| From: | Steve Kenson <TalonMail@***.COM> |
|---|---|
| Subject: | Re: Spirit Combat |
| Date: | Mon, 22 Dec 1997 15:40:44 -0500 |
>For argument's sake (and just to be a total bastard about this :) what would
>you consider ramming a spirit with a vehicle to be?
Non-melee combat. The spirit gets its full armor rating (twice it's Force)
against the impact. Running down an elemental or nature spirit isn't going to
hurt it a whole lot unless you've got a BIG vehicle with a LOT of momentum.
Even a vehicle "backed" by a rigger's will doesn't constitute a "melee
attack" IMHO.
Gurth <gurth@******.NL> wrote:
>> * Magical weapons (weapon foci) ignore the spirit's Armor. This includes
the
>> Killing Hands power of physical adepts.
>With "Armor", do you mean the (2x Essence) armor that spirits get from
>their limited Immunity to Normal Weapons power, or the armor that critters
>like insect spirits have "built in"?
The former. Immunity to Normal Weapons does not protect against magical
attacks like weapon foci, killing hands or spells. Natural armor (like that
of flesh-form bugs) does.
Scott Roberts <shayd@********.NET> wrote:
>I do not believe that this power should apply to any *magical* attacks
>(such as spells including elemental manipulation spells). That is to say,
>I would believe that a spell would target the astral critter, not the
>physical form; manipulations do that too--affect astrally, only primarily
>they ground out physically). They don't strike me as "normal weapons".
I agree that Immunity to Normal Weapons should not affect COMBAT spells
(which bypass armor entirely), but they should (IMHO) affect damaging
manipulations, which create a real, damaging medium (albeit at the usual half
armor rating vs. elemental effects).
>First, a decision must be made about the Power of any physical attacks in
>melee. Is it Willpower? Is it Strength? Even worse, what about the
>dread Monofilament Whip? Do I do 10S in melee combat to a spirit with
>one? These questions need to be answered in SR 3.
Point taken. I'd tend to say Strength off the top of my head, mainly for
simplicity. There probably should be a rule about purely technological
enhancements (i.e., laser cresent axe, dikote, monofilament) not adding any
damage against a spirit.
The other option I've consider is this: allow a mundane willing to engage a
material spirit in melee combat to fight the spirit using his Mental stats
(ala astral combat). In other words, the mundane attacker uses normal combat
skill, with Charisma in place of Strength, doing (Charisma)M damage,
regardless of what weapon the mundo is armed with (the weapon is nothing more
than a symbol, it's real damage is irrelevant). I say Charisma because it's
consistent with how regular astral combat works (and consistency is a goal of
SR3). The upside is the spirit gets NO armor against the attack. In effect,
the mundane is engaging the spirit in a kind of "astral combat" using the
focused power of the mundane's strength of character.
Under this system, you've got two options for melee combat with a spirit:
normal melee, using all of the regular rules, but the spirit has (Force x 2)
hardened armor. So you can use a monowhip against the spirit, but its armor
is going to reduce the Power, and a Force 5+ spirit is invulnerable to it. Or
you can engage the spirit in "spirit combat," doing (Charisma)M (regardless
of weapon), but ignoring the spirit's armor. Against powerful spirits, it may
be a mundane's only option....
Thoughts?
>Second, I would suggest that for Elementals, use of attacks in the
>physical world or spells which use elemental effects that oppose the
>spirit's element would have additional effect.
That's pretty much taken care of under the spirits' various Vulnerabilities
already. If you blast a fire elemental with water, it takes +1 Wound Level
automatically.
Steve K.
