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Message no. 1
From: Midn Daniel O Fredrikson <m992148@****.NAVY.MIL>
Subject: Weapon questions
Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 12:00:49 -0500
When using APDS against hardened armor (ie miltary grade) does one have
the ballistic before determaining if the bullets penatrate or not.

Where are the rules for flash grenades?

What is the difference between stun and gel rounds?

Thanks
Message no. 2
From: John Pederson <Canthros@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Weapon questions
Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 17:01:47 -0500
In a message dated 96-11-26 11:56:59 EST, you write:

>When using APDS against hardened armor (ie miltary grade) does one have
>the ballistic before determaining if the bullets penatrate or not.

I wouldn't, but I don't know for sure.

>Where are the rules for flash grenades?

Uh...I dunno.

>What is the difference between stun and gel rounds?

Stun rounds are defended by Impact, gel by Ballistic. Since Impact is
(usually) a smaller rating than Ballistic, Stun rounds have an advantage over
gel. However, Stun rounds require a large-bore weapon, ie, larger than an
SMG/heavy pistol (I think). I've always ruled that it would require
something at least as big as an AR, preferably no smaller than a shotgun.

John Pederson "God is dead"
canthros@***.com -Friedrich Nietzsche (1844 to 1900)
lobo1@****.com "Nietzsche is dead"
http://members.gnn.com/lenoj/johns.htm -God (everlasting to everlasting)

"Only dead fish swim with the stream."
Message no. 3
From: DT <david.s.thompson@****.EDU>
Subject: Re: Weapon questions
Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 19:14:46 -0500
On Tue, 26 Nov 1996, John Pederson wrote:

> In a message dated 96-11-26 11:56:59 EST, you write:
>
> >When using APDS against hardened armor (ie miltary grade) does one have
> >the ballistic before determaining if the bullets penatrate or not.
>
> I wouldn't, but I don't know for sure.
>
You would have to halv the armor rating before checking for penetration,
otherwise APDS wouldn't have the awesome effect against armor that it is
supposed to -- it would never penetrate military grade armor unless shot
from a sniping rifle.

--Sanction
Message no. 4
From: Tim Cooper <tpcooper@***.CSUPOMONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: Weapon questions
Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 19:03:58 -0800
On Tue, 26 Nov 1996, John Pederson wrote:

> In a message dated 96-11-26 11:56:59 EST, you write:
> >What is the difference between stun and gel rounds?
>
> Stun rounds are defended by Impact, gel by Ballistic. Since Impact is
> (usually) a smaller rating than Ballistic, Stun rounds have an advantage over
> gel. However, Stun rounds require a large-bore weapon, ie, larger than an
> SMG/heavy pistol (I think). I've always ruled that it would require
> something at least as big as an AR, preferably no smaller than a shotgun.
>
> John Pederson "God is dead"

I wasn't aware that an Assualt Rifle was considered "large-bore", I
thought that the only thing that really fit that classification (in SR)
was a shotgun (or a Panther Cannon, but I don't expect to fire
anti-armor Gel rounds..). Oh well..

~Tim
Message no. 5
From: John Pederson <Canthros@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Weapon questions
Date: Tue, 26 Nov 1996 22:04:35 -0500
In a message dated 96-11-26 19:16:49 EST, you write:

>> In a message dated 96-11-26 11:56:59 EST, you write:
>>
>> >When using APDS against hardened armor (ie miltary grade) does one have
>> >the ballistic before determaining if the bullets penatrate or not.
>>
>> I wouldn't, but I don't know for sure.
>>
>You would have to halv the armor rating before checking for penetration,
>otherwise APDS wouldn't have the awesome effect against armor that it is
>supposed to -- it would never penetrate military grade armor unless shot
>from a sniping rifle.
>
> --Sanction

Okay, you win:) I just checked my hardcopy of the Tarot Firearms file....I
was wrong:( Oh, well.

John Pederson "God is dead"
canthros@***.com -Friedrich Nietzsche (1844 to 1900)
lobo1@****.com "Nietzsche is dead"
http://members.gnn.com/lenoj/johns.htm -God (everlasting to everlasting)

"Only dead fish swim with the stream."
Message no. 6
From: Droopy <droopy@*******.NB.NET>
Subject: Re: Weapon questions
Date: Wed, 27 Nov 1996 02:04:11 +0000
Daniel wrote,

> When using APDS against hardened armor (ie miltary grade) does one have
> the ballistic before determaining if the bullets penatrate or not.

Hardend armor refers to vehicle grade armor not personal body armor.
As for the question itself, I'm not sure what you mean unless APDS
rounds work differently in SRII.

> Where are the rules for flash grenades?

Street Sammi book is one place to find them.

> What is the difference between stun and gel rounds?

Stun rounds are for shotguns only.


--Droopy
droopy@**.net
Message no. 7
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Weapon questions
Date: Wed, 27 Nov 1996 10:28:42 +0000
|
|In a message dated 96-11-26 11:56:59 EST, you write:
|
|>When using APDS against hardened armor (ie miltary grade) does one have
|>the ballistic before determaining if the bullets penatrate or not.
|
|I wouldn't, but I don't know for sure.
|
|>Where are the rules for flash grenades?

In the Street Sam catalog...

--
______________________________________________________________________________
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| |
|Andrew Halliwell | "ARSE! GERLS!! DRINK! DRINK! DRINK!!!" |
|Principal subjects in:- | "THAT WOULD BE AN ECUMENICAL MATTER!...FECK!!!! |
|Comp Sci & Electronics | - Father Jack in "Father Ted"
|
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ 5++ |
|X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! >*SULK*<|
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message no. 8
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Weapon questions
Date: Wed, 27 Nov 1996 12:36:18 +0100
Midn Daniel O Fredrikson said on 12:00/26 Nov 96...

> When using APDS against hardened armor (ie miltary grade) does one have
> the ballistic before determaining if the bullets penatrate or not.

I think so, it's not stated that you don't halve it.

> Where are the rules for flash grenades?

Street Samurai Catalog, page 44 -- though I don't know if the second
edition also has it, or if it has the page virtually blacked out. If they
are, I'm sure somebody on the list will be able to post them.

> What is the difference between stun and gel rounds?

Gel rounds get a -2 Power Level modifier, Stun rounds don't. Also, Stun
rounds are only available for shotguns, Gel rounds only for all other
weapons.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
Attach it to the leg of the long-distance duck.
-> NERPS Project Leader & Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version 3.1:
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE
Y PGP- t(+) 5+ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
Message no. 9
From: The Digital Mage <mn3rge@****.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Weapon questions
Date: Wed, 27 Nov 1996 12:27:52 +0000
On Tue, 26 Nov 1996, Midn Daniel O Fredrikson wrote:

> When using APDS against hardened armor (ie miltary grade) does one have
> the ballistic before determaining if the bullets penatrate or not.
Yes. One house rule I use is that on vehicles, if APDS has to penetrate
Hardened armour then that rating is halved, but teh barrier rating of teh
Body of the car is not. If there is no armour teh barrier rating of teh
car's Body is halved per normal.

e.g.
Ford AMericar with Body 2. Reduces power by half Body (-1) and roll body
to resist.

Ford Americar with 3 points armour as well. Reduce Power by one half
Armour (-1.5 rd to -1) and by teh full Body (-2) Total -3 Power. Roll Body
plus half armour(rd) to resist ie 3 dice.

> Where are the rules for flash grenades?
SSC

> What is the difference between stun and gel rounds?
Stun rounds are for Shotguns only and only impact armour is effective. Gel
rounds can be used in any weapon but use either ballistic or double impact
armour. Both suffer a -2 Power, but knockback is at that power rather than
half power per normal rounds.

The Digital Mage : mn3rge@****.ac.uk
"So that which I imagine, is that which I believe" -Rush
Shadowrun Web Site http://www.bath.ac.uk/~mn3rge/Shadowrun.html
Message no. 10
From: Mark McLaughlin <mmclaugh@*******.EENG.DCU.IE>
Subject: Re: Weapon questions
Date: Wed, 27 Nov 1996 13:15:16 -0800
Spike wrote:
>
> |
> |In a message dated 96-11-26 11:56:59 EST, you write:
> |
> |>When using APDS against hardened armor (ie miltary grade) does one have
> |>the ballistic before determaining if the bullets penatrate or not.
> |
> |I wouldn't, but I don't know for sure.
> |
> |>Where are the rules for flash grenades?
>
> In the Street Sam catalog...
>
> --
> ______________________________________________________________________________
> |u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| |
> |Andrew Halliwell | "ARSE! GERLS!! DRINK! DRINK! DRINK!!!"
|
> |Principal subjects in:- | "THAT WOULD BE AN ECUMENICAL MATTER!...FECK!!!! |
> |Comp Sci & Electronics | - Father Jack in "Father Ted"
|
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> |GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ 5++ |
> |X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now!
>*SULK*<|
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------

basicly they are the same as normal grenades except the (candle burn)
damage is (something)L and everyone if +6TG to all actions for 5 rounds
(i think). Only +3TG for flare compensator, also in SSC.
Message no. 11
From: John Pederson <Canthros@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Weapon questions
Date: Wed, 27 Nov 1996 23:51:02 -0500
In a message dated 96-11-26 22:06:58 EST, you write:

>I wasn't aware that an Assualt Rifle was considered "large-bore", I
>thought that the only thing that really fit that classification (in SR)
>was a shotgun (or a Panther Cannon, but I don't expect to fire
>anti-armor Gel rounds..). Oh well..
>
Uh, well, I'm not sure it is...this really hasn't come up yet, since we don't
play very often:( and since the players aren't (yet) worried about non-lethal
forms of threat reduction. Firearms aren't my forte (not even close), so if
ARs aren't large-bore, don't allow them to use stun rounds in them:) From now
on, I won't, either:)

John Pederson "God is dead"
canthros@***.com -Friedrich Nietzsche (1844 to 1900)
lobo1@****.com "Nietzsche is dead"
http://members.gnn.com/lenoj/johns.htm -God (everlasting to everlasting)

"Only dead fish swim with the stream."

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