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Message no. 1
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Graht)
Subject: Willpower, Initiative, and the Military was Re:
Date: Fri May 18 10:55:02 2001
At 04:08 PM 5/17/2001 -0700, caelric@****.com wrote:

>Orders nowadays, at least in the USMC are given as 'Commander's Intent'
>This is a general set of guidelines as to the final wished for result. How
>one arrives at that final result is left up to subordinate commanders, all
>the way down to the team level, and the individual level. Initiative is
>encouraged, highly encouraged.
>
>In fact, there are fourteen listed qualites of leadership in USMC doctrine.
> Initiative is one of those qualities, and is rated very highly in reviews
>and gradings. When someone screws up and makes an error in solving a
>problem (or percieved problem), we have a saying that goes like this "Good
>initiative, poor judgement' with the emphasis on the good initiative part
>to enourage it in the future.

Caelric,

Do you mind if I quote that on the message board of a gaming group I'm a
member of? The leadership of the gaming group is having trouble coming to
grips with the fact that they need to take initiative and make decisive
decisions quickly.

To Life,
-Graht
ShadowRN Gridsec, Nice Guy Division
--
Message no. 2
From: shadowrn@*********.com (shadowrn@*********.com)
Subject: Willpower, Initiative, and the Military was Re:
Date: Fri May 18 12:40:01 2001
At 08:59 AM 5/18/2001 -0600, Graht wrote:
>At 04:08 PM 5/17/2001 -0700, caelric@****.com wrote:
>
>>Orders nowadays, at least in the USMC are given as 'Commander's Intent'
>>This is a general set of guidelines as to the final wished for result. How
>>one arrives at that final result is left up to subordinate commanders, all
>>the way down to the team level, and the individual level. Initiative is
>>encouraged, highly encouraged.
>>
>>In fact, there are fourteen listed qualites of leadership in USMC doctrine.
>> Initiative is one of those qualities, and is rated very highly in reviews
>>and gradings. When someone screws up and makes an error in solving a
>>problem (or percieved problem), we have a saying that goes like this "Good
>>initiative, poor judgement' with the emphasis on the good initiative part
>>to enourage it in the future.
>
>Caelric,
>
>Do you mind if I quote that on the message board of a gaming group I'm a
>member of? The leadership of the gaming group is having trouble coming to
>grips with the fact that they need to take initiative and make decisive
>decisions quickly.
>

No problem. I could quote the 14 leadership traits for a leader, USMC style

Justice
Judgement
Decisiveness
Integrity
Dependability
Tact
Initiative
Enthusiasm
Bearing
Unselfishness
Courage
Knowledge
Loyalty
Endurance

Decisiveness and Initiative both occur in there, that should be a hint.

Anyways, despite sounding like a Boy Scout motto, it is not a bad list to
go by.

Dave
Message no. 3
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Graht)
Subject: Willpower, Initiative, and the Military was Re:
Date: Fri May 18 12:55:01 2001
At 09:39 AM 5/18/2001 -0700, caelric@****.com wrote:
>At 08:59 AM 5/18/2001 -0600, Graht wrote:
> >At 04:08 PM 5/17/2001 -0700, caelric@****.com wrote:
> >
> >>Orders nowadays, at least in the USMC are given as 'Commander's Intent'
> >>This is a general set of guidelines as to the final wished for result. How
> >>one arrives at that final result is left up to subordinate commanders, all
> >>the way down to the team level, and the individual level. Initiative is
> >>encouraged, highly encouraged.
> >>
> >>In fact, there are fourteen listed qualites of leadership in USMC doctrine.
> >> Initiative is one of those qualities, and is rated very highly in reviews
> >>and gradings. When someone screws up and makes an error in solving a
> >>problem (or percieved problem), we have a saying that goes like this
"Good
> >>initiative, poor judgement' with the emphasis on the good initiative part
> >>to enourage it in the future.
> >
> >Caelric,
> >
> >Do you mind if I quote that on the message board of a gaming group I'm a
> >member of? The leadership of the gaming group is having trouble coming to
> >grips with the fact that they need to take initiative and make decisive
> >decisions quickly.
> >
>
>No problem. I could quote the 14 leadership traits for a leader, USMC style
>
>Justice
>Judgement
>Decisiveness
>Integrity
>Dependability
>Tact
>Initiative
>Enthusiasm
>Bearing
>Unselfishness
>Courage
>Knowledge
>Loyalty
>Endurance
>
>Decisiveness and Initiative both occur in there, that should be a hint.
>
>Anyways, despite sounding like a Boy Scout motto, it is not a bad list to
>go by.

Thank you :)


To Life,
-Graht
ShadowRN Gridsec, Nice Guy Division
--
Message no. 4
From: shadowrn@*********.com (Bob Ooton)
Subject: Willpower, Initiative, and the Military was Re:
Date: Fri May 18 21:05:01 2001
At 06:08 PM 05/17/2001 , you wrote:
>Orders nowadays, at least in the USMC are given as 'Commander's Intent'
>This is a general set of guidelines as to the final wished for result. How
>one arrives at that final result is left up to subordinate commanders, all
>the way down to the team level, and the individual level. Initiative is
>encouraged, highly encouraged.

>In fact, there are fourteen listed qualites of leadership in USMC doctrine.
> Initiative is one of those qualities, and is rated very highly in reviews
>and gradings. When someone screws up and makes an error in solving a
>problem (or percieved problem), we have a saying that goes like this "Good
>initiative, poor judgement' with the emphasis on the good initiative part
>to enourage it in the future.

Initiative isn't bad for leadership roles, and I've not contested that in
my past posts. What I have contested is how initiative is received when it
comes from the bottom tier and conflicts with what has come from above.
When the good little worker starts questioning the status quo, only
problems will result for him.

>I guess I'm gullible and bought the lie, also. I suppose that means I have
>low willpower. I doubt you would be able to see the effects of this low
>willpower in my daily life, but you seem to know me and Paul here better
>than we know ourselves.

The methods used to produce employees and soldiers at the lowest levels run
toward creating and maintaining cattle who will do their jobs quietly and
not disobey their superiors or go outside the bounds of necessity in their
jobs. Thinking of and developing new ideas and processes is for those who
are paid to do it, not the underlings. The workplace is established as
mind-numbing so that only the task required can be concentrated on.
Personal space is to be denied as much as possible to concentrate efforts
on work to be done. Color schemes are soothing and neutral, clinical and
clean to further dull the senses and maintain complacency. Work is created
and parcelled out to maintain constant effort as much as possible to keep
workers concentrating on their duties and not other concerns. Quotas are
created to keep a steady pace for all workers so that each worker resembles
another in performance over time and no one is made more or less important.
There are a lot of examples of practices that businesses and other groups
adhere to in kind and most will fall into the numbing, conformity-based
approaches listed above.

>You, sir, have a *VERY* distorted view of the military; perhaps you have
>had a poor experience, or unsuccessful career in such. Please don't assume
>the entirety is what you have seen, because it quite truly is different
>than you think.

I know full well I haven't seen all of the military (in truth, who has?).
My experience wasn't bad and was among the easiest things I've ever gone
through, because I knew what to expect and what was expected of me and used
that to keep my time in as simple as possible. Most situations were so
hidebound by procedural guidelines that anyone could do them (or get out of
doing them) as required without need for much thought (which is exactly the
point, isn't it?). There were always those situations that weren't locked
in, but they were few and far between in daily life. I collected my
signing bonus, stayed for a short term (2 years), and then went to college
as I had intended before I joined.

Reading up on the psychological atmosphere of the workplace is fascinating.
I suggest searching through your local library's database for journals in
the field of psychology. It's been nine years since I last did so, but I'd
recommend going with the military, religious, and/or corporate settings as
starting points. If you won't believe me, perhaps scholars can convince
you otherwise.

__________________________________

Bob Ooton rbooton@*****.edu
aka TopCat, the cyberware advocate
__________________________________

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Thwap!