| From: | Unknown sender |
|---|---|
| Subject: | None |
| Date: | Unknown time and date |
can I combine:
Power focus 4
combat spell focus 3
fireball focus 5
Sorcery(spellcasting) 6(7)
Base magic rating 6
for a magic pool of 19
and magic rating of 18
???????????
Stephan
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 1994 16:19:46 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Nightfox <DJWA@******.UCC.NAU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Foci question???
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu
>For the magic rating AND magic pool, when I cast a fireball,
>can I combine:
>
>Power focus 4
>combat spell focus 3
>fireball focus 5
>
>Sorcery(spellcasting) 6(7)
>Base magic rating 6
>
>for a magic pool of 19
>and magic rating of 18
No.
Magic Rating with active Power Focus = 10
Magic Pool for spell casting = 11 - Spell foci do not add to the magic pool
SRII - pg 137 col 2, para 4.
Spell foci are treated like magic pool dice - but they are not.
Spell catagory foci can be used for drain, success or spell catagory resistance.
They can not be used for normal spell resistance.
Specific Spell Foci can be used for drain and success tests only.
Nightfox
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 1994 16:36:56 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Nightfox <DJWA@******.UCC.NAU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Be cool and tell me what is...
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu
Robert A. Hayden wrote:
>Don't forget SFLWGBTGMW
>
>Showering Fearless Leader with Gummy Bears to get my Way.
Yep, I've done that. two bags of Gummy Bears :)
Nightfox
Hey Rob, why was it that we sent you gummy bears anyway?
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 1994 16:42:28 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Nightfox <DJWA@******.UCC.NAU.EDU>
Subject: Re: A debate from Tucson
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu
>>>>>> "Marc" == Marc A Renouf <jormung@*****.UMICH.EDU>
writes:
>
>Marc> No, he'd still have a strength of six. He'd just have a but-high
>Marc> Athletics/lifting/"Pomping-Iiiron" skill. The extensive work you
>Marc> talk about manifests itself in the skills you have, not necessarily
>Marc> your attributes.
>
Rat:
>The problem with that is you're "inventing" a new mechanic to replace
>what's already covered by Strength, specifically lifting ability (that
>violates my left-hand rule of thumb: don't invent new, complex mechanics
>when an existing, simple mechanic already covers the situation). And then
Actually, I can see using Athletics for AUGMENTING a strength roll. You can do
it with athletics pertaining to running (dexterity)- I don't see why you can't
do it with strength and listing. By the way - the specialization for lifting
is lifting -- read the description for Athletics.
Athletics/lifting - you know how to correctly position yourself, steal yourself
to the weight, use your weight to help, and use all of your msucles in your body
to help you lift.
People who do power lifting work a lot in technique - my cousin do it for a
while.
Nightfox
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 1994 19:48:18 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "CHAPMAN, DANIEL LEE" <DANIELC@*****.CC.UGA.EDU>
Subject: Players Needed
Hey fellow Runners!
I live in the Athens,GA-UGA area and am looking for players for
a good old fashionedgame of SR. If interested E-mail me at:
DanielC@*****.cc.uga.edu
Hope to hear from you....
Dan aka Excalibur
If you ever encounter a troll sammie wearing that nifty new
military armor, I have a piece of advise:
RUN LIKE HELL OR THERE WON'T BE ENOUGH OF YOU LEFT FOR
DOCWAGON. It hurts, trust me on this one.
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 1994 17:36:58 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Erik S Jameson <esj@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410211812.AA07353@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
> Do you realize that in order for this to happen, your combined
> Quickness+Intelligence+Willpower has to be a 34? That's very nearly a
> twelve in each score. Either that or you have one HELL of a combat sense
> locked/quickened (target). For magic pool of 15 you need a sorcery skill
> (or appropriate concentration/specialization) of 15, or have one HELL of
> a power focus. Methinks y'all are playing a VERY different type of game,
> and so your system would not be adequate for what most of the rest of us
> do. For myself, if my comabat pool didn't refresh fully and often, my
> characters would die in short order. Difference in gaming styles, I guess.
>
> Marc (don't tell my that YOUR characters have 300+ karma pools!)
>
A couple of things here. We do play with the 1.5x rule currently, and
Apache/Mad Cat is loaded with cyber. But then again, that character has
been in existence for several years now. And the magic pool of 15? Try
a high sorcery skill and several power foci (right SS?) I mean, with all
my foci and skill, when I throw a combat spell, I can put 21! dice into
it, not counting the dice for the spell itself! But don't ever accuse us
(Spellslinger or myself) of munchkining. We have been all playing our
characters for several years now, and we don't go on cheese runs. We,
every week, go up against major corps (nothing new there, except the
difficulty level), the Brotherhood, or other VERY BAD THINGS, like the
Cult of Cthulhu, including your friend and mine, Nyaralothotep (sp?).
And that is just to start off. We run a very high powered campaign, with
powerful enemies and powerful characters. And trust me, it is not easy.
For example, my character (the Whistler) is STILL trying to find out who
killed his fiance. And she was killed last spring. Mike (Spellslinger)
has me running around in circles, facing a foe of unknown strength and
power. So we EARN our karma.
BTW, we don't use karma pools. Our entire group thinks karma pools are
stupid, so we don't use them. Instead, we follow SRI rules on karma. So
we earn a lot of karma, but we also burn a lot of karma. Spellslinger
actually LOST karma on our last adventure!
So back off on the veiled accusations of munchkining...
Erik, a.k.a. the Whistler
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 1994 17:50:10 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Erik S Jameson <esj@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Spiking the ball.
Okay, it looks like my views are in the minority (a minority of one it
would seem). Thanks for all the references, but I still cannot bring
myself to believe it.
As far as the cancer theory goes, that doesn't really explain aging.
Aging is primarily the bodies inability to successfully reproduce it's
cells. So the cancer theory is close. But what is closer to the truth
is that the body _also_ loses it's ability to repair itself. We are
being repaired on a cellular level every second we live, until we die.
Aging is extrmeley complex, and I, not being a biologist, do not pretend
to understand more than just a fraction of it all. But to become
immortal, we would have to not only have healthy, true replication of ALL
our cells, but also be able to repair them forever. And I'm not sure
that will EVER be possible. We will be able to slow the aging process
(check out anti-oxidants; they DO work [just not as well as some claim])
to a significant degree in the coming years, but immortality? I think it
is likely that will remain the realm of religion and fiction.
Erik, a.k.a. the Whistler
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 1994 17:59:31 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Spellslinger <mruane@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: Spur question???
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410212203.AC01681@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
On Fri, 21 Oct 1994, Stephane Lafrance wrote:
> In the book, it says that... It says nothing. The only thing I
> saw, is that SPUR is singular. Now one of my players tells me it comes
> in pair (one for each hand) and I said that if he wanted to have his
> retractable spurs in each hand, he had to pay twice the price and
> essence. Is that right?
>
> Stephan
>
yeah, go for it! That's how I read the rules. I'm right handed, so I'll
only need spurs for my right hand, and since most people are single
handed and not ambidexterous, it would make sense that the printing in
the book means for only one hand. If you put on another set of spurs,
you get another .3 removed 9retractable).
Mike aka Spellslinger
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 1994 21:12:43 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Skrub <mccllstr@*****.BUCKNELL.EDU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
>unscathed. The result is, even though Will is the one with wired
>reflexes and outrageous speed, Kelly (with no increases) slaps him
>silly 4 times in a combat round.
> Sorry for the long explanation but......comments?
>
However, Will is gonna be getting a whole lot more than 3 dice. His combat
pool gets refeshed each action...
Still doesn't seem quite right, but better.
Brian McCallister The lions sing and the hills take flight.
The moon by day, and the sun by night.
Skrub Blind woman, deaf man, jackdaw fool.
Let the Lord of Chaos rule. -R. Jordan
<mccllstr@*****.bucknell.edu>
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 1994 21:17:26 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Skrub <mccllstr@*****.BUCKNELL.EDU>
Subject: Re: Spike this! (Again)
>But even with "stop-watch" genes (or whatever), the
>physical body will _eventually_ not be able to freeze the advance of
>time. It's basic biology. I can, in the framework of SRII accept unique
And it's basic classical physics which sez that a body cannot have
acceleration when no forces are being applied. We still have levitae
(whatever) spells. Two things cannot occupy the same space but the Fireball
spell does not displace the air from the sphere of the explosion it creates.
Brian McCallister The lions sing and the hills take flight.
The moon by day, and the sun by night.
Skrub Blind woman, deaf man, jackdaw fool.
Let the Lord of Chaos rule. -R. Jordan
<mccllstr@*****.bucknell.edu>
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 1994 18:17:57 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Spellslinger <mruane@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: Foci question???
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410212205.AC01681@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
On Fri, 21 Oct 1994, Stephane Lafrance wrote:
> For the magic rating AND magic pool, when I cast a fireball,
> can I combine:
>
> Power focus 4
> combat spell focus 3
> fireball focus 5
>
> Sorcery(spellcasting) 6(7)
> Base magic rating 6
>
> for a magic pool of 19
> and magic rating of 18
>
> ???????????
>
> Stephan
>
Welcome to the world of stacked foci. Throw in any ally you have for
another addition to the pool.
Mike aka Spellslinger
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 1994 21:19:36 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Skrub <mccllstr@*****.BUCKNELL.EDU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
>We discovered that a refreshed pool each action requires an unholy amount
>of dice rolling. Apache/Mad Cat has a combat pool of 17, and for combat
>spells, my magic pool is 15. We both have 4d6 init. Mad Cat's average
>init is 32 and mine is 27. Our personal addendum to the rules is to
>allow a refreshed pool every turn. Any comments?
Just as a point of reference, and a question. Do you play in Ivy's campaign?
Brian McCallister The lions sing and the hills take flight.
The moon by day, and the sun by night.
Skrub Blind woman, deaf man, jackdaw fool.
Let the Lord of Chaos rule. -R. Jordan
<mccllstr@*****.bucknell.edu>
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 1994 18:30:13 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Spellslinger <mruane@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410220120.AA05848@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
On Fri, 21 Oct 1994, Skrub wrote:
> >We discovered that a refreshed pool each action requires an unholy amount
> >of dice rolling. Apache/Mad Cat has a combat pool of 17, and for combat
> >spells, my magic pool is 15. We both have 4d6 init. Mad Cat's average
> >init is 32 and mine is 27. Our personal addendum to the rules is to
> >allow a refreshed pool every turn. Any comments?
>
> Just as a point of reference, and a question. Do you play in Ivy's campaign?
Ivy who? Mike Ivy? We don't really have a single GM campaign, it's a
roving campaign between 3 GMs.
Oh, while I've got everyone's attention:
My average Joe comment: Sorry, I meant 6 is max for the average Joe.
Bob Pedestrian has 3's across the board.
My Magic pool: Sorry again. I'm talking dice from combat spell foci and
one from a power foci. My ally helps as only Bjork can. And she can
make a mean lasagna. besides, I did specify for >>combat spells<<.
Mike aka Spellslinger
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 1994 21:33:02 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Skrub <mccllstr@*****.BUCKNELL.EDU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
>Hey, would anyone mind if I posted a chain letter here that promises
>great sex if mailed out withing 96 hours?
Actually I made a script to handle that exact chain letter once. It mails
1,500 copies of said chain letter back to the sender. And just in case the
sender then sends me 30,000 copies in return, I modifeid the script to send
out 600,000. I didn't have to use the 600,000 one though.
Brian McCallister The lions sing and the hills take flight.
The moon by day, and the sun by night.
Skrub Blind woman, deaf man, jackdaw fool.
Let the Lord of Chaos rule. -R. Jordan
<mccllstr@*****.bucknell.edu>
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 1994 18:34:48 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Erik S Jameson <esj@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410220132.AA05985@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
> My ally helps as only Bjork can. And she can
> make a mean lasagna.
>
> Mike aka Spellslinger
>
She may be able to make lasagna, but can she make a good burger? I mean,
GOOD burger?
Erik, a.k.a. the Whistler
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 1994 18:38:49 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Spellslinger <mruane@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410220133.AA05999@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
On Fri, 21 Oct 1994, Skrub wrote:
> >Hey, would anyone mind if I posted a chain letter here that promises
> >great sex if mailed out withing 96 hours?
>
> Actually I made a script to handle that exact chain letter once. It mails
> 1,500 copies of said chain letter back to the sender. And just in case the
> sender then sends me 30,000 copies in return, I modifeid the script to send
> out 600,000. I didn't have to use the 600,000 one though.
>
Hahahahahahahaha! Remind me never to send you chain letters! Or letters
period! :-)
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 1994 20:58:04 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Wesley W. Walker" <wwalker@****.UARK.EDU>
Subject: Re: Spiking the ball.
In-Reply-To: <199410220051.TAA04894@****.uark.edu>
> As far as the cancer theory goes, that doesn't really explain aging.
> Aging is primarily the bodies inability to successfully reproduce it's
> cells. So the cancer theory is close. But what is closer to the truth
> is that the body _also_ loses it's ability to repair itself. We are
> being repaired on a cellular level every second we live, until we die.
> Aging is extrmeley complex, and I, not being a biologist, do not pretend
> to understand more than just a fraction of it all. But to become
> immortal, we would have to not only have healthy, true replication of ALL
> our cells, but also be able to repair them forever. And I'm not sure
> that will EVER be possible. We will be able to slow the aging process
> (check out anti-oxidants; they DO work [just not as well as some claim])
> to a significant degree in the coming years, but immortality? I think it
> is likely that will remain the realm of religion and fiction.
Uhm...Are we all forgetting that Elves are -magical- creatures, not quite
limited to the same 'reality' limitations as humans. Sure they're
immortal, but damned if a test tube is goina tell you that.
Laters,
\|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||/
- Wes W. Walker (wwalker@****.uark.edu) * "Brother Maynard..We -
- CSCI Major and General Slave * must extracate the -
- Artiste Wanna-be (accepting donations)* truth from this un- -
- * believer on pain of -
- \\ / / * torture!! Get... the -
- \\ /\\ / * COMFY CHAIR!!!!" -
- \\/ \\/ es * -The Spanish Inquisition-
/|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||\
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 1994 19:06:02 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Spellslinger <mruane@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: 2nd Hand-fighter AGAIN!
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410202039.AA20289@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
On Thu, 20 Oct 1994, Erik S Jameson wrote:
> Okay, if second hand fighters is actually relevant, then I would suggest
> talking to Spelslinger (mruane@***.uug.arizona.edu). I think he's back
> on this list (he got bounced because of our lame computers here), but in
> case he isn't, his address is above. I mention this because he has
> written up SR stats for a good many planes and choppers. He drew his
> info from Twilight 2000, but only as a source, so there should be no
> problem for NERPS. In this way, the discussion does become relevant.
>
> Erik, a.k.a. the Whistler
>
Ok, ye, I did translate almost all of the T-2000 planes & helicopters
into SR. If you want it, it'll have to be a WWW post because it's
already in book format! Haha! But, like a good little boy, I've not the
time to deal with Copyrights & whatnot, so publication isn't
perceived...ever! Maybe later, but not right now.
BTW, most the equipment listed in there was put out by a little operation
of riggers who organied runs to retreive surplus equipment from sites all
over the world. It took about 2 years for them to get most of the stuff,
and some of the stuff actually came from trades & barters. If anyone is
interested, drop me a line.
Mike aka Spellslinger
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 00:05:58 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "J.D. Falk" <jdfalk@****.CAIS.COM>
Subject: Re: Burning Bright author?
In-Reply-To: <199410211411.KAA21327@****.cais.com>
On Fri, 21 Oct 1994, Alex van der Kleut wrote:
> I got a question for all of you psychics out there who have been talking
> about Burning Bright." Where did you get it? I just checked at our local
> bookstore, and according to their national database it's not supposed to
> be published until November. I remember someone said that it came out in
> September. Do you guys have really good sources or have you been reading
> Nerps:Shadows of the Mind to much? :)
Well, I have been reading NERPS too much, but your bookstore must
be wrong...I got it at a local gaming/comic/card/bookstore which has a
reputation for hardly ever having the new stuff in before the other gaming
stores in this area. Just dropped in for the hell of it, and it was
there, so I scarfed it up. *grin*
/-----------------\
| J.D. Falk | "You're going to that happy land
| jdfalk@****.com | to play some volleyball."
\-----------------/ -A policeman making an arrest
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 00:09:46 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "J.D. Falk" <jdfalk@****.CAIS.COM>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
In-Reply-To: <199410211557.LAA26407@****.cais.com>
On Fri, 21 Oct 1994, Wesley W. Walker wrote:
> Hey, would anyone mind if I posted a chain letter here that promises
> great sex if mailed out withing 96 hours?
Chain letters are illegal in most countries, and are not
appreciated on any mailing list or newsgroup.
Please read the appropriate netiquette documents for more
information. They are automatically posted to news.announce.newusers
each month, and can also be found many places in gopherspace and the
World Wide Web.
/-----------------\ "We all wanna be big stars,
| J.D. Falk | But we don't know why
| jdfalk@****.com | And we don't know how."
\-----------------/ -Counting Crows
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 00:13:10 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "J.D. Falk" <jdfalk@****.CAIS.COM>
Subject: Re: NERPS
In-Reply-To: <199410211649.MAA29027@****.cais.com>
On Fri, 21 Oct 1994, The Dragon wrote:
> Not To Sound Overly Stupid Or Anything, but How Does One Use
> NERPS or Is It A List Like This One.
> Meaning do I have to go get stuff from NERPS or is it sent to me?
EMail me *privately* and I'll send you the FAQ.
By the way -- if you read the ShadowRN FAQ, most of these
questions will be answered.
-------------========== J.D. Falk <jdfalk@****.com> =========-------------
| NERPS Project Leader | Assorted current NERPS project files |
| (Editor & General Motivator) | ftp://cais.com/pub/jdfalk/nerps-proj |
----------------========== Finger for Geek Code ==========----------------
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 1994 23:28:45 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Wesley W. Walker" <wwalker@****.UARK.EDU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
In-Reply-To: <199410220409.XAA21667@****.uark.edu>
Geeze...It was a *joke*, guys! Catch a clue! *throws a clue for you guys*
The mail message was deleted a LONG time ago.
\||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||/
- Wes W. Walker (wwalker@****.uark.edu) * "Truth is well disguised lie and -
- CSCI Major and General Slave * never immediately apparent." -
- Artiste Wanna-be (accepting donations)* -Me -
/||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||\
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 00:48:15 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Malcalypse The Younger <shadow@******.NET>
Subject: Re: Spike this! (Again)
In-Reply-To: <9410210508.AA29610@ IntNet.net>
On Thu, 20 Oct 1994, Erik S Jameson wrote:
[Stuff about immortal elves deleted]
If you want a good list of proof, check out the EarthDawn FAQ, under the
crossover proofs. It gives a decent list of places to look for elven
immortality, as well as connections between the 4th and 6th Worlds.
Shadow@******.net
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 00:55:24 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Malcalypse The Younger <shadow@******.NET>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
In-Reply-To: <9410210543.AA00230@ IntNet.net>
On Thu, 20 Oct 1994, Jason Carter, Nightstalker wrote:
> > If you're firing two weapons, I would think that having two
> >points of red light would still make it easier than pointing the gun
> >at the target (never having fired two at once, I wouldn't know but..)
>
> First of all, your smartgun link is in one hand. Thus it works for one
> gun. Secondly, if you had two red lights, which is which gun?
So? I want to hit some one twice in the same general area. I see two
little red dots in that area. Who cares which is which weapon? I can see
losing the bonus on an aimed shot (unless they are both aimed shot to the
same area?)
>
> >3) Speaking of Melee combat, the way I have read it, Any initiative
> >bonuses are completely worthless. Please kick me if I have gotten it
> >wrong but:
> >Will Wired has an Initiative of 12+4d6 and an Unarmed of 3.
> >Kelly Karate has an Initiative of 4+1d6 and a Karate of 8.
>
[COmbat example deleted]
>
> Two things:
>
> 1) Your example is extreme. If the skill levels were closer the result
> would be different.
>
> 2) Your forgetting Combat Pools. Will gets to use his combat pool twice
> while Kelly gets to use it once.
>
Also, if Will happened to be using a gun of some sort, things would be
very different. Why in the world would someone with say, a white belt, go
up against a 2nd degree black belt hand to hand? They wouldn't. They
would take thier Assault Cannon or whatever and blow them away at range.
Then that initiative bonus is VERY usefull. (ie, I shoot you twice, you
get your combat pool only once, you are probably hurt... and then you TNs
all go up, etc.) That's where those initiative bonuses are good.
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 00:40:26 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Wow, Reality. That's a switch" <MHILLIARD@****.ALBION.EDU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
> Actually I made a script to handle that exact chain letter once. It mails
> 1,500 copies of said chain letter back to the sender. And just in case the
> sender then sends me 30,000 copies in return, I modifeid the script to send
> out 600,000. I didn't have to use the 600,000 one though.
Hey, I don't suppose you could make that available to the public? I could
use that! *evil grin*
Phelan
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 01:23:50 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Malcalypse The Younger <shadow@******.NET>
Subject: Re: Spiked Dwarves
In-Reply-To: <9410210831.AA03676@ IntNet.net>
Ok. This is the premise of my campaign:
The runners start in Tir Na nOg, Belfast to be exact. They were limited
to priority C or lower for resources (They're comming up off the streets
for thier first run). The characters that we ended up with were: 2
Physical Adepts. One of these is on the Path of the Warrior. He is a
TRC (Tir Republican Corp) agent who is basically 'slumming' for a while
to see what new things are going on in the Belfast area. The other Phys
Ad. was trained in a Dun by a very old elven weapons mistress (so far
he's not sure if she's immortal or a spike baby [and niether am I]).
There is one street sam. who uses only ancient type weapons (DiKote
sword, and Dikote arrows [which ate almost all his starting money]) and
one wolf shaman. All are elven (not such a great thing in Belfast, but
it was thier choice..)
Thier first 'run':
A bartender they all knew asked them to escort some visitor from out of
town around for a while. They were to keep them safe, and show them
anything they wanted to see, within reason. The runners showed up the
next morning to see a Phaeton (the first any of them had ever seen)
pulling away from the curb of the bar. When they went inside, there were
two unfamiliar men, and thier contact. One of the men was an American,
obviously cybered. The other man was an older Asian gentelman. No
detectable cyberware. Astral showed only some minor headware.
They were given a van to shw thier guests around town in. The two men
gave seemingly random directions for a while, though they seemed to stay
in the waterfront district mnost of the time. The next day it was the
same, seemingly random places, including some historically prominent
places. On the third day they said they wanted to watch the Isle of man
ferry terminal. The runners started to wonder what, exactly, was up. They
started asking questions...
The next day, when they picked up the two gentelmen, the American was
carrying a rather large briefcase, as was the Asian. They asked the
runners to park the van in line-of-site of the ferry terminal, and then
asked them to leave. The runners volunteered to help the pair out with
whatever they were doing.... And the pair agreed. They told them they
were going to assassinate someone (The runners had figured this out
already) when asked who, they were shown a picture of a middle age elf in
court robes. (This is when the runners started to get very bad feelings
about this) Several of them decided to try and protect this noble, though
they certainly didn't tell the Johnson's this. They watched the Asiatic
man take out a sofisticated looking cyberdeck, and jack into a cellular
link, and the American take out a high powered sniper rifle. They were
told to be clear of the van, because the tow men did not expect to live
through the encounter... (this also worried the runners) Anyway, they
were told to scatter as soon as the target went down.
As soon as the late ferry arrived, everyone was set up. The Physical
Adepts were concealed near the walkway, the shaman was mingling with the
crowds, and our Sammie was concealed in an alleyway nearby. The Shaman
was Astrally perciving through most of this.
When the target appeared (last off the ferry, accompanied by several
gaurds) he was hit by the rifleman before anyone else could act. He went
down (very down, even with a rating 6 physical barrier up, he took D+2
after body roll + combat pool). There was a scattered firefight with the
gaurds, but after only 2 turns, the sound of LAVs was heard (that's FAST)
and the runners scattered. The first target hit by the Banshees was
somehow the van... (this is where the runners get suspicious again)
While the shaman was astrally percieving she noticed a strange
fluctuation in the astral around the target as he was hit, but could not
identify it.
The TRC was swarming over the area within a few more seconds. That
evening there was no mention of the incident on the evening news....
We'll see how it goes from here. I should be running this again later
today, so I'll let you know.
PS: Sorry if you don't like long posts, but you can always stop
reading....
PPS: All coments welcome, direct flames to /dev/null.
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 01:29:49 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Malcalypse The Younger <shadow@******.NET>
Subject: Re: Elves (Was RE: Spike This!)
In-Reply-To: <9410211421.AB24403@ IntNet.net>
On Fri, 21 Oct 1994, Stainless Steel Rat wrote:
> As opposed to their counterparts in Celtic myths, the Seelie and Unseelie
> Courts, which were sort-of adapted into Shadowrun (Tir Tairngire being the
> Seelie Court, and Tir'na Nogth [or however you want to spell it because
> they're all valid] the Unseelie Court). So what about the Fiana Sidhe? :)
Actually the Warriors of Fian just may end up re-apperaing in my
campaign... I'll let you know if I ever work anything out about it... :)
>
> --
> Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> |Do not use Happy Fun Ball on concrete.
> http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox|
> PGP Public Key: Ask for one today! |
>
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 01:37:53 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Malcalypse The Younger <shadow@******.NET>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
In-Reply-To: <9410211815.AA01629@ IntNet.net>
> Marc (don't tell my that YOUR characters have 300+ karma pools!)
Ugh. My oldest character has a karma pool of around 24 dice (which, I
believe is very large). This is also a character that has been played
sporadicaly since long before the 2nd Ed. eules came out.... He's going
in to retirement very soon now (just one more run....) and I'm going to
start a new character... Sigh. Oh well.
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 15:41:53 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Antarctica
In-Reply-To: <199410211356.XAA26697@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Alex van der
Kleut" at Oct 21, 94 09:49:19 am
> If you can use Mosaic, etc., check out the Cyberpunk 2020 home page. It
> has a pretty cool article on Antarctica 2020, although it looks like it
> was cut off. A few interesting corps in there too.
Where is the CP 2020 home page?
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 15:44:43 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
In-Reply-To: <199410211556.BAA28980@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Michel
Racine"
at Oct 21, 94 11:47:42 am
Racine writes:
> But I'll still add the +2 target number for the second firearm.
> It'a an idea, what 'da think?.
Yep, if someone wanted to munchkinise everything so much that they could
fire two smartlinked weapons simultaneously and receives both smartlink
modidfiers, I'd make it awful difficult for them. The encalphen (sp?, which
is from shadowtech I think), and the skillwire requirements would be quite
appropriate I think, and a +2 on the second firearm goes down well with me.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 15:49:59 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
In-Reply-To: <199410211629.CAA29660@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Adi Marcus"
at
Oct 21, 94 06:19:15 pm
Life Is Hell(?) writes:
> I have never been pleased with the HTH rules of FASA.
> so this is a system that has served me well in the past:
> a hand strike does (STR)L damage and is considered a simple action.
> a kick does (STR+2)M and is considered +1 for reach (trolls +1 aren't
> commulative with the kick +1 , they simply have +1 for their hands as
> well as for their legs (remember the hand\body lengs ratio of a troll))
> all melee weapons of 0 reach require a simple action.
> all melee weapons greater then 0 reach require a complex action to use.
I like these rules; they also solve the problem of not being able to draw a
melee weapon and use it in the same action (which stops many of my players
using melee weapons which are, I have to admit, great fun).
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 15:52:56 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Spiked Dwarves
In-Reply-To: <199410211644.CAA00020@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Robert A.
Hayden" at Oct 21, 94 11:34:26 am
Our Fearless Leader writes:
> > > Adam wrote:
> > ^^^^
> > > > PS. Is there any interest in me posting the adventure ideas that I'm
> > > > either run my characters through or what I'm planning? (None of them
have
> > > > net access, so they wouldn't be able to see this stuff)
> >
> > I didn't write the above. ;-)
>
> If you read the attributions, it will show that you were quoting someone
> else.
Um, you sure? If you cut away all the excess ">", then it comes down to:
Adam wrote:
> PS. Is...
Now that seems like it implies that Adam wrote "PS. Is..." to me.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 16:02:48 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: planes
In-Reply-To: <199410211736.DAA08675@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Matt
Fullenwider" at Oct 21, 94 10:35:52 am
Matt writes:
> You should read the SR novel "Shadowplay." It tells why technology usn't
> as far ahead as it should be in the future. Remember the crash of 2029?
> A LOT was lost in that!
Well, that still leaves about 25 years until the crash. An _awful_ lot of
technology is going to be developed between now and then, and the crash
won't iradicate that. Think of the technological differences between the
moderne world (1994) and the 1970's, and that's the difference we should be
seeing _minimum_ between now and 2055. The only area where the difference is
even apparent is cyberware, and matrix tech.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 16:04:55 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: A debate from Tucson
In-Reply-To: <199410212343.JAA24885@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Nightfox"
at Oct
21, 94 04:42:28 pm
Nightfox writes:
> Actually, I can see using Athletics for AUGMENTING a strength roll. You can do
> it with athletics pertaining to running (dexterity)- I don't see why you can't
> do it with strength and listing. By the way - the specialization for lifting
> is lifting -- read the description for Athletics.
>
> Athletics/lifting - you know how to correctly position yourself, steal yourself
> to the weight, use your weight to help, and use all of your msucles in your body
> to help you lift.
>
> People who do power lifting work a lot in technique - my cousin do it for a
> while.
You are absoluetly correct there. To be one of these "oh so great" weight
lifters, or whatever, you would need both a high base attribute, and, in
order to be as successful as you are, a high appropriate skill.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 16:08:08 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
In-Reply-To: <199410220131.LAA26482@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from
"Spellslinger" at
Oct 21, 94 06:30:13 pm
Mike writes:
> Ivy who? Mike Ivy? We don't really have a single GM campaign, it's a
> roving campaign between 3 GMs.
You mean you don't know who Ivy is? You are deprived my child. BTW, does
anyone know if Ivy is going to get back onto the 'net? I miss my flame wars
with Ivy <grin>.
Perhaps a mention of the most illustrious personalities on the list (or
ex-on the list) should be made in the FAQ? Many of the references to people
I do not grasp, and I wouldn't mind knowing a little history of the list
myself.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 16:10:05 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: 2nd Hand-fighter AGAIN!
In-Reply-To: <199410220207.MAA27023@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from
"Spellslinger" at
Oct 21, 94 07:06:02 pm
Mike writes:
> Ok, ye, I did translate almost all of the T-2000 planes & helicopters
> into SR. If you want it, it'll have to be a WWW post because it's
> already in book format! Haha! But, like a good little boy, I've not the
> time to deal with Copyrights & whatnot, so publication isn't
> perceived...ever! Maybe later, but not right now.
Well, you've got me interested, SR could do with a few extra vehicles,
particularily hi-tech futuristic ones.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 16:16:11 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Spiked Dwarves
In-Reply-To: <199410220527.PAA29690@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Malcalypse The
Younger" at Oct 22, 94 01:23:50 am
Malcalypse The Younger writes:
> The TRC was swarming over the area within a few more seconds. That
> evening there was no mention of the incident on the evening news....
>
> We'll see how it goes from here. I should be running this again later
> today, so I'll let you know.
Cool run idea. I like it, and I'd be pleased to hear the next installment.
You have a good imagination there.
BTW, what is "TRC", or am I asking a dumb question?
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 02:19:46 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Malcalypse The Younger <shadow@******.NET>
Subject: Re: Spiked Dwarves
In-Reply-To: <9410220613.AA20952@ IntNet.net>
On Sat, 22 Oct 1994, Damion Milliken wrote:
> Malcalypse The Younger writes:
>
> > The TRC was swarming over the area within a few more seconds. That
> > evening there was no mention of the incident on the evening news....
> >
> > We'll see how it goes from here. I should be running this again later
> > today, so I'll let you know.
>
> Cool run idea. I like it, and I'd be pleased to hear the next installment.
> You have a good imagination there.
>
> BTW, what is "TRC", or am I asking a dumb question?
>
Thanks. TRC is the Tir Republican Corp. the military elite on the Tir
folks. Most/many of them a re magically active as either Sorcery Adepts
or Phys. Ads. Very tough people.
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 01:55:36 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Robert A. Hayden" <hayden@*******.MANKATO.MSUS.EDU>
Subject: Re: Be cool and tell me what is...
In-Reply-To: <199410212336.SAA27865@*******.mankato.msus.edu>
On Fri, 21 Oct 1994, Nightfox wrote:
> Hey Rob, why was it that we sent you gummy bears anyway?
Somebody hacked into my krypton account and deleted all my files and I
went mad for a few days.
____ Robert A. Hayden <=> hayden@*******.mankato.msus.edu
\ /__ -=-=-=-=- <=> -=-=-=-=-
\/ / Finger for Geek Code Info <=> I do not necessarily speak for the
\/ Finger for PGP Public Key <=> City of Mankato or anyone else
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GJ/CM d- H-- s-:++>s-:+ g+ p? au+ a- w++ v* C++(++++) UL++++$
P+>++ L++$ 3- E---- N+++ K+++ W M+ V-- -po+(---)>$ Y++ t+ 5+++
j R+++$ G- tv+ b+ D+ B--- e+>++(*) u** h* f r-->+++ !n y++**
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 05:26:01 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Doctor Doom <jch8169@*******.TAMU.EDU>
Subject: IN CELEBRATION OF AN ANNIVERSARY!!! HEAR YE, HEAR YE!!!
Meine Kameraden!
Today is a very special day ...
Today we celebrate the SECOND YEAR ANNIVERSARY of the venerable THWAP ...
As a short profile, included below is the definition of th THWAP as per the
ShadowRN Frequently Asked Questions document, as authored by myself:
THWAP
The sound a wet carp makes when someone is struck with it; also
the act of striking someone with a wet carp.
The term was first used in the latter part of the year the list became
operational, when our Fearless Leader, Robert Hayden, was experiencing
considerable problems with his mailer, such that all were receiving
several copies of EVERY posting he dispatched.
Howls of discontent were heard across the node. Tempers were raised.
Flames were exchanged.
On Thursday, 22 October 1992 (21:03:17 CET), Hayden, in an attempt to
soothe the raising ire of the other members as well as offer an
apology, infused a bit of levity in his requesting pardon for the
inconvenience, to wit:
"You can thwap me with a wet carp if it will make you feel better."
And thus the concept was born. Immediately many list members latched
upon this rather novel idea. The first actual THWAP was invoked by
Doctor Doom on 22 October 1992, 15:31:00 CST*, rapidly followed by
Harlequin and Flare. A legend was begun ...
Since then, its has been used so frequently that the idea took on a
life of its own, and it is now a legitimate term, even if only jargon.
Thwaps are generally brought to bear upon especially bizarre, silly, or
Munchkinous ideas, although their invocation usually indicates a degree
of levity and good-spiritedness. Thwaps are not meant for spite--that
purpose is served by flames.
* Technically, this initial sighting was of not a purebred member of
the species and as such the heritage and relation has been subjected
to no small measure of scrutiny, giving rise to the designation of
Cro-Magnon THWAP or simply TWAP. Despite the controversy, there can
be little doubt that this individual was, indeed, the progenitor of
the later THWAP race ... the first "modern" specimen of which was
invoked by Doctor Doom on Tuesday, 24 November 1992, at 2:45:19 CET.
From a slightly less historical bent, here is a eulogy,
authored by our own endearingly demented Daniel Waisley:
---
'May the Exulted Thwapp continue to prosper as a symbol of levity and good humor
on this list. May it bring us back slightly to reality every so often, but
still keep us in the blissful realm of fantasy where we long to be. May it also
bring back shards of rememberance for all of the wonderful times it has given
this list, and continue to remind us that if we take ourselves too seriously we
will probably all get ulsers. May the THWAPP grow old and stink greatly
thereby becoming even more effective.'
And now for your enjoyment. From the heated vaults, were it has been slowly
decaying over the past year, I bring you the first THWAPP that was created by
our on Honorable Herr DOOM, which was actually a twap!!, but would soon evolve
into our beloved symbol of Humor.
TTTTTTTT WW WW AAAAAA PPPPPPP !! !!
TT WW WW WW AA AA PP PP !! !!
TT WW WWWW WW AAAAAAAA PPPPPPP !! !!
TT WWWW WWWW AA AA PP !! !!
TT WW WW AA AA PP .. ..
*WET CARP NOISE*
Well, I feel sooo much better now.
Colonel Count von Hohenzollern und von Doom, DMSc, DSc, PhD.
Doom Technologies, Inc. & Dark Thought Publications
>>> Working on solutions best left in the dark.
<<<
[ Doctor Doom : jch8169@****.tamu.edu ]
RUN AWAY - IT STINKS WORSE THEN I THOUGHT!!!!!!!!!!!
---
I thank you for your time...
And for those of you who shall be going out this evening, do raise a glass in
the memory, in celebration of, the THWAP...
Colonel Count von Hohenzollern und von Doom, DMSc, DSc, PhD.
Doom Technologies & Weapon Systems -- Dark Thought Publications
>>> Working on solutions best left in the dark.
<<<
[ Doctor Doom : jch8169@*******.tamu.edu ]
^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^
INSANITY: It is all in your mind.
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 10:18:17 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Tim Skirvin <tskirvin@***.UIUC.EDU>
Subject: Re: planes
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.bitnet@***.cso.uiuc.edu>
In-Reply-To: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.edu.au> "Re: planes" (Oct 22,
4:02pm)
> technology is going to be developed between now and then, and the
> crash
> won't iradicate that. Think of the technological differences
> between the
It didn't destroy it all, but it DID lower the tech standard by more
than 10 years. They lost lots of stuff they had before.
--
Tim Skirvin (tskirvin@***.uiuc.edu)
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 10:20:50 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Tim Skirvin <tskirvin@***.UIUC.EDU>
Subject: Re: IN CELEBRATION OF AN ANNIVERSARY!!! HEAR YE, HEAR YE!!!
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.bitnet@***.cso.uiuc.edu>
In-Reply-To: Doctor Doom <jch8169@*******.TAMU.EDU> "IN CELEBRATION OF AN
ANNIVERSARY!!! HEAR YE, HEAR YE!!!" (Oct 22, 5:26am)
> And for those of you who shall be going out this evening, do raise
> a glass in the memory, in celebration of, the THWAP...
A glass?
Why not raise a wet carp?
*THWAP on the nearest lurker*
--
Tim Skirvin (tskirvin@***.uiuc.edu)
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 01:23:06 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: planes
In-Reply-To: <199410221518.BAA04958@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Tim
Skirvin" at
Oct 22, 94 10:18:17 am
Tim writes:
> > technology is going to be developed between now and then, and the
> > crash
> > won't iradicate that. Think of the technological differences
> > between the
>
> It didn't destroy it all, but it DID lower the tech standard by more
> than 10 years. They lost lots of stuff they had before.
Well, thats almost 20 years advanced over us, plus the advances in the years
after the crash, that makes a total of about thirty. I think the tech level
is still too low, and the only reason for it I can see is Rats(?) argument
about one-shot-one-kill, which is all too likely in a high-tech environment.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 10:37:58 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Tim Skirvin <tskirvin@***.UIUC.EDU>
Subject: Re: planes
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.bitnet@***.cso.uiuc.edu>
In-Reply-To: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.edu.au> "Re: planes" (Oct 23,
1:23am)
> Well, thats almost 20 years advanced over us, plus the advances in
> the years after the crash, that makes a total of about thirty. I
> think the tech level
Subtract some more.
VITAS made them work on getting that cured. They spent a LOT of time
on that. There goes tech research in that area (while it did probably help
in other areas, I'll admit...)
Riots in Chicago. There goes lots of stuff there. Who knows WHAT
was being stored in the Sears Tower?
Lots of revolutions. Instability everywhere, including the UCAS.
Less ability to research stuff. Less coordination in researching stuff when
the corps start taking over the stuff.
The corps are killing off each others' scientists, too.
All in all, I can see plenty of advances, but not as much as there
was previously.
(Beyond that, what more do you want exactly? What kinds of tech?)
--
Tim Skirvin (tskirvin@***.uiuc.edu)
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 14:54:57 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Marc A Renouf <jormung@*****.UMICH.EDU>
Subject: Re: A debate from Tucson
In-Reply-To: <199410211914.PAA23592@*****.engin.umich.edu>
Rat writes\; [don't invent a new game mechanic to cover lifting]
First, I didn't "invent" it. It's already in the rules. See the
description of the Athletics skill in the skill list, and the section on
"Hauling the Load" for more details.
Second, your strength is by far the largest contribution to how
much you can lift, so the gymnast won't be able to lift as much with a
strength of 4 as a weigthlifter with a strength of 6. Even with a
strewngth of 5 (most of the gymnasts I know are pretty damn strong) you
still have to make up at least 20 kilos to cover the difference in
strength alone. That would require a skill of 20+ !!! That's unlikely.
Third, if you look at how much someone with a strength of 6 can
lift (maximum) it's pretty damn impressive. at least 120 kilos! That's
not counting the extra 6D6 they get for maximum lift or any successes
they might get on an Athletic/Lifting skill roll. Someone with a
"paltry" skill of six and a decent athletics skill can lift in excess of
500 pounds! I will grant that some people are extreme cases, but even a
strength of 7 gives them a HUGE advantage over someone with a strength
of 6. Mr. Universe may be gigantico huge and have a strength of 7, but
anything above that is just losing the scale of the game.
I can offer you your own advice. Don't invent a new mechanic.
Racial maximum of 6 is there for a reason and it's silly to play around
with the averages. It's not even necessary. Remember that skills are
there to represent training, hard work, and experience. You don't NEED
to jack around the stats to get the desired result.
Marc
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 15:20:24 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Marc A Renouf <jormung@*****.UMICH.EDU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
In-Reply-To: <199410220038.UAA10123@*****.engin.umich.edu>
On Fri, 21 Oct 1994, Erik S Jameson wrote:
> actually LOST karma on our last adventure!
Yep. This is a regular occurrence with us, too.
> So back off on the veiled accusations of munchkining...
Touchy! Touchy! I was not making "veiled accusations" about
anything. I was saying that we have different styles of playing. I'm
not saying that you are a "munchkin" or that you are a power-hungry gamer
who gets his karma for free. I just said it was different. For what you
guys are doing, it would appear as though a magic attribute of 21 is
almost necessary. So lighten up.
Marc
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 15:03:52 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Nightfox <DJWA@******.UCC.NAU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Be cool and tell me what is...
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu
>> Hey Rob, why was it that we sent you gummy bears anyway?
>
>Somebody hacked into my krypton account and deleted all my files and I
>went mad for a few days.
ah, now I remember, it was a pretty depressing event.
Nightfox
gummy bears, bouncing here and there and everywhere
High adventure thats beyond compare.
We are the gummy bears.
BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!
Daniel Waisley + SCA - March of Ered Sul - Flagstaff AZ
DJWA@******.UCC.NAU.EDU + Nau fencing club.
"Nightfox" + Brotherhood of the Cryptic Demesne -household
BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!BOINGEE!!!
Geek code V2.1 GE d-? H++ s+:->++: g+ p? !au(-) a21! w++ v+* C++$(++++)
U(-) p? L !3 E? N K- W M+ V+ -po+(---) Y+ t+ 5+++! j-x R+(++) G' tv
b+(+++) D(+) B--- e+ u+*(++)(**) h(*) f+(*) r-->+++ !n- y+*>++
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 15:06:13 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Nightfox <DJWA@******.UCC.NAU.EDU>
Subject: Re: IN CELEBRATION OF AN ANNIVERSARY!!! HEAR YE, HEAR YE!!!
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu
>From a slightly less historical bent, here is a eulogy,
>authored by our own endearingly demented Daniel Waisley:
thank you. :)
>'May the Exulted Thwapp continue to prosper as a symbol of levity and good humor
>on this list. May it bring us back slightly to reality every so often, but
>still keep us in the blissful realm of fantasy where we long to be. May it also
>bring back shards of rememberance for all of the wonderful times it has given
>this list, and continue to remind us that if we take ourselves too seriously we
>will probably all get ulsers. May the THWAPP grow old and stink greatly
>thereby becoming even more effective.'
ya know - it wasn't until I read that last line there, that I even remembered
writing the bloody thing. I must have been really waxing poetic that day.
> Colonel Count von Hohenzollern und von Doom, DMSc, DSc, PhD.
> INSANITY: It is all in your mind.
yep, and it enjoyable
Nightfox
=========================================================================
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 1994 22:45:51 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Jon Hughes <hughesjo@******.LUTHER.EDU>
Subject: Payment
I was wondering if anyone has ever come up with a good method of decieding how much to pay
characters for a run. I know all about the Karma and all, just curious about the money
side.
Thanx
Jon Hughes
hughesjo@******.luther.edu
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 16:35:13 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: planes
In-Reply-To: <199410221538.BAA05088@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Tim
Skirvin" at
Oct 22, 94 10:37:58 am
Tim writes:
> Subtract some more.
OK, I suppose there are a few other things which could be considered.
> VITAS made them work on getting that cured. They spent a LOT of time
> on that. There goes tech research in that area (while it did probably help
> in other areas, I'll admit...)
Yeah, a worldwide epidemic on the scale of the black plague could have a few
adverse effects.
> Riots in Chicago. There goes lots of stuff there. Who knows WHAT
> was being stored in the Sears Tower?
Personally I couldn't see this having much of an effect at all. But then
again I don't know Chicago, so I can't really say.
> Lots of revolutions. Instability everywhere, including the UCAS.
> Less ability to research stuff. Less coordination in researching stuff when
> the corps start taking over the stuff.
A few collapses of world governments might somewhat set things back I guess.
> The corps are killing off each others' scientists, too.
I'd only rate this as nominal.
> All in all, I can see plenty of advances, but not as much as there
> was previously.
The Awakening might've thrown the world into turmoil for a few years too I
imagine.
But do remember, the technology curve is on the increase, so what occurs
over a five year period nowadays is perhaps equal to the advances occuring
over a longer period in the past. I can't see the increase in the curve
slowing down too much.
All in all I spose we can expect advances for maybe a quarter of the time
gone by, which would be about 15 years or so. When one looks at what we do
have in the SR world, I guess the few meager (or not so in a couple of
cases) advances might be sufficient to pass.
> (Beyond that, what more do you want exactly? What kinds of tech?)
Beats me. One day when either I've travelled to the year 2055, or when we
actually get there, I'll tell you :-)
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 16:38:07 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: A debate from Tucson
In-Reply-To: <199410221913.FAA25289@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Marc A
Renouf"
at Oct 22, 94 02:54:57 pm
Marc writes:
> I can offer you your own advice. Don't invent a new mechanic.
> Racial maximum of 6 is there for a reason and it's silly to play around
> with the averages. It's not even necessary. Remember that skills are
> there to represent training, hard work, and experience. You don't NEED
> to jack around the stats to get the desired result.
Well, do remember that FASA (no $) has set us a precedence. Every now and
then you come across an NPC with stats of 7 or 8, so I can see nothing wrong
with having PCs on the same kind of scale. After all, PCs are special.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 16:57:34 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Payment
In-Reply-To: <199410230351.NAA29802@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Jon Hughes"
at
Oct 22, 94 10:45:51 pm
Jon writes:
> I was wondering if anyone has ever come up with a good method of decieding
> how much to pay characters for a run. I know all about the Karma and all,
> just curious about the money side.
This I think depends more on your gaming style than does karma awards.
Myself I award what most others would probably think is ludicrous amounts of
cash for runs, and others out there award what I would consider below the
amount needed for a runner to actually stay alive.
Ivy once posted a not too bad suggestion for cash awards, I'll have a go at
recreating the gist of it for you.
Newbe runners/simple jobs (simple bodyguarding, roughing up, low threat
situations) - 3000-7000 depending on threat level.
Low end runners/minor corp jobs (data snatches on not so important corps,
bodyguarding of someone more important, attacks on better defended
opposition, middle threat operations) - 7000-25000, again varying on the
threat level.
Average runners/mid-range corp jobs (runs against subsidiaries of the big 8,
attacks on enemies requiring careful planning and operation, runs involving
anyone relatively well known in their field - eg trid stars, successful
scientists -, runs on well trained and equipped opponents) - 25000-60000,
once again it will vary with threat.
High end runners/big 8 runs (basically anything invloving one or more of the
big 8 corps, whether for or against, involvement with very well known
people, runs requiring special skills or low publicity, high threat
operations) - 60000-100000+
Legend status runners/urban legend making runs (anything deeply effecting a
major megacorp, a very public personality, an unique threat to a population,
a massive manouver with large scale repercussions) - 100000-1000000+
As an average I would recommend about 35000 or so for a run (mine tend
towards the 50000, but as I said, I run a high neyen campaign). If you are
running an Ivy style game, then the last two catagories will be for you.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 09:46:08 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Tim Skirvin <tskirvin@***.UIUC.EDU>
Subject: Re: planes
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.bitnet@***.cso.uiuc.edu>
In-Reply-To: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.edu.au> "Re: planes" (Oct 23,
4:35pm)
> have in the SR world, I guess the few meager (or not so in a couple
> of cases) advances might be sufficient to pass.
Actually, when you think about it, it's not THAT bad.
The biggest advances are, of course, in cybernetics and biotech. The
matrix stuff is probably even logical from what we're at now, in about 15
years.
Cybertech was worked on a lot because of the Crash.
Biotech was worked on a lot for VITAS.
It would make sense that these were the biggest advances.
(There are also probably more military advancements that we don't
know about yet...)
--
Tim Skirvin (tskirvin@***.uiuc.edu)
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 11:40:31 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Matt Hufstetler <gt2778a@*****.GATECH.EDU>
Subject: Missing Blood(Was Re: Payment)
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@******.GATECH.EDU
In-Reply-To: <199410230657.CAA26800@*****.gatech.edu> from "Damion
Milliken"
at Oct 23, 94 04:57:34 pm
Has anyone had a group of characters bail out of Missing Blood when they
found out how high the threat was, because the payment wasn't high enough?
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 11:12:54 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Robert A. Hayden" <hayden@*******.MANKATO.MSUS.EDU>
Subject: The Aliens are coming
While watching The X-files on Friday, I say a preview for the upcoming
Alien Nation movie (Teusday, 8pm EST). [Alien Nation was, IMHO, one of
the BEST sci-fi television shows in history, even though the movie pretty
much sucked].
Anyways, I got to thinking while watching the commercial "What would the
effect of a similiar situation be to a SR world?"
For those not familiar with Alien Nation, here is a very brief rundown:
A space ship arrives at or crashes on Earth. The occupants are
escaped slaves from an "evil empire" of some kind. After a long time,
these "newcomers" are integrated into society. This, of course, makes the
world worse because Newcomers are stronger, faster, smarter and have
customs and biologies (a whole season was devoted to one couple having a
child, and the male is the on that gives birth) that are far different
than humans. "Skags" becomes the derogatory term for these aliens and it
truly becomes a racist world. (Rent the movie if you haven't seen, even
though it isn't as good as the series).
Anyways, what would happen if a ship of aliens in a similiar situation
landed in 21st century Shadowrun. These aliens are stronger, faster,
smart. They can adapt to cyberware more readily than humans. They can
wield magic better and in more frightful ways than any Terran native
can. New racism makes that directed at meta-humans look like a gentle
ribbing at a family reunion.
I don't want to debate the movie Alien Nation, per se. I'd just like to
get some ideas about what effect this would have on the Shadowrun World.
____ Robert A. Hayden <=> hayden@*******.mankato.msus.edu
\ /__ -=-=-=-=- <=> -=-=-=-=-
\/ / Finger for Geek Code Info <=> I do not necessarily speak for the
\/ Finger for PGP Public Key <=> City of Mankato or anyone else
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GJ/CM d- H-- s-:++>s-:+ g+ p? au+ a- w++ v* C++(++++) UL++++$
P+>++ L++$ 3- E---- N+++ K+++ W M+ V-- -po+(---)>$ Y++ t+ 5+++
j R+++$ G- tv+ b+ D+ B--- e+>++(*) u** h* f r-->+++ !n y++**
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 11:31:23 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Tim Skirvin <tskirvin@***.UIUC.EDU>
Subject: Re: The Aliens are coming
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.bitnet@***.cso.uiuc.edu>
In-Reply-To: "Robert A. Hayden" <hayden@*******.MANKATO.MSUS.EDU>
"The Aliens
are coming" (Oct 23, 11:12am)
> the BEST sci-fi television shows in history, even though the movie
> pretty much sucked].
Never watched it much. I probably should have, but then again I
believe I was 10...
> Anyways, I got to thinking while watching the commercial "What
> would the effect of a similiar situation be to a SR world?"
Can we say "Invae"?
<grin>
I wouldn't see THAT many changes. Everyone's already geared for it,
at least a little. The Humanis groups would change their focus, and such, but
in general the racism wouldn't be as bad as in Alien Nation.
Not that it wouldn't be there, of course...
(What I want to know is how the Great Dragons would think of it).
--
Tim Skirvin (tskirvin@***.uiuc.edu)
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 17:40:44 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Micah Levy <M.Levy@**.UCL.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Missing Blood(Was Re: Payment)
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Sun, 23 Oct 94 11:40:31 -0400."
While I do not pay my runners large amounts in general, when they ran
Missing Blood, I knew that they simply would not carry on without further
incentive, so Danial became a more middle-ranked executive,Blood became an
entire jewellery set and the money offered to them was, I think upped to
10,000.
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
||Micah Levy Department of Computer Science ||
|| University College London ||
||Web Page: http://www.cs.ucl.ac.uk/people/zcacma0.html ||
||Email: M.Levy@**.ucl.ac.uk Cestor@******.com ||
|| zcacma0@**.ucl.ac.uk Micah@******.com ||
|| GCS d--@ H s g+(-) p? au--(+)>++ a- w v++ C++++($) UV++(-) P- L- 3 E-||
|| N++ K W++ M+ V-- -po+ Y++ t+ 5-- jx R++ G+(----) tv b+++ D+ B--- e+ u- ||
|| h- f n+ y? ||
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 17:47:37 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Micah Levy <M.Levy@**.UCL.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: The Aliens are coming
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Sun, 23 Oct 94 11:12:54 EST."
Hmm...Horror Fodder.
Or maybe they would be of some use against them....
After all, They are on Their way now!
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 13:07:54 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Spellslinger <mruane@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: Antarctica
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410220543.AA09079@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
Sorry about posting this here, but I was wondering if:
a) you could use Mosaic from your home computer (without a network) and
b) if you can use it, how DO you use it? I've got Mosiac 9shared) for
the Mac. Any help?
Mike
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 15:18:13 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Matt <mosbun@******.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: Re: Missing Blood(Was Re: Payment)
I took a slightly different approach. I completely hid what was really
going on until it was too late to back out. No one got any info about what
was really going on, and the basement of the chapterhouse was warded. Dirty?
Maybe, but the looks on the players' faces were worth it.
Matt
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Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 16:14:41 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "J.D. Falk" <jdfalk@****.CAIS.COM>
Subject: Re: The Aliens are coming
In-Reply-To: <199410231619.MAA25593@****.cais.com>
On Sun, 23 Oct 1994, Robert A. Hayden wrote:
> While watching The X-files on Friday, I say a preview for the upcoming
> Alien Nation movie (Teusday, 8pm EST). [Alien Nation was, IMHO, one of
> the BEST sci-fi television shows in history, even though the movie pretty
> much sucked].
Agreed...and, don't lose hope! The series can still be seen on
the Sci-Fi Channel here in North America (from the looks of most of their
advertisements, they aren't transmitting to anyplace else at present.)
This channel is on many cable systems, and is usually VCII scrambled on
satellite (EMail me if you need me to dig up which bird it's on.)
> Anyways, I got to thinking while watching the commercial "What would the
> effect of a similiar situation be to a SR world?"
Oooh, there you go, thinking again. Last time something like
this got you thinking, we dreamed up Psionics! *grin*
It is a very interesting idea, though I'm not sure if I like that
they adapt to cyberware faster than homo sapiens whatever...if it were put
into play, I'd suggest that they need customized cyberware, or _extremely_
customized bioware -- and current nanotech techniques would be totally
rejected, so that'd have to be re-worked as well.
In other words, they'd have more potential, but only the best of
them could beat your average munchkin troll sammie in a fair fight (as if
there would ever be a fair fight in a munchkin game.)
Still, this could make for some interesting discussion...and no,
I don't think it'd make a good NERPS submission. Yet. *grin*
/-----------------\
| J.D. Falk | "You're going to that happy land
| jdfalk@****.com | to play some volleyball."
\-----------------/ -A policeman making an arrest
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 13:26:06 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Spellslinger <mruane@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410230424.AB19371@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
On Sat, 22 Oct 1994, Marc A Renouf wrote:
> On Fri, 21 Oct 1994, Erik S Jameson wrote:
>
> > actually LOST karma on our last adventure!
>
> Yep. This is a regular occurrence with us, too.
>
> > So back off on the veiled accusations of munchkining...
>
> Touchy! Touchy! I was not making "veiled accusations" about
> anything. I was saying that we have different styles of playing. I'm
> not saying that you are a "munchkin" or that you are a power-hungry gamer
> who gets his karma for free. I just said it was different. For what you
> guys are doing, it would appear as though a magic attribute of 21 is
> almost necessary. So lighten up.
>
> Marc
>
Well, different GM rules, etc. GM Matt regularly kicked our asses. Matt
wasn't a killer GM. It's just that his adventures had a nasty habit of
killing everyone. Scott's campaigns are more rigged twoards our special
abilites (Spellslinger's academic persuits and archaelogical interests
have been used the past two adventures). Granted our characters are old
enough to specialize. We manage to survive better in Scotts campaigns,
but I think the survival is a reflection of our increased skill and
playing ability. You learn how to survive better as time progresses.
Mike
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Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 16:25:38 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "J.D. Falk" <jdfalk@****.CAIS.COM>
Subject: Mosaic question
In-Reply-To: <199410232009.QAA00167@****.cais.com>
I'm replying publically in hopes that this question won't come up
again any time soon. *grin*
The best place to go for help about the World Wide Web is the Web
itself. Even if all you've got is a Lynx client on a shell account (like
me, for example), you will still get more information than you'd ever
need.
Alternately, you can read the FAQs in comp.answers and the
WWW-related USENET groups.
For a quick answer (which shouldn't be on the list, so don't reply
publically), I hear that Mosaic _can_ be used over even 300-baud
connections, but it is not recommended by the experts. They say don't
even bother at less than 14,400...and the real wizards get ill with any
line slower than 56K. *grin*
"But still the screen is flickering /-----------------\
With an endless stream of garbage to | J.D. Falk |
Curse the place | jdfalk@****.com |
In a sea of random images." \-----------------/
-Pink Floyd
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Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 15:45:23 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Robert A. Hayden" <hayden@*******.MANKATO.MSUS.EDU>
Subject: ADMIN: Still need assistant
Comments: To: ShadowTalk <shadowtk@*****.nic.SURFnet.nl>
I've received several volunteers from people for the various open
positions, but there is one position that hasn't been spoken for.
Somebody is still needed to take over the editing of the ShadowTalk log.
This will require you to once-weekly get the log from the listserv,
remove the mailing headers, mistakes, and administrative postings as well
as doing corrections of serious formatting errors. You will then have to
send it to a HEARN address. Finally, you need to ZIP the file and put it
up on the cerebus FTP site.
If you are interested, please let me know ASAP.
____ Robert A. Hayden <=> hayden@*******.mankato.msus.edu
\ /__ -=-=-=-=- <=> -=-=-=-=-
\/ / Finger for Geek Code Info <=> I do not necessarily speak for the
\/ Finger for PGP Public Key <=> City of Mankato or anyone else
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GJ/CM d- H-- s-:++>s-:+ g+ p? au+ a- w++ v* C++(++++) UL++++$
P+>++ L++$ 3- E---- N+++ K+++ W M+ V-- -po+(---)>$ Y++ t+ 5+++
j R+++$ G- tv+ b+ D+ B--- e+>++(*) u** h* f r-->+++ !n y++**
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Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 15:46:46 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Bryan D. Jones" <bdj@****.UARK.EDU>
Subject: Short Stories Found
I found the following in the FASA archives on AOL.
Enjoy!
BTW anyones got any insight on the second story?
--
Bryan D. Jones Internet:bdj@****.uark.edu
GAT d--(-) H-- s:- g- p? au- a- w+ v(?) C++(++++)(---) US++>+++ P--- L+ 3-
E--- N+ K W+(--)(---) M(-) V(--) po Y+ t+ 5-- j R>+++ G' tv+ b+++ D++
B--- e+ u--- h(+) f r>+ n+ y+
THE FOLLOWING ARE SHADOWRUN SHORT STORIES PUBLISHED IN
VARIOUS FLYERS SINCE 1991. THEY ARE ALL WRITTEN BY TOM DOWD
AND ARE THE COPYRIGHT OF FASA CORPORATION, COPYRIGHT 1991,
1992, 1993. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED.
THESE FILES MAY BE DUPLICATED FOR FREE PERSONAL USE AND MAY
BE DISTRIBUTED TO OTHER BULLETIN BOARD SYSTEMS AS LONG AS
THIS NOTICE REMAINS INTACT WITH THIS FILE. THIS FILE MAY NOT
BE BROKEN UP INTO INDIVIDUAL STORIES FOR DISTRIBUTION, NOT
MAY THESE FILES BE EDITED OR AMENDED IN ANY MANNER WITHOUT
THE EXPRESSED WRITTEN PERMISSION OF FASA CORPORATION.
NO CHARGES OR COSTS MAY BE DIRECTLY PAID FOR THIS FILE, OTHER
THAN SUCH COSTS INCURRED THROUGH NORMAL USE OF THE ONLINE OR
ELECTRONIC SERVICE.
WYRM TALK
"There's a dragon here to see you." I was proud of how
steady I kept my voice.
He glanced up from either the papers strewn across the
coffee table or the datascreen sitting on top of the pile; I
couldn't tell which he was working on. The slice of pizza in
his hand dripped grease onto the papers. "Oh. Which one?" he
asked.
"How the drek should I know?" I replied. He was being a
royal pain again. "You haven't started teaching me that yet."
He smiled and put the pizza slice down on the table. "Of
course, my dear," he said as he stood. "Soon, soon."
"So?" I asked, dropping my hands to my hips.
His left eyebrow lifted. "So?"
"There's a fraggin' dragon here to see you!"
He licked the grease from his hand. "Well, yes, you just
told me that."
He'd made me promise to try to stop hitting him, but one
of these days. . . "Do you want me to just leave him out
there?"
"No, of course not!" he replied. "That would be quite
rude. Ask him in."
"Um, don't you think he's a little big for the doorway?"
I figured that was probably a stupid question. In the short
time I'd been with him, I'd learned, if nothing else, that
the obvious was rarely that, and the impossible the norm.
He gave me his best "I know lots of things you don't
know" look. "Why don't we let him decide, eh?"
I shrugged. "Fine, why don't we. You're the one paying
the repair bills." As I turned to leave, something occurred
to me. I paused and looked back at him. He was reaching for
the pizza slice.
"Uh, I don't know what dragons are into," I said, "but I
figure you might want to put some clothes on before he comes
in."
He looked at me, then at himself. "Yes, I suppose you're
right," he said. "But how do you know it's a he?"
Someday I was going to hit him so hard he'd need a
closed casket.
At the back of the house I hesitated, straightened my
clothes, then walked briskly into the garden. It was still
sitting right where it had landed, curiously watching the poi
circling in a nearby shallow pool. Its sapphire and silver
scales reflected the late afternoon sun, changing the garden
into a Maxfield Parrish painting. The dragon seemed oblivious
to my presence, intent instead on the movements of the
goldfish. I didn't want to'actually, was afraid to'disturb
it. I didn't want it to move again.
"Is he home?" it asked. I should have been ready for the
voice. I knew how they spoke, but I still found it
unsettling. I heard the words clearly, but it hadn't moved.
No part of it had moved.
Startled in spite of myself, I took a step back up the
flagstone steps. "I. . .yes. Yes, he is."
"I did not mean to frighten you, you know." Its great
head swung slowly toward me. A glint of light shined from
somewhere deep behind its eyes. It could have swallowed me
whole, right then and there, and I'd never have noticed.
"No, I know you didn't. . ."
"May I go in? It is very tiring keeping my tail in the
air like this, and this is such a wonderful garden that I
would not like to spoil it."
I looked up at its tail suspended a number of stories
above me. Barbs stuck out all around the end. Giant hooks
like that could'wait a minute, it was gone.
"He is expecting me, then.' A strange voice spoke.
My head snapped back toward earth. The dragon was gone.
In its place stood a young man, about twenty years old,
dressed in a suit cut from the most beautiful blue silk I had
ever seen. He had pale skin, and his features were those of
Michelangelo's David. His eyes sparkled a sharp silver and
blue. I gave a stupid-sounding laugh.
He smiled. "Oh dear, I have startled you again. I am
sorry."
I managed a small smile myself. "I didn't know dragons
could do that," I said sheepishly. I'd taken a few more steps
backward without realizing it.
He walked toward me, and placed one finger on his lips
as he passed. "Please do not tell anyone. It is supposed to
be a secret."
More secrets for me to keep, I thought. No problem.
However you looked at it, this was sure as hell more
interesting than Missouri.
***
He seemed intrigued by the house's modern decor. He
questioned me about the creator of every piece of art we
passed, but only paused once to lean in for a better look.
That was at the Warhol, drek knows why. I led him upstairs
and, deciding to be grandiose, threw wide the study doors as
he entered.
He grinned, and strode past me. "May I present
Dunklezahn," I announced.
The man the dragon had come to see stood as we entered.
He hadn't cleaned up the room any; it still reeked of sausage
and pepperoni. He'd managed to get dressed, though, and was
wearing black boots, denim pants, and one of the white cotton
shirts he'd bought the other day. He'd kept his face
unpainted.
"It's been some time, hasn't it?" he said, touching his
chest with the fingers of his left hand, just below the
heart. I'd seen him do that a few times before, but he'd
never explained what it meant. I think it meant he was
viewing the new arrival as an equal, thank god.
"Yes, it has, Harlequin," replied the dragon, repeating
the gesture. "I was pleased to hear of the outcome of your
chal'han." Dunklezahn didn't turn, but I felt his attention
rest on me for just a moment. Obviously, there were no
secrets from him.
Harlequin grinned. "I'll bet you were." He gestured at
the overstuffed black leather couch across from him. "Won't
you sit down?"
The dragon nodded. "Thank you." He walked to the couch,
considered it for a moment, then carefully sat down. Only
when he was fully balanced on the seat did he lean back. He
smiled.
"So, what can I do for you?" inquired Harlequin.
"I take it you are aware of my status?"
Harlequin tilted his head. "You mean as host of 'Wyrm
Talk'?"
I laughed to myself. Dunklezahn had been interviewed by
an international media team shortly after reemerging. He'd
apparently enjoyed the experience, especially his spontaneous
cross-examination of the journalists, so much so that he
requested his own show from one of the networks. In the
intervening years, he'd only given the idea his attention
long enough to produce three shows. Harlequin and I had
watched the show the last time it had aired. The dragon,
obviously enthralled by modern culture, had spent the whole
program commenting on an amazing range of topics. In a couple
of segments, he'd taken the concept of confrontational
journalism to such an extreme that I suggested the show
should have been renamed "Wyrm Food."
Dunklezahn grinned. "Exactly so. I find the media
absolutely fascinating. Free, unrestricted information
exchange. Who would have imagined?"
"Well now, I wouldn't exactly call it unrestricted,"
said Harlequin.
"No," agreed the dragon. "nor would I. Which is
precisely why I am here."
"Oh?"
"I would like you to be the subject of my next program."
"What!" Harlequin exclaimed, leaping to his feet.
I laughed aloud, and then clamped my hand over my mouth.
Harlequin glared at me for a split second, so I knew I'd
regret my indiscretion later, but it was such a joy seeing
him surprised.
"Yes," continued the dragon. "I think you would make a
wonderful guest."
Harlequin ran his hand through his hair as he shook his
head. "Of all the things I was expecting to talk about. . ."
"But, Harlequin, you have always been the best
storyteller. Just think how amazed these humans would be by
the things you could tell them! There is so much they just
don't understand'"
"And I'm certainly not going to tell them!" interrupted
Harlequin.
The dragon moved his head oddly. "Is it not possible
that they have a right to know? It is their world, after
all."
Harlequin exhaled noisily, his brow furrowed. "You want
to just tell them everything? Reveal all the myriad secrets
of the universe? You want me to. . ." He turned toward me,
arm extended and fingers twitching madly. "You want me to. .
."
"Spill my guts on global television?" I suggested.
"Yes!" he said, snapping his fingers and turning back
toward the dragon, who blinked. "Do you want me to spill my
guts on television? Open dear Pandora's box once again?"
"Well, yes," said the dragon. "Do you realize how
confused they all must be? Look at how their world has
changed. Is it not their right to know what it all means?"
Harlequin nodded vigorously and moved toward the center
of the room, gesturing wildly. "Of course it is!" he said.
"But why tell them? Let them figure it out; that's the fun of
it all! The clues are there!"
"The clues?" The dragon and I were equally baffled.
"To the mystery of life, Dunklezahn! The world is like a
giant tapestry. You start out standing very close to the
picture. There's a lot to see, and you could spend your whole
life inspecting that one little section. Some find that
section isn't enough. They step back to see more of the
picture. Eventually, they may find themselves standing so far
back that they see the whole tapestry hanging before them.
But if you start them standing all the way back, they'll be
confused. They won't know where to look first. They'll miss
seeing the whole picture." He folded his arms across his
chest, a satisfied smirk on his face. I eyed the dragon, who
still looked perplexed.
"Are there not some things they should be warned'" he
began.
"You mean like the invae?" Harlequin broke in.
"As a beginning, yes," the dragon told him.
Harlequin dismissed the idea with a gesture. "They're of
no concern. In fact, they actually support my point! The
humans knew nothing of their coming, but have been dealing
with them quite nicely, nonetheless. Spilling our guts'" he
nodded to me, "'to the humans early on would have denied them
the discovery! The joy is in the unfolding. Let them marvel
at their world, horrific as it may sometimes be. Let's not
reveal the end of the tale before the final page is turned,
Dunklezahn. Allow the story to tell itself."
The dragon seemed to be staring at the now-cold pizza,
but I could tell he was lost in thought. Finally, with a
sigh, he stood and nodded. "I will take that as a no."
Harlequin laughed, looked down, and shook his head.
"Thank you for your hospitality," said Dunklezahn,
moving slowly toward the door.
Harlequin looked up. "I hope I haven't fouled up your
schedule of guests."
The dragon smiled innocently. "No, not at all. I may ask
Lady Brane Deigh of the Daoine Sidhe to speak in your place."
Harlequin's face stilled. "I wouldn't recommend that."
"Oh?"
"Dunklezahn, you and I have always at least been
cordial," Harlequin began.
"Very true."
"But I warn you, there are some of my kind, and your
kind, who think you have told too much already."
"Oh?"
"Your comments about great dragons and dracoforms, for
one thing."
The dragon nodded. "Yes, I received some. . .grief for
that."
"Should you start to speak of other things. . ."
Dunklezahn nodded again. "Thank you for your warning,
Harlequin." He added wistfully, "You are quite sure of your
decision? Such wonderful stories could be told."
Harlequin smiled. "And they will be, in time."
The dragon touched his fingers to his chest again, and
when Harlequin had repeated the gesture, began to walk out of
the room. He stopped as he passed me. "It has been a pleasure
meeting you, my lady," he said. "You do your heritage proud."
I smiled, and couldn't think of what to say, so I touched my
fingers to my chest. He smiled, and returned the gesture.
I closed the doors behind him, and turned back to
Harlequin. "It's too bad," I said sadly. "I kind of like
him."
"I do too," Harlequin replied, looking down at his
papers. "He's the most reasonable of them all. It'll be a
shame when we have to destroy him."
HUNTER AND PREY
by Tom Dowd
Despite the efforts of the room's tungsten lights,
darkness came. The corner of the room whispered a name.
'Knight. . .'
He looked up for a moment from the twin flatscreens
inlaid beneath the plexiglass surface of the desk, and
frowned slightly. Behind him, the sun cut through Detroit's
fog for the last time that day and the city slipped into
twilight. He sipped from a glass of pale gold liquid and
waited. Nothing.
He looked down and the numbers danced again. Profits,
losses, credits, debits, balances forward and in arrears
woven together in a four-dimensional matrix. Projections
birthed from the financial mandala as'
'Knight. . .'
He removed the thin, gold-framed glasses from his aged
face and placed them gingerly on the desktop. Unburdened, his
tired eyes scanned the room and settled on the shadowed
corner across from him. He waited. Nothing.
'Show yourself,' he said, finally.
'As you wish,' said nothing.
The corner's shadow became mist and flowed forward. It
shifted, and silently extended a long and articulate part of
itself into the room. Solid now, it clicked against the
marble floor and found purchase. Another slim extension, hard
against a nearby wall, dug in and pulled. Darkness entered
from the corner and skittered against the floor. Slick and
shapeless, it grinned.
'Damian Knight. . .
The man stood slowly as it came, the pale color of his
hair now matched by the skin of his palm pressed hard against
the desktop. He licked his lips and nodded. 'As good a name
as any, I suspect.'
'We all have many names, some truer than others. We all
bear many faces.'
'I doubt you came here to recite trite philosophies.
What do you want?' His eyes flicked to the room's other
corners and then back to the dark form stretched before him.
'You have spoken my question.'
'Then the answer should be obvious: I want you to
leave.'
The grin turned sly. 'But I shall not. Your tower is
crafty and well protected, and I have spent much time gaining
entrance. I demand my due time of you.'
'Speak your piece and get out. I have no time for such
as you.'
The darkness grew larger before him. 'But you have
devoted much time to me already. Everywhere my children are
hunted by your agents. My deepest nests burn in the night and
my young cry their last.'
A smile touched the man's lips. 'Good.'
Blacker eyes in the darkness narrowed and it moved
forward slightly, brushing aside furniture. The man stepped
back. 'Do not taunt me, for I have not the patience and may
slay you before I intend. Speak the ills I have done you,
Damian Knight, so that I may wonder at my own foolishness.'
The man looked down for a moment at the numbers that
continued to flash beneath the desktop. He touched the
surface, and the screens dimmed and faded away. A light came
on above him and cast his shadow on the desk. He looked up
and faced the darkness.
'You've done nothing to me, spirit.'
'Then I have harmed your precious corporation. Have I
weakened Ares Macrotechnology in some manner I have
forgotten?'
'No. My only losses connected to you have been
ammunition expenditures.'
A tendril of darkness lashed out over the man's head and
struck the light. The fixture shattered and sprayed metal and
glass across the room. Darkness swelled behind a flashing
rake of teeth. 'Then why do you burn my nests?'
'Because you are.'
'My spawn damned for simply being? Then likewise are
you. For their essence I take yours.'
The man's eyes widened slightly. 'My soul is mine to
give. You cannot take what is not yours.'
The darkness hissed. 'I am the form incarnate: all is
mine to take.' It lashed out and struck at him from every
corner of the room. Blinding silver blocked the darkness as
veins of white fire shot up through the marble floor and
created a circle around the man and the desk. The darkness
stepped back and black talons scratched brilliant sparks as
they probed the borders of the ward.
'Powerful,' came the voice from somewhere in the
darkness.
The man shrugged. 'It suffices against such as you.'
'Such as I will feast on your soul until the last cycle
falls.' The black eyes and grin reared over him and dark
limbs grew from the shadow to grasp the boundaries of the
ward. Everywhere they touched argent fire danced along their
length.
The man shook his head. 'I think not. If you were truly
as you would have me fear, this ward would not slow you. You
are no avatar.'
The eyes narrowed above him. 'You know nothing of the
names you wield.'
Now the man grinned. 'I know more than you think. While
you are less than you claim, I am more than I seem.' The
man's features turned liquid and ran from him, the carefully
styled silver hair growing long, black, and shiny. The
creased, aged face smoothed and sharpened and his dark brown
eyes shifted to piercing blue.
'Ah. I named you wrong. No matter, I will have your soul
and then that of the man you pretended to be.'
The man shrugged and let the now too-big suit jacket
fall from his shoulders. 'I say again, you are no avatar. You
are no incarnation, insect, merely another true form sent to
destruction at your master's bidding.'
The talons tightened, and the ward strained, white and
black energy arcing about it to form a geodesic dome of power
over the man. The spirit's grin grew. 'Then I will have your
heart, mortal, to give to the newborns so that they may know
the taste of human early.'
'I think not. You will, in fact, find the situation even
worse than you begin to suspect.'
'Defiant to the end! Sweet will be the taste of your
lifeblood. Banter on, mortal, this ward of yours is soon no
more.'
The man spread his arms wide and looked up at the
spirit. Black and silver lightning danced just beyond his
reach. 'The ward is not mine, and so protects you from me
more than I from you.'
The spirit laughed, and a high, sharp, cracking tone
began to grow. 'Who are you, child of the earth, to stand
against one such as I?'
The man brought his arms together, one held straight
out, the other touching the first at the elbow in a well-
practiced, fluid gesture. Power shifted and grew around him.
'I may be born of this earth, spirit, but that is not where I
have been of late.'
Part of the ward gave, and a black limb gouged into the
floor within the circle of light. The spirit's chitinous,
ebony body slammed against the circle as it began to buckle.
'Many of your kind wander the greater planes, I feast on them
often.'
'Wrong realm. Knight suspected something would try to
kill him, so the corporation brought me down to protect him.
Magic is so much easier here.'
The ward shattered, raining white sparks down around the
man. The spirit's legs caged him and its impossibly grinning
face came closer to the man. 'Magic is easy for me
everywhere. There is nowhere I am weak.'
'Nowhere on the Earth, perhaps, but what of above it?'
The man pulled his arms toward himself, and held his palms
parallel. Power flowed inward, cleanly, from everywhere
around him. A light grew between his hands.
'Your tricks will avail you not, human, I am power
incarnate.' The spirit reared again.
The man laughed. 'I've shaped power among the stars and
danced with hearts far darker than yours.' The spirit fell
upon him, a wave of darkness pierced by a shaft of light
brighter than a hundred suns. 'Taste what I have learned.'
VOICES FROM THE PAST
Harlequin sat alone in a quiet room lit only by the
sinking flames of a dying fire. His face was unpainted, and
he wore a plain long robe woven with golden and burgundy
threads. The firelight caught the metallic threads of his
robe and the intricate metal filigree on the walls behind him
and made them sparkle. Harlequin didn't even notice. He was
drunk and his drink was his only concern.
The liquid swirled in the glass, impelled by the gentle
motion of his wrist. He watched the magical blending and
bleeding of colors as the liquid hovered on the edge of
solidifying, maintaining its liquid state only by the energy
from his moving hand. The colors changed dramatically as he
changed the direction of its motion. Firelight danced along
the edges of the fine crystal goblet that held the drink.
Harlequin drank from the goblet, barely sipping, and let
the drink's deep fire run through him. He nearly laughed with
the pleasure, but, as always, the cold aftertaste caught him
by surprise.
'You have fallen far,' spoke a long-dead voice.
Harlequin turned slowly from the fire and looked across
the long expanse of the room. In the center of the room,
caught in the flickering firelight, stood a figure. Its robes
were black, torn, covered in the dirt of a thousand roads.
Dark, gnarled hands hung limply from the sleeves of the robe,
but no face appeared within the raised hood. In its place, he
could see only smoke churning slightly.
Harlequin raised an eyebrow, snorted once, and turned
back to his drink, raising it to his lips. 'Oh, please,' he
muttered.
'You cannot ignore me,' said the robed figure.
Harlequin snorted again, spraying a few drops of liquid
from his mouth. 'I can do as I please,' he said.
'You are drunk.'
Harlequin laughed. 'And you, sir, are a feeble attempt
to frighten me with an image so common that it would not
frighten a child.' He looked into the fire. 'Lewis Carroll
must be spinning in his grave.'
'Indeed he must,' agreed the figure. 'You are drunk and
confused. A Christmas Carol was written by Charles Dickens.
"You fog your mind so you cannot see the truth.'
Harlequin stood abruptly and hurled the glass toward the
robed figure. The missile fell just short, exploding into
fragments of brilliant, flashing crystal and a spray of
liquid color. The figure did not move.
'Begone, foul spirit,' Harlequin cried. 'I summoned you
not into my home and I banish you hence.' He flung his hand
out toward the robed figure, spreading his fingers as if
throwing dust. A hint of power danced there.
The figure did not move. 'You cannot,' it said.
Harlequin's face grew wild. 'I can and I do!' he cried
again, and thrust his arms out to his sides. 'M'aela j-taarm
querm talar!'
The room darkened suddenly, and pockets of moisture
sealed in the firewood burning at Harlequin's back burst,
throwing showers of sparks into the air. They rained down up
him, ignored, until a cool wind rushed back at him and damped
them into embers. He brushed the char from his shoulders.
The figure did not move. 'It has been a long time since
those words were last spoken, Har'lea'quinn. It is not the
first time you have used them against me.' The figure's robes
rustled slightly. 'And they did not aid you then.'
Harlequin paled. 'No. . .' he breathed, and stumbled
back to his chair. 'You are gone. . .forgotten. . .'
'Forgotten, perhaps, but never gone. How could we ever
be truly gone?'
Harlequin turned away, covering his eyes with his
forearm. 'You are the past. Your place is there only,' he
moaned. 'That world is gone.'
'Perhaps,' replied the figure, 'but as long as you
remember. . .'
'Yes. That is the key, isn't it?' Harlequin said,
standing and dropping his arm to his side. He faced the robed
figure again. 'My mind. You are right, whatever you are. I am
drunk, and that is a bad state for one such as me.'
'Then I am a figment of your imagination?'
Harlequin shrugged. 'Were you ever anything more?'
The robes moved as if the figure laughed, but Harlequin
heard no sound. 'That borders on blasphemy. You once were
more devout.'
'Never for you.'
'I understood you too well.'
Harlequin thrust his hands into the pockets of his robe.
'Or vice versa.'
The figure bowed slightly. 'Perhaps. Madness can bring
wisdom.'
Harlequin sneered. 'You are the Master of the Twisted
Path. The only wisdom you teach is avoidance.'
'And yet I am here.'
'Alamestra,' said Harlequin, pointing to the now-
motionless, solid globs of color around the figure's feet,
'is not an indulgence known for gifting wisdom.'
'Then what of me?'
'What of you?' replied Harlequin.
'If I exist only as a creature of your mind, why am I
here?'
Harlequin shrugged again. 'It matters not. Your words
are lies and your deeds treachery. Your inspiration is
betrayal. I care not why you are here and will not listen to
you.'
'And yet you say you summoned me.'
'I am, was, drunk.'
'If I am of no consequence or concern, then why did your
dispelling not work?'
Harlequin stared at him.
'You have cleared your mind. The fog is lifted, yet I
remain.'
'You are a hangover incarnate, nothing more.'
The figure's robes shifted again. 'You lie to yourself.'
'No,' said Harlequin, 'you lie to me.'
'As I said.'
Harlequin tensed. 'This is foolishness. You are a shadow
of the dead past conjured by my drunken mind to vex me.'
'Why me?'
'I do not care.' Harlequin told the figure, turning back
to the near-dead fire.
'You lie to yourself.'
'You repeat yourself, bland spirit.'
The figure slowly raised one arm and pointed at
Harlequin. 'I am Deceit. I am Deception. I am Treachery. I am
Betrayal. I am the passions that bring men to lie to others,
and themselves.'
Harlequin turned and stared, his eyes growing slightly
wider. 'As you say,' he said.
'As you do, now.'
'Your words can never be believed,' said Harlequin.
'I am not words, Har'lea'quinn. I am emotion, I am
passion, I am what you feel.'
Harlequin was silent.
'And you feel them, do you not?'
'I feel nothing.'
'You can taste them in the air.'
'I taste nothing.'
'Smell them on the wind.'
'The air is still.'
'Hear them laughing in the silence, calling for their
due.'
'I hear only your maddening voice.'
The figure lowered its arm. 'You lie to yourself.'
Harlequin rushed toward the figure. 'I do not!' he
howled, his hands clenched into sweaty fists. He shook them
at the robed figure. 'It is too soon!'
'They are coming.'
Harlequin spun away, then rounded back on his
antagonist. 'It is too soon! They cannot be coming!'
'You lie to yourself.'
'It is you who lies to me!'
'As I have said.'
Harlequin turned again and stumbled back toward the
fire. 'It is too soon. . .' he mumbled. 'Nothing is right. .
.I cannot understand. . .'
'You do not wish to understand. The humans play with
things they do not comprehend because no one teaches them.'
Harlequin whirled back to face the figure. 'And telling
them would stop them? I think not.'
The figure shifted. 'The humans have danced their little
dance, Har'lea'quinn. They shook this world, and the others.
Now they pay the price.'
Harlequin grasped his head and shook it. 'No. . .It is
too soon. . .'
'You will still be saying that when they tear the
fingers from your hands and blind you with them. Have you
fallen so far, Har'lea'quinn? Have you forgotten the horror?'
'I can't. . .'
'Nor can I.' The figure stared at Harlequin. 'I expected
more from the last Knight of the Crying Spire.'
Harlequin stared back at the figure. 'The Northern
Islands are gone. Forgotten dust of a forgotten world.'
'As all shall be, Har'lea'quinn, as all shall be.'
'What would you have me do?' Harlequin cried.
'Destroy the bridge.'
Harlequin blanched. 'That cannot be done. . .How. . .'
'Thayla's Voice.'
Harlequin sat abruptly. 'No. . .'
'You know where she roams. Her song will shatter the
bridge and cast them back from the chasm. It will take them
time to find it again.'
Harlequin stared off into the darkness and nodded. 'Yes.
. .'
'Travel lightly. Some already wander the netherworlds.
It will not be safe. They will smell you coming.'
Harlequin continued to nod. 'I understand. . .'
The figure moved forward, walking past Harlequin toward
the dying embers of the fire. 'Move quickly, Laughing One;
they have experience in building their bridge.'
Harlequin did not answer but stared off into the
darkness of the room, still nodding.
The figure shook its head and stepped into the fire. The
embers flared and kindled, but no heat warmed Harlequin. At
last he looked up and saw his growing shadow on the wall, and
turned. He saw only the last swirls of burning cloth as the
heat from the now-raging fire danced them higher and higher.
He stared at the fire. The large, ornate doors at the
far end of the room swung open and Harlequin stood quickly. A
young woman entered, her long, white hair falling in waves
over the black satin dressing gown she clutched to her body
with one hand. The other hand held a heavy-barreled chrome
pistol. 'Did you. . .' she stammered. 'I felt. . .'
Harlequin nodded and walked toward her. 'Indeed you did.
Prepare yourself; it is time to see how much you have
learned.'
She stared at him. As he moved past her he turned and
continued walking, backward.
'The netherworlds. . .' he paused, and smiled. 'Pardon
my anachronism. The metaplanes will ring with the sounds of
battle and songs long unsung.' He walked backward out of the
room and down the hall.
She followed quickly. 'I don't. . .What happened?'
'Call up your files, dear Jane, and find us some
heroes.'
She snorted. 'Yeah, right.'
Harlequin grinned broadly. 'Yes, times have changed.'
His path arced across the large hall they'd entered and he
began ascending the staircase.
She stopped at its foot and yelled up after him. 'Will
you tell me what the frag is going on?'
'Why, my dear,' he said, turning away from her,
'Harlequin's back. Can't you tell?'
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 15:49:30 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Robert A. Hayden" <hayden@*******.MANKATO.MSUS.EDU>
Subject: Re: The Aliens are coming
In-Reply-To: <199410232018.PAA12665@*******.mankato.msus.edu>
On Sun, 23 Oct 1994, J.D. Falk wrote:
> It is a very interesting idea, though I'm not sure if I like that
> they adapt to cyberware faster than homo sapiens whatever...if it were put
> into play, I'd suggest that they need customized cyberware, or _extremely_
> customized bioware -- and current nanotech techniques would be totally
> rejected, so that'd have to be re-worked as well.
Adapt was a very bad choice of words...
Say, give them an essence rating of 8 instead of six, to represent
generations of selective breeding to make hearty slave stock. Require
them to get Alpha-grade or better cyber because generic-ware isn't
customized enough (sort of a play-balance offset, as well).
As for magic, also give them a magic rating of 8 instead of six.
> Still, this could make for some interesting discussion...and no,
> I don't think it'd make a good NERPS submission. Yet. *grin*
But just think, I might become DLoH....
____ Robert A. Hayden <=> hayden@*******.mankato.msus.edu
\ /__ -=-=-=-=- <=> -=-=-=-=-
\/ / Finger for Geek Code Info <=> I do not necessarily speak for the
\/ Finger for PGP Public Key <=> City of Mankato or anyone else
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GJ/CM d- H-- s-:++>s-:+ g+ p? au+ a- w++ v* C++(++++) UL++++$
P+>++ L++$ 3- E---- N+++ K+++ W M+ V-- -po+(---)>$ Y++ t+ 5+++
j R+++$ G- tv+ b+ D+ B--- e+>++(*) u** h* f r-->+++ !n y++**
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 13:50:28 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Erik S Jameson <esj@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: Spiking the ball.
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410220159.AA06257@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
> Uhm...Are we all forgetting that Elves are -magical- creatures, not quite
> limited to the same 'reality' limitations as humans. Sure they're
> immortal, but damned if a test tube is goina tell you that.
>
> Laters,
EXCUSE ME!!! Last time I checked, elves were just as mundane as humans.
The ONLY reason they are elves is because they have a recessive gene that
can only be activated during times of magic. In other words, they are
bound by the same laws of science humans are. Get a grip of reality, please!
Erik, a.k.a. the Whistler
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 16:05:08 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Spiking the ball.
All right!!
A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
and smile.
-Star-
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 17:03:53 -0400
Reply-To: jdfalk@****.cais.com
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "J.D. Falk" <jdfalk@****.CAIS.COM>
Organization: Schroedinger's Cats
Subject: Re: cmsg newgroup alt.personals.aliens
In USENET's 'control' group, our Fearless Leader wrote...
> It seems to be a group that is missing for our visiting extra-terrestrial
> visitors. :-)
IMHO, this is deserving of a light THWAP! and the ubiquitous
quote from that master of brevity Sir Tim Pierce (Knighted by Joel Furr,
King of alt.config): "No."
"But still the screen is flickering /-----------------\
With an endless stream of garbage to | J.D. Falk |
Curse the place | jdfalk@****.com |
In a sea of random images." \-----------------/
-Pink Floyd
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 16:14:42 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Spike this!
>
> Laughinh Man = Harlequin (5000+++ elf)
> The Big 'D' = Dunklezahn (Darktooth) The Greater Dragon and TV
personality
> (also 5000+++)
Thanx Nightfox. I didn't realize that these two were so prominent.
Usful info for a run though...
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 17:12:57 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "J.D. Falk" <jdfalk@****.CAIS.COM>
Subject: Re: Short Stories Found
In-Reply-To: <199410232048.QAA00957@****.cais.com>
These stories can (now) also be found at my FTP site:
ftp://cais.com/pub/jdfalk/shadowrun/dowdstories.txt
For those who (like me) prefer the World Wide Web, my home page is:
ftp://cais.com/pub/jdfalk/html/homepage.html
"But still the screen is flickering /-----------------\
With an endless stream of garbage to | J.D. Falk |
Curse the place | jdfalk@****.com |
In a sea of random images." \-----------------/
-Pink Floyd
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 17:17:20 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "J.D. Falk" <jdfalk@****.CAIS.COM>
Subject: Re: The Aliens are coming
In-Reply-To: <199410232051.QAA00998@****.cais.com>
On Sun, 23 Oct 1994, Robert A. Hayden wrote:
> On Sun, 23 Oct 1994, J.D. Falk wrote:
>
> > Still, this could make for some interesting discussion...and no,
> > I don't think it'd make a good NERPS submission. Yet. *grin*
>
> But just think, I might become DLoH....
Uh, oh...with you as DLoH, freely weilding the power to cause
large spaceships to crashland in Nevada in 2056, then Doctor Doom and the
rest of us would be left to deal with repetitive discussions about
SHADOWRUN <--> STAR TREK CROSSOVERS!!!
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 16:27:55 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Spike this! (Again)
No one can prove that elves are immortal, true. But, as was stated
earlier, no elf has died of old age. So no one knows. Plus, if you had
read the books, they don't say that ALL elves are immortal, just the
possibility that SOME elves are immortal. In addition, "basic
biology" doesn't cover genes.(Not major genes.) Some biologists
claim to have found that humans age because of certain genes in the
helix. Now, of course other things are attributed to ageing. Stress,
sunlight, girls, step-mothers, etc. But the fact remains that some
biologists and genetists claim that genes make us age. And they are
trying to limit or turn around this(these?)gene(s).
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 16:35:08 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Robert A. Hayden" <hayden@*******.MANKATO.MSUS.EDU>
Subject: Re: cmsg newgroup alt.personals.aliens
Comments: To: "J.D. Falk" <jdfalk@****.cais.com>
In-Reply-To: <199410232110.QAA15777@*******.mankato.msus.edu>
On Sun, 23 Oct 1994, J.D. Falk wrote:
> In USENET's 'control' group, our Fearless Leader wrote...
> > It seems to be a group that is missing for our visiting extra-terrestrial
> > visitors. :-)
>
> IMHO, this is deserving of a light THWAP! and the ubiquitous
> quote from that master of brevity Sir Tim Pierce (Knighted by Joel Furr,
> King of alt.config): "No."
I need to get enough of a net.personality so that somebody will create
alt.fan.robert-hayden.
Besides, how else is a Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal going to find
himself another Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal so far from home?
____ Robert A. Hayden <=> hayden@*******.mankato.msus.edu
\ /__ -=-=-=-=- <=> -=-=-=-=-
\/ / Finger for Geek Code Info <=> I do not necessarily speak for the
\/ Finger for PGP Public Key <=> City of Mankato or anyone else
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GJ/CM d- H-- s-:++>s-:+ g+ p? au+ a- w++ v* C++(++++) UL++++$
P+>++ L++$ 3- E---- N+++ K+++ W M+ V-- -po+(---)>$ Y++ t+ 5+++
j R+++$ G- tv+ b+ D+ B--- e+>++(*) u** h* f r-->+++ !n y++**
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 16:40:30 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
> >3) Speaking of Melee combat, the way I have read it, Any initiative
> >bonuses are completely worthless. Please kick me if I have gotten
it
> >wrong but:
> >Will Wired has an Initiative of 12+4d6 and an Unarmed of 3.
> >Kelly Karate has an Initiative of 4+1d6 and a Karate of 8.
>
> >Rolling initiative, Will gets a 25 and Kelly gets an 8. Therefore,
> >Will blazes in to attack Kelly. Rolling against a 4, Will gets 2
> >successes, but Kelly gets 5. "Not today tin-man.", as she obtains
> >speed from nowhere and strikes Will. Again at turn 15, Will rolls 1
> >success, Kelly rolls 5. More whamming on Will. Now at turn 8,
Kelly
> >gets to attack! Will rolls 2, Kelly 3. Will still gets hurt. Turn
> >5: Will 3, Kelly 4....Will goes to the hospital, Kelly scampers off
> >unscathed. The result is, even though Will is the one with wired
> >reflexes and outrageous speed, Kelly (with no increases) slaps
him
> >silly 4 times in a combat round.
> > Sorry for the long explanation but......comments?
>
> Two things:
>
> 1) Your example is extreme. If the skill levels were closer the
result
> would be different.
>
> 2) Your forgetting Combat Pools. Will gets to use his combat pool
twice
> while Kelly gets to use it once.
>
Also, the very nature of melee combat is strike, counter, strike. In the
SRII book, it clearly states that the antagonist does not get the strike.
Both opponents dance around for a bit, looking for weak spots, hitting
and blocking, until one gets the window and does damage. A higher
skill in a fighting technique will almost always allow a slower
individual to do more damage. The reflexes just allow the other poor
fool to rush to his death. I realize that faster reflexes should allow
more speed. A homerule we use is to compare the reactions. The
higher reaction gets a bonus equal to 1/2 the difference of the
reactions. This evens the combat a little, and placates the
proponants of "faster, superior".
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 16:41:00 CDT
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "David L. Hoff" <DLHOFF@****.WISC.EDU>
Subject: Re: Spiking the ball.
I know that a lot of people get rather emotional when talking about Shadowrun,
but I had to laugh when I read Erik, a.k.a. the Whistler's last post, which
concerned elves, how they are born only in times of high mana, due to a
recessive gene that is activated by magic. He then finished this with the
words "Get a grip of reality, please!"
Um, I hate to be the one to point this out, but Shadowrun is a _game_. There
is no "reality" in it for someone to get a grip of. *smile*
I realize that this sudden disclosure may cause several of you to suffer
severe emotional trauma. If you need help, you can call the RPGA (Role
Playing Gamers Anonymous), and they will start you on a 12 step program back
to the real world.
--Phoenix
dlhoff@****.wisc.edu
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 16:46:44 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
> And speaking of combat pools (pools in general, too)...
>
> We discovered that a refreshed pool each action requires an unholy
amount
> of dice rolling. Apache/Mad Cat has a combat pool of 17, and for
combat
> spells, my magic pool is 15. We both have 4d6 init. Mad Cat's
average
> init is 32 and mine is 27. Our personal addendum to the rules is to
> allow a refreshed pool every turn. Any comments?
>
> Mike aka Spellslinger
First, sorry for the strange letter. Accentally sent rether than deleted.
Second, I believe that combat pools refresh at turns rather than
actions. That's how I read it in the book. And that's how we have
been playing it. Otherwise, you don't get the way wiz sound of
someone sobbing as they realize that they just spend their entire CP
for that last shot, only to be staring down a vindicater next action.
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 17:45:58 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "J.D. Falk" <jdfalk@****.CAIS.COM>
Subject: Re: cmsg newgroup alt.personals.aliens
In-Reply-To: <199410232138.RAA01765@****.cais.com>
On Sun, 23 Oct 1994, Robert A. Hayden wrote:
> I need to get enough of a net.personality so that somebody will create
> alt.fan.robert-hayden.
Become the DLoH and/or publish some books, and the alt.config
court won't have as many reasons to argue against its creation....
> Besides, how else is a Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal going to find
> himself another Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal so far from home?
Good point! *grin*
"But still the screen is flickering /-----------------\
With an endless stream of garbage to | J.D. Falk |
Curse the place | jdfalk@****.com |
In a sea of random images." \-----------------/
-Pink Floyd
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 17:01:54 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Spiking the ball.
NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! hOW cOuLD yOU dO THiS To mE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
wHAt wAS tHE nuMBeR To THE rPGa??????
(nEED hElP rEAL bAD.)
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 15:33:36 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Erik S Jameson <esj@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Reality doesn't bite
No, this has nothing to do with the lame movie of a similar name. I
also had to laugh when Phoenix responded to my last post. No, Shadowrun
isn't real (oh, wait, should I have put a discalimer there or
something?), but what really bother me is people using that as a license
to do whatever they want, without regards to reality. SR does have at
least some basis in science. In fact, they seem to have tried very hard
to make everything at least pseudo-scientific. Something I very much
like about SR. THAT is why I sometimes get a little upset and tell
people to get a grip of reality. So in other words, elves are science
based, not magical based. Sorry folks.
Erik, a.k.a. the Whistler
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 15:37:07 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Erik S Jameson <esj@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: ADMIN: Two new HEARN Mailing lists added
In-Reply-To: <9410211728.AA06292@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
I understand what the FAQ says about he cast lists and the logs, but I'm
just not sure of how it will change by having them as mailing lists, and
how the mechanics of it all will change. Like I said this flu has my
brain slightly out of wack.
Erik, a.k.a. the Whistler
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 15:45:35 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Spellslinger <mruane@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: Spiking the ball.
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410232145.AA06905@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
On Sun, 23 Oct 1994, David L. Hoff wrote:
> I know that a lot of people get rather emotional when talking about Shadowrun,
> but I had to laugh when I read Erik, a.k.a. the Whistler's last post, which
> concerned elves, how they are born only in times of high mana, due to a
> recessive gene that is activated by magic. He then finished this with the
> words "Get a grip of reality, please!"
>
> Um, I hate to be the one to point this out, but Shadowrun is a _game_. There
> is no "reality" in it for someone to get a grip of. *smile*
> I realize that this sudden disclosure may cause several of you to suffer
> severe emotional trauma. If you need help, you can call the RPGA (Role
> Playing Gamers Anonymous), and they will start you on a 12 step program back
> to the real world.
>
> --Phoenix
> dlhoff@****.wisc.edu
>
*****-- Dateline Tucson
Mike Ruane was rushed to the hospital yestereday when he read a
message that "Shadowrun is a _game_". The induced psychological trauma
caused a stroke from which Mike has not recovered. Friends say, "And I
thought the time we said he was a chem geek was bad. He was dazed for
days back then! What a heartless man David Hoff must be!"
*****
Mike
P.S.> It's a joke. Really. i'm fine.
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 15:55:44 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Erik S Jameson <esj@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Aliens & the X-files
Some people have been starting to talk about what would happen if aliens
came to the world of Shadowrun. I would like to posit something along
thoose lines. Has anyone else out there been watching the best show on
TV, the X-Files? It is becoming obvious that some of the aliens are
actually the military doing strange things. This seems obvious in the
last two episodes. So would anyone in 2054-55 do anything like that? Is
it possible that the UCAS military would cover up illegal experiments by
pretending to be aliens? This may be alittle off topic, but what if the
aliens that visit the SR world are really the results of 100yrs of
military experiments? Just a nasty little paranoid thought...
Erik, a.k.a. the Whistler
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 17:59:16 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Tim Skirvin <tskirvin@***.UIUC.EDU>
Subject: Re: The Aliens are coming
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.bitnet@***.cso.uiuc.edu>
In-Reply-To: "Robert A. Hayden" <hayden@*******.MANKATO.MSUS.EDU>
"Re: The
Aliens are coming" (Oct 23, 3:49pm)
> But just think, I might become DLoH....
Just what we need.
When FLoH watches TV, new supplements for SR suddenly appear on
store shelves.
I say that we BAN him from watching TV if he gets the job. All agreed?
--
Tim Skirvin (tskirvin@***.uiuc.edu)
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 18:00:48 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Tim Skirvin <tskirvin@***.UIUC.EDU>
Subject: Re: The Aliens are coming
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.bitnet@***.cso.uiuc.edu>
In-Reply-To: "J.D. Falk" <jdfalk@****.CAIS.COM> "Re: The Aliens are
coming"
(Oct 23, 5:17pm)
> rest of us would be left to deal with repetitive discussions about
>
> SHADOWRUN <--> STAR TREK CROSSOVERS!!!
Sounds like a NERPS submission to me...
*duck*
--
Tim Skirvin (tskirvin@***.uiuc.edu)
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 16:14:24 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Spellslinger <mruane@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: 2nd Hand-fighter AGAIN!
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410220611.AB09446@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
OK, I've gotten enough response to warrant a posting of the general
catalog's TOC and anyone who is interested can contact Aria (Andi Forbes)
on the ShadowTK mailer. I have a problem with costs on some of the
aircraft, but remember, incorporated into the costs are the acquisition
expenses for each vehicle. To get stats on any particular vehicle, pick
the aircraft and I'll send you the entire stat's sheet (sans picture).
Mike
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 19:50:13 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Wow, Reality. That's a switch" <MHILLIARD@****.ALBION.EDU>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
>Elves are not based on magic
>based on science. Sorry folks
Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. Eric thinks it's impossible
for the elves to be immortal, and it looks like he's not going to be
convinced otherwise.
Personally, I wish FASA had drawn more on mythology and less on science,
or their own imaginations. Kind of like Misty's Serrated Edge novels. Who
says magic can't overcome science?
Phelan
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 22:34:28 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Matt Hufstetler <gt2778a@*****.GATECH.EDU>
Subject: Re: Missing Blood(Was Re: Payment)
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@******.GATECH.EDU
In-Reply-To: <199410232018.QAA14275@*****.gatech.edu> from "Matt" at Oct
23,
94 03:18:13 pm
> I took a slightly different approach. I completely hid what was really
> going on until it was too late to back out. No one got any info about what
> was really going on, and the basement of the chapterhouse was warded. Dirty?
> Maybe, but the looks on the players' faces were worth it.
Well, I let my players find out about "Madame Tsese Fly" early on. I
forget what her name really was, but that is what they called her.
Anyway, I played the bugs to be really weak, incompetent, and
underpowered. Basically I took thier force down 1/2. I figured the UB
wouldn't spend anything really powerful until they knew who they were
against. But then I threw everything at them when they tried to enter the
hive. Remember the scene from Aliens? Boy, I'll never forget that night.
I got too much enjoyment from their expressions of bewilderment.
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 21:35:13 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: The Aliens are coming
I second that, that might prove to be dangerous. Imagine DLoH
running Shadowrun. He might just take advantage of all the ideas you
guys are giving him, and some one his own. We all thought
Shadowrun was hard before.....
A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
and smile.
-Star-
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 21:37:19 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Spiking the ball.
WATCH OUT ALL, PHOENIX HAS FOUND US ALL OUT!!!!!
A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
and smile.
-Star-
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 13:09:41 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
In-Reply-To: <199410232235.IAA01727@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Erik S
Jameson"
at Oct 23, 94 03:33:36 pm
Erik writes:
> So in other words, elves are science based, not magical based. Sorry folks.
That's why they have special low light vision that can't be explained with
normal science, right?
I sort of agree with what you say, but there is nothing to say that this
"magic gene" doesn't in some way channel magic energy for the elves in a
fasion that does not occur for humans. The same way that the "magus factor"
or whatever it is called confers the ability to weild magic to magicians,
and the magic magicians weild _does_not_ follow the laws of science and
physics.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 23:12:16 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Dylan Northrup <northrup@*****.CAS.USF.EDU>
Subject: Re: The Aliens are coming
In-Reply-To: <199410231632.MAA25994@*****.cas.usf.edu>
On Sun, 23 Oct 1994, Tim Skirvin wrote:
> I wouldn't see THAT many changes. Everyone's already geared for it,
> at least a little. The Humanis groups would change their focus, and such, but
> in general the racism wouldn't be as bad as in Alien Nation.
You never know. I have learned to never under-estimate the ability of
humans to hate something simply because it's different.
> (What I want to know is how the Great Dragons would think of it).
Provavly something along the lines of "Hey guys. Long time, no see."
*****************************************************************************
* Dylan Northrup <northrup@*****.cas.usf.edu> * PGP and Geek Code available *
*********************************************** via WWW and upon request *
* Will code HTML for food * KIBO #7 * <http://www.cas.usf.edu/dylan.html>; *
*****************************************************************************
-----------------------
Random Babylon 5 Quote:
-----------------------
"The sky was full of stars and every star an exploding ship -- one of ours."
-- Sinclair (about the Line), "The Gathering"
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 13:11:49 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: 2nd Hand-fighter AGAIN!
In-Reply-To: <199410232315.JAA02772@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from
"Spellslinger" at
Oct 23, 94 04:14:24 pm
Mike writes:
> OK, I've gotten enough response to warrant a posting of the general
> catalog's TOC and anyone who is interested can contact Aria (Andi Forbes)
> on the ShadowTK mailer. I have a problem with costs on some of the
> aircraft, but remember, incorporated into the costs are the acquisition
> expenses for each vehicle. To get stats on any particular vehicle, pick
> the aircraft and I'll send you the entire stat's sheet (sans picture).
I take it the entire file is too large to simply post? Is it possible to
place it on an ftp site, or on someones www page?
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 22:20:01 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Robert A. Hayden" <hayden@*******.MANKATO.MSUS.EDU>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
In-Reply-To: <199410240309.WAA04082@*******.mankato.msus.edu>
On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Damion Milliken wrote:
> Erik writes:
>
> > So in other words, elves are science based, not magical based. Sorry folks.
>
> That's why they have special low light vision that can't be explained with
> normal science, right?
SRII: Page 36
Under Elves:
Commentary: Elven eyes are heavily endowed with rod structures.
This allows them to seein dim light far better
than sapiens.
No magic there, chummer.
____ Robert A. Hayden <=> hayden@*******.mankato.msus.edu
\ /__ -=-=-=-=- <=> -=-=-=-=-
\/ / Finger for Geek Code Info <=> I do not necessarily speak for the
\/ Finger for PGP Public Key <=> City of Mankato or anyone else
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GJ/CM d- H-- s-:++>s-:+ g+ p? au+ a- w++ v* C++(++++) UL++++$
P+>++ L++$ 3- E---- N+++ K+++ W M+ V-- -po+(---)>$ Y++ t+ 5+++
j R+++$ G- tv+ b+ D+ B--- e+>++(*) u** h* f r-->+++ !n y++**
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 23:46:50 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Dylan Northrup <northrup@*****.CAS.USF.EDU>
Subject: Re: cmsg newgroup alt.personals.aliens
In-Reply-To: <199410232137.RAA03022@*****.cas.usf.edu>
On Sun, 23 Oct 1994, Robert A. Hayden wrote:
> I need to get enough of a net.personality so that somebody will create
> alt.fan.robert-hayden.
If only I had saved that mail from Joel Furr about how to properly
format control messages :-)
Then again, I'd be too tempted to start alt.fan.dylan-studboy-northrup ;-)
> Besides, how else is a Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal going to find
> himself another Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal so far from home?
Check out Creative Loafing? The Village Voice? Rolling Stone?
*****************************************************************************
* Dylan Northrup <northrup@*****.cas.usf.edu> * PGP and Geek Code available *
*********************************************** via WWW and upon request *
* Will code HTML for food * KIBO #7 * <http://www.cas.usf.edu/dylan.html>; *
*****************************************************************************
-----------------------
Random Babylon 5 Quote:
-----------------------
"I will take it from her when I eat her flesh!"
-- Na'Toth (re: Jha'dur), "Deathwalker"
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 23:57:00 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Dylan Northrup <northrup@*****.CAS.USF.EDU>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
In-Reply-To: <199410240310.XAA11807@*****.cas.usf.edu>
On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Damion Milliken wrote:
> Erik writes:
>
> > So in other words, elves are science based, not magical based. Sorry folks.
>
> That's why they have special low light vision that can't be explained with
> normal science, right?
Physiological changes such as increased cone density in their eyes?
Could qualify as a passive magical power (I forget the exact wording
right now). It's a result of magic, but follows physics and biology just
fine.
Doc X
*****************************************************************************
* Dylan Northrup <northrup@*****.cas.usf.edu> * PGP and Geek Code available *
*********************************************** via WWW and upon request *
* Will code HTML for food * KIBO #7 * <http://www.cas.usf.edu/dylan.html>; *
*****************************************************************************
-----------------------
Random Babylon 5 Quote:
-----------------------
"I will take it from her when I eat her flesh!"
-- Na'Toth (re: Jha'dur), "Deathwalker"
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 21:19:18 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Spellslinger <mruane@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: 2nd Hand-fighter AGAIN!
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410240313.AA11741@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
>
> > OK, I've gotten enough response to warrant a posting of the general
> > catalog's TOC and anyone who is interested can contact Aria (Andi Forbes)
> > on the ShadowTK mailer. I have a problem with costs on some of the
> > aircraft, but remember, incorporated into the costs are the acquisition
> > expenses for each vehicle. To get stats on any particular vehicle, pick
> > the aircraft and I'll send you the entire stat's sheet (sans picture).
>
> I take it the entire file is too large to simply post? Is it possible to
> place it on an ftp site, or on someones www page?
>
> --
> Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
>
here's the critical stats on the catalog:
73 pages total
Each page is dedicated to a short desc of said aircraft, vehicle stats,
and commentary by "shadow figures". Each page also holds a neat header
and section marker.
As I leafed thru this thing, the only real roadblock is getting pictures
for the aircraft.
BTW, I also included 3 appendices on afterbunrer speeds, old mil
equipment, and rules (house rules) about assembly and bomb bursts.
I could post it up on WWW, but I don't know where to scan the images or
transfer it to a site. I just discovered WWW this semester.
Mike
=========================================================================
Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 21:20:11 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Erik S Jameson <esj@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410240357.AA12912@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
On Sun, 23 Oct 1994, Dylan Northrup wrote:
>
> Physiological changes such as increased cone density in their eyes?
> Could qualify as a passive magical power (I forget the exact wording
It's a result of magic, but follows physics and biology just
> fine.
>
> Doc X
That is EXACTLY what I have been trying to say, in my own round about
fashion. Magic may have been the trigger for the event, but it STILL
MUST obey the laws of science. There is even enough evidence I would
claim that even magic and the casting of spells obeys certain laws. You
shamanic types may not like that, but it would appear that EVERYTHING,
including magic, MUST obey certain laws and strictures. Otherwise there
would be chaos.
And so, elves, being living creatures that must obey the
laws of biology and genetics, CANNOT be immortal because "Mother Nature"
will no allow it; it would break the rules. Yes, SR is a fantasy game
that exists only in the minds of the people who created it and play it,
but if we are to have ANY valuable discussions on the game, we MUST
assume that it is as grounded in reality as possible. Laws, even those
of "Mother Nature" can be bent and stretched, but they CANNOT be broken.
In any case, thanks for letting me rant. I just got back from the gym a
little while ago and I am exhausted, which makes me a little cranky. So
I think it's time I went home and got some sleep. Hasta...
Erik, a.k.a. the Whistler
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 15:47:08 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: 2nd Hand-fighter AGAIN!
In-Reply-To: <199410240423.OAA11747@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from
"Spellslinger" at
Oct 23, 94 09:19:18 pm
Mike writes:
> here's the critical stats on the catalog:
> 73 pages total
> Each page is dedicated to a short desc of said aircraft, vehicle stats,
> and commentary by "shadow figures". Each page also holds a neat header
> and section marker.
> As I leafed thru this thing, the only real roadblock is getting pictures
> for the aircraft.
> BTW, I also included 3 appendices on afterbunrer speeds, old mil
> equipment, and rules (house rules) about assembly and bomb bursts.
> I could post it up on WWW, but I don't know where to scan the images or
> transfer it to a site. I just discovered WWW this semester.
As for scanning the pictures, I can't help you, but Paolo is always looking
for new SR stuff for his WWW page, so you have a ready made site available.
It sounds like a pretty cool compilation though (do I hear aa little voice
in the background saying "Nerps submission"? :-))
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 08:50:17 MET
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Paolo Marcucci <marcucci@***.TS.ASTRO.IT>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions (fwd)
>
> > My ally helps as only Bjork can. And she can
> > make a mean lasagna.
> >
> > Mike aka Spellslinger
> >
> She may be able to make lasagna, but can she make a good burger? I mean,
> GOOD burger?
>
> Erik, a.k.a. the Whistler
>
Hey! One lasagna, two lasagne. Usually there are more than one in a
dish. Usually.
And, yes, can she make good burgers? I'm interested :)
Bye, Paolo
--
________________________________________________________________________
Paolo Marcucci marcucci@***.ts.astro.it
<a href="http://www.oat.ts.astro.it/marcucci/home.html">My Home
Page</a>
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 08:40:20 GMT
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Neil Smith <NSMITH@***.AC.UK>
Organization: De Montfort Uni Milton Keynes
Subject: Who wrote this? (Was: Spiked Dwarves)
Adam wrote:
> On Fri, 21 Oct 1994, Neil Smith wrote:
>
> > Adam wrote:
> ~~~~
> I didn't write the above. ;-)
Apologies! I'm sure it said "Adam". Must be going senile...
Neil.
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 10:19:31 +0200
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Darth Vader <j07c@***.UNI-BREMEN.DE>
Subject: Re: The Aliens are coming
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@**.gmd.de
In-Reply-To: <9410231950.AA31552@***.zfn.uni-bremen.de> from "Robert A.
Hayden" at Oct 23, 94 03:49:30 pm
> Say, give them an essence rating of 8 instead of six, to represent
> generations of selective breeding to make hearty slave stock. Require
> them to get Alpha-grade or better cyber because generic-ware isn't
> customized enough (sort of a play-balance offset, as well).
>
> As for magic, also give them a magic rating of 8 instead of six.
I agree about the essence, but why give them the ability to use magic.
I mean they were bred to be efficient workers, I'd say their 'soul' simply
lacks the 'qualities' or 'strength' to influence the astral. So this could
give them some sort of negative attitude towards magic - as well as some
interesting properties. Their astral signature could be weak/twisted/non-
existent.....
--
"Believe in Angels." -- The Crow
GCS d>- H s+: !g p? !au a- w+ v-(?) C+++ UA++VS++L>++++ P-- (aren't we all?)
L+>+++ 3 E--- N++ K W(+)(---) M-- !V(--) -po+(---) Y+ t++ 5+ !j(-) R+++(--)
!G tv(++) b+++ D++ B- e+ u++(-) h*(+) f+ r- n!(----) y?
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 10:21:04 +0200
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Darth Vader <j07c@***.UNI-BREMEN.DE>
Subject: Re: Spiking the ball.
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@**.gmd.de
In-Reply-To: <9410231951.AA29770@***.zfn.uni-bremen.de> from "Erik S
Jameson"
at Oct 23, 94 01:50:28 pm
> EXCUSE ME!!! Last time I checked, elves were just as mundane as humans.
> The ONLY reason they are elves is because they have a recessive gene that
> can only be activated during times of magic. In other words, they are
> bound by the same laws of science humans are. Get a grip of reality, please!
Thats what you think Eric, and quite frankly I dont think that
FASA quite shares your opinion :) Did ya read Nosferatu ?
--
"Believe in Angels." -- The Crow
GCS d>- H s+: !g p? !au a- w+ v-(?) C+++ UA++VS++L>++++ P-- (aren't we all?)
L+>+++ 3 E--- N++ K W(+)(---) M-- !V(--) -po+(---) Y+ t++ 5+ !j(-) R+++(--)
!G tv(++) b+++ D++ B- e+ u++(-) h*(+) f+ r- n!(----) y?
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 11:49:48 --100
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stefan Willkofer <stefan.willkofer@*****.PHYSIK.UNI-REGENSBURG.DE>
Subject: Dwarven Kingdom
> If a Dwarf could 'spike they would have a harder time than the
> poser elves. Elves are all +ve bonus's remember.The Dwarf would
> be obviously physically different, with the short powerful dwarf
> build. the prejudice,hate and derision of several DECADES of
> this could make a |VERY| bitter character that hates Humans.
> They would become reclusive and hide away with the freinds they
> trust, maybe in palaces,private land,the benefits of the wealth
> they'd build purely be applying dwarf beligerance to human
> money.
> Soon they'd start going to go underground, retreating further
> into the ground.
> paranoia drives them deeper.
>
> They may meet the Elder Dwarves from the 4th age DOWN THERE
>
In Germany a Shadowrun novel trilogy is being published. In the
first book the main character finds retreat from elven hitmen in
an underground city, which is a dwarven kingdom (can't remember the
name) that existed for thousands of years. This Huge Kaer is
located in\under the Rhein-Ruhr-Megasprawl and can be entered through
the old coal mines.
So this might give you something to think about.
Mephisto ==St.Willkofer==
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 11:55:21 --100
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stefan Willkofer <stefan.willkofer@*****.PHYSIK.UNI-REGENSBURG.DE>
Subject: Immortals
In Burning Bright you can find an interesting ad for an upcoming
novel trilogy. Goes something like this:
"You know the Sixth World, but before there was the Fourth World.
Find out all about Shadowrun's origins ..."
The first volume is called SCARS, the trilogy is called "The
Immortals".
I guess it will be the trilogy that starts out in ED (firts and second
vol.) and ends in SR Time (third book).
Mephisto
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 07:28:17 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Skrub <mccllstr@*****.BUCKNELL.EDU>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
>> So in other words, elves are science based, not magical based. Sorry folks.
Look, this is real simple. Look at the level of mana in 1994. Count how many
elves are around. Look at the level of mana in 2054. Count how many elves
are around. Unless you want to attribute "elfiness" to a biological weapon
unleashed in Desert Storm that took a couple of decades to be noticed you
rae going to have to accept that elves are magical, even if they cannot
wield it.
Brian McCallister The lions sing and the hills take flight.
The moon by day, and the sun by night.
Skrub Blind woman, deaf man, jackdaw fool.
Let the Lord of Chaos rule. -R. Jordan
<mccllstr@*****.bucknell.edu>
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 07:35:38 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Skrub <mccllstr@*****.BUCKNELL.EDU>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
>Under Elves:
> Commentary: Elven eyes are heavily endowed with rod structures.
> This allows them to seein dim light far better
> than sapiens.
>
>No magic there, chummer.
Here is an interesting aspect of that. If the space on the retina is being
chewed up w/ rod structures. Lack of cones. Elves see color poorer than us
poor saps. Now if I pull out my text book I'll rmember that rods are also
important for edge detection. Or was that motion. No, edge becuz you see the
motion at night but not the edge. Hmmm....
"Okay, the Elf w/ the Vindicator steps around the corner, 10 meters from you."
"I freeze. Elves can't see you if you don't move."
"That's meta-gaming, you got that info off of ShadoRN"
"Well, let me roll my Elf Lore special skill, its a, umh, 8."
"I knew I shoulda made you trash the characters when I gave you that 400th
karma point."
Brian McCallister The lions sing and the hills take flight.
The moon by day, and the sun by night.
Skrub Blind woman, deaf man, jackdaw fool.
Let the Lord of Chaos rule. -R. Jordan
<mccllstr@*****.bucknell.edu>
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 12:35:52 +0100
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stefan Struck <struck@******.INFORMATIK.UNI-BONN.DE>
Subject: Re: Spiked Dwarves
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@**.gmd.de
In-Reply-To: <9410211327.AA25299@*****.informatik.uni-bonn.de> from "Gareth
Owen" at Oct 21, 94 01:51:27 pm
Gareth writes:
>
> Spiked Dwarves?
>
> Sounds like something out of w*rh*mm*r or maybe
> a new HTH combat style?
maybe a new drink:
"Give me a beer, a campari-soda and a Spiked Dwarf..."
wonder what's in it?
Stefan
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 11:36:43 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Alex Gay <cs6004@***.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: The Aliens are coming
In-Reply-To: <m0qz5Yh-0003tdC@****.wlv.ac.uk> from "Robert A. Hayden" at
Oct
23, 94 11:12:54 am
What do you mean, Alien Nation was one of the best Sci-fi
programs? It was complete and uter dross! Why the goverments
didn't imidiatly get rid of the bubble headed freaks is beyond
me. In the end the slags would take over our planet the way
they did on there own. There is no where near enough resorces
for us, let alone these canabalistic, sickening dieted Alian
SCUM!!
Thank you for your time, and Blake-7, Babylon-5 and War of the
Worlds were all far far superior to anything Alien nation put
out.
later..
--
**************************************************************
* Avon "...but one more death will do it!" *
* Blake " Then I would be very carefull if I were you, *
* it would be ironic if the death were yours.." *
**************************************************************
* JackFrost@****.wlv.ac.uk *
**************************************************************
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 07:42:19 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Skrub <mccllstr@*****.BUCKNELL.EDU>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
>Magic may have been the trigger for the event, but it STILL
>MUST obey the laws of science. There is even enough evidence I would
>claim that even magic and the casting of spells obeys certain laws. You
>shamanic types may not like that, but it would appear that EVERYTHING,
>including magic, MUST obey certain laws and strictures.
This is a sign of a truly disturbed individual.
"But magic MUST obey natural laws, Dr."
"I see. Tell me, did your mother teach you this?"
"No, she just said that casting obeyed certain laws."
"And you disagree?"
"Of course, all of magic follows classical physics, otherwise we'd have chaos."
"So there is no Quantum Law of Theurgistics allowing for randomness within a
magical system."
"Of course not. That would violate Newton."
Brian McCallister The lions sing and the hills take flight.
The moon by day, and the sun by night.
Skrub Blind woman, deaf man, jackdaw fool.
Let the Lord of Chaos rule. -R. Jordan
<mccllstr@*****.bucknell.edu>
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 13:10:00 GMT
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Iz The Wiz! <HB011TRP01@****************.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Missing Blood(Was Re: Payment)
Two seperate sets of PC's that I GM'ed for both went into it through that
detective guy making them feel extra guilty. I didn't need to up the payment or
anything
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 13:14:55 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Micah Levy <M.Levy@**.UCL.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 24 Oct 94 07:35:38 -0400."
Well, I had a slight problem last session.
Mage: I'm casting an Improved Invisibility spell on our Decker
Dwarf Decker: Okay...Can anyone see me now?
GM: Well, you can see your own Thermographic image when you look down but no
one else can see you because they're Human.
Dwarf Decker: But I can see myself, how comes?
GM: Well, you've got Thermographic eyes and the spell bend light around you
but doesn't affect heat patterns.
Dwarf Decker: Well, if it bends light around me and the retina works by
bouncing light waves off, does that mean that I can't see anything except for
heat patterns and that humans are blinded when they use it?
GM: Er, no.
Dwarf Decker: So how does it work then?
GM: Erm, it's Magic.
Any answers anyone?
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
||Micah Levy Department of Computer Science ||
|| University College London ||
||Web Page: http://www.cs.ucl.ac.uk/people/zcacma0.html ||
||Email: M.Levy@**.ucl.ac.uk Cestor@******.com ||
|| zcacma0@**.ucl.ac.uk Micah@******.com ||
|| GCS d--@ H s g+(-) p? au--(+)>++ a- w v++ C++++($) UV++(-) P- L- 3 E-||
|| N++ K W++ M+ V-- -po+ Y++ t+ 5-- jx R++ G+(----) tv b+++ D+ B--- e+ u- ||
|| h- f n+ y? ||
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 10:20:43 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Organization: The Happy Fun Ball Brigade
Subject: Re: A debate from Tucson
In-Reply-To: Nightfox's message of Fri, 21 Oct 1994 16:42:28 -0700
<01HIJMLQSV48003D1H@******.UCC.NAU.EDU>
>>>>> "Nightfox" == Nightfox <DJWA@******.UCC.NAU.EDU>
writes:
Nightfox> Athletics/lifting - you know how to correctly position yourself,
Nightfox> steal yourself to the weight, use your weight to help, and use
Nightfox> all of your msucles in your body to help you lift.
Yeah, that sounds right, both in RL and game mechanics. But again, as I
stated, having a high skill shouldn't be the only requirement. My technique
may be the best in the world, but with a Strength of 3 I'm most definitely
NOT going to be breaking any records.
--
Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> |Happy Fun Ball may stick to certain types
http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox|of skin.
PGP Public Key: Ask for one today! |
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 09:39:25 +0600
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Jeff Norrell <norrell@*******.ME.UTEXAS.EDU>
Subject: WARNING: Burning Bright/SRII Question
By the way... I bought Burning Bright last Thursday (finally arrived here) and
had finished within two days. Good book.
Now to my question.
>>>>Space for those who haven't read Burning Bright
yet<<<<
In the book, the main character has an air elemental that he uses to guard the
office building while he is off running around. My question is this, is the
order to guard the building while he is gone considered a _remote_ service.
If not, then how remote is remote? The reason I'm asking, this came up
in a game I'm running and the player was trying to make the argument that this
should NOT be considered a remote request and the elemental will still be
bound after the patrol is over (if the elemental still owes services to the
mage). Any advice is welcomed.
-Jeff
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 09:39:16 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Bands in SR
From the depths of his tower, the Magister speaks:
I would not use any mind-control spells during the performance. The
only spells that would be used would be illusion spells. Why use a
trid screen to create pictures when you can use magic. For that
matter, why use anything when you can use magic???
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 09:44:08 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Elves (Was RE: Spike This!)
I don't think that I would classify each nation as Seelie and Unseelie.
Aren't there elements of both in each?
Magister
"Life is pain. Anyone who tells you differently is selling something."
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 10:48:31 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Organization: The Happy Fun Ball Brigade
Subject: Re: Bands in SR
In-Reply-To: Magister's message of Mon, 24 Oct 1994 09:39:16 EST
<2154E3DD4@*****.vinu.edu>
>>>>> "Magister" == Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.edu>
writes:
Magister> I would not use any mind-control spells during the performance.
It doesn't matter. If the crowd /thinks/ you're using mind altering spells
on them, you're in big trouble.
Magister> The only spells that would be used would be illusion spells.
And how does a non-mage know the difference?
Magister> Why use a trid screen to create pictures when you can use magic.
Magister> For that matter, why use anything when you can use magic???
Lynchings tend to put severe cramps in most performers' lifestyles.
--
Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> |Do not use Happy Fun Ball on concrete.
http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox|
PGP Public Key: Ask for one today! |
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 10:50:59 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Organization: The Happy Fun Ball Brigade
Subject: Re: Elves (Was RE: Spike This!)
In-Reply-To: Magister's message of Mon, 24 Oct 1994 09:44:08 EST
<229DC7DE8@*****.vinu.edu>
>>>>> "Magister" == Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.edu>
writes:
Magister> I don't think that I would classify each nation as Seelie and
Magister> Unseelie. Aren't there elements of both in each?
Yes, because they're not really Fey, just human immitations based on
stories. The courts are archtypical; they could not exist in this reality.
--
Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> |Do not taunt Happy Fun Ball.
http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox|
PGP Public Key: Ask for one today! |
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 09:50:41 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
The Magister casts the "neverending thwap" spell on Wesley W.
Walker for such a childish, imbecilic posting.
Magister
"To the death!!! NO!!! To the pain."
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 10:01:35 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Magic (was Re: bands in SR)
Methinks our SS Rat has a fear of magic. Anyone or any group trying
to lynch me would find it to be quite a monumental undertaking. I
suppose I can see your point on how would a non-mage know the
difference. I tend to see things from a mana POV. But, with half the
crowd zoned out on one the designer drugs that are around, would
they even know I was using magic at all???
Magister
"An all nath rac, uth denvey........." (Excalibur)
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 10:08:15 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
Of course, magic follows natural laws. How else could we
magic-types use the stuff? However, these laws are laws of NATURE,
not, science. I would think that anyone who aspires to The Art, is
probably a bit disturbed. Thank all the gods.
Magister
"An it harm none, do as ye will."
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 01:18:52 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
In-Reply-To: <199410232148.HAA00945@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from
"Shadowdancer" at
Oct 23, 94 04:46:44 pm
Shadowdancer writes:
> Second, I believe that combat pools refresh at turns rather than
> actions. That's how I read it in the book. And that's how we have
> been playing it. Otherwise, you don't get the way wiz sound of
> someone sobbing as they realize that they just spend their entire CP
> for that last shot, only to be staring down a vindicater next action.
Well, technically you are wrong (check out page 84 of SR II), but as a house
rule there is nothing wrong with it, it has a habit of making games rather
deadly though.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 01:28:07 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
In-Reply-To: <199410240324.NAA10251@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Robert A.
Hayden" at Oct 23, 94 10:20:01 pm
Our Fearless Leader writes:
> SRII: Page 36
>
> Under Elves:
> Commentary: Elven eyes are heavily endowed with rod structures.
> This allows them to seein dim light far better
> than sapiens.
>
> No magic there, chummer.
FoF: Page 81
Under Low-Light and Thermal Systems:
Natural Low-Light and Thermal Vision: Though a certain biological
basis exists to explain this
visual ability, much of the
effect can only be explained
through the application of
magic.
Now, this is in the section of "Rules", which is, admittantly, "...rules
expansions, clarifications, and options...", but I see this as a definite
clarification, and FoF was printed after SR II...
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 11:30:06 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Organization: The Happy Fun Ball Brigade
Subject: Re: Magic (was Re: bands in SR)
In-Reply-To: Magister's message of Mon, 24 Oct 1994 10:01:35 EST
<274B46823@*****.vinu.edu>
>>>>> "Magister" == Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
writes:
Magister> Methinks our SS Rat has a fear of magic.
Yup. Magic is power, and power is something to be feared.
Besides, I'm just going by the information being given in Shadowbeat. Magic
at concerts is a Bad Thing(tm).
Magister> Anyone or any group trying to lynch me would find it to be quite
Magister> a monumental undertaking.
I dunnow. Have you ever been lynched before? :)
Or, assuming that you did manage to put down the entire uprising by
yourself. I can guarantee that someone's going to get killed, and you're
responsible. There goes your career.
Magister> I suppose I can see your point on how would a non-mage know the
Magister> difference. I tend to see things from a mana POV.
Perspective is a wonderful thing, neh? Try seeing it from security's or the
proprieter's point of view.
Magister> But, with half the crowd zoned out on one the designer drugs that
Magister> are around, would they even know I was using magic at all???
What about the other half that isn't stoned out of their collective gourds?
All it takes is one person to holler out something like, "get out of my
mind!" and you've got a riot on your hands.
--
Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> |Do not taunt Happy Fun Ball.
http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox|
PGP Public Key: Ask for one today! |
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 10:28:57 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Foci question???
With stacked foci like that, you could go around levelling buildings!
Not that that is a bad thing.......
Magister
Always on the lookout for a BBS(Bigger, Badder Spell)
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 01:33:16 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: WARNING: Burning Bright/SRII Question
In-Reply-To: <199410241444.AAA24576@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Jeff
Norrell" at
Oct 24, 94 09:39:25 am
Jeff writes:
> >>>>Space for those who haven't read Burning Bright
yet<<<<
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> In the book, the main character has an air elemental that he uses to guard the
> office building while he is off running around. My question is this, is the
> order to guard the building while he is gone considered a _remote_ service.
> If not, then how remote is remote? The reason I'm asking, this came up
> in a game I'm running and the player was trying to make the argument that this
> should NOT be considered a remote request and the elemental will still be
> bound after the patrol is over (if the elemental still owes services to the
> mage). Any advice is welcomed.
Well, on page 141 of SR II, it says "With the exception of remote serive
(see below), the elemental must remain within line-of-sight of the mage. The
use of astral senses, clairvoyant senses, or other magical senses fulfill
this requirement, but electronic viewing does not.". With that I would say
that unless you either keep an eye on it (in one of the aforementioned
ways), then you have to class it as a remote service.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 16:37:01 +0100
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Donald Walli <dwalli@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
In-Reply-To: <199410241520.LAA15780@***.edu>; from "Damion Milliken" at
Oct 25,
94 1:18 am
>Shadowdancer writes:
>> Second, I believe that combat pools refresh at turns rather than
>> actions. That's how I read it in the book. And that's how we have
>> been playing it. Otherwise, you don't get the way wiz sound of
>> someone sobbing as they realize that they just spend their entire CP
>> for that last shot, only to be staring down a vindicater next action.
>
Damion Milliken writes:
>Well, technically you are wrong (check out page 84 of SR II), but as a house
>rule there is nothing wrong with it, it has a habit of making games rather
>deadly though.
I have to agree with Damion here: the SRII rules state that your CP refreshes
on each phase in which you get an action. [Initiative 12: on 12, you get your
CP; it doesn't refresh until 2, so if you burn it all on 12, and someone
stitches you on 7, you'll be wishing you were a troll]. And giving only one
CP per *turn* will get lots of people geeked real fast. Depends on how
much gaming time you want to waste watching your players make up new char-
acters, I guess. :/
On another topic: has anyone had much luck integrating vehicle movement
and character combat? We've been having lots of... discussions, shall
we say... about resolving these two (as vehicle movement happens in real
time, and the SR combat system is based on an arbitrary time scale,
depending on the reaction speeds of the combatants).
Don Walli
dwalli@***.edu
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 10:40:40 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Matt <mosbun@******.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: Re: The Aliens are coming
>You never know. I have learned to never under-estimate the ability of
>humans to hate something simply because it's different.
'Course, it'd be nice to not OVERestimate the ability of humans to hate,
either.
Matt
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 10:43:26 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Matt <mosbun@******.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
>SRII: Page 36
>
>Under Elves:
> Commentary: Elven eyes are heavily endowed with rod structures.
> This allows them to seein dim light far better
> than sapiens.
>
>No magic there, chummer.
>
>
>____ Robert A. Hayden <=> hayden@*******.mankato.msus.edu
Yeah, but what caused the increase in the rod structures?
Magic, I'd say.
Matt
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 01:57:22 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
In-Reply-To: <199410241549.BAA25847@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Donald
Walli" at
Oct 24, 94 04:37:01 pm
Don writes:
> On another topic: has anyone had much luck integrating vehicle movement
> and character combat? We've been having lots of... discussions, shall
> we say... about resolving these two (as vehicle movement happens in real
> time, and the SR combat system is based on an arbitrary time scale,
> depending on the reaction speeds of the combatants).
Try dividing the total movement of the vehicle this turn (usually its
cruising unless otherwise specified) by the (number of phases in the turn)/10
and have the vehicle move 1/whatever of it's movement on the 1st, then the
11th and so on turns. An eg might be needed here. Say we have 27 phases (ie
Mr. Speedy Sammy got 27 inititive), then the vehicle move 1/3 of its
movement on phase 1, another third on phase 11 and it has moved it's full
movement on phase 21. It's not the most exact method, but it gets the
feeling across and doesn't require heaps of bookwork.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 15:10:26 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Gareth Owen <glowen1@*****.NHS.GOV.UK>
Subject: Re: Bands in SR
In-Reply-To: <9410241449.aa03332@****.demon.co.uk> from "Stainless Steel
Rat"
at Oct 24, 94 10:48:31 am
>
> >>>>> "Magister" == Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.edu>
writes:
>
> Magister> I would not use any mind-control spells during the performance.
>
> It doesn't matter. If the crowd /thinks/ you're using mind altering spells
> on them, you're in big trouble.
>
> Magister> The only spells that would be used would be illusion spells.
>
> And how does a non-mage know the difference?
>
> Magister> Why use a trid screen to create pictures when you can use magic.
> Magister> For that matter, why use anything when you can use magic???
>
> Lynchings tend to put severe cramps in most performers' lifestyles.
>
> --
> Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> |Do not use Happy Fun Ball on concrete.
> http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox|
> PGP Public Key: Ask for one today! |
Nah, I think Magister's right, illusion spells could create really
impressive spectacles at concerts, special effects for stage plays, etc.
GLO
--
Gareth Owen | Mail: glowen1@*****.nhs.gov.uk
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 16:12:15 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Micah Levy <M.Levy@**.UCL.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 24 Oct 94 16:37:01 +0100."
> On another topic: has anyone had much luck integrating vehicle movement
> and character combat? We've been having lots of... discussions, shall
> we say... about resolving these two (as vehicle movement happens in real
> time, and the SR combat system is based on an arbitrary time scale,
> depending on the reaction speeds of the combatants).
>
> Don Walli
> dwalli@***.edu
The way I do it in that sort of case is to treat it as Vehicle Combat for the
most part where those in the vehicles are restricted by the successes from the
Position Test. Anyone outside would be under no such restriction and could act
normally.
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
||Micah Levy Department of Computer Science ||
|| University College London ||
||Web Page: http://www.cs.ucl.ac.uk/people/zcacma0.html ||
||Email: M.Levy@**.ucl.ac.uk Cestor@******.com ||
|| zcacma0@**.ucl.ac.uk Micah@******.com ||
|| GCS d--@ H s g+(-) p? au--(+)>++ a- w v++ C++++($) UV++(-) P- L- 3 E-||
|| N++ K W++ M+ V-- -po+ Y++ t+ 5-- jx R++ G+(----) tv b+++ D+ B--- e+ u- ||
|| h- f n+ y? ||
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 11:15:25 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Wesley W. Walker" <wwalker@****.UARK.EDU>
Subject: Re: A debate from Tucson
In-Reply-To: <199410221913.OAA28717@****.uark.edu>
Huh??
\||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||/
- Wes W. Walker (wwalker@****.uark.edu) * "Truth is well disguised lie and -
- CSCI Major and General Slave * never immediately apparent." -
- Artiste Wanna-be (accepting donations)* -Me -
/||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||\
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 11:23:48 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Wesley W. Walker" <wwalker@****.UARK.EDU>
Subject: Re: Spiking the ball.
In-Reply-To: <199410232051.PAA25489@****.uark.edu>
>
> EXCUSE ME!!! Last time I checked, elves were just as mundane as humans.
> The ONLY reason they are elves is because they have a recessive gene that
> can only be activated during times of magic. In other words, they are
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Case and point. Thank you.
\||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||/
- Wes W. Walker (wwalker@****.uark.edu) * "Truth is well disguised lie and -
- CSCI Major and General Slave * never immediately apparent." -
- Artiste Wanna-be (accepting donations)* -Me -
/||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||\
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 11:39:16 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Wesley W. Walker" <wwalker@****.UARK.EDU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
In-Reply-To: <199410241503.KAA02605@****.uark.edu>
> The Magister casts the "neverending thwap" spell on Wesley W.
> Walker for such a childish, imbecilic posting.
One more time for the slow... IT WAS A JOKE!!!!!
CATCH UP!
Jeeze.
\||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||/
- Wes W. Walker (wwalker@****.uark.edu) * "Truth is well disguised lie and -
- CSCI Major and General Slave * never immediately apparent." -
- Artiste Wanna-be (accepting donations)* -Me -
/||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||\
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 11:42:24 EDT
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Michel Racine <racine@********.HYDRO.QC.CA>
Subject: Re: Bands in SR
> >From the depths of his tower, the Magister speaks:
>
> I would not use any mind-control spells during the performance. The
> only spells that would be used would be illusion spells. Why use a
> trid screen to create pictures when you can use magic. For that
> matter, why use anything when you can use magic???
>
Because magick drains power and energy. Try casting high quality
illusion spells for 2 or 3 hours, during all the show.
Devices such as a trid picture let you present special effects without
taxing nobody.
But the mix of illusion spells and trid picture would make a great show.
And what about the price to have a mage on the show? *ouch*
-Racine
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 15:56:42 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Gareth Owen <glowen1@*****.NHS.GOV.UK>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
In-Reply-To: <9410241510.aa11958@****.demon.co.uk> from "Magister" at Oct
24,
94 10:08:15 am
>
> Of course, magic follows natural laws. How else could we
> magic-types use the stuff? However, these laws are laws of NATURE,
> not, science. I would think that anyone who aspires to The Art, is
> probably a bit disturbed. Thank all the gods.
>
> Magister
>
> "An it harm none, do as ye will."
>
The laws of science are the laws of nature, scientists study
natural things
GLO
--
Gareth Owen | Mail: glowen1@*****.nhs.gov.uk
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 10:29:20 PST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Debbie Giesbrecht <Debbie_Giesbrecht@**.CHIRON.COM>
Subject: House rules for a newbie
Greetings,
As a newbie player and a GM, I have found the combat system to be kind
of confusing and slow. Most of this is probably because I don't know
exactly what I'm doing. These are some of the problems that I've run
into and I could use a little advice. Perhaps this will let some of
you veterans reminisce about the old days when you were searching
through the rulebooks too.
I've noticed that basically there is a separate combat system for each
class. I know its not written that way, but it comes out that way.
For example, the rigger needs to have a position test, the ranged
combat and melee combat are different, the magic system is hard to
keep straight with Astral reaction vs. regular reaction etc., and I
don't think there is any need to comment about decking. It is a field
unto itself.
I was just wondering if there is a simplified version or some house
rules that people have put together to help keep the game rolling. My
gaming style is such that I'm more interested in roleplaying than
rollplaying and I don't want to spend a good portion of my game
dealing with dice.
For that matter, I'm interested in any good house rules.
Debbie
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 10:14:54 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Adam Getchell <acgetche@****.UCDAVIS.EDU>
Subject: Re: Short Stories Found
In-Reply-To: <9410232047.AA00663@********.engr.ucdavis.edu>
Insight on the second story:
That person has been doing magic beyond where people think it can
be done. Because he is used to making magic with the limited mana of
Beyond, coming to mana-rich Earth allows him far more power and subtlety.
Knight knows about the Invae, and checking Corporate Shadowfiles
one can find that Ares has the best public image. As a "public service"
(and perhaps to boost profits and test weapons, although perhaps Ares
develops weapons *because* Knight knows of the coming Scourge) Ares is
eliminating nests.
I'd guess this mage is playing with magic in the Daedalus, if he
hasn't already contacted spirits from Beyond (check Germany sourcebook
about the spirits summoned near the old impact crater).
<evil grin>
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
|Adam Getchell|acgetche@****.engr.ucdavis.edu | ez000270@*******.ucdavis.edu |
| acgetchell |"Invincibility is in oneself, vulnerability is in the opponent"|
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 13:56:45 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Organization: The Happy Fun Ball Brigade
Subject: Re: Bands in SR
In-Reply-To: Gareth Owen's message of Mon, 24 Oct 1994 15:10:26 +0000
<9410241510.AA03232@*******.hq.gha.nhs.uk>
>>>>> "Gareth" == Gareth Owen <glowen1@*****.NHS.GOV.UK>
writes:
Gareth> Nah, I think Magister's right, illusion spells could create really
Gareth> impressive spectacles at concerts, special effects for stage plays,
Gareth> etc.
And again I'll ask, "how is a non-mage to know the difference between an
illusion he's seing with his eyes and an illusion with his mind's eye?"
Extrapolating from that, if the illusion is being projected directly into
his mind, what else is being put there?
No, I'll agree with what's in Shadowbeat. Using magic at shows is a really
bad idea.
--
Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> |Ingredients of Happy Fun Ball include an
http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox|unknown glowing substance which fell to
PGP Public Key: Ask for one today! |Earth, presumably from outer space.
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 18:37:05 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Micah Levy <M.Levy@**.UCL.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Short Stories Found
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 24 Oct 94 10:14:54 MST."
Sounds interesting, but 1) Could that not equally have been, say Harlequin?
2) What is Daedalus?
Remember, that the person impersonating Knight knew the Invae for what they
were.
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
||Micah Levy Department of Computer Science ||
|| University College London ||
||Web Page: http://www.cs.ucl.ac.uk/people/zcacma0.html ||
||Email: M.Levy@**.ucl.ac.uk Cestor@******.com ||
|| zcacma0@**.ucl.ac.uk Micah@******.com ||
|| GCS d--@ H s g+(-) p? au--(+)>++ a- w v++ C++++($) UV++(-) P- L- 3 E-||
|| N++ K W++ M+ V-- -po+ Y++ t+ 5-- jx R++ G+(----) tv b+++ D+ B--- e+ u- ||
|| h- f n+ y? ||
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 11:45:54 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Adam Getchell <acgetche@****.UCDAVIS.EDU>
Subject: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
In-Reply-To: <9410241317.AA04044@********.engr.ucdavis.edu>
On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Micah Levy wrote:
Improved Invisibility (Physical) works by bending light around you.
Vision is a passive sense, not an active one. This means that
light shines on the object, and then is randomly scattered into the
environment where it is picked up by detectors (eyes).
If light bends around the object, then no light reflects from the
objet and there is no light to detect the object with. Hence, it becomes
invisible. But now, the object actively radiates heat into the
environment, and bent or not the heat is still going to escape into the
environment, where it can be detected.
Ultrasound is an active sensor, meaning it sends out pulses of
sound which bounce off objects and reflect back into the environment,
where it can be detected. Because Invisibility does not affect Sound, it
cannot hide from Ultrasound. Because Invisibility does not change the
heat signature of the recipient, it cannot prevent the target from
emitting heat, and thus becoming detectable via Thermographic vision.
> ||Micah Levy Department of Computer Science ||
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
|Adam Getchell|acgetche@****.engr.ucdavis.edu | ez000270@*******.ucdavis.edu |
| acgetchell |"Invincibility is in oneself, vulnerability is in the opponent"|
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 14:02:36 +0600
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Jeff Norrell <norrell@*******.ME.UTEXAS.EDU>
Subject: Re: House rules for a newbie
When in doubt, wing it!
As long as you're consistent, most people won't complain. I tend to gloss over
some of the nit-picking combat rules myself but the players don't seem to mind.
However, if your players are the rules lawyers types, Good Luck.
-Jeff
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 19:10:01 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Micah Levy <M.Levy@**.UCL.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 24 Oct 94 11:45:54 MST."
I hear what you are saying, but the point my player was making was that
since the light was being bent around him then surely it couldn't bounce off
his retinas and so if he hadn't had thermographic vision he would have been
blinded.
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
||Micah Levy Department of Computer Science ||
|| University College London ||
||Web Page: http://www.cs.ucl.ac.uk/people/zcacma0.html ||
||Email: M.Levy@**.ucl.ac.uk Cestor@******.com ||
|| zcacma0@**.ucl.ac.uk Micah@******.com ||
|| GCS d--@ H s g+(-) p? au--(+)>++ a- w v++ C++++($) UV++(-) P- L- 3 E-||
|| N++ K W++ M+ V-- -po+ Y++ t+ 5-- jx R++ G+(----) tv b+++ D+ B--- e+ u- ||
|| h- f n+ y? ||
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 15:41:28 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Marc A Renouf <jormung@*****.UMICH.EDU>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
In-Reply-To: <199410232352.TAA25344@*****.engin.umich.edu>
On Sun, 23 Oct 1994, Wow, Reality. That's a switch wrote:
> Personally, I wish FASA had drawn more on mythology and less on science,
> or their own imaginations. Kind of like Misty's Serrated Edge novels. Who
> says magic can't overcome science?
Actually, I like the fact that they have "scientific"
explanations for many of the magical aspects of the game, like
goblinization genes. It gives a plausible, believable reason for why the
myths exist in the first place. It makes the myths that much cooler
because you can see where they came from.
Marc
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 14:43:34 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Magic (was Re: bands in SR)
Just because it's in Shadowbeat does not mean that it can't be done.
I interpreted it to mean magic that is harmful. You definitely would
not want to cast mana spells or anything that would hurt someone. All
I'm saying is simple, ethreal illusions. Ones that are made to
enhance the music, not control anyone.
Magister
"You fool!!! You've just committed one of the classic blunders!!!"
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 14:47:30 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
Deep within his tower, The Magister speaks:
My group plays the I.I. spell, thusly:
Since you are invisible to normal sight and technological sensing
devices, it would make you invisible to thermographic lenses as well.
That's the way we play it.
Arcanely yours,
The Magister
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 15:55:08 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Organization: The Happy Fun Ball Brigade
Subject: Re: Magic (was Re: bands in SR)
In-Reply-To: Magister's message of Mon, 24 Oct 1994 14:43:34 EST
<727C8010B@*****.vinu.edu>
>>>>> "Magister" == Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
writes:
Magister> Just because it's in Shadowbeat does not mean that it can't be
Magister> done.
But, according to Shadowbeat, the last time illusions were used during a
concert there were a number of deaths in the ensuing riot. What caused the
riot? People thought that their minds were being controlled. They weren't,
but they /thought/ they were. That's enough to cause a major problem.
You wanna get lynched, that's fine by me. But don't cry when it happens.
--
Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> |Do not taunt Happy Fun Ball.
http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox|
PGP Public Key: Ask for one today! |
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 15:54:49 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Marc A Renouf <jormung@*****.UMICH.EDU>
Subject: Re: A debate from Tucson
In-Reply-To: <199410241421.KAA17470@*****.engin.umich.edu>
On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Stainless Steel Rat wrote:
> Nightfox> Athletics/lifting - you know how to correctly position yourself,
> Nightfox> steal yourself to the weight, use your weight to help, and use
> Nightfox> all of your msucles in your body to help you lift.
>
> Yeah, that sounds right, both in RL and game mechanics. But again, as I
> stated, having a high skill shouldn't be the only requirement. My technique
> may be the best in the world, but with a Strength of 3 I'm most definitely
> NOT going to be breaking any records.
Yes, but lifting is determined MOSTLY by strength. The maximum
that a character can lift is Strength x 20 kilograms + (StrengthD6 kilos)
+ athletics successes for a limited time. As you can see, even with a
but-high skill, people with even one more strength point are going to
outclass you completely unless you get lucky. I think the above system
is correct, and if not it's awful close. I don't have my book handy. So
even Farmer Billy with a strength of 6 and no athletics skill is going to
outlift MR. Spiffy with Strength 4 and athletics 6.
Marc
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 15:00:42 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: The Aliens are coming
Just a tad on the xenophobic side, are we, Mr. Frost???
Magister
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 16:06:08 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Skrub <mccllstr@*****.BUCKNELL.EDU>
Subject: Re: Bands in SR
>But the mix of illusion spells and trid picture would make a great show.
>And what about the price to have a mage on the show? *ouch*
Not owning or having read Shadowbeat... I can understand mind effecting
magic terrifying governments. In typical governmental manner, they slap a
blanket law that can cover any possible contingency. magic is illegal in
public performances. Heck, magic of a non-healing nature is probably illegal
almost anywhere anyway if you think about it. Healing probably is too.
However, almost anything fun is illegal. I mean sex outside of marriage is
still illegal in some parts of the US, who cares about age or willingness -
they weren't married. Public opinion is the more important thing, will it be
inforced. In the Tir (on the European side of the puddle)has regular
performances involving magic, if I remember correctly from the sourcebook. I
imagine UCAS, CAS, would both illegalize it, whether the Native American
Nations would is another question, magic is part of their heritage. Hmmm....
Of course there is another aspect. Anyone know an area-effect spell big
enough to effect the whole audience? There is a practical limit.
RS: "So Mr. Gremlin, you admit to using magic in your stage performances?"
G : "More than just illusion, mind-affecting dweomers have a highly
beneficial effect."
RS: "Using and advocating mind-altering magics is illegal in almost all of
the countries you perform in. Aside from that most people don't use mind
controlling magics and in fact are quite violently against it. How do
you justify forcing it on them?"
G : "Mind-altering magic is just the pot of the early days of music as we
know it. No one has ever proven detrimonious effect, and we should be
free to
engage in the activities we choose. There was an article written almost
three-hundred years ago upon which almost all modern governments...
-Skrub
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 15:07:13 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Magic (was Re: bands in SR)
Magic is indeed Power and that is a Good Thing(tm).
An illusion spell does convince a person that they are actually seeing
what they think they are seeing, but, the type of magic I am referring
to is something akin to a hologram. It would be floating in the air and
would be related to whatever song the band is playing. A good
quality illusion would enhance a performance.
I forgot about the SSR's code against never killing anyone.
I'm not quite that magnanimous.
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 15:08:30 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: A debate from Tucson
Walker wrote: "Huh?"
And he calls me slow??? Geez!
Magister
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 16:21:00 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Organization: The Happy Fun Ball Brigade
Subject: Re: Magic (was Re: bands in SR)
In-Reply-To: Magister's message of Mon, 24 Oct 1994 15:07:13 EST
<78CC77FD5@*****.vinu.edu>
>>>>> "Magister" == Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
writes:
Magister> An illusion spell does convince a person that they are actually
Magister> seeing what they think they are seeing, but, the type of magic I
Magister> am referring to is something akin to a hologram. It would be
Magister> floating in the air and would be related to whatever song the
Magister> band is playing. A good quality illusion would enhance a
Magister> performance.
You're still missing the point. It doesn't matter what spells you're using,
this does not alter the fact that YOU ARE CASTING SPELLS AT THE AUDIENCE.
They don't know the difference between some entertaining illusion and a mob
mind spell, but as a rule the average joe is tremendously afraid of magic,
any magic. If anyone in the audience gets it in their head that you're
trying to control the crowd, doesn't matter if it's true or not, and he
gets other people believing it, which is really easy in that kind of
situation, then you WILL have a riot on your hands, and YOU are responsible
for it. Now what are you going to do? Fireball the audience into submission?
Magister> I forgot about the SSR's code against never killing anyone.
Magister> I'm not quite that magnanimous.
Hell of a way to treat your fans.
--
Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> |When not in use, Happy Fun Ball should be
http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox|returned to its special container and kept
PGP Public Key: Ask for one today! |under refrigeration.
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 21:41:50 +0100
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Donald Walli <dwalli@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: Immortality and Elves vs. Science and Laws of Nature
In-Reply-To: <199410241905.PAA11996@***.edu>; from "Automatic digest
processor" at Oct 24, 94 8:03 pm
>Date: Sun, 23 Oct 1994 21:20:11 -0700
>From: Erik S Jameson <esj@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
>Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
>
Whistler writes:
>And so, elves, being living creatures that must obey the
>laws of biology and genetics, CANNOT be immortal because "Mother Nature"
>will no allow it; it would break the rules.
Ahh... perhaps not. Have you looked at any of the (fairly) recent literature
from biology (esp. marine biology) on sharks and sturgeon? It strongly
suggests that some of these fish could indeed be "immortal," because
it appears that they never stop growing and regenerating--unless they are
killed by some outside agency. Admittedly, they grow slowly by human
terms--but what's to say that elves don't? If these fish can be immortal
in our real (?!?!?) world, why can't elves be similar?
>Yes, SR is a fantasy game
>that exists only in the minds of the people who created it and play it,
>but if we are to have ANY valuable discussions on the game, we MUST
>assume that it is as grounded in reality as possible. Laws, even those
>of "Mother Nature" can be bent and stretched, but they CANNOT be broken.
Well, I think that makes it a *whole* lot easier for many of us to deal
with the game conceptually, but what's to say that we know both all the
laws of Nature and all the loopholes in those laws?
>In any case, thanks for letting me rant.
You're welcome. ;)
>Erik, a.k.a. the Whistler
Don Walli
dwalli@***.edu
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 16:29:49 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Sam Thomas <sinbad@********.COM>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
>On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Micah Levy wrote:
>
> Improved Invisibility (Physical) works by bending light around you.
> Vision is a passive sense, not an active one. This means that
>light shines on the object, and then is randomly scattered into the
>environment where it is picked up by detectors (eyes).
> If light bends around the object, then no light reflects from the
>objet and there is no light to detect the object with. Hence, it becomes
>invisible. But now, the object actively radiates heat into the
>environment, and bent or not the heat is still going to escape into the
>environment, where it can be detected.
> Ultrasound is an active sensor, meaning it sends out pulses of
>sound which bounce off objects and reflect back into the environment,
>where it can be detected. Because Invisibility does not affect Sound, it
>cannot hide from Ultrasound. Because Invisibility does not change the
>heat signature of the recipient, it cannot prevent the target from
>emitting heat, and thus becoming detectable via Thermographic vision.
>
>
This is a common misconception, it has been resolved easliy. Light has to
obey the laws of physics but magic only has to obey the laws of "MetaPhysics".
Metaphysics does not equal physics. Improved invisilbity follows metaphysisc not
physics. Whether it bends, warps or cludges it works, ITS MAGIC not applied
engineering!! ;-)
Sinbad Sam
Law Of Contagion
Law Of Similarity
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 17:53:13 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "J.D. Falk" <jdfalk@****.CAIS.COM>
Subject: Re: The Aliens are coming
In-Reply-To: <199410240925.FAA14372@****.cais.com>
On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Darth Vader wrote:
> I agree about the essence, but why give them the ability to use magic.
> I mean they were bred to be efficient workers, I'd say their 'soul' simply
> lacks the 'qualities' or 'strength' to influence the astral.
That makes sense...especially since magic only happens within the
atmosphere of (what's left of) Earth. An interesting twist could be that
on their home planet(s) they _could_ do magic, but then they were captured
and selectively bred as workers off-planet (where their magic didn't
work), and now they're extremely wary of relying on magic for anything (it
let them down before....)
> So this could
> give them some sort of negative attitude towards magic - as well as some
> interesting properties. Their astral signature could be weak/twisted/non-
> existent.....
Different, anyway...remember that "posessed" (meta)humans have the
aura of the posessing spirit; these aliens could simply have a
strange-looking aura as compared to Earth natives.
/-----------------\
| J.D. Falk | All the world's indeed a stage
| jdfalk@****.com | And, damnit, I'm a stagehand.
\-----------------/
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 17:55:40 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "J.D. Falk" <jdfalk@****.CAIS.COM>
Subject: Re: Dwarven Kingdom
In-Reply-To: <199410241050.GAA15053@****.cais.com>
On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Stefan Willkofer wrote:
> In Germany a Shadowrun novel trilogy is being published. In the
> first book the main character finds retreat from elven hitmen in
> an underground city, which is a dwarven kingdom (can't remember the
> name) that existed for thousands of years. This Huge Kaer is
> located in\under the Rhein-Ruhr-Megasprawl and can be entered through
> the old coal mines.
Interesting! It sounds as if Shadowrun is very popular in
Germany...is that a valid assumption?
Might be worth asking the DLoH if it's going to be translated
into English. Do you remember the title?
--------------------------------------------------<jdfalk@****.com>--------
"Swing low, sweet Cadillac (Coming for to carry me home)
Swing low, sweet Cadillac (Coming for to carry me home)
I looked over Jordan, and what did I see? (Coming for to carry me home)
An Eldorado, a-comin' for me. (Coming for to carry me home)"
-Dizzy Gillespie and Jim Henson's Muppets
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 18:02:44 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "J.D. Falk" <jdfalk@****.CAIS.COM>
Subject: Re: Spiked Dwarves
In-Reply-To: <199410241137.HAA15645@****.cais.com>
On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Stefan Struck wrote:
> maybe a new drink:
> "Give me a beer, a campari-soda and a Spiked Dwarf..."
> wonder what's in it?
Hmmm...perhaps birch beer (sorta like root beer but usually
sweeter) and something strong but subtle, like gin.
And a joke that'd be _much_ funnier after drinking a few of 'em?
"Hey, Bartender -- gimme a spiked dwarf on the rocks!"
--------------------------------------------------<jdfalk@****.com>--------
"Swing low, sweet Cadillac (Coming for to carry me home)
Swing low, sweet Cadillac (Coming for to carry me home)
I looked over Jordan, and what did I see? (Coming for to carry me home)
An Eldorado, a-comin' for me. (Coming for to carry me home)"
-Dizzy Gillespie and Jim Henson's Muppets
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 17:20:46 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: The Aliens are coming
> I agree about the essence, but why give them the ability to use
magic.
> I mean they were bred to be efficient workers, I'd say their 'soul'
simply
> lacks the 'qualities' or 'strength' to influence the astral. So this
could
> give them some sort of negative attitude towards magic - as well as
some
> interesting properties. Their astral signature could be
weak/twisted/non-
> existent.....
But, you are not taking into consideration what these aliens are like.
Maybe they are naturally magical. Maybe what we consider magic
is their science. Or that since they were bred to adapt well, in a few
months, magic will become a part of them.
> --
> "Believe in Angels." -- The Crow
>
> GCS d>- H s+: !g p? !au a- w+ v-(?) C+++ UA++VS++L>++++ P--
(aren't we all?)
> L+>+++ 3 E--- N++ K W(+)(---) M-- !V(--) -po+(---) Y+ t++ 5+ !j(-)
R+++(--)
> !G tv(++) b+++ D++ B- e+ u++(-) h*(+) f+ r- n!(----) y?
>
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 15:22:44 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Adam Getchell <acgetche@****.UCDAVIS.EDU>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
In-Reply-To: <9410242126.AA07767@********.engr.ucdavis.edu>
On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Sam Thomas wrote:
> This is a common misconception, it has been resolved easliy. Light has to
> obey the laws of physics but magic only has to obey the laws of
"MetaPhysics".
Which are laws nonetheless in any empirical sense, so your
argument is fallacious.
> Metaphysics does not equal physics. Improved invisilbity follows metaphysisc not
> physics. Whether it bends, warps or cludges it works, ITS MAGIC not applied
> engineering!! ;-)
Read the worldview of the mage, in _The Grimoire II_, and you
will see that the above is blatantly not true, as the entire basis for
the mage's way of doing things is "Magic as Science". Oh, and read some
real magic books, like P.E.I. Bonewitz' _Real Magick_, and your arguments
are disproven (consider that Bonewitz had experts from all fields of
science, including some Nobel laureates at Berkeley, review his work to
insure it contained no contradictions to modern science.)
Physics is not just Newton's Laws or Quantum Mechanics, but a
conceptual framework for understanding natural phenomena. It necessarily
has a scaffolding constructed of mathematics, but like any scaffolding
the framework can be torn down and one is still left with the laws of
nature.
> Sinbad Sam
> Law Of Contagion
Here is a law that describes a "magical phenomenon", basically a
physical law not expressed in mathematical form.
> Law Of Similarity
And here is yet another one. You have disproven your own remarks!
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
|Adam Getchell|acgetche@****.engr.ucdavis.edu | ez000270@*******.ucdavis.edu |
| acgetchell |"Invincibility is in oneself, vulnerability is in the opponent"|
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 17:26:10 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
Elves can use magic though! My elven character for Shadowrun is a
Sea-Druid. She uses magic just fine. The only problem and
arguement that people might have is that when creating a elven
magician in Shadowrun, all the rest of the stuff gets royally fragged
because all the good stuff is taken up by the fact that the character is
a elf (or any other meta-human race). It is possible for elves to be
magicians, just with all the drawbacks, it is very unlikely.
As for the idea that elves are immortal, you'll just have to find one
and ask them, because since there are no elves, it's kinda hard to
find out when (or if) the elves are actually immortal.
One last note...since the SRII black book never actually comes out
and says it, it would be left up to us for discussions like this???
A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
and smile.
-Star-
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 17:30:55 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: The Aliens are coming
> What do you mean, Alien Nation was one of the best Sci-fi
> programs? It was complete and uter dross! Why the goverments
> didn't imidiatly get rid of the bubble headed freaks is beyond
> me. In the end the slags would take over our planet the way
> they did on there own. There is no where near enough resorces
> for us, let alone these canabalistic, sickening dieted Alian
> SCUM!!
Did somebody mention Humanis? Or is this more the work of Der
Nachtmachen(sp?)???
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 17:33:41 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Bands in SR
One simple word my friend...DRAIN!!! Sure, certain things are Ok to
use magic for, but if you flub enough rolls, you are going to pass
out!!!
A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
and smile.
-Star-
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 18:31:38 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "J.D. Falk" <jdfalk@****.CAIS.COM>
Subject: Re: A debate from Tucson
In-Reply-To: <199410242011.QAA06613@****.cais.com>
On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Magister wrote:
> Walker wrote: "Huh?"
>
> And he calls me slow??? Geez!
I'm not usually slow, but I must admit that I have no idea which
of the many things with a subject line of "Re: A debate from Tucson"
you're talking about. This thread has meandered through a number of
subjects over the past few days, and without quoting previous material or
at least stating in your message what you're talking about, it is
impossible to know what subject you two are being slow with.
===============================================
|| "You're going crazy, going insane ||
|| You know you'll never be the same again" ||
|| -Coverdale/Page ||
======<jdfalk@****.com>========================
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 17:59:55 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
GLO writes:
>
> The laws of science are the laws of nature, scientists study
> natural things
>
>
When has science done ANYTHING natural! Get with the program.
Everything that science touches turns to drek!!! The laws of nature
are wild, free, clean, and deal with magick. The real stuff. To
insinuate (or state) that laws of science are the laws of nature is
ludicrus. Science seeks to conform, confine, and kill anything that it
does not accept. Part of the reason that the REAL mana flow has
diminished is that science has killed peoples' belief in magick. When
enough people believe that something does/does not happen, the
result happens/not happends. When the Gods were taken out of
nature, man was justified to abuse nature. And since science has
taken everyone's Gods out of everything, science is justified to
abuse anything it damn well pleases!
Sorry for the rant, but these things tend to excite me. Please don't be
offended. It's not personal. And Magistar, please don't mix religion
with the list. It's hard not to, but we almost had a HUGE flaming war
when discussing magick. If religion is discussed, don't step on
anyone's toes, and keep it to a minimum.
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 19:04:47 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Skrub <mccllstr@*****.BUCKNELL.EDU>
Subject: Re: The Aliens are coming
> That makes sense...especially since magic only happens within the
>atmosphere of (what's left of) Earth.
Hmmm, actually the recently posted story about Knight and the Invae, err,
Insect Spirirts, implies that magic is NOT limited to earth. Yeah I know,
FASA said somewhere that the lack of mana above a certain height from earth
acts like a vaccuum on mages sanity if they try to cast or view astrally or
something. Whatever. That may well be commen opinion. Let's see though. Ares
is the leader in space technology. Ares "brings [a mage] down..." who says
"I've shaped power among the stars". I suspect magic can work in space, if
you are either trained very very carefully, or born and initially trained
there. There has been enough time since the Awakening to have people born in
space. Of course if Poul Anderson has decent sources, they'd have
problems... But. What about those mages from Mars?
"Did you see the news vid, they say Martian Mages are invading Seattle."
"Whatever."
"Seriously, it wasn't 'The Seattle Gossip' either, it was the Raku vid."
"Uh-huh."
Think about it, Ares certainly wouldn't PUBLISH their successes, and if they
know about the Horrors and Invae, where would be better to hide than where
there isn't enough mana to support Horror's existance?
Maybe FASA is gonna start tieing SR into MechWarrior :) We had to colonize
the inner sphere for some reason. Magic is fairy tale, no one really
believes Demons chased us off of Old Earth, that's just old world
superstition. In the 3000's magic would still be around, on Earth...
Think about it. Don't thwap me.
-Skrub
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 18:12:57 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Sam Thomas <sinbad@********.COM>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
>On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Sam Thomas wrote:
>
>> This is a common misconception, it has been resolved easliy. Light has to
>> obey the laws of physics but magic only has to obey the laws of
"MetaPhysics".
>
> Which are laws nonetheless in any empirical sense, so your
>argument is fallacious.
>
Never the less this was the decision from talking the Tom and Paul at Gencom
at a seminar
that they were open to questions, and from their reponses on Genie on this
topic.
>> Metaphysics does not equal physics. Improved invisilbity follows
metaphysisc not
>> physics. Whether it bends, warps or cludges it works, ITS MAGIC not applied
>> engineering!! ;-)
>
> Read the worldview of the mage, in _The Grimoire II_, and you
>will see that the above is blatantly not true, as the entire basis for
>the mage's way of doing things is "Magic as Science". Oh, and read some
>real magic books, like P.E.I. Bonewitz' _Real Magick_, and your arguments
>are disproven (consider that Bonewitz had experts from all fields of
>science, including some Nobel laureates at Berkeley, review his work to
>insure it contained no contradictions to modern science.)
Yes it is a science but only to itself, and following its own laws.
I believe that you find the title to Mr Bonewits's book is "Authentic
Thaumanturgy".
but that is the only work that I am familar with. Real Magic? by whose
definition?
Western? Eastern? Vancian?, Wiccan?, Satanic?, Druidical?, Voudun? Etc.
Experts?
how many are praticing Adepts in real life?
Contradictions to Modern Science? Oxymoron? maybe. Remember the bumble bee?
> Physics is not just Newton's Laws or Quantum Mechanics, but a
>conceptual framework for understanding natural phenomena. It necessarily
>has a scaffolding constructed of mathematics, but like any scaffolding
>the framework can be torn down and one is still left with the laws of
>nature.
Exactly I am talking about "Metaphysics" not physics.
>>> Law Of Contagion
>>
>> Here is a law that describes a "magical phenomenon", basically a
>>physical law not expressed in mathematical form.
>
Some things cannot be describe by todays mathematics or current scientific
theory.
>
>> Sinbad Sam
>> Law Of Contagion
>
> Here is a law that describes a "magical phenomenon", basically a
>physical law not expressed in mathematical form.
>
>> Law Of Similarity
>
> And here is yet another one. You have disproven your own remarks!
>
I really do not think so but to each its own.
>+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
>|Adam Getchell|acgetche@****.engr.ucdavis.edu | ez000270@*******.ucdavis.edu |
>| acgetchell |"Invincibility is in oneself, vulnerability is in the
opponent"|
>+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
>
>
Later Then
Sinbad Sam
"Blessed Be"
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 18:07:32 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: AIMEE COLWELL <ACOLWELL@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: SHADOWRN Digest - 24 Oct 1994
To all well knowing shadowrunners,
I was wondering if anyone had any new ideas on upgrading the
decks for deckers. Any helpful info. would be of great use.
gotta fly,
**Lynx**
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 18:07:28 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
> I have to agree with Damion here: the SRII rules state that your CP
refreshes
> on each phase in which you get an action. [Initiative 12: on 12, you
get your
> CP; it doesn't refresh until 2, so if you burn it all on 12, and
someone
> stitches you on 7, you'll be wishing you were a troll]. And giving
only one
> CP per *turn* will get lots of people geeked real fast. Depends on
how
> much gaming time you want to waste watching your players make
up new char-
> acters, I guess. :/
>
Sorry. I was refering to phases, not turns. Got a little cornfused. But
someone said actions, and actions go free,simple,complex, not
42,32,22,12,2. Sorry if I cornfused any of you.
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 18:22:41 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Immortality and Elves vs. Science and Laws of Nature
Whistler, I don't know what your problem is, but I think you have been
listen to professors way to much. "Mother Nature", Gaia, Is a strange
and interesting being. You cannot know Her ways, nor will a mere
mortal ever understand what She does. The fish story is an example.
Some fish live virtually forever. And elves might also. The fact that
humans say that nothing can live forever is nothing more then
jelousy speaking. Maybe we could live forever, be immortal, but
because we have treated Gaia so poorly She will not allow us to that
privilage. And if you want to argue with this science drek, see my
earlier rant.
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 18:32:32 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Immortality and Elves vs. Science and Laws of Nature
Will someone please put a leash on this boy!!!
A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
and smile.
-Star-
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 18:38:51 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: House rules for a newbie
On the case of astral and normal inish, We usually play with the
astral going first. Makes combat a little faster, especially since the
druid in the group likes the astral. If there is more than one in astral,
resolve astral first. It is the fastest. As to other combat proceedings,
just practice and learn the most used mods to TN#s. Speeds things
up. And another thing. If you are the GM, let the runners do the paper
work. If you have to roll dice, just gauge how powerful the roll is to be
and wing it. Way less stress.
As for decking, the down and dirty fast resolve system works real
well. If you don't have Virtual Realities, mail me for the exact rules.
And if you want to avoid heavy dice rolling, stay out of combat.
We've cracked dice rolling so often(and the occasional dragon
induced throwing dosen't help either.)
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 16:55:41 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Adam Getchell <acgetche@****.UCDAVIS.EDU>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
In-Reply-To: <9410242313.AA09716@********.engr.ucdavis.edu>
On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Sam Thomas wrote:
> I believe that you find the title to Mr Bonewits's book is "Authentic
> Thaumanturgy".
Nope; have it in my hot little hands. _Real Magick_.
> Contradictions to Modern Science? Oxymoron? maybe. Remember the bumble bee?
This is the biggest urban myth about aerodynamics and the bumble
bee, and I can't count how many times I have disproved it.
The bumblebee supposedly does not generate enough lift when using
a laminar flow model, which is all early aerodynamcists had to go on.
Once they investigated turbulent air flows and Prandtl's boundary layer
separation, they determined the bumble bee could indeed, fly.
> Exactly I am talking about "Metaphysics" not physics.
I think you missed my point. My point was that natural laws
still govern phenomena, whether you name it physics or metaphysics or
whatever. "A rose by any other name ..."
> Some things cannot be describe by todays mathematics or current scientific
> theory.
This doesn't mean that they *cannot* be explicated in terms of
scientific principles, but only that we lack the knowledge to currently
do so. A good example is quantum gravity.
> Sinbad Sam
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
|Adam Getchell|acgetche@****.engr.ucdavis.edu | ez000270@*******.ucdavis.edu |
| acgetchell |"Invincibility is in oneself, vulnerability is in the opponent"|
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 18:59:16 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: The Aliens are coming
>>
> Maybe FASA is gonna start tieing SR into MechWarrior :) We had to
colonize
> the inner sphere for some reason. Magic is fairy tale, no one really
> believes Demons chased us off of Old Earth, that's just old world
> superstition. In the 3000's magic would still be around, on Earth...
>
> Think about it. Don't thwap me.
>
Maybe this is were the adventure in White Wolf came from. The one
with 'Mechs fighting Godzilla and stuff. Or maybe it was a momentary
lapse in sanity.
And just because you said for us not to:
Shadowdancer's Vindicator thwapp:
(Barrels start rotating)
(One minute later)
(slime sloshing sounds)
THWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWA
PPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTH
WAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPP
THWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWA
PPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTH
WAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPP
THWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWA
PPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTH
WAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPP
THWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWA
PPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTH
WAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPP
THWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWA
PPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTH
WAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPP
THWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWA
PPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTH
WAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPP
THWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWA
PPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTH
WAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPP
THWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPPTHWAPP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(need fresh carp belt)
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 17:04:44 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Spellslinger <mruane@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions (fwd)
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410240747.AA15773@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
>
> And, yes, can she make good burgers? I'm interested :)
>
> Bye, Paolo
>
Soy burgers got me down ever since I moved to Seattle. But Bjork can do
the most wonderful things with Soy Helper..
Mike
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 19:06:56 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
> This doesn't mean that they *cannot* be explicated in terms of
> scientific principles, but only that we lack the knowledge to currently
> do so. A good example is quantum gravity.
>
Exactly. So stop fooling around with something you don't understand.
Could get yourself perished that way.
By-the-by, my stand on this issue will not be heard today. Gotta do
laundry, and the immortal elf who has been teaching me metaphysics
and spelling is of playing chess with Mountainshadow and hasn't
taught the spell for COMPLETE AND TOTAL
UNDERSTANDING!!!!!!!(nice name,neh?) It's usful for instant clean
clothes.:) Seriously i simply haven't the time. Please argue tomorrow
and I will gladly join in.
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 17:17:18 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Spellslinger <mruane@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: Foci question???
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410241531.AA19854@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Magister wrote:
> With stacked foci like that, you could go around levelling buildings!
>
> Not that that is a bad thing.......
>
> Magister
>
> Always on the lookout for a BBS(Bigger, Badder Spell)
>
We've discovered that levelling buildings is a bda idea. They tend to
fall on you if you're too close. :-)
Mike
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 19:25:16 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Sam Thomas <sinbad@********.COM>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
>> This doesn't mean that they *cannot* be explicated in terms of
>> scientific principles, but only that we lack the knowledge to currently
>> do so. A good example is quantum gravity.
>>
>
>
>Exactly. So stop fooling around with something you don't understand.
>Could get yourself perished that way.
>
Here Here!
>By-the-by, my stand on this issue will not be heard today. Gotta do
>laundry, and the immortal elf who has been teaching me metaphysics
>and spelling is of playing chess with Mountainshadow and hasn't
>taught the spell for COMPLETE AND TOTAL
>UNDERSTANDING!!!!!!!(nice name,neh?) It's usful for instant clean
>clothes.:) Seriously i simply haven't the time. Please argue tomorrow
>and I will gladly join in.
>
>
>
>Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will
smile upon them.
>I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
>
> -SHADOWDANCER-
>
>
Until then
Sinbad Sam
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 17:20:40 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Spellslinger <mruane@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410241538.AA20026@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
For all the pool refreshing debate:
We've been using it per turn simply because I don't have that many dice.
I have a LOT of dice, but if I GM, and the PCs walk into a room with 5
sec guys with CPs, that's a hideous amount of dice rolling. Also, at
this point in our adventuring carrers, we've determined that getting 10+
dice per phase is rediculous, especially for magic pool. I'd be putting
every bad guy down every time I sneezed.
Just my $.02
Mike
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 17:08:05 +0800
Reply-To: Ken Webb <hbphy009@****.csun.edu>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Ken Webb <hbphy009@****.CSUN.EDU>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Shadowdancer wrote:
> When has science done ANYTHING natural!
Hey, look, an uninformed person talking out of his a*s
> Everything that science touches turns to drek!!!
[deleted] ^^^^^^^
Can you say STEREOTYPE, yip, all science destroys everything. Sure.
> To insinuate (or state) that laws of science are the laws of nature is
> ludicrus. Science seeks to conform, confine, and kill anything that it
> does not accept.
[deleted]
Isn't it nice when you can cover everything with a nice blanket statement.
Last time I checked, some areas of science are only attempting to explain
nature so we can better understand (and in some cases, protect) it.
> Sorry for the rant, but these things tend to excite me.
[deleted]
> Please don't be offended. It's not personal.
[deleted]
A rant like that is dangerous without a ":)" to relieve the pressure. I
took it personally because your message is clear: science (and therefore,
scientists) destroy nature. I'm in the field of science and I get the
feeling you'ld just assume shoot me than say "Hi."
Let's see now, is it :) or is it :(
I can never remember. . .
Ken Webb -too disturbed to leave a sig.
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 19:37:10 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Sam Thomas <sinbad@********.COM>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
>On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Sam Thomas wrote:
>
>> I believe that you find the title to Mr Bonewits's book is "Authentic
>> Thaumanturgy".
>
> Nope; have it in my hot little hands. _Real Magick_.
>
I stand corrected but then I have not had the need for that tome since 1980.
I gave my
copy to someone who truly needed it but would not understand it.
>> Contradictions to Modern Science? Oxymoron? maybe. Remember the bumble bee?
>
> This is the biggest urban myth about aerodynamics and the bumble
>bee, and I can't count how many times I have disproved it.
> The bumblebee supposedly does not generate enough lift when using
>a laminar flow model, which is all early aerodynamcists had to go on.
>Once they investigated turbulent air flows and Prandtl's boundary layer
>separation, they determined the bumble bee could indeed, fly.
>
Some things will never be explained, classified or codified by a nonmetaphysical
mind set. Example the "Lights of Marfa" . What about the "light at the end
of the
tunnel" that near death victims describe. But these will be mote points to a
nonmetaphysical mindset.
>> Exactly I am talking about "Metaphysics" not physics.
>
> I think you missed my point. My point was that natural laws
>still govern phenomena, whether you name it physics or metaphysics or
>whatever. "A rose by any other name ..."
>
>> Some things cannot be describe by todays mathematics or current scientific
>> theory.
>
> This doesn't mean that they *cannot* be explicated in terms of
>scientific principles, but only that we lack the knowledge to currently
>do so. A good example is quantum gravity.
>
But some things just have to be belived rather than explained. Until you alter
your everything has to fit mindset, progress toward enlightnment will be
retarded
greatly.
>> Sinbad Sam
>
>+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
>|Adam Getchell|acgetche@****.engr.ucdavis.edu | ez000270@*******.ucdavis.edu |
>| acgetchell |"Invincibility is in oneself, vulnerability is in the
opponent"|
>+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
>
>
Sinbad Sam
"There none so blind as those who do not see"
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 22:29:25 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Malcalypse The Younger <shadow@******.NET>
Subject: Re: Bands in SR
In-Reply-To: <9410241441.AB02166@ IntNet.net>
On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Magister wrote:
> From the depths of his tower, the Magister speaks:
>
> I would not use any mind-control spells during the performance. The
> only spells that would be used would be illusion spells. Why use a
> trid screen to create pictures when you can use magic. For that
> matter, why use anything when you can use magic???
>
Well, there WAS a big scandal about mind control type magic being used at
concerts a while ago, but I think if you limited it to illusions, you'd
be ok with the authorities, and the fans woulod either like it or not,
thier choice...
Shadow aka Wraith
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 21:38:52 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Bands in SR
Well, I'm glad that there are at least a couple people out there that
aren't scared to death of magic being used in everyday life. Unlike
some, who will remain nameless but know who they are.
The illusions WOULD be judged by folks on their artistic merits
and relationship to the song.
Arcanely yours,
The Magister
"demented and sad,...but social!!!"
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 22:36:51 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Malcalypse The Younger <shadow@******.NET>
Subject: Re: Bands in SR
In-Reply-To: <9410241640.AA05834@ IntNet.net>
On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Michel Racine wrote:
> > >From the depths of his tower, the Magister speaks:
> >
> > I would not use any mind-control spells during the performance. The
> > only spells that would be used would be illusion spells. Why use a
> > trid screen to create pictures when you can use magic. For that
> > matter, why use anything when you can use magic???
> >
>
> Because magick drains power and energy. Try casting high quality
> illusion spells for 2 or 3 hours, during all the show.
> Devices such as a trid picture let you present special effects without
> taxing nobody.
> But the mix of illusion spells and trid picture would make a great show.
> And what about the price to have a mage on the show? *ouch*
>
Not much when the lead singer is a shaman.... With a 4 point illusion
focus. hehe.
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 22:43:47 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Malcalypse The Younger <shadow@******.NET>
Subject: Re: Magic (was Re: bands in SR)
In-Reply-To: <9410241959.AA11341@ IntNet.net>
On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Stainless Steel Rat wrote:
> But, according to Shadowbeat, the last time illusions were used during a
> concert there were a number of deaths in the ensuing riot. What caused the
> riot? People thought that their minds were being controlled. They weren't,
> but they /thought/ they were. That's enough to cause a major problem.
>
> You wanna get lynched, that's fine by me. But don't cry when it happens.
That's NOT what it says. It says there was a band using control
manipulations (control emotions probably), and they got busted by ANOTHER
magically active band... Who still use illusions in thier acts. Mostly, I
think you just have t obe carefull not to let ppl think you're doing
something wrong. But even if shit hits the fan I suppose you could always
put up ye old physical barrier with stun balls or something...
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 22:01:32 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Magic (was Re: bands in SR)
If the drek hits the fan, you can always teleport away. Use the power
to its fullest I always say.
Magister
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 23:23:42 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Chad Hessoun <chessoun@*******.COLUMBUS.OH.US>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
In-Reply-To: <199410241549.LAA02555@****.freenet.columbus.oh.us>
On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Donald Walli wrote:
> I have to agree with Damion here: the SRII rules state that your CP
> refreshes on each phase in which you get an action.
[handy example snipped]
> And giving only one CP per *turn* will get lots of people geeked real
> fast.
Well now, that depends largely on how stupid that players are that night...
We have always played that the pool refreshes with initiative, rather than
every phase. This would lead to bad things happenning for all involved if
we used the rules as written. My players face a decision every cycle
whether they are more interested in geeking the bad guys or saving their
hide; you can't do everything at once. Also, the more challenging the game
is, the more enjoyable and satisfying the outcome. You simply don't have
to work very hard at staying alive if you get your CP every phase. Mind
you, we run a large caliber campaign that's very violent and unrelenting.
Given these things, we've also adopted a house rule about healing that
allows multipe tries by the same mage on the same wounds (+2 TN every
successive attempt, and the drain gets hellacious). Generally, the two
rules balance themselves out. Gotta make those players WORK for that karma
and =Y=, ya' know?
-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+- C H A D H E S S O U N -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>> itinerant OTISian ArchBishop formerly of Kenyon and Greater Gambier
<<<
>>>>> Everything forbidden is optional... 9 out of 10 heretics agree!
<<<<<
Hail OTIS! Find out more: ighf@******.com or hessoun@******.edu Hail Spode!
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 23:54:39 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Chad Hessoun <chessoun@*******.COLUMBUS.OH.US>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
In-Reply-To: <199410241905.PAA01448@****.freenet.columbus.oh.us>
> On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Micah Levy wrote:
>
> Improved Invisibility (Physical) works by bending light around you.
[...]
> invisible. But now, the object actively radiates heat into the
> environment, and bent or not the heat is still going to escape into the
> environment, where it can be detected.
[more rant deleted]
I think that the scientific question would be how that leaking heat was
detected/evidenced. Heat registers in the infrared spectrum, which is part
of light, which can be seen. House ruling: Imp. Invis. affects all vision
types (normal, low, and thermo), but not ultra. That's my photographic
understanding of how these things work, which is good enough for me.
As for physics v. metaphysics, I suspect that some talented quantum
physician could allow for pretty much everything. Chill.
-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+- C H A D H E S S O U N -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>> itinerant OTISian ArchBishop formerly of Kenyon and Greater Gambier
<<<
>>>>> Everything forbidden is optional... 9 out of 10 heretics agree!
<<<<<
Hail OTIS! Find out more: ighf@******.com or hessoun@******.edu Hail Spode!
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 15:44:27 +1100
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Luke Kendall <luke@********.CANON.OZ.AU>
Subject: Attitude to magic (Was: Re: Bands in SR)
> Magister> I would not use any mind-control spells during the performance.
>
Rat> It doesn't matter. If the crowd /thinks/ you're using mind altering spells
Rat> on them, you're in big trouble.
>
> Magister> The only spells that would be used would be illusion spells.
>
Rat> And how does a non-mage know the difference?
>
> Magister> Why use a trid screen to create pictures when you can use magic.
> Magister> For that matter, why use anything when you can use magic???
>
Rat> Lynchings tend to put severe cramps in most performers' lifestyles.
Gareth> Nah, I think Magister's right, illusion spells could create really
Gareth> impressive spectacles at concerts, special effects for stage plays,
Gareth> etc.
Magister:
> Just because it's in Shadowbeat does not mean that it can't be done.
> I interpreted it to mean magic that is harmful. You definitely would
> not want to cast mana spells or anything that would hurt someone. All
> I'm saying is simple, ethreal illusions. Ones that are made to
> enhance the music, not control anyone.
Rat:
> But, according to Shadowbeat, the last time illusions were used during a
> concert there were a number of deaths in the ensuing riot. What caused the
> riot? People thought that their minds were being controlled. They weren't,
> but they /thought/ they were. That's enough to cause a major problem.
>
> You wanna get lynched, that's fine by me. But don't cry when it happens.
In the standard FASA world (which Magister's apparently differs from -
which is his choice) - the general populace's attitude to the use of
magic is one of fear and distrust.
This is mentioned throughout a lot of FASA's source material. It also
explains why hospitals don't all have mages in-house ready to heal
people. The normal law of supply and demand would guarantee this was
the case, even if you chose to ignore the existence of humanitarian
mages who would contribute their services free (or at-cost).
The same is true in most areas of society. Magic is power - we're
all agreed on that. For many tasks, magic is faster and simpler,
and even better. Unless you have this general fear of magic, the
society that would exist in a magic-rich world like Shadowrun would
be _nothing_ like our world today, or even the world of Shadowrun.
And it's perfectly reasonable to take this attitude. Think about
the saying: Power corrupts. Think about how subtle magic (SR) can
be. Think about how many non-saintly mages there would be. So,
(a) there would be plenty of examples of the misuse of magic to
have earned it this general reputation.
(b) A mage is, effectively, a superman. A superior human being that
can do things you cannot ever hope to match.
To me, it's obvious that the FASA `line' on the general public's
attitude to magic is spot-on. So: if you want a riot at a concert,
let someone convince them that a mage is present and casting spells
`for' the whole crowd.
So, while that marvellous `holographic' image up there is dazzling
you, what are those strange half-thoughts, that you can only half-
sense, being broadcast into your head? Or is he just marking you,
for an astral visit the next night? Or ...
I think this issue is an important one. In a well-run campaign, the
general attitude to magic will influence _everything_.
Of course, enlightened runners know better. Hell, most even have a
mage or two in their group. And they're no better or worse than the
average person.
Well, until they become _really_ powerful. Then, you know, it does
seem that they become just that bit more ... arrogant, you know?
luke
PS
I think FASA don't reinforce this enough. For the stuff I'm working
on, I've fleshed this out with mentions of `famous' recent events of
really horrifying abuses of magical power.
The destruction of an entire nation by one person through the exercise
of that being's magical abilities doesn't seem to count. After all,
Iran were the bad guys.
Weren't they?
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 14:50:47 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
In-Reply-To: <199410242316.JAA23028@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from
"Shadowdancer" at
Oct 24, 94 06:07:28 pm
Shadowdancer writes:
> Sorry. I was refering to phases, not turns. Got a little cornfused. But
> someone said actions, and actions go free,simple,complex, not
> 42,32,22,12,2. Sorry if I cornfused any of you.
Hunh? People have an Action every 10 phases, it's just that this Action can
be any combination (within the rules) of simple, complex, and free.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
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B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 14:53:09 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: SHADOWRN Digest - 24 Oct 1994
In-Reply-To: <199410242316.JAA23025@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "AIMEE
COLWELL"
at Oct 24, 94 06:07:32 pm
Lynx writes:
> I was wondering if anyone had any new ideas on upgrading the
> decks for deckers. Any helpful info. would be of great use.
Well, that depends on what you mean. VR has lots of customising deck rules,
and Shadowtech has some cool cranial cyberdecks, and many people on here
have various other tricky ideas, such as cyberdecks in your cyberarm
(cheaper than a C^3). Just what were you meaning?
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
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B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 14:58:18 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Immortality and Elves vs. Science and Laws of Nature
In-Reply-To: <199410242328.JAA23512@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from
"Shadowdancer" at
Oct 24, 94 06:22:41 pm
Shadowdancer writes:
> Whistler, I don't know what your problem is, but I think you have been
> listen to professors way to much. "Mother Nature", Gaia, Is a strange
> and interesting being. You cannot know Her ways, nor will a mere
> mortal ever understand what She does. The fish story is an example.
> Some fish live virtually forever. And elves might also. The fact that
> humans say that nothing can live forever is nothing more then
> jelousy speaking. Maybe we could live forever, be immortal, but
> because we have treated Gaia so poorly She will not allow us to that
> privilage. And if you want to argue with this science drek, see my
> earlier rant.
Shadowdancer, I don't know what you problem is, but I think you have been
smoking pot a little too much.
:-) [This is not to be taken too seriously, but this makes you sound like a
tree hugging, drug using, hippy. Are you? :-)]
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
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B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 15:00:00 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
In-Reply-To: <199410250033.KAA26158@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Sam Thomas"
at
Oct 24, 94 07:37:10 pm
Sinbad writes:
> But some things just have to be belived rather than explained. Until you alter
> your everything has to fit mindset, progress toward enlightnment will be
> retarded
> greatly.
Hey, you'd make a good shaman, and Adam'd make a good hermetic... :-)
And we all know what they say about arguments between the two different
types, now, don't we? :-)
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
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B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 15:59:38 +1100
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Luke Kendall <luke@********.CANON.OZ.AU>
Subject: Re: House rules for a newbie
Debbie,
I'm afraid you're right. Big combats take ages.
The time taken seems to be proportional (or worse) to the
number of dice involved, if both sides are evenly matched.
Note that the astral combat rules were gradually rewritten
over various issues of the game, to make it work more and
more like hand-to-hand combat.
As far as keeping astral Reaction (and other attributes)
straight - just write it down on the character sheets. As
far as I know, all the reactions are resolved using the
same `timeline'. Astral activities don't pass at a faster
rate, even if astral things can travel at high speeds.
(Not in close quarters: would you like to fly a highly
manoeuverable jet in your kitchen? :-) )
I'm afraid I don't have any practical suggestions for
simplification. I believe the SR II system is slightly faster
than SR I, mainly because all the weapons have a `staging factor'
of 2.
It gets faster with practice, of course.
Our group likes the flavour of the rules, however. It works
reasonably well, As long as all the people in the team have
a similar Reaction. Otherwise combats gets extremely boring
for the people with only 1 action.
For house rules, keep an eye out on rec.games.frp.cyber - there's
a FAQ on the subject which seems very good, to me, and will have
heaps of info for you.
luke
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 15:07:19 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
In-Reply-To: <199410250336.NAA03147@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Chad
Hessoun" at
Oct 24, 94 11:23:42 pm
Chad writes:
> You simply don't have to work very hard at staying alive if you get your CP
> every phase.
The rest of what you say seems pretty good, but I wouldn't be so bold as to
say this. My players only ever use their CP for defence, and never attack
(only about three times as far as I can remember, and one was fatal to the
runner who did it), and things still get pretty hairy for them.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
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B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 15:10:09 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
In-Reply-To: <199410250403.OAA04240@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Chad
Hessoun" at
Oct 24, 94 11:54:39 pm
Chad writes:
> As for physics v. metaphysics, I suspect that some talented quantum
> physician could allow for pretty much everything. Chill.
^^^^^^^^^
???? :-)
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
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B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 15:12:27 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: House rules for a newbie
In-Reply-To: <199410250502.PAA06620@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Luke
Kendall" at
Oct 25, 94 03:59:38 pm
luke writes:
> As far as keeping astral Reaction (and other attributes)
> straight - just write it down on the character sheets. As
> far as I know, all the reactions are resolved using the
> same `timeline'. Astral activities don't pass at a faster
> rate, even if astral things can travel at high speeds.
> (Not in close quarters: would you like to fly a highly
> manoeuverable jet in your kitchen? :-) )
Actually, I think the rules say to resolve all astral actions, then all
matrix actions then all physical ones. Why I cannot see (I have never used
the rules this way, I always run the lot simlutaneously), it just sems to be
a tad odd to me.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
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B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 22:30:24 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Jason Carter, Nightstalker" <CARTER@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: House rules for a newbie
Damion Milliken said:
>Actually, I think the rules say to resolve all astral actions, then all
>matrix actions then all physical ones. Why I cannot see (I have never used
>the rules this way, I always run the lot simlutaneously), it just sems to be
>a tad odd to me.
The rules say that on any given phase resolve all astral actions, then all
matrix actions, and then all physical actions. Thus on say Initiative phase
20 anyone in astral space goes first, anyone in the Matrix goes second, and
anyone in the physical world goes last.
*******************************************************************************
* See Ya in Shadows * * "Trust No One." *
* Jason J Carter * Carter@***.EDU * The late Deep Throat *
* The Nightstalker * * The X-Files *
*******************************************************************************
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 22:35:00 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Jason Carter, Nightstalker" <CARTER@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: Bands in SR
>From the depths of his tower, the Magister speaks:
>I would not use any mind-control spells during the performance. The
>only spells that would be used would be illusion spells. Why use a
>trid screen to create pictures when you can use magic. For that
>matter, why use anything when you can use magic???
Because trid is cheaper, more reliable, and doesn't care if the band's mage
gets sick. Besides the public loves tridio.
*******************************************************************************
* See Ya in Shadows * * "Trust No One." *
* Jason J Carter * Carter@***.EDU * The late Deep Throat *
* The Nightstalker * * The X-Files *
*******************************************************************************
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 00:38:49 -0500
Reply-To: "Robert A. Hayden" <hayden@*******.mankato.msus.edu>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Robert A. Hayden" <hayden@*******.MANKATO.MSUS.EDU>
Subject: ADMIN: New list helpers chosen
Comments: To: ShadowTalk <shadowtk@*****.nic.SURFnet.nl>,
ShadowTalk Plot Discussion <plot-d@*****.nic.SURFnet.nl>,
NERPS Working List <nerps@*****.nic.SURFnet.nl>
After a consideration of the 12 or so applications I have received for
the various openings, I've made some decisions about who I will pass the
various torches too. Chief among my concerns was people that have been
on the lists for a while and know what it is we (as a community) are
trying to accomplish. I also looked at factors of professionalism and my
percieved notion of their ability to do the work. Excitement on their
behalf was also a factor :-)
--------------------
Without further waiting, here are my selections:
ShadowRN FAQ: JD Falk
NERPS FAQ: JD Falk
ShadowTK FAQ: Jason Carter
TK Cast List: Gian-Paolo Musumeci
TK Edited Log: Dylan Northrup
------------------------------------------------------------
I will be contacting these people individually over the next week or so.
It will be up to the FAQ administrators (when the time comes) to make the
proper corrections, addendums, or deletions to the respective FAQs.
Any additional questions will be gladly answered.
____ Robert A. Hayden <=> hayden@*******.mankato.msus.edu
\ /__ -=-=-=-=- <=> -=-=-=-=-
\/ / Finger for Geek Code Info <=> I do not necessarily speak for the
\/ Finger for PGP Public Key <=> City of Mankato or anyone else
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GJ/CM d- H-- s-:++>s-:+ g+ p? au+ a- w++ v* C++(++++) UL++++$
P+>++ L++$ 3- E---- N+++ K+++ W M+ V-- -po+(---)>$ Y++ t+ 5+++
j R+++$ G- tv+ b+ D+ B--- e+>++(*) u** h* f r-->+++ !n y++**
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 22:40:01 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Jason Carter, Nightstalker" <CARTER@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: Magic (was Re: bands in SR)
Magister said:
>Methinks our SS Rat has a fear of magic. Anyone or any group trying
>to lynch me would find it to be quite a monumental undertaking.
Put Ehran the Scribe in a concert hall with 20,000 pissed off concert goers
and there's only one thing he can do to survive. GET THE HELL OUT OF THERE!
>I suppose I can see your point on how would a non-mage know the
>difference. I tend to see things from a mana POV. But, with half the
>crowd zoned out on one the designer drugs that are around, would
>they even know I was using magic at all???
They wouldn't. But the mage in isle 5 using his Astral Pereception to see
the magic in Astral Space would. He's going to think, what the hell are they
doing up there? If he's smart he'll do nothing but defend himself from the
magic. If he's good, he'll identify the spell. If he's a Wiz-ganger, he'll
fry the spell caster and start a riot.
*******************************************************************************
* See Ya in Shadows * * "Trust No One." *
* Jason J Carter * Carter@***.EDU * The late Deep Throat *
* The Nightstalker * * The X-Files *
*******************************************************************************
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 15:44:35 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Astral, Matrix and Pysical Intitive
In-Reply-To: <199410241316.XAA22761@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Micah Levy"
at
Oct 24, 94 01:14:55 pm
The Nightstalker writes:
[Explanation of just how it works]
Ah, yeah, it all makes sense now. That was the way I ran it anyhow, and I'd
never bothered to really check up just how "different" it was sposed to be.
I had this thing in my head that the way it was sposed to be was one then
the next then then next, but that's what you get from not reading the rules
for about two years eh? :-)
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
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B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 22:45:14 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Jason Carter, Nightstalker" <CARTER@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
Spellslinger said:
>We've been using it per turn simply because I don't have that many dice.
>I have a LOT of dice, but if I GM, and the PCs walk into a room with 5
>sec guys with CPs, that's a hideous amount of dice rolling. Also, at
>this point in our adventuring carrers, we've determined that getting 10+
>dice per phase is rediculous, especially for magic pool. I'd be putting
>every bad guy down every time I sneezed.
Your problem is not the frequency at which your pools refresh. It's in the
size of your pools and in your opposition. Try using characters with combat
and magic pools ranging from 5 to 8 and tell me it's too easy to kill the
opposition and survive when you refresh every phase. And make sure that at
least a few members of the opposition are not just standard security guards.
*******************************************************************************
* See Ya in Shadows * * "Trust No One." *
* Jason J Carter * Carter@***.EDU * The late Deep Throat *
* The Nightstalker * * The X-Files *
*******************************************************************************
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 22:46:44 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Jason Carter, Nightstalker" <CARTER@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: Magic (was Re: bands in SR)
Magister said:
>If the drek hits the fan, you can always teleport away. Use the power
>to its fullest I always say.
Yeah, right. Since when have you been on the same power level as Ehran the
Scribe and Harliquin?
*******************************************************************************
* See Ya in Shadows * * "Trust No One." *
* Jason J Carter * Carter@***.EDU * The late Deep Throat *
* The Nightstalker * * The X-Files *
*******************************************************************************
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 1994 22:56:26 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Jason Carter, Nightstalker" <CARTER@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: House rules for a newbie
Debbie Giesbrecht said:
> As a newbie player and a GM, I have found the combat system to be kind
> of confusing and slow. Most of this is probably because I don't know
> exactly what I'm doing. These are some of the problems that I've run
> into and I could use a little advice. Perhaps this will let some of
> you veterans reminisce about the old days when you were searching
> through the rulebooks too.
Yes, it can be quite confusing. As long as it is confusing, it will be slow,
but you will find that once you know what you are doing that it is actually
quite simple.
> I've noticed that basically there is a separate combat system for each
> class. I know its not written that way, but it comes out that way.
> For example, the rigger needs to have a position test, the ranged
> combat and melee combat are different, the magic system is hard to
> keep straight with Astral reaction vs. regular reaction etc., and I
> don't think there is any need to comment about decking. It is a field
> unto itself.
Here you are more or less correct. A few things to remember are that Astral
Combat is basically a combonation of melee combat and spell casting. Just
use the astral characteristics and run it like a melee battle. As for matrix
combat, it's totally screwed up. I've yet to find a matrix combat system
that makes me entirely happy. The chase rules are a world onto themselves,
although they do remind me of the rules in the James Bond RPG. We never use
the damn thing in the campaigns I've been in.
If you have any specific questions, please ask away.
*******************************************************************************
* See Ya in Shadows * * "Trust No One." *
* Jason J Carter * Carter@***.EDU * The late Deep Throat *
* The Nightstalker * * The X-Files *
*******************************************************************************
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 00:38:48 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Spellslinger <mruane@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410250619.AB09859@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
> Spellslinger said:
>
> >We've been using it per turn simply because I don't have that many dice.
> >I have a LOT of dice, but if I GM, and the PCs walk into a room with 5
> >sec guys with CPs, that's a hideous amount of dice rolling. Also, at
> >this point in our adventuring carrers, we've determined that getting 10+
> >dice per phase is rediculous, especially for magic pool. I'd be putting
> >every bad guy down every time I sneezed.
>
> Your problem is not the frequency at which your pools refresh. It's in the
> size of your pools and in your opposition. Try using characters with combat
> and magic pools ranging from 5 to 8 and tell me it's too easy to kill the
> opposition and survive when you refresh every phase. And make sure that at
> least a few members of the opposition are not just standard security guards.
>
That's just the problem. We've gotten to the point where our characters
do have big magic/combat/etc. pools. We're just not going to say, "Well,
off with your magic pool, then! It's too damn big!" So we moved it to
one turn has a complete pool, not phase. As long as it's universal,
we've had no problems. In fact, the biggest problem we had was with the
infamous PURPLE GUY!
That brings up a beef I've had. A while ago someone mentioned "When any
of the player's PCs get too buff, I geek them" or something to that
effect. Well, if you know your GM kills off your character when they get
house, then what's the point of playing? I like characters I've started
and I like seeing them progress from Mr. Nobody with a force 4 fire
missile to Spellslinger the Mage.
Besides, if runs start getting easy, begin recruiting for heavy action--
runs versus military targets or para-military operations.
Mike
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 01:31:02 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Matt Fullenwider <mattf@***.UNR.EDU>
Subject: Denver box
Is the new Denver module worth buying? Also are there any pre-made
adventures by FASA out there that would be good for a beginner GM (that's
me) and low-level characters?
Thanks,
---Matt Fullenwider (mattf@***.unr.edu)
"I don't want the world, I just want your half!" -TMBG
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 03:57:33 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Tim Skirvin <tskirvin@***.UIUC.EDU>
Subject: Re: The Aliens are coming
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.bitnet@***.cso.uiuc.edu>
In-Reply-To: Dylan Northrup <northrup@*****.CAS.USF.EDU> "Re: The Aliens are
coming" (Oct 23, 11:12pm)
> You never know. I have learned to never under-estimate the ability
> of humans to hate something simply because it's different.
True.
Worse, of course, is different and BETTER.
> > (What I want to know is how the Great Dragons would think
>
> Provavly something along the lines of "Hey guys. Long time, no
> see."
I think that hoping that they HADN'T seen the aliens before is more...
survivable...
--
Tim Skirvin (tskirvin@***.uiuc.edu)
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 10:22:47 +0200
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Darth Vader <j07c@***.UNI-BREMEN.DE>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@**.gmd.de
In-Reply-To: <9410241413.AA71165@***.zfn.uni-bremen.de> from "Magister"
at Oct
24, 94 10:08:15 am
> Of course, magic follows natural laws. How else could we
> magic-types use the stuff? However, these laws are laws of NATURE,
> not, science. I would think that anyone who aspires to The Art, is
> probably a bit disturbed. Thank all the gods.
But it all comes down to the same thing, as the laws of nature
are the laws of science. Science seeks to understand how nature works, it
doesnt create its own laws - that would have no meaning. So according to
this magic is just another form of science, as it follows the same laws
that our run of the mill modern day science does.
--
"Believe in Angels." -- The Crow
GCS d>- H s+: !g p? !au a- w+ v-(?) C+++ UA++VS++L>++++ P-- (aren't we all?)
L+>+++ 3 E--- N++ K W(+)(---) M-- !V(--) -po+(---) Y+ t++ 5+ !j(-) R+++(--)
!G tv(++) b+++ D++ B- e+ u++(-) h*(+) f+ r- n!(----) y?
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 10:33:08 --100
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stefan Willkofer <stefan.willkofer@*****.PHYSIK.UNI-REGENSBURG.DE>
Subject: Dwarven Kingdom
>
> Interesting! It sounds as if Shadowrun is very popular in
> Germany...is that a valid assumption?
> Might be worth asking the DLoH if it's going to be translated
> into English. Do you remember the title?
>
The first Volume is called #Das Zerissene Land# (The Torn Country).
But I can't remember the name of the trilogy.
Yes, indeed, Shadowrun is very popular in Germany. In a recent poll it was
the socond most favorite rpg in Germany. Therefore german authors wrote
the Germany Source Book and the novels. I guess the novelswill be translated
to English in some time.
Mephisto, ==St. Willkofer==
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 11:04:54 --100
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stefan Willkofer <stefan.willkofer@*****.PHYSIK.UNI-REGENSBURG.DE>
Subject: Astral Space <>Space ?
>
> Hmmm, actually the recently posted story about Knight and the Invae, err,
> Insect Spirirts, implies that magic is NOT limited to earth. Yeah I know,
> FASA said somewhere that the lack of mana above a certain height from earth
> acts like a vaccuum on mages sanity if they try to cast or view astrally or
> something. Whatever. That may well be commen opinion. Let's see though. Ares
> is the leader in space technology. Ares "brings [a mage] down..." who says
> "I've shaped power among the stars". I suspect magic can work in space, if
> you are either trained very very carefully, or born and initially trained
> there. There has been enough time since the Awakening to have people born in
Here lies an assumption that I had some time ago. In the short story Wyrm Talk
Dunkelzahn and Harlequinn are having an argument. Dunkelzahn wants to invite
H to his TV show and wants him to tell the people what he knows. D says "Is it
not possible that they have a right to know? It is their world, after all."
Does sounds like D and H don't belong to our world. Could this mean, that
Dragons, Elves (the great ones at least) are not native to Earth? Are the
mere products of experiments of aliens?
And what is out their in Space? Is Space the realm of Astral space where
the insect spirits and other evil spirits (also Horrors) dwell? I think so.
There was a SR adventure about an Cyber Eye and a lot of gouhls (can't
remeber the name). In that module a mage had astrally projected hinself
beyond the biosphere of Earth, and he suffered heavy trauma and saw something
horible ou there. Guess it was a Horror greeeting him.
Mephisto, ==St.Willkofer==
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 11:07:26 +0200
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Darth Vader <j07c@***.UNI-BREMEN.DE>
Subject: Re: Magic (was Re: bands in SR)
In-Reply-To: <9410241909.AA28675@***.zfn.uni-bremen.de> from "Magister"
at Oct
24, 94 03:07:13 pm
> Magic is indeed Power and that is a Good Thing(tm).
>
> An illusion spell does convince a person that they are actually seeing
> what they think they are seeing, but, the type of magic I am referring
> to is something akin to a hologram. It would be floating in the air and
> would be related to whatever song the band is playing. A good
> quality illusion would enhance a performance.
That would make it a physical illusion then, a mana based spell always
has something to do with the victims mind. And physical illusions are a wee
bit more draining than mana based ones. I dont think that magic would be
eficient as a permanent solution for special effects in a concert, unless
you have a couple of mages on your payroll that just sit around and drain
butts of casting illusions for hours on end.
> I forgot about the SSR's code against never killing anyone.
> I'm not quite that magnanimous.
--
"Believe in Angels." -- The Crow
GCS d>- H s+: !g p? !au a- w+ v-(?) C+++ UA++VS++L>++++ P-- (aren't we all?)
L+>+++ 3 E--- N++ K W(+)(---) M-- !V(--) -po+(---) Y+ t++ 5+ !j(-) R+++(--)
!G tv(++) b+++ D++ B- e+ u++(-) h*(+) f+ r- n!(----) y?
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 11:24:23 +0200
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Darth Vader <j07c@***.UNI-BREMEN.DE>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
In-Reply-To: <9410242205.AA54994@***.zfn.uni-bremen.de> from
"Shadowdancer" at
Oct 24, 94 05:59:55 pm
> When has science done ANYTHING natural! Get with the program.
> Everything that science touches turns to drek!!! The laws of nature
> are wild, free, clean, and deal with magick. The real stuff. To
> insinuate (or state) that laws of science are the laws of nature is
> ludicrus. Science seeks to conform, confine, and kill anything that it
> does not accept. Part of the reason that the REAL mana flow has
> diminished is that science has killed peoples' belief in magick. When
> enough people believe that something does/does not happen, the
> result happens/not happends. When the Gods were taken out of
> nature, man was justified to abuse nature. And since science has
> taken everyone's Gods out of everything, science is justified to
> abuse anything it damn well pleases!
*** FLAME ON ***
Excuse me, but you sound like some technophobic idiot that doesnt
know what he is talking about. This very medium you just used is a byproduct
of the science you blame for all the things you despise. Science is pure,
its arguably the only pure thing left. The desire to learn and to understand,
to ask questions and search for the answers - this is science. Now dont
tell me that this quest for knowledge can turn anything to 'drek'.
And dont give me that drek about 'the REAL mana flow' cause no such
thing exists. Science is mans magic, and only through science can we hope to
understand our gods. Only science can drag us out of the gutter of 'faith'
and give us understanding.
> Sorry for the rant, but these things tend to excite me. Please don't be
> offended. It's not personal. And Magistar, please don't mix religion
> with the list. It's hard not to, but we almost had a HUGE flaming war
> when discussing magick. If religion is discussed, don't step on
> anyone's toes, and keep it to a minimum.
No I do not forgive such ignorance. Ha you are a good one, talking
about not steping 'on anyone's toes', dont make me laugh.
*** FLAME OFF ***
No smiley :(
--
"Believe in Angels." -- The Crow
GCS d>- H s+: !g p? !au a- w+ v-(?) C+++ UA++VS++L>++++ P-- (aren't we all?)
L+>+++ 3 E--- N++ K W(+)(---) M-- !V(--) -po+(---) Y+ t++ 5+ !j(-) R+++(--)
!G tv(++) b+++ D++ B- e+ u++(-) h*(+) f+ r- n!(----) y?
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 11:58:43 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Micah Levy <M.Levy@**.UCL.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 24 Oct 94 16:29:49 EST."
> >On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Micah Levy wrote:
> >
> > Improved Invisibility (Physical) works by bending light around you.
> > Vision is a passive sense, not an active one. This means that
> >light shines on the object, and then is randomly scattered into the
> >environment where it is picked up by detectors (eyes).
> > If light bends around the object, then no light reflects from the
> >objet and there is no light to detect the object with. Hence, it becomes
> >invisible. But now, the object actively radiates heat into the
> >environment, and bent or not the heat is still going to escape into the
> >environment, where it can be detected.
> > Ultrasound is an active sensor, meaning it sends out pulses of
> >sound which bounce off objects and reflect back into the environment,
> >where it can be detected. Because Invisibility does not affect Sound, it
> >cannot hide from Ultrasound. Because Invisibility does not change the
> >heat signature of the recipient, it cannot prevent the target from
> >emitting heat, and thus becoming detectable via Thermographic vision.
> >
> >
> This is a common misconception, it has been resolved easliy. Light has to
> obey the laws of physics but magic only has to obey the laws of
"MetaPhysics".
>
> Metaphysics does not equal physics. Improved invisilbity follows metaphysisc
not
> physics. Whether it bends, warps or cludges it works, ITS MAGIC not applied
> engineering!! ;-)
>
> Sinbad Sam
> Law Of Contagion
> Law Of Similarity
Erm, I think you have made a mistake. I never said that- I think Adam
Getchell said that. And in any case, my point was that I didn't feel very
happy saying to the players 'well, it works because it's magic'.
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
||Micah Levy Department of Computer Science ||
|| University College London ||
||Web Page: http://www.cs.ucl.ac.uk/people/zcacma0.html ||
||Email: M.Levy@**.ucl.ac.uk Cestor@******.com ||
|| zcacma0@**.ucl.ac.uk Micah@******.com ||
|| GCS d--@ H s g+(-) p? au--(+)>++ a- w v++ C++++($) UV++(-) P- L- 3 E-||
|| N++ K W++ M+ V-- -po+ Y++ t+ 5-- jx R++ G+(----) tv b+++ D+ B--- e+ u- ||
|| h- f n+ y? ||
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 13:13:57 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Micah Levy <M.Levy@**.UCL.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 24 Oct 94 23:54:39 -0400."
> > On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Micah Levy wrote:
> >
> > Improved Invisibility (Physical) works by bending light around you.
> [...]
> > invisible. But now, the object actively radiates heat into the
> > environment, and bent or not the heat is still going to escape into the
> > environment, where it can be detected.
> [more rant deleted]
>
[stuff deleted]
>
> -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+- C H A D H E S S O U N -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
> >>> itinerant OTISian ArchBishop formerly of Kenyon and Greater Gambier
<<<
> >>>>> Everything forbidden is optional... 9 out of 10 heretics agree!
<<<<<
> Hail OTIS! Find out more: ighf@******.com or hessoun@******.edu Hail Spode!
Can't people read posts? I DID NOT SAY THAT! It was Adam Getchell. Please
attribute correctly.
Micah Levy
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 13:26:16 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Micah Levy <M.Levy@**.UCL.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Denver box
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 25 Oct 94 01:31:02 MST."
> Is the new Denver module worth buying? Also are there any pre-made
> adventures by FASA out there that would be good for a beginner GM (that's
> me) and low-level characters?
> Thanks,
> ---Matt Fullenwider (mattf@***.unr.edu)
> "I don't want the world, I just want your half!" -TMBG
I don't know about the Denver set- there's still too much to do in Seattle as
far as I'm concerned. A good module for starting players is Dreamchipper.
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
||Micah Levy Department of Computer Science ||
|| University College London ||
||Web Page: http://www.cs.ucl.ac.uk/people/zcacma0.html ||
||Email: M.Levy@**.ucl.ac.uk Cestor@******.com ||
|| zcacma0@**.ucl.ac.uk Micah@******.com ||
|| GCS d--@ H s g+(-) p? au--(+)>++ a- w v++ C++++($) UV++(-) P- L- 3 E-||
|| N++ K W++ M+ V-- -po+ Y++ t+ 5-- jx R++ G+(----) tv b+++ D+ B--- e+ u- ||
|| h- f n+ y? ||
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 12:51:00 GMT
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Iz The Wiz! <HB011TRP01@****************.AC.UK>
Subject: Astral Space <>Space ?
>Here lies an assumption that I had some time ago. In the short story Wyrm Talk
>Dunkelzahn and Harlequinn are having an argument. Dunkelzahn wants to invite
>H to his TV show and wants him to tell the people what he knows. D says "Is it
>not possible that they have a right to know? It is their world, after all."
>Does sounds like D and H don't belong to our world. Could this mean, that
>Dragons, Elves (the great ones at least) are not native to Earth? Are the
>mere products of experiments of aliens?
Did that not mean the Sixth World, (as D and H are from before that anyway)
Rather than a seperate planet.
Iz The Wiz!
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 09:38:09 EDT
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stephane Lafrance <Stephane.Lafrance@***.ULAVAL.CA>
Subject: Whoaaaaaaa!!!
Too much mail!!!! I'm out of the list for a few days!
See ya!
Stephan (who lives in Beautiful Quebec)
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 10:13:46 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Organization: The Happy Fun Ball Brigade
Subject: Re: Bands in SR
In-Reply-To: Magister's message of Mon, 24 Oct 1994 21:38:52 EST
<E13C64D0B@*****.vinu.edu>
>>>>> "Magister" == Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
writes:
Magister> Well, I'm glad that there are at least a couple people out there
Magister> that aren't scared to death of magic being used in everyday life.
Magister> Unlike some, who will remain nameless but know who they are.
Well, /I'm/ not remaining nameless, and /I/ personally am not scared to
death of magic being used in everyday life. But then /I/ personally am not
the "average joe" on the street. I know better; he doesn't. The "average
joe" thinks computers have big panels and lots of blinky-lights. He's
afraid of a "computer error" munging his credit record and destroying his
life. Why is he afraid? Because he doesn't understand what computers are.
The same things applies to magic. It's human nature to fear what isn't
understood, and that fear often erupts into violence.
Magister> The illusions WOULD be judged by folks on their artistic merits
Magister> and relationship to the song.
You're living in a much different world than I. Or maybe I'm just being
cynical, but I doubt it.
--
Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> |Caution: Happy Fun Ball may suddenly
http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox|accelerate to dangerous speeds.
PGP Public Key: Ask for one today! |
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 00:27:32 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
In-Reply-To: <199410250923.TAA13806@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Darth
Vader" at
Oct 25, 94 10:22:47 am
Darth writes:
> But it all comes down to the same thing, as the laws of nature
> are the laws of science. Science seeks to understand how nature works, it
> doesnt create its own laws - that would have no meaning. So according to
> this magic is just another form of science, as it follows the same laws
> that our run of the mill modern day science does.
Well, follow laws maybe, but not neccessrily the same laws as regular
science does. Else if you were invisible, as someone argued before, you
would not be able to see. From this I would conclude that some different
natural law(s) apply to magic.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 00:34:03 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Astral Space <>Space ?
In-Reply-To: <199410251333.XAA17901@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Iz The
Wiz!" at
Oct 25, 94 12:51:00 pm
[On a previous (unfortunately deleted) mail, someone hypothisises that
horrors lurk in outer space]
Urk, I hope not, after all, I'd like to think there is somewhere safe from
the horrors. Not knowing too much about them myself, I can't really say, but
don't they require a magic _rich_ environment, rather than a magically
desolate one such as in orbit?
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 09:50:21 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Matt Hufstetler <gt2778a@*****.GATECH.EDU>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@******.GATECH.EDU
In-Reply-To: <199410242141.RAA17363@*****.gatech.edu> from "Gareth Owen"
at
Oct 24, 94 03:56:42 pm
>
> >
> > Of course, magic follows natural laws. How else could we
> > magic-types use the stuff? However, these laws are laws of NATURE,
> > not, science. I would think that anyone who aspires to The Art, is
> > probably a bit disturbed. Thank all the gods.
> >
> > Magister
> >
> > "An it harm none, do as ye will."
> >
>
> The laws of science are the laws of nature, scientists study
> natural things
>
If we took this thread over to the Mage-L mailing list(The Mage
Storyteller game from White Wolf for those uninformed people) I think it
would be a lot more productive.
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 11:06:10 EDT
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Donald Walli <dwalli@***.EDU>
Subject: Various schtuff
Wow-- lotsa stuff.
For Matt Fullenwider:
The Denver module has been pretty cool so far. I don't know if it would
be the thing for low-level characters, but then I don't know what your
definition of low-level is. We're going into the Front Range Free Zone
with a group of 6 people (5 PCs) who have, on average, around 11 accum-
ulated (sp?) Karma. That gives us Karma pools of 2. We're hoping to
come out of the Aztlan sector with our hides. :)
For the dice pools discussion:
Yeah, big pools can be a pain. But 10+ magic pools (Mike)? Whoof! Are
power foci cheap in your world? We buy d6's by the block. 8^O But our
GM has more dice than any of us, and he's good at keeping track (uses
some custom SuperCard setup on his PowerBook). It's a house rules
call either way; we've stuck to the standard setup so as not to confuse
ourselves at cons. A good group can always work out a way to make the
rules bend to everyone's satisfaction, so that everyone can have *fun*.
Isn't that why we play?
For the science discussion:
Anyone else warm in here? :] Please, folks, let's put down those M-50's--
here, I brought Zippos for everyone! ;)
Thanks for running a good list!
Don
dwalli@***.edu
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 10:11:14 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Matt Hufstetler <gt2778a@*****.GATECH.EDU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@******.GATECH.EDU
In-Reply-To: <199410250147.VAA17710@*****.gatech.edu> from "Spellslinger"
at
Oct 24, 94 05:20:40 pm
> For all the pool refreshing debate:
>
> We've been using it per turn simply because I don't have that many dice.
> I have a LOT of dice, but if I GM, and the PCs walk into a room with 5
> sec guys with CPs, that's a hideous amount of dice rolling. Also, at
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Umm.... NPC's don't have a CP(O.K. I'm lying here. you can use a CP).
They have a Threat Rating. That saves GM's enough time so that they don't
have to fudge rolls to make up for lost time. If you want to keep up with
everyone's CP you must be masochistic.
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 10:26:51 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Matt Hufstetler <gt2778a@*****.GATECH.EDU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@******.GATECH.EDU
In-Reply-To: <199410250341.XAA22811@*****.gatech.edu> from "Chad Hessoun"
at
Oct 24, 94 11:23:42 pm
> Given these things, we've also adopted a house rule about healing that
> allows multipe tries by the same mage on the same wounds (+2 TN every
> successive attempt, and the drain gets hellacious). Generally, the two
Hmm, but in SRII, isn't it that you get ONE try at healing the person?
And isn't it every two successes you get, ONE box is removed? Try healing
that SS who has a serious wound now.
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 16:11:21 +0200
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Darth Vader <j07c@***.UNI-BREMEN.DE>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
In-Reply-To: <9410251328.AA50057@***.zfn.uni-bremen.de> from "Damion
Milliken"
at Oct 26, 94 00:27:32 am
> Well, follow laws maybe, but not neccessrily the same laws as regular
> science does. Else if you were invisible, as someone argued before, you
> would not be able to see. From this I would conclude that some different
> natural law(s) apply to magic.
Well this conclusion implies that we know of the existence of all
the laws of nature. Well I dont think so.....
--
"Believe in Angels." -- The Crow
GCS d>- H s+: !g p? !au a- w+ v-(?) C+++ UA++VS++L>++++ P-- (aren't we all?)
L+>+++ 3 E--- N++ K W(+)(---) M-- !V(--) -po+(---) Y+ t++ 5+ !j(-) R+++(--)
!G tv(++) b+++ D++ B- e+ u++(-) h*(+) f+ r- n!(----) y?
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 10:30:05 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Matt Hufstetler <gt2778a@*****.GATECH.EDU>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@******.GATECH.EDU
In-Reply-To: <199410250500.BAA26800@*****.gatech.edu> from "Damion
Milliken"
at Oct 25, 94 03:00:00 pm
> > But some things just have to be belived rather than explained. Until you
alter
> > your everything has to fit mindset, progress toward enlightnment will be
> > retarded
> > greatly.
>
> Hey, you'd make a good shaman, and Adam'd make a good hermetic... :-)
>
> And we all know what they say about arguments between the two different
> types, now, don't we? :-)
>
Yeah, you ever watch that show? 'The Odd Coven'? Totally a riot.
<Grin>
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 10:42:27 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Matt Hufstetler <gt2778a@*****.GATECH.EDU>
Subject: Re: Astral Space <>Space ?
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@******.GATECH.EDU
In-Reply-To: <199410251009.GAA05597@*****.gatech.edu> from "Stefan
Willkofer"
at Oct 25, 94 11:04:54 am
> Here lies an assumption that I had some time ago. In the short story Wyrm Talk
> Dunkelzahn and Harlequinn are having an argument. Dunkelzahn wants to invite
> H to his TV show and wants him to tell the people what he knows. D says "Is
it
> not possible that they have a right to know? It is their world, after all."
> Does sounds like D and H don't belong to our world. Could this mean, that
> Dragons, Elves (the great ones at least) are not native to Earth? Are the
> mere products of experiments of aliens?
Personally I think that is reading too much out of the story. IMHO, Big D
is just stating the obvious, humans run the majority of the world, and
know squat about magic. Your average person knows as much about magic as
he has seen it happen. The only time he saw a real dragon was the last
re-run of Wyrm-Talk, but he's never seen one in person. Besides, D and H
are from the 4th world(is that figure right?), not the 6th. I guess that
would make them not of 'our world' wouldn't it?
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 10:45:03 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Matt Hufstetler <gt2778a@*****.GATECH.EDU>
Subject: Re: Denver box
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@******.GATECH.EDU
In-Reply-To: <199410251328.JAA22762@*****.gatech.edu> from "Micah Levy"
at Oct
25, 94 01:26:16 pm
>
> > Is the new Denver module worth buying? Also are there any pre-made
> > adventures by FASA out there that would be good for a beginner GM (that's
> > me) and low-level characters?
> > Thanks,
> > ---Matt Fullenwider (mattf@***.unr.edu)
> > "I don't want the world, I just want your half!" -TMBG
>
> I don't know about the Denver set- there's still too much to do in Seattle as
> far as I'm concerned. A good module for starting players is Dreamchipper.
Bah, DNA/DOA is better. If you're really satannic, you could run them on
Mercurial, or Missing Blood. <BIG EVIL GRIN>
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 08:26:03 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Spellslinger <mruane@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410251511.AA16305@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
On Tue, 25 Oct 1994, Matt Hufstetler wrote:
> > For all the pool refreshing debate:
> >
> > We've been using it per turn simply because I don't have that many dice.
> > I have a LOT of dice, but if I GM, and the PCs walk into a room with 5
> > sec guys with CPs, that's a hideous amount of dice rolling. Also, at
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>
> Umm.... NPC's don't have a CP(O.K. I'm lying here. you can use a CP).
> They have a Threat Rating. That saves GM's enough time so that they don't
> have to fudge rolls to make up for lost time. If you want to keep up with
> everyone's CP you must be masochistic.
>
My general GM rule is: with few NPCs, add CP + Threat. With armies of
hosers in Med. Sec. Armor: No Cp and just threat. All of the opposing
shadowrunners have all their pools to make the "professional vs.
professional" battle equal out. The threat makes up for karma the
characters have.
Mike
"We're going into Salish lands? What kind of opposition are we running
into?"
"Here, I'll show you what kind of threat there is! Look on page 64!
See, that's the security! Nothing to worry about!"
-- famous last words
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 08:28:01 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Spellslinger <mruane@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410251515.AA16380@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
On Tue, 25 Oct 1994, Matt Hufstetler wrote:
> > Given these things, we've also adopted a house rule about healing that
> > allows multipe tries by the same mage on the same wounds (+2 TN every
> > successive attempt, and the drain gets hellacious). Generally, the two
>
> Hmm, but in SRII, isn't it that you get ONE try at healing the person?
> And isn't it every two successes you get, ONE box is removed? Try healing
> that SS who has a serious wound now.
>
No kidding. Mad Cat has an essence of .3. You should see him burn the
karma when the wounds accumulate. And people wonder why Spellslinger
hasn't adopted cyberware. Essence 6 is a wonderful thing.
Mike aka Spellslinger
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 11:28:58 EDT
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: GEORGE PLAINE <GPLAINE@********.ON.CA>
Organization: Sir Sandford Fleming College
please unsubscribe George Plaine
Remove GPLAINE from ShadowRN.
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 16:01:03 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Micah Levy <M.Levy@**.UCL.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Denver box
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 25 Oct 94 10:45:03 -0400."
> >
> > > Is the new Denver module worth buying? Also are there any pre-made
> > > adventures by FASA out there that would be good for a beginner GM (that's
> > > me) and low-level characters?
> > A good module for starting players is Dreamchipper.
>
> Bah, DNA/DOA is better. If you're really satannic, you could run them on
> Mercurial, or Missing Blood. <BIG EVIL GRIN>
Missing Blood for starter players? No way.
Micah Levy
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 11:58:48 EDT
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: James Nichols <JMNICH00@****.UKY.EDU>
Subject: Invisibility
Since I'm on digest I can't quote, but I think the "if Imp.Inv. bends light
how can the individual see anything" question is a good "It's magic, so it work
s. Who cares about physical laws, anyway?" argument.
That didn't come out right, but you see what I mean.
I kinda like the case from David Edding's first set of books (i think):
The evil bad guy, awakening god-type, blew himself up into giant sized, so
Belgarion (it's been awhile so if I screw up the names, forgive me) blows
himself up to match.
After whoopin' up on the bad guy, his Grandfather, who was considered to be the
last Grand Poobah and Repository of Magical Knowledge/Science asked
"How did you do that? conservation of Mass . . ."blah blah blah
The response
"I don't know, I just needed to match him in size so I did"
And that boys and girls is Magic. If you constrain yourself to the laws its
seems to follow, then you'll be bound by those laws.
My discourse is almost over.
A conversation between Herm D. Mage and Laughing Boy (Coyote shaman)
Herm - Now, I hope my hour long lecture has proven to you that shamanic
magic is also bound by the laws of magic.
L.B. - <startles awake> . . huh . . wazzat? Oh my magic is bound huh?
I'd like to see you tell Coyote that. More than likely he'd Rasberry
and Melvin you into the next cycle. Now just shut up and hand me a
beer Herm, all your talking has made me thirsty.
Herm - <throws his hands up in disgust, and gets a couple of beers>
James Nichols aka Shadow Masque (Racoon shaman) and Gryphon (Phys Ad)
"Magic is as Magic does" paraphrasing Forrest Gump
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 12:20:06 EDT
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Terry Amburgey <XANTH@****.UKY.EDU>
Subject: Wet Carp
In a [belated] celebration of the second anniversary of the THWAP, I have some
questions for the list:
Which is more of a badass, a street samurai armed with a vindicator using armor
piercing discarding sabot wet carp or a mage casting a force-8 thwap spell?
Which is better, American air-superiority wet carp or Russian air-superiority
wet carp?
Is the thwapping ability of wet carp based on magic or biology?
If my street samurai has an encephalon can he use 2 wet carp equipped with
smartcarp adaptors without suffering a penalty?
Is there a Horror nicknamed 'Hunter of Great Carp'?
Can vampiric wet carp have cyberwear installed?
Are wet carp immortal?
Terry
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 12:35:36 EDT
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: James Nichols <JMNICH00@****.UKY.EDU>
Subject: Concerts
I'd think if the band billed themselves as a band that uses illusion there'd
be few problems to worry about.
As far as the drain, I could see having shamans and mages, getting up on stage
and have the performance being kinda like a ritual where they get power to help
sustain the spells.
After all, how often have you heard of musicians saying "yeah, man, the crowd w
as really into it. They saw we were really jammin' all out for them, and sent
back the attitude, which just helped us go even more all out."
Just an idea, it probably does work by the rules, but the idea is a good one
"Those that live only by the rules, shall die by them"
"Magic is as Magic does"
James Nichols
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 09:58:40 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Adam Getchell <acgetche@****.UCDAVIS.EDU>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
In-Reply-To: <9410250009.AA10915@********.engr.ucdavis.edu>
On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Shadowdancer wrote:
> > This doesn't mean that they *cannot* be explicated in terms of
> > scientific principles, but only that we lack the knowledge to currently
> > do so. A good example is quantum gravity.
> >
>
>
> Exactly. So stop fooling around with something you don't understand.
> Could get yourself perished that way.
If we truly had that attitude, there would be no scientific
discovery or neat technology.
Might as well poke your head in the sand. "I don't understand it
-- it could hurt me, so I won't try."
> -SHADOWDANCER- >
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
|Adam Getchell|acgetche@****.engr.ucdavis.edu | ez000270@*******.ucdavis.edu |
| acgetchell |"Invincibility is in oneself, vulnerability is in the opponent"|
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 11:57:26 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Attitude to magic (Was: Re: Bands in SR)
I think that Mr. Kendall's posting about magical attitudes is absolutely
first rate. This was an intelligent, well-thought out letter. As opposed
to the rants that the rest of us (myself included) have been doing. I
admit that I do get a little magic happy now and again. Thank you all
for your interest.
Arcanely yours
The Magister
"Demented and sad....but social!"
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 11:58:33 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Robert A. Hayden" <hayden@*******.MANKATO.MSUS.EDU>
Subject: Re: Wet Carp
In-Reply-To: <199410251634.LAA12318@*******.mankato.msus.edu>
On Tue, 25 Oct 1994, Terry Amburgey wrote:
> Which is more of a badass, a street samurai armed with a vindicator using armor
> piercing discarding sabot wet carp or a mage casting a force-8 thwap spell?
A thermonuclear carp.
> Which is better, American air-superiority wet carp or Russian air-superiority
> wet carp?
A dead wet carp and pretty good control over the surrounding air,
regardless of nationality (peeee-yeeeewwwwwww)!
> Is the thwapping ability of wet carp based on magic or biology?
Yes
> If my street samurai has an encephalon can he use 2 wet carp equipped with
> smartcarp adaptors without suffering a penalty?
Yes.
> Is there a Horror nicknamed 'Hunter of Great Carp'?
Yes, he makes an appeared on that weekly fishing show "The Great Outdoors"
> Can vampiric wet carp have cyberwear installed?
Go ahead. Carp are touch to kill
> Are wet carp immortal?
The Great One is, unless you cath and filet it.
____ Robert A. Hayden <=> hayden@*******.mankato.msus.edu
\ /__ -=-=-=-=- <=> -=-=-=-=-
\/ / Finger for Geek Code Info <=> I do not necessarily speak for the
\/ Finger for PGP Public Key <=> City of Mankato or anyone else
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GJ/CM d- H-- s-:++>s-:+ g+ p? au+ a- w++ v* C++(++++) UL++++$
P+>++ L++$ 3- E---- N+++ K+++ W M+ V-- -po+(---)>$ Y++ t+ 5+++
j R+++$ G- tv+ b+ D+ B--- e+>++(*) u** h* f r-->+++ !n y++**
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 12:01:20 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
Still apologizing for previous rant. True, science has given us many,
many comforts and tools to help our lives, else I would not be on
this list. True, scientists are working to help save the enviornment.
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 10:03:54 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Adam Getchell <acgetche@****.UCDAVIS.EDU>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
In-Reply-To: <9410250021.AA10953@********.engr.ucdavis.edu>
On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Sam Thomas wrote:
> >Exactly. So stop fooling around with something you don't understand.
> >Could get yourself perished that way.
> >
> Here Here!
Do you understand how the computer you're using works? Exactly?
Can you make sense of the electrical diagram? Can you follow the circuit
pathways on the chip? How about that CRT Monitor you're staring at? Has
20,000 volts, don't you know?
Better log off. Stop fooling around with something you don't
understand, you could get yourself killed.
> Sinbad Sam
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
|Adam Getchell|acgetche@****.engr.ucdavis.edu | ez000270@*******.ucdavis.edu |
| acgetchell |"Invincibility is in oneself, vulnerability is in the opponent"|
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 12:02:51 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 13:04:40 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Organization: The Happy Fun Ball Brigade
Subject: Re: Concerts
In-Reply-To: James Nichols's message of Tue, 25 Oct 1994 12:35:36 EDT
<SHADOWRN%94102517441506@***.SURFNET.NL>
>>>>> "James" == James Nichols <JMNICH00@****.UKY.EDU>
writes:
James> I'd think if the band billed themselves as a band that uses illusion
James> there'd be few problems to worry about.
No patrons, either. "Hi, there. We use /real/ high explosives for our
fireworks shows. Nothing fake for us!"
James> As far as the drain, I could see having shamans and mages, getting
James> up on stage and have the performance being kinda like a ritual where
James> they get power to help sustain the spells.
How many shamans are going to pervert their nigh-religious calling to put
on a show for the "mundanes" just to make a buck?
James> After all, how often have you heard of musicians saying "yeah, man,
James> the crowd w as really into it. They saw we were really jammin' all
James> out for them, and sent back the attitude, which just helped us go
James> even more all out."
The last time I saw that kind of thing happen was the Green Day show on the
Esplinade in Boston. And we almost had a full-scale riot there.
--
Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> |Do not use Happy Fun Ball on concrete.
http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox|
PGP Public Key: Ask for one today! |
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 13:07:12 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "J.D. Falk" <jdfalk@****.CAIS.COM>
Subject: Re: Denver box
In-Reply-To: <199410250831.EAA00572@****.cais.com>
On Tue, 25 Oct 1994, Matt Fullenwider wrote:
> Is the new Denver module worth buying? Also are there any pre-made
> adventures by FASA out there that would be good for a beginner GM (that's
> me) and low-level characters?
Denver is pretty interesting, but I don't know why they _had_ to
put it in a boxed set...except for the maps and cards, everything
would've fit just fine into another book.
IMHO, they'd have been better advised to put the Germany info in a
box, along with more detail on the culture and technology, simply because
(to most of us Americans, Doctor Doom of course excepted) Germany is much
more foreign (no pun) than Denver.
My guess is that FASA wanted to see how a boxed set would do,
since there aren't any other Shadowrun boxes.
/-----------------\
| J.D. Falk | All the world's indeed a stage
| jdfalk@****.com | And, damnit, I'm a stagehand.
\-----------------/
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 12:10:08 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
Comments: To: hbphy009@****.csun.edu
Still apologizing for previous rant. True, science has given us
comforts and tools to make life easier and to communicate better,
else I would not be on this list. True, scientists are working to save
our environment, but only after helping to destroy it first. I should
have blamed corporations first, but I tend to go to the root of the
problem. I am truly sorry if I have hurt anyone, but this is my opinion.
If people had learned long ago to conserve we would not be in the
mess that we are in.
Please disregard the previous two messages. I am still unfamiliar
with my mailer and hit a key that sent mail, and I wasn't finished
writing.
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 13:10:18 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "J.D. Falk" <jdfalk@****.CAIS.COM>
Subject: SR popularity in Germany
In-Reply-To: <199410250933.FAA01081@****.cais.com>
On Tue, 25 Oct 1994, Stefan Willkofer wrote:
> Yes, indeed, Shadowrun is very popular in Germany. In a recent poll it was
> the socond most favorite rpg in Germany. Therefore german authors wrote
> the Germany Source Book and the novels. I guess the novelswill be translated
> to English in some time.
Hm...that would probably explain why the German version of the
Germany sourcebook was bigger & more detailed (or so we've been told.)
Just our of curiosity (though I'm not sure we want to know), what's the
most popular RPG there?
/-----------------\
| J.D. Falk | All the world's indeed a stage
| jdfalk@****.com | And, damnit, I'm a stagehand.
\-----------------/
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 12:13:34 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Concerts
Let's face it, boys and girls. No matter how much we blither about
how great (or not) it would be to have magic used to create illusions at
concerts, our friend, the SSR, will never concede that it will not cause
a riot. " You keep using that word, I don't think it means what you
think it means." :)
Til the flow dries up
The Magister
"Demented and sad....but social!"
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 13:18:36 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "J.D. Falk" <jdfalk@****.CAIS.COM>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
In-Reply-To: <199410251548.LAA12054@****.cais.com>
On Tue, 25 Oct 1994, Darth Vader wrote:
> > Well, follow laws maybe, but not neccessrily the same laws as regular
> > science does. Else if you were invisible, as someone argued before, you
> > would not be able to see. From this I would conclude that some different
> > natural law(s) apply to magic.
>
> Well this conclusion implies that we know of the existence of all
> the laws of nature. Well I dont think so.....
Yeah, I have to agree with Darth. See, there are way too many
things that have happened -- including some to me, personally -- which
cannot be satisfactorially explained by the commonly accepted tenets of
modern science. That's where theories come in -- but theories are, by
their very nature, not _laws,_ just very, very educated guesses.
Science is Humanity's attempt to understand Nature. Nature
happens whether we understand it or not (though there are some theories,
loosely related to Quantum Physics, which say otherwise.) And Magic?
Well, that has _always_ simply been natural (if human-controlled)
phenomenae that we don't understand scientifically yet.
"We all agree that your theory is mad. /-----------------\
The problem which divides us is this: | J.D. Falk |
is it sufficiently crazy to be right?" | jdfalk@****.com |
-Dr. Neils Bohr \-----------------/
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 12:23:33 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
> Do you understand how the computer you're using works?
Exactly?
> Can you make sense of the electrical diagram? Can you follow the
circuit
> pathways on the chip? How about that CRT Monitor you're staring
at? Has
> 20,000 volts, don't you know?
> Better log off. Stop fooling around with something you don't
> understand, you could get yourself killed.
I understand it well. I did not know that the monitor has 20K volts, but
I do know that volts don't hurt you, amps do. I can follow an electrical
diagram(helped my grandfather repair radios and wire houses). But
the question is whether YOU understand. I am not about to start
flaming here. I hope I just avoided that with the apology I sent. But
before you question MY understanding, or that of another like minded
individual, on basic principles, make sure that you understand both
those and the principles that I follow. I will agree, science has taken
some of its rules from natural law, but natural law is too wild for any
laws of man. Our laws are supposed to be civilized, yet these
"civilized" laws don't explain everything, or help those unfortunates
that cannot be helped. I know that I am way off subject, and am not
about to go into uthenasia(sp?) or the death penalty. I just wanted to
let you know where I was coming from. Can we still get along?:=))
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 13:30:48 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Skrub <mccllstr@*****.BUCKNELL.EDU>
Subject: Re: Concerts
>How many shamans are going to pervert their nigh-religious calling to put
>on a show for the "mundanes" just to make a buck?
>
If it were fun, I would. You don't make music to make a buck, you make the
music for the music. The bucks just keep you fed, and you are either hungry
or not hungry. If you're a mage, you are doing the music cuz you love it. If
you wanted money you'd sign on w/ Lone Star or something. Mages are a
precious commodity. If you can throw a spell, money won't be a problem.
-Skrub
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 10:43:38 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Adam Getchell <acgetche@****.UCDAVIS.EDU>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
In-Reply-To: <9410251725.AA15588@********.engr.ucdavis.edu>
On Tue, 25 Oct 1994, Shadowdancer wrote:
> I understand it well. I did not know that the monitor has 20K volts, but
> I do know that volts don't hurt you, amps do. I can follow an electrical
The monitor has anywhere from 2-20 Amps as well, more than enough
to ruin your day. ;-)
> the question is whether YOU understand. I am not about to start
> flaming here. I hope I just avoided that with the apology I sent. But
> before you question MY understanding, or that of another like minded
> individual, on basic principles, make sure that you understand both
> those and the principles that I follow. I will agree, science has taken
Actually, I was not questioning your understanding. I was
following your logic of "don't mess with things you don't understand" to
it's logical conclusion, to point out that the premise is flawed.
> some of its rules from natural law, but natural law is too wild for any
> laws of man. Our laws are supposed to be civilized, yet these
You are implying that we science types, oh, legislate natural
laws or set them in stone or something like that. The whole crux of
science has always been to make a hypothesis about some phenomena, and
then *test* it with observation, adjusting your hypothesis as needed etc.
etc ... you know, the scientific method. ;-)
I think you are confusing social laws with "physical laws" --
which, if I remember the quote are defined as "a hypothesis that has
withstood repeated trials of accuracy and repeatability that it would be
perverse to withold conditional acceptance." There is nothing about
natural laws being "civilized" -- check out turbulent vortex shedding
over a cylinder sometime -- the only criterion is that the "laws" or
hypothesis adequately explain phenomena as observed in the real world. A
powerful test for natural law (like Relativity) is it's ability to
predict phenomena we haven't observed yet, and all their
characteristics. That way, when and if the effect is observed (such as
the gravitational lens effect of the sun) the theory (Relativity) is
proven to be at least partially accurate.
> "civilized" laws don't explain everything, or help those unfortunates
> that cannot be helped. I know that I am way off subject, and am not
Somehow, I don't think the above is in the purview of natural
law, but rather is more in line with societal goals and responsibilities.
> let you know where I was coming from. Can we still get along?:=))
Sure thing. I am interested in a logical exchange of ideas, not
a flame-fest.
> -SHADOWDANCER-
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
|Adam Getchell|acgetche@****.engr.ucdavis.edu | ez000270@*******.ucdavis.edu |
| acgetchell |"Invincibility is in oneself, vulnerability is in the opponent"|
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 10:52:07 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Adam Getchell <acgetche@****.UCDAVIS.EDU>
Subject: Re: Concerts
In-Reply-To: <9410251718.AA15575@********.engr.ucdavis.edu>
On Tue, 25 Oct 1994, Magister wrote:
> Let's face it, boys and girls. No matter how much we blither about
> how great (or not) it would be to have magic used to create illusions at
> concerts, our friend, the SSR, will never concede that it will not cause
> a riot. " You keep using that word, I don't think it means what you
Perhaps because _Shadowbeat_ mentions it, and in _Shadowrun_ in
general the UCAS public sees magicians as bad guys. Remember the Great
Ghost Dance?
You can look at _Shadowbeat_ where they talk about popular trid
shows. Guess who's always the leering, sinister soap-opera villain?
That's right, the wage-mage. And those darn Injuns use them shaman
fellers, can't trust them neither.
Looking at the _Shadowrun_ background material and sourcebooks,
I'd say there's a pretty good rationale for saying that magic in a
concert will cause a riot; I came to the same conclusion independently
and I suspect that anyone reading _Shadowbeat_ would do likewise.
Except maybe yourself. Have you read _Shadowbeat_?
> The Magister
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
|Adam Getchell|acgetche@****.engr.ucdavis.edu | ez000270@*******.ucdavis.edu |
| acgetchell |"Invincibility is in oneself, vulnerability is in the opponent"|
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 17:36:45 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Gareth Owen <glowen1@*****.NHS.GOV.UK>
Subject: Re: Concerts
In-Reply-To: <9410251647.aa09998@****.demon.co.uk> from "James Nichols"
at Oct
25, 94 12:35:36 pm
>
> As far as the drain, I could see having shamans and mages, getting up on stage
> and have the performance being kinda like a ritual where they get power to help
> sustain the spells.
> After all, how often have you heard of musicians saying "yeah, man, the crowd w
> as really into it. They saw we were really jammin' all out for them, and sent
> back the attitude, which just helped us go even more all out."
>
> Just an idea, it probably does work by the rules, but the idea is a good one
>
Centering?
GLO
--
Gareth Owen | Mail: glowen1@*****.nhs.gov.uk
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 18:29:02 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Gareth Owen <glowen1@*****.NHS.GOV.UK>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
In-Reply-To: <9410250033.aa04408@****.demon.co.uk> from "Sam Thomas" at
Oct 24,
94 07:37:10 pm
> Some things will never be explained, classified or codified by a nonmetaphysical
> mind set. Example the "Lights of Marfa" . What about the "light at the
end
> of the
> tunnel" that near death victims describe. But these will be mote points to a
> nonmetaphysical mindset.
What is the "Lights of Marfa".
BTW: There exists an explanation of the light seen by near death victims
that is entirely consistant with modern knowledge of biology and
neurophysiology (sp)
> >> Some things cannot be describe by todays mathematics or current scientific
> >> theory.
> >
> > This doesn't mean that they *cannot* be explicated in terms of
> >scientific principles, but only that we lack the knowledge to currently
> >do so. A good example is quantum gravity.
> >
> But some things just have to be belived rather than explained. Until you alter
> your everything has to fit mindset, progress toward enlightnment will be
> retarded
> greatly.
Gah.
So:
"Hey guys - we can't explain this right now, what do you want to do,
try and explore, investigate and codify it or just believe?"
> Sinbad Sam
> "There none so blind as those who do not see"
>
Well that I will agree with.
GLO
--
Gareth Owen | Mail: glowen1@*****.nhs.gov.uk
Sytems Programmmer | Phone: (UK) 0495 765021
Gwent Health Authority | "Reboot it from orbit, it's the only way to be sure"
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 11:42:47 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Erik S Jameson <esj@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: Immortality and Elves vs. Science and Laws of Nature
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410250027.AB02635@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
Giai? Please...I only trust what I can know emperically. And as for
Giai, not to impugne on your beliefs, but I don't buy inot that New Age
type stuff.
Erik, a.k.a. the Whistler
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 17:57:46 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Gareth Owen <glowen1@*****.NHS.GOV.UK>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
In-Reply-To: <9410251710.aa17579@****.demon.co.uk> from "Adam Getchell"
at Oct
25, 94 10:03:54 am
Adam (I think) wrote:
>
> On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Sam Thomas wrote:
>
> > >Exactly. So stop fooling around with something you don't understand.
> > >Could get yourself perished that way.
> > >
> > Here Here!
>
> Do you understand how the computer you're using works? Exactly?
> Can you make sense of the electrical diagram? Can you follow the circuit
> pathways on the chip? How about that CRT Monitor you're staring at? Has
> 20,000 volts, don't you know?
Beware!
This message contains hundreds of high velocity subatomic particles!
:-)
GLO
--
Gareth Owen | Mail: glowen1@*****.nhs.gov.uk
Sytems Programmmer | Phone: (UK) 0495 765021
Gwent Health Authority | "Reboot it from orbit, it's the only way to be sure"
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 18:08:59 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Gareth Owen <glowen1@*****.NHS.GOV.UK>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
In-Reply-To: <9410251725.aa23069@****.demon.co.uk> from "Shadowdancer" at
Oct
25, 94 12:23:33 pm
> those and the principles that I follow. I will agree, science has taken
> some of its rules from natural law, but natural law is too wild for any
> laws of man. Our laws are supposed to be civilized, yet these
> "civilized" laws don't explain everything, or help those unfortunates
> that cannot be helped. I know that I am way off subject, and am not
> about to go into uthenasia(sp?) or the death penalty. I just wanted to
> let you know where I was coming from. Can we still get along?:=))
>
> -SHADOWDANCER-
<choke>
Someone thwap me before I overreact!
Please!
<rummages for flamethrower>
GLO
--
Gareth Owen | Mail: glowen1@*****.nhs.gov.uk
Sytems Programmmer | Phone: (UK) 0495 765021
Gwent Health Authority | "Reboot it from orbit, it's the only way to be sure"
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 15:23:45 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Matt Hufstetler <gt2778a@*****.GATECH.EDU>
Subject: Re: Astral Space <>Space ?
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@******.GATECH.EDU
In-Reply-To: <199410251512.LAA25468@*****.gatech.edu> from "Damion
Milliken"
at Oct 26, 94 00:34:03 am
> [On a previous (unfortunately deleted) mail, someone hypothisises that
> horrors lurk in outer space]
>
> Urk, I hope not, after all, I'd like to think there is somewhere safe from
> the horrors. Not knowing too much about them myself, I can't really say, but
> don't they require a magic _rich_ environment, rather than a magically
> desolate one such as in orbit?
>
I would think that they live on some undiscovered metaplane.
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 15:29:59 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Matt Hufstetler <gt2778a@*****.GATECH.EDU>
Subject: Re: Denver box
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@******.GATECH.EDU
In-Reply-To: <199410251650.MAA22203@*****.gatech.edu> from "Micah Levy"
at Oct
25, 94 04:01:03 pm
> > > > Is the new Denver module worth buying? Also are there any pre-made
> > > > adventures by FASA out there that would be good for a beginner GM
(that's
> > > > me) and low-level characters?
>
> > > A good module for starting players is Dreamchipper.
> >
> > Bah, DNA/DOA is better. If you're really satannic, you could run them on
> > Mercurial, or Missing Blood. <BIG EVIL GRIN>
>
> Missing Blood for starter players? No way.
Yeah! Do it with starting characters, so when they get killed the players
won't be so attached to them. I mean come on, unless you hold some stuff
back, most runners will end up being geeked halfway through the run.
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 15:57:24 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: the holy Entombed <rasputin@***.UMD.EDU>
Subject: Denver in a Box
In-Reply-To: <199410251711.NAA24173@*******.wam.umd.edu>
On Tue, 25 Oct 1994, J.D. Falk wrote:
> Denver is pretty interesting, but I don't know why they _had_ to
> put it in a boxed set...except for the maps and cards, everything
> would've fit just fine into another book.
Yes, it could've been a book, but it would've been a big one. Remember,
there's a sourcebook-sized book for general information, plus a
black-and-blue Gamemaster Info book, which contains a few new examples of
vehicles, rules on criminal offenses, and, thankfully, specific places to
go with ideas (options) on how to build stories around those places.
The maps were kind of nice. I'm not a huge fan of 3-D political
cartography, but it's a nice once-in-a-while kind of perspective.
> IMHO, they'd have been better advised to put the Germany info in a
> box, along with more detail on the culture and technology, simply because
> (to most of us Americans, Doctor Doom of course excepted) Germany is much
> more foreign (no pun) than Denver.
With additional material, Germany could've been a great boxed set. It
seems, however, that FASA is pushing to bring another major city in NA
into the SR spotlight, and Denver was a good choice. My only complaint
is that it's such a pain in the ass to move the party around the city!
> My guess is that FASA wanted to see how a boxed set would do,
> since there aren't any other Shadowrun boxes.
I'm sure that was part of it. I really hope they don't go the T$R route
and try to make the boxed set (and now BRIEFCASE) an RPG standard.
It's a really good looking box, isn't it?
--the holy Entombed---rasputin@***.umd.edu--- - - - - -
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 16:02:50 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: the holy Entombed <rasputin@***.UMD.EDU>
Subject: Starters
In-Reply-To: <199410251948.PAA07680@*******.wam.umd.edu>
I've never run anything FASA's produced, but I've looked through most of
the modules, and from that and talking to other GMs, it seems that Ivy &
Chrome is highly rated as a good starting adventure.
When I started, I liked running the stuff from Sprawl Sites. I can't
help but think it must've been difficult to come up with so many odd ideas...
--thE---rasputin@***.umd.edu---"Don and Mike, my brothers!"-- - - -
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 16:07:48 EDT
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Brett Ryan Brown <calvinoi@*******.SCRI.FSU.EDU>
Subject: Physad Handybook on FTP!
I just wanted to announce to those who care that there is now a
directory (Role-Playing/Shadowrun/Physical Adepts Handybook) on
Cerebus (cerebus.acusd.edu) that contains the Physical Adepts Handybbok
as assembled by Paolo Marcucci and myself. BTW, first of all, PLEASE
read the README file in the dir, and also: There is NO Word5.1 format
there, despite what the README file says. There will also soon be an
ASCII file, so don't get your panties in a bind! Any
comments/criticism/flames...well...see the README file...should be
sent to the address in my .sig, por favor. Mucho thanks, chummers!
-L8TR,
-Calvinoi MindFlyer
--
_/_/_/_/ _ calvinoi@*******.scri.fsu.edu
_/ | | _ _ NOTE: All of the above
_/ __ _ | | __ __ (_) _ _ ___ (_) text put there by me
_/ / _` | | | \ V / | | | ' \ / _ \ | | is SOLELY my _own_
_/_/_/_/ \__,_| |_| \_/ |_| |_||_\ \___/ |_| worthless blather.
=============================================== ----------------------
(Geek Code 2.0) d+ h- s !g !au a-- w++ v+(-) c++(++++) US>US++ P? !L 3
--------------| N++ K++ !W M++ !V -po+(---) Y+>++ t++ 5+ j r+(++) G+>++
| v+ b++ D+ b--- e u**(---) h! f !r>r n-@ y? |-----------
----------------------------------------------
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 15:10:17 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Shadowbeat
In Reply to Monsieur Getchell,
I have not read the aforementioned tome. As I am just a poor
college student with no money, the only books I get to read are the
ones my friends have. So far, no of us has it.
But, just because something is written in a book does not mean it
is written in stone. Didn't someone once say that the most are just
suggestions and that the GM has the final decison???
In all truth, I am not in the music business, I am in the magic
business. I just thought that it would be a good idea.
Arcanely yours,
The Magister
"Demented and sad......but social!"
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 15:27:47 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Sam Thomas <sinbad@********.COM>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
>Sinbad writes:
>
>> But some things just have to be belived rather than explained. Until you
alter
>> your everything has to fit mindset, progress toward enlightnment will be
>> retarded
>> greatly.
>
>Hey, you'd make a good shaman, and Adam'd make a good hermetic... :-)
>
>And we all know what they say about arguments between the two different
>types, now, don't we? :-)
>
>--
>Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
>
Right On Mate!
Lets go out and get Pissed then.
G'day
Sinbad Sam
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 16:05:41 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Sam Thomas <sinbad@********.COM>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
> Do you understand how the computer you're using works? Exactly?
>Can you make sense of the electrical diagram? Can you follow the circuit
>pathways on the chip? How about that CRT Monitor you're staring at? Has
>20,000 volts, don't you know?
> Better log off. Stop fooling around with something you don't
>understand, you could get yourself killed.
>
>> Sinbad Sam
>
Yes I do know exactly how my computer works, I have read circuit diagrams
since 1972. Also I can follow circuit pathways on and off chip. By the way
my CRT only has 10,400 volts, I know because I have repaired it. My current
occupation is BioMedical Electronics Technician II. I fix hospital equipment
from coffee makers to MRI's. I also build computers for my hospital. I
understand technology and have for decades.
By the way you can reach FASA.Support at FASA@*****.geis.com I belive. The
ruling by them is that invisiblity effects eyesight, and cybereyes (you paid
essence for it). But that is because it a normally a mana based test.
Improved invisiblity effects both of the above, ultrasound, radar motion
dectors and vehicle grade sensors. That is due to it is physcial based test.
But You must remember that the successes from the casting of the spell only
adds to target number to be seen/detected. So technically it does not make
you truly transparent but people/things do not have good chance to notice
you. You might call it a "ignore me" type of spell, so in this light the
physics of what it does/does not do to light is moot.
Sinbad Sam
"Felix I will not pick the living room. It has that lived in look." ;-)
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 16:15:57 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Sam Thomas <sinbad@********.COM>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
>What is the "Lights of Marfa".
>
Gareth,
They are near a town in west Texas in the Big Bend region, the closest town
is Marfa. They are lights that can be seen over range of "Mountains" ,
fairly regularly at night. All known possilbilities have to been pursued to
no avail.
By the way is the light at the end of the tunnel explanation?
Sinbad Sam
"Felix don't throw away that mold it was my pet!!"
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 16:31:19 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Doctor Doom <jch8169@*******.TAMU.EDU>
Subject: The Reports of My Demise ...
Meine Kameraden:
Madness did verily strike one to be the call of the day as I
perused the recent logs ... to what enigmatic missive did all of these
speculative statements as to my supposed replacement, identity as J.
Edgar Hoover, and dubious fashion sense owe their ultimate genesis?
Fraught with curiosity, I set to plying through the sundry communiques.
Eventually the instigation was localized to a solitary post ...
specifically, an unauthorized THWAP launched from mine account and with
some measure of the appropriate accouterments, save that of language.
In such a grievous affront to the personage of Doom there can be
but ONE conceivable culprit: Mister Mood, an entity with which I have
experienced innumerable clashes in the far-flung past.
Mr. Mood is only superficially versed in the myriad manifestations
and infinite intricacies which combine to form, conspire in concert, and
compose the admittedly markedly idiosyncratic language of Doomspeak, as
was readily apparent to astute observers of his abortive attempt at the
emulation of my archaic lexiphanicistic manner of verbal conveyance. My
antithesis he is in a host of respects ... yet there are undeniable
similarities betwixt he and me.
I mark your incredulity at this juncture ... jawohl, the delineation
doth ring quite fantastic, e'en to me were I not otherwise apprised of
the situation. 'Ware his presence, meine Kameraden! His motus operandi
deceitful and insidious, his demeanor ranging from the shockingly prosaic
to vulgar vernacular, yet his designs remain a mystery, assuming his
woefully pedestrian mind is capable of machinations transcending vexation
and trickery. Ne'ertheless, his snares are legion ...
"Yo Dudes! Like, you didn't like my post?"
Halt, interloper! I woulde speak with thee, for thou hast defiled mine
account with thy monosyllabic prattling!
Forgive my haste, meine Kameraden, but I am beset by the desire to thrash
a particularly exasperating doppelgaenger who is presently seeking egress
from the laboratory with conspicuous rapidity.
Colonel Count von Hohenzollern und von Doom, DMSc, DSc, PhD.
Doom Technologies & Weapon Systems -- Dark Thought Publications
>>> Working on solutions best left in the dark.
<<<
[ Doctor Doom : jch8169@*******.tamu.edu ]
^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^
"In terms of impact, the gulf between the correct way to express an idea and
the almost correct method of conveyance is not dissimilar to the disparity
betwixt shooting a bullet and throwing it."
-- Doctor Doom
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 15:51:48 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Adam Getchell <acgetche@****.UCDAVIS.EDU>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
In-Reply-To: <9410252107.AA14927@********.engr.ucdavis.edu>
On Tue, 25 Oct 1994, Sam Thomas wrote:
> Yes I do know exactly how my computer works, I have read circuit diagrams
> since 1972. Also I can follow circuit pathways on and off chip. By the way
I was not impugning your technical expertise, but rather noting
the fact that in a modern technological society many of us use device for
which we have little actual understanding, beyond the basics.
Therefore, an argument which cautions against using things one
doesn't understand has rather wider implications than the author probably
noted.
You may have a wide variety of technical expertise, but there are
so many devices in this world that it is nearly impossible for an
individual to understand them all in detail. Therefore, most of us will
be placed in the position of using something we do not truly understand.
> you. You might call it a "ignore me" type of spell, so in this light the
> physics of what it does/does not do to light is moot.
In my tract, I very specifically noted that I was talking about
the physical version of the invisibility spell, not the mana version.
> Sinbad Sam
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
|Adam Getchell|acgetche@****.engr.ucdavis.edu | ez000270@*******.ucdavis.edu |
| acgetchell |"Invincibility is in oneself, vulnerability is in the opponent"|
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 18:18:41 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Sam Thomas <sinbad@********.COM>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
Adam,
>On Tue, 25 Oct 1994, Sam Thomas wrote:
>> you. You might call it a "ignore me" type of spell, so in this light
the
>> physics of what it does/does not do to light is moot.
>
> In my tract, I very specifically noted that I was talking about
>the physical version of the invisibility spell, not the mana version.
>
>
My point is that there is no differance between the two except as to
what/who is effected and the drain cost.
Shadowrun page 156. Invisiblity
"....Double the number of successes to get the target number for an
ovserver's Perception Test. A successful Perception Test means that the
invisible person or thing has been "NOTICED". ....."
Shadowrun page 156. Improved Invisiblity
"Like the invisiblity spell, .., except that this spell affects technolgical
sensing devices."
If I can "notice" a person I can shoot to hit/kill/stun him/her. It also
means that both versions of the spell affect cybereyes using thermographic
vision.
Sinbad Sam
"Felix that is not a stink that your nose smells but an wear enhanced socks
with built in support"
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 18:17:20 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
.
> I have a LOT of dice, but if I GM, and the PCs walk into a room with 5
> sec guys with CPs, that's a hideous amount of dice rolling. Also, at
Are you playing 1st or 2nd ed.? Bad guys have professional and
threat ratings. Same function as CPs, but usually less dice and no
allocation problems. Por and threat ratings are added dice to ALL
success rolls: Pro to social and such, threat to combat.
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 18:28:05 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
Query: What is Ultravision???
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 18:47:10 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Sam Thomas <sinbad@********.COM>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
>Query: What is Ultravision???
>
>
Ultravision is what Ultraman has. ;-). But seriously it is vision into the
ultraviolet spectrum. Game use only if ultraviolet light source is
available. Thermographic is more useful IMO.
>
>Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will
smile upon them.
>I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
>
> -SHADOWDANCER-
>
>
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 18:43:48 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Bands in SR
> joe" thinks computers have big panels and lots of blinky-lights.
He's
> afraid of a "computer error" munging his credit record and
destroying his
> life. Why is he afraid? Because he doesn't understand what
computers are.
> The same things applies to magic. It's human nature to fear what
isn't
> understood, and that fear often erupts into violence.
>
> Magister> The illusions WOULD be judged by folks on their artistic
merits
> Magister> and relationship to the song.
>
> You're living in a much different world than I. Or maybe I'm just
being
> cynical, but I doubt it.
>
> --
> Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> |Caution: Happy Fun Ball may
suddenly
> http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox|accelerate to dangerous
speeds.
> PGP Public Key: Ask for one today!
Excellent SS!! I haven't heard a rebuttle like that in ages. I happen to
agree with both of you. Though trid use is recommended, magic can
be used as an AUGMENTATION. Illusions can be controlled better,
cost less in the long run, and provides other magicians with the astral
element. As for riots, some bad apples have hurt the magic in music
industry, yet their is a nova-hot band that uses magic regularly.
Cannot remember the name(try lugging every book,excluding
adventures, but 4 every where you go), but the group is in
Shadowbeat. The answer is a touchy one, but if authorities were
informed before hand, and some mages watched from astral the
whole time, it could be pulled off.
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 18:49:51 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
Here, here!! But it's kinda bed when you have bad guys that the
less essence you have, the less frightened you will be.
A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
and smile.
-Star-
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 19:22:29 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
THWAPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP!!!
THWAPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP!!!
Feel better now?
A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
and smile.
-Star-
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 19:24:59 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
> *** FLAME ON ***
>
> Excuse me, but you sound like some technophobic idiot that
doesnt
> know what he is talking about. This very medium you just used is a
byproduct
> of the science you blame for all the things you despise. Science is
pure,
> its arguably the only pure thing left. The desire to learn and to
understand,
> to ask questions and search for the answers - this is science. Now
dont
> tell me that this quest for knowledge can turn anything to 'drek'.
> And dont give me that drek about 'the REAL mana flow' cause
no such
> thing exists. Science is mans magic, and only through science can
we hope to
> understand our gods. Only science can drag us out of the gutter of
'faith'
> and give us understanding.
>
> *** FLAME OFF ***
>
> No smiley :(
>
My, my, my. I do believe that our dear friend Vader has lost that
"magick" that makes life worth living. I do understand science. See
earlier posting. And this bit-o-sci-fi has not DIRECTLY caused harm to
the environment. Indirectly is another story. And as posted earlier, I
should have blamed the corporations first. But science caused the
problem in the first place. I will not buge on that. The fact that it is
busting its hoop to rectify the mistake is admirable. I will admit to
flying off the handle. It was unexcusable, but forgivable. Hopfully
Adam has done so. If you cannot forgive for a minor indiscretion
based on a moment of heated emotions, maybe science has invaded
your soul. Look at ShadowRun for an example. Yes it is a game, but
also a horrifing future. Though I would love to run the shadows with
the wiz toys used in the game, I do not want to raise children in a
world where halve of it is dead, the other halve dying. This is what
unscrupulous business people and your science has done to the
world. Is their any cyber under your skin?
Sadness of a gained friend lost is matched only by the death of a
person, and his soul.
:'( Shadowdancer :'(
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 19:25:36 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Buddha <CCOLLINS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
Star how are you? My name is the Buddha.
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 19:40:37 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Immortality and Elves vs. Science and Laws of Nature
>
> Giai? Please...I only trust what I can know emperically. And as for
> Giai, not to impugne on your beliefs, but I don't buy inot that New
Age
> type stuff.
>
> Erik, a.k.a. the Whistler
>
You don't buy into a lot of stuff:) It makes you interesting to argue
with.
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 17:44:01 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Spellslinger <mruane@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: Concerts
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410251716.AA19060@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
On Tue, 25 Oct 1994, Magister wrote:
> Let's face it, boys and girls. No matter how much we blither about
> how great (or not) it would be to have magic used to create illusions at
> concerts, our friend, the SSR, will never concede that it will not cause
> a riot. " You keep using that word, I don't think it means what you
> think it means." :)
> Til the flow dries up
> The Magister
> "Demented and sad....but social!"
>
I just thought of something that might shed some light on the magical
ngiht of music thing:
Would you get upset if Quaker Oats started using subliminal advertising
to make you buy oatmeal, even though you had the oatmeal once and it
wasn't that spectacular? Wouldn't that piss you off?
Now, say you see a commercial for Frosted Flakes, and it has the same
format that Quaker Oats commercial had. It might've made you hungry (I
always had a weak spot for Tony's Sugar frosted flakes) but wouldn't you
get a little suspicious? What if Kellogs picked up and copied what
Quaker Oats was doing and was forcing you to buy Frosted Flakes? It
makes you paranoid just to think about it.
Just my $.02 and psychobable.
Mike aka Spellslinger
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 19:49:20 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
>
> Hunh? People have an Action every 10 phases, it's just that this
Action can
> be any combination (within the rules) of simple, complex, and free.
>
>
I just said that.
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 19:52:03 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Immortality and Elves vs. Science and Laws of Nature
I do not smoke pot. I do hug trees. I am a Witch. Remember the
discussion on real magick? :))
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 20:03:01 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Paranoia
Spellslinger, you and the Rat are so paraniod about mind control, it is
just unbelievable. How can you call yourself a mage and be so dead
set against this. I am not necessarily for magic in concerts and for
the use of magic in all aspects of life. The more it is used, the more
familar people will become, and the easier it will be for ALL members
of the Craft.
Arcanely yours,
The Magister
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 20:12:51 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
Hello Buddah. Nice to make your aquantaince. It is good to see
someone else from this campus besides Shadowdancer, Magister
and myself. It will be intresting to argue with you my friend.
Untill we meet in the shadows...
A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
and smile.
-Star-
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 20:13:38 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Paranoia
> Spellslinger, you and the Rat are so paraniod about mind control, it
is
> just unbelievable. How can you call yourself a mage and be so
dead
> set against this. I am not necessarily for magic in concerts and for
> the use of magic in all aspects of life. The more it is used, the more
> familar people will become, and the easier it will be for ALL
members
> of the Craft.
> Arcanely yours,
> The Magister
>
Please excuse our dear friend Magister. The controlling mage
passed out and unfortunatly let him loose. Please forgive any choas
he might have caused on the bases that he is not well. The sick boy
has been restrained and the magehood is in place. Oops.
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 20:17:47 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Paranoia
Excuse me, I think another case of the "Neverending Thwap" spell is
needed for our DEAR friend, Shadowdancer. Either that or a power
bolt up the old wazzoo.
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 20:21:13 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Paranoia
Thanx to wonderful "Lonestar" our dear friend Magister has been
caught, due to the help of Shadowdancer. Now, in memory, I ask that
everyone write a mean thanx note to Shadowdancer for the capture of
a good mage.
WEEP, WEEP, SOB, SOB.
A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
and smile.
-Star-
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 18:22:47 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Mercenary X <kdye@*****.STANFORD.EDU>
Subject: Re: Paranoia
In-Reply-To: <199410260115.SAA13593@*****.Stanford.EDU>
>
> Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smil
e
> upon them.
> I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
>
> -SHADOWDANCER-
>
Yah? Will I blow off yer head with an optical mag-3 assault cannon, and
now who is leading?
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 21:24:50 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Organization: The Happy Fun Ball Brigade
Subject: Re: Paranoia
In-Reply-To: Magister's message of Tue, 25 Oct 1994 20:03:01 EST
<C7DD74486@*****.vinu.edu>
>>>>> "Magister" == Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
writes:
Magister> Spellslinger, you and the Rat are so paraniod about mind control,
Magister> it is just unbelievable.
Paranoia? No, just a healthy fear. I'm afraid of quite a few things, most
notably the government of the United States. But that's beside the point.
My arguments aren't from the perspective of /my/ fear but that of the
audience. I'm playing the Devil's Advocate here.
One of the most important elements of cyberpunk is that kind of urban
shell-shock caused by technology advancing faster than the common man can
keep up with. The technology curve leaves him dazed and confused, and that
usually results in fear of the same technology. The Shadowrun world has
that kind of techno shell-shock, and it also has its analogue with magic.
Mages, like street ronin, are feared, not respected, except by a very small
handful, because they have at their command power and technology out of the
reach and comprehension of everyman. That's before you have the media and
the government and the corporations reinforcing those negative stereotypes.
Magister> How can you call yourself a mage and be so dead set against this.
Is there something wrong with having a strong desire to not get lynched by
a mob? Does having such a desire make me paranoid?
Magister> I am not necessarily for magic in concerts and for the use of
Magister> magic in all aspects of life. The more it is used, the more
Magister> familar people will become, and the easier it will be for ALL
Magister> members of the Craft.
Sure. But try convincing hundreds of millions of people of this. In the
UCAS and CAS of the 2050s, the Great Ghost Dance is ranked up there with
the Holocaust of Nazi Germany. Try convincing a Jew that the Holocaust was
a good thing. That's the kind of struggle you're up against.
--
Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> |Ingredients of Happy Fun Ball include an
http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox|unknown glowing substance which fell to
PGP Public Key: Ask for one today! |Earth, presumably from outer space.
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 20:23:55 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Buddha <CCOLLINS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
Hey I am new at this game so give me some time to catch up with the
rest of you experienced players. I will be there soon so do dispair
the Buddha will fair.
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 20:25:10 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Buddha <CCOLLINS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Paranoia
The "Buddha" rules all that walks before him!!
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 21:30:07 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Wow, Reality. That's a switch" <MHILLIARD@****.ALBION.EDU>
Subject: All this magick vs. science stuff
You magick types stop trying to convert the mundanes. That's against the rules,
remember? =)
You science types need to lighten up. You'all are gettin' way to tense for my
peace of mind.
A few specifics:
Vader: Flaming is bad. *thwap on the wrist* Flaming in public is especially
bad. *thwap upside the head-with a dikoted cybercarp*
Shadowdancer: 1) Way cool post about Gaia. 2) You owe me royalties. I came
out with the Rotary Autocarp over a year ago.
Eric: Gaia Theory is actually a scientific hypothesis. It is true that some
people take it beyond the scientific theory, though.
Science: Is not the world. It is a way of looking at the world. So is
Bhuddism.
Slainte'!
Phelan
_____________________________________________________________________
Phelan the Undisciplined \ "What family doesn't have its
MHILLIARD@****.Albion.edu \ ups and downs?"
----------------------------------\ -Eleanor of Aquitaine
"A man of God should be \----------------------------------
identifiable as a man of God in "No you idiot, port is LEFT!"
spite of his religion, not because
of it."
-David Gerrold
Geek Code: GL/SS/O !d- H+>+++ s+:+ !g !p+ auc a- w++++ !v+++ C++>+++ U? P?
!L !3 E? N K- !W--- M++ V+ po--- Y+ t+++(Romulans RULE!) 5+++ jx R+++ G' tv
b+++ D--- B---- e* u+++(u**) h* !f* r+>r++ n--- y--(**)
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 20:30:14 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Paranoia
Rat, I find in you a worthy opponent. I think you and I are arguing just
for the sake of arguing. :) But, in any case, my earlier statements
stand.
Hugs and Kisses
you know who
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 18:36:07 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Spellslinger <mruane@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: Paranoia
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410260107.AA00856@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
On Tue, 25 Oct 1994, Magister wrote:
> Spellslinger, you and the Rat are so paraniod about mind control, it is
> just unbelievable. How can you call yourself a mage and be so dead
> set against this. I am not necessarily for magic in concerts and for
> the use of magic in all aspects of life. The more it is used, the more
> familar people will become, and the easier it will be for ALL members
> of the Craft.
> Arcanely yours,
> The Magister
>
I'm hardly paranoid. I am educated so it's easier for me accept
changes. Being a scientist, change in accepted theories is welcome to
broaden our horizons. However, Bob McGee the farmer in Iowa may not be
as open minded as me. Look at Creationism (not meaning to start a
religious debate-- it's an allegory). It's easier for people to say "The
Bible says this, dam gum it!" rather than to spend the time to study and
understand the meaning behind it. It's also easier to fear something new
than to accept it. Imgine that the rock group was playing and they had a
guy on the stage with a loaded machine gun and was shooting it off.
It'd make me a bit scared, beacuse I have know idea if this guy is a
trained professional or a loon clinging to reality. If there isn't a man
with a gun, then it's easier to enjoy the music.
Mike aka Spellslinger
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 21:40:21 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Organization: The Happy Fun Ball Brigade
Subject: Re: Paranoia
In-Reply-To: Magister's message of Tue, 25 Oct 1994 20:30:14 EST
<CF20505EF@*****.vinu.edu>
>>>>> "Magister" == Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
writes:
Magister> Rat, I find in you a worthy opponent.
I will take that as a compliment :).
I'm also pretty darn stubborn if you hadn't noticed already :).
Magister> I think you and I are arguing just for the sake of arguing. :)
Magister> But, in any case, my earlier statements stand.
<shrug> As you would. But then I'm about 5-8 years older than most of the
people on this list (don't let the .edu site fool you), and those few extra
years of living in the real world, working at a real job, and dealing with
the real bullshit and beaurocracy of the government has given me a somewhat
different perspective on life than I had back when I was in school.
--
Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> |Do not use Happy Fun Ball on concrete.
http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox|
PGP Public Key: Ask for one today! |
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 21:42:57 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Malcalypse The Younger <shadow@******.NET>
Subject: Re: House rules for a newbie
In-Reply-To: <9410250553.AA29675@ IntNet.net>
>
> Here you are more or less correct. A few things to remember are that Astral
> Combat is basically a combonation of melee combat and spell casting. Just
> use the astral characteristics and run it like a melee battle. As for matrix
> combat, it's totally screwed up. I've yet to find a matrix combat system
> that makes me entirely happy. The chase rules are a world onto themselves,
> although they do remind me of the rules in the James Bond RPG. We never use
> the damn thing in the campaigns I've been in.
>
You know, I don't think we've had more of a decker than a charachter with
a plain 'ole datajack and a cheapo deck in a long time... No
'professional' deckers.. Just because the rules are so bad for most of
the matrix oriented stuff.
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 20:47:44 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Paranoia
I just have one thing to say to this Buddha person.......
THWAP!
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 22:04:04 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Malcalypse The Younger <shadow@******.NET>
Subject: Re: Astral Space <>Space ?
In-Reply-To: <9410251436.AA23934@ IntNet.net>
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, Damion Milliken wrote:
> [On a previous (unfortunately deleted) mail, someone hypothisises that
> horrors lurk in outer space]
>
> Urk, I hope not, after all, I'd like to think there is somewhere safe from
> the horrors. Not knowing too much about them myself, I can't really say, but
> don't they require a magic _rich_ environment, rather than a magically
> desolate one such as in orbit?
>
Hm.. Perhaps space is NOT the mana poor environment that we have been led
to believe, but is instead very mana RICH, but has been courrupted badly
by the Horrors (as has happened in ED, it's impossible to cast unfiltered
spells, and looking into the Astral plane is horrifying...) Hm.
I really don't support this theory, but it would seem to fufill the
observed data.
Shadow@******.Net
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 21:09:36 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: The "Real" World
Rat, I too am probably older than most on this list. I
worked in the "real" world for around five years, that's why there is an
edu. on my address as well. If you work in a government job, then I
understand the source of your cynicsm and paranoia. Perhaps we
can agree to disagree, if you will. :)
In full retreat from the
"real" world,
That Magic Guy
"Be careful,
People in masks can't be trusted."
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 22:10:40 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Malcalypse The Younger <shadow@******.NET>
Subject: Re: Denver box
In-Reply-To: <9410251544.AC26076@ IntNet.net>
On Tue, 25 Oct 1994, Matt Hufstetler wrote:
>
> Bah, DNA/DOA is better. If you're really satannic, you could run them on
> Mercurial, or Missing Blood. <BIG EVIL GRIN>
>
Hah. I'm going to be running my players through a very modified version
of Missing Blood in the Tir some time soon.. It will hurt. A lot.
BTW, what do you people think about this: If you are possessed by a
spirit, who has control? I contend that the spirit controls you, and you
have no more input into the character's actions. My GM contends that
you can have control as long as you willingly accept the spirit. This is
painful as I see our game going ULTRA-munchkin.. Sigh, our most recent
encounter was (still is actually) with 3 people in powered armor, which
is doubling as a rating 8 (I think) power focus, who have been possessed
by Force 21 Storm Spirits... Arg. 5d6 initiative, Spells, Rating 4
tactical computer in the armor, the works. Oh well.
Shadow@******.Net
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 22:14:19 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "D.O.A. SECURITY" <MKNABUSCH@****.ALBION.EDU>
Subject: Re: Paranoia
SWEET MOTHER OF US ALL!
I'm trying to be civil. I'm trying to be
nice. But at each successive flame, it gets
worse. PLEASE calm down. Does it pay to insult
anothers religion? Does it pay to personally attack
someone else?
*long suffering sigh*
C'mon people. Relax. Don't take things personally, don't
personally aim remarks (flamable ones that is) at each other.
If what some one says ticks you off, wait at least a half hour
before responding (I just broke my own rule...damn.).
Michael
aka Harlequin
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 21:28:29 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Paranoia
I do believe that Rat and I have settled our differences, if that is what
you're alluding to. If it is the debate between Shadowdancer and the
others, well I wholeheartedly agree.
Arcanely yours,
The Magister
No Geek Code
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 19:52:43 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Erik S Jameson <esj@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Many things...
I would like to take this time, my fellow Americans, to address a few
concerns that I have, that have been recently brought to my attention...
I am aware of the Giai Theory. However, there are two points which
_must_ be brought to light. First of all, it is _only_ a way a looking
at the whole environment, a holistic view of things. Taking the earth
and making it into a single organism for environmental purposes.
Secondly, there is very little, if any, reasonable proof there is
something like a Giai-sphere. There is no good, solid, reputable science
to prove the theory.
Second, I have been avoiding the whole magic in concerts debate for good
reasons. The primary one being I actually wasted my money and bought
Shadwobeat when it came out. However, I have been motivated to respond
when the issue of paranoia came up. Do you realize we are being
manipulated every time we turn on our televisions or radios? I am a
Media Arts student, and one of the primary things I have learned in the
long years here in Tucson is that advertising, television, radio, and
film, ALL manipluate us. No, I am not being paranoid. It is the truth.
In one segment of media, advertisement, the people who craft the
commercials use all sorts of what are refered to as "IG's", meaning
Instant Gratification's. That is why we see beautiful women in beer and
car commercials. Why perfume commercials make no sense. Advertisers are
putting in objects that appeal to use, whether or not they have
_anything_ todo with the product. And it works. Plain and simple fact.
People refuse to admit it, because it means they are not in control of
their own lives. But the simple fact remains. We, as a consuming
capitalistic society are being manipulated daily.
Third, I am not a dogmatic believer in only science. I am an agnostic.
If you can prove to me that ghosts exist, then I am willing to believe
you. But I have yet to see ANY positive, reputable proof of _anything_
supernatural, being UFO's, ghosts, or magic (or magick as Shadowdancer
would have it).
That is all my fellow Americans. Thank you for your time, and God bless you.
Erik, a.k.a. the Whistler
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 22:46:49 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Chad Hessoun <chessoun@*******.COLUMBUS.OH.US>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
In-Reply-To: <199410252343.TAA06472@****.freenet.columbus.oh.us>
> >Query: What is Ultravision???
> >
> >
> Ultravision is what Ultraman has. ;-). But seriously it is vision into the
> ultraviolet spectrum. Game use only if ultraviolet light source is
> available. Thermographic is more useful IMO.
I think you're thinking of a different game (p. 59, 1st ed. DMG, T$R, and
I'll never mention this whole ugly system again).
What I meant by "ultra" was ultrasound, as in the scope/imaging
technology found in SRII. This works by using sound waves (as opposed to
light of any kind) to produce an image. For example, let's say that a
carp, for no particular reason I'm sure, was being forceably waived in
your direction in total darkness. Ultrasound would bounce sound waves off
the carp, and let you "see" it just before it smacked one's skull. Not
unlike bats, and highly preferable to light-based sight (or so I've heard).
-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+- C H A D H E S S O U N -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>> itinerant OTISian ArchBishop formerly of Kenyon and Greater Gambier
<<<
>>>>> Everything forbidden is optional... 9 out of 10 heretics agree!
<<<<<
Hail OTIS! Find out more: ighf@******.com or hessoun@******.edu Hail Spode!
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 23:01:26 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Chad Hessoun <chessoun@*******.COLUMBUS.OH.US>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
In-Reply-To: <199410251520.LAA17338@****.freenet.columbus.oh.us>
On Tue, 25 Oct 1994, Matt Hufstetler wrote:
> > Given these things, we've also adopted a house rule about healing that
> > allows multipe tries by the same mage on the same wounds (+2 TN every
> > successive attempt, and the drain gets hellacious). Generally, the two
>
> Hmm, but in SRII, isn't it that you get ONE try at healing the person?
> And isn't it every two successes you get, ONE box is removed? Try healing
> that SS who has a serious wound now.
Let me jsut take a minute of everyone's time to clarify myself. The 1:1
ration of successes to healed boxes still applies; yes, the rules say you
only get one chance, that's why this is a HOUSE rule; noone ever said
healing a sammie [essence .01] was _easy_, uh huh, nothing's ever easy.
Thank you, we now return you to your regularlyscheduled flame wars.
Y'ouch!
"The first secret of good religious management is getting other people to
do the creative work for you. The second is lying through your teeth."
- T. Howland
-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+- C H A D H E S S O U N -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>> itinerant OTISian ArchBishop formerly of Kenyon and Greater Gambier
<<<
>>>>> Everything forbidden is optional... 9 out of 10 heretics agree!
<<<<<
Hail OTIS! Find out more: ighf@******.com or hessoun@******.edu Hail Spode!
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 1994 20:17:53 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Spellslinger <mruane@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Sorry...
I didn't mean to offend anyone through the religion reference. I was
just trying to put something in reference. I'm not flaming anyone,
either. Im just trying to present a perspective.
Mike aka Spellslinger
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 00:05:03 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Matt Hufstetler <gt2778a@*****.GATECH.EDU>
Subject: Re: Denver box
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@******.GATECH.EDU
In-Reply-To: <199410260331.XAA23963@*****.gatech.edu> from "Malcalypse The
Younger" at Oct 25, 94 10:10:40 pm
> BTW, what do you people think about this: If you are possessed by a
> spirit, who has control? I contend that the spirit controls you, and you
> have no more input into the character's actions. My GM contends that
> you can have control as long as you willingly accept the spirit. This is
> painful as I see our game going ULTRA-munchkin.. Sigh, our most recent
> encounter was (still is actually) with 3 people in powered armor, which
> is doubling as a rating 8 (I think) power focus, who have been possessed
> by Force 21 Storm Spirits... Arg. 5d6 initiative, Spells, Rating 4
> tactical computer in the armor, the works. Oh well.
From what I got in Missing Blood, it would seem that voluntary meshings
don't matter. It's just from voluntary meshings you can get soldiers,
instead of workers. Either way, your soul is consumed(Unless you can roll
6+ successes against the queen when you are captured. Read that. CONSUMED.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 17:32:10 +1100
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Luke Kendall <luke@********.CANON.OZ.AU>
Subject: Confusion?
It seems to me (from reading the recent flame wars, personal
introductions, urgings of people trying to convince other people
that magic should be used in music concerts, etc. and so on),
that some misunderstanding of the purpose of this mailing
list has developed.
Some of those posts read like remarks from a character _in_
the game to another character _in_ the game, rather than a
remark from one player _of_ the game to another.
This discussion list is _about_ Shadowrun. It's not a place
to _play_ Shadowrun. This is supposed to be mainly
a discussion of just the _rules_ of Shadowrun. (Even though we
often stray a little farther afield than that.)
The reason I'm pointing this out is that I don't want to just
hit the delete button as soon as I see a posting from XXYZYX
(not mentioning any real names). But for me, at least, it's
getting close to that point.
If you want other people to take the time to read what you have
written (and I assume that's why we all write, occasionally) -
then try to stick to the subject.
Please?
luke
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 17:36:52 +1100
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Luke Kendall <luke@********.CANON.OZ.AU>
Subject: Re: Astral Space <>Space ?
Malcalypse The Younger writes:
> Hm.. Perhaps space is NOT the mana poor environment that we have been led
> to believe, but is instead very mana RICH, but has been courrupted badly
> by the Horrors (as has happened in ED, it's impossible to cast unfiltered
> spells, and looking into the Astral plane is horrifying...) Hm.
>
> I really don't support this theory, but it would seem to fufill the
> observed data.
Well, that's the way our group basically played it, from the very start of
SR I.
(Probably due to our Cthulhu background, and my 1st character: a 16 yr
old mage who'd gone mad casting a spell in space.)
luke
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 16:54:07 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
In-Reply-To: <199410251548.BAA20689@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from
"Spellslinger" at
Oct 25, 94 08:26:03 am
Mike writes:
> My general GM rule is: with few NPCs, add CP + Threat. With armies of
> hosers in Med. Sec. Armor: No Cp and just threat. All of the opposing
> shadowrunners have all their pools to make the "professional vs.
> professional" battle equal out. The threat makes up for karma the
> characters have.
So if the runners are fighting only a few opponents the bad guys get _both_
CP and Threat? That's a bit nasty isn't it, since if there are only a few
opponents, then the enemies are probably pretty tough as it is :-). As for
the enemy runners receiving CPs, I agree, but do they also get Threat?
That'd make 'em pretty tough I'd reckon.
A question too. When you wear heavy armours, you lose CP points, right?
Well, what about those goons with the heavy armour and Threat ratings? Do
they sacrifice any, or do they get by without the kind of negatives that the
runners would get?
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 16:58:03 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
In-Reply-To: <199410251723.DAA27232@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "J.D. Falk"
at
Oct 25, 94 01:18:36 pm
Adam writes:
> > > Well, follow laws maybe, but not neccessrily the same laws as regular
> > > science does. Else if you were invisible, as someone argued before, you
> > > would not be able to see. From this I would conclude that some different
> > > natural law(s) apply to magic.
> >
> > Well this conclusion implies that we know of the existence of all
> > the laws of nature. Well I dont think so.....
>
> Yeah, I have to agree with Darth.
Hunh? I would have imagined that "different" would have implied "as yet
unkown", or "new", which means I was agreeing with you both all along. I
must make a point to ensure I am more clear in what I say in the future :-)
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 17:01:10 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
In-Reply-To: <199410251723.DAA27232@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "J.D. Falk"
at
Oct 25, 94 01:18:36 pm
Errgghh
In my post just prior to this, I did one of those things that would end up
creating lots and lots of possible annoyance to others out there; I
incorrectly attributed the quoted material. Arrrhhgg, Thwap me now if you
must. It was actually J.D. Falk, not Adam (I always get you two mixed up,
dunno why).
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 17:03:32 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Immortality and Elves vs. Science and Laws of Nature
In-Reply-To: <199410260057.KAA21623@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from
"Shadowdancer" at
Oct 25, 94 07:52:03 pm
Shadowdancer writes:
> I do not smoke pot. I do hug trees. I am a Witch. Remember the
> discussion on real magick? :))
Ah, that's right; you're the one we were going to burn at the stake. (joke -
joke :-) :-)). Yeah, now I remember. Sorry for calling you a hippy.
You do hug trees though eh? :-)
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 17:05:27 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Paranoia
In-Reply-To: <199410260132.LAA23174@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Magister"
at Oct
25, 94 08:30:14 pm
You know who (:-)) writes:
> Rat, I find in you a worthy opponent. I think you and I are arguing just
> for the sake of arguing. :) But, in any case, my earlier statements
> stand.
And just what is wrong with "arguing for the sake of it"? I do it all the
time. :-) I'll have to make a point of not doing it with Rat, we'd go on
forever :-)
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 17:07:07 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Astral Space <>Space ?
In-Reply-To: <199410260208.MAA24820@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Malcalypse The
Younger" at Oct 25, 94 10:04:04 pm
Shadow writes:
> Hm.. Perhaps space is NOT the mana poor environment that we have been led
> to believe, but is instead very mana RICH, but has been courrupted badly
> by the Horrors (as has happened in ED, it's impossible to cast unfiltered
> spells, and looking into the Astral plane is horrifying...) Hm.
>
> I really don't support this theory, but it would seem to fufill the
> observed data.
I might be a bit skeptical at that. Doesn't the creation/upkeep of the mana
level also require living beings to be around? Can't be too many of those
out in orbit.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 17:08:35 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Many things...
In-Reply-To: <199410260301.NAA27166@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Erik S
Jameson"
at Oct 25, 94 07:52:43 pm
Erik writes:
> I would like to take this time, my fellow Americans, to address a few
> concerns that I have, that have been recently brought to my attention...
>
> ...
>
> That is all my fellow Americans. Thank you for your time, and God bless you.
Ah, OK, so that means those of us who aren't Americans can safely ignore all
you just said? :-)
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 17:18:49 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Denver box
In-Reply-To: <199410260406.OAA29326@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Matt
Hufstetler"
at Oct 26, 94 00:05:03 am
Matt writes:
> > BTW, what do you people think about this: If you are possessed by a
> > spirit, who has control? I contend that the spirit controls you, and you
> > have no more input into the character's actions. My GM contends that
> > you can have control as long as you willingly accept the spirit. This is
> > painful as I see our game going ULTRA-munchkin.. Sigh, our most recent
> > encounter was (still is actually) with 3 people in powered armor, which
> > is doubling as a rating 8 (I think) power focus, who have been possessed
> > by Force 21 Storm Spirits... Arg. 5d6 initiative, Spells, Rating 4
> > tactical computer in the armor, the works. Oh well.
>
> From what I got in Missing Blood, it would seem that voluntary meshings
> don't matter. It's just from voluntary meshings you can get soldiers,
> instead of workers. Either way, your soul is consumed(Unless you can roll
> 6+ successes against the queen when you are captured. Read that. CONSUMED.
I think he might have been referring to the free spirit power of possesion,
rather than the insect spirit host domination. If he was, then I say that no
matter how the spirit gains possesion, the spirit and only the spirit is in
control. The person who's body has been highjacked is either out to it for
that period of time, or just along for the ride (I can't remember which
just now). I also have a suspicion that something in the Grimything backs me
up, but I could be imagining it... :-)
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 17:21:58 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Confusion?
In-Reply-To: <199410260635.QAA03892@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Luke
Kendall" at
Oct 26, 94 05:32:10 pm
luke writes:
> Some of those posts read like remarks from a character _in_
> the game to another character _in_ the game, rather than a
> remark from one player _of_ the game to another.
Nah, those people are actually like that, in real life :-) [Not meaning to
offend anyone if you really _are_ like that, in real life.]
> This discussion list is _about_ Shadowrun. It's not a place
> to _play_ Shadowrun. This is supposed to be mainly
> a discussion of just the _rules_ of Shadowrun. (Even though we
> often stray a little farther afield than that.)
Yeah, but we also discuss all those associated topics that go with it (I
can't remember just what the big list is), and I think things like
discussions on societies reactions to new technology and magic are perefctly
within the list specs.
Otherwise you are all too correct, yes.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 02:51:00 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Matt <mosbun@******.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: Re: Paranoia
> The "Buddha" rules all that walks before him!!
From what (admittedly little) I know about Buddhism, I find this statement
endlessly amusing.
I also find the idea of certain ultra-greens being adamantly opposed to the
exploration of the laws of nature fairly amusin. But not highly surprising.
Paganism loses a lot of it's mystery and perceived power as the laws of
nature are more fully understood.
Now if that ain't flame-bait, I don't know what is.
Matt
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 04:13:21 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Wow, Reality. That's a switch" <MHILLIARD@****.ALBION.EDU>
Subject: Re: magick vs science
>Paganism loses a lot of its mystery and perceived power as the laws of
>nature are uncovered by science
*snort*
*snicker*
*laugh*
Yeah, OK, whatever. Believe whatever you want, B'wanda. But the day Science
explains a Nightflyer I'll turn in my antlers.
Phelan
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 18:27:40 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
In-Reply-To: <199410252320.JAA17778@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Sam Thomas"
at
Oct 25, 94 06:18:41 pm
Sinbad Sam writes:
> My point is that there is no differance between the two except as to
> what/who is effected and the drain cost.
> Shadowrun page 156. Invisiblity
> "....Double the number of successes to get the target number for an
> ovserver's Perception Test. A successful Perception Test means that the
> invisible person or thing has been "NOTICED". ....."
> Shadowrun page 156. Improved Invisiblity
> "Like the invisiblity spell, .., except that this spell affects technolgical
> sensing devices."
>
> If I can "notice" a person I can shoot to hit/kill/stun him/her. It also
> means that both versions of the spell affect cybereyes using thermographic
> vision.
This all sounded just fine to me until I got home and actually looked it up
in the book. You forgot the sentance before the one you quoted for
Invisibility, the one that goes "Thermographic vision can still detect body
heat, and the subject is completely tangible and detectable to the senses of
hearing, smell, and so forth."
While I am rather partial to a "notice-me-not" type spell, I don't think
(Improved) Invisibility is this type of spell.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 10:29:33 GMT
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Neil Smith <NSMITH@***.AC.UK>
Organization: De Montfort Uni Milton Keynes
Subject: Legality ratings
Can anyone explain the legality rating system to me? (the 6P-CA
stuff). Having Sprawl Sites, I've figured out that the second bit is
the type of item and hence use/posession penalties. I take it that the
first bit is to do with permits, but I don't know how to read it.
Thanks,
Neil.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 09:14:14 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Gareth Owen <glowen1@*****.NHS.GOV.UK>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
In-Reply-To: <9410252116.aa03313@****.demon.co.uk> from "Sam Thomas" at
Oct 25,
94 04:15:57 pm
>
> >What is the "Lights of Marfa".
> >
>
> Gareth,
>
> They are near a town in west Texas in the Big Bend region, the closest town
> is Marfa. They are lights that can be seen over range of "Mountains" ,
> fairly regularly at night. All known possilbilities have to been pursued to
> no avail.
Oh, thanks, I wonder what causes them.
Any legends attached to them?
> By the way is the light at the end of the tunnel explanation?
Well, as I understand it:
In a near death experience the oxygen reaching the brain is reduced and
this causes the neurons in the brain to all start firing in a 'storm'
of activity, hence you see a bright light 'cos all the neurons dealing
with sight are firing at once. The tunnel effect is because the eyes are
more sensitive towards the centre than outside, hence more neurons
deal with the centre than the edges, so the light is brighter at the centre,
hence the person 'sees' a tunnel.
I've probably not explained that rigorously, that's the gist of what I can
remember from a TV/radio/book/whatever where I heard about it.
> Sinbad Sam
>
> "Felix don't throw away that mold it was my pet!!"
>
GLO
--
Gareth Owen | Mail: glowen1@*****.nhs.gov.uk
Sytems Programmmer | Phone: (UK) 0495 765021
Gwent Health Authority | "Reboot it from orbit, it's the only way to be sure"
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 09:25:08 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Gareth Owen <glowen1@*****.NHS.GOV.UK>
Subject: Re: Bands in SR
In-Reply-To: <9410252346.aa20189@****.demon.co.uk> from "Shadowdancer" at
Oct
25, 94 06:43:48 pm
>
> agree with both of you. Though trid use is recommended, magic can
> be used as an AUGMENTATION. Illusions can be controlled better,
> cost less in the long run, and provides other magicians with the astral
> element. As for riots, some bad apples have hurt the magic in music
> -SHADOWDANCER-
Illusions can be more spontaneous as well, every performance will
be different, more artistic, kinda like the synthesiser vs. real
instruments debate
GLO
--
Gareth Owen | Mail: glowen1@*****.nhs.gov.uk
Sytems Programmmer | Phone: (UK) 0495 765021
Gwent Health Authority | "Reboot it from orbit, it's the only way to be sure"
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 11:50:14 --100
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stefan Willkofer <stefan.willkofer@*****.PHYSIK.UNI-REGENSBURG.DE>
Subject: Astral Space <>Space ?
>
> I would think that they live on some undiscovered metaplane.
>
Don't you think that Space is an undiscovered realm of Astral
Space? Noone except the mage in Eye-Witness (that was the module)
was ever beyond the biospere. And in the Neo-A's Guide to Real Life
another guy said he saw something out there. (It's in the chapter
about suborbitals.) And the Horrors bring bad, corrupted mana with
them. This bad mana can also come from the lifeless, empty Space.
Mephisto
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 09:29:20 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Gareth Owen <glowen1@*****.NHS.GOV.UK>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
In-Reply-To: <9410260024.aa01401@****.demon.co.uk> from "Star" at Oct 25,
94 07:22:29 pm
>
> THWAPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP!!!
> THWAPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP!!!
>
> Feel better now?
>
Thanks, I needed that, I've calmed down now.
:-)
>
> A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
> is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
> and smile.
>
Like the qoute, BTW.
>
> -Star-
>
>
--
Gareth Owen | Mail: glowen1@*****.nhs.gov.uk
Sytems Programmmer | Phone: (UK) 0495 765021
Gwent Health Authority | "Reboot it from orbit, it's the only way to be sure"
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 12:03:16 --100
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stefan Willkofer <stefan.willkofer@*****.PHYSIK.UNI-REGENSBURG.DE>
Subject: Popularity in Germany
In Germany ShadowRun is (according to a recent poll) the second most
popular rpg in Germany. The most popular rpg is #Das Schwarze Auge#
(The Black Eye) which is a purely german RPG. German authors, german
producers, source books and adventures are published in german. Maybe
some of you already herad of it, because they made a computer rpg around
it and that game was quite popular in the states. (At least that's what
I was told.) And they say they want to translate it and publish the rpg
in English.
Nearly everyone knows DSA here, I guess it is as well known as AD&D in
the english speaking world. It is a Fantasy rpg that plays in the world
of "Aventurien", but I personally don't know very much about DSA, I rather
stick to SR and ED. Other peope are much more competent on DSA than me.
Mephisto
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 12:18:56 --100
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stefan Willkofer <stefan.willkofer@*****.PHYSIK.UNI-REGENSBURG.DE>
Subject: Re: Astral Space <>Space ?
>
> I might be a bit skeptical at that. Doesn't the creation/upkeep of the mana
> level also require living beings to be around? Can't be too many of those
> out in orbit.
>
I agree with you about the Mana we (and our SR characters) know, but what
about the corupted mana, the bad one, which does exist. Perhaps it is
corrupted because it has it's origin in orbit.
Mephisto
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 09:45:54 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Gareth Owen <glowen1@*****.NHS.GOV.UK>
Subject: Re: magick vs science
In-Reply-To: <9410260813.aa00788@****.demon.co.uk> from "Wow,
Reality. That's a switch" at Oct 26, 94 04:13:21 am
>
> >Paganism loses a lot of its mystery and perceived power as the laws of
> >nature are uncovered by science
>
> *snort*
> *snicker*
> *laugh*
> Yeah, OK, whatever. Believe whatever you want, B'wanda. But the day Science
> explains a Nightflyer I'll turn in my antlers.
>
> Phelan
>
>
A what?
GLO
--
Gareth Owen | Mail: glowen1@*****.nhs.gov.uk
Sytems Programmmer | Phone: (UK) 0495 765021
Gwent Health Authority | "Reboot it from orbit, it's the only way to be sure"
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 13:17:04 +0100
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Antoine DIAMANT-BERGER <diamant@********.UVSQ.FR>
Subject: This use of the lexicon
Dear Friends.
I've looked at the mail this morning, and I've found a lot of THWAPs.
Whether the carp is wet or not, the noise was pretty astounding: all your
THWAPS have undetermined noise. It could be a birds song ... or anything else.
I totally disagree with this: by convention, the THWAP MUST BE followed by a
wet carp noise.
I've got a question for the list although:
does a magicker with a trauma damper(Shadowtech) get the -2 bonus to resist the
drain ?
I think not, but the description makes sense that it could get the bonus...
I hope I'll get some responses soon.
PS: Whether Budhah, Shadowdancer or anyone leads, You can be sure I'm right in
his back, waiting for his faults, and helping him when I need him.
And don't forget: if there's no light at all, I use thermo, radar ...
... and I'm there too !!!
After this Blabla, all I wish you is
- a good day
- a good afternoon
- a good weekend
- all good for your Non-Birth day
- a happy new year
- having not read up to here an d having avoided the
Meta, Armor Piercing, Beta Realease, Highly Explosive,
Adamantium Coated, Dum Dum, Thermo Nuclear, Piezo Electrical,
20,000 V powered, Highly Urticant, Poisoned,
Fearless Leader Guided(tm), By the doctor Doomed(tm),
Shadow Danced(tm), Meta Existentialist, Ultra Sound Powered,
multi tasking encephalon triggered, magically concerted ...
TTTTTTTTTT HH HH WW WW WW AA PPPPPPPP
TT HH HH WW WW WW A A PP PP
TT HH HH WW WWWW WW AA AA PP PP
TT HHHHHHHHHH WW WW WW WW AAAAAAAA PPPPPPPP
TT HH HH WWWW WWWW AA AA PP
TT HH HH WW WW AA AA PP
TT HH HH WW WW AA AA PP
WITH A WET CARP NOISE !!!
--
*********************************************************
* Friend or Foe, I'm always behind you !!! *
* *
* Shadow : diamant@******.ens-info.uvsq.fr *
* *
* Wherever you find light, you find me too !!! *
*********************************************************
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 08:22:24 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Wow, Reality. That's a switch" <MHILLIARD@****.ALBION.EDU>
Subject: Re: This use of the lexicon
You forgot to dikote it. *evil grin*
=)
Phelan
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 13:25:46 +0100
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Antoine DIAMANT-BERGER <diamant@********.UVSQ.FR>
Subject: Re: This use of the lexicon
In-Reply-To: <199410261222.NAA25804@******.uvsq.fr> from "Wow,
Reality. That's a switch" at Oct 26, 94 08:22:24 am
>
> You forgot to dikote it. *evil grin*
>
> =)
> Phelan
>
No, that's for the Gamma Release !!!!!
I'll send you an other later, ...
--
*********************************************************
* Friend or Foe, I'm always behind you !!! *
* *
* Shadow : diamant@******.ens-info.uvsq.fr *
* *
* Wherever you find light, you find me too !!! *
*********************************************************
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 13:38:16 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "L.T.Bryant" <cs5025@***.AC.UK>
Subject: shadows power foci problem
Ok shadow heres a idea to bring them down,
(well its a few but most {im told} arnt plausable)
morter bombs ... just flatten the area
FAE... see above
The sensable one
Air timed mini grnades with shaped charges, this should give the
optimum stand off distance for the copper strem, and enable it
to punch through,
alternatly try a couple of flasks of real strong acid at the
ARMOUR forget abought the insides , they will run from the acid
eating there suits and you win
Hope this helps
Lawrence Bryant
--
oh rose thou art sick
the invisible worm that flys by night.....STEEL
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 13:48:41 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "L.T.Bryant" <cs5025@***.AC.UK>
Subject: Space...Mana
For those of you currently involved in the astral space / orbit
upwards problem, heres a side line.
Look back at last years logs on the question of space staions,
Here we ( chopper , JackFrost (one word folks) Mark Archer and
my self) theorised that a large spacestaion we guesed at a small
O`Neail collany would grow its OWN gaiasphere after a short time
allowing mages to work up there.
We then theorised that this would work on outher planets and
this would enable them to be colanised by humanity, enabiling us
to spread out, This would realy bug up the horrors as they may
well only be able to get to earth allowing the mars colony to
act as an emergancy resurve for the resupply of earth, and if
the dang horrors turn up then they will have to split there
attacks between the 2 locations,,..... Devide and concor any one.
There you go a few ideas
If you guys set off book me a seat on the generation ship to
barnar star.
Lawrence (steel , Shifter , swan, bob the troll ) Bryant
--
oh rose thou art sick
the invisible worm that flys by night.....STEEL
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 13:49:27 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "James W. Thomas" <cm5323@***.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: ULTRA munchkin
In-Reply-To: <m0r07DT-0003uBC@****.wlv.ac.uk> from "Automatic digest
processor" at Oct 26, 94 12:33:05 pm
> From: Matt Hufstetler <gt2778a@*****.GATECH.EDU>
>
> > BTW, what do you people think about this: If you are possessed by a
> > spirit, who has control? I contend that the spirit controls you, and you
> > have no more input into the character's actions. My GM contends that
> > you can have control as long as you willingly accept the spirit. This is
> > painful as I see our game going ULTRA-munchkin.. Sigh, our most recent
> > encounter was (still is actually) with 3 people in powered armor, which
> > is doubling as a rating 8 (I think) power focus, who have been possessed
> > by Force 21 Storm Spirits... Arg. 5d6 initiative, Spells, Rating 4
> > tactical computer in the armor, the works. Oh well.
>
> >From what I got in Missing Blood, it would seem that voluntary meshings
> don't matter. It's just from voluntary meshings you can get soldiers,
> instead of workers. Either way, your soul is consumed(Unless you can roll
> 6+ successes against the queen when you are captured. Read that. CONSUMED.
>
<CHOP>ULTRA munchkin?!?! sounds a little painful!
You've gotta be Subtle vs stuff like that...Hide in crowds. Take
Hostages/bodysheilds. pretend to be corporate
BUT THE best is DON'T fight them! never go head to head with
stuff like that.
Snipe them. Bomb them. Gas them. Report them to the police
(possesion is ILLEGAL i think, or at least should be)
Personally I'd
Netrun a unmanned cargo remote and crash 200 tonnes of fridge
freezers onto there heads.
Or Use demolition/structural engineering or RAM/structeng to
COLLAPSE a building onto them.
OR shoot one of them with a harpoon gun, them throw the cable
up into overhead powerlines
Enjoy...
CHOPPER
The Mage carefully bound the lv1 spell focus onto the Joystick,
then settled back onto the couch, slipping astrial...
The joystick started to jump as the mage grounded 'use
skill:videogame' through it.
BLEEP BLEEP BLOOP BAP BAP BAP.
All the Scientists nodded and made notes...
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 15:19:59 +0200
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Darth Vader <j07c@***.UNI-BREMEN.DE>
Subject: Re: Many things...
In-Reply-To: <9410261021.AA52961@***.zfn.uni-bremen.de> from "Erik S
Jameson"
at Oct 25, 94 07:52:43 pm
> That is all my fellow Americans. Thank you for your time, and God bless you.
> Erik, a.k.a. the Whistler
There are those of us here that have absolutely nothing to do with
Amerika dude :)
--
"Believe in Angels." -- The Crow
GCS d>- H s+: !g p? !au a- w+ v-(?) C+++ UA++VS++L>++++ P-- (aren't we all?)
L+>+++ 3 E--- N++ K W(+)(---) M-- !V(--) -po+(---) Y+ t++ 5+ !j(-) R+++(--)
!G tv(++) b+++ D++ B- e+ u++(-) h*(+) f+ r- n!(----) y?
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 10:27:15 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Chris Lubrecht <lubrecht@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: Paranoia
so Rat.....exactly how old are you?
Should we be refering to you as the venerable Rat? (as Bede cringes) :-)
Nigel
"don't let the .edu site fool you"
-the Venerable Rat
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 10:29:16 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Chris Lubrecht <lubrecht@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: The "Real" World
On Tue, 25 Oct 1994, Magister wrote:
> Rat, I too am probably older than most on this list. I
> worked in the "real" world for around five years, that's why there is an
> edu. on my address as well. If you work in a government job, then I
> understand the source of your cynicsm and paranoia. Perhaps we
> can agree to disagree, if you will. :)
> In full retreat from the
"real" world,
> That Magic Guy
> "Be careful,
> People in masks can't be trusted."
>
This list is turning into an old age home! :-)
Nigel
age=thought
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 10:26:41 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Organization: The Happy Fun Ball Brigade
Subject: Re: Paranoia
In-Reply-To: Matt's message of Wed, 26 Oct 1994 02:51:00 -0500
<9410260751.AA18204@******.cc.purdue.edu>
>>>>> "Matt" == Matt <mosbun@******.CC.PURDUE.EDU> writes:
>> The "Buddha" rules all that walks before him!!
Matt> From what (admittedly little) I know about Buddhism, I find this
Matt> statement endlessly amusing.
Isn't it, though? I'd say that this is a case of a name that's chosen
because it's the exact opposite of the personality behind it. I'll bet my
belief in my cyber-carp is stronger than your belief that all is maya any
day, "Buddha" :).
--
Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> |When not in use, Happy Fun Ball should be
http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox|returned to its special container and kept
PGP Public Key: Ask for one today! |under refrigeration.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 10:29:15 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Organization: The Happy Fun Ball Brigade
Subject: Re: Paranoia
In-Reply-To: Chris Lubrecht's message of Wed, 26 Oct 1994 10:27:15 -0400
<Pine.ULT.3.91.941026102529.18352A-100000@****.esu.edu>
>>>>> "Chris" == Chris Lubrecht <lubrecht@***.EDU> writes:
Chris> so Rat.....exactly how old are you?
I turned 27 last week.
Chris> Should we be refering to you as the venerable Rat? (as Bede cringes)
Chris> :-)
Hooo boy. I'm not /that/ old :)
--
Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> |Happy Fun Ball may stick to certain types
http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox|of skin.
PGP Public Key: Ask for one today! |
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 15:15:36 +0200
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Darth Vader <j07c@***.UNI-BREMEN.DE>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
In-Reply-To: <9410261020.AA30654@***.zfn.uni-bremen.de> from
"Shadowdancer" at
Oct 25, 94 07:24:59 pm
> My, my, my. I do believe that our dear friend Vader has lost that
> "magick" that makes life worth living. I do understand science. See
> earlier posting. And this bit-o-sci-fi has not DIRECTLY caused harm to
> the environment. Indirectly is another story. And as posted earlier, I
> should have blamed the corporations first. But science caused the
> problem in the first place. I will not buge on that. The fact that it is
> busting its hoop to rectify the mistake is admirable. I will admit to
> flying off the handle. It was unexcusable, but forgivable. Hopfully
> Adam has done so. If you cannot forgive for a minor indiscretion
> based on a moment of heated emotions, maybe science has invaded
> your soul. Look at ShadowRun for an example. Yes it is a game, but
> also a horrifing future. Though I would love to run the shadows with
> the wiz toys used in the game, I do not want to raise children in a
> world where halve of it is dead, the other halve dying. This is what
> unscrupulous business people and your science has done to the
> world. Is their any cyber under your skin?
>
> Sadness of a gained friend lost is matched only by the death of a
> person, and his soul.
Aw allright I can forgive a moment of heated emotions, by god we are
only human and for better or worse we are subject to our emotions. Anyway
I kinda like this tone better too, its not my nature to flame people and I
think that this list can testify to that. Ok I want to comment on one thing
you mentioned in your reply 'But science caused the problem in the first place'
Let me pose a hypothetical question. As we all know gunpowder was invented by
this french (?) monk, now can this man be held responsible for the deaths
of all the men and women who died from the guns using his gunpowder? Or should
we praise him for giving us a way to make marvellous fireworks, mine the earth,
build breathtaking monuments on rocks etc. The same goes for the scientists
who worked on atomic energy. Should we blame them for giving the military
the means to build bombs or should we praise them for all the new and
wonderfull things that they made possible through their discoveries.
Science (as magic in SR) is but a tool in the hands of its wielder, never
forget that.....
--
"Believe in Angels." -- The Crow
GCS d>- H s+: !g p? !au a- w+ v-(?) C+++ UA++VS++L>++++ P-- (aren't we all?)
L+>+++ 3 E--- N++ K W(+)(---) M-- !V(--) -po+(---) Y+ t++ 5+ !j(-) R+++(--)
!G tv(++) b+++ D++ B- e+ u++(-) h*(+) f+ r- n!(----) y?
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 10:52:05 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: the holy Entombed <rasputin@***.UMD.EDU>
Subject: Re: Confusion?
In-Reply-To: <199410260635.CAA16128@*******.wam.umd.edu>
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, Luke Kendall wrote:
> Some of those posts read like remarks from a character _in_
> the game to another character _in_ the game, rather than a
> remark from one player _of_ the game to another.
I've noticed this, too. It seems more prevalent among the newbies, or
perhaps it's a group of lurkers that have burst forth at around the same
time.
> This discussion list is _about_ Shadowrun. It's not a place
> to _play_ Shadowrun. This is supposed to be mainly
> a discussion of just the _rules_ of Shadowrun. (Even though we
> often stray a little farther afield than that.)
I have to disagree, and it's probably with not much more than your
wording. This list would be cold and dull if all that were supposed to
be discussed were the rules. While it definitely isn't s place to -play-
(although, I have to admit, I haven't really seen anything of this nature
lately), the discussions are supposed to be able to cover all aspects of
the game, even fighter jets of the late twentieth century. Rules,
adventure ideas, personalities, critical reviews, theories of the time, etc.
> If you want other people to take the time to read what you have
> written (and I assume that's why we all write, occasionally) -
> then try to stick to the subject.
I think this is a bit too all-encompassing. I, personally, haven't
'killfiled' anyone for not sticking to the subject; just for posting too
often, having posts so badly punctuated they're a strain to attempt to
read, etc.
> luke
--thE--rasputin@***.umd.edu---"It must be the pretzels."- - - - -
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 10:15:32 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: The Dragon <JMEYER@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: ULTRA munchkin
I'd personaly go in for the freezers drop. Now thats' what I call
tasteful (not to menition painful! ) *grin*
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 10:34:55 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: The Dragon <JMEYER@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: All this magick vs. science stuff
Can be that all it takes is a silly nickname (Buddha) to get you peolpe
going? Now that, is Truely Funny :: ::
\____/
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 10:42:31 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: The Dragon <JMEYER@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Paranoia
I don't see how ya'll can call yourselves Mages any way!
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 10:47:34 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: The Dragon <JMEYER@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Immortality and Elves vs. Science and Laws of Nature
I'd have to believe the witch part!
I'm got some *friends* coming in this weekend to do some RUNS.
These people play with munckins the likes of witch you have never
seen. Anybody got some GOOD *evil grin* ideas on how I wack these
guys. I've got some ideas, but was hoping to get some real classy
ending to these sad as they characters!
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 10:50:38 +0600
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Jeff Norrell <norrell@*******.ME.UTEXAS.EDU>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
Shadowdancer,
I'll tell you what...
We won't mix religion with the list if you'll refrain from hugging any trees.
S'okay?
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 10:54:28 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: The Dragon <JMEYER@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Paranoia
I'll Have to agree that statement!
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 09:03:29 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Adam Getchell <acgetche@****.UCDAVIS.EDU>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
In-Reply-To: <9410252315.AA15831@********.engr.ucdavis.edu>
On Tue, 25 Oct 1994, Sam Thomas wrote:
> My point is that there is no differance between the two except as to
> what/who is effected and the drain cost.
There certainly is a difference between a physical spell and a
mana spell as regarding the above.
A mana spell affects minds. It would not affect a guard viewing
the character remotely, whereas the physical version would.
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
|Adam Getchell|acgetche@****.engr.ucdavis.edu | ez000270@*******.ucdavis.edu |
| acgetchell |"Invincibility is in oneself, vulnerability is in the opponent"|
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 11:02:50 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: The Dragon <JMEYER@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Denver in a Box
Since someone mentioned "BOXED SETS" what are odds on a
Live-Action-Role-Play Version of Shadowrun?
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 12:18:30 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Organization: The Happy Fun Ball Brigade
Subject: Re: All this magick vs. science stuff
In-Reply-To: The Dragon's message of Wed, 26 Oct 1994 10:34:55 EST
<336C72A36@*****.vinu.edu>
>>>>> "Dragon" == The Dragon <JMEYER@*****.VINU.EDU>
writes:
Dragon> Can be that all it takes is a silly nickname (Buddha)
"Buddha" isn't a silly nickname, "Laughing Buddha Jesus" is a silly
nickname.
Dragon> to get you peolpe going?
^^^^^^
You misspelled "Yonderboy."
--
Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> |Happy Fun Ball may stick to certain types
http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox|of skin.
PGP Public Key: Ask for one today! |
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 11:27:03 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: The Dragon <JMEYER@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: All this magick vs. science stuff
I stand corrected "Laughing Buddha Jesus" is much sillyer(sp?)!
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 12:11:04 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Marc A Renouf <jormung@*****.UMICH.EDU>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
In-Reply-To: <199410242307.TAA18584@*****.engin.umich.edu>
On Mon, 24 Oct 1994, Shadowdancer wrote:
> When has science done ANYTHING natural! Get with the program.
> Everything that science touches turns to drek!!! The laws of nature
> are wild, free, clean, and deal with magick. The real stuff. To
> insinuate (or state) that laws of science are the laws of nature is
> ludicrus. Science seeks to conform, confine, and kill anything that it
> does not accept. Part of the reason that the REAL mana flow has
> diminished is that science has killed peoples' belief in magick. When
> enough people believe that something does/does not happen, the
> result happens/not happends. When the Gods were taken out of
> nature, man was justified to abuse nature. And since science has
> taken everyone's Gods out of everything, science is justified to
> abuse anything it damn well pleases!
Sorry, but I have to jump all over this one. Your argument shows
an utter lack of understanding of the term "science." Science seeks to
find the reason for that which happens in our universe. It deals with
things that are pure and free as well, especially now that chaos theory
is getting added into the whole picture. Science does not crush things
it does not accept. It tries to explain things so that they can be
better understood.
Your next point of things happening/not happening just because
enough people believe in them is...dumb (sorry). For centuries, everyone
thought that the sun revolved around the Earth, until that notion was
proven false. But at the time it was an unpopular idea, and the common
masses still believed that the Earth was the center of the universe. Are
you trying to tell me that sometime in the middle ages, the sun stopped
revolving around the Earth and switched to the other way around just
because enough people believed it? Even though it had been proven
hundreds of years before? This same argument could be made for any
number of "belief" oriented fallacies throughout history. You could get
cheesy on me and say "Why yes, the orbits of the Earth and Sun *did*
switch in the middle ages," but I think even you wouldn't go that far.
As for Gaia punishing mankind for its wicked, wicked ways, I have
no opinion on this. I will say, however, that we are perfectly capable
of punishing ourselves, and we don't appear to need Mother Gaia's help in
that respect ;)
I ask you: what could be more godly than science? What could be
more devout than trying to understand the wonder of the universe and
unlock the secrets that the powers that (may or may not) be have hidden
for us to discover?
Do not confuse the science that goes into, say astrophysical
research with the science that is performed in a lab to make the better
bomb. The astrophysicist is trying to understand how the universe
works. The military researcher is trying to find a more efficient way to
kill people given existing knowledge. They are *very* different. Think
about that next time you rag on "science."
Marc
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 11:33:56 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: The Dragon <JMEYER@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Bands in SR
I've got it!!! Instead of trying to put thoughts into to peolpes heads just
use the magic to play the instrments. i.e Look ma no hands. That way
the Stars can come out and mingle with the crowd.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 17:36:18 +0200
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Darth Vader <j07c@***.UNI-BREMEN.DE>
Subject: Re: magick vs science
In-Reply-To: <9410261000.AA64518@***.zfn.uni-bremen.de> from "Wow,
Reality. That's a switch" at Oct 26, 94 04:13:21 am
> >Paganism loses a lot of its mystery and perceived power as the laws of
> >nature are uncovered by science
I dont think so, in some weird and mysterious way the human psyche
desires the unknown. People want to believe that there are things that
can not be understood by man, that there are things that hold mans destiny
in their hands.....
> *snort*
> *snicker*
> *laugh*
> Yeah, OK, whatever. Believe whatever you want, B'wanda. But the day Science
> explains a Nightflyer I'll turn in my antlers.
Huh? Whats a nightflyer ??????
--
"Believe in Angels." -- The Crow
GCS d>- H s+: !g p? !au a- w+ v-(?) C+++ UA++VS++L>++++ P-- (aren't we all?)
L+>+++ 3 E--- N++ K W(+)(---) M-- !V(--) -po+(---) Y+ t++ 5+ !j(-) R+++(--)
!G tv(++) b+++ D++ B- e+ u++(-) h*(+) f+ r- n!(----) y?
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 11:40:57 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: ELFBOY <MBAKER@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Hey Dragon, gotta light?
Hoi, chummers, I am Elfboy. I been subscribed for about a month
now, sorry I haven't spoken sooner, I bet yer all just real fraggin
disappointed.
Dragon, I've got a good idea for your friends. Use your characters
backround to develope your own plot to coincide the the gamemasters
plot, but bend it to your liking and chums' disaster. Then rescue them
so they'll be all gratefull. Or just let them die slowly while you flaunt
your fortune. It's been fun. g-luck @><@********
\-^-/
ELFBOY
"Eternal youth is yours, gift or curse, make of it
what you will."-Elfqueen
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 11:48:49 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: The Dragon <JMEYER@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Hey Dragon, gotta light?
I like your idea! but ya see I was thinking of writing my own RUN and
leave weak ass RUN at the bus stop. (FLAME THROWER OFF).
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 12:57:18 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Skrub <mccllstr@*****.BUCKNELL.EDU>
Subject: Re: Immortality and Elves vs. Science and Laws of Nature
>I'd have to believe the witch part!
>
>I'm got some *friends* coming in this weekend to do some RUNS.
>These people play with munckins the likes of witch you have never
>seen. Anybody got some GOOD *evil grin* ideas on how I wack these
>guys. I've got some ideas, but was hoping to get some real classy
>ending to these sad as they characters!
>
See that posting where a number of Force 21 free storm spirits possesed
troll sammies in heavy power armor w/ force 8 power foci.
Of course that is as far from classy as it gets.
Try cybered vampires.
Not too classy either.
Force a BTL addiction onto them! That is the way to go. Especially w/ FASA
drug rules. Munchkins tend to be rules lawyers so... Turn the tables. Make
em deal w/ an addiction.
-Skrub
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 12:05:16 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: The Dragon <JMEYER@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Immortality and Elves vs. Science and Laws of Nature
Love it.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 11:05:29 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Matt <mosbun@******.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: Re: Astral Space <>Space ?
>Hm.. Perhaps space is NOT the mana poor environment that we have been led
>to believe, but is instead very mana RICH, but has been courrupted badly
>by the Horrors (as has happened in ED, it's impossible to cast unfiltered
>spells, and looking into the Astral plane is horrifying...) Hm.
the NAGRL, it hints at mages who have tried to go beyond the Earth's
atmosphere in the Astral have gone insane. That could be explained by the
unusually large rush of mana into the mage's mind. The horrifying visions that
one mage claimed to have seen (I think- don't have the book handy) could well
be Horrors.
How would the draining of magic objects be explained, though? Can Horrors
do that?
>I really don't support this theory, but it would seem to fufill the
>observed data.
Yeah, but it's fun to speculate.
>Shadow@******.Net
Matt
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 11:14:47 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Matt <mosbun@******.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: Re: Astral Space <>Space ?
>I might be a bit skeptical at that. Doesn't the creation/upkeep of the mana
>level also require living beings to be around? Can't be too many of those
>out in orbit.
What about beings that live primarily, or even solely, in the Astral plane?
'Though I'd hate to think of the kind of spirits that live in space's Astral
plane. Toxics perhaps? Maybe that's where the Insect spirits come from.
Maybe that's where the Horrors originate from.
Matt
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 12:07:28 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: ELFBOY <MBAKER@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Dragon:>I like your idea! but ya see I was thinking of writing my own
RUN and
leave weak ass RUN at the bus stop. (FLAME THROWER OFF).
Elfboy:>Well... uh... Yeah that's what I meant. No seriously combine
the two ideas if you would like. also check to make sure your run is
allowed by your GM's guidelines. Cool!
ELFBOY
"Eternal youth is yours, gift or curse, make of it
what you will."-Elfqueen
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 13:00:59 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: The "Real" World
You better watch out, you young whippersnapper. I'd hate to have to
bop you with my +2 Staff of Thwapping. The Rat is older than I am by
a measly year. Us old folk can run with the best of you kiddies.
Geriatrically yours
The Magister
"I have been, and shall always be...a mage"
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 13:04:20 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: All this magick vs. science stuff
We all have silly nicknames, don't we drag. Some are just a bit
more ostentatious than others.
Grammatically yours
The Magister
"used my 50 cent word for the day"
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 13:12:30 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: LARP/SR
Now here is an idea that deserves some discussion. If the Vamps
and the Werewolves can get away with it, why couldn't we? However,
the logistics that would have to be worked out are mind-boggling.
But, who better than us to work them out? We would need rules for
magic, combat, places to run, rules for the matrix, riggers, etc.etc.
I'm open to any suggestions.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 13:19:24 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Buddha <CCOLLINS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Paranoia
I hope that you don't think that I believe completely with buddhaism.
I so in some aspect of thier teachings. The name "Buddha" is just a
nickname that some friends game me at work.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 14:26:09 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Organization: The Happy Fun Ball Brigade
Subject: Re: Paranoia
In-Reply-To: Buddha's message of Wed, 26 Oct 1994 13:19:24 EST
<5F4CB11A0@*****.vinu.edu>
>>>>> "Buddha" == Buddha <CCOLLINS@*****.VINU.EDU> writes:
Buddha> I hope that you don't think that I believe completely with
Buddha> buddhaism.
Heh :). You even seem to have a hard time spelling it :).
<duck!>
--
Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> |Happy Fun Ball may stick to certain types
http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox|of skin.
PGP Public Key: Ask for one today! |
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 13:30:49 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Nightflyers
Nightflyers are creatures from the realm of Nightmare in a series of
books by Mercedes Lackey. Most notably, "Knight of Ghosts and
Shadows" and "Call to Tourney" I highly recommend them.
Everyone's favorite bookworm,
The Magister
"Elves??? In L.A.???"
"Explains a lot."
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 19:36:44 +0200
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Darth Vader <j07c@***.UNI-BREMEN.DE>
Subject: Re: Nightflyers
In-Reply-To: <9410261732.AA47982@***.zfn.uni-bremen.de> from "Magister"
at Oct
26, 94 01:30:49 pm
> Nightflyers are creatures from the realm of Nightmare in a series of
> books by Mercedes Lackey. Most notably, "Knight of Ghosts and
> Shadows" and "Call to Tourney" I highly recommend them.
And what does that have to do with the privious post and the guy who
mentioned nightflyers as something unexplationed (was that you ?). I dont get
the conection.
> "Elves??? In L.A.???"
> "Explains a lot."
I agree :)
--
"Believe in Angels." -- The Crow
GCS d>- H s+: !g p? !au a- w+ v-(?) C+++ UA++VS++L>++++ P-- (aren't we all?)
L+>+++ 3 E--- N++ K W(+)(---) M-- !V(--) -po+(---) Y+ t++ 5+ !j(-) R+++(--)
!G tv(++) b+++ D++ B- e+ u++(-) h*(+) f+ r- n!(----) y?
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 13:43:09 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: ULTRA munchkin
Of course, you could always send to a concert where the band is
using magic to create illusions. After all, there would either be a riot
or they would be under the band's mind control.
<Hysterical laughter>
Just kidding, Rat!!!
Teasingly yours,
The Magister
"BWA-HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!"
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 13:37:35 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Buddha <CCOLLINS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Paranoia
True. I just want to try to clear my reputation, since I'm new at this.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 12:40:25 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Erik S Jameson <esj@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: My fellow Americans...
Just making sure everyone out there realized that the "My fellow
Americans" thing was indeed a joke...
I just hope people actually read the rest of the post...:)
Erik, a.k.a. the Whistler
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 15:02:51 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Wow, Reality. That's a switch" <MHILLIARD@****.ALBION.EDU>
Subject: Re: Nightflyers
Uh, yeah, that's true, Magister. Except that wasn't what I was referring to.
Suffice it to say my Teacher encountered one, and it took us a week to clean
out the workroom.
Misty's books are cool, though. =)
Phelan
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 16:19:56 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: the holy Entombed <rasputin@***.UMD.EDU>
Subject: Re: Paranoia
In-Reply-To: <199410261558.LAA27460@*******.wam.umd.edu>
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, The Dragon wrote: (entire message)
> I'll Have to agree that statement!
>
What statement would that be?
You have to include some kind of reference for the listmembers who don't
memorize the progress of every thread.
--thE--
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 15:53:03 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Sam Thomas <sinbad@********.COM>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
>Sinbad Sam writes:
>
>
>This all sounded just fine to me until I got home and actually looked it up
>in the book. You forgot the sentance before the one you quoted for
>Invisibility, the one that goes "Thermographic vision can still detect body
>heat, and the subject is completely tangible and detectable to the senses of
>hearing, smell, and so forth."
>
>While I am rather partial to a "notice-me-not" type spell, I don't think
>(Improved) Invisibility is this type of spell.
>
>--
>Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
>
>(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
> N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
> B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
>
>
Yes improved invisiblity is this type of spell. Fasa.support@*****.gies.com
Sinbad Sam
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 15:39:59 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: ELFBOY <MBAKER@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: INvisIBility/science/magic/reality
Eb:>someone argued that elves are alive thus they must also die.(or
something similar in words) Look, the word immortality implies that
something !!-living-!! would !!-live-!! forever. Are you going to say that
the word immortal can't exist either now? You haven't witnessed
immortality and you haven't witnessed an elf. Wow, there's one
charactaristic they share already. Elves are immortal! (go ahead
argue, i need it)
Invisibility:the definition of invisisible-Not visible. 2.Not open to view.
CasE CloseD
I'd say magic is a science and science is magical. Elves exist, so
does reality, but nothing is imaginary. Everything is real.
Even 'nothing' is something. Therefore it isn't nothing.
Anyone who is actually worried about reality vs. unreality, can
attempt to explain to me the difference between the two if there are
actually two. I believe there is only one.
Remember: "All is and nothing isn't."
Please Argue! I Need It! I'm Addicted to It
thankyou
ELFBOY
"Eternal youth is yours, gift or curse, make of it
what you will."-Elfqueen
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 16:11:00 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Firepower <DVANDERS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Comments: To: shadowrn%hearn.bitnet@****.princeton.edu
Testing the send address.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 15:47:03 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Adam Getchell <acgetche@****.UCDAVIS.EDU>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
In-Reply-To: <9410260658.AA18163@********.engr.ucdavis.edu>
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, Damion Milliken wrote:
> Adam writes:
^^^^
>
> > > > Well, follow laws maybe, but not neccessrily the same laws as regular
> > > > science does. Else if you were invisible, as someone argued before,
you
> > > > would not be able to see. From this I would conclude that some
different
> > > > natural law(s) apply to magic.
> > >
> > > Well this conclusion implies that we know of the existence of all
> > > the laws of nature. Well I dont think so.....
> >
> > Yeah, I have to agree with Darth.
Damion, I didn't write *any* of the above.
> Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
|Adam Getchell|acgetche@****.engr.ucdavis.edu | ez000270@*******.ucdavis.edu |
| acgetchell |"Invincibility is in oneself, vulnerability is in the opponent"|
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 16:14:48 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Adam Getchell <acgetche@****.UCDAVIS.EDU>
Subject: Re: magick vs science
In-Reply-To: <9410260813.AA18553@********.engr.ucdavis.edu>
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, Wow, Reality. That's a switch wrote:
> Yeah, OK, whatever. Believe whatever you want, B'wanda. But the day Science
> explains a Nightflyer I'll turn in my antlers.
Perhaps if you could explain what you mean by "Nightflyer".
Also, it is a logical fallacy to assume that because something
hasn't been explained it _can't_ be explained.
I happen to have experienced "ki" or "qi" enough times in my
martial arts practice to believe in it, and yet the only satisfactory
theories are Chinese tracts several hundred to several thousands of years
old. Definitely not quite attuned to an occidental science explanation,
although I have read of some attempts there, too.
This does not, to my mind, invalidate science, but rather bring
home the wonders of this infinitely complex Universe.
> Phelan
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
|Adam Getchell|acgetche@****.engr.ucdavis.edu | ez000270@*******.ucdavis.edu |
| acgetchell |"Invincibility is in oneself, vulnerability is in the opponent"|
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 18:22:42 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Paranoia
Quite an ego we have, eh Buddah?
A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
and smile.
-Star-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 16:32:10 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Adam Getchell <acgetche@****.UCDAVIS.EDU>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
In-Reply-To: <9410261437.AA19624@********.engr.ucdavis.edu>
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, Darth Vader wrote:
> think that this list can testify to that. Ok I want to comment on one thing
> you mentioned in your reply 'But science caused the problem in the first place'
I have to agree with Darth's arguments (shouldn't argue with the
Dark Lord of the Sith, could be unhealthy even over electronic media ;-)
One might also note that before "Science" proper was developed,
early humans did quite a good job of desertifiying the Sahara desert
through over-abundant goat grazing, and an ancient Hellenic city managed
to choke its bay with silt so that it was effectively removed from the
seacoast to about 12 miles inland, meanwhile reducing the arable land
surrounding it to wind-blasted hills.
Finally, a substantial amount of air pollution especially in Asia
comes from burning rice fields after harvest, an "unscientific" practice.
> Science (as magic in SR) is but a tool in the hands of its wielder, never
> forget that.....
I'll agree wholeheartedly with that.
> "Believe in Angels." -- The Crow
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
|Adam Getchell|acgetche@****.engr.ucdavis.edu | ez000270@*******.ucdavis.edu |
| acgetchell |"Invincibility is in oneself, vulnerability is in the opponent"|
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 18:31:28 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Many things...
Cute ending.
Whistler is right though. Manipulating magics in concerts is not the
only problem. How about subliminals? I remember a debate as to
whether certain movie theaters were subliminally controlling the
adience's decisions to purchase consecions. A study showed that
these theaters had higher candy sales then theaters that did not use
sublims. Another study showed that sublim did not work. Go fig.
Query: How would sublims be used in trid? The same way, or would
it have to be programmed different to compenste for the
three-diminsional transmissions?
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 18:34:12 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: magick vs science
>
> >Paganism loses a lot of its mystery and perceived power as the
laws of
> >nature are uncovered by science
>
>
> Yeah, OK, whatever. Believe whatever you want, B'wanda. But the
day Science
> explains a Nightflyer I'll turn in my antlers.
>
> Phelan
>
HEHEEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHE!!! I second that!!! Nature losing it's
mystries? I don't think so.
A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
and smile.
-Star-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 18:37:35 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
>
> >
> > THWAPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP!!!
> > THWAPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP!!!
> >
> > Feel better now?
> >
>
> Thanks, I needed that, I've calmed down now.
> :-)
>
> >
> > A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
> > is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
> > and smile.
> >
>
> Like the qoute, BTW.
>
> >
> > -Star-
> >
> >
>
>
>Thanx.
A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
and smile.
-Star-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 19:42:00 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "CHAPMAN, DANIEL LEE" <DANIELC@*****.CC.UGA.EDU>
In-Reply-To: In reply to your message of WED 26 OCT 1994 16:11:00 EST
> Testing the send address.
It works. :)
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 18:41:27 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: All this magick vs. science stuff
>
> Can be that all it takes is a silly nickname (Buddha) to get you
peolpe
> going? Now that, is Truely Funny :: ::
> \____/
>
Like a name such as "THE dragon"? Isn't that conceded? Are you
impling(sp?) that you are the only!! dragon? I hope not!!!!
A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
and smile.
-Star-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 18:43:26 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Immortality and Elves vs. Science and Laws of Nature
>
> I'd have to believe the witch part!
>
> I'm got some *friends* coming in this weekend to do some RUNS.
> These people play with munckins the likes of witch you have never
> seen. Anybody got some GOOD *evil grin* ideas on how I wack
these
> guys. I've got some ideas, but was hoping to get some real classy
> ending to these sad as they characters!
>
Be careful who's toes you step on, dragon, please.
A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
and smile.
-Star-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 18:45:16 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: All this magick vs. science stuff
> You magick types stop trying to convert the mundanes. That's
against the rules,
> remember? =)
>
Sorry.
> You science types need to lighten up. You'all are gettin' way to
tense for my
> peace of mind.
Still sorry about my posts. I have since taken some lithium and
retract what I said earlier. In a way, we are all science types. Just of
different sciences.
> Shadowdancer: 1) Way cool post about Gaia. 2) You owe me
royalties. I came
> out with the Rotary Autocarp over a year ago.
>
1) Thanx much.
2) How about Winsors? I hear that they are a fueden' bunch>:-)
Serously, I did not know about that. So to you, many, many, kudos
and karma.
> Science: Is not the world. It is a way of looking at the world. So is
> Bhuddism.
Exactly. There is no point in arguing further because there is no way
we will convince each other of the validity of our claims. Just pass it
out as a bad-dogma day.
>
>
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 18:47:17 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Denver in a Box
>
> Since someone mentioned "BOXED SETS" what are odds on a
> Live-Action-Role-Play Version of Shadowrun?
>
How do you mix "BOXED SETS" with live-action-role-playing??? I
don't see the connection??
A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
and smile.
-Star-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 18:53:25 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
> I think you're thinking of a different game (p. 59, 1st ed. DMG, T$R,
and
> I'll never mention this whole ugly system again).
>
> What I meant by "ultra" was ultrasound, as in the scope/imaging
> technology found in SRII. This works by using sound waves (as
opposed to
> light of any kind) to produce an image. For example, let's say that a
> carp, for no particular reason I'm sure, was being forceably waived
in
> your direction in total darkness. Ultrasound would bounce sound
waves off
> the carp, and let you "see" it just before it smacked one's skull. Not
> unlike bats, and highly preferable to light-based sight (or so I've
heard).
>
>
I thought you were refering to the ultraviolet spectrum of seeing,
myself. And no, I personally despise the 1st ed rules by the
unmentionable. But what of sonic stunners? Would a device that
produced soundwaves to stun someone effectivly blind a person(or
paranormal) using ultravision?
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 19:01:46 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: All this magick vs. science stuff
> We all have silly nicknames, don't we drag. Some are just a bit
> more ostentatious than others.
> Grammatically yours
> The Magister
> "used my 50 cent word for the day"
>
Not to be rude, dear Magister, but, osten...what?
A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
and smile.
-Star-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 17:10:42 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: JOHANNA BURWELL-KALES <burwell@******.EDU>
Subject: Re: Grenades...
In-Reply-To: <199410262302.QAA13237@****-office.nevada.edu>
Who can really argue the usefulness of grenades. They can be
timed, trip-wired, thrown with out harm to you, used in a gun, dropped,
pu in someones mouth ( as in wanted dead or alive with Rutger Hauer), and
other possibilities exist. By far they are the most deadly weapon in
SR. Utilizing the chunky-salsa effect described in SRII, a player can
take out 2 to 3 people in one shot. Also, who says you should be allowed
to save for a called and smartgunned head shot? On any race, a head shot
kills in one hit, logicaly. What do you think. who can argue against the
use of grenades to cause widespread panic?
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 19:10:01 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Nightflyers
Phelan:
I knew most of Misty's stuff was taken from reality and
juiced up a bit for the books, I honestly thought she made up the NFs.
If they are anything like they are in the books, I feel real for your
Teacher.
Quivering in my boots,
The Magister
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 19:12:01 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
> Testing the send address.
>
It works...
A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
and smile.
-Star-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 19:13:48 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Paranoia
> > The "Buddha" rules all that walks before
him!!
>
> From what (admittedly little) I know about Buddhism, I find this
statement
> endlessly amusing.
>
Worry not, so do I.
> I also find the idea of certain ultra-greens being adamantly
opposed to the
> exploration of the laws of nature fairly amusin. But not highly
surprising.
> Paganism loses a lot of it's mystery and perceived power as the
laws of
> nature are more fully understood.
>
And if science speaks in latin, else it would lose its mystery.
> Now if that ain't flame-bait, I don't know what is.
>
No go. Myhoop is scorched enough as it is.
> Matt
>
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 19:14:51 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
> Errgghh
>
> In my post just prior to this, I did one of those things that would end
up
> creating lots and lots of possible annoyance to others out there; I
> incorrectly attributed the quoted material. Arrrhhgg, Thwap me now if
you
> must. It was actually J.D. Falk, not Adam (I always get you two
mixed up,
> dunno why).
>
> --
>
THWAPPPPPPP!!!!! THWAPPPPPPPP!!!
I love doing that...
A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
and smile.
-Star-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 19:15:11 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: 50 cent words v.2.0
Star, sweetie:
Ostentatious-----a word meaning grandiose or boastful
Full of Big Words,
The Magister
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 20:17:10 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Organization: The Happy Fun Ball Brigade
Subject: Re: All this magick vs. science stuff
In-Reply-To: Star's message of Wed, 26 Oct 1994 19:01:46 EST
<BA9566DA0@*****.vinu.edu>
>>>>> "Star" == Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU> writes:
Star> Not to be rude, dear Magister, but, osten...what?
DEFINE ostentatious
DEFINITION 1
1 showy os.ten.ta.tious \-sh*s\ aj : marked by or tending toward
ostentation : PRETENTIOUS - os.ten.ta.tious.ly av
--
Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> |When not in use, Happy Fun Ball should be
http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox|returned to its special container and kept
PGP Public Key: Ask for one today! |under refrigeration.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 19:18:37 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Bands in SR
> Illusions can be more spontaneous as well, every performance will
> be different, more artistic, kinda like the synthesiser vs. real
> instruments debate
>
> GLO
>
Speaking of which, I like the synthlinks. Especially when cororinated
with a dance number. How a bout a spell to cororinate illusions with
the dance? Would resome heavy anchoring, but would it work??
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 17:20:35 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: JOHANNA BURWELL-KALES <burwell@******.EDU>
Subject: Re: SR newbies...
In-Reply-To: <199410262302.QAA13237@****-office.nevada.edu>
Any one know how many new people have come on the list in the
last couple of months? I believe there are quite a few around here.
One thing that ticks me off are the idiots that play role-playing
games and take them as serious as real life. Like the people who die
playing D&D for example. What brain capacity does it take to decide
between real life and a fake character? I don't mean anyone on the list
because most of the people on the list are a lot smarter than this. The
people i do mean are are the ones who compare eerything to game terms and
what if you had this in real life and what if this happened in Sr and
what if this character out of a book came to life and a lot of other
things...
I hadto say this seeing the kids playing games in the Gamers Club
at my school. I mean were talking kids who have no life playing Magic or
D&D till their brain oozes out their ass in a state of atrophy. I saw a
kid today with a cardboard box filled with nothing ut about half a foot
of magic cards. What a waste of money. To him its a liffe, to people
like me it is only a game and a game it will stay.
Sorry if I offended anybody.....
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 19:21:04 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: All this magick vs. science stuff
Yeah, what the Rat said. He said much better than I did.
Oh my stars and garters!!!! Rat>>>>We actually agree on something.
SCARY!!
That Magic Dude
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 19:21:23 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: All this magick vs. science stuff
> Can be that all it takes is a silly nickname (Buddha) to get you
peolpe
> going? Now that, is Truely Funny :: ::
> \____/
>
What is wrong, Dragon? Jealous?????
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 19:23:56 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
> Shadowdancer,
>
> I'll tell you what...
>
> We won't mix religion with the list if you'll refrain from hugging any
trees.
>
> S'okay?
>
Sorry, cannot do that. Just call me sappy<grin>.
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 19:26:29 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: All this magick vs. science stuff
> >>>>> "Star" == Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU> writes:
>
> Star> Not to be rude, dear Magister, but, osten...what?
>
> DEFINE ostentatious
> DEFINITION 1
> 1 showy os.ten.ta.tious \-sh*s\ aj : marked by or tending toward
> ostentation : PRETENTIOUS - os.ten.ta.tious.ly av
>
> --
> Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu>
Hey, Rat, are you a walking dictionary or something??
Just kidding... <big red-cheeked *grin*>
A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
and smile.
-Star-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 20:31:09 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Organization: The Happy Fun Ball Brigade
Subject: Re: All this magick vs. science stuff
In-Reply-To: Star's message of Wed, 26 Oct 1994 19:26:29 EST
<C12D203DE@*****.vinu.edu>
>>>>> "Star" == Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU> writes:
Star> Hey, Rat, are you a walking dictionary or something??
Star> Just kidding... <big red-cheeked *grin*>
No, but I've got an on-line Webster's & Roget's handy :).
Now to somehow get the on-line versions onto a skillsoft...
--
Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> |Happy Fun Ball contains a liquid core,
http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox|which, if exposed due to rupture, should
PGP Public Key: Ask for one today! |not be touched, inhaled, or looked at.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 19:29:31 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: SR newbies...
Didn't you know that Magic TOG is nothing but crack for gamers???
Everyone I know that has gotten into it, has boxes and boxes of the
silly things. It is a highly addictive thing can will drain your wallet
and kill off brain cells. It is evil and should be stopped.
<Flame Off>
Post-Flame: Anyone who has trouble distinguishing fantasy from
reality has no business playing ANY RPG.
Still smoking,
The Magister
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 19:32:20 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
> > Shadowdancer,
> >
> > I'll tell you what...
> >
> > We won't mix religion with the list if you'll refrain from hugging
any
> trees.
> >
> > S'okay?
> >
> Sorry, cannot do that. Just call me sappy<grin>.
>
>
>
> -SHADOWDANCER-
>
God, Shadowdancer. You have been around me too long. That's one
of my jokes!!!
A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
and smile.
-Star-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 19:35:17 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: All this magick vs. science stuff
> >>>>> "Star" == Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU> writes:
>
> Star> Hey, Rat, are you a walking dictionary or something??
> Star> Just kidding... <big red-cheeked *grin*>
>
> No, but I've got an on-line Webster's & Roget's handy :).
>
> Now to somehow get the on-line versions onto a skillsoft...
>
> --
> Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu>
Lots, and lots, and lots of memory....
A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
and smile.
-Star-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 19:35:23 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
Shadowdancer, for the use of a bad pun, we hereby award you with
the Golden THWAP award.
<duck>
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 19:45:50 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
>
> Sorry, but I have to jump all over this one. Your argument
shows
> an utter lack of understanding of the term "science." Science seeks
to
> find the reason for that which happens in our universe. It deals with
> things that are pure and free as well, especially now that chaos
theory
> is getting added into the whole picture. Science does not crush
things
> it does not accept. It tries to explain things so that they can be
> better understood.
> Your next point of things happening/not happening just
because
> enough people believe in them is...dumb (sorry). For centuries,
everyone
> thought that the sun revolved around the Earth, until that notion was
> proven false. But at the time it was an unpopular idea, and the
common
> masses still believed that the Earth was the center of the universe.
Are
> you trying to tell me that sometime in the middle ages, the sun
stopped
> revolving around the Earth and switched to the other way around
just
> because enough people believed it? Even though it had been
proven
> hundreds of years before? This same argument could be made for
any
> number of "belief" oriented fallacies throughout history. You could
I am not going to get "cheesy". The fact is that all of these are
"belief" systems. The problem is when beliefs collide. The thing is,
we cannot "prove" who was right then. This whole arguement deals
with philosophies and knowledge. Problem is, who is really right? I
have appologized many times before and will again. But if all of you
want me gone because I believe differently, then I will leave. In
24hrs. I will log off from this list. Any last comments or flames can be
left before I leave.
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 20:54:52 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "CHAPMAN, DANIEL LEE" <DANIELC@*****.CC.UGA.EDU>
In-Reply-To: In reply to your message of WED 26 OCT 1994 19:12:01 EST
>> Testing the send address.
>>
>
>It works...
>
>
>
>
>A love that is never can always be obtained, a love that
>is lost can never be regained. Think of the ones loved,
>and smile.
>
>
>
>-Star-
Thanks for the uplifting thought Star, keep it up and the world
will be a better place. :)
Excalibur
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 17:54:52 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Erik S Jameson <esj@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Don't leave...
Shadwodancer, I'm not sure what is going thru your head, but I don't
think anyone on here wants you to leave. I started teh whole damn thread
about elves and immortality and magic and science, and you and I are
probably the most opposed of everyone out there on those topics. But I
don't want you to leave. If for no other reason but to force me to think
through my beliefs and make sure I really do have a validation for them.
I disagree with you on amny thigs, the least of all magic, but so what?
Differences and arguements are what made America great. So relax, and
don't cut off your subscription.
Erik, a.k.a. the Whistler
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 17:55:06 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Erik S Jameson <esj@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: INvisIBility/science/magic/reality
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410262101.AA05207@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, ELFBOY wrote:
> Eb:>someone argued that elves are alive thus they must also die.(or
> something similar in words) Look, the word immortality implies that
> something !!-living-!! would !!-live-!! forever. Are you going to say that
> the word immortal can't exist either now? You haven't witnessed
> immortality and you haven't witnessed an elf. Wow, there's one
> charactaristic they share already. Elves are immortal! (go ahead
> argue, i need it)
>
You know, while I may be a bastard, and I may not be the nicest person
here, I have tried to avoid out and out flaming. But here
goes--FLAME ON--elfboy's above comment has to be one of the STUPIDEST I
HAVE EVER HEARD!!!!! Good God boy, what are you thinking? Is this
supposed to be like Zen and Shadworun or something? PLEASE!!! Get on
grip on reality or something closely approximating it!! --FLAME OFF--
Okay, now I am back to normal. I have given up on the immortal elves
arguement and the science vs. magic arguement because it seemed like we
were only getting dogmatic beliefs (I could be wrong there), but at least
NO ONE was stupid enough to post anything like elfboy did.
Erik, a.k.a. the Whistler
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 20:00:35 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
> Let me pose a hypothetical question. As we all know gunpowder
was invented by
> this french (?) monk, now can this man be held responsible for the
deaths
> of all the men and women who died from the guns using his
gunpowder? Or should
> we praise him for giving us a way to make marvellous fireworks,
mine the earth,
> build breathtaking monuments on rocks etc. The same goes for the
scientists
> who worked on atomic energy. Should we blame them for giving the
military
> the means to build bombs or should we praise them for all the new
and
> wonderfull things that they made possible through their discoveries.
> Science (as magic in SR) is but a tool in the hands of its wielder,
never
> forget that.....
>
>
I thought the chinese created gunpowder.....
Anyway, I agree with you.
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 20:20:48 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
> A question too. When you wear heavy armours, you lose CP points,
right?
> Well, what about those goons with the heavy armour and Threat
ratings? Do
> they sacrifice any, or do they get by without the kind of negatives
that the
> runners would get?
>
>
I would believe so. Or you could increase the threat. A goon in heavy
milspec is pretty threating to me.
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 20:23:48 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Immortality and Elves vs. Science and Laws of Nature
> You do hug trees though eh? :-)
>
>
Yea, but not eucalyptous. Koalas are cute, but claws are not.:-)
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 20:27:43 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "The Kumquat <smirk>" <CRF_BROWNJT@***.CUIS.EDU>
Organization: Concordia University Information Systems, River Forest, Il.
Subject: Let's get some focus...
There have been complaints over the last few days, that the mass quantities of
text being sent to this list is, for the most part, Irrelavent and Idiotic.
I have remained silent about this for a while but it is really getting out of
hand. THIS LIST IS HERE FOR SHADOWRUN. That's it. I find it a waste of my time
and quota to have to sit here deleting 100+ messages of CRAP per day....
Several of my friends came on because it was a method for the INTELLIGENT
discussion of Shadowrun. 10 Messages on Shadowrun stats on Mahatma Gandhi?
(Note the CORRECT spelling) Some people (mainly new) are wasting everyones time
by not practicing netiquette.... DON'T: Post one line messages, unless the line
has a shred of intelligent thought in it. DON'T Quote a 2-page message, adding
"I agree!" at the end.... DON'T post 3 lines, and a fifty-line signature with
extra spacing..... And Most of all, DON'T keep sending messages to everyone on
this mailing lists involving stupid flames which have nothing to do with the
list itself...i.e. Someone's Nickname, Religious, or Political beliefs.... IT'S
JUST PLAIN RUDE! I'm generally pretty level-headed, posting only when I have
something intelligent to say (Instead of 50 posts per day of high-school
insults and immature foolishness) but I'm ranting because you, and you know who
you are, are ruining the list for everyone. If you want to write idiotic
flames, try IRC.... don't waste everyone else's bandwidth.
There, Speech over....
And Now Back to Shadowrun...(I hope)
Just My Two Pence.
The Kumquat.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 20:30:59 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Let's get some focus...
>
> There, Speech over....
> And Now Back to Shadowrun...(I hope)
> Just My Two Pence.
> The Kumquat.
>
Cute name..
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 20:31:59 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: SR newbies...
No offense taken on this side. I can testify to what you are saying. It
does go a little to far. But in defense, sometimes I like to imagine
what it would be like to do what we do in games. It is fun. It can go to
far though. I knew someone who almost blew his brains out because
he lost his favorite _&_ character. Sad really.
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 20:34:15 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Matt <mosbun@******.CC.PURDUE.EDU>
Subject: Re: Denver in a Box
>Since someone mentioned "BOXED SETS" what are odds on a
>Live-Action-Role-Play Version of Shadowrun?
Somewhere between Nil and None, I'd say.
Matt
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 20:39:26 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Let's get some focus...
What the hell is a Kumquat???????:-)
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 20:48:53 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Let's get some focus...
I seem to find it really interesting that in the two weeks that I have
been on this list, that the only complaints come from two people I
haven't seen on this list at all. If the complaint came from someone
in authority, say, the FL or one of his assistants, it might carry just a
little more weight.
However, some of the comments and arguments do get a little
repetitous and boring. That is one reason I tried to make peace with
the Rat over the magic and music debate. I got real tired of the spike
babies postings and the damn immortal elves debate. I think our
"dear friend" The Vegetable needs to remember that this is a list for
public exchange of ideas, mainly about SR,but, it can branch out into
other areas. Afterall, we ARE gamers, and how many gamers do you
know that stick to just one idea during any conversation???
Arcanely yours
The Magister
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 20:56:44 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "The Kumquat <smirk>" <CRF_BROWNJT@***.CUIS.EDU>
Organization: Concordia University Information Systems, River Forest, Il.
Subject: My last post
Shadowdancer, I hate to single people out, but you seemed to have missed the
point of my whole message (FLAME ON!) I wrote a twenty-five line criticism of
the lack of Intelligence apparent by those new people who post one line, with a
large sig, about topics having nothing to do with Shadowrun. Your first
response (for lack of a better word to describe that moronic waste of
bandwidth...) was "What The Hell is a Kumquat.....? " Well.... so I don't get
any other stupid comments and end this... The Kumquat means, quite simply, me.
I am an amateur occultist, (Studies for 11 years, a Communications/Theatre, and
Writing major at a University near Chicago. I have been on this list for a
while now, although I don't post all that often. (Read as: I only post when I
have something worthwhile to say, a pracice you could benefit from trying.) My
original point was that we should get back in the focus of shadowrun.... If you
want to blabber, take it to PRIVATE E-mail.... don't waste everyone's time...
If anyone wishes to talk to me about Any form of gaming (I attend from 3-10
cons per year, and stay on the cutting edge in all gaming) or the occult, My
Address is : CRF_BROWNJT@***.CUIS.edu
And let's try and not waste anymore time on irrelavent topics, please?
Just My Two Pence.
The Kumquat.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 18:57:49 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Mercenary X <kdye@*****.STANFORD.EDU>
Subject: Re: Let's get some focus...
In-Reply-To: <199410270150.SAA16709@*****.Stanford.EDU>
Do you guys actully read all the crap this list gets? This list list
used to be about shadowrun, now its the talkings about everything but.
If you want to flame someone, send me a cc (Just kidding), but seriously,
maybe we should make a new list, I'm sure FL(oH) could set it up. We
could call it Flames-R-us!
__ __
"If we weren't crazy, we'd all \ \ / /
insane" \ \/ /
M E R C E N A R Y
/ /\ \ kdye@*****.stanford.edu
/_/ \_\
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 22:01:02 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Malcalypse The Younger <shadow@******.NET>
Subject: Re: Astral Space <>Space ?
In-Reply-To: <9410260703.AA24719@ IntNet.net>
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, Damion Milliken wrote:
> Shadow writes:
>
> > Hm.. Perhaps space is NOT the mana poor environment that we have been led
> > to believe, but is instead very mana RICH, but has been courrupted badly
> > by the Horrors (as has happened in ED, it's impossible to cast unfiltered
> > spells, and looking into the Astral plane is horrifying...) Hm.
> >
> > I really don't support this theory, but it would seem to fufill the
> > observed data.
>
> I might be a bit skeptical at that. Doesn't the creation/upkeep of the mana
> level also require living beings to be around? Can't be too many of those
> out in orbit.
The data that that hypothesis was created from is that there is no mana
in space... If that data is flawed, then the hypothesis is also flawed.
It does require a vast re-thinking of exactly how magic works, but...
Shadow@******.net
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 22:10:09 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Malcalypse The Younger <shadow@******.NET>
Subject: Re: shadows power foci problem
In-Reply-To: <9410261341.AA16501@ IntNet.net>
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, L.T.Bryant wrote:
> Ok shadow heres a idea to bring them down,
> (well its a few but most {im told} arnt plausable)
> morter bombs ... just flatten the area
> FAE... see above
>
> The sensable one
> Air timed mini grnades with shaped charges, this should give the
> optimum stand off distance for the copper strem, and enable it
> to punch through,
> alternatly try a couple of flasks of real strong acid at the
> ARMOUR forget abought the insides , they will run from the acid
> eating there suits and you win
>
Unfortunatly, none of these are plausible.. We are currently deep beneath
the ruins of NORAD, and are in a largish sized room where these things
just beat down a (titanium) door. BTW, we also have one of these, since I
was able to kill it's owner with a force 10 mana bolt. Unfortunatly, the
new opponents all have stats in execess of 25. (possessed by force 21
storm spirts...) Which rules out most targeted spells. Right now I'm
considering a transformation spell (Target: Willpower, not resisted) into
like a rabbit or something... seems like a slim chance, but I have to try
:)
Shadow@******.net
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 22:04:45 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Marc A Renouf <jormung@*****.UMICH.EDU>
Subject: Re: Grenades...
In-Reply-To: <199410270012.UAA04769@*****.engin.umich.edu>
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, JOHANNA BURWELL-KALES wrote:
> Who can really argue the usefulness of grenades. They can be
> timed, trip-wired, thrown with out harm to you, used in a gun, dropped,
> pu in someones mouth ( as in wanted dead or alive with Rutger Hauer), and
> other possibilities exist. By far they are the most deadly weapon in
> SR. Utilizing the chunky-salsa effect described in SRII, a player can
> take out 2 to 3 people in one shot. Also, who says you should be allowed
> to save for a called and smartgunned head shot? On any race, a head shot
> kills in one hit, logicaly. What do you think. who can argue against the
> use of grenades to cause widespread panic?
First: Why, yes, grenades *are* a wonderful, versatile, and
awfully mean weapon. Thank you for joining the rest of the class ;) (I
love grenades, especially in office buildings with the little cardboard
divider walls...)
Second: A head hit is not an automatic kill. You would be
surprised how many people get hit in the head and live. Ya see, it's
like this. Not every shot hits the brain, and even those that do don't
guarantee a kill. Oblique shots will often pass through both cheeks
without hitting anything in between (except maybe grazing the tongue).
Or they may pass through the jaw, totally shattering it. Or you may pass
across both eyes, puncturing the ocular orbs and shattering the nose, but
not harming anything immediately vital. Or you could hit from the the
front arc, but off to one side or the other, effectively removing one ear
and a sizeable chunk of scalp. Or the bullet might hit dead center in
the forehead and pass between the hemispheres of the brain without
seriously tearing anything up. If you want more info on this, read
military medical manuals, police reports, emergency room reports, or
books or studies on the effects of gunshot wounds on the human body (yes,
there has been *extensive* study into this field).
So a head shot doesn't always make you dead. Sometimes it just
makes you *wish* you were dead.
Marc
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 22:13:22 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Malcalypse The Younger <shadow@******.NET>
Subject: Re: ULTRA munchkin
In-Reply-To: <9410261350.AB16613@ IntNet.net>
>
> <CHOP>ULTRA munchkin?!?! sounds a little painful!
> You've gotta be Subtle vs stuff like that...Hide in crowds. Take
> Hostages/bodysheilds. pretend to be corporate
> BUT THE best is DON'T fight them! never go head to head with
> stuff like that.
> Snipe them. Bomb them. Gas them. Report them to the police
> (possesion is ILLEGAL i think, or at least should be)
> Personally I'd
> Netrun a unmanned cargo remote and crash 200 tonnes of fridge
> freezers onto there heads.
> Or Use demolition/structural engineering or RAM/structeng to
> COLLAPSE a building onto them.
> OR shoot one of them with a harpoon gun, them throw the cable
> up into overhead powerlines
>
> Enjoy...
>
Hm. Good ideas, and good suggestions. Unfortunatly, the situation
precludes just about anything but direct confrontation (see previous
post). Good ideas though..
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 22:17:40 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Malcalypse The Younger <shadow@******.NET>
Subject: Re: Immortality and Elves vs. Science and Laws of Nature
In-Reply-To: <9410261658.AB21937@ IntNet.net>
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, Skrub wrote:
>
> See that posting where a number of Force 21 free storm spirits possesed
> troll sammies in heavy power armor w/ force 8 power foci.
Hey. They're humans, not trolls. but they are initiates. (I think)
>
> Of course that is as far from classy as it gets.
>
Agreed.
> Force a BTL addiction onto them! That is the way to go. Especially w/ FASA
> drug rules. Munchkins tend to be rules lawyers so... Turn the tables. Make
> em deal w/ an addiction.
>
Oh. I like that..
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 22:20:23 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Malcalypse The Younger <shadow@******.NET>
Subject: Re: LARP/SR
In-Reply-To: <9410261814.AA24204@ IntNet.net>
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, Magister wrote:
> Now here is an idea that deserves some discussion. If the Vamps
> and the Werewolves can get away with it, why couldn't we? However,
> the logistics that would have to be worked out are mind-boggling.
> But, who better than us to work them out? We would need rules for
> magic, combat, places to run, rules for the matrix, riggers, etc.etc.
> I'm open to any suggestions.
>
Arg. I don't think it would work. these are the reasons:
a) Automatic Weapons
b) Cyberware
c) Magic
d) Heavy armor
e) The Matrix
f) Astral Space
g) etc.
SR is just too complex a game to do Live Action...
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 22:22:48 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Marc A Renouf <jormung@*****.UMICH.EDU>
Subject: Re: Back to Shadowrun...
In-Reply-To: <199410270129.VAA07156@*****.engin.umich.edu>
Am I the only GM who likes to run deckers? I get the impression
that everyone things deckers are a total waste of time. Why is that?
They add such an incredible element to the campaign!
Has anyone else out there ever participated in an all-decker
campaign? What a riot...
Marc
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 22:39:05 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Malcalypse The Younger <shadow@******.NET>
Subject: Re: Back to Shadowrun...
In-Reply-To: <9410270222.AB09679@ IntNet.net>
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, Marc A Renouf wrote:
> Am I the only GM who likes to run deckers? I get the impression
> that everyone things deckers are a total waste of time. Why is that?
> They add such an incredible element to the campaign!
> Has anyone else out there ever participated in an all-decker
> campaign? What a riot...
I DO like deckers... but they tend to clog up game time, and most of the
decking rules are rather cumbersome. Agreed, they add an incredible
element to the game, and it would not be the same without them... But, so
far the only rules I've seen for deckers are either cumbersome or kill
the whole experience (fast resolution) If anyone has any alternatives,
I'd love to hear them....
And no, I've neven been in an all decker game... It might be interesting
though. Hm.
Oh, BTW. Is there any interest in a PBIRC (Play by IRC) SR game? I'd be
willing to give it a try some time In the Near Future if people are
interested..
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 20:27:26 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Spellslinger <mruane@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410260655.AA07325@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, Damion Milliken wrote:
> So if the runners are fighting only a few opponents the bad guys get _both_
> CP and Threat? That's a bit nasty isn't it, since if there are only a few
> opponents, then the enemies are probably pretty tough as it is :-). As for
> the enemy runners receiving CPs, I agree, but do they also get Threat?
> That'd make 'em pretty tough I'd reckon.
>
> A question too. When you wear heavy armours, you lose CP points, right?
> Well, what about those goons with the heavy armour and Threat ratings? Do
> they sacrifice any, or do they get by without the kind of negatives that the
> runners would get?
>
> Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
The runners in current adventures are pretty house. I like to perceive
opponents as people with the will to survive equivalent to that of the
characters. Threat pool is the NPC's natural defence against Karma.
This may sound evil, but I give runners Cps and >karma<. This makes
enemy runners with karma a pain in the ass.
Oh, and yes, anyone in heavy armor gets the CP penalty. PCs and NPCs.
threat rating is a helper for NPCs versus stacked PCs. They still have a
bad habit of dying, however.
Mike
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 00:12:52 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "J.D. Falk" <jdfalk@****.CAIS.COM>
Subject: Re: All this magick vs. science stuff
In-Reply-To: <199410261556.LAA25463@****.cais.com>
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, The Dragon wrote:
> Can be that all it takes is a silly nickname (Buddha) to get you peolpe
> going? Now that, is Truely Funny :: ::
For me, it was a bunch of people with silly nicknames arguing
with each other, yet not realizing that they weren't quite discussing the
same thing. In other words, it was the combination of silly _actions_
and the silly nicknames. *grin*
Still, my nickname could well be the silliest of all....
/-----------------\
| J.D. Falk | "My lockpick of choice has always been
| jdfalk@****.com | the Panther Assault Cannon."
\-----------------/ -David L. Hoff
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 23:18:20 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Robert A. Hayden" <hayden@*******.MANKATO.MSUS.EDU>
Subject: saw this
I saw this on alt.humor.best-of-usenet and I had to pass it along....
-------------------------------------
____
___ .-~. /_"-._
`-._~-. / /_ "~o\ :Y
\ \ / : \~x. ` ')
] Y / | Y< ~-.__j DIE BARNEY! DIE!
/ ! _.--~T : l l< /.-~ /
/ / ____.--~ . ` l /~\ \<|Y ~~~~~
/ / .-~~" /| . ',-~\ \L|
/ / / .^ \ Y~Y \.^>/l_ "--'
/ Y .-"( . l__ j_j l_/ /~_.-~ .
Y l / \ ) ~~~." / `/"~ / \.__/l_
| \ _.-" ~-{__ l : l._Z~-.___.--~
| ~---~ / ~~"---\_ ' __[>
l . _.^ ___ _>-y~
\ \ . .-~ .-~ ~>--" / __ I love you...
\ ~---" / ./ _.-' / oo\ /
"-.,_____.,_ _.--~\ _.-~ _.( .\..| _
~~ ( _} (_ \\_\==//_)
`. ~( \| | \_/
) \ /.\_//
/,`--'~\--'~\ \) L)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
____ Robert A. Hayden <=> hayden@*******.mankato.msus.edu
\ /__ -=-=-=-=- <=> -=-=-=-=-
\/ / Finger for Geek Code Info <=> I do not necessarily speak for the
\/ Finger for PGP Public Key <=> City of Mankato or anyone else
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GJ/CM d- H-- s-:++>s-:+ g+ p? au+ a- w++ v* C++(++++) UL++++$
P+>++ L++$ 3- E---- N+++ K+++ W M+ V-- -po+(---)>$ Y++ t+ 5+++
j R+++$ G- tv+ b+ D+ B--- e+>++(*) u** h* f r-->+++ !n y++**
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 00:31:49 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "J.D. Falk" <jdfalk@****.CAIS.COM>
Subject: Some words of wisdom...
Partially in an attempt to appease my mother, and partially
because of personal interest, I'm subscribed to a mailing list called "A
Byte of Torah," which is sent out every Sabbath by a rabbi in Israel. (As
you can guess, I'm Jewish by birth, though my personal belief system is
unclassifiable.)
This mailing list is as close as I get to organized religion, and
for me it's enough, because every now and then a really great bit shows
up in it that touches me directly.
Today, I think one portion fits for the whole ShadowRN mailing
list, and perhaps the 'net in general.
---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 20:53:40 +0200 (IST)
From: Zev Itzkowitz <zev@**********.datasrv.co.il>
To: A Byte of Torah <bytetorah@******.nysernet.ORG>
Subject: A Byte Of Torah IV,V Chayey Sarah
[portions deleted for forwarding]
We tend to think that we act in a vacuum - if our actions don't affect
anybody else, they're alright; whatever we say or do only reflects upon
ourselves, and nobody else. However, we all are part of communities and
interact with other people. Our behavior reflects back upon the community
we belong to, for good or, G-d forbid, for bad. May we strive to act in
such a way that we bring honor to Hashem, ourselves and our communities.
---------- End of forward ----------
Regardless of your personal beleifs about God, etcetera, it is an
undeniable truth that we all are a part of our community. The Shadowrn
mailing list is just such a community. I heard a while back that there
were something like fifty new subscribers a _week_ on this list -- and I'm
sure their decisions about whether to stay or to go are based, at least in
part, on the quality of mail they get from the list.
We don't want to push away people whose conversation and insights
we would enjoy...people who would benifit the list, and benifit from the
list, thereby helping our community.
No response is necessary.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 23:47:28 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Doctor Doom <jch8169@*******.TAMU.EDU>
Subject: ADMIN: Quoting Previous Messages
Meine Kameraden:
There are a number of tendencies of list members, pertaining to
procedures followed in replying/responding to a message, that have been the
source of no small degree of consternation for me. Since my recent elevation
to status to that of Dread Executor, I feel compelled to enumerate upon these
behaviors, in that I have received word that they are a source of irritation
for others:
When one seeks to juxtapose one's own views with an earlier message, i.e.
reply to an anterior posting, one should:
1. Facilitate differentiation between original and cited material by denoting
text from the former correspondence with initial line characters (">" and
"]" being typical), rather than simply append one's own material at the
end.
2. Quote, or cite, only those lines pertinent to your reply or commentary,
that is to say, avoid recapitulating the entire message.
3. Quote the earlier posting /previous/ to insertion of one's own script,
RATHER than including the preceding post at the /end/ of your message.
Hence, observers may see what instigated one's reaction, and following
that, specifically what one's reaction /was/.
In line with this is the popular procedure that "intermingles" the
respective texts, by which one replies to specific lines of text
individually, followed by another citation, followed by more response
material, and so forth.
4. Indicate the prior posting's authorship by identifying said message's
originator at the beginning of the earlier material, and /not/ by the
inclusion of the (typically) multiple-line signature file.
I only mention this in interests of the greater good and due to the
fact that others have made similar complaints. It is poor Net etiquette for
those who choose to plow through the volume of mail this list produces and
to have to contend with such obviously unnecessary verbiage -- especially
those members who must actually PAY for electronic mail service.
________________ _______ _______ ____ ____
\ _____ \ / \ / \ / \/ \ >>> Attack,
\ | | | |---___ | ___---| | || || | attack, and
| | | | |_____/ | \_____| | || || | if in doubt
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- | | | | | | || || | ATTACK! <<<
"Iron hand in a | |___/ / \_______/ \_______/|____| |____| -=-=-=-=-=-
velvet glove." | / ||
-- Charles V |_______/ Dread Executor of Administrative Tasks for Hayden
^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 00:46:24 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "J.D. Falk" <jdfalk@****.CAIS.COM>
Subject: Re: Grenades...
In-Reply-To: <199410270020.UAA15556@****.cais.com>
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, JOHANNA BURWELL-KALES wrote:
> Who can really argue the usefulness of grenades.
[examples of useful grenades deleted]
In our gaming session on Monday, we needed a distraction in a
packed club in order to get the bouncer away from a door which we wished
to pass through (sure, we coulda killed him, but distractions are
cheaper, usually easier, and almost always more fun.)
Our mage's trick didn't work -- the guy whose joint she tried to
magic-fingers away was a mage as well. So, our muscle (he's more than
muscle, but his muscles are the fastest in the team) tossed a stun
grenade as far as he could -- we think it landed in the pit.
Extremely effective, I must say...though it would've been even
more effective if the bouncer hadn't seen him throw it.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
"The problems of two second-rate actors | "But this is _our_ hill.
don't amount to a hill of beans | And these are _our_ beans!"
in this crazy underworld." | -Frank Drebbin, The Naked Gun
-Tom Servo, MST3K |-----------<jdfalk@****.com>----
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 1994 22:00:27 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Spellslinger <mruane@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Re: Back to Shadowrun...
Comments: To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun
<SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@*******.ccit.arizona.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9410270226.AA05856@***.UUG.Arizona.EDU>
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, Marc A Renouf wrote:
> Am I the only GM who likes to run deckers? I get the impression
> that everyone things deckers are a total waste of time. Why is that?
> They add such an incredible element to the campaign!
> Has anyone else out there ever participated in an all-decker
> campaign? What a riot...
>
> Marc
>
I like to run deckers. The big problem is the rules with the system.
They are hard to interpret and hard to run. Plus, the people we play
with don't like playing with deckers. Personaly, I'd run my decker more
often but the runs e go on often do not require a decker. I have an idea
that intially begins with a decker seeing something horrifying yet
totally amzing in the matrix. great, but we don't have a decker in the
group. opps. It jsut loses a personal element when you have an NPC
relate what he saw. Plus, some of the party member love blowing the crap
out of people. Something deckers really don't get a chance to do, unless
in cyberspace.
Mike aka Spellslinger
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 01:02:22 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "J.D. Falk" <jdfalk@****.CAIS.COM>
Subject: Re: Let's get some focus...
In-Reply-To: <199410270149.VAA20256@****.cais.com>
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, Magister wrote:
> I seem to find it really interesting that in the two weeks that I have
> been on this list, that the only complaints come from two people I
> haven't seen on this list at all. If the complaint came from someone
> in authority, say, the FL or one of his assistants, it might carry just a
> little more weight.
I am one of the assistants -- I edit & coordinate the current
NERPS project, and am now also responsible for the NERPS and SHADOWRN
FAQs. Also, I've been on the list quite a while.
Main reason you haven't seen me complaining a lot is that I've
been trying to stay polite. Let me go on record now stating that I, J.D.
Falk, am sick and tired of the recent trend of various people (seemingly
all from the same site) arguing with each other over minutae.
Let me also go on record stating that two weeks on this list is
piddly-shit. You have no idea what you're talking about. It is not that
you are unable to find _out_ what you're talking about, merely that at
present you do not know.
Wait. Watch and learn. Lurk for a while. I did.
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
: "Information's pretty thin stuff : J.D. Falk
: unless mixed with experience." : jdfalk@****.com
: -Clarance Day :
````````````````````````````````````
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 01:24:39 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Wow, Reality. That's a switch" <MHILLIARD@****.ALBION.EDU>
Subject: Re: My last post
Personally, this chitter-chater is why I came back to the list. I *LIKE*
it. Kuwquat (It that IS your real name), there DOES exist that marvelous
invention of computer science-the delete function. Feel free to utilize it,
instead of asking us to limit our conversations to what you consider relevant.
ShadowRN/ShadowTK/Plot-D has more personality and community than any other
listserv I've ever been on. This is a good thing, IMNSHO.
*one BIG idiotic grin*
Phelan
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 03:21:45 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: the holy Entombed <rasputin@***.UMD.EDU>
Subject: Kumquat's Plea
In-Reply-To: <199410270528.BAA23407@*******.wam.umd.edu>
On Thu, 27 Oct 1994, Wow, Reality. That's a switch. wrote:
> Personally, this chitter-chater is why I came back to the list. I *LIKE*
> it. Kuwquat (It that IS your real name), there DOES exist that marvelous
> invention of computer science-the delete function. Feel free to utilize it,
> instead of asking us to limit our conversations to what you consider relevant.
Yes, and there is also that "marvelous invention of computer science"
called _private E-mail_. It is absolutely ridiculous to have to hit the
delete key one-hundred-plus times a DAY just to erase all of the
one-and-two-line mindless chatter that is running between practically
closed groups of people....many of whom posting from ONE SITE.
BTW, he's not asking you, or anyone, to keep the conversations to what HE
feels is relevant, he's requesting you to keep to topics that the list is
running to cover, that Robert Hayden feels are relevant, that the
majority of us feel are relevant.
If you like the idle chitter-chatter, there's always IRC, or various
MUSHes, or even the bulk of the alt.* groups. There's nothing wrong with
the idle banter...in moderation.
--thE--
rasputin@***.umd.edu
mf2138@****.umd.edu
etrager@***.gwu.edu
etc...
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 17:23:45 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Astral Space <>Space ?
In-Reply-To: <199410261710.DAA16054@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Matt" at
Oct 26,
94 11:14:47 am
Matt writes:
> What about beings that live primarily, or even solely, in the Astral plane?
> 'Though I'd hate to think of the kind of spirits that live in space's Astral
> plane. Toxics perhaps? Maybe that's where the Insect spirits come from.
> Maybe that's where the Horrors originate from.
Malcalpyse The Younger writes:
> The data that that hypothesis was created from is that there is no mana
> in space... If that data is flawed, then the hypothesis is also flawed.
> It does require a vast re-thinking of exactly how magic works, but...
Hmm, interesting concept. If you allow pure astral presences to maintain the
mana flow, then it would seem possible. What I mean by that is that normally
the existence and presence of life on the physical plane is required for an
astral plane to exist in that particular place (at least that's how it comes
across to me). Now, would it be possible for such a mana "field", so to
speak, to be set up by there presence of astral only creatures? Assuming
that somehow (buggered if I know how) they can get there in the first place?
If so, then it could well be argued that space (or at least near earth
space) is inhabited by astral presences. Now, based on the evidence that
this area is a real bad place to visit for a human magaician, it wouldn't be
too difficult to conclude that horrors could exist there. The background
count is created by the effects of the emotions and feelings of the
creatures inhabiting the place, and horrors wouldn't be real pleasant to
live around, so I could envision a rather nasty background count due to
their presence, such as could well send a human insane or even kill them.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 17:27:54 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Bands in SR
In-Reply-To: <199410270022.KAA24686@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from
"Shadowdancer" at
Oct 26, 94 07:18:37 pm
Shadowdancer writes:
> Speaking of which, I like the synthlinks. Especially when cororinated
> with a dance number. How a bout a spell to cororinate illusions with
> the dance? Would resome heavy anchoring, but would it work??
I'd say that if you had a sustained illusion, and you had it running the
whole time then you would be able to (have to suffer the +2 for the whole
concert though :-)). As for having the illusions in sync with the dance, I
would rule out the possibility of an anchored spell performing adequately,
after all, can you program the spell to do exactly what you want exactly
when you want? And you could pretty much forget interfacing it with the
synthlink, you know how it goes "Do not mix thy magic with thy matrix", or
something like that, and a synthlink isn't too far removed from a matrix
interface.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 10:11:28 +0200
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Darth Vader <j07c@***.UNI-BREMEN.DE>
Subject: Re: All this magick vs. science stuff
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@**.gmd.de
In-Reply-To: <9410262247.AA52837@***.zfn.uni-bremen.de> from "Star" at
Oct 26,
94 06:41:27 pm
> Like a name such as "THE dragon"? Isn't that conceded? Are you
> impling(sp?) that you are the only!! dragon? I hope not!!!!
Hey what about mine, am I not beyond all help :)
--
"Believe in Angels." -- The Crow
GCS d>- H s+: !g p? !au a- w+ v-(?) C+++ UA++VS++L>++++ P-- (aren't we all?)
L+>+++ 3 E--- N++ K W(+)(---) M-- !V(--) -po+(---) Y+ t++ 5+ !j(-) R+++(--)
!G tv(++) b+++ D++ B- e+ u++(-) h*(+) f+ r- n!(----) y?
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 09:26:00 GMT
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Iz The Wiz! <HB011TRP01@****************.AC.UK>
Subject: Spirit Possesion.
What would happen if a free spirit with the power of possesion, possessed a
decker, then tried to jack into the matrix? Would the spirit be able to
interface with the matrix or not?
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 10:34:58 MET
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Paolo Marcucci <marcucci@***.TS.ASTRO.IT>
Subject: Re: Paranoia (fwd)
>
> so Rat.....exactly how old are you?
>
> Should we be refering to you as the venerable Rat? (as Bede cringes) :-)
>
> Nigel
Are we going to "I'm the elder" contest? :)
(maybe I can make it in the first places...)
--
________________________________________________________________________
Paolo Marcucci marcucci@***.ts.astro.it
<a href="http://www.oat.ts.astro.it/marcucci/home.html">My Home
Page</a>
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 10:29:16 +0200
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Darth Vader <j07c@***.UNI-BREMEN.DE>
Subject: Re: Let's get some focus...
In-Reply-To: <9410270028.AA52770@***.zfn.uni-bremen.de> from "The
Kumquat" at
Oct 26, 94 08:27:43 pm
> There have been complaints over the last few days, that the mass quantities of
> text being sent to this list is, for the most part, Irrelavent and Idiotic.
> I have remained silent about this for a while but it is really getting out of
> hand. THIS LIST IS HERE FOR SHADOWRUN. That's it. I find it a waste of my time
Frag off, if you want a flame fest I'd be happy to oblige - lets take
this to email ......
--
"Believe in Angels." -- The Crow
GCS d>- H s+: !g p? !au a- w+ v-(?) C+++ UA++VS++L>++++ P-- (aren't we all?)
L+>+++ 3 E--- N++ K W(+)(---) M-- !V(--) -po+(---) Y+ t++ 5+ !j(-) R+++(--)
!G tv(++) b+++ D++ B- e+ u++(-) h*(+) f+ r- n!(----) y?
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 19:36:13 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Thermographics and Improved Invisibility
In-Reply-To: <199410262103.HAA19759@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Sam Thomas"
at
Oct 26, 94 03:53:03 pm
Sinbad Sam writes:
> >While I am rather partial to a "notice-me-not" type spell, I don't
think
> >(Improved) Invisibility is this type of spell.
>
> Yes improved invisiblity is this type of spell. Fasa.support@*****.gies.com
Ah, so this is a FASA (no $) clarification. Well it seems like it is a
pretty contradictory one to me, but oh well, that's FASA for you.
Shadowdancer writes:
> I thought you were refering to the ultraviolet spectrum of seeing,
> myself. And no, I personally despise the 1st ed rules by the
> unmentionable. But what of sonic stunners? Would a device that
> produced soundwaves to stun someone effectivly blind a person(or
> paranormal) using ultravision?
Would that not depend on the frequency of the sound? If the frequency of
the stunner corresponded to the frequency of detection, then the person
attempting to "see" would be overwhealmed and wind up blinded. Better check
that explanation with the physics geeks around here though.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 19:49:50 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: More dumb questions
In-Reply-To: <199410270122.LAA27133@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from
"Shadowdancer" at
Oct 26, 94 08:20:48 pm
Shadowdancer writes:
> I would believe so. Or you could increase the threat. A goon in heavy
> milspec is pretty threating to me.
Yes you could, but I don't think Threat Ratings are meant to be chosen based
on the power of the equipment carried by bad guys, it's to do with training
and dedication I thought.
Mike writes:
> > A question too. When you wear heavy armours, you lose CP points, right?
> > Well, what about those goons with the heavy armour and Threat ratings? Do
> > they sacrifice any, or do they get by without the kind of negatives that the
> > runners would get?
>
> This may sound evil, but I give runners Cps and >karma<. This makes
> enemy runners with karma a pain in the ass.
Threat Ratings too? Now that would be nasty!
> Oh, and yes, anyone in heavy armor gets the CP penalty. PCs and NPCs.
> threat rating is a helper for NPCs versus stacked PCs. They still have a
> bad habit of dying, however.
Well, in theory the NPCs do not have CPs, they get Threat Ratings, and I
was asking if their Threat Rating would be reduced or not. If it is, then
NPCs would be rather disadvantaged by this, sinse Threat Ratings rarely
equal CPs in size; their advantage of being used many times consecutively
would be overshadowed if they were to lose a point or two, but on the other
hadn, if they are not penalised, then they have a decided advantage over PCs
when using heavy armours.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 08:52:12 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Gareth Owen <glowen1@*****.NHS.GOV.UK>
Subject: Re: magick vs science
In-Reply-To: <9410262319.aa04500@****.demon.co.uk> from "Adam Getchell"
at Oct
26, 94 04:14:48 pm
Hmmmm.
As I see it the science known to man covers just a small portion
of the laws of nature, but that portion is increasing and becoming
more accurate all the time (hopefully). Magic and other unexplained
phenomena lie in a region of the laws of nature htat science has yet
to understand. It seems to me that in the SR world a major new theory
is required before magic can be understood by a scientist. The mages
and shamans understand magic well enough to manipulate it, but possibly
don't understand how it works at a fundamental 'physical' level.
I believe all unexplained phenomena are explainable from a scientific
point of view, but scientists have shown a lack of interest in the
'supernatural' which does not do them credit. For example, I believe
the human mind cn do things that modern biology would deny, but that
these things can be explained when biology advances enough.
See the book 'Supernature' by Lyall Watson (?) for a more eloqount (sp)
discussion of this.
GLO
"A sufficiently advanced science is indistinguishable from magic"
- and vice versa.
--
Gareth Owen | Mail: glowen1@*****.nhs.gov.uk
Sytems Programmmer | Phone: (UK) 0495 765021
Gwent Health Authority | "Reboot it from orbit, it's the only way to be sure"
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 20:13:24 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Let's get some focus...
In-Reply-To: <199410270130.LAA27463@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "The
Kumquat" at
Oct 26, 94 08:27:43 pm
The Kumquat writes:
> There have been complaints over the last few days, that the mass quantities of
> text being sent to this list is, for the most part, Irrelavent and Idiotic.
> I have remained silent about this for a while but it is really getting out of
> hand. THIS LIST IS HERE FOR SHADOWRUN. That's it.
While I have to agree with you, I think you are being a little extreme - it
wasn't quite as bad as you make it out.
> I find it a waste of my time and quota to have to sit here deleting 100+
> messages of CRAP per day....
You sure, I always thought that ShadowRN was limited to 100 messaegs per
day. You must not have a very high opinion of _all_ of our mail. :-)
> Several of my friends came on because it was a method for the INTELLIGENT
> discussion of Shadowrun. 10 Messages on Shadowrun stats on Mahatma Gandhi?
This was actually a single example in a discussion on what I think is a very
important SR topic - that of average stats and stat limits.
[Big rant deleted]
While I agree with most of that, it is very nice to have an aknowledgement
of something you have posted, particulrily if you are conducting and
argument with a particular person or persons, and you wish to concede the
point (or whatever). It is alwyas nice to have someone respond to your
response to their post for "suggestions" or the like too, and this will
probably be no more than a one or two line post. But the silly single line
posts, yeah, they're a waste of time (sometimes the funny ones are good
though, you do remember FLs "and they have a strong tendancy not to stay
crispy in milk" or something similar, which quite nicely topped off and
finished a discussion on dragons (I think), but had absolutely nothing
whatsoever to do with the topic, or with SR at all. You wouldn't seriously
criticise that would you?).
> Shadowdancer, I hate to single people out, but you seemed to have missed the
> point of my whole message (FLAME ON!) I wrote a twenty-five line criticism of
> the lack of Intelligence apparent by those new people who post one line, with a
> large sig, about topics having nothing to do with Shadowrun. Your first
> response (for lack of a better word to describe that moronic waste of
> bandwidth...) was "What The Hell is a Kumquat.....? "
Actually, Star made some single line post in response to your rant first,
adn I don't think it was any more useful. BTW, I thought a kumquat was a
small green fruit.
J.D. Falk writes:
> Let me also go on record stating that two weeks on this list is
> piddly-shit. You have no idea what you're talking about. It is not that
> you are unable to find _out_ what you're talking about, merely that at
> present you do not know.
> Wait. Watch and learn. Lurk for a while. I did.
While the man was a bit abrasive, he does have a very good point, being a
lurker for a month or two won't do any real harm (it'll reduce the time you
spend logged on replying to mail too :-)). And it'll give you a chance to
learn the idiosyncrasies of this list, and the people on it (like, if Ivy
was on, you'd learn not to disagree with her ;-)). I too lurked for a month
or two, and even then made a blazing entrance (note the wink with the Ivy
reference), but I did take care after that :-).
Phelan writes:
> Personally, this chitter-chater is why I came back to the list. I *LIKE*
> it. Kuwquat (It that IS your real name), there DOES exist that marvelous
> invention of computer science-the delete function. Feel free to utilize it,
> instead of asking us to limit our conversations to what you consider relevant.
Bummer for those who have to pay though isn't it?
> ShadowRN/ShadowTK/Plot-D has more personality and community than any other
> listserv I've ever been on. This is a good thing, IMNSHO.
I happen to agree with you here.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 06:15:37 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "D.O.A. SECURITY" <MKNABUSCH@****.ALBION.EDU>
Subject: Re: Don't leave...
Hey mon. Don't leave us. Most people log on and have
a problem or two wit da rest o us. Some leave, mon.
The rest stick it out. It only gets better. Sides,
who will start up the debate again in six months, Shadowdancer?
Moi? No, I tried staying clear after the one two years ago.
*grin* And Phelan, myself, and Brian started that one (I think)
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 14:27:02 +1100
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Luke Kendall <luke@********.CANON.OZ.AU>
Subject: Re: Let's get some focus...
It seems to me that after a flurry of new subscriptions, people
started posting without taking the time to get the `feel' of
the discussions on this list.
And that as a result, most of what they saw were similar posts
from other new people.
You could look at it as an injection of a whole lot of fresh
ideas and enthusiasm, or as an annoying flooding of `our' discussion
list with irrelevant mail.
Me, I lean to the former interpretation. Especially since I see
signs of things settling down now.
Perhaps if people who would like more on-topic discussion could take
the time to actually write some, then the newer people would have a chance
to work out what it is we're supposed to be discussing, eh?
luke
PS:
Kumquat, my reaction to your (lengthy) plea (for people to try to
get back onto the subject) being followed by Shadowdancer's instant
response of `What the hell's a Kumquat', was to crack up.
Things seem to be cooling down, for the most part. Hopefully, by now,
Shadowdancer is reconsidering his plan to unsubscribe.
PPS:
I hope none of you mind some of these mails being forwarded to a friend
whose Phd thesis is turning into Alchemy and the Internet.
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 20:21:00 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Why Decker Suck :-)
In-Reply-To: <199410270228.MAA29516@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Marc A
Renouf"
at Oct 26, 94 10:22:48 pm
Marc writes:
> Am I the only GM who likes to run deckers? I get the impression
> that everyone things deckers are a total waste of time. Why is that?
> They add such an incredible element to the campaign!
> Has anyone else out there ever participated in an all-decker
> campaign? What a riot...
Deckers are vital to most campaigns, but they really suck as PC material.
Too much time ends up getting devoted to the decker and his decking, with
the rest of the team sitting there and saying "Hey, I know, how 'bout we cut
power to the entire city block?" and "Yeah, what a great idea, it'll both
knock out all the security in the building, and get this damn decker outa
the matrix so we can get on with this run!". And as someone pointed out, the
quick resolution methods in VR somewhat lose the point of decking. I find
that either running the deckers part of the game before hand (and then
having the decker a multi use character so he can participate in the run
normally), or using two GMs like they do at some cons works pretty well. Of
course neither of these options are particularily convienient, so NPC
deckers usually abound, sinse they are really easy to run, it's just a case
of GM decides.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 20:23:51 +1000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Damion Milliken <u9467882@***.EDU.AU>
Subject: Re: Spirit Possesion.
In-Reply-To: <199410270930.TAA10700@****.cc.uow.edu.au> from "Iz The
Wiz!" at
Oct 27, 94 09:26:00 am
Someone writes:
> What would happen if a free spirit with the power of possesion, possessed a
> decker, then tried to jack into the matrix? Would the spirit be able to
> interface with the matrix or not?
I would say yes, since when a spirit posseses someone it obtains access to
all of the persons skills and abilities, so they could merely use a persons
body to interface with the matrix for them, and just receive the sensory
input themselves, as well as issue commands. Great when you're up against
black ICE too, 'cause then the persons body cops the deadly damage, and the
spirit gets away scot free.
--
Damion Milliken University of Wollongong e-mail: u9467882@***.edu.au
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GE -d+(d) H s++:-- !g p? !au a18 w+ v(?) C+(++) US++ P? L !3 E?
N K- W+ M@ !V po@ Y(+) t+ !5 !j R+(++) G(+)('') !tv(--)@ b++ D+
B? e+ u@ h* f(+) !r n--(----) !y+
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 09:02:22 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Gareth Owen <glowen1@*****.NHS.GOV.UK>
Subject: Please don't leave shadowdance
In-Reply-To: <9410270052.aa06251@****.demon.co.uk> from "Shadowdancer" at
Oct
26, 94 07:45:50 pm
Shadowdancer,
Your beliefs and world view are different from mine.
This is a good thing.
Really.
Please stay on the list, we need people with different opinions,
different views, different ideas. Without these things there's
no point to having the list.
Sometimes we hit topics that get us heated up. I have a physics degree
so science is an important thing to me, I get worked up about it
sometimes.
So what do you say? Will you stick around?
GLO
--
Gareth Owen | Mail: glowen1@*****.nhs.gov.uk
Sytems Programmmer | Phone: (UK) 0495 765021
Gwent Health Authority | "Reboot it from orbit, it's the only way to be sure"
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 11:43:10 MET
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Paolo Marcucci <marcucci@***.TS.ASTRO.IT>
Subject: Re: Why Decker Suck :-) (fwd)
Damion (in response to Marc) wrote things about deckers and the inability
to use them effectively in gaming terms.
So, if the standard SR2 rules actually stops the game for a while and the
fast resolution system from VR is a kind of a cheat for the decker and all
the toys he can have, why not design a new, fast, original, chromed and
plausible :) matrix run system?
Something that keeps track of the decker stats, the deck, the programs
and all the toys (routers, dampers, etc...) in a usable way. I hate to
have to wait for VR2 to get some working rules....
Bye, Paolo
PS: maybe with cards? I was trying to implement a computer program to
emulate a deck, but, given that my players are not always computer-literate,
that would take more time to teach them how to move the mouse than really
perform the run. And it takes away something from the game experience,
ya see, "the black no-headed golem attacks you with whirlwind arms" is
quite difficult to implement in Windows :)
--
________________________________________________________________________
Paolo Marcucci marcucci@***.ts.astro.it
<a href="http://www.oat.ts.astro.it/marcucci/home.html">My Home
Page</a>
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 10:00:03 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Gareth Owen <glowen1@*****.NHS.GOV.UK>
Subject: Re: Back to Shadowrun...
In-Reply-To: <9410270227.aa29342@****.demon.co.uk> from "Marc A Renouf"
at Oct
26, 94 10:22:48 pm
>
> Am I the only GM who likes to run deckers? I get the impression
> that everyone things deckers are a total waste of time. Why is that?
> They add such an incredible element to the campaign!
> Has anyone else out there ever participated in an all-decker
> campaign? What a riot...
>
> Marc
>
Deckers are difficult to run well, IMHO, without spending too much
time on them, leaving everyone else twiddling their thumbs. I tend
to use deckers as support characters (NPC's mostly) or use 'one roll'
resolution of netruns. In my mercrun campaign I'm trying to give
deckers a real element of difference (failing miserably so far), i.e.
most characters won't understand their world, they use their own
slang, etc.
I like the idea of the all decker game though.
Hmmmm.
GLO (hey, I need a nickname)
--
Gareth Owen | Mail: glowen1@*****.nhs.gov.uk
Sytems Programmmer | Phone: (UK) 0495 765021
Gwent Health Authority | "Reboot it from orbit, it's the only way to be sure"
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 07:48:12 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Wow, Reality. That's a switch" <MHILLIARD@****.ALBION.EDU>
Subject: Re: Why Decker Suck :-)
I've never played a decker anywhere but ShadowTK, but I ran a Netrunner
in a Cyberpunk 2020 game and it raised the same problems. At first, while
I was wreaking havoc in the Net the other players would sit around, twiddle
their thumbs, or poke their nose into a sourcebook. But we came up with a
solution. A quick trip for pizza, caffeine. and other essential victuals
*grin* was SOP in those days. It used to be before the game started, but we
got the bright idea to do it while I was hijacking data. Then the only person
who had cause to complain was me, 'cus they always screwed up my order. =)
It also provided some roleplaying opportunities, when I took a greenie along
with and she tripped some Watchdog ICE. The other characters had to break
us out of jail.
Another solution is to give all the players some facility with decking. We
all use Internet, and I sure as hell wouldn't call myself a hacker! This is
actually easier in SR than Cyberpunk-all you need is a datajaclk
and the
Computer skill. (In CP you need a neural processor with a cybermodem link,
interface plugs, AND the Interface skill, which only the Netrunner character
class can get).
Phelan
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 08:43:20 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Chris Lubrecht <lubrecht@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: Paranoia
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, Stainless Steel Rat wrote:
> >>>>> "Chris" == Chris Lubrecht <lubrecht@***.EDU>
writes:
>
> Chris> so Rat.....exactly how old are you?
>
> I turned 27 last week.
>
> Chris> Should we be refering to you as the venerable Rat? (as Bede cringes)
> Chris> :-)
>
> Hooo boy. I'm not /that/ old :)
>
Hey! Were the same age!!! Cool!
I was thinking of the sign...Welcome to Shadow Dales
Here have some pudding.
Nigel
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 08:45:51 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Chris Lubrecht <lubrecht@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: Immortality and Elves vs. Science and Laws of Nature
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, The Dragon wrote:
> I'd have to believe the witch part!
>
> I'm got some *friends* coming in this weekend to do some RUNS.
> These people play with munckins the likes of witch you have never
> seen. Anybody got some GOOD *evil grin* ideas on how I wack these
> guys. I've got some ideas, but was hoping to get some real classy
> ending to these sad as they characters!
>
Wel...dragons are a start, also "big f***ing guns" :-)
Nigel
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 08:50:15 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Chris Lubrecht <lubrecht@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: The "Real" World
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, Magister wrote:
> You better watch out, you young whippersnapper. I'd hate to have to
> bop you with my +2 Staff of Thwapping. The Rat is older than I am by
> a measly year. Us old folk can run with the best of you kiddies.
> Geriatrically
yours
> The Magister
>
> "I have been, and shall always be...a mage"
>
That makes me older than you by a year! Pass me the Geritol. :-)
Nigel
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 08:59:15 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Chris Lubrecht <lubrecht@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: SR newbies...
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, Magister wrote:
> Didn't you know that Magic TOG is nothing but crack for gamers???
> Everyone I know that has gotten into it, has boxes and boxes of the
> silly things. It is a highly addictive thing can will drain your wallet
> and kill off brain cells. It is evil and should be stopped.
> <Flame Off>
> Post-Flame: Anyone who has trouble distinguishing fantasy from
> reality has no business playing ANY RPG.
> Still smoking,
> The Magister
>
I think you are being harsh here. Magic:TG is not crack, rather it is a
religion. Please come join us. I don't smoke pot, I do hug Scryb
sprites :-)
Nigel
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 09:15:30 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Chris Lubrecht <lubrecht@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: Why Decker Suck :-)
There is a third school of thought here. (sorry I did not quote Damion's
post...can't figure out my editor). The third school is....
one action=one action....as I remember it, ony travel in the matrix is
fast, if ya wanna do something it takes place in real time. Run both
matrix and decker at the same time. This is the method used in my games
and it works pretty good.
Nigel
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 09:15:11 EDT
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: James Nichols <JMNICH00@****.UKY.EDU>
Subject: concerts
Well, we're not talking 'bout high explosives we're talking about a show
billed as using illusions.
As far as a neo-religious experience, (damn I hate the cheesy system i have to
use, can't remember exactly what you said) I could see a band of muscians/magic
ally active types who might have met in the Magick Dept. in a local university.
Mages wouldn't be uptight about it, and shamans of the more playful totems woul
d probably love to be rock stars (Coyote does come readily to mind). They migh
t look at it as a chance to show people some of the cool and (relatively)
harmless things magic can do.
And as far as the crowd/band link goes, (if I misremember, sue me =) )
If you don't want to look at it as a ritual look at it as a positive (helpful)
background count. You have a bunch of people who generally are all focused on
the band and have a high emotional state. (of course if the band is having a
crappy show it could work the other way)
And another thought occured to me, if the band started small and worked it's
way up thru the ranks, everybody would know to expect some illusion type stuff.
Two asides:
1: How was the Green Day show?
2: Well Terry, after that discourse on CARPS, I guess Mask will have to take
Gemini and the Kid out for a few rounds of (echoing booming voice) Dwarven
Hammers and Wet Carp shooters. <heh>
James Nichols
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 08:44:35 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Firepower <DVANDERS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: INvisIBility/science/magic/reality
Pardon me. Are you actually stating that an Elf, Homo Nobilus, is
capable of the life eternal? As a vampire, I would strongly disagree.
(not really a vampire, but I play one in Shadowrun).
I recall no Immune to Age statement in the SRII sourcebook: at
least not pertaining to homo nobilus. In fact, should we create a 0
allocation choice on the master character generation list for this kind
of thing?
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 12:24:32 +0000
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Gareth Owen <glowen1@*****.NHS.GOV.UK>
Subject: Re: Grenades...
In-Reply-To: <9410270024.aa26476@****.demon.co.uk> from "JOHANNA
BURWELL-KALES" at Oct 26, 94 05:10:42 pm
>
> Who can really argue the usefulness of grenades. They can be
> timed, trip-wired, thrown with out harm to you, used in a gun, dropped,
> pu in someones mouth ( as in wanted dead or alive with Rutger Hauer), and
> other possibilities exist. By far they are the most deadly weapon in
> SR. Utilizing the chunky-salsa effect described in SRII, a player can
> take out 2 to 3 people in one shot. Also, who says you should be allowed
> to save for a called and smartgunned head shot? On any race, a head shot
> kills in one hit, logicaly. What do you think. who can argue against the
> use of grenades to cause widespread panic?
>
Don't forget grenades come in a variety of 'flavours', offensive,
defensive, smoke, flash and white phosphorous (my personal favourite).
A PC in one of my games once killed a mini adventure stone dead by
lobbing a grenade into a cave. Killed the Wendigo and all his cronies
in one shot. Not recommended for hostage rescues though.
Actually he has a grenade launcher built into his cyberarm. He's
planning on using it sometime by grabbing someone's face, forcing
them to open their mouth and firing.
Can we say 'splat'?
See ya
GLO (still considering a moniker)
--
Gareth Owen | Mail: glowen1@*****.nhs.gov.uk
Sytems Programmmer | Phone: (UK) 0495 765021
Gwent Health Authority | "Reboot it from orbit, it's the only way to be sure"
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 08:52:46 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Firepower <DVANDERS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: SR newbies...
Hi. Just joined up yesterday. I'm 26 now, and have been
roleplaying since the original D&D came out (yes, my parents worry,
which is why I keep the GPA up there). I agree with your description
of many gamers. Granted, a character should be roleplayed to the
hilt--if not, what are you playing for? But the death of a character is
not the absolute end of the world. Although it is annoying when a
maniacal GM kills that guy you spent 2 hours creating <no, this never
happens to me>.
Keep in mind, Shadowrun is a form of entertainment. Like all
entertainment, it is a form of escape from reality. Let's keep in mind
this simple fact. For many people gaming is the best escape there
is-- a way to run away and be a hero (or villian), a person they can't
be in real life.
I also agree that "magic" is, as Stalin would say, the "opiate of the
gamer." However, with the amount of money it's inventor is making,
I wish I'd thought of it first!
Mages rule,
FIREPOWER
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 08:54:48 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Firepower <DVANDERS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Grenades...
Even better, check out the new grenade launcher pistol in Fields
Of Fire, the new Mercs book. This is truly a bitchin' weapon, carrying
6 grenades in a package more concealable than a Pred II.
Gun nut,
FIREPOWER
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 09:05:05 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Firepower <DVANDERS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Many things...
Subliminals are usually flashed on a viewing medium very
quickly--we're talking well under a second. Any skillful person can
add subliminals to a video presentation---I've tried "give me an A"
messages on some of my own editing work (I'm a Broadcasting
major.).
So far I have recieved A grades. But I hope that this is just my
work, and not the sublims.
No one is certain of their effectiveness--and so far there is no Mass
Mind Conrol spell on the books.
SO FAR.
Fellow psycho
FIREPOWER
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 10:11:30 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "C. Paul Douglas" <granite@*****.NET>
Subject: Re: WAS Grenades...Now headshot
In-Reply-To: <199410270023.UAA29623@*****.net>
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, JOHANNA BURWELL-KALES wrote:
Also, who says you should be allowed
> to save for a called and smartgunned head shot? On any race, a head shot
> kills in one hit, logicaly. What do you think.
The only problem is that not all head shots are fatal [in real life that
is]..there was this one guy on TV documentry about suicide [i think] that
tried to blow his own head off by sticking a shotgun under his
chin..Didn't work..he now has no jaw bone and is real hard to understand
when he talks..there have also been cases where [another suicide attempt]
a guy put a gun up to his temple and pulled the trigger..the bullet
traveled under his skin and exit on the other side of his head..And there
have even been cases where penetration was made into the brain but the
people didn't die..Documented cases go all the way back to the Civil War
[US Version 2.0] one soldier [I think he was a blue coat] was shot
through the head and survived..The man was completely normal..BUT..he
could become violent at little provocation..I even know of a friend of my
inlaws that had a similar injury except he also has some memory loss...So
it is my opinion that even headshots should get to be saved
against..Althought they should DEFFINATELY have some heavy plusses added
to the target number...
-----------------------------GRANITE
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 11:01:55 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Matt Hufstetler <gt2778a@*****.GATECH.EDU>
Subject: Re: Astral Space <>Space ?
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@******.GATECH.EDU
In-Reply-To: <199410261050.GAA18307@*****.gatech.edu> from "Stefan
Willkofer"
at Oct 26, 94 11:50:14 am
>
> >
> > I would think that they live on some undiscovered metaplane.
> >
> Don't you think that Space is an undiscovered realm of Astral
> Space? Noone except the mage in Eye-Witness (that was the module)
> was ever beyond the biospere. And in the Neo-A's Guide to Real Life
> another guy said he saw something out there. (It's in the chapter
> about suborbitals.) And the Horrors bring bad, corrupted mana with
> them. This bad mana can also come from the lifeless, empty Space.
You have a point, but since I don't have Eye Witness handy.....
The only real evidence that I have reguarding this is:
1) if they come from space, why couldn't they enter anytime they want?
(They are NOT vermatious knids)
2) since space is lifeless(for sake of argument), wouldn't there be NO
mana, instead of bad mana?
3) what the hell is this 'bridge' Harlequin was talking about with that
thing in the shortstory?
question three is the one that gets me. Why couldn't they be
Martians? <*SNICKER*> Sorry, that is just too stupid. There have to be
lots of metaplanes we haven't discovered yet. There has to be a metaplane
of Cockroach, Ant, and Mantis right? Why not just a metaplane of only
horrors? (Wow, the horror totem.....nasty.)
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 11:08:33 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Matt Hufstetler <gt2778a@*****.GATECH.EDU>
Subject: Re: DeathTraps
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@******.GATECH.EDU
In-Reply-To: <199410262033.QAA20761@*****.gatech.edu> from "The Dragon"
at Oct
26, 94 10:47:34 am
>
> I'd have to believe the witch part!
>
> I'm got some *friends* coming in this weekend to do some RUNS.
> These people play with munckins the likes of witch you have never
> seen. Anybody got some GOOD *evil grin* ideas on how I wack these
> guys. I've got some ideas, but was hoping to get some real classy
> ending to these sad as they characters!
>
Send them on a run and fill the place with booby traps. Ever seen the
book of traps? How about this. A pit + A Monofilament Net = Cube Steak.
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 08:35:25 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Adam Getchell <acgetche@****.UCDAVIS.EDU>
Subject: Re: Reality doesn't bite
In-Reply-To: <9410270102.AA24661@********.engr.ucdavis.edu>
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, Shadowdancer wrote:
> I thought the chinese created gunpowder.....
Correct. About 1074 A.D. or thereabouts, if I don't misremember
my history. ;-)
> -SHADOWDANCER-
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
|Adam Getchell|acgetche@****.engr.ucdavis.edu | ez000270@*******.ucdavis.edu |
| acgetchell |"Invincibility is in oneself, vulnerability is in the opponent"|
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 11:38:37 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Matt Hufstetler <gt2778a@*****.GATECH.EDU>
Subject: Re: INvisIBility/science/magic/reality
Comments: To: SHADOWRN%HEARN.BITNET@******.GATECH.EDU
In-Reply-To: <199410271347.JAA07213@*****.gatech.edu> from "Firepower" at
Oct
27, 94 08:44:35 am
> Pardon me. Are you actually stating that an Elf, Homo Nobilus, is
> capable of the life eternal? As a vampire, I would strongly disagree.
> (not really a vampire, but I play one in Shadowrun).
> I recall no Immune to Age statement in the SRII sourcebook: at
Not every elf. That seems to be most of what everyon is griping about.
Only a select few elves seem to live forever. I would attribute that to
powerful magicks anyway.
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 08:42:49 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Adam Getchell <acgetche@****.UCDAVIS.EDU>
Subject: Re: Back to Shadowrun...
In-Reply-To: <9410270226.AA25187@********.engr.ucdavis.edu>
On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, Marc A Renouf wrote:
> Has anyone else out there ever participated in an all-decker
> campaign? What a riot...
Quite, I agree. They decided to go after someone had done them
dirty, and so they hacked into *every* single bank in Seattle looking for
his name (since they were operating out of a Bison with a SatLink, they
weren't too worried about Trace IC). Finally found his account, and a
few others matching his name/identity.
The things they did to his credit wasn't pretty ....
He also got a mild surprise when a seemingly innocuous credstik
slot melted down his 'stik.
> Marc
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
|Adam Getchell|acgetche@****.engr.ucdavis.edu | ez000270@*******.ucdavis.edu |
| acgetchell |"Invincibility is in oneself, vulnerability is in the opponent"|
+-------------+---------------------------------------------------------------+
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 11:48:32 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Bryan D. Jones" <bdj@****.UARK.EDU>
Subject: Fwd: Re: German Novel Translations
Straight from the DLoH himself.
>
>---------------------
>Forwarded message:
>Subj: Re: question
>Date: 94-10-25 21:11:32 EDT
>From: FASA Tom
>To: Quarm
>
>We're looking at the German novels with regard to their publication in
>English. No firm verdicts have been reached, but The Torn Land probably will
>see print at some point. When, I have no idea. :)
>
>Adios!
>
>Tom
>
--
Bryan D. Jones Internet:bdj@****.uark.edu
GAT d--(-) H-- s:- g- p? au- a- w+ v(?) C++(++++)(---) US++>+++ P--- L+ 3-
E--- N+ K W+(--)(---) M(-) V(--) po Y+ t+ 5-- j R>+++ G' tv+ b+++ D++
B--- e+ u--- h(+) f r>+ n+ y+
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 13:31:39 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Alex van der Kleut <sommers@*****.UMICH.EDU>
Subject: Re: Astral Space <>Space ?
In-Reply-To: <199410271515.LAA00912@*****.engin.umich.edu>
Want a really scary thought? What if the Horrors are mages from another
planet? Their planet is magical all the time, but everyone there is a
kick-ass mage (or whatever). Every couple thousand years the mana is
strong enough to create an astral plane that comes close to our astral
plane. The tough ones create an astral bridge linking the two and voila!
Instant roast people. It's a liittle weak, but its got potential.
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 12:56:29 +0600
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Jeff Norrell <norrell@*******.ME.UTEXAS.EDU>
Subject: Astral Question...
In an attempt to make things interesting for the SR party I'm gm'ing, I
decided to throw in a little inclement weather...
The problem is that I've got little idea how rain and thunderstorms would
affect a mage astrally projecting.
Any ideas?
-Jeff
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 13:01:13 +0600
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Jeff Norrell <norrell@*******.ME.UTEXAS.EDU>
Subject: Re: Grenades...
Remember the best result of grenades...
FUBAR...
(Obscure 'Tango and Cash' reference. Sorry about that.)
-Jeff
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 14:12:21 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Organization: The Happy Fun Ball Brigade
Subject: Re: Astral Question...
In-Reply-To: Jeff Norrell's message of Thu, 27 Oct 1994 12:56:29 +0600
<9410271756.AA15540@*******.me.utexas.edu>
>>>>> "Jeff" == Jeff Norrell
<norrell@*******.ME.UTEXAS.EDU> writes:
Jeff> The problem is that I've got little idea how rain and thunderstorms
Jeff> would affect a mage astrally projecting.
Not at all. Rain, snow, sleet, hail, tornadoes, etc., are all physical,
non-living phenomena, so they have little to no astral presence.
--
Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> |Do not use Happy Fun Ball on concrete.
http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox|
PGP Public Key: Ask for one today! |
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 11:20:40 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Erik S Jameson <esj@***.UUG.ARIZONA.EDU>
Subject: Astral Space & Grenades
First off, really quick, grenades kind of have a bad name in our
campaign, at least before FoF came out. You see, we all have at least
Light Security Armor and enough dice to roll that normal grenades did
jack didly squat. A 2 or 3S is pretty damn easy to resist...
On the astral space/horrors thing, one of our GM's came up with the idea,
before any of us had neard of the horrors, that space was where Cthulhu
and the rest of those badies resided. This was when we were heavily
involved in fighting our own SR versions of Cthulhu. So maybe this idea
that the Horrors "live" in space isn't that far out. I don't know enough
about ED to rally know, but maybe they are in stasis or something out in
space, waiting for enough mana on earth to reach them and wake them up.
Kind of like "that which is dead can eternal lie, and with strange aeons
even death may die" or whatever teh quote is. Just an idea...
Erik, a.k.a. the Whistler
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 19:29:26 --100
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stefan Willkofer <stefan.willkofer@*****.PHYSIK.UNI-REGENSBURG.DE>
Subject: Re: Astral Space <>Space ?
> You have a point, but since I don't have Eye Witness handy.....
> The only real evidence that I have reguarding this is:
> 1) if they come from space, why couldn't they enter anytime they want?
> (They are NOT vermatious knids)
What if the astral space is like a sphere surrounding Earth. In times of
low mana level this sphere decreases in size so that it effectively goes
way below Earth's surface. Therefore the Dwarfs could live in their kaer
below the Rhein-Ruhr-Megaplex. In times of a high mana Level this sphere
expands and grows, grows even beyond the border of orbit. When orbit's and
Earth's astral planes come close in this way, the Horrors can build a bridge
to cross the barrier(in other words, the bridge needn't be so big and therefore
easier to build).
> 2) since space is lifeless(for sake of argument), wouldn't there be NO
Lifeless on the physical plane, agreed. But on the astral plane, ...
> There have to be
> lots of metaplanes we haven't discovered yet. There has to be a metaplane
> of Cockroach, Ant, and Mantis right? Why not just a metaplane of only
> horrors? (Wow, the horror totem.....nasty.)
>
I think the Insect Spirits and the Horrors come from the same plane, insect
spirits (= Invae) are a lesser form of Horrors.
And WHEN will Harlequinn's Back be released? Any date known?
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 13:35:48 +0600
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Jeff Norrell <norrell@*******.ME.UTEXAS.EDU>
Subject: Re: Astral Question...
Jeff> The problem is that I've got little idea how rain and thunderstorms
Jeff> would affect a mage astrally projecting.
Rat>Not at all. Rain, snow, sleet, hail, tornadoes, etc., are all physical,
Rat>non-living phenomena, so they have little to no astral presence.
The real problem for me though (and this is probably getting a little nit-
picky) is what about microorganisms in water; rain, sea, or whatever?
In a previous discussion about astral safeguards against mages, reference was
made to a barrier of vegetation or a layer of 'primordial ooze' (which was
also included in 'Burning Bright'). How large does something have to be to
interfere with an astral mage?
Lastly, consider a vine-covered wall, we're talking to thick to see through.
In astral space that should be perceived as a solid barrier. Could a mage
bash his way through the barrier or would he knock himself silly? Would the
shock in astral space pull him back to his body?
Thanks again.
-Jeff
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 14:44:04 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@***.NEU.EDU>
Organization: The Happy Fun Ball Brigade
Subject: Re: Astral Question...
In-Reply-To: Jeff Norrell's message of Thu, 27 Oct 1994 13:35:48 +0600
<9410271835.AA15591@*******.me.utexas.edu>
>>>>> "Jeff" == Jeff Norrell
<norrell@*******.ME.UTEXAS.EDU> writes:
Jeff> The real problem for me though (and this is probably getting a little
Jeff> nit- picky) is what about microorganisms in water; rain, sea, or
Jeff> whatever?
Take the same attitude that FASA does: "what?" :).
--
Rat <ratinox@***.neu.edu> |Ingredients of Happy Fun Ball include an
http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/ratinox|unknown glowing substance which fell to
PGP Public Key: Ask for one today! |Earth, presumably from outer space.
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 15:14:06 -0400
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Sandman <SANDS@******.JUNIATA.EDU>
Subject: Initiative Q
Wow, I used to rarely get two digests in a day; now it' becoming
regular...
Of, Magister? A kumquat is a fruit, not a vegetable. In fact for those
who want to know (which is next to none):
kumquat 1. A tree or shrub of the genus Fortunella, bearing a small,
edible, orange-like fruit. 2. The citrus fruit of the kumquat, with an
acid pulp and a thin edible rind.
From the Houghton Mifflin College Dictionary, BTW.
I'm glad to see the flames are dying down... my stock of heat-resistant
ablative tiles was getting low. Kudos to all the apologies. I'll vouch
for Kumquat; I've seen him on before. (And this is my third year on here,
so don't start in on me. :) )
And now for a question to start some interesting discussions, perhaps:
Using the assumption of Rule of Sixes being in effect for initiative
rolls, (my group uses it, so no "You can't do that!" arguments, please)
would you also apply the Rule of Ones to initiative? Why or why not,
and if so, what would be some results of succumbing to the Rule (humorous
and/or fatal. heh ;) )
That should get some interesting responses. Maybe J.D. can even pull
some of it for NERPS... Ain't I generous? :) :)
Sandman
: Jon Sands aka Sandman ^ "You disobeyed my direct order. :
: sands@******.juniata.edu ^ You placed yourself in grave danger. :
: Snail: 1168 Juniata College ^ I am _not_ happy." :
: Huntingdon, PA 16652 ^ -Capt. Picard, "Interface" :
: **** "He hits and... I think I'm going to need more dice..." **** :
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 14:19:10 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Magister <MELLIOTT@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Addendum 2 Decker Discussion
I just read something in The Grimoire(2nd ed.) that pertains to the
decker discussion. It was saying that deckers are a lot like mages,
whereas, they have to dedicate their lives to their craft. Deckers are
a different bunch, but, highly useful for recon before a run. Our decker
is real good at gaining control of a buliding's systems for our use.
Fun things like, security cameras, elevators, alarm systems. She's
good at what she does and really doesn't like going out on runs. She
is invaluable to us anyway. IMHO, every group needs a good decker
as much as a good mage.
Arcanely yours,
The Magister
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 14:18:23 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "The Kumquat <smirk>" <CRF_BROWNJT@***.CUIS.EDU>
Organization: Concordia University Information Systems, River Forest, Il.
Subject: GM's And Storytelling
First off,
I'd like to say that perhaps my flaming of many of the new people on this list
could be construed as a little harsh, but it was not meant to be taken
personally, and I don't think (for the most part) I said anything that wasn't
already standard netiquette. Thanks to Doom, Rasputin and any others for their
support, suggestions, etcetera... but this is not a place for "us against them"
kind of taking sides. I apologize if I offended anyone, But hey, we're all
friends here, neh? I don't "hate" shadowdancer... I don't hate ANYONE if I can
help it, but I just want to make sure that things are fair for everyone...
including those of us who pay for net access.... To all the new people, I say,
Welcome! My point was exactly that posts containing such tidbits of
intelligent jargon such as "frag off!" are of no use to anyone....
Ok, let's put this thread to bed.
For a Shadowrun Question now, I need some input from all of those GM's
listening out there. How do you deal with being descriptive without giving
away what is important... An example. "You walk into the bar, and everything
seems to be normal nightlife, EXCEPT this one guy sitting in the corner
booth.. " Gee, I wonder who I should talk to for this run? <wink,wink>
How can we be effective storytellers? Should we have pre-written descriptions
for every location, person, or other piece of "scenery" the Characters meet?
How can I, as a GM, avoid "leading" the characters around with too-obvious
clues? And, if they are wasting hours on unimportant parts of the adventure,
how can I let them know, without being too obvious as to where they should go?
I'd appreciate any suggestion/discussion.
Just My Two Pence.
The Kumquat.
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 14:38:10 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Wesley W. Walker" <wwalker@****.UARK.EDU>
Subject: Re: INvisIBility/science/magic/reality
In-Reply-To: <199410270057.TAA19765@****.uark.edu>
> Okay, now I am back to normal. I have given up on the immortal elves
> arguement and the science vs. magic arguement because it seemed like we
> were only getting dogmatic beliefs (I could be wrong there), but at least
> NO ONE was stupid enough to post anything like elfboy did.
When I first got on this mailing list...I read that PERSONAL INSULTS WERE
OUT OF THE QUESTION and punishable by banning from the mailing list.
Whistler's comment is far beyond this. Don't get personal...This is a
public mailing system and your comments aren't really that impressive.
Lay off.
\||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||/
- Wes W. Walker (wwalker@****.uark.edu) * "Truth is well disguised lie and -
- CSCI Major and General Slave * never immediately apparent." -
- Artiste Wanna-be (accepting donations)* -Me -
/||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||\
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 14:44:54 -0500
Reply-To: Kyle Monroe <mk0648@*********.edu>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Kyle Monroe <mk0648@*********.EDU>
Subject: Re: Astral Space <>Space ?
Going on the hypothesis that the Horrors reside in space, possibly what
makes it so horrific to the magically active is the background count?
You've gotta admit that something as nasty as a Horror would have to
generate quite a bit of background count, and with all of 'em up there in
the same place...Geesh! It's easy to see how anyone would have problems
keeping their sanity under those circumstances.
Kyle Monroe
>>>Glitch<<<
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 15:05:49 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: **Lynx** <ACOLWELL@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Deckers don't suck!!!
sorry boys but i will have to disagree with everyone on the
discussion that claims deckers suck. I myself refuse to play anything
but a decker and i like them. Hypothetical question: How do suppose
you can get your men to the top of a 50 story building if you dumbies
knock out all of the power on the city block??(THINK ABOUT IT!)
Hypothetical questions answer: You need a decker in the matrix(du)
who can control both the security and the elavators. Anyone who
knows decking would know that. And also deckers have that cash
most of the time. Easy access to the banks.!!!!!
Try thinking before you open your mouths next time,
Gotta fly,
**Lynx**
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 15:31:00 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: The Dragon <JMEYER@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
You don't seem to understand. If I wright the RUN I AM THE GM!
Therefore It would be my guidelines I'm checking with. COOL!
Lead, follow, Do what cha like, but stay out of MY way!
-------The Dragon--------
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 15:48:57 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: The Dragon <JMEYER@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: SR newbies...
I couldn't agree more emphaticly!
Lead, follow, Do what cha like, but stay out of MY way!
-------The Dragon--------
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 16:08:09 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Robert A. Hayden" <hayden@*******.MANKATO.MSUS.EDU>
Subject: Re: Deckers don't suck!!!
In-Reply-To: <199410272011.PAA25747@*******.mankato.msus.edu>
The problem isn't that deckers suck, it's that DECKING sucks.
The cinematic presentation of netrunning is time consuming and not even
close to any contemporary thoughts on cyberpunk realism. I am not going
to take an hour or two of game time out so that one person can run his
decker in search of datafiles and Evil Inc.
If FASA had come up with some realistic fast-resolution rules, it would
be much better, but right now it's easier to just make deckers NPCs and
at least enjoy the game.
____ Robert A. Hayden <=> hayden@*******.mankato.msus.edu
\ /__ -=-=-=-=- <=> -=-=-=-=-
\/ / Finger for Geek Code Info <=> I do not necessarily speak for the
\/ Finger for PGP Public Key <=> City of Mankato or anyone else
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GJ/CM d- H-- s-:++>s-:+ g+ p? au+ a- w++ v* C++(++++) UL++++$
P+>++ L++$ 3- E---- N+++ K+++ W M+ V-- -po+(---)>$ Y++ t+ 5+++
j R+++$ G- tv+ b+ D+ B--- e+>++(*) u** h* f r-->+++ !n y++**
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 16:14:33 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: GM's And Storytelling
Kumquat sez:
> that posts containing such tidbits of
> intelligent jargon such as "frag off!" are of no use to anyone....
> Ok, let's put this thread to bed.
I totally and completly disagree. This "tidbit" is part of the SR
universe. It is this jargon that helps make the game unique and adds
to the whole flavor of the game(and this list). It also helps distingush
those who run and those who "adventure"(T$R word). If anyone does
not know what some of this jargon means, either post
questions(private e-mail) or buy one of the novals. Though you may
not pick up on it at first, comprehension will soon follow.
> how can I let them know, without being too obvious as to where they
should go?
> I'd appreciate any suggestion/discussion.
>
>
>
Try some post-run clues. Especially in a different language. Make it
one the players do not know. Also, the bar with the strange guy, say
something like," You walk into your favorite watering hole. As your
eyes adjust( or switch modes), you see the familiar faces of the
regulars, plus some new ones. As you saunter up the the bar to order
your favorite drinks, a loud,hacking choke booms from the back
corner. One of these newbies seems to have drank something he
shouldn't." Make perception roll. Any who make it see," a strange
package fall from the man's hand as he desperatly tries to suppress
his choking. One of the local toughs decides to play around with him
a little. The man does his best to get back the package, but to no
avail. What do you do?"
If your runners are the compasionate type, no prob. But for the
vicious type, try knocking them out. Drop them off in and unfamiliar
place with a totally obvious clue, then frag around with them with very
sublte clues. If they are paranoid enough, they'll pick up, but if not....
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 16:17:52 +0600
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Jeff Norrell <norrell@*******.ME.UTEXAS.EDU>
Subject: Re: GM's And Storytelling
>How do you deal with being descriptive without giving
>away what is important..
That certainly is a problem... What I tend to do is require the players to
make a perception test. Either they roll or I roll for them. Assign some
target number based on ease of test and then use the intelligence or some
appropriate skill for the test basis. However, to keep the players on their
toes, make some random perception tests even where there is nothing to see.
You know, roll some dice, look at them with a thoughtful look, and say something
like, "What a shame" and keep going. Gives players ulcers. It's great.
-Jeff
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 16:22:06 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: The Dragon <JMEYER@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: All this magick vs. science stuff
> > Can be that all it takes is a silly nickname (Buddha) to get you
> peolpe
> > going? Now that, is Truely Funny :: ::
> > \____/
> >
> What is wrong, Dragon? Jealous?????
No, I just it was kind of funny, especialy since i happen to know
BUDDHA.
Lead, follow, Do what cha like, but stay out of MY way!
-------The Dragon--------
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 16:25:18 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Firepower <DVANDERS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: GM's And Storytelling
This is always a problem--unfortunately, you can only do so much
with a story. Sure, you could go into excruciating detail, but, as Doug
Adams once said, boredom doesn't sell.
I have frankly always agonized over the "goon in bar"
problem--sometimes to the point of after--the--game self--kicking and
"what I should have done was..." I certainly don't want to describe
every fraggin' (pardon my streetslang) person in the entire bar!
I try instead to let the runners relax on the floor or at the bar--then
have the trouble come to them... NPCs are always a problem as
well. often my classes won't give me the time to create the kind of
memorable NPCs that I would be a lot happier with...
Dikote flechettes carefully......
FIREPOWER
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 16:31:04 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Astral Space <>Space ?
How about this hypothesis: The horrors do not come from space or a
metaplane. They come from Venus. I have always heard that it is the
sister planet, and though incredibly hot, could support plant and
microbial life. The thesis was that because of the make-up of the
atmosphere and the moisture, plant life would be abundant. This
qualifies for the mana aspect. Maybe there is so much mana that the
horrors could take small excursions into space, providing the
"horrorifing" visions. And when the mana on Earth and Venus was at
its peak, a "bridge" like Stefan was speaking about would form. This
would corralate with the fact that horrors destroy everything in their
paths. Hang around Venus for a while, food gets low, weak horrors
get eaten by big horrors, mana rises, bridge forms, horrors go to
Earth, eat for a while, and Venus restores herself until the mana
lessen again. Sound OK?
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 16:05:24 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: ELFBOY <MBAKER@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Erik,akaWhistler>FLAME ON--elfboy's above comment has to be one
of the
STUPIDEST I HAVE EVER HEARD!!!!! Good God boy, what are you
thinking?
Eb>Well, at least your barbaric nature shines true. I understand
that vampires wish immortality to be uniquely theirs, but tough
drek. I mean get real yourself, what the hell kind of attack was that. I
know, being a vampire makes it hard to come up with a viable
argument, being occupied by your sole thought-blood lust. But your
inate reflex to harsh my persona clearly represents inability to
comprehend my point of view. If you could see my point of view I
would have appreciated a critical argument of some sort. Open your
mind a bit and free your soul. (Oops. my bad, you're a vampire) good
luck savage.
But hey, Don't let self doubt get in the way of your plans to improve
yourself.
Your feeble attempt to participate in any intelligent conversation only
goes to exaggerate your already pathetic lack of mental ability.--Mark
Lowry.
And remember, no matter where you go, there you are.-Adventures of
Buckaroo Banzai.
Next time please come up with a plausable argument rather that
blatant insults. But if that is your nature, so be it.
ELFBOY
"Eternal youth is yours, gift or curse, make of it
what you will."-Elfqueen
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 14:55:21 -0700
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: JOHANNA BURWELL-KALES <burwell@******.EDU>
Subject: Re: Grenades, Weirdos, and thanx to marc...
In-Reply-To: <199410270436.VAA04820@****-office.nevada.edu>
grenades can also be used in place of car bombs, trash can bombs
and even be tapped to carts.
In an adventure with my character named "Arnold." I was hired to
take out a corporate official at a dinner party. So being a rather buff
and austrian speaking waiter, I wheeled out a cart. Underneath the cloth
draping over the side I had my character tape about 6 grenades. The pins
would be pulled by fishline conected to the bottom of the plate. The
detonator switches had weights taped on to them. Enough to start the
reaction. Arnold leaves to get Pepper for the dish and the busboy
arrives and pulls the dish off of the cart. Resulting explosion killed 5
people and a busboy. Arnold meanwhile was busy rappeling to his
motorcycle in the parking garage dressed as a Moty the motorcycle riding
clown.
Thanx marc about the suggested reading on head shots. I'll look
for any of them if I can find them...
Later, sorry for the long message everybody
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 16:57:38 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Legality ratings
Legality ratings. In your post, it was 6p-ca correct? The 6 is the
target number for an authority to recognize that that piece is illegal.
The P means permit can be gotten. The CA is a type of code. This
one means cyberware class A I believe. See Shadotech for a full list.
If you do not have or can purchase one, I will post it at request.
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 17:13:51 -0500
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: "Robert A. Hayden" <hayden@*******.MANKATO.MSUS.EDU>
Subject: ADMIN: LISTEN UP!
I'm sick of the petty flames and pointless spamming.
If you keep it up I'm gonna nuke ya permanently, got it?!!!!
Grow up folx.
____ Robert A. Hayden <=> hayden@*******.mankato.msus.edu
\ /__ -=-=-=-=- <=> -=-=-=-=-
\/ / Finger for Geek Code Info <=> I do not necessarily speak for the
\/ Finger for PGP Public Key <=> City of Mankato or anyone else
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
(GEEK CODE 2.1) GJ/CM d- H-- s-:++>s-:+ g+ p? au+ a- w++ v* C++(++++) UL++++$
P+>++ L++$ 3- E---- N+++ K+++ W M+ V-- -po+(---)>$ Y++ t+ 5+++
j R+++$ G- tv+ b+ D+ B--- e+>++(*) u** h* f r-->+++ !n y++**
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 17:55:34 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Shadowdancer <BRIDDLE@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: ADMIN: LISTEN UP!
Done did. Did you not read the numorous apologies and anti-flame
lit.?:-)
Many people run the shadows, praying that whatever gods they worship will smile upon them.
I waltz through shadows with my gods, and I lead!
-SHADOWDANCER-
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 1994 17:57:56 EST
Reply-To: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
Sender: Discussion of the Fantasy game ShadowRun <SHADOWRN@*****.BITNET>
From: Star <KADAMS@*****.VINU.EDU>
Organization: Vincennes University, Shake LRC
Subject: Re: Back to Shadowrun...
The only problem is that our group had a decker that neglected to get
the program "auto exe." and he was our only decker. The other 6
members of the party, myself included, got tired of the incessent dice
rolling and we had nothing to do for about two hours. A simple matrix
run that with this program would take 10 min. turned into a complete
matrix battle that lasted around an hour and a half.
The is nothing wrong with deckers, if the people playing tham know
how.
