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Message no. 1
From: Wordman <wordman@*******.COM>
Subject: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 00:33:32 -0400
Here comes a plug:

I have updated my character sheets to version 2.3. Here's what's new:

Added signal control monitors to remote control decks (by request)
Gave extra armor space to More Weapons sheet (by request)
Added mode column to weapons list (by request)
Added Natural Reach space to bottom of weapons list (by request)
Added Natural Recoil Mod space to bottom of weapons list (by request)
Corrected spelling of "Initiation" (by request)
Added alternate samurai sheet (by request)
Added vehicle sheet
Added condition monitor sheet
Added weapon sheet
Added NPC sheet
Changed damage monitor of vehicle record on all sheets

You can find the sheets at:

http://pobox.com/~wordman/personal/srunsheets.html

The sheets are free. If you like them, I would really appriciate it if you
would vote for them in the Shadowrun Archive Survey if you have not already
done so. You can cast your vote by clicking on the "Vote for this article
graphic" on the download page. Thanks.

Enjoy,

Wordman
Message no. 2
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 13:14:51 +0100
Wordman said on 0:33/15 Jun 98,...

> I have updated my character sheets to version 2.3. Here's what's new:

Since we're plugging character sheets, I feell the need to add
that not too long ago, I put up my own home-brew sheets on my
page, in Word 97 format (they use some stuff that won't translate
to Word 6.0/95 or RTF). They're available from
http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/pw/shadowrun.html

There are 11 sheets:

Main sheet, front (for all characters -- attributes, skills, condition
monitor, cyberware, bioware, vehicle, body armor)
Main sheet, back (for all characters -- contacts, equipment, notes,
edges & flaws)
Magician sheet (spells, physad powers, libaries, foci, etc.)
Decker sheet for SRII/VR 1.0
Decker sheet for VR 2.0
Rigger sheet for SRII/RBB
Rigger sheet for Rigger 2
Vehicle sheet for Rigger 2
Firearms sheet
Melee weapons & thrown weapons sheet
Other equipment sheet

Suggestions for improvements are always welcome :)

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
An intelligent computer would be one that doesn't work most of the time.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 3
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 17:43:34 -0400
At 01:14 PM 6/15/98 +0100, you wrote:

>Since we're plugging character sheets, I feell the need to add
>that not too long ago, I put up my own home-brew sheets on my
>page, in Word 97 format (they use some stuff that won't translate
>to Word 6.0/95 or RTF). They're available from
>http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/pw/shadowrun.html

I don't suppose you have anything *for* Word 6.0 or something less than
Office 97...

Erik J.


"Forgive me FASA for I have sinned. It has been 6 days since I last played
Shadowrun and 15 days since I last bought a SRTCG booster pack."
Message no. 4
From: Robert Watkins <robert.watkins@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 08:49:56 +1000
Erik Jameson writes:
> >Since we're plugging character sheets, I feell the need to add
> >that not too long ago, I put up my own home-brew sheets on my
> >page, in Word 97 format (they use some stuff that won't translate
> >to Word 6.0/95 or RTF). They're available from
> >http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/pw/shadowrun.html
>
> I don't suppose you have anything *for* Word 6.0 or something less than
> Office 97...

Erik (and anyone else with this problem), you should be able to get a free
Word 97 reader/viewer from the Microsoft Web Site
(http://www.microsoft.com/). This will let you read/print Word 97 documents,
but won't let you edit them, convert them, etc.

If you have trouble finding it, let me know, and I'll dig it out for you.

--
.sig deleted to conserve electrons. robert.watkins@******.com
Message no. 5
From: Adam J <fro@***.AB.CA>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 18:49:39 -0600
At 08:49 16/06/98 +1000, you wrote:

>> I don't suppose you have anything *for* Word 6.0 or something less than
>> Office 97...
>
>Erik (and anyone else with this problem), you should be able to get a free
>Word 97 reader/viewer from the Microsoft Web Site
>(http://www.microsoft.com/). This will let you read/print Word 97 documents,
>but won't let you edit them, convert them, etc.

There should be a fairly close link from my resources page at
http://www.interware.it/users/adamj/resource.htm to the Word 97 reader.
(When Interware gets back up..)

Also, I'm always open to converting files to PDF format so more people can
read them easily. Just don't send me tons of uncompressed stuff
unannounced. <g>

-Adam J
-
http://www.interware.it/users/adamj \ fro@***.ab.ca \ ICQ# 2350330
ShadowRN Assistant Fearless Leader \ FreeRPG Webring \ TSS Productions
The Shadowrun Supplemental \ SR Archive Co-Maintainer \ RPGA Reviwer
"And you know why these (Independent) movies are good? Because they come
from Bumblefuck, America." -- Kevin Smith.
Message no. 6
From: Wordman <wordman@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 20:50:25 -0400
Gurth said:
>Since we're plugging character sheets, I feell the need to add
>that not too long ago, I put up my own home-brew sheets on my
>page, in Word 97 format
>
>Suggestions for improvements are always welcome :)

Make them available in PDF. I don't know why, but the page breaks of the
sheets (and NERPS, for that matter) get hosed when I open them on my NT
machine at work. With PDF, everyone sees them as .you. want them seen.

Wordman
Message no. 7
From: Alexia <alexia_silverstein@*****.COM>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 19:02:30 -0700
> I don't suppose you have anything *for* Word 6.0 or something less
than
> Office 97...

Why? WE don't use the lesser versions...one must stay current in this
industry if one wants to keep up...
==
~Alexia
http://www.sova.net/trish/shadowrun



_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @*****.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
Message no. 8
From: Adam J <fro@***.AB.CA>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 21:33:09 -0600
At 20:50 15/06/98 -0400, you wrote:

>>Suggestions for improvements are always welcome :)
>
>Make them available in PDF.

Not that easy for everyone, you know that Wordman.. :)

>I don't know why, but the page breaks of the
>sheets (and NERPS, for that matter) get hosed when I open them on my NT
>machine at work. With PDF, everyone sees them as .you. want them seen.

I haven't checked Gurth's sheets out yet, but I assume he designed them for
A4 paper. Word sometimes does funky things trying to translate it to
letter size..

-Adam J
-
http://www.interware.it/users/adamj \ fro@***.ab.ca \ ICQ# 2350330
ShadowRN Assistant Fearless Leader \ FreeRPG Webring \ TSS Productions
The Shadowrun Supplemental \ SR Archive Co-Maintainer \ RPGA Reviwer
"And you know why these (Independent) movies are good? Because they come
from Bumblefuck, America." -- Kevin Smith.
Message no. 9
From: Geoff Skellams <geoff.skellams@*********.COM.AU>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 13:43:33 +1000
On Shadowrun Discussion, Adam J[SMTP:fro@***.AB.CA] wrote:
> At 20:50 15/06/98 -0400, you wrote:
>
> >>Suggestions for improvements are always welcome :)
> >
> >Make them available in PDF.
>
> Not that easy for everyone, you know that Wordman.. :)
>
> >I don't know why, but the page breaks of the
> >sheets (and NERPS, for that matter) get hosed when I open them on my
NT
> >machine at work. With PDF, everyone sees them as .you. want them
seen.
>
> I haven't checked Gurth's sheets out yet, but I assume he designed
them for
> A4 paper. Word sometimes does funky things trying to translate it to
> letter size..

It's no worse than us trying to print stuff formatted for Letter sized,
when all we can get is A4. I priced getting some letter sized paper here
in Australia. Here in Canberra, I can only get it if I go to a paper
house and have it specially cut, at A$15 a ream. When you consider that
a ream of A4 costs <A$5, it doesn't seem worth the extra hassle.

Good on ya, Gurth. You show 'em how the rest of the world works :)

cheers
G

--
Geoff Skellams R&D - Tower Software
Email Address: geoff.skellams@*********.com.au
Homepage: http://www.towersoft.com.au/staff/geoff/
ICQ Number: 2815165

"That rates about a 9.5 on my weird-shit-o-meter"
- Will Smith in "Men in Black"
Message no. 10
From: Adam J <fro@***.AB.CA>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Mon, 15 Jun 1998 21:51:50 -0600
At 13:43 16/06/98 +1000, you wrote:
>> I haven't checked Gurth's sheets out yet, but I assume he designed
>them for
>> A4 paper. Word sometimes does funky things trying to translate it to
>> letter size..
>
>It's no worse than us trying to print stuff formatted for Letter sized,
>when all we can get is A4. I priced getting some letter sized paper here
>in Australia. Here in Canberra, I can only get it if I go to a paper
>house and have it specially cut, at A$15 a ream. When you consider that
>a ream of A4 costs <A$5, it doesn't seem worth the extra hassle.

Now, never having actually Seen a piece of A4 paper myself, just hearing
the measurments -- it's slightly wider and longer than 8x11, no? So Letter
stuff should be printable on A4 fairly easily, although you would end up
with extra-wide margins.

Am I way off?

In either case, I stand by Gurth's philosphy: Make something that *you* can
use first, and worry about the rest later.. :)

-Adam
-
http://www.interware.it/users/adamj \ fro@***.ab.ca \ ICQ# 2350330
ShadowRN Assistant Fearless Leader \ FreeRPG Webring \ TSS Productions
The Shadowrun Supplemental \ SR Archive Co-Maintainer \ RPGA Reviwer
"And you know why these (Independent) movies are good? Because they come
from Bumblefuck, America." -- Kevin Smith.
Message no. 11
From: Robert Watkins <robert.watkins@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 14:11:09 +1000
Adam J writes:
> Now, never having actually Seen a piece of A4 paper myself, just hearing
> the measurments -- it's slightly wider and longer than 8x11, no?
> So Letter
> stuff should be printable on A4 fairly easily, although you would end up
> with extra-wide margins.
>
> Am I way off?

Not quite, but you're not on, either... it's slightly _narrower_ and longer.
This can mean that a US-letter formatted document, with typical margins, may
not print on some printers for A4 (as some printers often have unprintable
areas on the edges that can be quite extensive, 5mm or more each side).

In general, A4 translates to US Letter better than vice-versa... margins at
the top and bottom of the page aren't as essential, and usually just contain
stuff like the page number and document title (useful, but not essential).

> In either case, I stand by Gurth's philosphy: Make something that
> *you* can
> use first, and worry about the rest later.. :)

Ditto. And make a format that people can play with should they need to. :)

--
.sig deleted to conserve electrons. robert.watkins@******.com
Message no. 12
From: Wordman <wordman@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 01:23:34 -0400
Adam J wrote:
>Wordman wrote:
>>Make them available in PDF.
>
>Not that easy for everyone, you know that Wordman.. :)

Yeah. I don't get how Adobe wants PDF to be _the_ internet document format,
then charges U.S. $150 for the distiller. (Side note: Apple announced that
in Mac OS X, PDF would replace PICT as the _default_ graphic format for the
Macintosh platform).

Still, if you can print the document, you can make it available as
postscript. Then I could turn it into PDF. The one problem is when people
use fonts in the odious TrueType format instead of Type 1, as it turns the
PDF file into a an ugly rasterized peice of shit. But I digress.

>>I don't know why, but the page breaks of the
>>sheets (and NERPS, for that matter) get hosed when I open them on my NT
>>machine at work. With PDF, everyone sees them as .you. want them seen.
>
>I haven't checked Gurth's sheets out yet, but I assume he designed them for
>A4 paper. Word sometimes does funky things trying to translate it to
>letter size..

I know. My problems occur even after I adjust for that. If I print to
letter sized, it gets really bad. Going to A4 is only sort of bad. Like,
maybe one page in 20 orphans a single line to the following page, totally
screwing up the pagination.

I know I'm going to regret asking, but would an A4 version of the Collected
NAGEE be of any use to anyone?

Wordman
Message no. 13
From: Robert Watkins <robert.watkins@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 16:10:48 +1000
> Make them available in PDF. I don't know why, but the page breaks of the
> sheets (and NERPS, for that matter) get hosed when I open them on my NT
> machine at work. With PDF, everyone sees them as .you. want them seen.

I've got to back Wordman up here... I opened up the character sheets, and
the Rigger sheets were broken up (The vehicle condition monitors at the
bottom were on the next page). I played with the margins a bit (reduced top
and bottom margins by .25 cm each), and it was fine, but that was for A4.

--
.sig deleted to conserve electrons. robert.watkins@******.com
Message no. 14
From: Danyel N Woods <9604801@********.AC.NZ>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 18:28:12 +1200
Quoth Wordman (1724 06-06-98 NZT):

<<SLICE>>
> I know. My problems occur even after I adjust for that. If I print to
> letter sized, it gets really bad. Going to A4 is only sort of bad.
Like,
> maybe one page in 20 orphans a single line to the following page,
totally
> screwing up the pagination.

> I know I'm going to regret asking, but would an A4 version of the
Collected
> NAGEE be of any use to anyone?

YO!!! I'll take a copy of an A4 NAGEE (when I get my Internet access
back)! The Letter format is great, but it seems a little...disjointed,
when I print it on my machine.

Danyel Woods - 9604801@********.ac.nz
'Any more for any more?'
Message no. 15
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 12:33:17 +0100
Wordman said on 20:50/15 Jun 98,...

> >Suggestions for improvements are always welcome :)
>
> Make them available in PDF. I don't know why, but the page breaks of the
> sheets (and NERPS, for that matter) get hosed when I open them on my NT
> machine at work. With PDF, everyone sees them as .you. want them seen.

That's because you probably have a different printer than I do
here at home. Word makes minor changes in the layout
depending on the printer Windows is using at the moment (you
can easily check this -- install two totally different printer drivers,
load a doc with one printer as the default, and then select a
different printer in Word's print setup dialog).

Like I said in another message, turning them into PDF hasn't
worked because it hangs on the first page. All the other ones are
turned into PDF fine, but the first one isn't. This must be related
to the fact that each time I try to print multiple copies of page
#1, Word crashes, while it doesn't with the other pages...

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
An intelligent computer would be one that doesn't work most of the time.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 16
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 12:33:16 +0100
Erik Jameson said on 17:43/15 Jun 98,...

> I don't suppose you have anything *for* Word 6.0 or something less than
> Office 97...

Most of the other files are in RTF format, which AFAIK you should
be able to read on a Mac; the character sheets, though, I wanted
to turn into PDF but the damn thing kept crashing on the first
page. Everything else worked fine except for that first page...

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
An intelligent computer would be one that doesn't work most of the time.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 17
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 12:33:17 +0100
Adam J said on 21:51/15 Jun 98,...

> Now, never having actually Seen a piece of A4 paper myself, just hearing
> the measurments -- it's slightly wider and longer than 8x11, no? So Letter
> stuff should be printable on A4 fairly easily, although you would end up
> with extra-wide margins.

A4 is 21.0 x 29.7 cm, against 21.6 x 27.9 cm for your Letter
paper. The two should be fairly interchangeable, as long as
nothing in the file goes right up to the edge of the paper. I've
printed out lots of Letter-formatted stuff on A4 without changing
the paper size in the document.

> Am I way off?

No.

> In either case, I stand by Gurth's philosphy: Make something that *you* can
> use first, and worry about the rest later.. :)

Exactly :)

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
An intelligent computer would be one that doesn't work most of the time.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 18
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 12:33:17 +0100
Adam J said on 21:33/15 Jun 98,...

> I haven't checked Gurth's sheets out yet, but I assume he designed them for
> A4 paper.

Of course... Why design them for Letter-size paper if I've got
about 1500 sheets of A4 left? :)

> Word sometimes does funky things trying to translate it to
> letter size..

Or the other way around... I rpinted out TSS #8 yesterday, and
with EVERY DAMN PAGE Word told me the margins for section 1
fell outside the printable area, would I like to continue? *sigh*
Just once would be enough, thankyouverymuch...

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
An intelligent computer would be one that doesn't work most of the time.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 19
From: Lord Saethar <saethar@*********.COM>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 07:09:02 -0500
>> I don't suppose you have anything *for* Word 6.0 or something less
>than
>> Office 97...

Who ever asked for the above...email me...I got a Word 97 conversion for
Word 6.0/7.0(95), works pretty good.

--
Lord Saethar
saethar@*********.com

http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Labs/5085
Message no. 20
From: Damion Milliken <milko@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Wed, 17 Jun 1998 03:02:58 +1000
Wordman writes:

> I know I'm going to regret asking, but would an A4 version of the Collected
> NAGEE be of any use to anyone?

Yep, yep, you betcha! My copy of NAGEE 6 is more than a little screwy (with
blank pages, pages with one line, and other general formatting wierdness),
which is very likely attributable to the letter paper size it was originally
designed for. I'd love A4 versions of the net.publications.

--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong
Unofficial Shadowrun Guru E-mail: milko@***.edu.au
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DI+++ D G+ e++>++++$ h(*) r(--) y--
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
Message no. 21
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 13:46:46 -0400
At 07:02 PM 6/15/98 -0700, you wrote:
>> I don't suppose you have anything *for* Word 6.0 or something less
>than
>> Office 97...
>
>Why? WE don't use the lesser versions...one must stay current in this
>industry if one wants to keep up...

Hey now girly, some of can do mighty fine work with Word 5 for Mac, or even
a simple typewriter...and Word 6 for this crappy Wintel machine is what I
have here at work.

I mean honestly, the only time I wish I had a more current version of Word
is when I want to download something written in Word 97. Sure, it's got
some cool bells and whistles, but that sure as hell doesn't help me *write*
anything.

Anyway, I'm heading down to Staples during my lunch hour anyway to pick up
a few things and I may pick up a pack of A4 paper if they have it. If they
do, I'll be downloading Gurth's entire website over the next week or
two...well, except for the stuff I wrote myself.

Thanks for all the suggestions by the way.

Erik J.


"Forgive me FASA for I have sinned. It has been 6 days since I last played
Shadowrun and 15 days since I last bought a SRTCG booster pack."
Message no. 22
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 21:22:10 +0100
Lord Saethar said on 7:09/16 Jun 98,...

> >> I don't suppose you have anything *for* Word 6.0 or something less
> >than
> >> Office 97...
>
> Who ever asked for the above...email me...I got a Word 97 conversion for
> Word 6.0/7.0(95), works pretty good.

Except you'll lose the kinds of things that Word 97 can do and
Word 6.0/95 cannot. That's not a problem if those things aren't in
the document, but if some are (like with my character sheets)
then it won't be able to convert 100% right, and you'll end up
with layouts that are messed up.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
An intelligent computer would be one that doesn't work most of the time.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 23
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 14:24:39 -0500
On Wed, 17 Jun 1998 03:02:58 +1000 Damion Milliken <milko@***.EDU.AU>
writes:
>Wordman writes:
>> I know I'm going to regret asking, but would an A4 version of the
Collected
>> NAGEE be of any use to anyone?

>Yep, yep, you betcha! My copy of NAGEE 6 is more than a little screwy
(with
>blank pages, pages with one line, and other general formatting
wierdness),
>which is very likely attributable to the letter paper size it was
originally
>designed for. I'd love A4 versions of the net.publications.
>
>--
>Damion Milliken
<SNIP Sig>

Acually, I have the collected NAGEE and I think every segment (each
section IIRC, is seperate file) ends in a blank page. Also, Gurth's
stuff in PDF look VERY funky the gear names and the table headings
(conceal, armor, balistic, etc...) in Acrobat Reader just look like
______ and when I C&P It comes out "fine" except that it's all scrambled
(but with some work I could ecode it :/ ). Is this just because Gurth
used a font or something that my sys doesn't have? I, for some reason,
thought the fonts were included in the file format ... :/

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)
"Let he who is without SIN cast the first stone"

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
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Message no. 24
From: Adam J <fro@***.AB.CA>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 17:27:35 -0600
At 12:33 16/06/98 +0100, you wrote:

>> Word sometimes does funky things trying to translate it to
>> letter size..

Reminder to self: steal some paper from school before I leave. :)

>Or the other way around... I rpinted out TSS #8 yesterday, and
>with EVERY DAMN PAGE Word told me the margins for section 1
>fell outside the printable area, would I like to continue? *sigh*
>Just once would be enough, thankyouverymuch...

Shit.. I thought that was just due to the "Dead" spot on my HP500C. Looking
at a few printouts, there is just a Tiny bit cut off the bottom, so you
could shorten the bottom margin by a teeny bit and the footer should fall
into the right place.

-Adam
-
http://www.interware.it/users/adamj \ fro@***.ab.ca \ ICQ# 2350330
ShadowRN Assistant Fearless Leader \ FreeRPG Webring \ TSS Productions
The Shadowrun Supplemental \ SR Archive Co-Maintainer \ RPGA Reviwer
"And you know why these (Independent) movies are good? Because they come
from Bumblefuck, America." -- Kevin Smith.
Message no. 25
From: Robert Watkins <robert.watkins@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Wed, 17 Jun 1998 09:32:53 +1000
Adam J writes:
> Shit.. I thought that was just due to the "Dead" spot on my
> HP500C.

What was that about making something _you_ could use first, Adam? ;)

--
.sig deleted to conserve electrons. robert.watkins@******.com
Message no. 26
From: Wordman <wordman@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 20:08:31 -0400
Gurth said:
>Adam J said on 21:51/15 Jun 98,...
>> In either case, I stand by Gurth's philosphy: Make something that *you* can
>> use first, and worry about the rest later.. :)
>
>Exactly :)

Naturally, I'm more interested in something _I_ can use :-).

As for Acrobat crashing, tips from some one who has seen his share of
flaming death in Acrobat products: (these tips are from the Mac side of
things, but might help a little)

1) Make sure you use the most recent version (which I think is 3.0.1). 3.0
crashed like a dog about every time I used it on certain documents.
Actually, to more more specific, it crashed all the time on certain
_fonts_. The Mac version of the Acrobat Reader 3.0, for example, crashes
when opening a number of the Shadowrun Supplements. The same docs with
Reader 3.1 open fine, though with a couple of characters messed up. (Adam,
I think I told you all this before, unless I'm hallucinating).

2) Most crashes in Acrobat tend to involve a badly formatted font. You
might try changing the fonts used on the front page, at least to see if the
crash goes away. Unfortunately, the fix for this seems to be fixing the
font, which isn't always easy. On the Mac, Fontographer does a great job of
this (usually), but I'm not familiar with the Windows tools for such things.

3) Instead of using the "Print to PDF" method, just print to a file, then
run the file through the distiller. I've found the print driver to do some
flaky things. In my character sheets, for example, it just decides some of
the text isn't there. Another bonus of this is that the distiller sometimes
gives line numbers of the postscript file when it hits a problem. Often you
can look at the postscript and at least get some clue where things are
messing up, at least if it's ASCII postscript.

4) As a last resort, start deleting things off the page until the crash
goes away. This will at least tell you what Acrobat is choking on. You can
also try the standard stuff: use a different machine, different printer,
etc. If I remember correctly, a lot of the Plastic Warriors stuff has a big
graphic on the front? Maybe? I dunno. But that could be the problem.

5) As a really last resort, ask Adobe. They tend to be either really good
or really bad about tech support. Sometimes you get lucky.

6) Long,long shot: Word's file format is very strange and tends to get
convoluted quickly. Sometimes a bunch of formatting information can
accumulate at the head of the file, which gets immediately overriden by
information right after it. A save as might solve this, and will definately
re-order the file into a semblance of order. Another trick is to copy the
whole document except the first character into a new document. The Mac
version of Office 98 is also now catching flack for not zeroing out
unallocated buffers, then writing these into files. This can leave a bunch
of stuff (like e-mail addresses) hidden in you file. I suppose it's
possible that this could do something strange to the whole process.

Sorry. I'm babbling.

Wordman
Message no. 27
From: Robert Watkins <robert.watkins@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Wed, 17 Jun 1998 10:21:14 +1000
Wordman writes:
> 3) Instead of using the "Print to PDF" method, just print to a file, then
> run the file through the distiller. I've found the print driver to do some
> flaky things. In my character sheets, for example, it just decides some of
> the text isn't there. Another bonus of this is that the distiller
> sometimes
> gives line numbers of the postscript file when it hits a problem.
> Often you
> can look at the postscript and at least get some clue where things are
> messing up, at least if it's ASCII postscript.

Assuming that you know postscript, of course... :)

Actually, this method lets you create PDF files without Acrobat Exchange (I
don't believe that Acrobat Distiller is freeware... correct me if I'm wrong,
as I would appreciate a copy. :).

Print to the file, as mentioned above, and then open the file using a
postscript viewer, such as GSView (a free postscript viewer, supported by
Alladin, and available on all platforms). Using GSView, you can print to a
file again, and one of the supported 'printer' drivers is pdfwrite, which
writes to a PDF file. A little convoluted, but it works (for example, I just
converted Gurth's sheets, which were crashing for him).

--
*************************************************************************
* .--_ # "My opinions may have changed, but not the fact *
* _-0(#)) # that I'm right." -- Old Fortune Saying *
* @__ )/ # *
* )=(===__==,= # Robert Watkins <---> robert.watkins@******.com *
* {}== \--==--`= # *
* ,_) \ # "A friend is someone who watches the same *
* L_===__)=, # TV programs as you" *
*************************************************************************
Message no. 28
From: Wordman <wordman@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 20:26:14 -0400
D.Ghost wrote:

>Acually, I have the collected NAGEE and I think every segment (each
>section IIRC, is seperate file) ends in a blank page.

That's actually intentional, but it doesn't happen for every section.
Basically the blank pages are there to ensure that the following section
begins on an odd numbered page. I should have probably put page numbers on
the blanks. Or better yet, filled them with art or something.

> Also, Gurth's
>stuff in PDF look VERY funky the gear names and the table headings
>(conceal, armor, balistic, etc...) in Acrobat Reader just look like
>______ and when I C&P It comes out "fine" except that it's all
scrambled
>(but with some work I could ecode it :/ ). Is this just because Gurth
>used a font or something that my sys doesn't have? I, for some reason,
>thought the fonts were included in the file format ... :/

Most of the current batch of the Plastic Warriors was converted to PDF by
me, and I've never been too pleased with the result. I know the problem
you're talking about, and I'm not sure of the reason. I'm guessing that the
problem stems from the fonts, and probably the Bizantine way I did the
conversion. I did this a while ago, but this is how I remember it:

1) Download Gurth's TrueType Windows fonts.
2) On a Mac, build Type1 PostScript fonts for Windows with Fontographer.
3) Install both the TrueType and Type1 fonts on my NT machine. It may be
that on installing the Type 1 fonts, I let NT build TrueType versions for
me. Either way, this could be a source of error and I don't think I ever
tried it the other way.
4) Download the Word versions of Plastic Warriors.
5) Open them in either Word 95 or 97, I don't remember which.
6) Make sure printer is set to print to A4 paper.
7) Print to file. This creates a .prn file, which every other platform in
the world calls a .ps file: raw postscript.
8) Bring the .prn files to the Mac, and run them through Acrobat Distiller.
9) Viola, error-ridden PDF files.

I'm guessing/hoping/praying that if the whole thing was done on the same
machine, it might run a bit more smoothly.

BTW, Gurth, let me know what you want done with these files. Do you want
them available, even with some gremlins? Do you want to replace them with
your own? Etc.?

Wordman
Message no. 29
From: Wordman <wordman@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 20:37:28 -0400
Gurth wrote:

>Most of the other files are in RTF format, which AFAIK you should
>be able to read on a Mac;

In theory, this is true. Unfortunately, the Rich Text Format is a bit of a
moving target. One product's version of RTF often does not work with
another product's. One reason for this is that Microsoft keeps altering the
format. Another reason (at least, this is my theory) is that writing
import/export parsers is a horrid, thankless, dirty, boring job, so it
usually gets assigned to junior programmers, who naturally are the least
qualified at doing it. The end result is that most RTF parsers I've seen
crash like banshees on any document with real formatting in it (and Plastic
Warriors _definately_ qualifies as real formatting). (BTW, for those
keeping score at home, banshees crash loudly and often.)

On the Mac, I've found that MacLink translators (now free with OS8, BTW)
handle RTF best. Typically, Microsoft products do very well with RTF from
other Microsoft products, but play well neither to nor from other products.
Read any political agenda you like into that. Nisus Writer, an otherwise
brilliant word-processor, often crashes when reading in its _own_ RTF files.

Wordman
Message no. 30
From: Adam J <fro@***.AB.CA>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 1998 21:39:43 -0600
At 09:32 17/06/98 +1000, you wrote:
>Adam J writes:
>> Shit.. I thought that was just due to the "Dead" spot on my
>> HP500C.
>
>What was that about making something _you_ could use first, Adam? ;)

I print the PDF file, not the Word file. :)

-Adam
-
http://www.interware.it/users/adamj \ fro@***.ab.ca \ ICQ# 2350330
ShadowRN Assistant Fearless Leader \ FreeRPG Webring \ TSS Productions
The Shadowrun Supplemental \ SR Archive Co-Maintainer \ RPGA Reviwer
"And you know why these (Independent) movies are good? Because they come
from Bumblefuck, America." -- Kevin Smith.
Message no. 31
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Wed, 17 Jun 1998 00:05:42 -0500
On Tue, 16 Jun 1998 20:26:14 -0400 Wordman <wordman@*******.COM> writes:
>D.Ghost wrote:
>>Acually, I have the collected NAGEE and I think every segment (each
>>section IIRC, is seperate file) ends in a blank page.

>That's actually intentional, but it doesn't happen for every section.
>Basically the blank pages are there to ensure that the following section
>begins on an odd numbered page. I should have probably put page numbers
on
>the blanks. Or better yet, filled them with art or something.

Or "This page left intentionally blank" :)

>> Also, Gurth's
>>stuff in PDF look VERY funky the gear names and the table headings
>>(conceal, armor, balistic, etc...) in Acrobat Reader just look like
>>______ and when I C&P It comes out "fine" except that it's all
scrambled
>>(but with some work I could ecode it :/ ). Is this just because Gurth
>>used a font or something that my sys doesn't have? I, for some reason,
>>thought the fonts were included in the file format ... :/

>Most of the current batch of the Plastic Warriors was converted to PDF
by
>me, and I've never been too pleased with the result. I know the problem
>you're talking about, and I'm not sure of the reason. I'm guessing that
the
>problem stems from the fonts, and probably the Bizantine way I did the
>conversion. I did this a while ago, but this is how I remember it:
>
>1) Download Gurth's TrueType Windows fonts.
>2) On a Mac, build Type1 PostScript fonts for Windows with Fontographer.
>3) Install both the TrueType and Type1 fonts on my NT machine. It may be
>that on installing the Type 1 fonts, I let NT build TrueType versions
for
>me. Either way, this could be a source of error and I don't think I ever
>tried it the other way.
>4) Download the Word versions of Plastic Warriors.
>5) Open them in either Word 95 or 97, I don't remember which.
>6) Make sure printer is set to print to A4 paper.
>7) Print to file. This creates a .prn file, which every other platform
in
>the world calls a .ps file: raw postscript.
>8) Bring the .prn files to the Mac, and run them through Acrobat
Distiller.
>9) Viola, error-ridden PDF files.

I wonder if this is the problem ... you're on a Mac and I'm on Windoze95
...

<SNIP>
>
>Wordman

(Great files btw ... unfortunately I'm having a hard time processing the
in WP 8 [so I can read all that scrambled stuff ...] ... apparently all
the Chromebook conversions plus Plastic Warriors stuff in 1 file makes
for a file size Win95 and/or WP 8 doesn't like ;)

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)
"Let he who is without SIN cast the first stone"

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
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Message no. 32
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Wed, 17 Jun 1998 11:02:27 +0100
Adam J said on 17:27/16 Jun 98,...

> Shit.. I thought that was just due to the "Dead" spot on my HP500C.

That would explain that, then... If a 500C does it, so will my 520.

> Looking
> at a few printouts, there is just a Tiny bit cut off the bottom, so you
> could shorten the bottom margin by a teeny bit and the footer should fall
> into the right place.

The first and last page had about half of the bottom line cut off,
yeah. Next time I'll check the margins before I print :)

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
An intelligent computer would be one that doesn't work most of the time.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 33
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Wed, 17 Jun 1998 11:02:26 +0100
Alfredo B Alves said on 14:24/16 Jun 98,...

> Acually, I have the collected NAGEE and I think every segment (each
> section IIRC, is seperate file) ends in a blank page. Also, Gurth's
> stuff in PDF look VERY funky the gear names and the table headings
> (conceal, armor, balistic, etc...) in Acrobat Reader just look like
> ______ and when I C&P It comes out "fine" except that it's all
scrambled
> (but with some work I could ecode it :/ ). Is this just because Gurth
> used a font or something that my sys doesn't have? I, for some reason,
> thought the fonts were included in the file format ... :/

I don't know, as I didn't make those PDF files. Wordman turned
most of the Plastic Warriors files into PDF, IIRC, but I haven't
taken a look at them to see how good a job he did... I do want to
make PDF versions myself, but haven't got round to it yet. (I've
had lots of troubles actually making PDF files of just about
anything...)

As for the fonts required, that shouldn't matter with PDF, because
the file contains ALL the data needed to view the document
properly. For the RTF files on my page, though, I suggest you
download the fonts file that's also on my page, to make sure you
have all the right fonts on your system before you open and print
any of the RTF files.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
An intelligent computer would be one that doesn't work most of the time.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 34
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Wed, 17 Jun 1998 11:02:27 +0100
Wordman said on 20:08/16 Jun 98,...

> 3) Instead of using the "Print to PDF" method, just print to a file, then
> run the file through the distiller. I've found the print driver to do some
> flaky things. In my character sheets, for example, it just decides some of
> the text isn't there. Another bonus of this is that the distiller sometimes
> gives line numbers of the postscript file when it hits a problem. Often you
> can look at the postscript and at least get some clue where things are
> messing up, at least if it's ASCII postscript.

This was, more or less, suggested to me by someone else too. It's
probably what I'll try this afternoon.

> 4) As a last resort, start deleting things off the page until the crash
> goes away. This will at least tell you what Acrobat is choking on. You can
> also try the standard stuff: use a different machine, different printer,
> etc. If I remember correctly, a lot of the Plastic Warriors stuff has a big
> graphic on the front? Maybe? I dunno. But that could be the problem.

That's what I did yesterday. There are a number of graphics
generated by Word on it, and I thought the problem might be in
those... (Un)fortunately, that wasn't the case. I think it's one of
those weird faults Word sometimes has, like the one where it
refuses to do the page header right.

> 5) As a really last resort, ask Adobe. They tend to be either really good
> or really bad about tech support. Sometimes you get lucky.

I don't think I want to contact Adobe about this...

> 6) Long,long shot: Word's file format is very strange and tends to get
> convoluted quickly. Sometimes a bunch of formatting information can
> accumulate at the head of the file, which gets immediately overriden by
> information right after it. A save as might solve this, and will definately
> re-order the file into a semblance of order.

That's an idea I hadn't thought of... I'll try this to see if it works
first.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
An intelligent computer would be one that doesn't work most of the time.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 35
From: "Arno R. Lehmann" <arlehma@***.NET>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Thu, 18 Jun 1998 17:35:33 +0200
On Mon, 15 Jun 1998 17:43:34 -0400, Erik Jameson wrote:

>At 01:14 PM 6/15/98 +0100, you wrote:
>
>>Since we're plugging character sheets, I feell the need to add
>>that not too long ago, I put up my own home-brew sheets on my
>>page, in Word 97 format (they use some stuff that won't translate
>>to Word 6.0/95 or RTF). They're available from
>>http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/pw/shadowrun.html
>
>I don't suppose you have anything *for* Word 6.0 or something less than
>Office 97...

I've got something more exotic to offer: Character Sheet templates for
AmiPro and LaTeX (dvi-version available, too) as well as PostScript
versions that can be printed directly. Available at
http://pinguin.ast.uct.ac.za/~arno/SR/forms.html

Use it if you need something like that!

Arno
--
Arno
*********************************************************************
Be careful when replying to this mail - check the address !!!
(And send me a note when you notice that
the reply-to-address points to the list!)
*********************************************************************
Message no. 36
From: Randy Nickel <RANNIC@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Thu, 18 Jun 1998 12:25:25 -0700
Being new to the list could I get a copy of the character sheets that
were sent out. I would certainly appreciate it.

- Eclipse

"They shall all drown in lakes of blood. Now they shall know why
they are afraid of the dark. Now learn why they fear the night."
Message no. 37
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Thu, 18 Jun 1998 22:25:57 +0100
Randy Nickel said on 12:25/18 Jun 98,...

> Being new to the list could I get a copy of the character sheets that
> were sent out. I would certainly appreciate it.

They weren't sent out, the web sites for them were posted. In
case you're interested take a look here:

Wordman's sheets, PDF format:
http://pobox.com/~wordman/personal/srunsheets.html

My sheets, Word 97 format:
http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/pw/shadowrun.html

Arno Lehman's sheets, AmiPro, LaTeX, Postscript formats:
http://pinguin.ast.uct.ac.za/~arno/SR/forms.html

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html
An intelligent computer would be one that doesn't work most of the time.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

GC3.1: GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N o? K- w+ O V? PS+
PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y?
Incubated into the First Church of the Sqooshy Ball, 21-05-1998
Message no. 38
From: Wordman <wordman@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: Wordman's character sheets updated
Date: Fri, 19 Jun 1998 01:06:03 -0400
>Randy Nickel said on 12:25/18 Jun 98,...
>
>> Being new to the list could I get a copy of the character sheets that
>> were sent out. I would certainly appreciate it.
>
>They weren't sent out, the web sites for them were posted. In
>case you're interested take a look here:
>
>Wordman's sheets, PDF format:
>http://pobox.com/~wordman/personal/srunsheets.html
>
>My sheets, Word 97 format:
>http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/pw/shadowrun.html
>
>Arno Lehman's sheets, AmiPro, LaTeX, Postscript formats:
>http://pinguin.ast.uct.ac.za/~arno/SR/forms.html

You can also find a bunch on http://www.interware.it/shadowrun/. When you
get to the site, pick "Sheets" from the menu.

Wordman

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