initiative and costs 2 Magic points. For the same
bonus, the physical adept pays 3 Magic Points (I'm assuming he's a human
with a Reaction of 3 here).
Wired-2 gives +4+2D6, which would cost the adept 9 Magic Points (4 for the
+2D6, 5 for the +4), while the cyberware would only cost him 3 Magic, plus
maybe another one because of the surgery...


Gurth@******.nl - Gurth@***.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Ever get the feeling you've been cheated?
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B? e+ u+@ h! f--(?) !r(--)(*) n---->!n y? Unofficial Shadowrun Guru :)
Message no. 9
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Usefulness of Physical Adepts
Date: Mon, 10 Apr 1995 10:50:50 -0400
>>>>> "Gurth" == Gurth <gurth@******.NL> writes:

Gurth> Well, to get reflex boosts it would be more Magic-effective to get
Gurth> wired refs instead of the power that duplicates it. Think about it:
Gurth> Wired Reflexes-1 gies +2+1D6 Initiative and costs 2 Magic points.
Gurth> For the same bonus, the physical adept pays 3 Magic Points (I'm
Gurth> assuming he's a human with a Reaction of 3 here).

From the perspective of raw game mechanics, yes, cyber is almost always
better than a Physical Adept's ``natural'' abilities. But... (and this is
very important), a Physical Adept's abilities can't be forcibly turned off
or deactivated, they don't break, there's no market for PhysAd limbs in the
local cyber chop-shop, and they don't trigger the MAD detectors in
airports.

--
Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> | Do not taunt Happy Fun Ball.
http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox |
PGP Public Key: Ask for one today! |
Message no. 10
From: Jani Fikouras <feanor@**********.UNI-BREMEN.DE>
Subject: Re: Usefulness of Physical Adepts
Date: Mon, 10 Apr 1995 18:03:35 +0200
> Well two weeks ago the whole party I was GM-ing was struck dead by some
> spirits. They didn't complain about that too much tough: Immunity to Weapons
> can be amazing using high-force spirits(say 8): a full-auto burst of 15
> bullets just passes thru them harmlessly. This power also extends to
> explosives, so it doesn't matter if you're using air-timed attack
> grenades, the result will be similar: nothing.

I agree, why didnt your players attack them with weapons or bare hands ?
You dont have to be a PA to use your willpower you know. And seriously
what were the mages doing ? The best way to defeat a spirit is either to
outright bust its ass with conjuring(banishing) or keep it ocupied with
a banishing atempt while the other take turns beating the *hit out of it.

> Don't tell me that spirits are rare: if there is magician in the opposition,
> there well be spirits as well. And if there isn't a magician in the
> opposition, but the party has got some, then they won't stand a chance: this
> was explicitly stated in the Grimthingy 2, and I agree with that.
> Okay, enough about that. Just a little <grunt>-ing. I love spirits.
>
> Ps: not only spirits have Weapon Immunity...
> Ps2: that party did NOT have a physad...

Did the party have a mage?

--
"Believe in Angels." -- The Crow

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Message no. 11
From: Jani Fikouras <feanor@**********.UNI-BREMEN.DE>
Subject: Re: Usefulness of Physical Adepts
Date: Mon, 10 Apr 1995 18:11:36 +0200
> How many spirits (that a mage can get power over) are there that are...
>
> a) Force 8

There is no force limit, a mage can summon a number of elementals equal to
his charisma.

> b) Possessing Immunity to Normal Weapons

All of them do (*I think*) well sortof, its not outright immunity, but
rather a prety high resistance - sort of a misnomer there.

> So? No mages with spells to cast or even a weapon focus? (likes to point
> out that mages can use weapon foci too) And one of the things that most
> runners who are faced with that situation like to do (or at least should
> consider doing) is leaving! Go somewhere where the spirit has no influence.
> (i.e. don't play in the swimming pool when the water spirit is angry...)

Well weapon foci are kindof a karma scam :) (unless you are playing a prety
combat oriented mage - something I tend to avoid). The best way to deal with
this would keep it busy while the sammies hack at it with everything they got.

--
"Believe in Angels." -- The Crow

GCS d H s+: !g p1 !au a- w+ v-(?) C++++ UA++S++L+>++++ L+>+++ E--- N++ W(+)(---)
M-- !V(--) -po+(---) Y+ t++ 5++ R+++ tv b++ e+ u++(-) h*(+) f+ r- n!(-) y?
Message no. 12
From: Jani Fikouras <feanor@**********.UNI-BREMEN.DE>
Subject: Re: Usefulness of Physical Adepts
Date: Mon, 10 Apr 1995 18:32:42 +0200
> >weakest bang for the buck? huh? wait a sec? your kidding? First of all
> >healing a street sam with that kind of essense magically is gonna
> >be really hard. And they don't more essense so you can't really get
> >more cyberware. but since Phys ads can become Initiates they can
> >add to their magic and then buy more stuff.
>
> Sure it's harder to heal a samurai, but it REALLY sucks to take a
> serious/deadly wound as a phys ad or a mage.

Not only that, but its considerably less probable that a sammie will get
that wound in the first place. A sammie will almost invariably have a higher
initiative than a PA and that means that he'll probably get a shot at that
bad guy before the bad guy has a chance to shoot at him.

> Also there's those stim
> patches and trauma patches that work wonders for the magically challenged.
> Slap a stim patch on the party's mage? Not if you ever want him to back you
> up again.

So whats that supposed to mean ? I fail to see your point here.

> And yes, Phys Ads/Mages have that wonderful initiation thing
> (it's a good idea, really. I am >NOT< being sarcastic) but samurai can get
> alpha/beta/(gamma & delta are out there somewhere...) grade cyberware.

Well initiation is considerably more effective than betaware :) and actually
the only major edge PAs have over sammies. But even with initiation
PAs are still lamer than samies (in a toe to toe fight). I mean they have
to cough up all their magic to get equall dice with a sammie with wired 3
and the sammie still gets a +6 in reaction. Whereas an initiatiated PA must
pay 2 magic points per extra reaction point (that is over the racial maximum,
but that is anyway always the case) if he still wishes to pursue the
path of inhuman speed :)
I think that we all agree that in direct combat speed is everything
and that is exactly were PAs tend to get their asses handed back to them
by sammies.

> And
> yes, Phys Ads can use cyberware too (look at Teachdaire in Prime Runners)
> but they're probably better off without it. Yes, Phys Ads can add to their
> magic through initiation and buy "more stuff" but there's a limit on all
> that stuff and karma just doesn't grow on trees.

Even though its probably not such a bad idea to sacrifice one magic point
for some cool stuff no combat oriented runner should leave home without :)
And mana is definitely hard to come by...

--
"Believe in Angels." -- The Crow

GCS d H s+: !g p1 !au a- w+ v-(?) C++++ UA++S++L+>++++ L+>+++ E--- N++ W(+)(---)
M-- !V(--) -po+(---) Y+ t++ 5++ R+++ tv b++ e+ u++(-) h*(+) f+ r- n!(-) y?
Message no. 13
From: Eve Forward <lutra@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Usefulness of Physical Adepts
Date: Mon, 10 Apr 1995 14:06:02 -0700
Something I've noticed is that magical types have a lot more potential
for advancement in some games. Because you can spend Karma to buy new
abilities and stuff; whereas if you're a cyber-type, what you really
need to buy new abilities is cash.
You can usually go out and get Karma doing just about any run;
but stuff that pays in nice nuyen is not so easy to find. If you're
a mage, and you're low on cash, you're probably OK; you've got
spells, and fetishes aren't too expensive. If you're a rigger with your
modded Westwind in the shop, facing a buttload of expensive repairs
because of that last nasty battle, or, even worse, if the Westwind got
totalled, you're almost SOL.
Once you get Karma, the options for a mundane are pretty simple;
buy stats, or buy skills. This gets expensive and kinda silly, as you
save up Karma so you can buy Motorcycle at 10. If you're a mage, though,
wow! Do you buy spells? Do you increase stats? Skills? Do you initiate?
Get an ally? Make some new spells? Bond a focus? Go on an astral quest?
Get a quickening or a spell lock? Something else?
I've played in games where there was a lot of cash and little
karma, and games with a lot of karma and little cash. Mages don't have
near as much use for money, it seems, as people with tech stuff that
needs upkeep.
I can't think of any real solution to this... just my thoughts
on the matter.

-E
Message no. 14
From: Damion Milliken <adm82@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Usefulness of Physical Adepts
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 11:07:42 +1000
Jani Fikouras writes:

> > Also there's those stim patches and trauma patches that work wonders for
> > the magically challenged. Slap a stim patch on the party's mage? Not if
> > you ever want him to back you up again.
>
> So whats that supposed to mean ? I fail to see your point here.

He means that if your teams magician passes out, and you slap a stim patch on
him to revive him, and cause him to lose Magic points, then don't ever
expect him to back you up in the future.

--
Damion Milliken Unofficial Shadowrun Guru E-mail: adm82@***.edu.au

(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+@ H s++:-- !g p0 !au a19 w+ v(?) C++ US++>+++ P+ L !3
E? N K- W M@ !V po@ Y+ t+ 5 !j R+(++) G(+)('''') !tv(--@)
b++ D B? e+$ u@ h* f+ !r n----(--)@ !y+
Message no. 15
From: GR DIRK KENNETH W <DIRKKENN@***.ISU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Usefulness of Physical Adepts
Date: Mon, 10 Apr 1995 21:07:53 MST
Jettero Heller writes:
> Indeed, phys ads can use cyberware, but why? about the only thing
> they would want is some kind of radio headware, or a smartlink,
> everything else (low light eyes, high frequency ears, etc. . .)
> they can get.

How about giving phys ads cyberware to add flavor rather than
power to the character? My favorite character is a phys ad modeled
after the Japanese ninja. She has used 2 magic points for things
such as a toxin exhaler, skillwires plus, culture pheramones (sp?),
and even a fingertip compartment. "Now come and give me a big kiss"
(activates toxin exhaler). *grin*
Message no. 16
From: Bob Ooton <topcat@**.CENCOM.NET>
Subject: Re: Usefulness of Physical Adepts
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 00:03:30 -0500
> How about giving phys ads cyberware to add flavor rather than
>power to the character? My favorite character is a phys ad modeled
>after the Japanese ninja. She has used 2 magic points for things
>such as a toxin exhaler, skillwires plus, culture pheramones (sp?),
>and even a fingertip compartment. "Now come and give me a big kiss"
>(activates toxin exhaler). *grin*

(see above for a character with conception... she knew that the cyber would
give her an edge so she got it. damn the essence and go for results...BRAVO!)

-- Bob Ooton <topcat@******.net>
Message no. 17
From: Jani Fikouras <feanor@**********.UNI-BREMEN.DE>
Subject: Re: Usefulness of Physical Adepts
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 14:06:07 +0200
> Gurth> Well, to get reflex boosts it would be more Magic-effective to get
> Gurth> wired refs instead of the power that duplicates it. Think about it:
> Gurth> Wired Reflexes-1 gies +2+1D6 Initiative and costs 2 Magic points.
> Gurth> For the same bonus, the physical adept pays 3 Magic Points (I'm
> Gurth> assuming he's a human with a Reaction of 3 here).
>
> From the perspective of raw game mechanics, yes, cyber is almost always
> better than a Physical Adept's ``natural'' abilities. But... (and this is
> very important), a Physical Adept's abilities can't be forcibly turned off
> or deactivated, they don't break, there's no market for PhysAd limbs in the
> local cyber chop-shop, and they don't trigger the MAD detectors in
> airports.

This is very true, but in all fairness when did that stop the groups
cybermonster from geting anywhere. I was reading through Divided
Assets the other day (that paragraph about how to smuggle the
runners into Denver) when it hit me - Face it no matter what kind of cyber
the runners have, they'll always manage to smuggle it in because they are
the runners and if they dont make it there'll be no run.

--
"Believe in Angels." -- The Crow

GCS d H s+: !g p1 !au a- w+ v-(?) C++++ UA++S++L+>++++ L+>+++ E--- N++ W(+)(---)
M-- !V(--) -po+(---) Y+ t++ 5++ R+++ tv b++ e+ u++(-) h*(+) f+ r- n!(-) y?
Message no. 18
From: Damion Milliken <adm82@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Usefulness of Physical Adepts
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 22:28:40 +1000
Jani Fikouras writes:

> This is very true, but in all fairness when did that stop the groups
> cybermonster from geting anywhere. I was reading through Divided
> Assets the other day (that paragraph about how to smuggle the
> runners into Denver) when it hit me - Face it no matter what kind of cyber
> the runners have, they'll always manage to smuggle it in because they are
> the runners and if they dont make it there'll be no run.

This is the same as the SIN(less) thing. Sure, being SINless has many pros
and cons, and so does being SINful. But in the end, if the runner has a SIN
(for example) and is going to get busted for some crime, then usually the GM
will provide some method for him to escape/evade capture. Same reasoning as
above. Actually, this also applies to many of the disadvanatges proclaimed
to many of the things in SR (broad I know, but I think you get the idea).
They all end up not being half as much of a problem as is pointed out,
simply because if the GM didn't work some way around it, then the runners
would never go on a run (for any number of reasons, not just
transportation). But that's life. And anyway, it is always possible to be a
hard-ass and enforce all such things (but it'll probably make your players
grumpy, which is not good in my view - one, you might lose them, and two the
idea is to have fun. It's no fun if the team of phys adpets with the one
sammy go on a run in another location, and the GM says to the sammy's player
"sorry chummer, but you've got buckly's of getting all that chrome past
airport security. You'll have to figure out some other way to get it by, or
just make up a new character".) All a matter of gaming style I suppose...

--
Damion Milliken Unofficial Shadowrun Guru E-mail: adm82@***.edu.au

(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+@ H s++:-- !g p0 !au a19 w+ v(?) C++ US++>+++ P+ L !3
E? N K- W M@ !V po@ Y+ t+ 5 !j R+(++) G(+)('''') !tv(--@)
b++ D B? e+$ u@ h* f+ !r n----(--)@ !y+
Message no. 19
From: Jani Fikouras <feanor@**********.UNI-BREMEN.DE>
Subject: Re: Usefulness of Physical Adepts
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 14:57:53 +0200
> a mage, and you're low on cash, you're probably OK; you've got
> spells, and fetishes aren't too expensive. If you're a rigger with your
> modded Westwind in the shop, facing a buttload of expensive repairs
> because of that last nasty battle, or, even worse, if the Westwind got
> totalled, you're almost SOL.

Our mage/shaman always played the loan-shark. The others owed him
gross amounts of money all the time :)

--
"Believe in Angels." -- The Crow

GCS d H s+: !g p1 !au a- w+ v-(?) C++++ UA++S++L+>++++ L+>+++ E--- N++ W(+)(---)
M-- !V(--) -po+(---) Y+ t++ 5++ R+++ tv b++ e+ u++(-) h*(+) f+ r- n!(-) y?
Message no. 20
From: Jani Fikouras <feanor@**********.UNI-BREMEN.DE>
Subject: Re: Usefulness of Physical Adepts
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 15:21:58 +0200
> > > Also there's those stim patches and trauma patches that work wonders for
> > > the magically challenged. Slap a stim patch on the party's mage? Not if
> > > you ever want him to back you up again.
> >
> > So whats that supposed to mean ? I fail to see your point here.
>
> He means that if your teams magician passes out, and you slap a stim patch on
> him to revive him, and cause him to lose Magic points, then don't ever
> expect him to back you up in the future.

Is that supposed to be something new or funny ? I mean what sort of an
a***ole would do a think like that ? And what mage would let it slide after
geting up ?

--
"Believe in Angels." -- The Crow

GCS d H s+: !g p1 !au a- w+ v-(?) C++++ UA++S++L+>++++ L+>+++ E--- N++ W(+)(---)
M-- !V(--) -po+(---) Y+ t++ 5++ R+++ tv b++ e+ u++(-) h*(+) f+ r- n!(-) y?
Message no. 21
From: Bob Ooton <topcat@**.CENCOM.NET>
Subject: Re: Usefulness of Physical Adepts
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 1995 12:01:59 -0500
> Is that supposed to be something new or funny ? I mean what sort of an
>a***ole would do a think like that ? And what mage would let it slide after
>geting up ?

That was my point... you just can't get qiuck fixes like stim patches for
mages without maiming them. And I don't know too many mages who would (at
least in a game very few players would... check out Streets of Blood for an
example of a mage getting stimmed)


-- Bob Ooton <topcat@******.net>
Message no. 22
From: Robert Watkins <bob@**.NTU.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Usefulness of Physical Adepts
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 03:18:40 +0930
Jani Fikouras wrote:
> > He means that if your teams magician passes out, and you slap a stim patch on
> > him to revive him, and cause him to lose Magic points, then don't ever
> > expect him to back you up in the future.
>
> Is that supposed to be something new or funny ? I mean what sort of an
> a***ole would do a think like that ? And what mage would let it slide after
> geting up ?

I've had these situations come up in tournament-style games... lots of
newbies, typically, with a couple of experienced players only (who
typically get the mages and deckers). Usual thing I do is check to see if
the poor sammy might have known something about the effects, by rolling,
and then sit back and look at the sparks fly.

--
Robert Watkins bob@**.ntu.edu.au
Real Programmers never work 9 to 5. If any real programmers
are around at 9 am, it's because they were up all night.
Finger me for my geek code
Message no. 23
From: Paul Jonathan Adam <Paul@********.DEMON.CO.UK>
Subject: Re: Usefulness of Physical Adepts
Date: Wed, 12 Apr 1995 01:48:36 GMT
In message <4F770D53E13@***.ISU.EDU> SHADOWRN@*****.nic.surfnet.nl writes:
> Jettero Heller writes:
> > Indeed, phys ads can use cyberware, but why? about the only thing
> > they would want is some kind of radio headware, or a smartlink,
> > everything else (low light eyes, high frequency ears, etc. . .)
> > they can get.
>
> How about giving phys ads cyberware to add flavor rather than
> power to the character? My favorite character is a phys ad modeled
> after the Japanese ninja. She has used 2 magic points for things
> such as a toxin exhaler, skillwires plus, culture pheramones (sp?),
> and even a fingertip compartment. "Now come and give me a big kiss"
> (activates toxin exhaler). *grin*

Now *THAT* is roleplaying! I personally liked Lynch's approach to being sniped
at: he took the monofilament whip out of his thumb compartment (I hated the
thing and always used spurs anyway) and replaced it with a camera. So instead
of putting his head above the parapet/round the corner, he just pokes the
last joint of his thumb. Really helps for shooting, too, although we ruled
a +2 for disorientation using the ThumbCam for targeting: but it beats +8
for blind fire.

There is a lot you can do with cyberware and magic if you use your brain
rather than just leap for a combat spell/big gun. We threw around the idea of
the "Emergency Skillchip" one time: it needed a biomonitor facility. If your
life signs went critical (i.e. you were dead) the chip took over and made your
"dead" body use best available transport to the nearest medical facility.
So a mangled body lurches in, shouting "I have suffered severe trauma and need
urgent medical assistance!"

None of the others pushed it to development. But in one run (set in New Orleans)
they were convinced the chief bad guy was a zombie, because he almost had to
be dismembered before he stopped getting back up, and back up, and back up...
nobody thought to check his datajack :-) I thought it was fun for an NPC,
anyway...

Or a voice mask: we allow voice masks to "imitate" sampled voices, but the
unaided ear has a chance to spot it and it won't ever fool an analyser. But over
a part-jammed radio link, close is good enough...so you can feed disinformation
into the corp nets :-)

Corp Cops 1 - "We're on our way to medical now. Keep them pinned down."
Us - "They're heading for the genetics bay!"
Corp Cops 2 - "I don't see them, where are they?"
CC1 - "I see something ahead..."
Us - "It's them! Fire! Fire!"
CC2 - "We're being fired on!"
Us - "Return fire! We've got them in a crossfire!"...

Creating a blue-on-blue engagement is the funniest way to exterminate an
opponent going for a mercenary.

But then we modified the toxin exhaler to a snake-style venom gland to be
implanted on a tooth or nail, or spur or razor. One of my major NPCs bought
five, for the drugs she used most as a trauma surgeon... so all she has to
do is prod her patient with a razor to give him a dose of antibiotic, No-Shok
and suchlike. Novel? And of course with hand razors, you always have a
scalpel handy, and total sterility is pointless for trauma work anyway.

I do like it when people buy stuff because it's in character - Lynch trading
off muscle augmentation for enhanced volume lungs and synthacardium, for
instance. Why? He's an infantryman, and stamina is the be-all and end-all:
strength is useful but stamina is God.

The real test of a new item isn't so much "Can I kill more people with this
gimmick?" but "Does this add to my character?" Lynch had been using a lot
of the new gear from Fields of Fire since he was created - climbing gear,
tactical datalinks, mortars, the lot. That's five years before FASA. I'm
quite smug about that.

I'm still feeling smug. Leave me alone to enjoy it :-)

--
When you have shot and killed a man, you have defined your attitude towards
him. You have offered a definite answer to a definite problem. For better or
for worse, you have acted decisively.
In fact, the next move is up to him.

Paul J. Adam paul@********.demon.co.uk

Further Reading

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