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Mailing List Logs for ShadowRN

Message no. 1
From: "Ojaste,James [NCR]" <James.Ojaste@**.GC.CA>
Subject: Re: was Re: Rigger 2
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 1997 10:06:15 -0400
David Mezerette[SMTP:mezeretted@*****.U-NANCY.FR] wrote:
> >I agree here a full simsense signal DIR-X has an flow rate of3mp/sec
> >thats 9mp/turn.
>
> I'm sure this point has already been discussed on this list, but -hey!- i'm
> on it for a week, so there are many things i've missed
> so, my question is: does anyone know what a Mp is? Most of the time i feel
> it too 'abstract', a bit like those old CFs, and i have problems to estimate
> how many Mps would half an hour convo or 5 mins filming take.
> Can someone help me?

Yes, a Mp is a silly little measurement that means absolutely
nothing in particular. It can mean anything from 1k to about
100M, as far as I can tell.

It's not abstract - it's not even a measurement!

As for filming requirements etc, I believe that either SRII or
SSC mentions it...

James Ojaste
Message no. 2
From: "Paul J. Adam" <shadowrn@********.DEMON.CO.UK>
Subject: Re: was Re: Rigger 2
Date: Fri, 17 Oct 1997 19:56:49 +0100
In article <cÊ%a=GOVMT.CANADA%p=GC+EC%lìNCR_EXCH2-971017140615Z-
27905@*****_exch1.SID.NCR.DOE.CA>, "Ojaste,James [NCR]"
<James.Ojaste@**.GC.CA> writes
>Yes, a Mp is a silly little measurement that means absolutely
>nothing in particular. It can mean anything from 1k to about
>100M, as far as I can tell.

It's abstract for a reason: it avoids the sort of silliness that beset
the very original Traveller, which gave the most powerful computer
available to a high-tech starfaring civilisation a whopping 16K of
memory...

A megapulse hovers somewhere around a megabyte, but very unreliably.


--
There are four kinds of homicide: felonious, excusable, justifiable and
praiseworthy...

Paul J. Adam paul@********.demon.co.uk
Message no. 3
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: was Re: Rigger 2
Date: Sat, 18 Oct 1997 13:48:47 +0100
Ojaste,James [NCR] said on 10:06/17 Oct 97...

> Yes, a Mp is a silly little measurement that means absolutely
> nothing in particular. It can mean anything from 1k to about
> 100M, as far as I can tell.
>
> It's not abstract - it's not even a measurement!

And as has been said lts of times before, this was intentional -- think
about it: back when SR came out in 1989, a pretty good computer was a 286
or 386 with 1 or 2 megs RAM and a 60 MB hard drive. Nowadays, if you have
a P133 with 32 MB RAM and 2 GB hard drive, it's starting to get obsolete.

*Gurth thinks about his 486/100 that still does everything he wants it to*

Had FASA used real-world measurements, I have a feeling that their 2050
computers would have been years behind today's SOTA. However, it is
possible to work out how much a megapulse is in terms of bytes. However,
you end up with widely different values from the various sources --
comparing the values from Shadowbeat with real-world equivalents gives
different ratios than using the ones mentioned in SRII, for example.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Turn into nothing less than nothing new.
-> NERPS Project Leader & Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version 3.1:
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE
Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
Message no. 4
From: James Lindsay <jlindsay@******.CA>
Subject: Re: was Re: Rigger 2
Date: Sat, 18 Oct 1997 23:17:30 GMT
On Sat, 18 Oct 1997 13:48:47 +0100, Gurth wrote:

> Had FASA used real-world measurements, I have a feeling that their 2050
> computers would have been years behind today's SOTA. However, it is
> possible to work out how much a megapulse is in terms of bytes. However,
> you end up with widely different values from the various sources --
> comparing the values from Shadowbeat with real-world equivalents gives
> different ratios than using the ones mentioned in SRII, for example.

What's worse-- FASA would have to rerelease every product about once a year
to keep up with Real Life(tm) technology. I, too, have played Traveller
since its inception and some of the original "canon" is laughably
inadequate by today's standards, considering the current *realism* of its
last two incarnations.



James W. Lindsay Vancouver, British Columbia
"http://www.prosperoimaging.com/ground_zero";

Money talks... it usually says "bend over"...
Message no. 5
From: "Ojaste,James [NCR]" <James.Ojaste@**.GC.CA>
Subject: Re: was Re: Rigger 2
Date: Mon, 20 Oct 1997 09:06:35 -0400
Gurth[SMTP:gurth@******.NL] wrote:
> Ojaste,James [NCR] said on 10:06/17 Oct 97...
>
> > Yes, a Mp is a silly little measurement that means absolutely
> > nothing in particular. It can mean anything from 1k to about
> > 100M, as far as I can tell.
> >
> > It's not abstract - it's not even a measurement!
>
> And as has been said lts of times before, this was intentional -- think
> about it: back when SR came out in 1989, a pretty good computer was a 286
> or 386 with 1 or 2 megs RAM and a 60 MB hard drive. Nowadays, if you have
> a P133 with 32 MB RAM and 2 GB hard drive, it's starting to get obsolete.
>
> Had FASA used real-world measurements, I have a feeling that their 2050
> computers would have been years behind today's SOTA. However, it is

Oh, I'm not complaining about them creating a new measurement system
to offset SOTA, but it would be nice if they kept the values
relatively consistent. Little things like text taking up more space
than full motion video bug me.

> possible to work out how much a megapulse is in terms of bytes. However,
> you end up with widely different values from the various sources --
> comparing the values from Shadowbeat with real-world equivalents gives
> different ratios than using the ones mentioned in SRII, for example.

Yeah - I don't mind some fluctuation in the absolute size of one
Mp, but not being able the pin down the order of magnitude just
rubs me the wrong way.

James Ojaste
Message no. 6
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: was Re: Rigger 2
Date: Tue, 21 Oct 1997 12:43:28 +0100
Ojaste,James [NCR] said on 9:06/20 Oct 97...

> Oh, I'm not complaining about them creating a new measurement system
> to offset SOTA, but it would be nice if they kept the values
> relatively consistent. Little things like text taking up more space
> than full motion video bug me.

That's something that's bothered me a little bit as well. You read a book
and see things like "Block delete: 7 Mp by sysop" and hen find out that
with 7 Mp, you can record 7 minutes of high-resolution video, or 7 minutes
of normal-spectrum sound. There's a contradiction even there... No way
does sound take up as much memory as video, because if it did then RL
video cassettes would be the same size as audio cassettes and play at the
same speed.

There is, however, not all that much that can be done about it, apart from
adjusting all the figures yourself and treat them as house rules.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
The truth may be out there, but lies are inside you head.
-> NERPS Project Leader & Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version 3.1:
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE
Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------

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