From:	Unknown sender
Subject:	None
Date:	Unknown time and date

And verily, did Paul Gettle hastily scribble thusly...
|If ANYONE else sends their E-Card to Barbie 'me toos' to the list
|instead of airwasp@***.com, I will publicly thwap them too, even if
|they do include a smiley like D.Ghost did.

Does this mean I can THWAP you? He apologised already for sending to
the list, saying he *MEANT* it to be private....

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 11:43:34 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: SThanatos <sthanatos@*********.COM>
Subject: Re: Sense Link and Free Spirits
In-Reply-To: <392c6e81.3568e3cc@***.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 11:21 PM 5/24/98 EDT, you wrote:
>In a message dated 5/24/98 8:46:06 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
>dghost@****.COM writes:
> Can a character "ride" a manifest spirit?

I think what you're refering to, is if ally spirits has the power of 3
dimensional movement when manifested, if their strength is high enough,
could they carry a character on their backs or shoulders or something and
thus allowing the character to 'fly' via the allies 3d movement power.

I don't know, but if the list-gods would like to take this one on, it seems
feasable that if they ally has enough strength to carry the PC, then it
could be possible. Balance may be an issue.

Thanatos
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 12:06:21 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Paul Gettle <pgettle@********.NET>
Subject: Re: [Admin] Fixed, I hope.
In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980525064347.0083de70@****.lis.ab.ca>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

At 06:43 AM 5/25/98 -0600, Adam wrote:
>>There does still appear to be a slight problem with the list
however.
>>Or am I the only one who's getting duplicate postings from some
people?
>>(Including Gurth)
>
>I'm not getting any duplicates..
>
>Anyone else? :)

Out of this morning's batch-o-mail, I have at least two duplicates...
one pair from Jett, and one pair from Robert Watkins.
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--
-- Paul Gettle (pgettle@********.net)
PGP Fingerprint, Key ID:11455339 (RSA 1024, created 97/08/08)
625A FFF0 76DC A077 D21C 556B BB58 00AA
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 12:11:12 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: MC23 <mc23@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: [Admin] Fixed, I hope.
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

Once upon a time, Adam J wrote;

>At 13:33 25/05/98 +0100, you wrote:
>
>>|Good, in that case you don't deserve to be thwapped, IMHO. Had you been
>>|thinking to yourself "I wonder what happens when I set this flag..."
and
>>|ended up crashing the list, that would be another matter :)
>>
>>There does still appear to be a slight problem with the list however.
>>Or am I the only one who's getting duplicate postings from some people?
>>(Including Gurth)
>
>I'm not getting any duplicates..
>
>Anyone else? :)


I've only had one duplicate from Robert Nesius, to date.
weird.

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

Ancient cultures believed that names held great power, personal names
more so and they were guarded very closely. To protect themselves, they
answered to another name, because if another discovered their real name,
it could be used against them.
History repeats itself.
Welcome to the Digital Age.
I am MC23
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 12:35:26 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Question about Barriers
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/25/98 2:35:55 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
nesius@******.COM writes:

> This time the topic is regarding the Physical Barrier spell. Is it
> possible to cast a physical barrier in the "wall form factor," and then
> move that barrier around? I think what the player has in mind is
> dropping down an elevator shaft, and throwing a phsyical barrier
> up against the wall where the doors are and sliding his barrier
> down the wall as he decends in case the doors pop open and people with
> assault rifles are standing there.

This sounds like a Patrick, but I'm probably wrong... :)

> The description for the spell in the BBB describes the spell manifesting
> as either a "dome" or as a "flat wall." A "personal
physical barrier"
> obviously moves around it's caster (right?) - but what about the big full
> blown version?

This is where the confusion between two game systems come up. IIRC, the
actual, factual "Full Blown Version" (aka, non-personal) doesn't move around
at all. Once it is cast, it is cast, and that's it. No mobilities. Now is
that how I have played it in the past? No, but I do believe that is what is
actually is.

For some reason I remember this "Barrier" Conversation coming up before.

> What is the correct interpretation of this?

The -correct- interpretation is whatever works the best to help the game move
along. In that method, even the BBB is wrong fairly consistently.

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 12:43:22 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Insect Totems
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/25/98 3:06:15 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
runefo@***.UIO.NO writes:

<snipped commentary about "Otherwhere" Insect Spirits and similar remarks and
how "Insect Totem" could be rewritten.>

> Ant is the perfect corporate wageslave, but also an asset for any
> runner team.
> --

HOLD ON RIGHT THERE!!!! I do recall very specifically doing this once a LONG
time ago, and it may or may not even be in the Nagee's that Lester has. I
also remember other people getting really upset with me on -this- list as to
this suggestion, one of them was very similar to yourself Rune (nudge nudge).

The idea, I still believe, is a good one. I just don't believe we can view
the "Bug Spirits" the same after that point. IF such a change is made, then
for lack of better terms, the -entire- Bug City Saga would have to be
considered "Toxic Insect Shamans" that are out of control. Not that I don't
see that is possible, especially in light of the other major changes headed
this way, I just don't see it as Probable.

I know we've used similar ideas (-Other- Insect Spirits being -nearly-
playable) in the games. Hell, the time Binder went for the CAS draft and ran
into an Ant Shaman just about caused him to schiz-out (old habits vs. the
newly aquired understandings).

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 12:55:57 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Sense Link and Free Spirits
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/25/98 3:12:36 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
dghost@****.COM writes:

> One more question I didn't think of ... can the spirit/critter power of
> movement affect a magician's Fast astral movement speed?
>
In a word...

NNNN NN OOOOOOOOOOOO
NN NN NN OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
NN NN NN OOOOOO OOOOOO
NN NN NN OOOOOO OOOOOO
NN NN NN OOOOOO OOOOOO
NN NN NN OOOOOO OOOOOO
NN NN NN OOOOOO OOOOOO
NN NN NN OOOOOO OOOOOO
NN NN NN OOOOOO OOOOOO
NN NN NN OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
NN NNNN OOOOOOOOOOOO

:P

Sorry, I just had to do that. In seriousness though, the Movement power of
many spirits is a physical world type of ability, at least that is IMO. My
reasoning for this is that all spirits/being/astral -others- that are known to
date in SR all move at a given "Force x 1000" in the astral, with Magicians
Force being their Magic Attribute.

Now I admit, that I've always wondered if one magician could "carry" another
magician (or similar situation with a Higher Force spirit carrying a "Lower
Force" magician) through the astral at their faster speeds or not.

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 13:05:18 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: [Admin] Fixed, I hope.
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/25/98 7:41:52 AM US Eastern Standard Time, fro@***.AB.CA
writes:

> >There does still appear to be a slight problem with the list however.
> >Or am I the only one who's getting duplicate postings from some people?
> >(Including Gurth)
>
> I'm not getting any duplicates..
>
> Anyone else? :)
>
I have on occasion gotten duplicates from Mongoose and MC23, but it doesn't
appear to be consistent on any basis.

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 13:07:11 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: (Duplicate Alert) Re: The T-shirt - a step-by-step guide
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/25/98 7:46:15 AM US Eastern Standard Time, fro@***.AB.CA
writes:

> Even I get that joke :) (Although it's from reading the NERPS logs..)
>
> So..do we have any volunteers? :)
>
Okay, I'm sending this to let people know. Adam, I did just get this as a
duplicate -after- reading the other Duplicate topic post. So a question
arises, did you do this on purpose to confuse me or what??? :P

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 13:09:17 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Hardsuits
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/25/98 8:08:22 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
MgkellyMP5@***.COM writes:

> <>
>
> It can, but Jym suits are also big and cumbersome. Hard armor is bulky, but
> not anywhere as much as a Jym suit.
>
> Mgkelly
>
KELLY!!!! Two things, get the damn italics off of your postings, those -are-
consistent. Two, please please please please please don't snip so much of the
paragraph that it is no longer recognizable to a newcomer to a thread (or even
a lot of the old comers too ;).

I recognized it (the remark), simply because I'm the one who pointed out Jym
suits in Cyberpirates and the concept of "Power Armor" isn't nearly so far
away. At least not "little suits" of such anyway....

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 13:11:18 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Giving blood in 205X: common or rare?
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/25/98 8:23:46 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
rabiola@**.NETCOM.COM writes:

> Just a thought, but it seems to me that the blood of a real person would
> have much more "power" in if for ritual uses than would clonal types.
> Also, seems to me that the different metatypes would have their own
> types. Just a lay man's opinion, one who donates platlets/plasma on a
> fairly regular basis.
>
You are probably correct on both accounts, but somehow I don't see the
"Metatypes" being so different. At least, from the POV that all of the major
metatypes came from "Human Stock" at some point in the view of the scientists
of the Awakened Age.

I'd be willing to be that an ork can give blood to a human or a dwarf as long
as it meets similar compatibility requirements that we have today.

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 13:12:21 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: (Duplicate Alert) Re: Giving blood in 205X: common or rare?
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/25/98 8:23:48 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
rabiola@**.NETCOM.COM writes:

> Just a thought, but it seems to me that the blood of a real person would
> have much more "power" in if for ritual uses than would clonal types.
> Also, seems to me that the different metatypes would have their own
> types. Just a lay man's opinion, one who donates platlets/plasma on a
> fairly regular basis.
>
Okay folks, WHAT THE HELL!!!!!!!

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 13:15:16 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Idea for Spell Drain
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/25/98 9:32:45 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
Airwasp@***.COM writes:
>
> So, here is my take on how this would work out ...

<snipped out of alignment damage category to drain category to something
category table>

> What do you guys think of it?

I think I am confused. I do think I get what you are saying, but I am not
sure how to measure it or deal with it. Something we are gonna have to talk
about in person...

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 13:15:18 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: MC23 <mc23@**********.COM>
Subject: Duplicate Posts and Revised List
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

Ok, maybe the revised list Friday will cure this bizarre random
duplicate postings. My real question for right now is how will the
transfer from current list to resubscribed list going to be handled? I
don't care to miss any posts and I typically work a 12 hour day Friday.
Will there be overlapping subscriptions for the transfer, or
pre-resubscribing or what?

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

Ancient cultures believed that names held great power, personal names
more so and they were guarded very closely. To protect themselves, they
answered to another name, because if another discovered their real name,
it could be used against them.
History repeats itself.
Welcome to the Digital Age.
I am MC23
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 13:22:05 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Duplicate Posts and Revised List
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/25/98 12:19:26 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
mc23@**********.COM writes:

> Ok, maybe the revised list Friday will cure this bizarre random
> duplicate postings. My real question for right now is how will the
> transfer from current list to resubscribed list going to be handled? I
> don't care to miss any posts and I typically work a 12 hour day Friday.
> Will there be overlapping subscriptions for the transfer, or
> pre-resubscribing or what?
>
I believe we are just going to all "resubscribe" to the list itself. All
inbound mail I guess could be "Held" again like last weekend, and a single
message could be sent out to the "old" list, informing everyone of the
changes. After that message is sent out, the "old list" of addy's is
destroyed or archived and not to be touched again.

Then everyone just starts resubscribing, and after a given amount of time, the
"Held" letters are allowed to flow into the "New List".

-K (thoughts???)
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 13:49:57 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Paul Gettle <pgettle@********.NET>
Subject: Re: [Admin] Fixed, I hope.
In-Reply-To: <989effeb.3569a4cf@***.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

At 01:05 PM 5/25/98 -0400, K wrote:
>>
>I have on occasion gotten duplicates from Mongoose and MC23, but it
doesn't
>appear to be consistent on any basis.

I just got a duplicate of your big ASCII 'No.'

I think the list has gone flakey.

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--
-- Paul Gettle (pgettle@********.net)
PGP Fingerprint, Key ID:11455339 (RSA 1024, created 97/08/08)
625A FFF0 76DC A077 D21C 556B BB58 00AA
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 20:33:45 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: Re: The T-shirt - a step-by-step guide
In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19980525101059.006cf3f4@****.tconl.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

Quicksilver said on 10:35/25 May 98...

> But.. I've been trying to get a response from anyone as to how
> many shirts to expect. How many have been made in past years and how
> many names were included. I've also got a couple ideas for the t-shirt
> layout, but I need to know how many names we're going to have to fit on
> the back.

The numbers were going up each year from 94 to 96; I don't know about 97
because there are no names on the shirt; anyway, the exact numbers are:

1994 shirt: 25 names, at least 26 shirts (I know for certain there's one
person who has a shirt but his name doesn't appear on it)
1995 shirt: 47 names
1996 shirt: 67 names

So from that, I'd say to expect at least some 50 T-shirts, maybe 75 or so.
I think it's best to base the price on the lower value, just to be on the
safe side.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
"You haven't given me a headache. I like you."
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- + --+--
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GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N | the First Church of
o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ | the Sqooshy Ball
tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y? | 21 May 1998
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ + --+--
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 20:33:45 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: Re: Duplicate Posts and Revised List
In-Reply-To: <199805251717.NAA21421@******.mindspring.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

MC23 said on 13:15/25 May 98...

> Ok, maybe the revised list Friday will cure this bizarre random
> duplicate postings. My real question for right now is how will the
> transfer from current list to resubscribed list going to be handled? I
> don't care to miss any posts and I typically work a 12 hour day Friday.
> Will there be overlapping subscriptions for the transfer, or
> pre-resubscribing or what?

The way I understand it, the existing lists (shadowrn@********.itribe.net
et al) will just stay where they are, but we'll all get kicked off of them
by Mark -- IOW he'll reset the subscribers list this coming Friday. Then
you re-subscribe once you've received the "You have been removed from the
ShadowRN list" message, and then all should work as it does now.

Unless I missed something, that's what's going to happen if you ask me.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
"You haven't given me a headache. I like you."
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- + --+--
Version 3.1: | Incubated into
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N | the First Church of
o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ | the Sqooshy Ball
tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y? | 21 May 1998
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ + --+--
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 20:33:44 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: Re: [Admin] Fixed, I hope.
In-Reply-To: <10890.199805251233@******.teach.cs.keele.ac.uk>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

Spike said on 13:33/25 May 98...

> There does still appear to be a slight problem with the list however.
> Or am I the only one who's getting duplicate postings from some people?
> (Including Gurth)

You're not the only one. I haven't seen duplicate posts from myself, but I
have from some others. I'll turn this into a request from me, as GridSec
officer, to everyone not to point this out every time (I know that hasn't
happened much yet, but given time, it will), and to Mark and/or Adam to
try and sort out why this is happening.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
"You haven't given me a headache. I like you."
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- + --+--
Version 3.1: | Incubated into
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N | the First Church of
o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ | the Sqooshy Ball
tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y? | 21 May 1998
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ + --+--
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 20:33:45 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: Re: The T-shirt - a step-by-step guide
In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980525064748.0084f320@****.lis.ab.ca>
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Adam J said on 6:47/25 May 98...

> >Hopefully, they'll arrive in countries outside of North America within
> >about a month, then... If not, I've got four other ShadowRN shirts to help
> >in identifying me :)
>
> What, we can't recognize you from the lovely clear pictures on your page? :)

Dvixen took one of me... I'm dreading the time she gets home and starts
developing her rolls of film...

:)

> ><old-timer joke>beer & hookerz</old-timer joke> :)
>
> Even I get that joke :) (Although it's from reading the NERPS logs..)

You weren't around on the list back then, you're too young to understand
it :)

> So..do we have any volunteers? :)

Unfortunately, not me. I wouldn't mind doing it if it weren't for the fact
that it'd mean receiving quite a lot of money without being able to keep
any of it (no, I'm not saying what it sounds like I'm saying).

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
"You haven't given me a headache. I like you."
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- + --+--
Version 3.1: | Incubated into
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N | the First Church of
o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ | the Sqooshy Ball
tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y? | 21 May 1998
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ + --+--
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 14:37:46 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: NEWSHADOW <NEWSHADOW@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Hijacking
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In a message dated 98-05-25 03:27:45 EDT, you write:

> Does the fact that the three hijackers protested against their home
> province being used as a nuclear testing site change anything?

IMHO is doesn't change much. They endangered a multitude of innocent lives,
making them no better than the government that they were protesting against.
The fact that they were protesting the nukes may have given them better PR
with the population, but it doesn't wash away the crime they committed. When I
say crime, I'm not referring to written laws, but rather to the act of using
innocents as a bargaining chip.

Shadow
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Arena/6852/index.html
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 19:19:02 +0200
Reply-To: "Arno R. Lehmann" <arlehma@***.net>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Arno R. Lehmann" <arlehma@***.NET>
Subject: Re: [Admin] Fixed, I hope.
MIME-Version: 1.0
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On Mon, 25 May 1998 06:43:47 -0600, Adam J wrote:
>I'm not getting any duplicates..
>
>Anyone else? :)

Yes, me.
The one you wrote, for example. Ubiratans, too

Arno
--
Arno
*********************************************************************
Be careful when replying to this mail - check the address !!!
(And send me a note when you notice that
the reply-to-address points to the list!)
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 13:29:40 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Sense Link and Free Spirits

On Mon, 25 May 1998 09:52:02 EDT Airwasp <Airwasp@***.COM> writes:
>In a message dated 5/25/98 12:58:31 AM !!!First Boot!!!,
>sthanatos@*********.COM writes:
>> Can the Ally spirit power of sense link be used to target someone for
a
>spell?

>Yes, as this is basically what Clairvoyance does for the caster also,
and on a
>side note, if the ally is on the other side of the world, the caster has
a
>pretty decent range.
<SNIP>
>Mike

Uhm ... actually if Sense Link works like Clairvoyance, then the answer
would be no ... the description of Clairvoyance says that it can't be
used for spell targeting ... Also Animal Spy from Awakenings says the
same thing ... :/ If Sense link works as K suggested (link a Spotter in
ritual spell casting), then it would work ...

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
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Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 13:33:16 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: [Admin] Fixed, I hope.

On Mon, 25 May 1998 11:33:52 -0400 Tim Kerby <drekhead@***.NET> writes:
>On 25 May 98, at 13:33, Spike wrote:
>> There does still appear to be a slight problem with the list however.
Or
>> am I the only one who's getting duplicate postings from some people?
>> (Including Gurth)

>Nope. Me too. I noticed today duplicates from Spike, Gurth, Adam, and
Bira, >and probably a couple I've missed.
>
>--
>
>=================================================================
> - Tim Kerby - drekhead@***.net - ICQ-UIN 2883757 -
<SNIP Sig>

Me too but not as many .... I think it has been just Gurth so far ...
before the list shut down, I was getting notices every once in a while I
was sending duplicates (which I wasn't) and figured Juno was goofing up
... it seems to have stopped ... :/

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
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Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 13:37:15 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Duplicate Posts and Revised List

On Mon, 25 May 1998 13:22:05 EDT Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM> writes:
>In a message dated 5/25/98 12:19:26 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
>mc23@**********.COM writes:
<SNIP>
>> duplicate postings. My real question for right now is how will the
>> transfer from current list to resubscribed list going to be handled?
I
<SNIP>

>I believe we are just going to all "resubscribe" to the list itself.
All
>inbound mail I guess could be "Held" again like last weekend, and a
single
>message could be sent out to the "old" list, informing everyone of the
>changes. After that message is sent out, the "old list" of addy's is
>destroyed or archived and not to be touched again.
>
>Then everyone just starts resubscribing, and after a given amount of
time, the
>"Held" letters are allowed to flow into the "New List".
>
>-K (thoughts???)

Sounds good, If I understand this correctly ... You put the list on hold,
unsubscribe everyone (or this first part in reverse order), then everyone
resubscribes, and after a day or so the list is unheld and no one misses
a post? :)

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
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=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 12:07:51 PDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: roun <roun@***.NET>
Subject: Acers
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Acers came out in Shadowland #1. the article is by andrew ragland.
actually, half the articles in it are by andrew ragland, with some by steve
kenson.

anyways the acer requires an ACR or armor control rig, which has to be
installed at level 3 for 5.0 points of essence at half the cost of a VCR
level 3. it is able to be run at level 1, 2, or 3. costs about 120,000 b4
you add weapons. that's for the suit, the controllers, motors, mods like
cameras, l-l, t-g, enviroseal, onboard comp to keep it from falling down.
so you sit in this suit and it adds the ACR rating to your quickness and
reaction, adds 2 dice to combat pool, 1 to initiative, and adds 1 to all
#TNs for Physical activities, except for weapons that are built-in to the
suit. it also has a strength of 12 and armor of 7/5 cuz it's based off of
a heavy security armor, right, just heavy security armor. hmmmmmm.
this was made with SR1 rules and so is basically a thin air creation with
no basis or balance.
the total price listed for it in the mag is 456,620 nuyen. kinda steep for
something so specialized.
IMO, this could have been done better, way better. something based along
these lines could be made with R2 rules maybe. but this is not a remote
set of armor, you wear this thing. i dunno, not too good in my opinion.
i think i can email some more info on it to interested parties but i did
not want to just reprint the whole article here, cuz ya never know whos
watching.

if you are interested, email me PRIVATELY at the addy below.

roun aka dave
roun@***.net
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 21:54:37 +0200
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Rune Fostervoll <runefo@***.UIO.NO>
Subject: Re: [Admin] Fixed, I hope.
In-Reply-To: <199805251748.OAA08509@*******.scescape.net> (message from Paul
Gettle on Mon, 25 May 1998 13:49:57 -0400)

Paul Gettle wrote:
>>but it doesn't appear to be consistent on any basis.
>
>I just got a duplicate of your big ASCII 'No.'
>
>I think the list has gone flakey.

Just to make the confusion complete, I *DIDN'T* get a duplicate of that one.

So it's definitely flakey. (Got some other mails duplicate, mind - the insect
question, for instance.).
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 22:07:36 +0200
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Rune Fostervoll <runefo@***.UIO.NO>
Subject: Re: Insect Totems
In-Reply-To: <fa2c7d64.35699fab@***.com> (message from Ereskanti on Mon, 25
May 1998 12:43:22 EDT)

>> Ant is the perfect corporate wageslave, but also an asset for any
>> runner team.
>> --
>
>HOLD ON RIGHT THERE!!!!
*OOPS - GRAB!*

> I do recall very specifically doing this once a LONG
> time ago, and it may or may not even be in the Nagee's that Lester has. I
> also remember other people getting really upset with me on -this- list as to
> this suggestion, one of them was very similar to yourself Rune (nudge nudge).

Mmmmmm.. must have been some other me. Probably. Possibly. Perhaps.

Just to clarify, I don't read Nagee, and I think I made it clear it was
a suggested shaman *IF* someone wanted to play with Shamans with insect totems
rather than insect shamans. So I consider myself in the clear here. :)

>*SNIP Shamans with insect totems rather than Insect Shamans changes a lot of
>the world*

True - it's not something that should be introduced without being ready to
throw a LOT of stuff out the window - you'd need a good reason for that, more
so than 'Hey, is it possible?'. It makes the insect spirits a lot more
'demonic' as well, with no real ties to something even vaguely familiar except,
if the GM thinks it appropriate, a vague similarity in form to some insects.

I wouldn't make insect spirits summoned by toxic insect shamans, but rather
by ensnared initiates. Now these could be thought of as 'toxic insect shamans'
but they aren't.

--

ADVICE, n. The smallest current coin.
-Ambrose Bierce
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 16:09:39 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Grahamdrew <grahamdrew@***.NET>
Subject: Re: (ot) Insect spirits living in my bathroom (was: insect
spirits)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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I'm not really sure, but I know it's detailed in Target:UCAS. There was
something about it on FASA's sight, in the state of the union address.
--
DISCLAIMER: All grammatical and spelling errors are inserted
deliberately to test the software I am developing. In fact,
that is the only reason I am posting. Yeah, that's the ticket!
All my postings are just test data! Yeah!!
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 16:14:33 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: BigDaddy <bigdaddy@*****.COM>
Organization: @**** Network
Subject: Re: Insect Totems
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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<snip>
The way I run the local campaign, that would work just fine, no
problems - good idea, in fact. It would go well with the I.S.'s
really being from 'otherwhere' and just incidentally looking like
insects we know about. (Waiting out there to lure wandering initiates
into opening a gateway for them to enter, the whole paranoia bug
terror thing.). On the other hand, it changes a few precepts of how
things are, and should be a house rule, at best.

Some would make excellent totems, though - Ant, for instance.
<snip>
i discussed this a while ago. many kool ideas came out of the discussion
the only prob would be how to counter the effects that a queen spirit
has on the shaman. Eventually the shaman would be possessed and then die
or be a npc. how to deal with the prob yalL?
--
Napalm Sticks to Kidz,
BigDaddy
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 14:11:13 PDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Matthew Waddilove <m_waddilove@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: Teleport spell
Content-Type: text/plain

Gurth wrote
>
>Matthew Waddilove said on 7:20/22 May 98...
>
>> Teleport spell
>>
>> How's about this for an Idea for a workable, non-game killing
teleport
>> spell. It's not playtested but I'd be gratefull for any comments.
>>
>> Type : Physical
>> Range : Limited.
>> Target : (6 + (Target's mass in KG) ) * ( ( 7 - Essence <live
>> targets>) or (TN from object resistance table -2 <inanimate
objects>))
>> Duration : Sustained
>> Drain : F + 12 D
>>
>> Description:
>> The target will be teleported to a point within range for a number
of
>> phases
>
>Do you really mean phases and not turns? (Just checking to make
sure...)
>
>[snip]
>> Check drain each phase that the spell is sustained.
>
>At +12D? Ouch! I have a feeling this spell will mainly be used to jump
>somewhere and jump back instantly because the caster passes out from
>drain...
>
>> The equation for the target number (6 + (Target's mass in KG) ) * (
(
>> 7 - Essence <live targets>) or (TN from object resistance table -2
>> <inanimate objects>)) might require some explanation. The (6+
Target's
>> Mass in KG) is to make it harder to teleport large objects and KG
should
>> be rounded up.
>
>Do you realize that if you want to teleport a living creature, it's
almost
>impossible to teleport something larger than, say, a medium-sized dog,
and
>even those would be very difficult? Forget trying to teleport a mundane
>human -- say 70 kg -- you're rolling against a TN of 76! Nobody will
roll
>that even with a very large ritual group and too much Karma Pool...
>
>> (7 - essence) makes it harder to teleport non-pure subjects and the 7
is
>> present so that a target with 6 essence will have a multiplyer of 1.
(TN
>> from object resistance table - 2 <inanimate objects>) makes it harder
to
>> teleport complex man made objects with a multiplyer of 1 for natural
>> objects and 8 for complex man made things.
>
>Oh, you mean the multiplier equals the object resistance rating -2. At
>first I thought you wanted the TN to be equal to the ORR.
>


Sorry I this was a bit confusing but since the discussion about
teleporting I was mulling it over in my head and that's what I came up
with.

I had'nt got the grimore or awakenings with me when I thought it up so
the numbers are a bit :) screwy. Also I haven't played a mage so I
admit that the Drain is a _LITTLE_ Harsh but in a way it was meant to be
harsh, After all this is some thing that officially can't be done.
The drain could be tested per turn not phase, I guess I was just feeling
nasty when I thought up that bit.

RE: The target I saw the mage teleporting object A from point B in the
range of the spell to point C in the range of the spell. Another bit
that wasn't clear.

I envisioned the spell to be the first results of a research project
into teleportation with successive generations of the spell having a
lower drain and TN(eg Targets mass / 10kg instead of targets mass in
kg).

Thanks for the comments.

-Matthew Waddilove

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 16:03:57 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Insect Totems

On Mon, 25 May 1998 16:14:33 -0400 BigDaddy <bigdaddy@*****.COM> writes:
><snip>
>The way I run the local campaign, that would work just fine, no
>problems - good idea, in fact. It would go well with the I.S.'s
>really being from 'otherwhere' and just incidentally looking like
>insects we know about. (Waiting out there to lure wandering initiates
>into opening a gateway for them to enter, the whole paranoia bug
>terror thing.). On the other hand, it changes a few precepts of how
>things are, and should be a house rule, at best.
>
>Some would make excellent totems, though - Ant, for instance.
><snip>

>i discussed this a while ago. many kool ideas came out of the discussion
>the only prob would be how to counter the effects that a queen spirit
>has on the shaman. Eventually the shaman would be possessed and then die
>or be a npc. how to deal with the prob yalL?
>--
> Napalm Sticks to Kidz,
> BigDaddy

Uhm ... what I suggested was a a different type of "insect Shaman" that
doesn't summon insect spirits so that wouldn't be a problem ...

Now About your posts:
Getting better ... at least your quoting the previous message but you
still need to identify the original post.
The standard format is :
<SNIP irrevelent material>
>Quoted Material
<SNIP irrevelent material>
>
>BigDaddy

My Reply (notice the spaces)

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 16:35:52 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Insect Totems

On Mon, 25 May 1998 22:07:36 +0200 Rune Fostervoll <runefo@***.UIO.NO>
writes:
<SNIP>
[Previous Posts were about having Insects as normal Totems]
>> I do recall very specifically doing this once a LONG
>> time ago, and it may or may not even be in the Nagee's that Lester
has. I
>> also remember other people getting really upset with me on -this- list
as to
>> this suggestion, one of them was very similar to yourself Rune (nudge
>> nudge).

>Mmmmmm.. must have been some other me. Probably. Possibly. Perhaps.
>
>Just to clarify, I don't read Nagee, and I think I made it clear it was
>a suggested shaman *IF* someone wanted to play with Shamans with insect
totems
>rather than insect shamans. So I consider myself in the clear here. :)

I have the collected NAGEE and I didn't see anything about this ... K,
can you send me something about this privately? (If you need to send it
as an attachment, please send it to alfredo@*****.uh.edu)

>>*SNIP Shamans with insect totems rather than Insect Shamans changes a
lot of
>>the world*

>True - it's not something that should be introduced without being ready
to
>throw a LOT of stuff out the window - you'd need a good reason for that,
more
>so than 'Hey, is it possible?'. It makes the insect spirits a lot more
>'demonic' as well, with no real ties to something even vaguely familiar
>except, if the GM thinks it appropriate, a vague similarity in form to
some
>insects.
>
>I wouldn't make insect spirits summoned by toxic insect shamans, but
rather
>by ensnared initiates. Now these could be thought of as 'toxic insect
shamans'
>but they aren't.
<SNIP Rune's Sig>

Hmmm... I like this ... I was thinking about demonology recently and how
to introduce it into SR ... If shamans follow insect totems as normal
totems, the insect spirits and or their stats can be used as these
"demons" ... interesting ... :) deffinately as a house rule if anything
... :)

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 17:51:47 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Insect Totems
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/25/98 4:38:59 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
dghost@****.COM writes:

> >Just to clarify, I don't read Nagee, and I think I made it clear it was
> >a suggested shaman *IF* someone wanted to play with Shamans with insect
> totems
> >rather than insect shamans. So I consider myself in the clear here. :)
>
> I have the collected NAGEE and I didn't see anything about this ... K,
> can you send me something about this privately? (If you need to send it
> as an attachment, please send it to alfredo@*****.uh.edu)
>
Uh, wow, that material didn't make it to Lester's Collection eh? Interesting.
Anyway, the material was put out at least 6 years, not 7, on .games.frp.cyber
back when it was still mostly just .games.frp and the big splits hadn't
happened all the way yet.

I don't have it anymore, I was just trying to get Rune's goat.... (smile) The
material was written up though, damn, wish I had it.

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 17:05:31 -0600
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Adam J <fro@***.AB.CA>
Subject: Re: Duplicate Posts and Revised List
In-Reply-To: <19980525.134117.10710.4.dghost@****.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 13:37 25/05/98 -0500, you wrote:

>Sounds good, If I understand this correctly ... You put the list on hold,
>unsubscribe everyone (or this first part in reverse order), then everyone
>resubscribes, and after a day or so the list is unheld and no one misses
>a post? :)

If nobody is subscribed there will be no posts.

So: Everyone is unsubscribed. People resubscribe when they get the time.
Conversation restarts where it was left off.

-Adam
-
http://www.interware.it/users/adamj \ fro@***.ab.ca \ ICQ# 2350330
ShadowRN Assistant Fearless Leader \ FreeRPG Webring \ TSS Productions
The Shadowrun Supplemental \ SR Archive Co-Maintainer \ RPGA Reviwer
"So Marilyn Manson is a criticism of gimmickry while being itself a gimmick."
--- Marilyn Manson
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 19:27:17 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: BigDaddy <bigdaddy@*****.COM>
Organization: @**** Network
Subject: Re: Insect Totems
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Alfredo B Alves wrote:
>
> On Mon, 25 May 1998 22:07:36 +0200 Rune Fostervoll <runefo@***.UIO.NO>
> writes:
> <SNIP>

> >>*SNIP Shamans with insect totems rather than Insect Shamans changes a
> lot of
> >>the world*
>
> >True - it's not something that should be introduced without being ready
> to
> >throw a LOT of stuff out the window - you'd need a good reason for that,
> more
> >so than 'Hey, is it possible?'. It makes the insect spirits a lot more
> >'demonic' as well, with no real ties to something even vaguely familiar
> >except, if the GM thinks it appropriate, a vague similarity in form to
> some
> >insects.
> >
> >I wouldn't make insect spirits summoned by toxic insect shamans, but
> rather
> >by ensnared initiates. Now these could be thought of as 'toxic insect
> shamans'
> >but they aren't.
> <SNIP Rune's Sig>
>
> Hmmm... I like this ... I was thinking about demonology recently and how
> to introduce it into SR ... If shamans follow insect totems as normal
> totems, the insect spirits and or their stats can be used as these
> "demons" ... interesting ... :) deffinately as a house rule if anything
> ... :)
>
> D.Ghost
> (aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)
>
how bout this for a replay(ghost) ;)

anyway. what would happen if persay us as gm's were to summon said
"spirits". Casting those spells would definately throw it in the face of
the Grimoire. What about a spellcasting roll for control over the
spirit or have the spirit roll every few rounds to decide if it:

a. stays and obeys
b. stays and attacks caster.
c. leaves
d. does whatever it wants regardless of who or what is around it.


hmmmm what would the spirit roll against. its own force or int? hmmm


Napalm Sticks to Kidz,
BigDaddy


ps i snipped out most of the prev. posts (why waste bandwith?)
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 20:12:02 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: William Ashe <wmashe@***.NET>
Subject: Re: Hijacking
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Fade made some interesting comments about Hijacking:

Using a potential hijacking might add a nice moral dilemma for some PC's ...
Hmmmmm

-Bright Light
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 20:20:10 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: William Ashe <wmashe@***.NET>
Subject: Example of Play Matrix style
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

Here is an example of play that I generated for the PBeM I'm GM'ing. I'm
thinking about submitting this to Paolo's site. Feel free to comment
wherever you'd like. I think that I'm starting to get the hang of VR 2.0
now.

BTW if any of this comes out HTML 'ized or other Gatesian Crap let me know
and I'll fix it

-Bright Light
ps thiss will also end up on my web page
http://freeweb.pdq.net/wmashe/shadowrun.html

So here it is

Getting Information On AC Agritech



Prologue:

The others never quite understood the complexities of Combat Biker. There
were subtleties, strategies, plans within plans. Their mutual appreciation
of the game was what made them fast friends. The game was over and its now
late at night. If Lobo has gone, then you need a ride. Otherwise, Lobo is
able to shoot you home (unless you drove yourself). Anyway, Fast Eddy slips
you the simsense deck and the program chip. Path took it home and tested it.
The deck was in perfect working order and the program chip clocked in at
0.875. Now in the CAS it needs to get to 0.890 before it becomes
"borderline". Only in some of the more restrictive countries would it be
even close. The simsense is well within legal limits, its strong but hey! It
’s a diet aid. Too bad you don't have a bio-chemistry shop to test the
herbs. Testing the herbs will take someone with a little more hard science
skills. (I'll have to check peoples Contacts and let you know). Well anyway,
back to what you know best; circuits and programs, little pills of green
goop don't really do it for you.



Chapter 1:

Getting into AC Agritech

This time when you head over "Barry's Bar and Grille (the same illegal
cyber-café from before), Xander's friend is at the bar. You are able to get
into the back without costing you any cash. Unless of course you bring the
heat down on them. Once in the back you grab a Fizzy-Cola and jack in. First
thing you have to do is to get past the phone grid. You need to Logon to
LTG. The phrase "Not a Challenge" popped into his head as he tripped the
logon interrupts.

The CAS LTG has an ACIFS rating of Green 3 6/8/7/8/8. The decker needs to
perform the "Logon to LTG" operation. It is an Access test so the decker
rolls his computer skill dice against a target number of the Access rating
minus the rating of the appropriate utility. Which in this case is a
"Deception-6" i.e. TN = 6-6=0, but the lowest TN in Shadowrun is 2. Path
rolls 10 dice and comes up with 8 successes.

The phone grid resists his attempt by rolling its security dice (all 3 of
them) against his "Detection Factor". The detection factor TN is his
"Masking" attribute plus his "Sleaze-6" Program divided by two. i.e.
(6+6)/2=6 Since the phone grid has only three dice and no pool it could
never get more successes than Path did. In fact it got zero successes, so
Path is in and the "Security Tally" is still just 1.

Once into the phone grid, Path needed to find the LTG location of AC
Agritech, so he fires up his "Browse" program and calls up the 21st century
equivalent of directory assistance.

The decker needs to perform the "Locate Access Node" operation. It is a
Files test so the decker rolls his computer skill dice against a target
number of the Files rating minus the rating of the appropriate utility.
Which in this case is a "Browse-6" i.e. TN = 7-6=1, but the lowest TN in
Shadowrun is 2. Path rolls 10 dice and comes up with 7 successes.

The phone grid resists his attempt by rolling its security dice (all 3 of
them) against his "Detection Factor". The detection factor TN is his
"Masking" attribute plus his "Sleaze-6" Program.

i.e. (6+6)/2=6

This time it gets one success so Path finds the LTG point for the SAN and
the "Security Tally" rises to 2.

The main number is in Chillicothe Ohio. Getting to the System Access Node is
a snap. In the phone grid the outside of the node looks like an ancient
greek temple. Path triggers the logon interrupts and is into the public
access part of the node. Inside, one would think that they are back in
ancient greece. Path sniffs the virtual air a little disdainfully.

"Drek, anybody can get a sculpted system these days."

As he wanders around the virtual landscape he comes across icons of people
in the best of health touting the company's products. A beautiful woman in a
skimpy toga looking thing is hawking vitamins and a man with cut muscles and
golden skin tone is hawking an herbal compound designed to restore vigor and
a youthful sex drive. As Path wanders into the center of the host he sees a
number of various types of icons. Most are rudimentary icons of typical
users. There are a couple of icons of users who know how to cut some code.
But in the center is an icon of a user that just radiates wisdom, and
knowledge.

"Wait a damn minute here," He thinks. Path remembers something from his
literature classes. It only takes a moment for his encephalon to probe
though his youthful memories to come up with the answer. It comes from
Plato's Republic, Plato described how his mentor Socrates would recline in
the sun of an Athens afternoon and teach philosophy to the young men of
Athens. Path strides up to the group basking in the virtual warmth of a sky
that hasn't existed for over three thousand years.

As Path listens, he hears the "teacher" talk about how through a melding of
simsense technology and natural herbal treatments, one can reach their
goals.

"Not even the most obese, … unless they have some definite medical
condition… The lawyers made me say that…" that gets a chuckle from the crowd
, "can reorient his or her lifestyle to the path of vigor and healthfulness.

The reclining man continues "And the only thing you put into your bodies is
all natural herbs, and pure clean technology."

Path can't help but speak up,

"Um excuse me … teacher …." Path is a little shocked, that the system would
try to put words into his mouth, "I have heard rumors about unnatural side
effects."

"Nonsense dear child, my system has been tested all over the world, why back
in mother Russia, we had the most extraordinary results. I assume you are
from some media organization, feel free to purchase one of my simsense kits
at any store you choose, and test any way you can. You will see that it is
perfectly legal."



Chapter 2:

The Conversation:

Note: now the other people in the host can see Path because he let his
masking drop. But, not enough that the system can see him.

The warm virtual sun shined in the sky of an ancient Greece. Path's icon
looked a tad out of place. It was an icon of a typical sarariman in a grey
trenchcoat. His whole body is silvery metallic, but the coat conceals most
of it. On his chest is a emblem (under the coat) it is the same as Path's
triangular type tatoo. His head appears to have flesh and look normal. The
only indications that he has a metallic body are his feet and hands that
stick out of the trench coat. The "teacher" reclined on the mat and looked
serene.

"What do you consider to be a reasonable training routine? … Teacher." Once
again Path bristled at the system putting words in his mouth. He debated
hacking into the control system and having it stop putting words in his
mouth.

"Well dear child, A reasonable routine is what is necessary for each
individual."

"But, what is reasonable? Would a person exercising eight to nine hours a
day, exercising to the point of collapse, rest for a while, then do it
again. In a continuous cycle. …Teacher."

"Now dear child, it must be reasonable for that person or he … or she
wouldn't do it. Everyone sets their own goals. The program just helps them
realize them. Our special herbal shakes and pills assist this by providing
complete nutrition to the person."

"I'm glad you brought up the shakes. I read the ingredient list, most of it
is just normal stuff, but what are the special herbs and nutrients? …
teacher."

"O.k. that tears it" Path thinks to himself, "If you'll excuse me for a few
moments I have something to take care of in the real world."

"Of course dear child, take your time. I'll still be here."



Path winks out of sight as he reengages his masking. He steps away from the
scene and prepares to send some code to the control center of this host that
will stop making it end all of his questions with the word "teacher".

The decker needs to perform the "Logon to Host" operation to get out of the
public access portion of the host. It is an Access test so the decker rolls
his computer skill dice against a target number of the Access rating minus
the rating of the appropriate utility. Which in this case is a "Deception-6"
i.e. TN = 8-6=2, Path rolls 10 dice plus 4 from his hacking pool and comes
up with 10 successes.

The host resists his attempt by rolling its security dice against his
"Detection Factor". The detection factor TN is his "Masking" attribute
plus
his "Sleaze-6" Program.

i.e. (6+6)/2=6

The host system gets only one success, so Path is in and the "Security
Tally" goes from 1 to 2.

Once he is inside the rest of the system it switches over to a standard UMS
system. Path isn't surprised. Many of the smaller companies create virtual
machines that sport a lot of "oomph" for the front end and public access
parts. Doing this leaves the rest of the system rather starved for
resources, which forces the system administrator to fall back to UMS. He's
willing to bet that the host is a small Fuchi Multi-6000 or an Aztechnology
Jaguar. The first thing he needs to do is to see just what he's up against,
so he executes an Analyze Host operation.

The decker needs to perform the "Analyze Host" operation. It is a Control
test so the decker rolls his computer skill dice against a target number of
the Control rating minus the rating of the appropriate utility. Which in
this case is an "Analyze-4" i.e. TN = 10-4=6, Path rolls 10 dice plus 1 from
his hacking pool and comes up with 1 success. He decides to use a karma pool
point to re roll for more successes. He's lucky he got that one success or
he'd be stuck. He re rolls the failures and comes up with 2 more successes,
for a total of 3.

The host resists his attempt by rolling its security dice against his
"Detection Factor". The host system gets 1 success, so Path gets the info
and the "Security Tally" is 3.

The answer comes back that the system is a green 5 with a control of 10. Not
bad, but still kinda soft. So now that he knows what's going on he needs to
whack that silly control feature that keeps putting words into his mouth so
makes a files test to find the offending bit of code then a read/write
operation to delete it

The decker needs to make a "Locate File" operation. It is an Index test so
the target number is reduced by his Browse-6 utility. The decker rolls 10
dice plus none from his hacking pool and comes up with 10 successes. The
host resists his attempt by rolling its security dice against his "Detection
Factor". The detection factor TN is his "Masking" attribute plus his
"Sleaze-6" Program.

i.e. (6+6)/2=6 The host system gets 1 success, so Path gets the info and the
"Security Tally" is 4.

He finds the file. He needs to check whether or not its protected by a data
bomb. He could care less if it's protected in other ways since he just plans
on deleting it.

The decker needs to make an "Analyze Icon" operation. It is a Index test so
the target number is reduced by his Analyze-4 utility. The decker rolls 10
dice plus 5 from his hacking pool and comes up with no successes. The host
resists his attempt by rolling its security dice against his "Detection
Factor". TN=6 The host system gets 1 success, so Path gets squat, and the
"Security Tally" is 5. He tries again and comes up with 5 successes. The
host gets 1 success. The tally is now 6. The file is rigged with a data
bomb. Path swaps his Defuse-4 utility into his system and prepares to go at
the bomb. He rolls against a target number of the Files rating minus the
Defuse rating (10-4=6). He gets 2 successes and the system gets none so he
has defused the bomb. He now makes the "Edit File" operation. This has a
target number of the Files rating minus his Read/Write utility (10-5=5). He
gets two successes and the system gets one success. The security tally is
now 7. As he looks around he sees that he is about to be "attacked" by a
Probe utility. He's lucky that this is a standard UMS system so he can tell
what the icon is just by looking at it (A Computer skill test against a
target number 4). He's not quite sure what to do now

Path looks at the old fashioned UMS probe icon moving toward him. He decides
to attack this program and get it off of his back permanently.

Chapter 3

Cybercombat Begins:

The first thing that happens is initiative is resolved. The decker has a
hot-ASIST, and Response Increase +2. That gives him 7+3d6 in the matrix. The
system is running a Probe-6 so it has 6+2d6. The decker rolls and gets 1, 1,
and 4 (ouch) so he has an initiative of 13 the system rolls and gets 2, and
3 so the system has an initiative of 11.

[Phase 13.1] Path fires off his first salvo from his attack-6M program. It
is a simple action.

According to the section "Resolving Attacks" on pg 123 in VR 2.0 this is how
the target numbers shake out. He is an "intruding" icon so any IC from this
green host trying to hit him has a target number of 5. Likewise the Probe IC
is a "legitimate icon" so the target number to hit it is 4.

Path initiates his attack: He rolls his Computer Skill plus 2 dice from his
Hacking Pool against the target number of 4. He gets 5 successes this scales
up the damage level up to Deadly. The system resists damage by rolling its
security value against the target number of the attack program (6m). This
system is a green 5 so it uses 5 dice to resist damage. No matter what the
system gets, it cannot stage the damage down below Moderate. The system
rolls its 5 dice and gets two successes. The Probe IC takes Serious damage.
Path isn't about to wait around for the IC to try to spill the beans so he
hits it again.

[Phase 13.2] He rolls his Computer Skill plus 2 dice from his Hacking Pool
against the target number of 4. He gets 5 successes this scales up the
damage level up to Deadly. The system resists damage by rolling its security
value. This system is a green 5 so it uses 5 dice to resist damage. The
system rolls its 5 dice and gets one success. Note: injury modifiers only
apply to actions taken by the IC not damage resistance tests. The target
number for resisting damage is still 6. The Probe IC takes deadly damage and
is gone. Now the decker has to make decision does he let the IC add its
value (6) to the security tally as it dies, or does he use a point of his
detection factor to suppress it. Path decides to suppress it.


Path reaches into his coat and pulls out a wicked looking gun from the folds
of his virtual garb. He shoots twice blasting the icon into bits (or would
it be bytes). As the icon is disintegrating Path removes his coat and grabs
the bits of the IC as it fades away so that the system can't hear the IC
die. Path pauses for a moment to sum up. He has deleted the bit of annoying
code that tries to put words into his mouth and he has just greased a bit of
probe IC. While he's in he might as well look for a little paydata.

The decker now performs the "Locate File" operation. He wants to look for
R&D files on the simsense diet program. This is an index test so the target
number is 10 - 6 = 4. Path is getting a little nervous so he wants to really
stick it so he decides to use his entire hacking pool. He does stick it with
9 successes. The system resists by rolling its 5 security dice against a
target number of 5. Recall that he used a point of his detection factor to
suppress the IC. The system gets no successes.



Path reaches into his coat again and pulls out a small toy dog shaped by a
bloodhound. He winds up the key on its back and tells it to fetch. Path
stands around for a moment or two as the bloodhound goes off to sniff the
system. Soon it comes back with its mouth full of data. In fact there's so
much data that he has to spend a few moments digesting it. It appears that
there is no R&D department on this system. Path isn't really surprised, a
lot of small companies can't afford the really stringent security necessary
to have their dirty laundry available in the matrix. It's a simple enough
thing to have a stand alone system. However Path noticed a couple of e-mails
that were still in the archive that describes the "problems with the Russian
end of the business." He checks them for data bombs. They're clean.

The decker needs to make an "Analyze Icon" operation. It is a Index test so
the target number is reduced by his Analyze-4 utility. The decker rolls 10
dice plus 5 from his hacking pool and comes up with 5 successes. The host
resists his attempt by rolling its security dice against his "Detection
Factor". The host system gets 1 success, so Path discovers that the files
are clean, and the "Security Tally" is 7. Now he has to read the files. It
is a simple files test using his Read/Write utility. So the target number is
5. He gets 5 successes. The system resists and gets zero successes. The
security tally is unchanged.

One e-mail read, "My god what a mess over there. I'm glad we tested this
product in such a backward country. Most of those stupid families have never
even heard the word 'Product Liability', we just gave them a little cash and
they shut up and went away. I hope we have most of the problems fixed.
<FrankKing@****_Dev 12/3/2055 12:35>"

Another e-mail read "I just got off the phone with Legal. The laws in the
CAS are just as screwed up as in Russia. So long as each piece of the system
is legal, the entire thing is. We're completely safe. <AlexZhanov@****_Dev
12/3/2055 12:35>"

Path reviews a few more e-mails. They all say more or less the same thing.
The people sending them sent them from corporate headquarters in Ohio. The
first thing he needs to do is download this information into his offline
storage.

The decker now has to execute a Download Data operation. It is a files
operation with Read/Write being the appropriate utility. Thus the target
number is 5. Path uses his entire hacking pool to make sure it happens. He
gets 6 successes. The system resists and gets zero successes. The security
tally is unchanged, and the data is successfully downloaded to his
cyberdeck.

Well, he's about ready to head back to the phone grid. He first has to
logoff to make a few phone calls.

Path performs his Graceful Logoff. This operation removes any trace of his
presence as he leaves the system. This is an access test with Deception-6 as
the utility so 8-6 = 2. He gets a whole lot of successes. The system gets 2.
The tally is 9 and Path is gone.

Path is now floating in the LTG just outside the Greek temple icon of the
host. First he needs to call his compatriots in the real world and let them
know he's found something. So he heads over to one of the glowing blue pipes
that represent a comm line. He reaches into his coat and pulls out an old
fashioned phone booth and plugs a "cable" into the blue pipe. Now he can
make his comm call

Path initiates the Make Comcall operation. It is a Files test using his
Commlink-5 utility. The phone call has a final target number of 8-5=3. The
phone grid resists his attempt just like any host would, so it rolls three
dice against his Detection Factor (he gets his 1 point back after his
graceful logoff). The phone grid gets no successes.

Inside his phone booth Path puts a quarter into the slot and dials the
number of his friend Lobo. The screen in front of him says "ringing, please
wait". It rings twice then Lobo's face appears. Judging by the distortion he
must be using his personal secretary with its small camera.

"Hey Path, what's shakin?" Lobo says.

"Well, I've got some good news and some bad news. The good news I found a
little evidence. I don't want to send it over the commlines, just in case."

"What did you get?"

"A couple of incriminating e-mails."

"Wow, that's pretty good. I'm not sure if its enough though. "Hey can you
get Fast Eddy on the line too?"

"I'll see."

Path initiates another Make Comcall operation. The phone grid gets no
successes. The call goes through.

Several moments later the screen splits and Path's icon face and Fast Eddy's
real one are both displayed on the screen in the virtual phone booth. It
takes Path a few moments to bring Fast Eddy up to speed on his matrix
adventures.

"Well, there you go. Some real evidence." Path says

"That's good, but I agree with Lobo, we really need a smoking gun. What we
need is something really solid. The e-mails are good. That's enough for me
to take to my editor, but its not enough for a story."

"What kind of evidence do you need to make a really killer story?" Lobo asks

"Heh, ideally I'd like one of the executives to spill his guts. But, the
chance of that happening is about the same as me getting to do a one on one
with Lofwyr. Second to that would be to get some really incriminating stuff
from their R&D department."

"But, that system isn't on the matrix."

"Wellll." Fast Eddy lets the comment hang

"Huh? … ohhhhh." Path says.

"Say, Path I'll call the others. See what you can dig up on this company.
You know, building plans, security stuff, whatever."

"I'm on it."

"I'll talk to you guys later. We should try to keep the discussions off line
now. No sense kicking the ant hill if we don't need to." Fast Eddy says as
he hangs up.

Path hangs up also. Time to do a little digging on the illustrious Mr. King
and Mr. Zhanov.

"Let's see here, time to get a little clever. I don't want to ring any
alarms, so I'll try to do something sneaky." He said to himself.



Chapter 4

Being Clever

The Matrix became a blur as Path races across the LTG towards the most
annoying people in the Matrix, Spammers. The businesses that made their
living dumping megapulses of worthless junk mail into everyone's inboxes.
"The Price is Right" House was one of the largest companies in the CAS. It
sent out almost a gigapulse a minute of crap. But, in addition to sending
out crap, they also bought marketing data from every legal source they could
find. They bought data on people using credsticks to buy ice cream, or
people who send in for information to horticultural web pages. They were the
great accumulators of information on the masses of people in the world. Once
they got this data, they used some of the most powerful computers on the
Trix to massage it all together. They tracked data by locale, by interest,
by almost every category you could think of., and if for some bizarre chance
you came up with a category they didn't have, they go make you a mailing
list (for a reasonable fee). So if your company was designing a product that
was to be targeted to a specific group of people. These companies would be
able to provide you with a mailing list of everyone who fitted your profile.
They could even provide limited dossiers on each person on that list if you
paid enough. Path materializes in front of a giant gaudy megaplex of
flashing lights, happy sounds, even pretty smells. It was easily the most
annoying place in the Trix.

He didn't even have to try to log in. This place let everyone in.

"Hi!!! Welcome to the Price is Right!!! Where everything is for sale. What
can I sell you." Piped out an annoying perky icon of some wage slave.

"I would like to purchase some marketing data."

The decker has to make a matrix etiquette roll against a target number of 4.
He rolls 5 dice and gets two successes.

"Excellent, what kind of data."

"Detailed dossiers for Ohio UCAS, Archetype is middle to upper management in
small companies with a class B to class C bond rating."

"And what would you be using this information for?"

"I'm establishing a marketing profile for our new product. It is a service
provided to companies with weak bond ratings to bolster their credit
rating."

"Oooh sounds fascinating, what company is that?"

"Oh you naughty girl, you know you can’t ask that."

"I have to try though."

"Of course you do. Will this take long? I need to write a report by
tomorrow."

"Okey, dokey."

The perky icon waved her hands and a big sheaf of data appeared, and handed
it to him. The data file was so large that it took path several memory swaps
to get it all. He'd have to analyze this offline. But, Path ran a search
utility as the data went into his deck to find whether or not these two
names were on it. They were.

"Great! This is some really spiffy keen data, how much do I owe." Path
responded perkily

"One thousand two hundred nuyen … uh Six thousand three hundred and fifty
dollars CAS."

"Ouch, o.k. you got it. Take the funds from account AR4456P00975663." This
account was one that Path maintained. Luckily it had seven thousand CAS
dollars in it.

"Thank goodness for expense accounts." He thought

There was a slight pause as she checked the account, "Well o.k. thank you
very much."

"No thank you." Path's icon did the matrix equivalent of a wink.

"Oh you naughty boy … behave."

"Not if I meet you … in the flesh … "

"Well if you head to the Darkstar in Dallas, you just might. Look for the
girl with the Neon hair and the black leather boots."

"Dallas eh? Well I might need to make a Fact Finding Trip to that city."

"Well I hope you do."

Path logs off and is back into the phone grid. He then downloads that to his
deck also. Now he needs to jack out and evaluate what he's got. There is a
moment of disorientation as his consciousness was slammed back into his meat
body. He looked around for a moment. It was kind of weird. Here he was
sitting in a hidden back room on Sixth Street in Austin Texas. A century
ago, Janice Joplin walked through this room talking to Jimi Hendrix. Now, it
was filled with a room full of people with wires plugged into their heads
drooling on themselves. Path looked down at his FizzyCola. It was very warm
and very flat.

"Hey Garcon, bring me a shot of real whisky." He said to the girl in the
back.

"Garcon means 'boy', and real whisky is real expensive … got dumped didn't
ya?"

"Uh do you want a tip or not?"

"O.k. o.k. Mr. Cranky Man."

Path sipped the very expensive real whisky. He was surrounded by wireheads.
Not one person in here even cared about real reality. He thought back on his
trip into the PCC. He was surprised that he remembered enjoying every minute
of the trip. He even enjoyed the fighting. He couldn't help but think that
somehow, real life was passing him by, and he didn’t even realize it.

"Man, I hate it when I get like this. Now I'm going to have to listen to the
blues for a while."

He walked out of the cyber café with his deck inside of its protective case.
Down the street a little, he saw a young ork. He was about fifteen or
sixteen playing a ratty old guitar out of a ratty old amp. But, the boy
could play. Path stopped for a while to listen to the young boy sing.

"I'm big and strong." He said

"da da da dum." Went the guitar.

"I'm smart too," He said

"da da da dum." Went the guitar.

"But the only job I can get"

"da da da dum." Went the guitar.

"Is cleanin' the john's"

Path listened to the blues for a while longer then put a twenty into the
boy's guitar case. The boy looked up.

"Man you decker's are just weird."

"Yeah we are."

Analyzing the Data and Going Back for More

Path got into his car and drove home. He drove by his place. He looked to
see if he could see any surveillance. He couldn't. He unlocked the door and
walked in. The cops had been through the place. But, at least they had put
his record collection back in alphabetical order. He grabbed the three large
cases of music disks and carried them to his trunk. At least now, they
wouldn't have to listen to country music all of the time. He looked again
and saw a drone fly by. It didn't make any return trips, so he piled the
music into the car and left. Back home he analyzed the data that he got.

Alex Zhanov

Age 39

Race Human

Birthplace: Kiev Ukraine

Employment: A&C Agritech Chilicothe Ohio

Position: Director of Operations

Salary: 50,000 to 75,000 nuyen

Marital Status: Divorced,

Magical Ability: Unknown

Hobbies: Simsense games, chess

Dossier: Executive in small company, Average number of change of positions
Works average hours, Favorite restaurant = TGI Fridays, Purchases an above
average amount of alchohol = Stolychnya vodka. Sexual orientaion = hetero,
vanilla, Vices = below average but consistent use of Ethel's Escort Service
(LTG=Oh-UCAS-49766593)

Additional Comments: none

Frank King

Age 39

Race Dwarf

Birthplace: Chicago Illinois UCAS

Employment: A&C Agritech Chilicothe Ohio

Position: Director of Marketing

Salary: 50,000 to 75,000 nuyen

Marital Status: Married, wife Ellen, human two children one male dwarf, one
female human

Magical Ability: none

Hobbies: golf, camping, kayaking

Dossier: Executive in small company, Average number of change of positions
Works below average hours, Purchases an above average amount of beer =
budweiser Sexual orientaion = hetero, vanilla, Vices = unknown

Additional Comments: Member of "Mothers of Metahumans" policlub. Arrested
three times in civil rights protests

After Path downloaded this information onto something solid he decided to go
back into the Matrix to look for more dirt. So this time he headed for a
small coffee house he knew. This place catered to deckers and had full
bandwidth connections on every table. Since he wasn't planning on doing
anything very illegal, he could jack in here. Now with a steaming hot cup of
Soykaf and a cruller in front of him, Path once again slipped out of his
mortal coil. He was back into the matrix. It was an easy hack to get into
the phone system and another easy one to zip over to these two men's virtual
mailboxes. The LTG numbers were provided as part of the marketing data.

Certain actions that have been well documented previously I will not
describe any longer. I'll only describe the details of any new things he
does or runs into.

Both men maintained virtual mailboxes on the same MSP (Matrix Service
Provider), Ohio telecom. To look at their "inboxes" he would have to hack
the host that provided the service. Path debated the wisdom of doing that.
Getting information from Spammers was one thing, but hacking into their
personal "inboxes" was another thing entirely. The host itself would
probably be a dark green or a light orange, and each inbox would have the
bejeebers protected out of it. One slip and they might find out that someone
is digging on them.

Getting information on the complex wasn't easy. First he browsed over to the
City of Chilicothe Public Database. He paid his 1.15 nuyen ($5.25 CAS) and
tried to look up any information on the building. The details were held in
the confidential section. He wasn't sure whether to hack the city's system
when it came up with a message of "This information is restricted … please
enter login and password." He performed an Analyze Host operation and found
that it was a Green 9 with a Control of 13. A difficult nut to crack, but
not impossible

"Maybe I ought to try a different tactic."

Hacking a Satellite

He browsed over to one of the satellite imaging companies. The icon
resembled a cartoonish version of a satellite sporting a giant old-fashioned
1940's camera. Now he could either login as a paying customer and deal with
the restrictions on what images he could view and which ones he couldn't or
he could try to hack it. Hacking the satellite would be interesting, Lots of
companies needed satellite imaging, but no one wanted one to be able to peer
down on them while they were doing naughty things. So sat companies had all
kinds of wacky rules imposed on them by the big boys. This kind of satellite
would have higher security on it would probably be an orange-hard system
with scrambled jack points and everything. If he could get in and program it
to take the pictures he wants, then he could learn all kids of juicy bits.
He could also get his synapses seriously toasted.

"Well time to get down to it." He said to himself as he triggers the logon
interrupts.

This nut is a little more difficult to crack than any of his earlier
attempts, the first time he rolls 12 dice against a target number of 7 (that
includes his Deception-6) and gets zero successes (No Karma Pool allowed
here). The system rolls against his detection factor of 6 and gets 3
successes. Well Path needs to try again or give up. This time he uses all 14
dice, and gets 3 successes. This time he uses a point of Karma Pool to
re-roll failures and gets one more success for a total of 4. The systems
resists and gets zero successes. Path is in on his second try.

Path is in. Inside the system looks like a simple control room. At the
console is a set of screens that are displaying what the satellite is
currently looking at. Over to one side is another display showing where the
sat is in relation to the ground. It is currently over Poland. Path will
have to wait many hours for the sat to be over Ohio. Path then notices that
this console can control more than one satellite. In fact it controls 4. A
quick glance at the output shows that sat number 3 will be in position in
about an hour. Path debates what to do. He decides that he will try to make
the system think he has a valid passcode so that he can come back when the
sat is in position, snap a few pictures, download, then make a quick
getaway. So he has to create himself a passcode.

The "Validate Passcode" is a Control operation using the "Validate-4"
utility. This makes a target number of 7 (standard user status). He rolls 14
dice to get 1 success. Too bad he used his one point of Karma Pool already.
The system resists, and also gets 1 success. VR 2.0 isn't specific as to
what happens in the event of a tie (pg 19) so I say Path gets it. Path now
has a valid passcode. The passcode will probably only last for today, but
that's o.k. by Path.

Path now has a valid passcode. He can log back in and have the sattelite
take whatever pictures he wants (he hopes). So now Path has a little time to
kill, so he performs a graceful logoff and goes to make a couple of phone
calls. Path logs off and is gone back into the phone grid. About an hour
later Path is back in. This is a commercial satellite with only limited
resolution so he can only get "the big picture." But, this is the best that
he's able to do. The sat computer was very helpful in providing him with
some image analysis software to tell him what certain object were.

Path logs out of the system with his image in his virtual hand. Time to head
back to the real world and see what the other guys have got.
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 21:04:24 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Waffelmeisters <evamarie@**********.NET>
Subject: T-Shirts My Submission
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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> T-Shirts My Submission (GRANITE , Sun 3:22)
>
> And someone suggested we set some drop dead dates..And I whole
> heartedly agree..End of this month for submissions and 7 June for
> selection..Who wants to be the keeper of the votes???I would but I
> have a submission and that would not be fair..so somebody else has to
> do it..

There is no way in hell I can have finished art ready by then, so folks
will have to judge by whatver representation I have and my bravado
asurances of higher quality to come...

>
> OK..I finished My suggestion for the 98' list shirt front and back..
> And it they are posted at the following sites:
>
> http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/1068/GranitesTshirt.htm

> Anyway..Keep in mind the picture will be inverted on the
> shirt..meaning black where the white is and white where the black
> is..both side look even better that way..But it is easier to draw
> this way..The back of the shirt looks really cool inverted..

This is genrally a REAL easy thing to do in any image program (i
downloaded one and tried it). I'd advise, though, that thin lines in
white on black often do not silkscreen well, unless done with high
quality ink. Thats a bad color scheme to choose unless your going with
a printer whom you know does very good work.
-Mongoose X
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 21:04:15 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Waffelmeisters <evamarie@**********.NET>
Subject: Re: T-shirt - proposed art link
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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>
> Re: T-shirt - proposed art link (Alfredo B Alves , Sun 1:57)
>
> On Sun, 24 May 1998 01:52:42 EDT Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM> writes:
> >In a message dated 5/23/98 7:53:08 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
> >mbreton@**.NETCOM.COM writes:
> >
> >> Waffelmeisters wrote:
> >> >
> >> > Iv'e worked up a crude representation of a list shirt idea I'd like
> to
> >> > do. Check it out: http://www.concentric.net/~evamarie/RNSHIRTB.GIF
> >> > (caps required). Its only 16K.

> I like the alternate back as well, and the front's concept is good but
> needs some serious work (no offense) ... I think the shirt would look
> better without the slugs also ... If I have time, I'll try and do this by
> hand see if it turns out ok ... If so I'll scan it in and e-mail it to
> someone ... (Was it Granite or K that volounteered space?)
> D.Ghost
> (aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)


Yes, as said, it is a CRUDE representation. I whipped it up in 1 hour
in paintshop pro, which doesn't even have bezier curves. A decent
version would have to be (mostly) hand drawn.
I'm leaning towards an 18 sprocket gear, with a celtic knot work
border covering its circumferance and teath. The interirs would have a
3-lobed Celtic knotwork design like on T-dairs shirt, posibly
integrating a scrollwork design in the background.
This would be drawn WITHOUT slugs, which, if used, would be added as
seperate elements. They were there mostly to be true to t-dairs shirt,
but if some of the motifs I have in mindplay out, they won't be needed
to convey the idea of mystic-cyber intgration.
I like K's idea of a common linksite. I should have put more info with
the image, but my HTML editor is busted, so I just put some text in the
image.
-Mongoose X
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 21:04:32 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Waffelmeisters <evamarie@**********.NET>
Subject: Re: T-shirt - proposed art link
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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> Re: T-shirt - proposed art link (Adam J , Sun 21:05)
>
> At 14:54 24/05/98 -0500, you wrote:
>
> >> Can we set a deadline for the end of this month for shirt designs to come
> >> in, then a week to decide which ones we like? Is that to soon?
> >
> > Not if we actually want to use GenCon as an orgizing focus forgetting
> >printing done. Even AFTER a concensus is reached, there's likely to be
> >some long work, like collecting names / adresses.
>
> ERr..
> Not sure I understand you here. IIRC alot of people want the shirts to be
> Finished for Gencon. Which means they need to be printed by late
> June/early July so they can get mailed out.

URG, That would be faster than I planned on working. I COULD work up
finished art by June 15th, I guess, and handing it to a printer is easy
(lots in town here). Guess I'll get cracking (I usually get a tatoo for
my birthday, and have missed a fewyears for lack of designs, so heres a
chance to get one, if I don't usethe art otherwise...)

>
> Collecting who wants to order shirts shouldn't take more than 2 weeks. I
> know it's taken much longer in the past, but it doesn't NEED to. The
> longer we drag it out the worse the results will be, IMO.
>
> -Adam

I was just judging by past results. I know sometimes getting cash to
the printers and shipping done has been very slow, but you are right, it
need not be.
-Mongoose X
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 21:09:14 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Waffelmeisters <evamarie@**********.NET>
Subject: Re: Multi-target rituals
MIME-Version: 1.0
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> Re: Multi-target rituals (Ereskanti , Sun 22:04)

> IT did have some strange effects (Sam's ritual that is). How is this for a
> thought? The "dust" that Sam used in the books was nothing more than a
> "sighter" for the ritual, a mobile material link, for lack of better terms.
> As the waves of the magic expanded, it "ground out" into the Dust, igniting
it
> as a "Manifestual Effect", and allowing the Ritual Energies to do their
duty.
>
> -K
Um, maybe were thinking of diferent rituals (or mey memory is quite
bad)? In any case, unusual effects there are easly explained; A) Its a
ghost dance B) Its a NOVEL. Neither follows normal SR rules. :)
I don't remebr a Dust in any case, but I do remeber it resolving MANY
diffrent plot threads at once.
-Mongoose X
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 21:54:01 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: DisnyShamn <DisnyShamn@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Mood music
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Me said:

> It's even more important to have recurring NPC villains, especially
> powerful ones, have theme music! Preferably one that starts low
> and builds, so you can surruptitiously start it playing and watch
> the looks on the players faces as it builds up and they realize
> who's coming...

Learned at yesterday's game some of the Really Effective music is that my
Nightspawn GM had been using; the soundtrack from The Vision of Escaflowne
(anime). Doesn't use the whole thing, but there's some really great orchestral
pieces suitable for climactic battles, mysterious danger, etc. Let me tell
you, it improved our confrontation with Nightlords and their army by at LEAST
200%.

In fact, in SR some more pieces (with Japanese lyrics) might even be useful.
(Heck, I also just sit and listen to it, for that matter...)

- Sean
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 22:04:27 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: DisnyShamn <DisnyShamn@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Skill Level 0
Mime-Version: 1.0
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Me:
> >> I, personally, allow exactly that in my game.

Quantum:
> >How do you get it to work?
> >I'm assuming that you mean that you don't have a general skill, just a
> >concentration?

D.Ghost
> I allow the same thing in my campaigns, so I'm guessing he handles it the
> same way I do, or in a similar manner ... when you want to use the
> general skill 1) default from another stat, or 2) use the rules in SRCo
> pg 48 for defaulting from concentrations / specializations ... (I use
> option 2)

Feel kinda silly quoting all that to just say this, but: Basically, yeah.

Bear in mind I don't overmuch like the defaulting rules as they are. I don't
really know what to do about it, but the solution in the Compendium is
certainly an improvement.

My own GM doesn't allow us the choice in defaulting -- if you have the skill,
you HAVE to use the skill (at least, last time I checked), no matter what your
default is; the result is that someone defaulting at +2 target from skill 8
(which is fairly competent) who goes and *trains* (1 die) in the actual skill
becomes *abyssmal*.

As I'm sure some have, I was toying, for my game, with the idea of subtracting
dice with skill substitutions, rather than adding to targets. Anyone have any
success with this?


- Disney Shaman
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 19:11:23 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Jeremy \"Bolthy\" Zimmerman"
<jeremy@***********.COM>
Subject: Re: Mood music
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
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----------
> From: DisnyShamn <DisnyShamn@***.COM>
> To: SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET
> Subject: Re: Mood music
> Date: Monday, May 25, 1998 6:54 PM
>
> Me said:
>
> > It's even more important to have recurring NPC villains, especially
> > powerful ones, have theme music! Preferably one that starts low
> > and builds, so you can surruptitiously start it playing and watch
> > the looks on the players faces as it builds up and they realize
> > who's coming...
>
> Learned at yesterday's game some of the Really Effective music is that my
> Nightspawn GM had been using; the soundtrack from The Vision of
Escaflowne
> (anime). Doesn't use the whole thing, but there's some really great
orchestral
> pieces suitable for climactic battles, mysterious danger, etc. Let me
tell
> you, it improved our confrontation with Nightlords and their army by at
LEAST
> 200%.
>
> In fact, in SR some more pieces (with Japanese lyrics) might even be
useful.
> (Heck, I also just sit and listen to it, for that matter...)
>

On other hand, I played Billy Idol's "Cyberpunk" once, and almost got
lynched.
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 22:43:30 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Multi-target rituals
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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In a message dated 5/25/98 8:39:16 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
evamarie@**********.net writes:

> > IT did have some strange effects (Sam's ritual that is). How is this for
a
> > thought? The "dust" that Sam used in the books was nothing more than
a
> > "sighter" for the ritual, a mobile material link, for lack of better
terms.
>
> > As the waves of the magic expanded, it "ground out" into the Dust,
> igniting it
> > as a "Manifestual Effect", and allowing the Ritual Energies to do
their
> duty.
> >
> > -K
> Um, maybe were thinking of diferent rituals (or mey memory is quite
> bad)? In any case, unusual effects there are easly explained; A) Its a
> ghost dance B) Its a NOVEL. Neither follows normal SR rules. :)
> I don't remebr a Dust in any case, but I do remeber it resolving
> MANY
> diffrent plot threads at once.
>
Okay, a dance through the craze haze of memory here....

Each of the site teams were supposed to go through a series of steps to
"trigger" the materials, which was kept in a "medicine bag" with each
team.
Striper and the Thief had one, and it described the thief going through the
motions after they beat the one thing or two in their way.

It described Sam's sister and Ghost going through the motions on their end in
the downed Ocoola (sp?) once they had beaten the forces back enough.

It also described the -REAL- team (sorry, Sally, Ghost and Kam just were a
Runner Team, not a MERC team, and I think that is more my personal style) with
Sam's girlfriend going at it in the remote citadel, which for some reason
reminds of the "Navarone" movie. In that episode, the dear lady was nearly
killed, reached into the bag and tossed the sand/dust into the air, it caught
fire (manifestual appearance) and kept going from there.

Yeah, the first couple at least had some symmetry to their descrips, while the
last was something else. Of course, the lady (whose name I am just
forgettiing) was likely initiated as she did more magic than just about anyone
else and therefore could likely compensate for not "going through the
motions."

My thinking was the motions/dust were one set of establishing triggers that
would set off a particular "astral signature" which the "ritual" that
Sam and
the others were performing would recognize and literally "ground out" the
desired effects. THAT is what I am getting at with "grounding out to multiple
targets". There is some particular triggering mechanism or "astral flare"
that a given ritual responds to.

I am sorry, I know what I am trying to say, I am just not finding the words
for it right now...

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 22:58:49 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: BigDaddy <bigdaddy@*****.COM>
Organization: @**** Network
Subject: Re: Mood music
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

DisnyShamn wrote:
>

> Learned at yesterday's game some of the Really Effective music is that my
> Nightspawn GM had been using; the soundtrack from The Vision of Escaflowne
> (anime). Doesn't use the whole thing, but there's some really great orchestral
> pieces suitable for climactic battles, mysterious danger, etc. Let me tell
> you, it improved our confrontation with Nightlords and their army by at LEAST
> 200%.
>
> In fact, in SR some more pieces (with Japanese lyrics) might even be useful.
> (Heck, I also just sit and listen to it, for that matter...)
>
> - Sean

What about the soundtrack from Akira(all time great anime), the chasing
of the clowns (something like that) was used in mine when the runners
were in hot pursuit by corps.
--
Napalm Sticks to Kidz,
BigDaddy
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 23:54:52 -0300
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ubiratan P. Alberton" <ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR>
Subject: Re: Harvesting (Re: Giving blood in 205X: common or rare?)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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Ereskanti escreveu:
>
> In a message dated 5/24/98 4:48:23 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
> ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR writes:
>
> > There's a movie with Christopher Lambert tha comes
> > to my mind... >)
> >
> > Bira
> Which one? I don't remember anything off the top of my head. And as for the
> idea of a "Harvester" waking up, yeah, we've tampered with that thought
> before. Not really pursued it though, at least not yet...
>
> -K

I don't recall the original name, but I think it was something like
Adrenalin. A
mutated human with a mortal plague wich will "wake up" in 24 hrs is
being pursued by
a group of cops, and enters an abandoned prision. They go after him but
the thing is very
intelligent. The movie doesn't has this title for nothing :) .

Bira
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 23:44:27 -0300
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ubiratan P. Alberton" <ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR>
Subject: Re: Acers
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

roun escreveu:


(snip acer description)

> IMO, this could have been done better, way better. something based along
> these lines could be made with R2 rules maybe. but this is not a remote
> set of armor, you wear this thing. i dunno, not too good in my opinion.
> i think i can email some more info on it to interested parties but i did
> not want to just reprint the whole article here, cuz ya never know whos
> watching.
>
>

IMHO, it's not practical to use R2 rules (altough I don't have the
book, I have seen
plenty of demonstration here :) ) to build powered armor. After all, in
spite of the motors,
it's a suit of armor, not a vehicle. I said earlier that I had an
article on powered armor
based on the Hardsuits of Bubblegum Crisis. It doesn't follow any
published construction rules,
but I think it's worth a look. If you want that, please mail me
privately.

Bira
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 23:56:34 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Mark A. Imbriaco" <mark.imbriaco@*****.COM>
Subject: [ADMIN] Duplicates and the purge.
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

1) I'm aware of the duplicate message problem. I don't see anything
obvious causing it right now, so I'm going to ignore it until I restart
the lists.

2) Re: Resetting the lists. Here's how it's going to work.

1. I send out a message saying that the lists are getting
reset.
2. Wait 30 minutes.
3. Completely remove the lists from the server.
4. Re-create the list.

At this point, everything will be back online and ready to roll
with the new list. I don't intend to put the lists on hold or
anything of that nature, so once you've subscribed, assume that
the list is 'live'. I suspect that the lists will be available
approximately 1 hour after I send the message saying that I am
beginning the reset. In practice it will only take me a couple
of minutes to do it, but I want to give the mail a chance to
propagate.

Hopefully that will clear things up a little bit.

-Mark

=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 15:50:23 +1200
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Danyel N Woods <9604801@********.AC.NZ>
Subject: Re: EW-209 (was : Aztec Armored Troopers)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

Quoth Ubiratan P Alberton (1502 22-5-98):

<<SLICE my post>>
>Why don't you just make the damn things remote-controlled? One single
>rigger
>(perhaps in a r-tank at the home base) could pilot several, and in case
>of jamming
>they'd proceed to shoot anything that doesn't show a proper ID on a IFF
>(incoming
>friens or foe) system built into the autopilot (wich should be around
>5).

Well, for one thing, Bira, radio links can be jammed, and Identification
Friend or Foe (IFF) systems are too dicey: what happens if you have to
turn off your IFF to penetrate enemy lines (who also have IFF), and the
unit interprets the lack of signal as an 'enemy'? Remember Robocop 1,
when ED-209 was first demonstrated to the Board? Remember how they had
to take a guy out of the room in a bucket? That was a faulty threat
routine in the IFF software. You need a human mind *in the cockpit* to
prevent fratricide like that in heavy-jamming environments (which would
be most 205X battlefields). This is where 'volunteer' Crusher pilots
come in. In areas where 'collateral damage' doesn't matter, the
'Berserkers' are turned loose - which leads me to my next point.

For another point, the whole *idea* of my mean-machine was to have a
human (or what was left of one) inside these things. When (*if*) the
PCs take one of these things down and take to it with a DiKoted
can-opener, they'll be shocked/horrified to find a 'brain in a jar'
running it. Y'know, sort of an editorial on the inhumanity the corps
are capable of?

<PC conversation>
"Jesus, they cut off the guy's limbs and *permanently* wired him into
this thing? What about the rest of him?"
"Spare parts."
"Aw, shit, man...What's that gotta do to his mind? D'you think he's
still sane?"
"D'you think the Azzies care?"
"...!"

Danyel Woods
9604801@********.ac.nz
'Are you deliberately trying to drive me insane?'
'The universe is already mad. Anything else would be
redundant.'
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 15:59:50 +1200
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Danyel N Woods <9604801@********.AC.NZ>
Subject: Re: Harvesting (Re: Giving blood in 205X: common or rare?)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

Quoth Ubiratan P Alberton (1455 26-5-98 NZT):

<<SLICE>>
>> > There's a movie with Christopher Lambert tha comes
>> > to my mind... >)
>> >
>> > Bira
>> Which one? I don't remember anything off the top of my head. And as
for the
>> idea of a "Harvester" waking up, yeah, we've tampered with that
thought
>> before. Not really pursued it though, at least not yet...
>>
>> -K
>
> I don't recall the original name, but I think it was something like
>Adrenalin. A
>mutated human with a mortal plague wich will "wake up" in 24 hrs is
>being pursued by
>a group of cops, and enters an abandoned prision. They go after him but
>the thing is very
>intelligent. The movie doesn't has this title for nothing :) .

If that's the one I'm thinking off, the title (in English) was
Adrenaline: Fear the Rush. Natasha (Species I & II) Henstridge played
the female lead, which was about the only reason I rented the video :-).
(Well, that and I was looking for 'Run ideas).
My brother reckoned it sucked. I wouldn't go *that* far, but it ain't
an Oscar candidate.

Danyel Woods
9604801@********.ac.nz
'Are you deliberately trying to drive me insane?'
'The universe is already mad. Anything else would be
redundant.'
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 11:34:52 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: rabiola <rabiola@**.NETCOM.COM>
Subject: Re: [OT] Sideways Smileys
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

>
>>Ever catch yourself signing your net-name to a check? For some
reason,
>I
>>don't think the credit union is going to take a check signed by
Nexx...
>>
>>Nexx
>
>Haven't done that, but I do find that a disturbing lot of the time, I
>think /me instead of I (ie normal peeps say "I have to do this today",
I
>think "/me has to do this today") oh well...
>


Haven't gotten to that point, but around these parts we put our handle
and well as real name on our name badges at conventions; you'd be
surprised at how many people recognize the handle before the name or
face.

Tony Rabiola rabiola@**.netcom.com
Fourth and Sixth World Adept
Still working on the Fifth...
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 11:54:29 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: rabiola <rabiola@**.NETCOM.COM>
Subject: Re: (ot) Insect spirits living in my bathroom (was: insect
spirits)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

>I'm taking a bath. I lean back to rinse my hair, and I see a hornet
>crawling up the wall. ABout two inches long, I kid you not. So of
>course, I freak out and look around for something to kill it with. I
>pass over several items, cause I'm afraid if I don't kill it on the
>first hit, I'll be in a world of hurt. So I grab a flat wooden-backed
>bath brush, and sit there, in the tub, trying to get up the cojones to
>hit the thing. After about 5 minutes of sitting there with the brush in
>midair, I finally whack it. Of course, it falls into the bathtub with
>me, at which point I promptly scream and try to hide in the farthest
>three square inches of the tub. All the swirling water from my fleeing
>sweeps the thing within, like, two inches of me, and I'm trying to get
>away from it since it's still moving, even though I'm already backed up
>against the wall. I grab the brush and sweep the hornet onto the floor,
>where I promptly bludgeon it with a shampoo bottle.
>


LAUGH! Too funny, Jett! We have those over-sized bug-a-boos here as
well, and they make anyone sit up and take wary notice...they are BIG
bugs. Maybe why bugs are such a serious enemy for SR, eh? Some sort of
universal fear in the human species.

Tony Rabiola rabiola@**.netcom.com
Fourth and Sixth World Adept
Still working on the Fifth...
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 00:31:55 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Convention Stuff (Re: [OT] Sideways Smileys)
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/25/98 11:18:16 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
rabiola@**.NETCOM.COM writes:

> Haven't gotten to that point, but around these parts we put our handle
> and well as real name on our name badges at conventions; you'd be
> surprised at how many people recognize the handle before the name or
> face.
>
Actually, to that end effect I am not surprised at all. I was a dinner once
not long ago with my roommate, who dragged me along for company. As he was
introducing himself and me, he'd say "YHONE", which is his screen name, then
there'd be this cacophony of "I KNOW YOU!!!" Mercifully, "Ereskanti"
is more
than rare-enough to not get such responses. Somehow, I think that will be
different in August....

Anyway, on that topic. Assuming no one makes any major choices on T-Shirts
for the RN group, I am just fore-warning everyone that I am probably going to
try and have one of my own made. Yeah, it'll be more expensive, and I'll
likely have it done at one of the local air-brush booths. It won't have the
nifty names, but it will definitely make certain -some- people will recognize
me.

BUT, I am still interested in one of the List shirts...

My vote is for the "shirt back" like Granite made, with the "ShadowRN"
done in
"Shadowrun" formatting, and for the alternate backing that Wafflemeisters'
made. I still think those "Cogs" of his were cool, and probably a bit easier
to do on formatting for a print.

We'll see I guess....

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 00:36:53 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Wordman <wordman@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: Way [OT]: Translating
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

David Buehrer <dbuehrer@******.CARL.ORG> wrote:
>Does anyone know the translations in Spanish, Italian, German and
>French for the seasons: Winter, Spring, Summer and Fall.

English (from personal knowledge):
winter, spring, summer, fall/autumn

Spanish (Harper Collins Spanish-English dictionary):
invierno, primavera, verano, otoño*
*the second to last character above is an enya: an n with a squiggle

French (from Dennison French-English ditionary):
hiver, printemps, été*, automne
*accented e at beginning and end.

German (from Collins Gem German-English dictionary):
Winter, Frühling*, Sommer, Herbst
*The u has an umlaut.

Italian (sorry, don't know):

Russian (from Oxford Russian-English dictionary):
zima, vesna, leto, osen

Japanese (from Webster's Japanese-English dictionary):
fuyu, haru, natsu, aki

Elvish (from _The_Languages_of_Tolien's_Middle_Earth_):
Quenya: hrivë*, tuilë*, laire, yávië*
Sindarin: hrîw, ethuil, laer, iavas
*the final e has an umlaut
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 00:46:39 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Jett <grota@*********.COM>
Subject: Re: Convention Stuff (Re: [OT] Sideways Smileys)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Ereskanti wrote:
>
> In a message dated 5/25/98 11:18:16 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
> rabiola@**.NETCOM.COM writes:
>
> > Haven't gotten to that point, but around these parts we put our handle
> > and well as real name on our name badges at conventions; you'd be
> > surprised at how many people recognize the handle before the name or
> > face.
> >

I don't think anyone will have trouble IDing the great Jettster by her
nick (yup, I'll be one of the likely minority female gamers). But to
make it easy, I just might walk around with a purple triangle painted
over my left eye, just to make things a bit easier. ;)

--Jett
=========================================================================
Date: Mon, 25 May 1998 11:00:18 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: rabiola <rabiola@**.NETCOM.COM>
Subject: Re: Pool Use (was; Summer Time)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

> Given that, does anybody else find it odd that having multiple
pools
>essentially makes it BETTER to divide you attention among multiple task
>types? The most common case is the mage who uses his magic pool for
>magical offense (and maybe defense) while still getting his whole
combat
>pool for damage resistance. Why does he get to use ALL of BOTH pools,
>when clearly, his attention is divided? If a samurai is using ONLY
>combat pool, why does he effectively get fewer pool dice?
>(Note that this is less aproblem with other pool combos, but still
>noticable).
>Having multiple pools should NOT mean you can acsess them all freely,
as
>that would require you attention to be spilt more than using only one
>pool, which should not give a bonus.
>


What about applying a +2 modifier if trying to use two pools at once?
Much simpler to implement, and similar to other situations when a
character is trying to do another thing while already busy with the
first.

Tony Rabiola rabiola@**.netcom.com
Fourth and Sixth World Adept
Still working on the Fifth...
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 02:18:45 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: MC23 <mc23@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: Duplicate Posts and Revised List
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

Once upon a time, Adam J wrote;

>If nobody is subscribed there will be no posts.
>
>So: Everyone is unsubscribed. People resubscribe when they get the time.
>Conversation restarts where it was left off.

But if I can't resubscribe for a while I miss all the posts after the
current list gets scrapped. There has got to be some kind of work around
for us diehards who won't be there at the moment of change.

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

Ancient cultures believed that names held great power, personal names
more so and they were guarded very closely. To protect themselves, they
answered to another name, because if another discovered their real name,
it could be used against them.
History repeats itself.
Welcome to the Digital Age.
I am MC23
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 16:33:33 +1000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Robert Watkins <robert.watkins@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Duplicate Posts and Revised List
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

MC23 writes:
>Once upon a time, Adam J wrote;
>
>>If nobody is subscribed there will be no posts.
>>
>>So: Everyone is unsubscribed. People resubscribe when they get the time.
>>Conversation restarts where it was left off.
>
>But if I can't resubscribe for a while I miss all the posts after the
>current list gets scrapped. There has got to be some kind of work around
>for us diehards who won't be there at the moment of change.


Either:
a) Use the logs.
b) Stay online and wait... sleep is for lozerz. :)
c) Send a money order (cheques bounce) to Adam, for $US50, so that he can
subscribe you instantly after he has scrapped the existing subscriptions.
Note that amounts for less than $US50 will cause him to subscribe you
_before_ he has scrapped the existing subscriptions. Amounts greater than
$US50 will be used to establish the order in which he will resubscribe
people. Note that sending such a money order would entitle you to add the
following title to your .sig: ShadowRN List Sucker

Personally, I'm using option c. :)

--
sig deleted to conserve electrons. robert.watkins@******.com
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 02:13:25 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: rabiola <rabiola@**.NETCOM.COM>
Subject: Re: T-shirt - proposed art link
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

>>
>> Iv'e worked up a crude representation of a list shirt idea I'd like
to
>> do. Check it out: http://www.concentric.net/~evamarie/RNSHIRTB.GIF
>> (caps required). Its only 16K.
>
>It's got my vote! I'd watch out for the alternate back (circular
>pattern). It looks cool - I like it better than standard columns - but
>I can see it getting a bit too dizzifying.
>


I'll second that one, alternate back.

Tony Rabiola rabiola@**.netcom.com
Fourth and Sixth World Adept
Still working on the Fifth...
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 04:01:34 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Waffelmeisters <evamarie@**********.NET>
Subject: Ingentization
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Well, It's official. I'm turning into a troll. :] I visited the
dentist, and that weird poking feeling in the back of my left upper jaw
is my 33rd tooth coming in. There's a matching one on the other side
waiting to join it. (that makes 34, two more than non-trolls should
ever have, according to SR racial descriptions).
Next thing you know, I'll bust out in warts and gain 350 lbs...
Were there any reported cases of "spike UGE"? That could save me a LOT
in dentist bills (not to mention make me some good money as a circus
freek). Actually, the dentist says these extra molars are not to rare-
it happens to 1-2% of the population...
-Mongoose X
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 20:29:50 +1200
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Danyel N Woods <9604801@********.AC.NZ>
Subject: Rigger 2 design sheet
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

I found an MS Excel spreadsheet on the 'net somewhere that let people
design vehicles according to the R2 rules. Unfortunately, I
accidentally deleted it a few weeks ago during a clean-out. Could
someone mail me this sheet privately, or direct me to the site where I
could find this download? (I want to check my ED-209 design according
to the rules.)

Thanks a ton.

Danyel Woods
9604801@********.ac.nz
'Are you deliberately trying to drive me insane?'
'The universe is already mad. Anything else would be
redundant.'
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 12:58:41 +1000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: NightRain <nightrain@***.BRISNET.ORG.AU>
Subject: Re: (Back on topic) Insect spirits living in my bathroom
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

-----Original Message-----
From: Quantum <a.hides@*******.QUT.EDU.AU>


>Ok. I'm guessing that the things that we call hornets in Australia
are
>different to the ones in America. The ones in Australia are just
black
>and orange things that can't even sting. All the do is build
annoying mud
>nests....


No, I think you just have a little bit of a misunderstanding. They
sting alright, although they don't tend to be quite as agro as
everyone on the list is describing.

NightRain.

----------------------------------------------------------------------
| The universe is a big place, |
| and whatever happens, you will not be missed |
----------------------------------------------------------------------

http://nightrain.home.ml.org

EMAIL : nightrain@***.brisnet.org.au
: macey@***.brisnet.org.au
ICQ : 2587947
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 12:55:26 +1000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: NightRain <nightrain@***.BRISNET.ORG.AU>
Subject: Re: Hardsuits
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

-----Original Message-----
From: Ubiratan P. Alberton <ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR>


> If you want another view on the power-armor stuff, I have a
>file with an adaptation of the fabled Hardsuits from Bubblegum Crisis
to
>Sr2. No Acer needed :) . If anyone wants this, send me mail in
private
>and I'll
>send it directly.


I'd love to see it.

Thanks,

NightRain.

----------------------------------------------------------------------
| The universe is a big place, |
| and whatever happens, you will not be missed |
----------------------------------------------------------------------

http://nightrain.home.ml.org

EMAIL : nightrain@***.brisnet.org.au
: macey@***.brisnet.org.au
ICQ : 2587947
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 12:17:17 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: Re: Acers
In-Reply-To: <356A2C8B.74ED4817@************.com.br>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

Ubiratan P. Alberton said on 23:44/25 May 98...

> IMHO, it's not practical to use R2 rules (altough I don't have the
> book, I have seen plenty of demonstration here :) ) to build powered
> armor.

Not unless you first design a chassis and probably an engine for it. I
tried building a walker vehicle with room for one occupant once, but
couldn't because of load restrictions -- basically, the resulting vehicle
wasn't strong enough to carry a bucket seats without overloading it. It
would still be possible to add a bucket seat, but in essence the vehicle
would be permanently attempting to lift/pull something (namely, the
driver) and suffer stress and other unwanted problems.

> After all, in spite of the motors, it's a suit of armor, not a vehicle.

But where exactly does the difference between a suit of powered armor
and a walker vehicle lie?

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
We never choose to be anything but truthful. It's right there in our
manual, under Lies.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- + --+--
Version 3.1: | Incubated into
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N | the First Church of
o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ | the Sqooshy Ball
tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y? | 21 May 1998
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ + --+--
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 11:18:34 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
In-Reply-To: <356A84EE.27A7@**********.net> from "Waffelmeisters" at May
26,
98 04:01:34 am
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

And verily, did Waffelmeisters hastily scribble thusly...
| Were there any reported cases of "spike UGE"?

As a matter of fact, yes.
Read Harlequin, or play it.
One adventure is based in Germany....
I won't say any more though...
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 11:15:49 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Duplicate Posts and Revised List
In-Reply-To: <199805260620.CAA07158@******.mindspring.com> from "MC23" at
May
26, 98 02:18:45 am
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

And verily, did MC23 hastily scribble thusly...
|
|Once upon a time, Adam J wrote;
|
|>If nobody is subscribed there will be no posts.
|>
|>So: Everyone is unsubscribed. People resubscribe when they get the time.
|>Conversation restarts where it was left off.
|
|But if I can't resubscribe for a while I miss all the posts after the
|current list gets scrapped. There has got to be some kind of work around
|for us diehards who won't be there at the moment of change.

This is worrying me...
I can't stand it when I come back to the list only to find... nothing...
I *HATE* list crashes, and the fact that I know that it's going to happen
when I might not be there to do it only makes it worse....

PLEASE... Come up with a solution for us addicts....

Please?


--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 11:12:44 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Way [OT]: Translating
In-Reply-To: <l03110701b18feff54708@[100.100.100.10]> from "Wordman" at
May
26, 98 00:36:53 am
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

And verily, did Wordman hastily scribble thusly...
|Elvish (from _The_Languages_of_Tolien's_Middle_Earth_):
|Quenya: hrivë*, tuilë*, laire, yávië*
|Sindarin: hrîw, ethuil, laer, iavas
|*the final e has an umlaut

And WHY haven't you given the same translations in Sperethiel?
That *IS* the true elven language after all....

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 11:07:06 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Duplicate Posts and Revised List
In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980525170531.0086a3a0@****.lis.ab.ca> from "Adam
J"
at May 25, 98 05:05:31 pm
MIME-Version: 1.0
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And verily, did Adam J hastily scribble thusly...
|If nobody is subscribed there will be no posts.
|
|So: Everyone is unsubscribed. People resubscribe when they get the time.
|Conversation restarts where it was left off.

What day is this going to happen again?
I'm off at the TA all weekend, and I don't want to miss anything.

(PSSSSSST... Adam.... Could you resub me? Please? Pretty please?)

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 08:48:50 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: DisnyShamn <DisnyShamn@***.COM>
Subject: Power Armor
Mime-Version: 1.0
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> Please do search out that article, mister Machine-Gun. Power-armour
> might be interesting, if only for curiosity's sake; it'd certainly
> explain how people can actually function in Military-grade armour that
> weighs what, 20+ kilos by itself? Between that and the other gear
> they'd have to pack, power-armour would be about the only way they cou=
ld
> *move*!

Though I've no actual rules for creation – it's all GM-arbitrary so far=
– the Brody Mk IV power armor for my "ShadowZone" campaign masses 10=
0 kg; the main effect of the "powerdness" is to reduce this to a mere 1=
0 kg of encumbrance. It takes damage something like a vehicle; instead =
of damage reducing speed, however, it simply increases the percentage o=
f encumbrance (Light wound = 20kg, Moderate = 50 kg, Severe = 75 =
kg, Deadly = 100 kg/Forget moving). One could get it boosted, to comp=
letely eliminate the weight and/or provide increased Strength, but of c=
ourse this is going to increase overall mass (and cost, of course. :)

Disney Shaman
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 09:15:26 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ojaste,James [NCR]" <James.Ojaste@**.GC.CA>
Subject: Re: Rigger 2 design sheet
MIME-Version: 1.0
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>I found an MS Excel spreadsheet on the 'net somewhere that let people
>design vehicles according to the R2 rules. Unfortunately, I
>accidentally deleted it a few weeks ago during a clean-out. Could
>someone mail me this sheet privately, or direct me to the site where I
>could find this download? (I want to check my ED-209 design according
>to the rules.)

Well, it's not a spreadsheet, but why don't you try The Shop? It's an
R2 vehicle editor for W95 available from:
http://ojaste.ml.org/~ojastej/SRII/

It's currently at version 1.2.6

James Ojaste
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 09:31:28 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Duplicate Posts and Revised List
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In a message dated 5/26/98 1:21:21 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
mc23@**********.COM writes:

> >So: Everyone is unsubscribed. People resubscribe when they get the time.
> >Conversation restarts where it was left off.
>
> But if I can't resubscribe for a while I miss all the posts after the
> current list gets scrapped. There has got to be some kind of work around
> for us diehards who won't be there at the moment of change.
>
Yeah, there is. It's called the Archives...
-K
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 09:34:46 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Duplicate Posts and Revised List
Mime-Version: 1.0
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In a message dated 5/26/98 1:37:52 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
robert.watkins@******.COM writes:

> Either:
> a) Use the logs.
> b) Stay online and wait... sleep is for lozerz. :)
> c) Send a money order (cheques bounce) to Adam, for $US50, so that he can
> subscribe you instantly after he has scrapped the existing subscriptions.
> Note that amounts for less than $US50 will cause him to subscribe you
> _before_ he has scrapped the existing subscriptions. Amounts greater than
> $US50 will be used to establish the order in which he will resubscribe
> people. Note that sending such a money order would entitle you to add the
> following title to your .sig: ShadowRN List Sucker
>
ROFLMFAO
-K
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 09:49:04 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ojaste,James [NCR]" <James.Ojaste@**.GC.CA>
Subject: Re: Acers
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Gurth wrote:
>> IMHO, it's not practical to use R2 rules (altough I don't have the
>> book, I have seen plenty of demonstration here :) ) to build powered
>> armor.
>
>Not unless you first design a chassis and probably an engine for it. I
>tried building a walker vehicle with room for one occupant once, but
>couldn't because of load restrictions
>[snip]
>> After all, in spite of the motors, it's a suit of armor, not a vehicle.
>
>But where exactly does the difference between a suit of powered armor
>and a walker vehicle lie?

The suit of powered armour has an occupant? Is meant to be piloted
internally instead of remotely? Something like that. Yeah, go ahead.
Build a new chassis. Technically, SRII tech should be able to handle
it (just build a cyber body that's a little bigger and hollow), but
it would be hugely expensive. I'd give it the Unusual design/features
markup of 1.2 and a milspec markup of 5, and remove the "drone" markup
for a final markup of 11.

James Ojaste
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 08:14:25 -0600
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: David Buehrer <dbuehrer@******.CARL.ORG>
Subject: Re: Way [OT]: Translating
In-Reply-To: <199805240248.UAA06378@******.carl.org> from "Jeremy
\"Bolthy\"
Zimmerman" at May 23, 98 07:42:40 pm
Content-Type: text

Thank You: Jett, Jeremy, Annihilator, Cobra, and Wordman, for all your
help.

-David
--
"If I told you, then I'd have to pull a Shadowrun against you. Sorry."
--
email: dbuehrer@******.carl.org
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/1068/homepage.htm
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 10:42:50 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ojaste,James [NCR]" <James.Ojaste@**.GC.CA>
Subject: Re: Duplicate Posts and Revised List
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
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Robert Watkins wrote:
>Either:
>a) Use the logs.
>b) Stay online and wait... sleep is for lozerz. :)
>c) Send a money order (cheques bounce) to Adam, for $US50, so that he can

Just one small detail - Adam is Canadian. Sending him C$75 is roughly
equivalent and much more convenient... :-)

>subscribe you instantly after he has scrapped the existing subscriptions.
>Note that amounts for less than $US50 will cause him to subscribe you
>_before_ he has scrapped the existing subscriptions. Amounts greater than
>$US50 will be used to establish the order in which he will resubscribe
>people. Note that sending such a money order would entitle you to add the
>following title to your .sig: ShadowRN List Sucker
>
>Personally, I'm using option c. :)

I'll just use option d) Wait until I regain access to this email account
on Monday when I can resub. I can't reasonably access this account
from home, and I don't want to overload my poor machine with the 500+
megs of mail that I currently have archived (well, SR isn't most of
that, but there's several weeks of SR that I haven't gotten around
to archiving yet...) :-)

James Ojaste
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 10:40:49 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Acers
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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In a message dated 5/26/98 8:46:00 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
James.Ojaste@**.GC.CA writes:

> >Not unless you first design a chassis and probably an engine for it. I
> >tried building a walker vehicle with room for one occupant once, but
> >couldn't because of load restrictions
> >[snip]
> >> After all, in spite of the motors, it's a suit of armor, not a vehicle.
> >
> >But where exactly does the difference between a suit of powered armor
> >and a walker vehicle lie?
>
> The suit of powered armour has an occupant? Is meant to be piloted
> internally instead of remotely? Something like that. Yeah, go ahead.
> Build a new chassis. Technically, SRII tech should be able to handle
> it (just build a cyber body that's a little bigger and hollow), but
> it would be hugely expensive. I'd give it the Unusual design/features
> markup of 1.2 and a milspec markup of 5, and remove the "drone" markup
> for a final markup of 11.

Okay folks, if you want to build "Power Armor", you had best start looking at
the given mods within the rules and literally "flipping" them.

Please note, I am talking about the R2 rules here, not anything in first ed.
You could build anything in first ed., because first ed B/R didn't tell you
what to -really- do.

When you want build a -real- walker, try using the "Crane" modifications, only
do it to more than two limbs, and flip them upside down. Turn them into
"Jacks", and use the same rules. Use James' suggestion of special markups and
the like for cost modifiers. It isn't -that- hard to build a Star Wars At-At,
though the smaller one's (symbols I don't care to remember) are harder. The
trick is to gain a chassis that is light enough for two of four limbs to
support. Apply Structural Agility (this -IS- the kind of thing that option
was meant for) with some liberal cost. Apply Engine Customization, but don't
give any bonuses for the first level at all. Just let that first level
represent the additional work needed to modify existing drive trains to work
on the jack/limbs proportionately. Utilize cost factors for "Mechanical
Limbs" as additional work, and to reflect a greater degree of control over the
Jack/Limbs.

Yes, this is stretching it, but that is exactly what has to be done in order
to get "Walkers" in SR the scale that everyone keeps wanting to reach.

Mechs.

That is the majority of people's end goals here in this discussion after all.
Just to find out how "Far Can You Go."

As for "Power Armor". Here is a thought. Give the system an
"Anthroform"
beginning body, and remember that the Power Plant in the "armor" isn't the
-only- engine that is working with the weight. There is also the (meta)human
occupant who get's to utilize his/her own muscles in it as well.

We recently designed some armor along these lines, using variations on Heavy
Milspec and the Jym suits in the book. Taking into account the environment
was either going to be water or space for the design basis, where weight vs.
mass weren't -quite- consistent with the surface environment of "standard
gravity".

A LONG time ago now, Mike and I were both talking about taking the designs and
rearranging them to get other stuff. THIS is kind of what we meant. The
"Power Armor" that we came up with the "Titanic Recovery" game was
very
strange, and it became -very- obvious how dangerous it was. Especially when
that stupid submarine showed up (as in -Hull- attribute vehicle, not -Bod-).
No spell or weapon we had could directly effect it.

Freeze Water. Gotta love the mechanics of Ice chunks and pressure.

But guys, come on. You -CAN- design anything you want still, it just takes
some more thinking to do it. At least here, the thinking is the fun part.

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 11:27:02 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Mike Elkins <MikeE@*********.COM>
Subject: Re: Hacking Security Tallies (Was Re: Weird Campaigns)

Gurth wrote:
>But there's still a part that depends on software -- some or another
>routine has to check whether the key is in the computer. If you can
>fool that, you're as good as there. (Except for defeating any IC that
>may be sitting around the security tally...)

No, not if you design it correctly. If hardware controls access to that
section of memory or whatever, then there is no amount of software
changing that can modify it.

Before people use this to design un-hackable computers, remember that
anything in hardware must be designed in when the machine is
designed, and can never be changed or updated. Also, good design
practices indicate that you should keep this part as simple as possible.
Putting ICE there probably wont work. Putting a simple listing of what
ICE should exist on the system probably would.

Double-Domed Mike
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 11:53:32 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Dust <rogan@******.ORG>
Subject: Distance Strike Signature
In-Reply-To: <s56aa9b0.015@********.dragonsys.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Many PC physads in my campaigns have the distance strike power. We've
interpreted it as the hadugens from Street Fighter II so we figured each
character has a different signature. (like a spell signature) Like the
koborkuru dwarf does a spinning jump kick which emits a blast.

Any of you have any thoughts or similar ideas?

Lates,

Dust

*****************************************
* Roger J. An *
* rogan@******.org *
* http://users.bergen.org/~rogan/ *
*****************************************
* "I always think I've got it all *
* figured out. Then I live another day *
* and it gets more complicated." *
* - Scud the Disposable Assassin *
*****************************************
* "I slack therefore I am." *
* - Roger J. An *
*****************************************
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 09:00:42 PDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: walker of shadows <wkr_shadows@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: More thoughts about clones and magic
Content-Type: text/plain

>Subject: More thoughts about clones and magic
>
>Last night I posted an idea about a teleport spell using
>clones, and that lead me to think about something else. You
>can use DNA like a blood sample, skin, or hair as a ritual
>link. Now what if the target of the ritual has a clone? Since
>this clone's DNA is an exact replica of the target's, what
>happens to the ritual spell? Does it affect the target, the
>clone, or both simultaneously?
>
>Let's say it's the latter (which is the result I am leaning
>toward); consider this. Let's say a mage wants to take out a
>large group of people in one fell swoop (like a rioting mob,
>or an enemy army). Insert a group of clones (all alike) into
>the mob at spaced intervals. The mage then casts a ritual into
>the target; one of the clones, or the original. The spell will
>ground out through all the clones. If an area effect physical
>spell was cast, a very large area could be covered. The clones
>would probably get wasted, but so would a lot of people in the
>target area.
>What do you think? Feasible, whacked-out, or just plain silly?
>

Well, according to SHADOWTECH, in 2053 human Geomegeering was only in
its "vegistative" stages. hmmmm...

Well, the spell would probably only go to the target. WHY?

In one of the various SR sourcebooks it says, "The spell targets the
person's AURA."

In another it says, "Even identical twins don't have the same
fingerprints, and they don't have the same aura, as each person's is
different."

mabie i'm just fragged, but I think it would only target the target.



Walker Of Shadows

---------------------------------------------------------

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
+In the shadows darkness reigns, +
+and I am the one walks the path +
+between both of these worlds. +
+ -Walker of Shadows +
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++


______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 13:06:37 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: MC23 <mc23@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: Idea for Spell Drain
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

Once upon a time, Airwasp wrote;

>Okay, something I have been mulling over for a spell design I am in the
>process of making is building in additional drain which will happen
>irregardless of how the normal drain for the spell is dealt with. And this
>extra damage is dealt with when the spell is done being sustained, or as soon
>as the spell is cast for Instantaneous spells.

<snip the rest>

Extra drain could be justified for use with sustained spells but I
don't understand it's use for an instantaneous spell. Instantaneous
Spells is handled all at once, Higher drain not multiple drain, that's
how the game mechanics are set up to handle things (1 staging is a higher
level). Two serious drains should be one deadly drain.
Sustained spells could make sense for a secondary drain but the +2
target modifier also represents this which does affect the mage greatly.
I could possibly see a recurring drain modifier for sustained spells
(like exclusive or fetish modifiers) where the drain is reduced but that
same drain must be tested against the beginning of every new turn.

That has some possibilities but I don't know if I would use it or
that it's what you were after.

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

Ancient cultures believed that names held great power, personal names
more so and they were guarded very closely. To protect themselves, they
answered to another name, because if another discovered their real name,
it could be used against them.
History repeats itself.
Welcome to the Digital Age.
I am MC23
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 13:22:06 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: MC23 <mc23@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

Once upon a time, Spike wrote;

>And verily, did Waffelmeisters hastily scribble thusly...
>| Were there any reported cases of "spike UGE"?
>
>As a matter of fact, yes.
>Read Harlequin, or play it.
>One adventure is based in Germany....
>I won't say any more though...

Yeah, the original Spike baby would know.

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

"I know
I GOTTA BELIEVE !"
-Parappa the Rapper
I am MC23
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 13:27:32 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Powered Armor Idea
In-Reply-To: <81F7A43B468BD111AFEC00A024EA0A2B09D389@*********.polytech. ac.nz>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 04:34 PM 5/22/98 +1200, you wrote:
>Quoth MgkellyMP5 (0922 21-5-98):
>
>>Reminds me of an article I saw in Shadowland a couple years ago about
>Acers.
<snipped>

Actually, I wrote another powered armor article for Shadowland, I think
Issue #4 or 5 I think.

Took a different tack than the ACER concept, and while it might not mesh
well with R2, at the time I thought it was better game-balanced than the
ACERs were. My opinion though. As I recall, they were more expensive, but
also had lots of options for personalizing the powered armor (including
price charts). And they came in two basic models, a "power lifting"
chassis and a "speed" chassis, since I still think those capabilities are
really mutually exclusive.

If you want to see what I came up with for powered armor, e-mail me at
GKoth2258@***.com with a really obvious subject header; I get *LOTS* of
friggin' spam and unless I know what an e-mail is, I tend to delete it
without looking.

But if someone wants to look at it on an individual basis, let me know.

As a note to people: while Shadowland has folded, as far as I know,
everything that was published in that magazine is the property of FASA.
Which means that I don't believe that you can take those articles and slap
them up on a web site; that's one huge reason I still don't have my own site.

Anyway, let me know at my home address if you want to look at that article.

Erik J.


"Forgive me FASA for I have sinned. It has been 6 days since I last played
Shadowrun and 15 days since I last bought a SRTCG booster pack."
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 09:38:33 PDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: roun <roun@***.NET>
Subject: Re: Acers
In-Reply-To: <199805261016.MAA12866@*****.xs4all.nl>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"; X-MAPIextension=".TXT"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

----------
| Ubiratan P. Alberton said on 23:44/25 May 98...
|
| > IMHO, it's not practical to use R2 rules (altough I don't have the
| > book, I have seen plenty of demonstration here :) ) to build powered
| > armor.
|
| Not unless you first design a chassis and probably an engine for it. I
| tried building a walker vehicle with room for one occupant once, but
| couldn't because of load restrictions -- basically, the resulting vehicle
| wasn't strong enough to carry a bucket seats without overloading it. It
| would still be possible to add a bucket seat, but in essence the vehicle
| would be permanently attempting to lift/pull something (namely, the
| driver) and suffer stress and other unwanted problems.
|
| > After all, in spite of the motors, it's a suit of armor, not a vehicle.
|
| But where exactly does the difference between a suit of powered armor
| and a walker vehicle lie?
|
|gurth

a suit of powered armor is one you actually put on and you make the
movements to walk around in it. a walker is probably bigger and has an
actual seat that you sit in and drive it like a vehicle (or rig it).

now what about one of these powered suits that is filled with robotics like
a drone and is controlled via remote control by a rigger? viable?? too
expensive?? what do you think?

roun aka dave
roun@***.net
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 20:08:59 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: Re: Acers
In-Reply-To:
<cÊ%a=GOVMT.CANADA%p=GC+EC%lìNCR_EXCH2-980526134904Z-26836@***.ncr.ec.gc.ca>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

Ojaste,James [NCR] said on 9:49/26 May 98...

> >But where exactly does the difference between a suit of powered armor
> >and a walker vehicle lie?
>
> The suit of powered armour has an occupant? Is meant to be piloted
> internally instead of remotely? Something like that.

Not a walker _drone_, a walker _vehicle_ with a pilot inside. Sort of like
an AT-AT, AT-ST, or BattleMech but smaller. The difference between a suit
of powered armor and such a vehicle is very small, I feel. Perhaps the
best way of separating the two would be to call vehicles the pilot/wearer
stands in "powered armor," and ones where the pilot can sit down
"walkers."

> Yeah, go ahead. Build a new chassis. Technically, SRII tech should be
> able to handle it (just build a cyber body that's a little bigger and
> hollow), but it would be hugely expensive.

Naturally it should be expensive, we don't want players running around in
them, do we? :)

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
We never choose to be anything but truthful. It's right there in our
manual, under Lies.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- + --+--
Version 3.1: | Incubated into
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N | the First Church of
o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ | the Sqooshy Ball
tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y? | 21 May 1998
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ + --+--
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 12:04:04 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Otaku Datajacks

I just realized something ... normal datajacks take input from whereever
and format it in format that can be understood by the brain or whatever
... So can an Otaku use a normal datajack for decking? As I understand
it, the Otaku's brain basically becomes a cyberdeck, so the Otaku would
only need a fiberoptic cable to the matrix ... If you agree here are some
options:

1a-1c) Otaku versions of datajacks are priced as normal datajacks but
with 2 (or 3 or 4) times normal I/O but can only be used to access the
Matrix.

2) Otaku versions of datajacks are priced as normal datajacks because
they are are cheaper to make but are not as common (only made by Otaku
communities)

3) As Option 1 or 2 but use the following table
Price Based on Option used
DFR 1a 1b 1b 2
25 375 300 313 500
50 500 400 375 1000
75 750 500 438 2000
100 1000 660 500 4000
125 1500 820 625 8000
150 2000 1000 750 16000
175 3000 1300 875 32000
200 _4000_ 1600 1000 _64000_
225 6000 2000 1250 128 k
250 8000 2600 1500 256 k
275 12000 3200 1750 512 k
300 16000 _4000_ 2000 1024 k
325 24000 5300 2500 2048 k
350 32000 6600 3000 4096 k
375 48000 8000 3500 8192 k
400 64000 10600 _4000_ 16384 k

NOTE: I am not neccisarily suggesting that all of the DFRs should be
available just giving the price using whatever price progression you
would like. The suggested limit is marked by an _underscore_ (or as
close as I can get ;)

Would this version of the datajack cost less essence since there is less
to implant?

Availability: *Only* available from major Otaku communities (and only
implantable there). Denver, having the largest Otaku community (AFAIK),
might have Alpha grade but Beta and Delta would, IMO, be out of even
their reach.

What do you think? Am I off my rocker?

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

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Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 14:32:37 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Waffelmeisters <evamarie@**********.NET>
Subject: Re: Hijacking
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> Re: Hijacking (William Ashe , Mon 22:12)
>
> Fade made some interesting comments about Hijacking:
>
> Using a potential hijacking might add a nice moral dilemma for some PC's ... Hmmmmm

More than a MORAL dilema. Neutralizing Hijackers in SR would not be as
easy as today. Even relatively legal cyber could allow them to
communicate with outside compatriots, and if such communications were
blocked, much nastier countermeasures would be likely, both on the plane
and elsewhere, as potential terrorist groups tend to be larger, and
better organized / funded.
I'm thinking the hi-jacking would be just an "attention getting
manuever" and barganing chip, the real threat being much worse. Hell,
they arel ikely tokill everone just as a "proof of intention" statement,
instead of bargaining. Even taking magical control of the hijackers
might not be enough, if his compatriots KNEW you took control.
-Mongoose X
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 14:33:06 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Waffelmeisters <evamarie@**********.NET>
Subject: Re: Multi-target rituals
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> Re: Multi-target rituals (Ereskanti , Mon 21:43)

> Okay, a dance through the craze haze of memory here....
>
> Each of the site teams were supposed to go through a series of steps to
> "trigger" the materials, which was kept in a "medicine bag" with
each team.
> Striper and the Thief had one, and it described the thief going through the
> motions after they beat the one thing or two in their way.
>

OOOOOH, NOW I remember.

> My thinking was the motions/dust were one set of establishing triggers that
> would set off a particular "astral signature" which the "ritual"
that Sam and
> the others were performing would recognize and literally "ground out" the
> desired effects. THAT is what I am getting at with "grounding out to multiple
> targets". There is some particular triggering mechanism or "astral
flare"
> that a given ritual responds to.
>

Well, for ritual sorcery, you don't have to "ground" anything, but I
think you are right on the "signature" bit- if something can be a ritual
link to you (and usually items you enchant can), then I'd say you can
link to them for ritual sorcery. The gestures and such may have been
similar to the "activation link" used by anchors- not that that would be
needed for anchors, but only active foci are links, and Novels tend to
blur such fine distinctions.
The timing may have been a litlle funny (was there time allowed after
the use of the powder to form links and do the sending?), but hey, its a
ghost dnace, right?

> I am sorry, I know what I am trying to say, I am just not finding the words
> for it right now...

Seemed clear enough.
-Mongoose
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 12:11:23 PDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Mon goose <landsquid@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: Kiss and Tell
Content-Type: text/plain

> Are you people ready to spill your guts now. If you want to say
>you're playtesting just say it. That much I _think_ is allowed by FASA.
>Anything else isn't.

Aw, but then we'd loose that air of coy mystery. Actually, it
looks like many of the playtesters "handles" ended up as Shadow Talk
names in "Target: Smugglers Havens", so even if they won't tell you,
that will.
God, does FASA think we're like a bunch of deckers with nothing
better to do than sit around on shadowland and make various commnets on
evey pulse of text that comes by? :)
-Mongoose



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Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 15:33:15 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Mike Elkins <MikeE@*********.COM>
Subject: Server Prices (was Re: Hacking Security Tallies)

>Depends. You can get a kick butt multi-cpu intel based system for what
>$2000 or so. I think the Alpha 500 Mhz is probably in the $5000 range
>(somebody check me on that), and IBM's SP-2's are considerably more
>expensive (Into the 100,000's) depending on how much memory they
>have and when you bought them.
>As far as mainframes go, I have no idea.

Well, you get what you pay for. $2000 gets you a PC. If you try to run
server software on a PC it sort of works, but if you push the load on it
up towards the maximum, it starts getting very flakey.

Essentially there are 3 things that make a server a server, and not all
servers have all three, but that it what to aim for:
1) Reliability. You can expect a server to run 24 hours a day, 7 days a
week, for months or years at a time. Expect to pay at least $10,000 for
a PC with this kind of reliability.
2) Capacity: The ability to add lots and lots of disk space, RAM, CPUs
etc. You can add these to a PC, but expect to hit limits.
3) Speed: The least important of these, in some ways. Similar to
Capacity.

I haven't priced a mainframe lately, but my last company's mainframe
cost $3.5 Mil, and it was a small one.

Here would be my rule of thumb: Base cost: 1-3 users: $8000
4-10 users $15000, 10-50 users $40,000, 50-100 users: $100,000

Excellant Reliability: price x 5
Rock-Solid Reliability: price x 15-25

Security: Green System: price x 1.5
Orange System: price x 6
Red System: price x 15
Black System: GM's call

Add some more money for higher system ratings, too.

All of this is off the top of my head, and IMHO.

Sanity Check: An Orange system for a small research group (25-50
people), mission critical work: $40k*20*6 = $4.8 million. Yup, I can live
with that.

Double-Domed Mike
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 15:41:40 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Kiss and Tell
In-Reply-To: <19980526191123.12546.qmail@*******.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 12:11 PM 5/26/98 PDT, you wrote:
>> Are you people ready to spill your guts now. If you want to say
>>you're playtesting just say it. That much I _think_ is allowed by FASA.
>>Anything else isn't.

Don't know. Anyone out there seen a FASA non-disclosure agreement?

> Aw, but then we'd loose that air of coy mystery. Actually, it
>looks like many of the playtesters "handles" ended up as Shadow Talk
>names in "Target: Smugglers Havens", so even if they won't tell you,
>that will.

Hey, how do you know that? The bloody thing isn't supposed to be shipping
until today, and FASA's own site is saying to expect it on June 2!! (I'm
expecting it a few days earlier though, since I've got a great game store
with a solid distributor as my source). Don't tell me you've already got a
hold of the thing...

And what about people like me or David or whatnot that use our real names
most of the time? It's a lot easier to steal Mongoose as a handle than
erikj is...

> God, does FASA think we're like a bunch of deckers with nothing
>better to do than sit around on shadowland and make various commnets on
>evey pulse of text that comes by? :)

You mean we're not?

;-)

Erik J.

Who is actually subscribed to NERPS at home under his "GKoth2258"
handle...which is a variant on the nick I had on my university account
years ago...
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 16:02:36 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ojaste,James [NCR]" <James.Ojaste@**.GC.CA>
Subject: Re: Server Prices (was Re: Hacking Security Tallies)
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Mike Elkins wrote:
>>Depends. You can get a kick butt multi-cpu intel based system for what
>>$2000 or so. I think the Alpha 500 Mhz is probably in the $5000 range
>>(somebody check me on that), and IBM's SP-2's are considerably more
>>expensive (Into the 100,000's) depending on how much memory they
>>have and when you bought them.
>>As far as mainframes go, I have no idea.
>
>Well, you get what you pay for. $2000 gets you a PC. If you try to run
>server software on a PC it sort of works, but if you push the load on it
>up towards the maximum, it starts getting very flakey.

Sorry, but I think that you're off here - if you push anything too far,
it'll snap. A lot of that depends on the OS used - I'm getting into
sensitive territory here, but some OSes are much more stable than
others and I don't necessarily mean the expensive ones.

>Essentially there are 3 things that make a server a server, and not all
>servers have all three, but that it what to aim for:
>1) Reliability. You can expect a server to run 24 hours a day, 7 days a
>week, for months or years at a time. Expect to pay at least $10,000 for
>a PC with this kind of reliability.

Whoa! If I wanted a fast, SOTA server, I wouldn't expect to pay more
than C$5000! Granted, I wouldn't be paying for support from Compaq
or IBM, but I'd be getting a machine built on standards that I can
get parts for easily and inexpensively.

>2) Capacity: The ability to add lots and lots of disk space, RAM, CPUs
>etc. You can add these to a PC, but expect to hit limits.

A PC's limits nowadays are based more on the size of the case than on
the PC itself - a big tower with a set of 20G SCSI drives and hundreds
of megs of RAM will cover lots... Granted, PCs don't handle TB yet,
but that's far beyond what's required of most servers.

>3) Speed: The least important of these, in some ways. Similar to
>Capacity.

Most servers require IO speed much more than CPU speed.

>I haven't priced a mainframe lately, but my last company's mainframe
>cost $3.5 Mil, and it was a small one.

*Boggle*! What is it used for?

[prices snipped]
These are all pretty arbitrary and are relative to stuff we don't know
about, so I'm not going to comment on them...

>All of this is off the top of my head, and IMHO.
>
>Sanity Check: An Orange system for a small research group (25-50
>people), mission critical work: $40k*20*6 = $4.8 million. Yup, I can live
>with that.

What are they researching? That makes a *huge* difference in cost.
Basically, to get just a little more performance costs a lot more
money.

James Ojaste
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 15:58:57 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Lehlan Decker <decker@****.FSU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Server Prices (was Re: Hacking Security Tallies)
In-Reply-To: <s56ae2c9.040@********.dragonsys.com> from "Mike Elkins" at
May
26, 98 03:33:15 pm
Mime-Version: 1.0
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<SNIP>
>
> Well, you get what you pay for. $2000 gets you a PC. If you try to run
> server software on a PC it sort of works, but if you push the load on it
> up towards the maximum, it starts getting very flakey.
>
> Essentially there are 3 things that make a server a server, and not all
> servers have all three, but that it what to aim for:
> 1) Reliability. You can expect a server to run 24 hours a day, 7 days a
> week, for months or years at a time. Expect to pay at least $10,000 for
> a PC with this kind of reliability.
> 2) Capacity: The ability to add lots and lots of disk space, RAM, CPUs
> etc. You can add these to a PC, but expect to hit limits.
> 3) Speed: The least important of these, in some ways. Similar to
> Capacity.
>
> I haven't priced a mainframe lately, but my last company's mainframe
> cost $3.5 Mil, and it was a small one.
>
> Here would be my rule of thumb: Base cost: 1-3 users: $8000
> 4-10 users $15000, 10-50 users $40,000, 50-100 users: $100,000
>
> Excellant Reliability: price x 5
> Rock-Solid Reliability: price x 15-25
>
> Security: Green System: price x 1.5
> Orange System: price x 6
> Red System: price x 15
> Black System: GM's call
>
> Add some more money for higher system ratings, too.
>
> All of this is off the top of my head, and IMHO.
>
> Sanity Check: An Orange system for a small research group (25-50
> people), mission critical work: $40k*20*6 = $4.8 million. Yup, I can live
> with that.
>
I'll work with you on that. Although there are liable to be far more
smaller networks, vs mainframes. (The universities seem to be moving
away from mainframes and more towards clustering technology, at least FSU
is). The other key word there is mission-critical. If you can't live without
it being down for any length of time, it cost big bucks. If you can live
with the a few hours or days, you cost is much lower.
Of course the good stuff is always on the expensive toys. :)
(And actually depending on what your doing, I would rank speed higher,
people hate slow anything these days)



--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Lehlan Decker 644-4534 Systems Development
decker@****.fsu.edu http://www.scri.fsu.edu/~decker
--------------------------------------------------------------------
The universe doesn't have laws, it has habits. And habits can be broken.
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 16:34:08 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: John Penta <johndevil@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Hijacking

<snip>
Hmm. I *almost* sympathize with the hijackers. *almost*.
Anyway..an idea I came up with for my group's first run, that can be run
with little mods for wherever they choose to start(From Seattle, Tir na
Nog(No elves in the group, BTW...twas their choice.), Middle East,
Boston, and New York)...Really, a reenactment of the Entebbe
rescue...cept it happens in said city..doing it in the Middle
East(City-wise, it'll prolly be Tel Aviv, though), will add a cool
twist...and the runners gotta bust the hijackers, cuz it's on corp
property...note, these guys are RUNNERS.
What would the stats be for:Hijackers, Passengers, Crew, and, the
optional SpecFor team, from wherever I want it to be from(Likely choices
are UCAS, Israel(this for a further deja vu aspect), Ares, S-K, or
Aztechnology(BIG maybe here.).)? Any help possible? (This'll prolly be
their FIRST run, with SR as a whole. maybe just as a practice on the
combat system.)

John

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Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 16:53:27 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Craig J Wilhelm Jr <craigjwjr@*********.NET>
Organization: Afterlife Incorperated
Subject: Re: Server Prices (was Re: Hacking Security Tallies)
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Ojaste,James [NCR] wrote:
> A PC's limits nowadays are based more on the size of the case than on
> the PC itself - a big tower with a set of 20G SCSI drives and hundreds
> of megs of RAM will cover lots... Granted, PCs don't handle TB yet,
> but that's far beyond what's required of most servers.

I dunno about most, but let's take something as complex as a modern
(1990's) car for example. From conception to production, the total data
produced ranges between 20-40 terabytes.
In the 2050's, with people working on things like cyberdecks,
cyberware, Banshees and other insanely complex things, the data
handeling requirements are goint to push the limits of human
comprehension. And how many exapulses of RAM does it take to run an AI
on your server?

--
Craig "Knee Deep in the Blood of Swine" Wilhelm
Inside every living human being, there's a dead one waiting to come out.
UIN: 1864690
-------------BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-------------
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GAT/$ d- s+:+ a- C+++ U--- P+ L- E-- W++ N++
o K- w+ O> !M-- !V PS+ PE Y+ PGP++ t--- 5+++
X-- R++ tv b++ DI-- D+(Q2++) G++ e++ h* r y++**
--------------END GEEK CODE BLOCK--------------
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 15:53:37 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Server Prices (was Re: Hacking Security Tallies)

On Tue, 26 May 1998 15:33:15 -0500 Mike Elkins <MikeE@*********.COM>
writes:
>>Depends. You can get a kick butt multi-cpu intel based system for what
>>$2000 or so. I think the Alpha 500 Mhz is probably in the $5000 range
>>(somebody check me on that), and IBM's SP-2's are considerably more
>>expensive (Into the 100,000's) depending on how much memory they
>>have and when you bought them.
>>As far as mainframes go, I have no idea.
>
>Well, you get what you pay for. $2000 gets you a PC. If you try to run
>server software on a PC it sort of works, but if you push the load on it
>up towards the maximum, it starts getting very flakey.

Well, If a keyboard sized computers can handle the strain of decking what
can a PC sized server do?

>Essentially there are 3 things that make a server a server, and not all
>servers have all three, but that it what to aim for:
>1) Reliability. You can expect a server to run 24 hours a day, 7 days a
>week, for months or years at a time. Expect to pay at least $10,000 for
>a PC with this kind of reliability.
>2) Capacity: The ability to add lots and lots of disk space, RAM, CPUs
>etc. You can add these to a PC, but expect to hit limits.
>3) Speed: The least important of these, in some ways. Similar to
Capacity.
>
>I haven't priced a mainframe lately, but my last company's mainframe
>cost $3.5 Mil, and it was a small one.

Yeah, a mainframe will give you the best server performance, but a server
doesn't HAVE to be a mainframe and I wish that VR 2.0 took that into
account.

>Here would be my rule of thumb: Base cost: 1-3 users: $8000
>4-10 users $15000, 10-50 users $40,000, 50-100 users: $100,000
>
>Excellant Reliability: price x 5
>Rock-Solid Reliability: price x 15-25

The problem here is that the normal VR rules don't take into account
reliability and system load (AFAIK) so unless the you want to introduce
new rules (or associate rating values with the above "stats") the price
is going to have to be based on rating (and security value, which the VR
price doesn't take into account ...)

However, I think that an abstract load "background stat" (ie mainly there
for reference, and only comes into play in special circumstances) might
be a good idea. Say on a scale of 1 to whatever, a 1 would be a PC based
/ sized server and the upper limit would mainframes with (practically)
infinite numbers of users. Then a base price might be
((rating*load)^2)*1000.

>Security: Green System: price x 1.5
>Orange System: price x 6
>Red System: price x 15
>Black System: GM's call

by Black do you mean UV systems? If they're even "purchasable", I'd say
x100 or more. (due to rarity, and SOTA as well as relitave costs [ie the
first pentium was overpriced when it was first available for purchase])

>Add some more money for higher system ratings, too.
>
>All of this is off the top of my head, and IMHO.
>
>Sanity Check: An Orange system for a small research group (25-50
>people), mission critical work: $40k*20*6 = $4.8 million. Yup, I can
live
>with that.
>
>Double-Domed Mike

my turn for a sanity check :)
say load is on a scale of 1 to 10, then
An Orange system, Rating 8, Load 5 (25-50 people ain't much, so an even
lower Load would be appropriate):
( ((8*5)^2)*1000 )*6 = 9.6 mil

Now for some other examples:
Telecomm grid (Blue Sys, Load 10, Rating 6):
( ((6*10)^2)*1000 )*1 = 3.6 mil

Dinky Server(TM) (Blue Sys, Rating 4, Load 1):
( ((4*1)^2)*1000 )*1 = 16 k

The Good Stuff (Red Sys, Rating 11, Load 10):
( ((11*10)^2)*1000 )*15 = 181.5 mil (no wonder the corps get pissed if
you crash their servers :)

Well, this price system was pretty arbritrary but tell me what ya think
none-the-less, okay? :)

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
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Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 17:01:59 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Craig J Wilhelm Jr <craigjwjr@*********.NET>
Organization: Afterlife Incorperated
Subject: Re: Hacking Security Tallies (Was Re: Weird Campaigns)
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Mike Elkins wrote:
> Before people use this to design un-hackable computers, remember that
> anything in hardware must be designed in when the machine is
> designed, and can never be changed or updated.

Good point. One other thing to consider if you use this idea, is that
since upgrading this kind of system will be realatively hard, and
expensive, they will rarely be SOTA. Not far behind SOTA but very likely
not spot on SOTA.

--
Craig "Knee Deep in the Blood of Swine" Wilhelm
Inside every living human being, there's a dead one waiting to come out.
UIN: 1864690
-------------BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-------------
v3.12
GAT/$ d- s+:+ a- C+++ U--- P+ L- E-- W++ N++
o K- w+ O> !M-- !V PS+ PE Y+ PGP++ t--- 5+++
X-- R++ tv b++ DI-- D+(Q2++) G++ e++ h* r y++**
--------------END GEEK CODE BLOCK--------------
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 17:02:57 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Airwasp <Airwasp@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Power Armor
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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In a message dated 5/26/98 12:53:30 PM !!!First Boot!!!, DisnyShamn@***.COM
writes:

> > Please do search out that article, mister Machine-Gun. Power-armour
> > might be interesting, if only for curiosity's sake; it'd certainly
> > explain how people can actually function in Military-grade armour that
> > weighs what, 20+ kilos by itself? Between that and the other gear
> > they'd have to pack, power-armour would be about the only way they could
> > *move*!

Okay, I'm gonna spill something on how we do power armor here ... we take mil-
spec armor and go ahead and put cybertech and vehicle mods into the armor.
The person still needs to be able to shoulder the weight, so we throw in stuff
like Muscle Replacement and other things which either increase the effective
strength of the pc or reduce the weight of the suit (like Smart Materials
does).

Mike
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 17:07:47 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Paul Gettle <pgettle@********.NET>
Subject: Re: Acers
In-Reply-To: <199805261807.UAA03935@*****.xs4all.nl>
Mime-Version: 1.0
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At 08:08 PM 5/26/98 +0100, Gurth wrote:
>Not a walker _drone_, a walker _vehicle_ with a pilot inside. Sort of
like
>an AT-AT, AT-ST, or BattleMech but smaller. The difference between a
suit
>of powered armor and such a vehicle is very small, I feel. Perhaps
the
>best way of separating the two would be to call vehicles the
pilot/wearer
>stands in "powered armor," and ones where the pilot can sit down
>"walkers."

Usually, when I think of 'power armor' it's on a scale where it
wouldn't get confused with any sort of 'walker' vehicle.

Something about a half step up from heavy military armor, large enough
to incorporate servos and gyros to add strength and weapon stability,
with some external mounting points for weapons usually considered too
heavy to be man-portable.

The closest thing from actual SR would be the suits of armor worn by
the Rhiannon Glendower, Countess of Snowdon's Knights of Harlech,
described on p. 127 of the London Sourcebook.
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--
-- Paul Gettle (pgettle@********.net)
PGP Fingerprint, Key ID:11455339 (RSA 1024, created 97/08/08)
625A FFF0 76DC A077 D21C 556B BB58 00AA
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 17:10:21 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Airwasp <Airwasp@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Acers
Mime-Version: 1.0
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In a message dated 5/26/98 1:45:55 PM !!!First Boot!!!, James.Ojaste@**.GC.CA
writes:

> >Not unless you first design a chassis and probably an engine for it. I
> >tried building a walker vehicle with room for one occupant once, but
> >couldn't because of load restrictions

Yeah, but did you ever consider having the person be the one carrying the load
this time instead of the walker ? This is also another way that we did power
armor also.

> >[snip]
> >> After all, in spite of the motors, it's a suit of armor, not a vehicle.
> >
> >But where exactly does the difference between a suit of powered armor
> >and a walker vehicle lie?

When the person inside the thing is no longer having to physically move
themselves to make the thing move. That is the difference between power armor
and a walker.

> The suit of powered armour has an occupant? Is meant to be piloted
> internally instead of remotely? Something like that. Yeah, go ahead.
> Build a new chassis. Technically, SRII tech should be able to handle
> it (just build a cyber body that's a little bigger and hollow), but
> it would be hugely expensive. I'd give it the Unusual design/features
> markup of 1.2 and a milspec markup of 5, and remove the "drone" markup
> for a final markup of 11.

Actually, you would be surprised how much junk you can throw into something
that does not take up any CF or load rating at all. You would be surprised.

Yeah, and these things are expensive, but then again ... if you do it the way
I suggest, the person carries the load, then perhaps the drone markdown mod
should be reinstated then.

Mike
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 16:55:30 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Craig J Wilhelm Jr <craigjwjr@*********.NET>
Organization: Afterlife Incorperated
Subject: Re: Server Prices (was Re: Hacking Security Tallies)
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Mike Elkins wrote:
[snip reasonable pricing system]

> Sanity Check: An Orange system for a small research group (25-50
> people), mission critical work: $40k*20*6 = $4.8 million. Yup, I can live
> with that.

Me too, thanks! But then again, where am I going to use this in game?
--
Craig "Knee Deep in the Blood of Swine" Wilhelm
Inside every living human being, there's a dead one waiting to come out.
UIN: 1864690
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o K- w+ O> !M-- !V PS+ PE Y+ PGP++ t--- 5+++
X-- R++ tv b++ DI-- D+(Q2++) G++ e++ h* r y++**
--------------END GEEK CODE BLOCK--------------
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 17:08:56 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Server Prices (was Re: Hacking Security Tallies)
In-Reply-To: <cÊ%a=GOVMT.CANADA%p=GC+EC%lìNCR_EXCH2-980526200236Z-28
589@***.ncr.ec.gc.ca>
Mime-Version: 1.0
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At 04:02 PM 5/26/98 -0400, you wrote:

>>I haven't priced a mainframe lately, but my last company's mainframe
>>cost $3.5 Mil, and it was a small one.
>
>*Boggle*! What is it used for?

Note the difference in terms; he said *mainframe* while you said server.

You're probably right for a common server, but he's definitely right for a
mainframe machine.

It really all depends on what you intend to do with that machine. If it's
just a mail server, a P166 running NT 4.0 can service a 100 people no
problem at all. My dad does that at his work. Says running the mail
utilizes about 3-4%$ of the processor resources.

But if you want your server to handle the firewall, the entire corporate
database, all the mail, *EVERYTHING* then you need something bigger, like a
mainframe.

So make sure you are talking about the same thing here. That should solve
half your problems with this discussion.

Erik J.


"What was that popping sound?"

"A paradigm shifting without a clutch."
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 17:21:48 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Jett <grota@*********.COM>
Subject: Re: (Back on topic) Insect spirits living in my bathroom
MIME-Version: 1.0
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NightRain wrote:
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Quantum <a.hides@*******.QUT.EDU.AU>
>
> >Ok. I'm guessing that the things that we call hornets in Australia
> are
> >different to the ones in America. The ones in Australia are just
> black
> >and orange things that can't even sting. All the do is build
> annoying mud
> >nests....
>
> No, I think you just have a little bit of a misunderstanding. They
> sting alright, although they don't tend to be quite as agro as
> everyone on the list is describing.
>
> NightRain.


Maybe what you have are yellowjackets? They are much smaller and less
aggressive than hornets, with smaller stingers. Really, more like skinny
little bumblebees...

--Jett
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 17:18:35 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Airwasp <Airwasp@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Idea for Spell Drain
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In a message dated 5/26/98 5:08:58 PM !!!First Boot!!!, mc23@**********.COM
writes:

> Extra drain could be justified for use with sustained spells but I
> don't understand it's use for an instantaneous spell. Instantaneous
> Spells is handled all at once, Higher drain not multiple drain, that's
> how the game mechanics are set up to handle things (1 staging is a higher
> level). Two serious drains should be one deadly drain.

Okay, with Instantaneous spells, the additional drain would also hit
immediately after the caster rolls for the standard drain of the spell
normally.

> Sustained spells could make sense for a secondary drain but the +2
> target modifier also represents this which does affect the mage greatly.
> I could possibly see a recurring drain modifier for sustained spells
> (like exclusive or fetish modifiers) where the drain is reduced but that
> same drain must be tested against the beginning of every new turn.

That is actually a wonderful idea ... a penalty for sustaining a spell for too
long ... sounds nifty ...

> That has some possibilities but I don't know if I would use it or
> that it's what you were after.

It is in the right direction, as I am still fishing for opinions on this ...
and as for using it very often, not very ... as it would be something most
runner mages would shy away from, though I could see it as something done by
people involved in a ritual ... sure, bring the standard drain down to L stun,
yeah, and at the end once the ritual is over, someone please hand us tylenol
once the Serious stun nails us in the head.

Mike
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 17:21:53 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Airwasp <Airwasp@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Otaku Datajacks
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In a message dated 5/26/98 6:58:59 PM !!!First Boot!!!, dghost@****.COM
writes:

> I just realized something ... normal datajacks take input from whereever
> and format it in format that can be understood by the brain or whatever
> ... So can an Otaku use a normal datajack for decking? As I understand
> it, the Otaku's brain basically becomes a cyberdeck, so the Otaku would
> only need a fiberoptic cable to the matrix ... If you agree here are some
> options:

Dude, an otaku still needs a datajack, the one thing is that as time goes on
(before you actually begin playing the pc), the otaku mind rewrites the code
and melds somewhat with the jack, making it appear to act faster than it
normally can.

Reread the section on Otaku in the VR2 ... it explains what happens to a
datajack implanted into an otaku.

Mike
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 17:24:39 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Airwasp <Airwasp@***.COM>
Subject: Real-Life Computing ...
Mime-Version: 1.0
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For anyone wanting grins and giggles ... consider the following ...

Intel is going to begin selling chips to the consumer market sometime in the
year 2000 ...

Their speed .... 800 MHz ...

(Drool)

Mike
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 17:38:05 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: BigDaddy <bigdaddy@*****.COM>
Organization: @**** Network
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Airwasp wrote:
>
> For anyone wanting grins and giggles ... consider the following ...
>
> Intel is going to begin selling chips to the consumer market sometime in the
> year 2000 ...
>
> Their speed .... 800 MHz ...
>
That's if and a big IF they get the 2k bug squashed. Hell wont that be
funny. "we'll sell ya a chip that might work in the year 2000." But i
wonder what happened in SR to cope with the year 2k bug? any ideas?
--
Napalm Sticks to Kidz,
BigDaddy
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 17:39:15 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: MgkellyMP5 <MgkellyMP5@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Acers
Mime-Version: 1.0
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In a message dated 98-05-26 14:52:28 EDT, Gurth writes:


<< Naturally it should be expensive, we don't want players running around in
them, do we? :)
>>

Wearing obvious armor makes you a target. The Star would be more than happy to
whistle up an FRT if they saw someone jandering down the street in heavy
armor, toting a BFG. Which kind of helps keep the Acer players under control
(provided that they weren't a Munchkin and actually needed it ;] )

Mgkelly
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 14:40:21 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Jeremy \"Bolthy\" Zimmerman"
<jeremy@***********.COM>
Subject: Re: Otaku Datajacks
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
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----------
> From: Airwasp <Airwasp@***.COM>
> To: SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET
> Subject: Re: Otaku Datajacks
> Date: Tuesday, May 26, 1998 2:21 PM
>
> In a message dated 5/26/98 6:58:59 PM !!!First Boot!!!, dghost@****.COM
> writes:
>
> > I just realized something ... normal datajacks take input from
whereever
> > and format it in format that can be understood by the brain or
whatever
> > ... So can an Otaku use a normal datajack for decking? As I
understand
> > it, the Otaku's brain basically becomes a cyberdeck, so the Otaku
would
> > only need a fiberoptic cable to the matrix ... If you agree here are
some
> > options:
>
> Dude, an otaku still needs a datajack, the one thing is that as time goes
on
> (before you actually begin playing the pc), the otaku mind rewrites the
code
> and melds somewhat with the jack, making it appear to act faster than it
> normally can.
>
> Reread the section on Otaku in the VR2 ... it explains what happens to a
> datajack implanted into an otaku.
>

Really? Man, i'm definitely going to have to reread that bit... I played
an otaku for a while, and don't recall anything like that... =T
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 16:45:48 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Justin Bell <justin@******.NET>
Subject: Re: Server Prices (was Re: Hacking Security Tallies)
In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.16.19980526133524.252fb29a@****.fbiz.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 05:08 PM 5/26/98 -0400, Erik Jameson wrote:
# At 04:02 PM 5/26/98 -0400, you wrote:
#
# >>I haven't priced a mainframe lately, but my last company's mainframe
# >>cost $3.5 Mil, and it was a small one.
# >
# >*Boggle*! What is it used for?
#
# Note the difference in terms; he said *mainframe* while you said server.
#
# You're probably right for a common server, but he's definitely right for a
# mainframe machine.
#
# It really all depends on what you intend to do with that machine. If it's
# just a mail server, a P166 running NT 4.0 can service a 100 people no
# problem at all. My dad does that at his work. Says running the mail
# utilizes about 3-4%$ of the processor resources.
#
# But if you want your server to handle the firewall, the entire corporate
# database, all the mail, *EVERYTHING* then you need something bigger, like a
# mainframe.

actually, a fairly inexpensive Sparc 2000 can handle EVERYTHING for a
decent sized company, firewall and all.

--
/- justin@****.mcp.com -------------------- justin@******.net -\
|Justin Bell NIC:JB3084| Time and rules are changing. |
|Simon & Schuster | Attention span is quickening. |
|Programmer | Welcome to the Information Age. |
\------------ http://www.mcp.com/people/justin/ ---------------/
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 16:49:32 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Justin Bell <justin@******.NET>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
In-Reply-To: <356B363D.70DFEFE4@*****.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 05:38 PM 5/26/98 -0400, BigDaddy wrote:
# Airwasp wrote:
# >
# > For anyone wanting grins and giggles ... consider the following ...
# >
# > Intel is going to begin selling chips to the consumer market sometime
in the
# > year 2000 ...
# >
# > Their speed .... 800 MHz ...
# >
# That's if and a big IF they get the 2k bug squashed. Hell wont that be
# funny. "we'll sell ya a chip that might work in the year 2000." But i
# wonder what happened in SR to cope with the year 2k bug? any ideas?

you realise the 2029 bug was when the 32 bit time bug in UNIX hit
;)
--
/- justin@****.mcp.com -------------------- justin@******.net -\
|Justin Bell NIC:JB3084| Time and rules are changing. |
|Simon & Schuster | Attention span is quickening. |
|Programmer | Welcome to the Information Age. |
\------------ http://www.mcp.com/people/justin/ ---------------/
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 23:42:59 +0200
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: AlSeyMer <AdSM@******.BE>
Subject: Re: Server Prices (was Re: Hacking Security Tallies)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Craig J Wilhelm Jr wrote:
>
> Mike Elkins wrote:
> [snip reasonable pricing system]
>
> > Sanity Check: An Orange system for a small research group (25-50
> > people), mission critical work: $40k*20*6 = $4.8 million. Yup, I can live
> > with that.
>
> Me too, thanks! But then again, where am I going to use this in game?

I would find this kind of information extremely handy, for mundane
things like "What kind of server X inc. can afford?", or "How much worth
of precious corporate property had they wasted this run?"

Besides pricing servers, another good question would be pricing
softwares. I assume that those pretty Killers don(t come for nothing,
and this should also be accounted for in the total system value.

AlSeyMer
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 15:58:07 -0600
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Mike Loseke <mike@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
In-Reply-To: <534c1e8b.356b3318@***.com> from "Airwasp" at May 26,
98 05:24:39 pm
Content-Type: text

Thus spake Airwasp:
>
> For anyone wanting grins and giggles ... consider the following ...
>
> Intel is going to begin selling chips to the consumer market sometime in the
> year 2000 ...
>
> Their speed .... 800 MHz ...

They're still a bit behind the competition. IBM, earlier this year,
announced that they have demonstrated the first procesor that can operate
beyond 1GHz. Digital Alpha processors have been over 600MHz (and higher)
for some time now.

http://www.ibm.com/News/1998/02/ls980204.html

However, Intel shipping speeds like this to mass market consumers for
somewhat reasonable prices, is important. The more power on distributed
systems, whatever the processor, will only bring us nearer to the
Matrix-like netowrks of the future. I'm already saving up for a datajack
and an encephalon. :-)

--
| Even Einstein objected to the idea of
Mike Loseke | wave-function collapse, calling it
mike@*******.com | "spooky action-at-a-distance."
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 17:08:37 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Wyrmy <elfman@*****.NET>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Waffelmeisters wrote:
>
> Well, It's official. I'm turning into a troll. :] I visited the
> dentist, and that weird poking feeling in the back of my left upper jaw
> is my 33rd tooth coming in. There's a matching one on the other side
> waiting to join it. (that makes 34, two more than non-trolls should
> ever have, according to SR racial descriptions).
> Next thing you know, I'll bust out in warts and gain 350 lbs...
> Were there any reported cases of "spike UGE"? That could save me a
LOT
> in dentist bills (not to mention make me some good money as a circus
> freek). Actually, the dentist says these extra molars are not to rare-
> it happens to 1-2% of the population...

Well, I happen to be turning into an ork.Wierd HuH?I'm growing 2 new
teeth in the front of my mouth in the shape of fangs, and I have an
increased hunger for meat.Perfectly normal Ork :^).
--
-W
============================
If you are a dreamer come in,
If you are a dreeamer, a wisher,
A liar, a magic jelly bean buyer,
Come In!
-What should be the motto of all internet users.
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 18:09:14 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: BigDaddy <bigdaddy@*****.COM>
Organization: @**** Network
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Mike Loseke wrote:
>
> Thus spake Airwasp:
> >
> > For anyone wanting grins and giggles ... consider the following ...
> >
> > Intel is going to begin selling chips to the consumer market sometime in the
> > year 2000 ...
> >
> > Their speed .... 800 MHz ...
>
> They're still a bit behind the competition. IBM, earlier this year,
> announced that they have demonstrated the first procesor that can operate
> beyond 1GHz. Digital Alpha processors have been over 600MHz (and higher)
> for some time now.
but the 1ghz chip is only soooo stable at sooo low of a temp. as soon as
they invent microcooled, and minaturized NO machines (hehehe i want one)
then the speed will FLY! until they find a way to decrease that heat
that all us engineers out there hate, we will be slowly increasing in
speed.
>
> http://www.ibm.com/News/1998/02/ls980204.html
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 18:39:36 -0300
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ubiratan P. Alberton" <ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR>
Subject: Re: Acers
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Gurth escreveu:
>
> Ubiratan P. Alberton said on 23:44/25 May 98...
>
>
>
> > After all, in spite of the motors, it's a suit of armor, not a vehicle.
>
> But where exactly does the difference between a suit of powered armor
> and a walker vehicle lie?
>

The Harsuits from Bubblegum Crisis (anime) are suits of powered
armor. The Labors from
Patlabor (also anime) are walker vehicles, and humanoid at that. Another
walker would be
the tank in the end of Ghost in the Shell (that spider thing).
IMHO, a walker vwhicle is something you pilot from a cockpit, like
that one you tried to build.
A power-armor, in spite of its servo-systems, is still a suit of
armor. It can't stand
on its feet if there's no one inside it, nor does it have any rigger
systems (you "control" it
by moving your own body.). Howz that?

Bira
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 18:34:29 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: SThanatos <sthanatos@*********.COM>
Subject: Biophysical Armor
In-Reply-To: <356B3698.D4B1EBD6@************.com.br>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

I noticed a spell in Paolo's Shadowrun Character Generator called
Biophysical armor. Unfortunately I have found no other information
regarding this spell, so I don't know what it does. But it got me
thinking...wouldn't it be cool to make a spell that produces the effects
(and some sort of Guyver-esque looking biosuit) of dermal plating that
protects the target...so here's my idea...if anyone cares to shoot it down:

Dermal Shell

Creates a plating of physical armor around the target's body, which acts
not unlike dermal plating. Form-fits to the targets body. The character
adds his successes to the body attribute of the target.

Formula -
Manipulation Spell
Minor Physical Change M
Physical spell +1 DT
Sustained +1 DT
Affects Attribute (Body) +1 DL
Add dice per success +1 DL
Voluntary Spell -1 DL
Final Formula [(F/2)+2]S

If it were a personal spell, I'd have to make it at M stun simply because
of the nature of the spell. Noone should be able to cast this powerful a
spell for L stun.

Thanatos
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 18:47:41 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Distance Strike Signature
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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In a message dated 5/26/98 10:49:25 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
rogan@******.ORG writes:

> Many PC physads in my campaigns have the distance strike power. We've
> interpreted it as the hadugens from Street Fighter II so we figured each
> character has a different signature. (like a spell signature) Like the
> koborkuru dwarf does a spinning jump kick which emits a blast.
>
> Any of you have any thoughts or similar ideas?
>
Actually yeah, and we even added "Elementality (Select)" for 2 points to the
Killing Hands/Distance Strike option, giving the Killing Hands a true
elemental effect of some kind.

Now -there- is a signature for ya.

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 19:09:04 -0300
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ubiratan P. Alberton" <ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR>
Subject: Re: EW-209 (was : Aztec Armored Troopers)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Danyel N Woods escreveu:
>
> Quoth Ubiratan P Alberton (1502 22-5-98):
>
>
>
> Well, for one thing, Bira, radio links can be jammed, and Identification
> Friend or Foe (IFF) systems are too dicey: what happens if you have to
> turn off your IFF to penetrate enemy lines (who also have IFF), and the
> unit interprets the lack of signal as an 'enemy'? Remember Robocop 1,
> when ED-209 was first demonstrated to the Board? Remember how they had
> to take a guy out of the room in a bucket? That was a faulty threat
> routine in the IFF software.

Make it a drone and you'll have the perfect adaptation. It's not the
ED-209
without those tons of bugs :) . I bet they used a Microsoft OS in the
thing :) .

> For another point, the whole *idea* of my mean-machine was to have a
> human (or what was left of one) inside these things. When (*if*) the
> PCs take one of these things down and take to it with a DiKoted
> can-opener, they'll be shocked/horrified to find a 'brain in a jar'
> running it. Y'know, sort of an editorial on the inhumanity the corps
> are capable of?
>
> <PC conversation>
> "Jesus, they cut off the guy's limbs and *permanently* wired him into
> this thing? What about the rest of him?"
> "Spare parts."
> "Aw, shit, man...What's that gotta do to his mind? D'you think he's
> still sane?"
> "D'you think the Azzies care?"
> "...!"
>

How about building something like those Labos (humanoid walker
vehicles) from the
anime Patlabor? Something about 7m tall, humanoid, with room for a
pilot. Carries giant
versions of "normal" weapond, such as a 90mm shotgun >) .

Bira
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 19:16:11 -0300
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ubiratan P. Alberton" <ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR>
Subject: Re: Hardsuits
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------14A4920CCCAA42EF15195AB5"

Esta é uma mensagem de várias partes no formato MIME.
--------------14A4920CCCAA42EF15195AB5
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

NightRain escreveu:
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ubiratan P. Alberton <ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR>
>
> > If you want another view on the power-armor stuff, I have a
> >file with an adaptation of the fabled Hardsuits from Bubblegum Crisis
> to
> >Sr2. No Acer needed :) . If anyone wants this, send me mail in
> private
> >and I'll
> >send it directly.
>
> I'd love to see it.
>
> Thanks,
>
> NightRain.
>

Here is the file. I would like feedback, for a future update...

Bira
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SEtJVC5UWFRQSwUGAAAAAAEAAQA6AAAAfhwAAAAA
--------------14A4920CCCAA42EF15195AB5--
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 19:18:21 -0300
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ubiratan P. Alberton" <ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR>
Subject: Re: Harvesting (Re: Giving blood in 205X: common or rare?)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Danyel N Woods escreveu:
>
>
> >
> > I don't recall the original name, but I think it was something like
> >Adrenalin. A
> >mutated human with a mortal plague wich will "wake up" in 24 hrs is
> >being pursued by
> >a group of cops, and enters an abandoned prision. They go after him but
> >the thing is very
> >intelligent. The movie doesn't has this title for nothing :) .
>
> If that's the one I'm thinking off, the title (in English) was
> Adrenaline: Fear the Rush. Natasha (Species I & II) Henstridge played
> the female lead, which was about the only reason I rented the video :-).
> (Well, that and I was looking for 'Run ideas).
> My brother reckoned it sucked. I wouldn't go *that* far, but it ain't
> an Oscar candidate.
>
> Danyel Woods
> 9604801@********.ac.nz
> 'Are you deliberately trying to drive me insane?'
> 'The universe is already mad. Anything else would be


That's it! This is the movie. As you said, not exactly excellent, but
great for ideas.

Bira
> redundant.'
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 08:57:56 +1000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Robert Watkins <robert.watkins@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

BigDaddy writes:
>That's if and a big IF they get the 2k bug squashed. Hell wont that be
>funny. "we'll sell ya a chip that might work in the year 2000." But i
>wonder what happened in SR to cope with the year 2k bug? any ideas?


The crash of '29 was just an extended version of the Y2K bug. :)

(Actually, one of the MS Office products does have a problem with 2028 as
its last year, I think... and I succesfully campaigned to have the rollover
year for 2-digit date entry be 2028 for a product we have here. :)

--
.sig deleted to conserve electrons. robert.watkins@******.com
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 17:56:11 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "David R. Lowe" <david@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Mood music
In-Reply-To: <356A2FE9.B3A0894B@*****.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 2:58 AM -0000 5/26/98, BigDaddy wrote:
>DisnyShamn wrote:

>> Learned at yesterday's game some of the Really Effective music is that my
>> Nightspawn GM had been using; the soundtrack from The Vision of Escaflowne
>> (anime). Doesn't use the whole thing, but there's some really great
>>orchestral
>> pieces suitable for climactic battles, mysterious danger, etc. Let me tell
>> you, it improved our confrontation with Nightlords and their army by at
>>LEAST
>> 200%.

>What about the soundtrack from Akira(all time great anime), the chasing
>of the clowns (something like that) was used in mine when the runners
>were in hot pursuit by corps.

I find that a steady diet of Tom Waits, Nick Cave and Ministry usually
fuels the creative process when I'm writing up scenarios. We have a CD
burner at work, so I'm thinking of making a custom soundtrack for our next
session.

D.

David R. Lowe
Frank Harrison Perez Design
665 Chestnut Street, Suite 300
San Francisco, California 94133
415.353.5752 (Voice)
415.474.0400 (Main)
415.474.0481 (Fax)

david@******.com
http://www.fhpnet.com
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 19:02:11 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
In-Reply-To: <356B3D65.203@*****.net>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 05:08 PM 5/26/98 -0500, you wrote:
<snipped Wafflemeister's UGE story>

>Well, I happen to be turning into an ork.Wierd HuH?I'm growing 2 new
>teeth in the front of my mouth in the shape of fangs, and I have an
>increased hunger for meat.Perfectly normal Ork :^).

I dunno there Wyrmy, that could just be puberty hitting you upside the head...

Sorry, couldn't resist. The door was wide open, the runway was clear, the
target was painted...

But seriously, it probably is just your hormones running rampant.

Hey, is there anyone out there besides me that thinks that if the Awakening
were to occur right now they would probably remain a vanilla human? I just
don't see anything in my body that indicates "troll" or "elf" or
anything;
I'm pretty much well within statistical and cosmetic standards for an
average male...

Erik J.
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 19:02:49 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
In-Reply-To: <199805262158.PAA09338@******.verinet.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 03:58 PM 5/26/98 -0600, you wrote:
>Thus spake Airwasp:
>>
>> For anyone wanting grins and giggles ... consider the following ...
>>
>> Intel is going to begin selling chips to the consumer market sometime in
the
>> year 2000 ...
>>
>> Their speed .... 800 MHz ...
>
> They're still a bit behind the competition. IBM, earlier this year,
>announced that they have demonstrated the first procesor that can operate
>beyond 1GHz. Digital Alpha processors have been over 600MHz (and higher)
>for some time now.

Motorola's RISC chipsets should also be in the same ballpark, since I have
little doubt they will still be in production in 2000. Actually, they may
be even faster, since Exponential Computing (which has since gone BIG
bankrupt) was announcing over a year ago that they could do 500Mhz by the
end of 97 and could push over a 1000MHz by 2000 for their Mac-based RISC
chips.

Of course, I would ask what the hell is the consumer going to do with
800Mhz of processing speed (hey, the system bus had better be whole frag of
a lot faster than it is now!), but then again, they always find new ways to
chew up a computer and make it seem slow...

Anyone remember the days when 10Mhz and a few hundred K of memory was all
anyone could ever possibly want?


> However, Intel shipping speeds like this to mass market consumers for
>somewhat reasonable prices, is important. The more power on distributed
>systems, whatever the processor, will only bring us nearer to the
>Matrix-like netowrks of the future. I'm already saving up for a datajack
>and an encephalon. :-)

Heh. Me too. But I'm also saving up for the cybereyes and the smartgun
link...

Erik J.

Who really is bent enough to actually be willing to have his perfect 20/20
eyes replaced with cybernetics...when they become good enough that is...
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 19:10:55 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/26/98 4:36:56 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
bigdaddy@*****.COM writes:

> > Intel is going to begin selling chips to the consumer market sometime in
> the
> > year 2000 ...
> >
> > Their speed .... 800 MHz ...
> >
> That's if and a big IF they get the 2k bug squashed. Hell wont that be
> funny. "we'll sell ya a chip that might work in the year 2000." But i
> wonder what happened in SR to cope with the year 2k bug? any ideas?
> --
The solution to the 2K bug already exists and all Intel chips above the 200
MHZ speeds are resolved beyond the problem already. Software that is before
the year 97 is also in need of checking. Beyond that, I don't know if I care.

I already know that the stuff I have is "2K Proof"...
-K
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 19:13:05 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/26/98 4:58:36 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
mike@*******.COM writes:

> However, Intel shipping speeds like this to mass market consumers for
> somewhat reasonable prices, is important. The more power on distributed
> systems, whatever the processor, will only bring us nearer to the
> Matrix-like netowrks of the future. I'm already saving up for a datajack
> and an encephalon. :-)
>
funny, I always thought one of the things in our way was connection speeds,
not processor speeds at this point....

-K (who would love to save up for an Encephalon, but isn't going to be able to
do that for some time yet)
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 19:46:59 -0300
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ubiratan P. Alberton" <ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR>
Subject: What's a megapulse?
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

With the recent computing discussion going around here, something has
come to my mind. How much is a megapulse worth in today's "data
measuring units (i.e bytes, megabytes, etc.). I'm using 8 megabytes
based on a somewhat quick calculation for a byte in a quartenary system
(64 bits, as oposed to 8 from todays binary computers).

Bira
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 19:19:03 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Biophysical Armor
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/26/98 5:37:18 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
sthanatos@*********.COM writes:

> I noticed a spell in Paolo's Shadowrun Character Generator called
> Biophysical armor. Unfortunately I have found no other information
> regarding this spell, so I don't know what it does. But it got me
> thinking...wouldn't it be cool to make a spell that produces the effects
> (and some sort of Guyver-esque looking biosuit) of dermal plating that
> protects the target...so here's my idea...if anyone cares to shoot it down:

OMG!!!! Paolo has it?!?!? Wow, if that is what I think it is, that is
something from my dark history. The spell, if it -IS/Was- mine (or my groups
in a possible case) wasn't designed as anything so perverse as a -Guyveresque-
plating. It is a lot more like the Pathogen Protection spells that are within
the "Health" category.

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 18:51:06 -0500
Reply-To: evamarie@**********.net
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Waffelmeisters <evamarie@**********.NET>
Subject: Re: Kiss and Tell
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

> From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
> Subject: Re: Kiss and Tell


> >> Are you people ready to spill your guts now. If you want to say
> >>you're playtesting just say it. That much I _think_ is allowed by FASA.
> >>Anything else isn't.
>
> Don't know. Anyone out there seen a FASA non-disclosure agreement?

I remeber it being pretty vauge- the whole thing is less than 1/2 a
page. The upshot is you don't talk publicly about FASA "inside info",
or reveal important aspects of upcomming material or related background
info. I assumed all playtesters signed one, but maybe its more because
I know one of the editors personally that I had to sign.
For example, If for some reason I knew what was up at Crater Lake
(which I don't, and never will unless I work at FASA or write related
subject material), I could not tell. If I discussed an upcoming product
with somebody at FASA, I could not reveal the specifics of that
discussion, including its topic, but could still discuss related areas
in other conversation. If I thought a rule should / would be changed,
and that idea came directly from such dissucssion, it would be a bad
thing discuss publicly. But if I thought up a rule change all on my
own, and sent the idea to FASA, I'm still free to share that with
whomever I like, as long as I don't talk about FASA's use of the rule.
I believe Steve K. has done this in the past.
The intention is that nobody messes with FASA's line developement and
publicity by spoiling long held in-game secrets (which they don't share
much anyhow) or publisizing unreleased work (which can change before
release anyhow).
Genrally, its hard to break the non-diclosure rule without looking
either really stupid (cause they might change stuff at the last minute)
or far to well informed (IE, "God Says So" type answers about certain
topics or off-the-wall rules changes and plot ideas- Like "what if
Dunkelzhan ran for President, and was then killed on the eve of his
inaugeration, and it created a mana vortex with X effect on astral
mages?").
So, yes, AFAIK, you could say you are play testing SOMETHING (unless
you were asked / told not to), but saying much about WHAT would be bad,
even after play testing ended. Saying EXACTLY what (specific rules) is
obviously out.
An important function of non-disclosure, as I can see it, is to keep
wild rumours to a minimum, giving FASA time to actually get something
done before folks send them tons of mail on the topic. Mike's desk
bends down in the middle as it is.

>
> > Aw, but then we'd loose that air of coy mystery. Actually, it
> >looks like many of the playtesters "handles" ended up as Shadow Talk
> >names in "Target: Smugglers Havens", so even if they won't tell you,
> >that will.
>
> Hey, how do you know that? The bloody thing isn't supposed to be shipping
> until today, and FASA's own site is saying to expect it on June 2!! (I'm
> expecting it a few days earlier though, since I've got a great game store
> with a solid distributor as my source). Don't tell me you've already got a
> hold of the thing...

I was asked if I'd like my name to be used, and asked if others were
maybe being used. I assumed It was OK to say so, as I thought the book
had arived in some locations by now (shows what I know, agreement or
not...). I can't imagine saying "uh, BTW, the name "Mongoose" and some
others may apear as a shadow posters" is the kind of thing
non-disclosure is meant for. Now, if I'd thought that maybe DUNKLEZHAN
was a shadowposter, or knew Mongoose and others played a major plot
role, THAT would be private info, as it would affect the product
developement. This is more on the area of an "easter egg" that makes
little sense if you don't know what to look for.

>
> And what about people like me or David or what not that use our real names
> most of the time? It's a lot easier to steal Mongoose as a handle than
> erikj is...

Couldn't say yet even if I did know exactly, I guess. I think somebody
was just looking for names, and thought it would be a cute "in-joke".
Anybody catches more once they scan the text, share them, eh? Unless
its "forbiden ground", of course.
-Mongoose
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 19:15:37 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Biophysical Armor
In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.32.19980526183429.006b801c@****.geocities.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 06:34 PM 5/26/98 -0400, you wrote:

>Dermal Shell

<snipped spell description>

Urm, maybe I'm missing something, but doesn't the Armor spell do something
like that already? Add Body points for damage resistance, right?

Seems like the extra stuff is really more cosmetic than anything. But
maybe I missed something in the description.

Erik J.


"Ladies & Gentleman, the newest member of the band, the one and only Spice
Boy, GRUMPY SPICE!!!" <and the crowd goes wild!!!>
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 19:16:04 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Hardsuits
In-Reply-To: <356B3F2B.29CCE2C5@************.com.br>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

ARGH!!!!

PLEASE don't send attachments to the list. While your file may well be
interesting, I didn't actually request it.

If you continue to send attachments to the list, I may have to send a
shadowrun team down to Brazil to kick your ass, wipe your hard drive and
stomp all over your modem as they dance upon your fingers with their boots.

So please, please, don't do it again.

Thank you.

Erik J.


"Ladies & Gentleman, the newest member of the band, the one and only Spice
Boy, GRUMPY SPICE!!!" <and the crowd goes wild!!!>
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 19:41:21 -0300
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ubiratan P. Alberton" <ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR>
Subject: Re: Server Prices (was Re: Hacking Security Tallies)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

Mike Elkins escreveu:
>
(snip mainframe building rules)

> Sanity Check: An Orange system for a small research group (25-50
> people), mission critical work: $40k*20*6 = $4.8 million. Yup, I can live
> with that.
>
> Double-Domed Mike


Good system! Better than the official thing (5M¥ per Security Rating
point... and those
systems always have at least 6 points.. ugh.). The official might fit
for UV (black) systems,
but not for the more normal stuff...

Bira
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 00:00:24 -0300
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ubiratan P. Alberton" <ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR>
Subject: Re: Insect Totems
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Airwasp escreveu:
>
> In a message dated 5/25/98 5:35:35 AM !!!First Boot!!!, dghost@****.COM
> writes:
>
> > Hey what about Shamans following Insect totems with normal bonus dice and
> > normal spirits makeing the standard Insect "shamans" a different
> > tradition?
>
> I had a potential NPC in the form of an Ant Shaman (same bonuses and
> disadvantages as a Wolf Shaman). He wanted to join the CAS army when the
> Azzie-CAS war broke out. Never panned out though. The group never followed
> what happened up close and personal.
>
> Mike

I don't think Insect shamans need bonuses. Probably the absence of
spell bonuses is
compensated by the fact that they can summon and mantain MANY powerful
spirits at a time.
Of course, the "totem" will eventually frag the shaman up, but that's
a detail :) .

Bira
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 19:22:53 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Hardsuits
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/26/98 5:54:26 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR writes:

> > Thanks,
> >
> > NightRain.
> >
>
> Here is the file. I would like feedback, for a future update...
>
> Bira
>
BIRA!!!!!!

Now look guy, this is what got you kicked off last time. STOP WITH THE LIST
ATTACHMENTS!!!!!

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 19:22:58 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: SThanatos <sthanatos@*********.COM>
Subject: Re: Biophysical Armor
In-Reply-To: <cc937d58.356b4de9@***.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

>OMG!!!! Paolo has it?!?!? Wow, if that is what I think it is, that is
>something from my dark history. The spell, if it -IS/Was- mine (or my groups
>in a possible case) wasn't designed as anything so perverse as a
-Guyveresque-
>plating. It is a lot more like the Pathogen Protection spells that are
within
>the "Health" category.

Perverse? PWBBBT! Oh well, I like it.
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 19:24:43 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/26/98 6:09:26 PM US Eastern Standard Time, erikj@****.COM
writes:

> Hey, is there anyone out there besides me that thinks that if the Awakening
> were to occur right now they would probably remain a vanilla human? I just
> don't see anything in my body that indicates "troll" or "elf" or
anything;
> I'm pretty much well within statistical and cosmetic standards for an
> average male...
>
I don't know Erik, the attitude kind of matches with Elvish traits, especially
IE type...

-K (as you said, the target was painted.... ;)
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 16:23:06 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Jeremy \"Bolthy\" Zimmerman"
<jeremy@***********.COM>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

----------
> From: Ubiratan P. Alberton <ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR>
> To: SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET
> Subject: What's a megapulse?
> Date: Tuesday, May 26, 1998 3:46 PM
>
> With the recent computing discussion going around here, something has
> come to my mind. How much is a megapulse worth in today's "data
> measuring units (i.e bytes, megabytes, etc.). I'm using 8 megabytes
> based on a somewhat quick calculation for a byte in a quartenary system
> (64 bits, as oposed to 8 from todays binary computers).
>

I take it saying that a megapulse is a thousand kilopulses doesn't help,
huh?

Isn't there a resource that says how much text you can fit in a pulse?
That should solve the problem right there. *shrug*
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 19:27:23 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: NEWSHADOW <NEWSHADOW@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 98-05-26 19:13:33 EDT, you write:

> The solution to the 2K bug already exists and all Intel chips above the 200
> MHZ speeds are resolved beyond the problem already. Software that is
before
> the year 97 is also in need of checking. Beyond that, I don't know if I
> care.

Does that mean that any computer that we buy now won't be affected by the Y2K
bug?

Shadow
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Arena/6852/index.html
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 18:27:16 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: William Ashe <wmashe@***.NET>
Subject: Re: Hijacking
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
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> More than a MORAL dilema. Neutralizing Hijackers in SR would not
be as
>easy as today. Even relatively legal cyber could allow them to
>communicate with outside compatriots, and if such communications were
>blocked, much nastier countermeasures would be likely, both on the plane
>and elsewhere, as potential terrorist groups tend to be larger, and
>better organized / funded.
> I'm thinking the hi-jacking would be just an "attention getting
>manuever" and barganing chip, the real threat being much worse. Hell,
>they arel ikely tokill everone just as a "proof of intention" statement,
>instead of bargaining. Even taking magical control of the hijackers
>might not be enough, if his compatriots KNEW you took control.
>-Mongoose X

more what I was thinking was the PC's "overhear" the planning or something.
Or worse; have it be a radical group that believes the same thing the PC's
do

-Bright Light
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 17:30:32 -0600
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: David Buehrer <dbuehrer@******.CARL.ORG>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
In-Reply-To: <199805262319.RAA07099@******.carl.org> from "Ubiratan P.
Alberton" at May 26, 98 07:46:59 pm
Content-Type: text

Ubiratan P. Alberton wrote:
/
/ With the recent computing discussion going around here, something has
/ come to my mind. How much is a megapulse worth in today's "data
/ measuring units (i.e bytes, megabytes, etc.).

Nobody knows. FASA didn't define the term on purpose (we think) so
that it wouldn't get tied down and possibly passed by present
technology. Witness the RPG Traveller. They had a real world limit on
the computer memory in their games that was surpased by real world
technology in the 80s. In Traveller hyperspace travel is used everyday
but their computers aren't much better than a Comodore 64 :) FASA
wisely didn't define a megapulse and can't get caught in that trap.

A Megapulse is a lot. It has always been a lot. And it will always be
a lot.

-David
--
"If I told you, then I'd have to pull a Shadowrun against you. Sorry."
--
email: dbuehrer@******.carl.org
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/1068/homepage.htm
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 00:30:08 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Hardsuits
In-Reply-To: <356B3F2B.29CCE2C5@************.com.br> from "Ubiratan P.
Alberton" at May 26, 98 07:16:11 pm
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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And verily, did Ubiratan P. Alberton hastily scribble thusly...
|> I'd love to see it.

A little *THWAP* for you Nightrain....
(For asking for it)

|> Thanks,
|>
|> NightRain.
|>
|
| Here is the file. I would like feedback, for a future update...

Feedback?
I'll give you feedback you ignorant idiot.

1> READ THE FAQQING FAQ!!!
2>
##### # # # # ## #####
# # # # # # # # #
# ###### # # # # # #
# # # # ## # ###### #####
# # # ## ## # # #
# # # # # # # #

And finally, 3>
####### ####### ####### ###
# # # # ###
# # # # ###
# # # # #
# # # #
# # # # ###
####### ####### # ###

In case you haven't got the message yet,
# # ####
## # # #
# # # # #
# # # # #
# ## # #
# # ####

###
##### # # # ## ##### # ###### #### ###
# # # ## # # # # # # # # ###
##### # # # # # # # # # ##### #### #
# # # # # # ###### ##### # # #
# # # # ## # # # # # # # # ###
##### # # # # # # # # ###### #### ###

|G/2f//R7xpjnVebNIsudwf+tWWXLVb41bVlWi2yW2dzUbe688VVbz5xpKjNts3xutlVrqtfS
|pNP0e4NmVXlnZlWVG1sXVY1566ow79rpNHfLtjA3deYzf2yy0ry/nly/8WaysvPqtW7LsfkV
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:27:28 +1200
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Danyel N Woods <9604801@********.AC.NZ>
Subject: Re: Hardsuits
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain

Quoth Ubiratan P Alberton (1016 27-5-98 NZT):

>NightRain escreveu:
><<SLICE>>
>> > If you want another view on the power-armor stuff, I have a
>> >file with an adaptation of the fabled Hardsuits from Bubblegum
Crisis
>> to
>> >Sr2. No Acer needed :) . If anyone wants this, send me mail in
>> private
>> >and I'll
>> >send it directly.
>>
>> I'd love to see it.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> NightRain.
>>
>
> Here is the file. I would like feedback, for a future update...
>
> Bira << File: hkit13.zip >>

<Dirty Harry>
Bira, the attachment close to hand, finds himself staring down the
smoking barrel of Duke's Carp .45.
"Now, I know what you're thinking. Did he fire seven carps, or only
six? And, y'know, in all this excitement I kinda lost count myself.
Since this is a Carp .45, the most powerful carp-gun in the world, and
it could thwap your head clean off, you gotta ask yourself one question:
Do I feel lucky?"
Duke cocks the .45. "Well, do you, punk?"
Bira grabs for the attachment...

*THWAP* *THWAP* *THWAP*

"Guess so. But luck don't mean much when the other guy changes clips."
</Dirty Harry>

While I thank you for the file, Bira (it might be useful as the basis of
the Labour units you spoke of), and this was probably a simple mistake
of addressing, the FAQ clearly says "Do NOT send attachments to the
list!" Gawd knows the list-server is sick enough as is.

Danyel Woods
9604801@********.ac.nz
GridSec Wannabe
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 17:31:50 -0600
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Mike Loseke <mike@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
In-Reply-To: <b963fa55.356b4c82@***.com> from "Ereskanti" at May 26,
98 07:13:05 pm
Content-Type: text

Thus spake Ereskanti:
>
> In a message dated 5/26/98 4:58:36 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
> mike@*******.com writes:
>
> > However, Intel shipping speeds like this to mass market consumers for
> > somewhat reasonable prices, is important. The more power on distributed
> > systems, whatever the processor, will only bring us nearer to the
> > Matrix-like netowrks of the future. I'm already saving up for a datajack
> > and an encephalon. :-)
> >
> funny, I always thought one of the things in our way was connection speeds,
> not processor speeds at this point....

That point of distinction is becoming more and more blurred as of
late. New switches and routers (and switching routers and routing
switches) are doing less in software and more in hardware. Have you
heard the phrase "wire speed?" This term is being thrown around by router
and switch manufacturers to describe the flow of traffic through their
devices. Basically, these devices, which have traditionaly been choke
points for network traffic, are capable of becoming almost transparent
to the flow of traffic across the wire between connection points. They
do this by making routing and switching decisions at the hardware level
instead of going through multiple layers of software.

With the increase in use of ATM, and gigabit ethernet basically here now,
the network will become less of a bottleneck than storage devices and
CPU's, especially when you take into consideration that you can bond
multiple pipes into much larger pipes which can handle more traffic
than any one computer can throw at them, for both backbone and single
connection use.

Of course, these high-speed networks still don't do anything for the
home user behind an analog switch on crappy phone lines being served by
US West. But with newer housing developments having fiber run out to
the slick instead of copper this is becoming more of a moot point. The
telco's are actually doing quite alot to improve the network as a whole
in some areas.

--
| Even Einstein objected to the idea of
Mike Loseke | wave-function collapse, calling it
mike@*******.com | "spooky action-at-a-distance."
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 17:35:04 -0600
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Adam J <fro@***.AB.CA>
Subject: [Admin] Re: Hardsuits
In-Reply-To: <356B3F2B.29CCE2C5@************.com.br>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 19:16 26/05/98 -0300, you wrote:
> Here is the file. I would like feedback, for a future update...
>
> Bira
>Attachment Converted: "C:\INTERNET\EUDORA\Attach\hkit13.zip"

Err.. Do Not under any circumstances post attachments to the list. This is
covered in the FAQ at http://www.coastnet.com/~dvixen

If you must send an attachment out: Ask the list who wants it, wait a day
or so, then send it to everyone one asked.

Or: Post it to a web page or FTP site and advertise the address.

If you can't do either of those for some reason, get it to me somehow and I
can post it online either permanently (Shadowrun Archive, ya'know), or
temporarily on my page..

Since this was a SR related attachment and may have been an accident, I'll
waive the standard unsubscribing..

Thank you,
-Adam J
ShadowRN AFL

-
http://www.interware.it/users/adamj \ fro@***.ab.ca \ ICQ# 2350330
ShadowRN Assistant Fearless Leader \ FreeRPG Webring \ TSS Productions
The Shadowrun Supplemental \ SR Archive Co-Maintainer \ RPGA Reviwer
"So Marilyn Manson is a criticism of gimmickry while being itself a gimmick."
--- Marilyn Manson
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 09:31:01 +1000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Robert Watkins <robert.watkins@******.COM>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Ubiratan P. Alberton writes:

>With the recent computing discussion going around here, something has
>come to my mind. How much is a megapulse worth in today's "data
>measuring units (i.e bytes, megabytes, etc.). I'm using 8 megabytes
>based on a somewhat quick calculation for a byte in a quartenary system
>(64 bits, as oposed to 8 from todays binary computers).


It is stated repeatedly throughout the sourcebooks that a megapulse is a
measurement term that has no relation whatsoever to bits, bytes, nybbles,
dynners, plytes, or dysserts (a nybble is 4 bits, a plyte is 2 bytes, a
dynner is 4 bytes, and a dyssert is a checksum bit on the end of a byte).
Although it is a measure of information size, the holographic storage
mechanism used in SR is not even compatible with current media, and can give
weird results (eg, a plain text file may be larger in size than the
equivalent file using formatted text). The term comes from pulse (well, duh)
which is a quantum of light, and indicates the number of quanta required to
represent the data.

In other words, don't try to find a comparison.

--
sig deleted to conserve electrons. robert.watkins@******.com
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 00:34:02 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
In-Reply-To: <356B4663.BB2C18A1@************.com.br> from "Ubiratan P.
Alberton" at May 26, 98 07:46:59 pm
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

And verily, did Ubiratan P. Alberton hastily scribble thusly...
|
|With the recent computing discussion going around here, something has
|come to my mind. How much is a megapulse worth in today's "data
|measuring units (i.e bytes, megabytes, etc.). I'm using 8 megabytes
|based on a somewhat quick calculation for a byte in a quartenary system
|(64 bits, as oposed to 8 from todays binary computers).

Please don't ask that.
And PLEASE read the FAQ!

The MegaPulse is a fictional construct to avoid the embarrassment caused to
the people who wrote traveller in the 80's.

(They specified a memory capacity for ships computers in Kilobytes...)
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:31:59 +1200
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Danyel N Woods <9604801@********.AC.NZ>
Subject: Re: Rigger 2 design sheet
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain

Quoth James Ojaste (0115 27-5-98 NZT):

>>I found an MS Excel spreadsheet on the 'net somewhere that let people
>>design vehicles according to the R2 rules. Unfortunately, I
>>accidentally deleted it a few weeks ago during a clean-out. Could
>>someone mail me this sheet privately, or direct me to the site where I
>>could find this download? (I want to check my ED-209 design according
>>to the rules.)
>
>Well, it's not a spreadsheet, but why don't you try The Shop? It's an
>R2 vehicle editor for W95 available from:
>http://ojaste.ml.org/~ojastej/SRII/
>
>It's currently at version 1.2.6

Downloaded it last night, James, but thanks for the heads-up. (Was that
a shameless plug, or what? :-). I'll give it a whirl over the weekend
(there're hard-drive limitations here at the polytech). I'll have to
see about that 'error loading from file' thing, too - probably the .ocx
is in the wrong place.

Danyel Woods
9604801@********.ac.nz
'Are you deliberately trying to drive me insane?'
'The universe is already mad. Anything else would be
redundant.'
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 09:40:18 +1000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Robert Watkins <robert.watkins@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

NEWSHADOW writes:
>Does that mean that any computer that we buy now won't be affected by the
Y2K
>bug?


Actually, if any electronic equipment (including, say, your VCR or
microwave) that you purchased new in the last 2-3 years (since the Y2K
problem became big news) is affected by the Y2K problem, then you have a
strong legal case that they sold you defective equipment/software. Go see a
lawyer. Some consumer organisations are already organising similar cases, so
maybe you should go talk to Ralph Nader.

Which means that if Intel has a Y2K problem (mind you, I wasn't aware of
it... where could I get more info), you could sue them. :) Or at least ask
for a fix.

Oh, and it's not a bug, it's a feature. Seriously. It's a feature of the
hardware/software that it has a problem with the year 00, in that it was
invariably a design decision. Built-in limitations aren't bugs. That's why
it's correctly called the Y2K _problem_ (or Millennium Problem).

--
.sig deleted to conserve electrons. robert.watkins@******.com
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 20:30:45 -0300
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ubiratan P. Alberton" <ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR>
Subject: Re: Biophysical Armor
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

SThanatos escreveu:
>
> I noticed a spell in Paolo's Shadowrun Character Generator called
> Biophysical armor. Unfortunately I have found no other information
> regarding this spell, so I don't know what it does. But it got me
> thinking...wouldn't it be cool to make a spell that produces the effects
> (and some sort of Guyver-esque looking biosuit) of dermal plating that
> protects the target...so here's my idea...if anyone cares to shoot it down:
>
>
(snip spell stats)

This made remember about an article in a Brasilian RPG magazine...
Something
about a critter (_Arthroderma sp._ :) ) wich was some kind of symbiote,
wich stayed in the
brain, and released chemicals in the bloodstream that caused a chitinous
armor to form aroud
the bearer's body. They gave stats from three species (_Arthroderma
gladius_, _A. hydra_ and
_A. araneus_ ), each with different characteristics. If anyone wants, I
can make a quick conversion
(the artivle was originally for GURPS).

Ubiratan
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 16:49:57 PDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Mon goose <landsquid@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
Content-Type: text/plain

>Subject: What's a megapulse?
>To: SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET
>
>With the recent computing discussion going around here, something has
>come to my mind. How much is a megapulse worth in today's "data
>measuring units (i.e bytes, megabytes, etc.). I'm using 8 megabytes
>based on a somewhat quick calculation for a byte in a quartenary system
>(64 bits, as oposed to 8 from todays binary computers).
>
> Bira
>

A better place to work from, IMO, is that an MP is an amount of
PROCESSOR POWER consumed. This way, files take MP because they are like
little java aplets that dislpay themselves (explaining both why platform
compatability is an issue and you don't need any programs to read chips
and such, and thier large size). Matrix utilities consume Deck
procesing power (although MPCP limits the "power"of utilities, perhaps
by limiting the instruction set availible). Other items are "burned"
onto chips, easily being a demand on procesorers to use, not a "memeory
size".
Under this assumption, memeory is practically free (reasonable
assumption), but processors have trouble with certain massive chunks of
"bloatware" (also, unfortunatley, a reasonable assumption).
-Mongoose



______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 13:10:20 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: David Hinkley <dhinkley@***.ORG>
Subject: Re: [ADMIN] Duplicates and the purge.
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.3.96.980525235126.470A-100000@********>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

On 25 May 98, at 23:56, Mark A. Imbriaco wrote:

> 1) I'm aware of the duplicate message problem. I don't see anything
> obvious causing it right now, so I'm going to ignore it until I restart
> the lists.
>
> 2) Re: Resetting the lists. Here's how it's going to work.
>
> 1. I send out a message saying that the lists are getting
> reset.
> 2. Wait 30 minutes.
> 3. Completely remove the lists from the server.
> 4. Re-create the list.
>
> At this point, everything will be back online and ready to roll
> with the new list. I don't intend to put the lists on hold or
> anything of that nature, so once you've subscribed, assume that
> the list is 'live'. I suspect that the lists will be available
> approximately 1 hour after I send the message saying that I am
> beginning the reset. In practice it will only take me a couple
> of minutes to do it, but I want to give the mail a chance to
> propagate.
>
> Hopefully that will clear things up a little bit.
>
> -Mark
>
The plan looks good. I would make an addition, when you know for sure when
this is going to happen. Post the approximate date and time (and the time
zone). That way the more fanactic or is it addicted members of this list can be
on line to get the final "I have started the purge" notice. So they can set
thier
on hour timer.





David Hinkley
dhinkley@***.org

====================================================
Those who are too intelligent to engage in politics
are punished by being governed by those who are not
--Plato
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 19:12:41 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Otaku Datajacks

On Tue, 26 May 1998 17:21:53 EDT Airwasp <Airwasp@***.COM> writes:
>In a message dated 5/26/98 6:58:59 PM !!!First Boot!!!, dghost@****.COM
>writes:
>> I just realized something ... normal datajacks take input from
whereever
>> and format it in format that can be understood by the brain or
whatever
>> ... So can an Otaku use a normal datajack for decking? As I
understand
>> it, the Otaku's brain basically becomes a cyberdeck, so the Otaku
would
>> only need a fiberoptic cable to the matrix ... If you agree here are
some
>> options:

>Dude, an otaku still needs a datajack, the one thing is that as time
goes on
>(before you actually begin playing the pc), the otaku mind rewrites the
code
>and melds somewhat with the jack, making it appear to act faster than it
>normally can.

I'm saying that I don't think Otaku could use a normal Datajack because
an Otaku's brain would work differently than a normal (meta)human's
brain. These were just suggestions because if an Otaku doesn't need the
formating of a normal datajack to jack into the Matrix, the DFR rate
would be faster... I never said they didn't need a datajack, I was
suggesting that they needed a specialized one ...

>Reread the section on Otaku in the VR2 ... it explains what happens to a
>datajack implanted into an otaku.
>
>Mike

No, it doesn't :) It says that the interaction between the brain &
datajack change... IMO, that is because of the changes in the brain not
the datajack ...

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 02:09:42 +0200
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Jörg Melcher <jom@********.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.16.19980526155638.08ff751a@****.fbiz.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

At 07:02 PM 5/26/98 -0400, Erik J. wrote:

>Hey, is there anyone out there besides me that thinks that if the Awakening
>were to occur right now they would probably remain a vanilla human? I just
>don't see anything in my body that indicates "troll" or "elf" or
anything;
>I'm pretty much well within statistical and cosmetic standards for an
>average male...

In germany there is a advertisement "you would have better asked someone
who had an understanding for this" .

Sorry , couln´d resist <mg>

JOM
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 20:22:26 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: DisnyShamn <DisnyShamn@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Acers
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

> now what about one of these powered suits that is filled with robotics like
> a drone and is controlled via remote control by a rigger? viable?? too
> expensive?? what do you think?

I think that'd be an anthropoid drone...

- Disney Shaman
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 19:19:49 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Biophysical Armor

On Tue, 26 May 1998 19:15:37 -0400 Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM> writes:
>At 06:34 PM 5/26/98 -0400, you wrote:
>>Dermal Shell
>
><snipped spell description>
>
>Urm, maybe I'm missing something, but doesn't the Armor spell do
something
>like that already? Add Body points for damage resistance, right?
>
>Seems like the extra stuff is really more cosmetic than anything. But
>maybe I missed something in the description.
>
>Erik J.
<SNIP Sig>

Actually, his version was "worse", his added 1 pt per success whereas the
normal armor spell adds 1 per 2 successes. :/

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 20:21:09 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
In-Reply-To: <19980526234958.9261.qmail@*******.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 04:49 PM 5/26/98 PDT, you wrote:

> A better place to work from, IMO, is that an MP is an amount of
>PROCESSOR POWER consumed. This way, files take MP because they are like
>little java aplets that dislpay themselves (explaining both why platform
>compatability is an issue and you don't need any programs to read chips
>and such, and thier large size). Matrix utilities consume Deck
>procesing power (although MPCP limits the "power"of utilities, perhaps
>by limiting the instruction set availible). Other items are "burned"
>onto chips, easily being a demand on procesorers to use, not a "memeory
>size".
> Under this assumption, memeory is practically free (reasonable
>assumption), but processors have trouble with certain massive chunks of
>"bloatware" (also, unfortunatley, a reasonable assumption).

Ooooooh...that's an elegant solution from my standpoint.

Yes, MegaPulses probably were an abstraction created to avoid making
statements about computers that would be made obsolete and laughable in a
few years.

But for those that want to know, for whatever reason, this is a terribly
elegant solution. Without knowing too much about computers other than how
to use them, this appeals to me on so many levels.

I like it.

Erik J.


"Forgive me FASA for I have sinned. It has been 6 days since I last played
Shadowrun and 15 days since I last bought a SRTCG booster pack."
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 20:21:32 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
In-Reply-To: <516baaad.356b4f3c@***.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 07:24 PM 5/26/98 EDT, you wrote:
>In a message dated 5/26/98 6:09:26 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
erikj@****.COM
>writes:
>
>> Hey, is there anyone out there besides me that thinks that if the Awakening
>> were to occur right now they would probably remain a vanilla human? I
just
>> don't see anything in my body that indicates "troll" or
"elf" or anything;
>> I'm pretty much well within statistical and cosmetic standards for an
>> average male...
>>
>I don't know Erik, the attitude kind of matches with Elvish traits,
especially
>IE type...


Carefull there... ;-)

Maybe...but all sorts of human corporate execs have that same sort of
general attitude...gotta remember I have a white collar job and the word
"Executive" is in my official job title...

Besides, I'm not skinny enough or tall enough to be an elf; I'd like to
claim their enhanced Charisma, but I know I don't score terribly high on
that Attribute either.

No, I'm afraid that I'd at best be a corporate wage mage, at worst, just
like I am now, a mundane wage slave...

But definitely corporate. And probably Ares, or for the New World Order in
BitB, Novatech.

Erik J.

But at least being corporate means I don't have to ask "And would you like
fries with that?" <shudder>
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 20:21:57 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Hardsuits
In-Reply-To: <81F7A43B468BD111AFEC00A024EA0A2B09D38F@*********.polytech. ac.nz>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 11:27 AM 5/27/98 +1200, you wrote:

><Dirty Harry>
>Bira, the attachment close to hand, finds himself staring down the
>smoking barrel of Duke's Carp .45.
>"Now, I know what you're thinking. Did he fire seven carps, or only
>six? And, y'know, in all this excitement I kinda lost count myself.
>Since this is a Carp .45, the most powerful carp-gun in the world, and
>it could thwap your head clean off, you gotta ask yourself one question:
>Do I feel lucky?"
>Duke cocks the .45. "Well, do you, punk?"
>Bira grabs for the attachment...
>
>*THWAP* *THWAP* *THWAP*
>
>"Guess so. But luck don't mean much when the other guy changes clips."
></Dirty Harry>


YES!! You bastard, you made me laugh out loud in my office!! My
co-workers think I'm strange enough as it is!

Actually, on the "Ingentization" topic, I probably would be the wage mage;
too strange for all the norms, but too straight for all the freaks, trapped
in that middle ground occupied by wage mages...

Erik J.

<raspy voice>

"Go ahead. Make my day."

</raspy voice>
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 20:25:50 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: DisnyShamn <DisnyShamn@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Biophysical Armor
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

> Creates a plating of physical armor around the target's body, which acts
> not unlike dermal plating. Form-fits to the targets body. The character
> adds his successes to the body attribute of the target.

Other than cosmetically, how would this differ from the regular "armor" spell?

- Disney Shaman
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 20:29:43 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: DisnyShamn <DisnyShamn@***.COM>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

> Isn't there a resource that says how much text you can fit in a pulse?
> That should solve the problem right there. *shrug*

Well, I've seen some things like this. Trouble is twofold:

(a) At the rates given, SR data capacity will soon be outstripped by real
world computers, and

(b) It would change with the SOTA curve, anyway. It's supposed to just be a
game mechanic reference, I recommend strongly against trying to translate it
into real-life equivalents.

- Disney Shaman
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 20:28:47 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: SThanatos <sthanatos@*********.COM>
Subject: Re: Biophysical Armor
In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.16.19980526161156.252ffc8e@****.fbiz.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

>>Dermal Shell
>
><snipped spell description>
>
>Urm, maybe I'm missing something, but doesn't the Armor spell do something
>like that already? Add Body points for damage resistance, right?
>
>Seems like the extra stuff is really more cosmetic than anything. But
>maybe I missed something in the description.

Well..magic is all about *style* ;)
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 01:59:43 +0200
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Jörg Melcher <jom@********.COM>
Subject: Re: Acers
In-Reply-To: <199805261016.MAA12866@*****.xs4all.nl>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

At 12:17 PM 5/26/98 +0100, Gurth wrote:

>> After all, in spite of the motors, it's a suit of armor, not a vehicle.
>
>But where exactly does the difference between a suit of powered armor
>and a walker vehicle lie?

In a powered armor you move by yourself with some assist from enchantments,
a walker is a vehicle with another kind of transmission.


JOM

jom@********.com

Handy : +491725341545, Homepage : http://members.aol.com/jomelcher

>>>>And it is my opinion that Elf´s had to be removed from
earth<<<<
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 20:42:45 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
In-Reply-To: <199805270011.AAA72958@****.ibm.net>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 02:09 AM 5/27/98 +0200, you wrote:

>In germany there is a advertisement "you would have better asked someone
>who had an understanding for this" .

Sorry, I'm sure it got lost in the translation to English, but I don't
really understand this sentence. Maybe it also has something to do with
the fact that as soon as I finish typing this I'm leaving work and heading
to the gym...but I don't understand what you were trying to say there.

Off to move piles of weights now...

Erik J.
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 20:50:20 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Mike Bobroff <Airwasp@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Acers
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

Okay everybody, Keith mentioned how we go about making mechs here for our
games ... so here is one I pulled up on the spot ...

There is something to remember about mechs ... these things are expensive,
which means they are not going to be really popular and will be few in number.
Though the greatest application for these things would be in the areas of
construction and possibly even mining.

So, without fanfare ... I present to you the Saedder Kruppe Construction Mech
Drone

And guys, this thing is a drone, otherwise the end cost for this thing would
be something in excess of 165 MILLION nuyen ...

Enjoy ...

Saedder Kruppe Construction Mech Droid

Handling Speed Accel Body Armor Signature
1/3 10 1 7 0 2

Autonav Pilot Sensors Cargo Load
3 1 5 22 9028


Seating : NA
Set-Up / Breakdown Time : NA
Entry Points : NA
L/ToP : NA
Fuel : Jet (7500 liters)
Economy : 0.3 km / liter
Point Value : 78626
Cost : 16,511,460 nuyen
Template : Jet-Fighter
Reference : NA

Other Features
Mechanical Legs (Cranes)(2)(30000 kg limit, includes max load)
Datajack Port
Drive-By-Wire III
Enviroseal (Gas)
Improve On-Road Handling 2
Mechanical Arms (2)(Strength 49)
Remote Control Interface
Rigger Adaption
Smart Materials
Smartlink II Integration
Spotlights
Structural Agility III
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 19:03:58 -0600
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Karl Low <kwil@*********.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>


>Hey, is there anyone out there besides me that thinks that if the Awakening
>were to occur right now they would probably remain a vanilla human? I just
>don't see anything in my body that indicates "troll" or "elf" or
anything;
>I'm pretty much well within statistical and cosmetic standards for an
>average male...


Just my luck, I'd remain your shorter than average human.
I don't have the stockiness to really qualify as going "dwarf", and at
5'3",
I'm just a shade too tall, to boot.

-Karl
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:26:49 +1000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Geoff Skellams <geoff.skellams@*********.COM.AU>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain

On Shadowrun Discussion, Karl Low[SMTP:kwil@*********.COM] wrote:
> From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
>
>
> >Hey, is there anyone out there besides me that thinks that if the
Awakening
> >were to occur right now they would probably remain a vanilla human?
I just
> >don't see anything in my body that indicates "troll" or "elf"
or
anything;
> >I'm pretty much well within statistical and cosmetic standards for an
> >average male...
>
>
> Just my luck, I'd remain your shorter than average human.
> I don't have the stockiness to really qualify as going "dwarf", and at
5'3",
> I'm just a shade too tall, to boot.
>
> -Karl

What everyone seems to be forgetting is that these are all just
stereotypes. In Shadowrun, it *is* possible to have a tall skinny dwarf
(5'3" is probably where a dwarf would top out), just the same way as it
is possible to have a short, fat elf. The figures in the book are just
averages. There are probably elves as short as 5'3" as well.
Let's see more short, fat, ugly elves. And ork or troll
supermodels. It makes the world a more interesting place

cheers
Geoff
--
Geoff Skellams R&D - Tower Software
Email Address: geoff.skellams@*********.com.au
Homepage: http://www.towersoft.com.au/staff/geoff/
ICQ Number: 2815165

"That rates about a 9.5 on my weird-shit-o-meter"
- Will Smith in "Men in Black"
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 22:15:37 -0300
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ubiratan P. Alberton" <ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR>
Subject: Re: [Admin] Re: Hardsuits
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Adam J escreveu:
>
> At 19:16 26/05/98 -0300, you wrote:
> > Here is the file. I would like feedback, for a future update...
> >
> > Bira
> >Attachment Converted: "C:\INTERNET\EUDORA\Attach\hkit13.zip"
>
> Err.. Do Not under any circumstances post attachments to the list. This is
> covered in the FAQ at http://www.coastnet.com/~dvixen
>
> If you must send an attachment out: Ask the list who wants it, wait a day
> or so, then send it to everyone one asked.
>
> Or: Post it to a web page or FTP site and advertise the address.
>
> If you can't do either of those for some reason, get it to me somehow and I
> can post it online either permanently (Shadowrun Archive, ya'know), or
> temporarily on my page..
>
> Since this was a SR related attachment and may have been an accident, I'll
> waive the standard unsubscribing..
>

This one I can explain! The person who asked for the file in the msg
I was replying to
sent his request to the list! As I had told everyone to ask me
PRIVATELY, I didn't pay attention
to the header, replying to the msg and ACCIDENTALY sending hkit13.zip to
the list. Sorry!

Bira
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 20:32:20 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Acers

On Wed, 27 May 1998 01:59:43 +0200 Jörg Melcher
<jom@********.COM> writes:
>At 12:17 PM 5/26/98 +0100, Gurth wrote:
>>> After all, in spite of the motors, it's a suit of armor, not a
vehicle.
>>
>>But where exactly does the difference between a suit of powered armor
>>and a walker vehicle lie?
>
>In a powered armor you move by yourself with some assist from
>enchantments,
>a walker is a vehicle with another kind of transmission.
>
>
>JOM
<SNIP Sig>

So a bicycle would fall under powered armor? ;P Conceptually I don't
think there is much difference from powered armor and vehicles ... hmmm
... what about fudging with whater chassis then for install a "seat" at 5
CF (6 - 1 [see Weight and Space restrictions pg 118 Rigger 2]) then say
that the standard Load represents the amount of additional wt that can be
carried and use the speed increase design option to represent increased
speed (from the wearer's walking movement rate)
:)
Just a though :)

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 22:22:12 -0300
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ubiratan P. Alberton" <ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR>
Subject: Re: Hardsuits
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Ereskanti escreveu:
>
> In a message dated 5/26/98 5:54:26 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
> ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR writes:
>
> > > Thanks,
> > >
> > > NightRain.
> > >
> >
> > Here is the file. I would like feedback, for a future update...
> >
> > Bira
> >
> BIRA!!!!!!
>
> Now look guy, this is what got you kicked off last time. STOP WITH THE LIST
> ATTACHMENTS!!!!!
>
> -K


I was an ACCIDENT! I toght NightRain's msg was private!!! This tough
me to pay attentio to
msg headers...

Bira
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 22:33:54 -0300
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ubiratan P. Alberton" <ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR>
Subject: Apologies and hkit link.
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

<Climbs up from 30m wide crater left by carps>

Okay, I writing this to apologize for sending that attachment
to the list. IIRC, I said in the original msg offering the file the
anyone who wanted the hkit should mail me privately. Mr. NightRain,
mailed to the list asking for it, and I, not having paid attention to
the msg header, just replied to him and sent the file. I know I made a
mistake and probaly deserved those .45 carp rounds, so this time I'm
sendin a URL where you can find it, a direct link to the file.

It is here:

http://www.br.homeshopping.com.br/~ubiratan/hkit13.zip

If you have trouble getting the file from this URL, mail me PRIVATELY,
and I repeat, PRIVATELY, and I'll send it. I would like feedback on
the text if possible.


Sincerely
Ubiratan P. Alberton
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 21:43:56 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Grahamdrew <grahamdrew@***.NET>
Subject: Re: smugglers?
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

> Okay. I kind figured one, but I hadn't thought of the other. I just
> remember the first SR novel I ever read (don't remember the title... )
> there was a T-Bird pilot, and he didn't seem like he did either of those.

I'm just making a wild guess but maybe Never Deal With A Dragon. The
one where the guy(Samual Verner) finds out he's a dog shaman after
geting extracted from Renraku...
--
DISCLAIMER: All grammatical and spelling errors are inserted
deliberately to test the software I am developing. In fact,
that is the only reason I am posting. Yeah, that's the ticket!
All my postings are just test data! Yeah!!
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 20:57:06 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization

On Wed, 27 May 1998 11:26:49 +1000 Geoff Skellams
<geoff.skellams@*********.COM.AU> writes:
>On Shadowrun Discussion, Karl Low[SMTP:kwil@*********.COM] wrote:
>> From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
>> >Hey, is there anyone out there besides me that thinks that if the
Awakening
>> >were to occur right now they would probably remain a vanilla human? I
just
>> >don't see anything in my body that indicates "troll" or
"elf" or
anything;
>> >I'm pretty much well within statistical and cosmetic standards for an
>> >average male...

>> Just my luck, I'd remain your shorter than average human.
>> I don't have the stockiness to really qualify as going "dwarf", and at
5'3",
>> I'm just a shade too tall, to boot.
>>
>> -Karl

>What everyone seems to be forgetting is that these are all just
>stereotypes. In Shadowrun, it *is* possible to have a tall skinny dwarf
>(5'3" is probably where a dwarf would top out), just the same way as it
>is possible to have a short, fat elf. The figures in the book are just
>averages. There are probably elves as short as 5'3" as well.

Actually at about 6'5" (~1.95 m) and 200 lbs (~90 kilos) I'd make for a
fat Elf or a tall (and still pudgey) human ... also, my hair is thick in
wavy which is not a common Elf feature, plus I don't have almond shaped
eyes ... so I'll prolly be a human even though I want to be an elf :)

BTW, even if what's listed are statistical averages, it doesn't say how
much variation there is ... although, the 20 questions section talks
about being a tall thin dwarf or a short fat elf, it doesn't say what
that means ... :P~

> Let's see more short, fat, ugly elves. And ork or troll
>supermodels. It makes the world a more interesting place
>
> "That rates about a 9.5 on my weird-shit-o-meter"
> - Will Smith in "Men in Black"

Sorry I just *HAD* to transplant that ;)

>cheers
>Geoff
<SNIP Sig>

Cheers? Interesting, where you from?
*
\@_@/
\_/

There, now, I've got the pointed ears ;)

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 03:42:27 +0200
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Jörg Melcher <jom@********.COM>
Subject: Re: Acers
In-Reply-To: <19980526.203516.10710.17.dghost@****.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

At 08:32 PM 5/26/98 -0500, you wrote:

>
>So a bicycle would fall under powered armor? ;P

Ups, not really. Unless it encloses you with a soiled layer off armor.

JOM
jom@********.com

Handy : +491725341545, Homepage : http://members.aol.com/jomelcher

>>>>And it is my opinion that Elf´s had to be removed from
earth<<<<
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 22:24:51 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: BigDaddy <bigdaddy@*****.COM>
Organization: @**** Network
Subject: Re: Ingentization
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Erik Jameson wrote:
>
> At 05:08 PM 5/26/98 -0500, you wrote:
> <snipped Wafflemeister's UGE story>
>
> >Well, I happen to be turning into an ork.Wierd HuH?I'm growing 2 new
> >teeth in the front of my mouth in the shape of fangs, and I have an
> >increased hunger for meat.Perfectly normal Ork :^).
>
> I dunno there Wyrmy, that could just be puberty hitting you upside the head...
>
> Sorry, couldn't resist. The door was wide open, the runway was clear, the
> target was painted...
>
> But seriously, it probably is just your hormones running rampant.
>
> Hey, is there anyone out there besides me that thinks that if the Awakening
> were to occur right now they would probably remain a vanilla human? I just
> don't see anything in my body that indicates "troll" or "elf" or
anything;
> I'm pretty much well within statistical and cosmetic standards for an
> average male...
>
> Erik J.
ill go for a troll. Im tall yes, not a friggin 8ft giant, and have the
dental work and broad shoulders. Hmmm, humanity would be too dull for me
gotta liven it up. Ork or dwarf nope no sir no how. Elf, hmmmm
possibilities do arise,


heres my pic someone tell me troll or elf or (pah!) even human.

--
Napalm Sticks to Kidz,
BigDaddy


http://www.flnet.com/~bigdaddy.html

ps this is not my gf in the pic. i get askeeddd that soo much. (im
workin on it heheehehehehe!)
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 23:03:11 -0300
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ubiratan P. Alberton" <ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

DisnyShamn escreveu:
>
> > Isn't there a resource that says how much text you can fit in a pulse?
> > That should solve the problem right there. *shrug*
>
> Well, I've seen some things like this. Trouble is twofold:
>
> (a) At the rates given, SR data capacity will soon be outstripped by real
> world computers, and
>
> (b) It would change with the SOTA curve, anyway. It's supposed to just be a
> game mechanic reference, I recommend strongly against trying to translate it
> into real-life equivalents.
>
> - Disney Shaman


The reason I was aking this is beacuse all my current players are
beginners, so I needed
something to make them understand how powerful those decks are... Never
mind, tough, just forget I asked this.

Bira
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 12:37:00 +1000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Geoff Skellams <geoff.skellams@*********.COM.AU>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain

On Shadowrun Discussion, Alfredo B Alves[SMTP:dghost@****.COM] wrote:
> >What everyone seems to be forgetting is that these are all just
> >stereotypes. In Shadowrun, it *is* possible to have a tall skinny
dwarf
> >(5'3" is probably where a dwarf would top out), just the same way as
it
> >is possible to have a short, fat elf. The figures in the book are
just
> >averages. There are probably elves as short as 5'3" as well.
>
<<< SNIP >>>
>
> BTW, even if what's listed are statistical averages, it doesn't say
how
> much variation there is ... although, the 20 questions section talks
> about being a tall thin dwarf or a short fat elf, it doesn't say what
> that means ... :P~
>
Personally, within reason, I reckon they mean what you want them
to mean. Mind you, a 6'6" dwarf is pushing things a bit.

> > Let's see more short, fat, ugly elves. And ork or troll
> >supermodels. It makes the world a more interesting place
> >
> > "That rates about a 9.5 on my weird-shit-o-meter"
> > - Will Smith in "Men in Black"
>
> Sorry I just *HAD* to transplant that ;)
>

I had to think about why, but it was funny when I did :) Actually, there
probably would be Ork or Troll supermodels in the world of 205x. At
least to some extent. Look at what we have now. Supermodels come from
all sorts of ethnic backgrounds. There are also a few "larger size"
supermodels as well. I'm sure that this would extend to metatypes in the
future. Sure, there are some people who would be offended by it, but I
am sure that some people are offended by the current set as well.

> >cheers
> >Geoff
> <SNIP Sig>
>
> Cheers? Interesting, where you from?

Me? Australia. Canberra to be more specific. (the email address is a bit
of a giveaway).

cheers
Geoff
--
Geoff Skellams R&D - Tower Software
Email Address: geoff.skellams@*********.com.au
Homepage: http://www.towersoft.com.au/staff/geoff/
ICQ Number: 2815165

"That rates about a 9.5 on my weird-shit-o-meter"
- Will Smith in "Men in Black"
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 12:34:25 +1000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Robert Watkins <robert.watkins@******.COM>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Ubiratan P. Alberton writes:To: SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET
<SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>

> The reason I was aking this is beacuse all my current players are
>beginners, so I needed
>something to make them understand how powerful those decks are... Never
>mind, tough, just forget I asked this.


Do it like this: Compare a modern PC to the early mainframes. A modern PC
could _emulate_ the early mainframe and still run circles around them. Ask
them to think of their PC as the early mainframe (the time frame is more or
less right, if you take into account the hiccup with the crash of '29).

Now take the quote from FastJack in the Denver Sourcebook, where he states
he uses a late-generation PowerPC chip (this is circa 2010, if I remember
right, and the chip was a few years old then). This chip wouldn't hit our
shelves for at least another few years. He uses that chip to do low-level
I/O work, IIRC.

So... the most powerful computer chip we could make today would be (barely)
suitable for a tertiary processor in a cyberdeck. (Okay, FastJack's deck
could probably run circles around an Excalibur, but it's the idea).

--
.sig deleted to conserve electrons. robert.watkins@******.com
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 21:07:08 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Matb <mbreton@**.NETCOM.COM>
Organization: Tin Roses Publishing
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

David Buehrer wrote:

> A Megapulse is a lot. It has always been a lot. And it will always be
> a lot.

Megapulse requirements even follow memory growth curves. Compare, oh,
the space Win3.1 takes up, compared to Win95. Then compare an Attack-6
program in SR1 to an Attack-6 program in VR2. (So the "amazingly huge"
500MP hard disk your decker bought in 2050 is a pinhead on which angels
dance in 2058.)


- Matt

------------------------------------
In a dark time, the eye begins to see. - T. Roethke

GridSec: SRCard
Teen Poets FAQ: http://pw1.netcom.com/~mbreton/poetry/poetfaq.htm
SRTCG Website: http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Station/2189/ccgtop.htm
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 22:54:45 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: List T-Shirt Price Options
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

Okay folks, listen up. I have information, price quotes no less.

T-Shirts (White or Gray) in sizes up to X-L with single color, single side are
12.95
T-Shirts (White or Gray) in sizes up to X-L with single color, two sided are
15.95

T-Shirts (White or Gray) in sizes up to X-L with two color, single side are
14.95
T-Shirts (White or Gray) in sizes up to X-L with two color, two sided, are
16.95 (IIRC).

Good color combinations :

Gray shirts with Black/Red or Black/Blue
Whites Shirts with Black/Blue or Red/Blue

The place is -probably- willing to lower the prices, especially when I told
him I'd be interested in 50 to 75 of them.

He can have the entire order (up to 70ish) done within a week or receiving the
order of actual T-Shirts. He will accept lots of stuff, especially pre-
prints. They use computer technology (GASP!), and can probably work out
different image options and image formats so that we can get the clarity that
-WE- want.

Please note, I did this as a side thought while I was out romping around
helping my roommate spend his tax return (gosh, I wish I could get that much).

They would probably be willing to take multiple personal checks and/or money
orders made out directly to them, thus removing the concept of someone else
having to collect the money then have anyone risk re-shipping. They are a
business here in Lafayette, and receipts could likely be printed (I wonder if
they'd charge for that much printing ? ;)

I know I am interested now for sure. I'll probably get my -personal- shirt
done with more colors and the like, and a "List Shirt" as well.

Just for curiosities sake, 5 colors, double sided, 27.95......per shirt.

Sizes of XX-L and XXX-L are available as well, at an additional $2 or so more
each.

Just FYI....

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 22:57:37 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Insect Totems
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/26/98 6:27:30 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR writes:

> I don't think Insect shamans need bonuses. Probably the absence of
> spell bonuses is
> compensated by the fact that they can summon and mantain MANY powerful
> spirits at a time.
> Of course, the "totem" will eventually frag the shaman up, but that's
> a detail :) .
>
> Bira
>
I somehow think/believe that several people are missing the point here. The
"Bug City" type of Insect Shamans would be considered a "Toxic
Variant", and
thus have those special spirits and the appropriate rules. Player-Character
Insect Shamans would NOT have such access, and would be more like "standard"
totems, with possibly the option of conjuring/summoning "worker spirits" that
would follow rules similar to the "Work Loa" in the Awakenings Book for the
Voudon.

Gosh folks, broaden a bit would ya???

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 22:59:10 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: DisnyShamn <DisnyShamn@***.COM>
Subject: megapulses for beginners
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

> The reason I was aking this is beacuse all my current players are
> beginners, so I needed something to make them understand how
> powerful those decks are... Never mind, tough, just forget I asked this.

Oh! Well, I find it simplest to say "They could download your machine's entire
hard drive faster than you can boot it up; and hold the contents it in
memory..."

- Disney Shaman
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 22:59:11 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/26/98 6:37:57 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
NEWSHADOW@***.COM writes:

> > The solution to the 2K bug already exists and all Intel chips above the
200
> > MHZ speeds are resolved beyond the problem already. Software that is
> before
> > the year 97 is also in need of checking. Beyond that, I don't know if I
> > care.
>
> Does that mean that any computer that we buy now won't be affected by the
> Y2K
> bug?
>
It means that any -NEW- computer purchased now -SHOULD- be free and clear of
the year 2K virus. It is always a wise thing to ask about this. IF the
salesman does not know if the machine/product is clear of the problem, then DO
NOT purchase it. If the salesman doesn't even know about the Year 2K Problem,
leave the store...

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 23:03:18 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/26/98 6:48:40 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
mike@*******.COM writes:

> With the increase in use of ATM, and gigabit ethernet basically here now,
> the network will become less of a bottleneck than storage devices and
> CPU's, especially when you take into consideration that you can bond
> multiple pipes into much larger pipes which can handle more traffic
> than any one computer can throw at them, for both backbone and single
> connection use.
>
> Of course, these high-speed networks still don't do anything for the
> home user behind an analog switch on crappy phone lines being served by
> US West. But with newer housing developments having fiber run out to
> the slick instead of copper this is becoming more of a moot point. The
> telco's are actually doing quite alot to improve the network as a whole
> in some areas.
>
And of course with the terminology you are mentioning, this is still NOT
focused upon the "At Home User" (AHU). Ethernet is NOT a big thing for the at
home user, and thus "Modems" are going to remain a restriction until "Cable
Linkups" become more common, OR we get two-way satellite feeds (I LIKE the 400
Mhz downloads I saw on the one).

Service providers are something else that SR doesn't go into greatly. Major
coverage and the like and how "crowded" are the bandwidths at any given time.
This could possibly effect a decker while doing their job.

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 13:06:51 +1000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Robert Watkins <robert.watkins@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Ereskanti writes:
>It means that any -NEW- computer purchased now -SHOULD- be free and clear
of
>the year 2K virus. It is always a wise thing to ask about this. IF the
>salesman does not know if the machine/product is clear of the problem, then
DO
>NOT purchase it. If the salesman doesn't even know about the Year 2K
Problem,
>leave the store...


There are two lessons in life you should have learnt by now, Ereskanti...
a) Never, EVER, ask the salesman something. They will NEVER know the answer,
and if they give you one, they just made it up on the spot.
b) Never, EVER, believe what the salesman tells you. Ask to speak to the
tech guy who fixes the stuff under warranty, and get him to tell you which
machines don't come back a lot.

Oh, and I'm sure that there are babies still in the womb that know about the
Y2K problem, so intensive is the media coverage. And they're probably as
well informed as the average salesperson.

Seriously, though, do ask, and get them to give you an answer, in writing,
signed by the manager of the store. If they are unwilling to give you said
document, then take your business elsewhere. Then keep the document in a
nice safe place so that you can submit it for evidence in the court case.

--
.sig deleted to conserve electrons. robert.watkins@******.com
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 23:17:04 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

Just FYI, ther -IS- a way to figure out a MP in SR measurements. Using the
"Universal Brotherhood" sourcebook, which has an exacting MP value, you could
do a translation into "MP Measurements" from "Current Memory"
format(s).

Just FYI
-K
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 23:27:08 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: 'K' is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/26/98 9:01:02 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
dghost@****.COM writes:

> BTW, even if what's listed are statistical averages, it doesn't say how
> much variation there is ... although, the 20 questions section talks
> about being a tall thin dwarf or a short fat elf, it doesn't say what
> that means ... :P~
>
Ah, but it -DOES- give variation if you look at the "Critter Table" for
options, and compare it to the "Racial maximums" table as well. Use the
percentages as height, weight, etcera...

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 23:35:58 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/26/98 10:11:15 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
robert.watkins@******.COM writes:

> There are two lessons in life you should have learnt by now, Ereskanti...
> a) Never, EVER, ask the salesman something. They will NEVER know the
answer,
> and if they give you one, they just made it up on the spot.
> b) Never, EVER, believe what the salesman tells you. Ask to speak to the
> tech guy who fixes the stuff under warranty, and get him to tell you which
> machines don't come back a lot.
>
Talk about this brings up a heller of a question to me. When
pawning/bargaining/trading in the SR realm, what kind of guarantees are viable
options to ask for from a Fixer concerning stuff like this. Sure, I know, you
should probably go to a Deckmeister, but for the samurai who just wants a
code-breaker for a maglock or something similar, that option may not be an
option.

Basically, has anyone -really- thought out the Negotiations/Etiquette role-
playing impact this could have?

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 23:39:08 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Hey BigDaddy!!!
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

Your web page address didn't come up right. Want to make sure of it for me
please?

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 23:50:00 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Jett <grota@*********.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Geoff Skellams wrote:
>
> On Shadowrun Discussion, Karl Low[SMTP:kwil@*********.COM] wrote:
> > From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
> >
> >
> > >Hey, is there anyone out there besides me that thinks that if the
> Awakening
> > >were to occur right now they would probably remain a vanilla human?
> I just
> > >don't see anything in my body that indicates "troll" or
"elf" or
> anything;
> > >I'm pretty much well within statistical and cosmetic standards for an
> > >average male...
> >
> >
> > Just my luck, I'd remain your shorter than average human.
> > I don't have the stockiness to really qualify as going "dwarf", and at
> 5'3",
> > I'm just a shade too tall, to boot.
> >
> > -Karl
>
> What everyone seems to be forgetting is that these are all just
> stereotypes. In Shadowrun, it *is* possible to have a tall skinny dwarf
> (5'3" is probably where a dwarf would top out), just the same way as it
> is possible to have a short, fat elf. The figures in the book are just
> averages. There are probably elves as short as 5'3" as well.
> Let's see more short, fat, ugly elves. And ork or troll
> supermodels. It makes the world a more interesting place
>
> cheers
> Geoff


Hear, hear! I volunteer to be the short, fat elf, the short, pretty ork,
or the tall, average dwarf. :) Of course, barring the sudden appearance
of warts, tusks, or a beard, I would most likely stay my old human self.
In 2057, you could bet that I'd be a shadowrunner, maybe a neoanarchist,
probably a shaman or a street sam (Hey, I could be a shamurai like
Jett!)


--Jett
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 23:44:38 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: MC23 <mc23@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: Hey BigDaddy!!!
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

Once upon a time, Ereskanti wrote;

>Your web page address didn't come up right. Want to make sure of it for me
>please?

Try it agin and 86 the .html

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

Ancient cultures believed that names held great power, personal names
more so and they were guarded very closely. To protect themselves, they
answered to another name, because if another discovered their real name,
it could be used against them.
History repeats itself.
Welcome to the Digital Age.
I am MC23
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 13:43:16 +1000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Robert Watkins <robert.watkins@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Ereksanti writes:
>Talk about this brings up a heller of a question to me. When
>pawning/bargaining/trading in the SR realm, what kind of guarantees are
viable
>options to ask for from a Fixer concerning stuff like this. Sure, I know,
you
>should probably go to a Deckmeister, but for the samurai who just wants a
>code-breaker for a maglock or something similar, that option may not be an
>option.


Well, you can assume that any competent fixer has knowledge bases to draw on
for helping him to evaluate gear. So the Fixer would presumably have at
least a part of a clue, or he probably wouldn't touch the stuff.

As for wether or not the fixer wants to pull a swifty or not... it would
depend largely, I think, on how likely it is for the fixer to get caught. A
fixer who is known for screwing his customers wouldn't last long, I feel.

In general, if a fixer doesn't have immediate access to something like a hot
one-shot icepick on a regular basis, he would probably know where to go to
get it. This level of indirection would probably increase the street index,
though.

--
sig deleted to conserve electrons. robert.watkins@******.com
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 22:01:58 -0600
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Adam J <fro@***.AB.CA>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
In-Reply-To: <356B745F.A97BB59C@************.com.br>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 23:03 26/05/98 -0300, you wrote:

> The reason I was aking this is beacuse all my current players are
>beginners, so I needed
>something to make them understand how powerful those decks are... Never
>mind, tough, just forget I asked this.

"Your deck? If you used it today you could connect to 18 quake servers at
once, control a character in every single deathmatch, and win. This while
chatting with 12 people at once, real time, of course. And you can be
working on the spreadsheet for that *job* thing of yours, and also fixing
up some editorial mistakes in TSS-378. Did I mention scanning some
databases for information about that hot new programming language that's
coming out?

If your little brain could keep up with it."

Unless you install Microdeck DeckOS61, of course.

-Adam
-
http://www.interware.it/users/adamj \ fro@***.ab.ca \ ICQ# 2350330
ShadowRN Assistant Fearless Leader \ FreeRPG Webring \ TSS Productions
The Shadowrun Supplemental \ SR Archive Co-Maintainer \ RPGA Reviwer
"So Marilyn Manson is a criticism of gimmickry while being itself a gimmick."
--- Marilyn Manson
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 23:59:06 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Hey BigDaddy!!!
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/26/98 10:46:58 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
mc23@**********.COM writes:

> >Your web page address didn't come up right. Want to make sure of it for me
> >please?
>
> Try it agin and 86 the .html
>
Thanks a bunch MC!!! It worked now...nice Christmas shot....ooo LEGS!!! :P

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 22:17:27 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Matb <mbreton@**.NETCOM.COM>
Organization: Tin Roses Publishing
Subject: Re: Ingentization
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

'K' is the Symbol wrote:

> > BTW, even if what's listed are statistical averages, it doesn't say how
> > much variation there is ... although, the 20 questions section talks
> > about being a tall thin dwarf or a short fat elf, it doesn't say what
> > that means ... :P~

> Ah, but it -DOES- give variation if you look at the "Critter Table" for
> options, and compare it to the "Racial maximums" table as well. Use the
> percentages as height, weight, etcera...

...Giving you such results as a 27kg, 60-cm Dwarf (2 feet, sixty-some
pounds - roughly) and a 1.8 meter, 81kg Dwarf as his brother. (Roughly
the same stats as an elf, that second one).

The first one isn't terribly believable, though - I'd hate to see a
full-grown Dwarf that size give birth. Incidentally, if you open up the
size table, you're bound to get players interested in the Variation
table as well - and the munchkins go wild for that +8 bonus to their
stats. (Who needs Priority A?) A bit more common sense, and a bit less
reliance on tables that don't apply.


- Matt

------------------------------------
In a dark time, the eye begins to see. - T. Roethke

GridSec: SRCard
Teen Poets FAQ: http://pw1.netcom.com/~mbreton/poetry/poetfaq.htm
SRTCG Website: http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Station/2189/ccgtop.htm
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 22:13:11 -0600
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Adam J <fro@***.AB.CA>
Subject: [OT] Re: Real-Life Computing ...
In-Reply-To: <016301bd88ff$a505ca20$5a5211ac@********.mincom.oz.au>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 09:40 27/05/98 +1000, you wrote:

>Actually, if any electronic equipment (including, say, your VCR or
>microwave) that you purchased new in the last 2-3 years (since the Y2K
>problem became big news) is affected by the Y2K problem, then you have a

Hell, even if I can't get a penny, I hope my 10 year old VCR explodes
because of the Y2K bug. Then my parents might buy a new one :P

-Adam
Who probably won't care, because he'll be too far away to use it..
-
http://www.interware.it/users/adamj \ fro@***.ab.ca \ ICQ# 2350330
ShadowRN Assistant Fearless Leader \ FreeRPG Webring \ TSS Productions
The Shadowrun Supplemental \ SR Archive Co-Maintainer \ RPGA Reviwer
"So Marilyn Manson is a criticism of gimmickry while being itself a gimmick."
--- Marilyn Manson
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 00:08:26 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Paul Gettle <pgettle@********.NET>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
In-Reply-To: <da67f86a.356b85b2@***.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

At 11:17 PM 5/26/98 -0400, K wrote:
>Just FYI, ther -IS- a way to figure out a MP in SR measurements.
Using the
>"Universal Brotherhood" sourcebook, which has an exacting MP value,
you could
>do a translation into "MP Measurements" from "Current Memory"
format(s).

Really?

I was under the impression that even simple textfiles in Shadowrun had
a signifigant deal of 'overhead' that precluded any sort of
conversion. After all, there's text styling, specific fonts used (most
likely included whole in the document), graphics (the UB file had
quite a few pictures in it, how much MP did they take up?), audio
annotations, subliminal sub-tracks that encourage you to buy Fuchi (or
MCT, depeding on who wrote the wordprocessor software that generated
the file) for when the file is viewed in the ASIST environment of a
cyberdeck, that sort of thing.

It's like the difference today between a flat plaintext file (where
you can reasonably asume 1 character = 1 byte) and a full blown html
document, with the associated background graphics, style sheets,
inline .gifs, scripting language applets and so on. The two documents
might have the exact same content, text-wise, but one is going to be a
lot bigger than the other.

Advance the SOTA curve 60-70 years, and you can see why bytes had to
be abandoned as an outmoded scale of measure.
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: PGP for Personal Privacy 5.5.3

iQCVAwUBNWuRms2C0fERRVM5AQGbnwP9F1LxbcxmZC+QqDM4JVReay235pscKRJk
e/KMgtCKfi+//MspTD1KLSEP2DXio0QzPbbyrCOB280dReUts49fKX9lH4T6E56l
NVnh3uZfY7dNIWm1+eoRmk3FvkwXmBe5o1sbVQSK9cmlu/Z+sGHjYCNutp+QRuTs
aZMcezIIezM=
=VH94
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

--
-- Paul Gettle (pgettle@********.net)
PGP Fingerprint, Key ID:11455339 (RSA 1024, created 97/08/08)
625A FFF0 76DC A077 D21C 556B BB58 00AA
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 00:33:46 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/26/98 11:06:23 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
mbreton@**.NETCOM.COM writes:

> The first one isn't terribly believable, though - I'd hate to see a
> full-grown Dwarf that size give birth. Incidentally, if you open up the
> size table, you're bound to get players interested in the Variation
> table as well - and the munchkins go wild for that +8 bonus to their
> stats. (Who needs Priority A?) A bit more common sense, and a bit less
> reliance on tables that don't apply.
>
it was an idea Mr. Breton...(snuffy voice)...besides the "extreme variations"
would also NOT be allowable as a beginning character without cyber/bioware to
make it so IMO. And as far as gaining those stats, the table suggestion is an
NPC thing, otherwise you are paying for those attribs with some hefty Karma IF
you are using the optional attribute maximum rules...

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 00:37:04 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/26/98 11:31:26 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
pgettle@********.NET writes:

> Really?
>
<snipped comparisons in html vs. flat text and other related ideas.>

All of what you said was true guy, I was merely trying to give an idea of
stuff, assuming HTML code or some variation thereof, as "Matrix" is an
interactive medium, and thus would probably utilize similar formats (even if
they are ultra-advanced).

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 22:43:41 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <granite@**.net>
From: GRANITE <granite@**.NET>
Organization: Granite Forge Productions
Subject: Re: Convention Stuff (Re: [OT] Sideways Smileys)
In-Reply-To: <356A492F.3237@*********.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

> I don't think anyone will have trouble IDing the great Jettster by her
> nick (yup, I'll be one of the likely minority female gamers).

Oh..not as small a minority as you might think..more and more of the
ladies are getting involved [Thank Goodness] in RPGs..LAst year's GC
had a very high babe factor..which I personally base on both numbers
as well as ocular pleasantness..

> But to
> make it easy, I just might walk around with a purple triangle painted
> over my left eye, just to make things a bit easier. ;)

Hmm..We are talking about GC here..you might not get noticed if that
is all you go for.. ;)
Actually I found it useful to slip my handle over my name on my
badge..Then when you are talking to someone and they sneak a peak at
your badge to see what your name is the spot your handle and aske
"Hey, aren't you the ....."
--------------------------------GRANITE
"Rock Steady"
===============================================
Lord, Grant Me The Serenity To Accept The Things I Cannot Change,
The Courage To Change The Things I Can,
And The Wisdom To Hide The Bodies Of Those People I Had To Kill
Because They Pissed Me Off.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ShadowRunner's Serenity Prayer
===============================================
Kind of a bummer. Gettin' your butt kicked by a dead guy.
- Lt Col McQueen
Understanding is a three edged sword. - Kosh
What is best in life?
To Crush Your Enemies,
To See Them Driven Before You,
To Hear The Lamentation Of Their Women. -Conan
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 00:41:40 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Insect Totems

On Tue, 26 May 1998 22:57:37 EDT Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM> writes:
>In a message dated 5/26/98 6:27:30 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
<SNIP>
>I somehow think/believe that several people are missing the point here.
The
>"Bug City" type of Insect Shamans would be considered a "Toxic
Variant",
and
>thus have those special spirits and the appropriate rules.
Player-Character
>Insect Shamans would NOT have such access, and would be more like
"standard"
>totems, with possibly the option of conjuring/summoning "worker spirits"
that
>would follow rules similar to the "Work Loa" in the Awakenings Book for
the
>Voudon.
>
>Gosh folks, broaden a bit would ya???
>
>-K

Hmmm...I think the "Worker Spirits" would be too close to the original
Insect Spirits ... what I was just wondering was basically if anybody
thought anything wrong with following an insect totem like a normal totem
instead of like the standard rules ... (though if you say that Ant speaks
to you, your gonna get a heap of trouble ... [though it'd be pretty funny
if you said "Grasshopper says I have much to learn ..."])

:)

Hmmmm... making Insect Shamans Toxic? don't Toxics summon warped
versions of what the normals summon? (I believe there is a mention in
Grimmy about Toxic Insect Shamans...) I think if, this were done, Insect
shamans should be a different tradition (ie, you have Hermetics,
Shamans/Druids, and Insect Shamans)

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
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Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
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=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 00:31:27 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?

On Tue, 26 May 1998 22:01:58 -0600 Adam J <fro@***.AB.CA> writes:
>At 23:03 26/05/98 -0300, you wrote:
>> The reason I was aking this is beacuse all my current players are
>> beginners, so I needed something to make them understand how powerful
those >> decks are... Never mind, tough, just forget I asked this.

>"Your deck? If you used it today you could connect to 18 quake servers
at
>once, control a character in every single deathmatch, and win. This
while
>chatting with 12 people at once, real time, of course. And you can be
>working on the spreadsheet for that *job* thing of yours, and also
fixing
>up some editorial mistakes in TSS-378. Did I mention scanning some
>databases for information about that hot new programming language that's
>coming out?
>
>If your little brain could keep up with it."
>
>Unless you install Microdeck DeckOS61, of course.
>
>-Adam
<SNIP Sig>

A less spectacular demonstration would be to point to the timestamps in
VR 2.0 ... notice anything? the time between posts is measured in
hundreths of a second ... if you've ever been on IRC you know that the
represents some blazing speed ... (although I don't know if shadowland
compares to IRC ... more like a cross between RN and IRC and most likely
with a lot of posts cut out ...) I tried checking the difference in
timestamps in the conversation about Otaku in the Denver SB but they were
all missing (I only recently realized how low their Target numbers would
be ... Cripes!)

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)
Hey what if Bill Gates was an IE?

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 01:44:13 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization

On Wed, 27 May 1998 12:37:00 +1000 Geoff Skellams
<geoff.skellams@*********.COM.AU> writes:
>On Shadowrun Discussion, Alfredo B Alves[SMTP:dghost@****.COM] wrote:
<snip "If I were a metahuman ...">
>> > Let's see more short, fat, ugly elves. And ork or troll
>> >supermodels. It makes the world a more interesting place
>> >
>> > "That rates about a 9.5 on my weird-shit-o-meter"
>> > - Will Smith in "Men in Black"

>> Sorry I just *HAD* to transplant that ;)

>I had to think about why, but it was funny when I did :) Actually, there
>probably would be Ork or Troll supermodels in the world of 205x. At
>least to some extent. Look at what we have now. Supermodels come from
>all sorts of ethnic backgrounds. There are also a few "larger size"
>supermodels as well. I'm sure that this would extend to metatypes in the
>future. Sure, there are some people who would be offended by it, but I
>am sure that some people are offended by the current set as well.

Actually, This could be a great Adventure idea ... Protect the Miss Troll
(or Ork or whatever) UCAS pageant from the Humanis or sabotage the
paageant ... Body Guard Duty for a Troll or Ork Trid/Simsense star (who
insists on hitting on the PCs ;) As well as comic relief (an aging,
goblinized Pamela Lee still on Buttwa--err -- Baywatch due the miracles
of plastic surgery [go figure ;) ] )

BTW, by "larger Size" models do mean larger than a 12" waist? ;)

Males of the list: how many of you would "go for" the different metatypes
and which ones?
(To answer my own question: Dwarves, Elves and humans deffinately, maybe
Orks, and on the very outside chance Trolls :)

Females of the list: Same question. (I felt if I didn't make the
distinction, it wouldn't be apparent that I was asking both genders :)

Btw, do female dwarves have facial hair? The descript in the BBB doesn't
say so IIRC, but Jett seemed to mention something about them having
some... I recall somewhere that they did but I'm pretty sure that's from
another RPG systems ...

>> >cheers
>> >Geoff
>> <SNIP Sig>

>> Cheers? Interesting, where you from?

>Me? Australia. Canberra to be more specific. (the email address is a bit
>of a giveaway).

>cheers
>Geoff
<SNIP Sig>

Not if you snip the Sig before you realize anything's up :)

Cheers back at ya ;)
D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)
Oh no! Pamela Lee has Goblinized into a Plastic Troll! Run away! Run
Away!
(Ok, It's late my brain is running on empty [barely running is more like
it ;) ] I need to go nite-nite before I say something stupid ... [too
late! ;) ])

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Tue, 26 May 1998 21:31:50 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Robert Nesius <nesius@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...(OT, obviously)
In-Reply-To: <199805262331.RAA21320@******.verinet.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

>Thus spake Ereskanti:
>>
>> In a message dated 5/26/98 4:58:36 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
>> mike@*******.com writes:
>>
>> > However, Intel shipping speeds like this to mass market consumers for
>> > somewhat reasonable prices, is important. The more power on distributed
>> > systems, whatever the processor, will only bring us nearer to the
>> > Matrix-like netowrks of the future. I'm already saving up for a datajack
>> > and an encephalon. :-)
>> >
>> funny, I always thought one of the things in our way was connection speeds,
>> not processor speeds at this point....
>
<Discourse on routing/switching technologies snipped>

There is a larger issue surrounding superfast microprocessors - the bus
speed on the board. The reason Exponential, who was touting a 500-700mghz
PPC chip, went bottom up was because designing a chip with backside cache
offered the same performace increase on slower chips for a much lower cost.
And what's more, the system-bus speeds on both PowerMac and Intel boards
are increasing. However, there are some very difficult problems involved
with bus speeds that high... I was talking with the Gossamer design team
this summer (The group that designed the board on the PowerMac G3's. I
worked with that team and went to lunch with them when we took the System
Software for that project Golden Master). One of them told me that
when the bus speeds get up to 100mghz or so, current technologies only
allow for the bus to be 1-2 centimeters long. That's not much room to
hook up a memory management unit, etc... (Oh, and to clarify, I wasn't
/on/ the Gossamer team. I was in a cross-functional support role.)

Anyway, the point is that the real gating item on obtaining performance
from mega-fast CPUs is how fast you can feed the processor instructions.
Even with the backside cache, these processors still end up
spending cycles either flushing their pipelines or waiting for
instructions to arrive.

There's a whole new angle developing in computing technology though -
Quantum Computers. They've actually successfully solved a problem
using a device exploiting quantum theory stuff. It's mostly over
my head, but the example used involved 4 "operations" to be performed
to make a decision. ie: a comparison. The quantum computer
solved all four possiblities at once... This is technology that
probably won't see the light of day though until....2050? :)

-Rob
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 03:38:26 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Phil Levis <pal@**.BROWN.EDU>
Subject: Re: Server Prices (was Re: Hacking Security Tallies)
In-Reply-To: <s56ae2c9.040@********.dragonsys.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Tue, 26 May 1998, Mike Elkins wrote:

> Here would be my rule of thumb: Base cost: 1-3 users: $8000
> 4-10 users $15000, 10-50 users $40,000, 50-100 users: $100,000
>
> Excellant Reliability: price x 5
> Rock-Solid Reliability: price x 15-25
>
> Security: Green System: price x 1.5
> Orange System: price x 6
> Red System: price x 15
> Black System: GM's call
>
> Add some more money for higher system ratings, too.

I'd personally lower the multipliers for excellent and rock-sold
reliability, and raise the base costs. <shrug>

These prices seem pretty reasonable to me, not as a 'mainframe' per se,
but as the cost of a *host*. So, some orange host for 40 users costs =Y=
1.25 mill, and it's pretty reliable. In that cost are, a la Matrix 1.0,
SANs, SPUs, a CPU, all that sort of jazz; it's a distributed system with
five or six physical boxes all linked up. By Matrix 2.0, it's an orange
sculpted host.

Phil
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 03:51:28 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Phil Levis <pal@**.BROWN.EDU>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...(OT, obviously)
In-Reply-To: <v03110701b1914362edab@[204.202.55.77]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Tue, 26 May 1998, Robert Nesius wrote:

> Software for that project Golden Master). One of them told me that
> when the bus speeds get up to 100mghz or so, current technologies only
> allow for the bus to be 1-2 centimeters long. That's not much room to

This changes with optical technology. Light travels much faster than
electricity.

> There's a whole new angle developing in computing technology though -
> Quantum Computers. They've actually successfully solved a problem
> using a device exploiting quantum theory stuff. It's mostly over
> my head, but the example used involved 4 "operations" to be performed
> to make a decision. ie: a comparison. The quantum computer
> solved all four possiblities at once... This is technology that
> probably won't see the light of day though until....2050? :)

I sat in on a few lectures on this topic. My personal opinion is that they
will fill a similar role to that of biological/genetic computation;
problem formulation is tough, and takes a long time, but once it's set up,
one can compute at amazing speeds. Not really well suited for normal
computer use, really.

The one area that quantum computers excel is cryptography. Several
leading researchers believe that once some of the techniques are
honed, public key cryptography will no longer be very secure; simple
formulations can solve for all the possible key combinations quite
effortlessly. One of the lecturers commented that once this development
was discovered, an extremely large (say, in the tens of millions) grant
came from a consortium of three letter agencies.

Phil
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:19:13 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: Re: Hijacking
In-Reply-To: <356B18D5.764C@**********.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

Waffelmeisters said on 14:32/26 May 98...

> I'm thinking the hi-jacking would be just an "attention getting
> manuever" and barganing chip, the real threat being much worse. Hell,
> they arel ikely tokill everone just as a "proof of intention" statement,
> instead of bargaining.

That would be a stupid move, because once all the hostages are dead you
give the CT teams a free hand -- they can come in without having to worry
about accidentally killing those hostages. Not to mention you've killed
one of the few things you can use to buy time with, if you're not planning
on bargaining.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
We never choose to be anything but truthful. It's right there in our
manual, under Lies.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- + --+--
Version 3.1: | Incubated into
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N | the First Church of
o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ | the Sqooshy Ball
tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y? | 21 May 1998
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ + --+--
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:19:15 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: Re: Ingentization
In-Reply-To: <19980527.014414.11246.0.dghost@****.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

Alfredo B Alves said on 1:44/27 May 98...

> Btw, do female dwarves have facial hair? The descript in the BBB doesn't
> say so IIRC, but Jett seemed to mention something about them having
> some... I recall somewhere that they did but I'm pretty sure that's from
> another RPG systems ...

I don't think they do; dwarf women in Middle Earth and on the Discworld
have beards, but I don't think they do in SR. I don't have any real idea
why they wouldn't, though.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
We never choose to be anything but truthful. It's right there in our
manual, under Lies.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- + --+--
Version 3.1: | Incubated into
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N | the First Church of
o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ | the Sqooshy Ball
tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y? | 21 May 1998
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ + --+--
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:19:14 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
In-Reply-To: <da67f86a.356b85b2@***.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

Ereskanti said on 23:17/26 May 98...

> Just FYI, ther -IS- a way to figure out a MP in SR measurements. Using the
> "Universal Brotherhood" sourcebook, which has an exacting MP value, you
could
> do a translation into "MP Measurements" from "Current Memory"
format(s).

You can also do it like this: we know a CD-ROM holds 640 MB. SR CDs hold
500 Mp (says Shadowbeat), so 1 Mp = 1.28 MB. This would assume no
breakthroughs in storage capacity, which is unlikely seeing DVDs hold a
lot more; I don't have the storage capacity of a DVD handy, though, so I
can't calculate how much an Mp would be when based on that. A lot less,
that's for certain.

An alternative method: normal-spectrum sound takes up 1 Mp per minute
(again, per Shadowbeat). A current CD can hold 74 minutes of music. Once
again I forgot how many bytes a minute of uncompressed, good-quality sound
takes up, but again it shouldn't be hard to convert. Be prepared to find
completely different figures than with the first method, however.

Also be prepared to find out that if these methods were to give "right"
values, people tend to write absurdly long essays in decker comments in SR
books. Lots of times we see things like "12.5 Mp snipped" -- which would
equate to a text several MB large. I dare you to write that much text in a
few minutes, or even days :)

Of course, a solution here is to say that the comments contain formatting
data, executables, and lots of other stuf, but it still doesn't make much
sense. It's generally easiest to just ignore the ratio and do not attempt
to convert between the fictional and real-world memory capacities.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
We never choose to be anything but truthful. It's right there in our
manual, under Lies.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- + --+--
Version 3.1: | Incubated into
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N | the First Church of
o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ | the Sqooshy Ball
tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y? | 21 May 1998
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ + --+--
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:19:14 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: Re: Biophysical Armor
In-Reply-To: <889ccaa8.356b5d8f@***.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

DisnyShamn said on 20:25/26 May 98...

> > Creates a plating of physical armor around the target's body, which acts
> > not unlike dermal plating. Form-fits to the targets body. The character
> > adds his successes to the body attribute of the target.
>
> Other than cosmetically, how would this differ from the regular "armor"
spell?

Probably in the same way Manaball differs from Mana Cloud, or Fireball
from Fireball.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
We never choose to be anything but truthful. It's right there in our
manual, under Lies.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- + --+--
Version 3.1: | Incubated into
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N | the First Church of
o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ | the Sqooshy Ball
tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y? | 21 May 1998
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ + --+--
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:19:14 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: Re: Biophysical Armor
In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.32.19980526183429.006b801c@****.geocities.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

SThanatos said on 18:34/26 May 98...

> I noticed a spell in Paolo's Shadowrun Character Generator called
> Biophysical armor. Unfortunately I have found no other information
> regarding this spell, so I don't know what it does.

I think it's in one of the NAGEEs, let me check... Yep, NAGEE #2 has it,
so an updated version for SRII should be in #6.

It was designed by one of our current listmembers, even (somehow, that
doesn't surprise me, reading the spell description now :)

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
We never choose to be anything but truthful. It's right there in our
manual, under Lies.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- + --+--
Version 3.1: | Incubated into
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N | the First Church of
o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ | the Sqooshy Ball
tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y? | 21 May 1998
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ + --+--
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:19:14 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: [OT] Re: Real-Life Computing ...
In-Reply-To: <002201bd891c$7f77f720$5a5211ac@********.mincom.oz.au>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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Robert Watkins said on 13:06/27 May 98...

> There are two lessons in life you should have learnt by now, Ereskanti...
> a) Never, EVER, ask the salesman something. They will NEVER know the answer,
> and if they give you one, they just made it up on the spot.
> b) Never, EVER, believe what the salesman tells you.

"I really don't know."
"Does your father know?"
"Do I know if he knows?"
"If you did would you tell me?"
"If he said that I could."
"If he said that you couldn't?"
"I would say I don't know."
"As you're saying right now. At least you're truthful."
"I try."
"Even when you lie. There's a paradox there. We are talking in circles."
"I went to divinity school."

(Followed a few lines down by the quote in my .sig.)

Sorry about the OT post, but I just had to do this after Robert's
comments about salesmen. Karma points for the first to tell me where this
is from and which people are involved in this discussion.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
We never choose to be anything but truthful. It's right there in our
manual, under Lies.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- + --+--
Version 3.1: | Incubated into
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N | the First Church of
o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ | the Sqooshy Ball
tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y? | 21 May 1998
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ + --+--
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:19:14 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: Re: (Back on topic) Insect spirits living in my bathroom
In-Reply-To: <356B326C.6DC9@*********.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

Jett said on 17:21/26 May 98...

> Maybe what you have are yellowjackets? They are much smaller and less
> aggressive than hornets, with smaller stingers. Really, more like skinny
> little bumblebees...

So _that's_ what a yellowjacket is... I always thought it was kind of a
funny name for a light helicopter. Now it turns out it's a bee-like insect
it makes much more sense.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
We never choose to be anything but truthful. It's right there in our
manual, under Lies.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- + --+--
Version 3.1: | Incubated into
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N | the First Church of
o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ | the Sqooshy Ball
tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y? | 21 May 1998
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ + --+--
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:19:14 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
In-Reply-To: <829d7158.356b5e79@***.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

DisnyShamn said on 20:29/26 May 98...

> (b) It would change with the SOTA curve, anyway. It's supposed to just be a
> game mechanic reference, I recommend strongly against trying to translate it
> into real-life equivalents.

Most definitely. Some years ago I calculated how large an Mp would be in
modern-day measures, IIRC in a few different ways. None of the values I
ended up with really made sense in the end. It's best to leave it as "An
Mp is an Mp" to avoid all this. If you need to know the size of a file,
just roll some dice :)

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
We never choose to be anything but truthful. It's right there in our
manual, under Lies.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- + --+--
Version 3.1: | Incubated into
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N | the First Church of
o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ | the Sqooshy Ball
tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y? | 21 May 1998
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ + --+--
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 02:38:59 +0000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Thomas Berman <gametheory@***********.COM>
Subject: Technobabel Teaser Q
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

At the end of Beyond the Pale... There's the usual teaser for the
next novel in the series. This one happens to be Steve Kenson's
Technobabel. The teaser starts off with a quote from Fastjack talking
about the Ghost in the Machine... Does anyone have any idea what the
hell he's talking about? It seems like the "Awakening" of the 'Trix
has been foreshadowed since for years... but coming from Fastjack it
just seems legit. Anyway, a clarification would be appreciated, if
anyone can oblige...


------------------------------
Thomas "Nylar" Berman
gametheory@***********.com
http://www.pipeline.com/~nylar
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:09:17 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
In-Reply-To: <014c01bd88fe$58b26940$5a5211ac@********.mincom.oz.au> from
"Robert Watkins" at May 27, 98 09:31:01 am
MIME-Version: 1.0
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And verily, did Robert Watkins hastily scribble thusly...
|
|Ubiratan P. Alberton writes:
|
|>With the recent computing discussion going around here, something has
|>come to my mind. How much is a megapulse worth in today's "data
|>measuring units (i.e bytes, megabytes, etc.). I'm using 8 megabytes
|>based on a somewhat quick calculation for a byte in a quartenary system
|>(64 bits, as oposed to 8 from todays binary computers).
|
|
|It is stated repeatedly throughout the sourcebooks that a megapulse is a
|measurement term that has no relation whatsoever to bits, bytes, nybbles,
|dynners, plytes, or dysserts (a nybble is 4 bits, a plyte is 2 bytes, a
|dynner is 4 bytes, and a dyssert is a checksum bit on the end of a byte).

First time I've heard of them.
I suppose it had to happen eventually though, what with Bytes and Nybbles
though....

I've always gone by the terms...
Byte
Word : 2 Bytes
Longword: 4 Bytes.

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:14:48 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: [ADMIN] Duplicates and the purge.
In-Reply-To: <199805262002.NAA26034@*****.efn.org> from "David Hinkley"
at May
26, 98 01:10:20 pm
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

And verily, did David Hinkley hastily scribble thusly...
|The plan looks good. I would make an addition, when you know for sure when
|this is going to happen. Post the approximate date and time (and the time
|zone). That way the more fanactic or is it addicted members of this list can be
|on line to get the final "I have started the purge" notice. So they can set
thier
|on hour timer.

I've just had a wonderful *ping* idea....
<Pulls cord and lightbulb over head goes out>

Is there any way to make elm DELAY posting a message for a set amount of
time? 'cos if there is, when the date came through, I could set it to send
the subscribe message automatically, while I'm away....

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:17:14 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Hardsuits
In-Reply-To: <4f237cda.356b4ece@***.com> from "Ereskanti" at May 26,
98 07:22:53 pm
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

And verily, did Ereskanti hastily scribble thusly...
|BIRA!!!!!!
|
|Now look guy, this is what got you kicked off last time. STOP WITH THE LIST
|ATTACHMENTS!!!!!

Last time?
So my venomous post was justified then...
(And just when I was starting to feel slightly guilty... )

:)
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:24:29 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
In-Reply-To: <00f901bd890b$eeb496e0$2e44e4cf@****.cadvision.com> from "Karl
Low" at May 26, 98 07:03:58 pm
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

And verily, did Karl Low hastily scribble thusly...
|Just my luck, I'd remain your shorter than average human.
|I don't have the stockiness to really qualify as going "dwarf", and at
5'3",
|I'm just a shade too tall, to boot.

Look. Even if the awakening DID arrive tomorrow, no-one's going Dwarf or Elf
anyway. Elves and Dwarves are BORN, not "awakened".

Ingenticisation is called that because it only works on humans TRANSFORMING
into one of the other races, and the only races that suffered that indignity
were Orks and Trolls.

In fact, as trolls are homo ingentis, that's where it got it's name from.

I suppose someone transforming into an ork could be said to be undergoing
Vulgarisation....

:)
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:36:09 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
In-Reply-To: <aa870630.356b8180@***.com> from "Ereskanti" at May 26,
98 10:59:11 pm
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

And verily, did Ereskanti hastily scribble thusly...
|It means that any -NEW- computer purchased now -SHOULD- be free and clear of
|the year 2K virus.

Y2K Virus?
Something tells me you've been reading too many tabloid papers.
Even if there is a virus set to go off on the year 2000, that's not what all
the current media panic is all about....

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:39:34 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980526220158.0086e210@****.lis.ab.ca> from "Adam
J"
at May 26, 98 10:01:58 pm
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

And verily, did Adam J hastily scribble thusly...
|If your little brain could keep up with it."
|
|Unless you install Microdeck DeckOS61, of course.

In which case, make sure you have that brainscan chip handy, for when you
need a full brain reboot and reinstall after it crashes for the 1000th time.
:)
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 04:58:05 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Matb <mbreton@**.NETCOM.COM>
Organization: Tin Roses Publishing
Subject: Re: Ingentization
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Ereskanti wrote:

> > The first one isn't terribly believable, though - I'd hate to see a
> > full-grown Dwarf that size give birth. Incidentally, if you open up the
> > size table, you're bound to get players interested in the Variation
> > table as well - and the munchkins go wild for that +8 bonus to their
> > stats. (Who needs Priority A?) A bit more common sense, and a bit less
> > reliance on tables that don't apply.

> it was an idea Mr. Breton...

Check 'em before you post 'em.

> besides the "extreme variations"
> would also NOT be allowable as a beginning character without cyber/bioware to
> make it so IMO.

At least as far as the critter size table is concerned, no
augmentation's needed. You born that way and gonna die that way.

> And as far as gaining those stats, the table suggestion is an
> NPC thing, otherwise you are paying for those attribs with some hefty Karma IF
> you are using the optional attribute maximum rules...

It's not even an NPC thing: It's a Critter thing. You were offering
that it be used for beginning characters, so you *can't* pay Karma for
them. Applying the table to (meta)humans, the bonus comes for free - no
zits, no worry, no nothin'.

That being said, there's a wide range of heights and weights
vanilla-humans fall under (check out a copy of Guiness' world Records -
which I've somehow misplaced). I'm not sure I'd translate those
straight across to all metatypes and variants; humans suffering giantism
already have a plague of worries and I'm not sure that a wakayambi or
(troll) giant would fare much better. It also marks your ass if you
ever have to conceal your identity.


- Matt

------------------------------------
In a dark time, the eye begins to see. - T. Roethke

GridSec: SRCard
Teen Poets FAQ: http://pw1.netcom.com/~mbreton/poetry/poetfaq.htm
SRTCG Website: http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Station/2189/ccgtop.htm
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:48:45 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Michael Cugley <michael.cugley@******.NET>
Subject: Shadowrun Quake
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Any Quake players out there? Specifically anyone interested in Quake
editing? I've often thought it'd be rather fun to have a Shadowrun-based
Quake mod, maybe based around a Bug Hunt type scenario. I've got some
map-designing and skinning experience (and a *small* amount of modelling
experience)... anyone else interested?

Obviously, we'd have to ask FASA nicely if we ever wanted to *distribute*
a SR-based mod, but I don't see why we can't have a go in the privacy of
our own hard-drives...


--
Mike Cugley, lunatic at large

http://freespace.virgin.net/michael.cugley/
http://freespace.virgin.net/michael.cugley/Art/
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:56:29 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
In-Reply-To: <199805270918.LAA25529@*****.xs4all.nl> from "Gurth" at May
27,
98 11:19:14 am
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

And verily, did Gurth hastily scribble thusly...
|Also be prepared to find out that if these methods were to give "right"
|values, people tend to write absurdly long essays in decker comments in SR
|books. Lots of times we see things like "12.5 Mp snipped" -- which would
|equate to a text several MB large. I dare you to write that much text in a
|few minutes, or even days :)

Who can say what snazzy effects they'll have for text online...
For one thing, you can guarantee it won't be ASCII text. More likely some
variation on unicode.

Now, if unicode has multiple, scalable fonts, that in itself is going to
take up ONE hell of a lot of memory.

If special eefects can be attached to fonts, such as moving/rotating/colour
changing, musical fonts, then .... The world is you welk.... Errrm...
Oyster. MASSIVE amounts of memory used for a simple "Hello".
(It just HAPPENS to be dancing arount the screen singing silly songs....)

:)


|Of course, a solution here is to say that the comments contain formatting
|data, executables, and lots of other stuf, but it still doesn't make much
|sense. It's generally easiest to just ignore the ratio and do not attempt
|to convert between the fictional and real-world memory capacities.

See above....

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:50:36 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...(OT, obviously)
In-Reply-To: <Pine.SOL.3.96.980527034040.3202B-100000@******> from "Phil
Levis" at May 27, 98 03:51:28 am
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

And verily, did Phil Levis hastily scribble thusly...
|
|On Tue, 26 May 1998, Robert Nesius wrote:
|
|> Software for that project Golden Master). One of them told me that
|> when the bus speeds get up to 100mghz or so, current technologies only
|> allow for the bus to be 1-2 centimeters long. That's not much room to
|
|This changes with optical technology. Light travels much faster than
|electricity.

When you're talking about high frequencies like that, the only difference
between light and the signals travelling down wires is the medium itself.

(The speed of light is *not* a constant. It changes depending on the medium
it's travelling through. i.e.

Free-space > 30 X 10^8 M/S
Wire (EM waves = EM radiation = Light [of very low frequencies]) Slower.
Fibreoptic cable. Slower. Faster than Wire, but still slower....

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 12:58:18 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
In-Reply-To: <13098.199805271056@******.teach.cs.keele.ac.uk> from
"Spike" at
May 27, 98 11:56:29 am
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

And verily, did Spike hastily scribble thusly...
|If special eefects can be attached to fonts, such as moving/rotating/colour
|changing, musical fonts, then .... The world is you welk.... Errrm...
|Oyster. MASSIVE amounts of memory used for a simple "Hello".
|(It just HAPPENS to be dancing arount the screen singing silly songs....)
|
|:)

Like a Festive Fonted "Merry Christmas" dancing around the screen singing...

"Mr Hanky the Christmas Poo, You love me and I love you...."

(Just saw it last weekend.... LOL)

"There's... something not quite right...."
"Yeh, something feels.... Incomplete...."
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 07:28:52 -0600
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: David Buehrer <dbuehrer@******.CARL.ORG>
Subject: Re: [OT] Delayed ELM
In-Reply-To: <199805271015.EAA09463@******.carl.org> from "Spike" at May
27,
98 11:14:48 am
Content-Type: text

Spike wrote:
/
/ I've just had a wonderful *ping* idea....
/ <Pulls cord and lightbulb over head goes out>
/
/ Is there any way to make elm DELAY posting a message for a set amount of
/ time? 'cos if there is, when the date came through, I could set it to send
/ the subscribe message automatically, while I'm away....

Maybe you could set it up with a filter. Send a message to yourself
that the filter will pick up and forward to the listserv at a specific
time.

-David
--
"If I told you, then I'd have to pull a Shadowrun against you. Sorry."
--
email: dbuehrer@******.carl.org
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/1068/homepage.htm
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 09:33:40 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Lehlan Decker <decker@****.FSU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Server Prices (was Re: Hacking Security Tallies)
In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.16.19980526133524.252fb29a@****.fbiz.com> from "Erik
Jameson" at May 26, 98 05:08:56 pm
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

>
> At 04:02 PM 5/26/98 -0400, you wrote:
>
> >>I haven't priced a mainframe lately, but my last company's mainframe
> >>cost $3.5 Mil, and it was a small one.
> >
> >*Boggle*! What is it used for?
>
> Note the difference in terms; he said *mainframe* while you said server.
>
> You're probably right for a common server, but he's definitely right for a
> mainframe machine.
>
> It really all depends on what you intend to do with that machine. If it's
> just a mail server, a P166 running NT 4.0 can service a 100 people no
> problem at all. My dad does that at his work. Says running the mail
> utilizes about 3-4%$ of the processor resources.
>
> But if you want your server to handle the firewall, the entire corporate
> database, all the mail, *EVERYTHING* then you need something bigger, like a
> mainframe.
>
> So make sure you are talking about the same thing here. That should solve
> half your problems with this discussion.
>
I'll toss in here a few thoughts. I've seen mention of the
requirments for a single mainframe, etc.
First putting all your eggs in one basket is always bad (I don't
care how reliable the machine is). Distributed computing seems
to be used more commonly (a web and mail server, one dns server, etc).
Second, one machine doesn't have to be the "ultimate" box. If trends
continue, clustering the resources of many machines seems likely
to be much more common. (And if one fails, far less stress).
Ex: In the Denver-DataHaven section of the sourcebook, it mentions
the Nexus doesn't have one huge mainframe, but several smaller but
still very beefier boxes.
Anyway....one with the show. :)
(Since know one in my group wants to play deckers, I don't have to
worry about this stuff often. :))



--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Lehlan Decker 644-4534 Systems Development
decker@****.fsu.edu http://www.scri.fsu.edu/~decker
--------------------------------------------------------------------
The universe doesn't have laws, it has habits. And habits can be broken.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 09:36:00 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Lehlan Decker <decker@****.FSU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
In-Reply-To: <356B363D.70DFEFE4@*****.com> from "BigDaddy" at May 26,
98 05:38:05 pm
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

>
> Airwasp wrote:
> >
> > For anyone wanting grins and giggles ... consider the following ...
> >
> > Intel is going to begin selling chips to the consumer market sometime in the
> > year 2000 ...
> >
> > Their speed .... 800 MHz ...
> >
> That's if and a big IF they get the 2k bug squashed. Hell wont that be
> funny. "we'll sell ya a chip that might work in the year 2000." But i
> wonder what happened in SR to cope with the year 2k bug? any ideas?
> --
Heh..I could mention something here about Dec-Alpha's processors but
I won't. :)
Most likley the 2k bug caused some chaos for awhile, and things went on.
Besides with the Crash of '29, I'm guessing it wasn't relevant. :)



--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Lehlan Decker 644-4534 Systems Development
decker@****.fsu.edu http://www.scri.fsu.edu/~decker
--------------------------------------------------------------------
The universe doesn't have laws, it has habits. And habits can be broken.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 09:39:20 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Lehlan Decker <decker@****.FSU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Server Prices (was Re: Hacking Security Tallies)
In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980526164548.007edb90@***.iquest.net> from "Justin
Bell" at May 26, 98 04:45:48 pm
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

>
> At 05:08 PM 5/26/98 -0400, Erik Jameson wrote:
> # At 04:02 PM 5/26/98 -0400, you wrote:
> #
> # >>I haven't priced a mainframe lately, but my last company's mainframe
> # >>cost $3.5 Mil, and it was a small one.
> # >
> # >*Boggle*! What is it used for?
> #
> # Note the difference in terms; he said *mainframe* while you said server.
> #
> # You're probably right for a common server, but he's definitely right for a
> # mainframe machine.
> #
> # It really all depends on what you intend to do with that machine. If it's
> # just a mail server, a P166 running NT 4.0 can service a 100 people no
> # problem at all. My dad does that at his work. Says running the mail
> # utilizes about 3-4%$ of the processor resources.
> #
> # But if you want your server to handle the firewall, the entire corporate
> # database, all the mail, *EVERYTHING* then you need something bigger, like a
> # mainframe.
>
> actually, a fairly inexpensive Sparc 2000 can handle EVERYTHING for a
> decent sized company, firewall and all.
>
And if someone hacks that one machine, your SOL. :) (It will also have
a more likely chance of failure, since it does everything.)
The other problem is of course, researchers. They need their own
dedicated systems, since often one researchers experiments will take
monthes to complete on one system with 20+ gig of drive space, and a gig
of RAM. Now translate this into shadowrun....

--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Lehlan Decker 644-4534 Systems Development
decker@****.fsu.edu http://www.scri.fsu.edu/~decker
--------------------------------------------------------------------
The universe doesn't have laws, it has habits. And habits can be broken.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 09:41:12 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Lehlan Decker <decker@****.FSU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Distance Strike Signature
In-Reply-To: <9b9ecc4a.356b468e@***.com> from "Ereskanti" at May 26,
98 06:47:41 pm
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

>
> In a message dated 5/26/98 10:49:25 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
> rogan@******.ORG writes:
>
> > Many PC physads in my campaigns have the distance strike power. We've
> > interpreted it as the hadugens from Street Fighter II so we figured each
> > character has a different signature. (like a spell signature) Like the
> > koborkuru dwarf does a spinning jump kick which emits a blast.
> >
> > Any of you have any thoughts or similar ideas?
> >
> Actually yeah, and we even added "Elementality (Select)" for 2 points to
the
> Killing Hands/Distance Strike option, giving the Killing Hands a true
> elemental effect of some kind.
>
> Now -there- is a signature for ya.
>
Ouch so for a distance strike killing hands with fire, I just used
all my starting magic points + some (don't have my books handy). Nice but
ouch!

--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Lehlan Decker 644-4534 Systems Development
decker@****.fsu.edu http://www.scri.fsu.edu/~decker
--------------------------------------------------------------------
The universe doesn't have laws, it has habits. And habits can be broken.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 07:35:26 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Hijacking

On Wed, 27 May 1998 11:19:13 +0100 Gurth <gurth@******.NL> writes:
>Waffelmeisters said on 14:32/26 May 98...
>> I'm thinking the hi-jacking would be just an "attention
getting
>> manuever" and barganing chip, the real threat being much worse. Hell,
>> they arel ikely tokill everone just as a "proof of intention"
statement,
>> instead of bargaining.

>That would be a stupid move, because once all the hostages are dead you
>give the CT teams a free hand -- they can come in without having to
worry
>about accidentally killing those hostages. Not to mention you've killed
>one of the few things you can use to buy time with, if you're not
planning
>on bargaining.
>
>--
>Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html -
<SNIP Sig>

I think he was referring to group A takes plane hostage, group gets
everyone's attention and describes threat posed by group B if demands
aren't met by a certain amount of time ... to prove they are serious,
Group A kills the passengers (and prolly suicides afterwards) ... Group B
is the real threat ...

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 08:41:00 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Speed Records (in 1989)

Well, as long as a I have the Guinness Book of World Records out for the
post about (meta)human heights, I thought I'd post the land speed records
(for the guy who maybe made a supersonic motorcycle, mainly)

Fastest Car: 633.468 mph (~1019 kph) --Jet Engined

Fastest Track motorcycle: 186.4 mph (~300 kph) --Gasoline Engine

Hope this is of some help ... IMO the Guinness book (An up-to-date copy)
is a good reference for determining the practicality of R2 / RBB vehicles
:)

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 07:25:56 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: (Back on topic) Insect spirits living in my bathroom

On Wed, 27 May 1998 11:19:14 +0100 Gurth <gurth@******.NL> writes:
>Jett said on 17:21/26 May 98...
>> Maybe what you have are yellowjackets? They are much smaller and less
>> aggressive than hornets, with smaller stingers. Really, more like
skinny
>> little bumblebees...
>
>So _that's_ what a yellowjacket is... I always thought it was kind of a
>funny name for a light helicopter. Now it turns out it's a bee-like
insect
>it makes much more sense.
>
>--
>Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html -
<SNIP Sig>

So the "Upgrade" in FoF is really insectoid cyberware? These poor little
insects were getting beat up by bigger insects so a kind hearted corp
design cyber for them? :)

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 09:43:47 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Lehlan Decker <decker@****.FSU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
In-Reply-To: <a314be4.356b4c01@***.com> from "Ereskanti" at May 26,
98 07:10:55 pm
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

>
> In a message dated 5/26/98 4:36:56 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
> bigdaddy@*****.COM writes:
>
> > > Intel is going to begin selling chips to the consumer market sometime in
> > the
> > > year 2000 ...
> > >
> > > Their speed .... 800 MHz ...
> > >
> > That's if and a big IF they get the 2k bug squashed. Hell wont that be
> > funny. "we'll sell ya a chip that might work in the year 2000." But i
> > wonder what happened in SR to cope with the year 2k bug? any ideas?
> > --
> The solution to the 2K bug already exists and all Intel chips above the 200
> MHZ speeds are resolved beyond the problem already. Software that is before
> the year 97 is also in need of checking. Beyond that, I don't know if I care.
>
> I already know that the stuff I have is "2K Proof"...

Heh..would this comment translate as if your behind SOTA you've
earned your problems. :)
Hmm...to keep this on task. This could definently be some good
material for a run. Some companies latest chip design has a flaw
and the competitor wants to expose it, or delay it. :)
--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Lehlan Decker 644-4534 Systems Development
decker@****.fsu.edu http://www.scri.fsu.edu/~decker
--------------------------------------------------------------------
The universe doesn't have laws, it has habits. And habits can be broken.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 09:47:33 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ojaste,James [NCR]" <James.Ojaste@**.GC.CA>
Subject: Re: [ADMIN] Duplicates and the purge.
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Spike wrote:
>I've just had a wonderful *ping* idea....
><Pulls cord and lightbulb over head goes out>
>
>Is there any way to make elm DELAY posting a message for a set amount of
>time? 'cos if there is, when the date came through, I could set it to send
>the subscribe message automatically, while I'm away....

Well, it's easy enough to tell unix to delay running elm... Set up a
crontab to run "elm -s subject email@******* < message.file" at the
appropriate time.

If you can't run crontab, setup a sh script to sleep lots and then run
elm as above. The just run the script with nohup.

James Ojaste
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 08:20:16 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization

On Wed, 27 May 1998 04:58:05 -0700 Matb <mbreton@**.NETCOM.COM> writes:
>Ereskanti wrote:
>> > The first one isn't terribly believable, though - I'd hate to see a
>> > full-grown Dwarf that size give birth. Incidentally, if you open
up the
>> > size table, you're bound to get players interested in the Variation
>> > table as well - and the munchkins go wild for that +8 bonus to
their
>> > stats. (Who needs Priority A?) A bit more common sense, and a bit
less
>> > reliance on tables that don't apply.

<SNIP what was said>
>That being said, there's a wide range of heights and weights
>vanilla-humans fall under (check out a copy of Guiness' world Records
>-
>which I've somehow misplaced). I'm not sure I'd translate those
>straight across to all metatypes and variants; humans suffering giantism
>already have a plague of worries and I'm not sure that a wakayambi or
>(troll) giant would fare much better. It also marks your ass if you
>ever have to conceal your identity.
>
>
>- Matt
<SNIP Sig>

My Copy is a little old (1989) but tthat shouldn't matter
(all of these are recorded/confirmed reports)
Tallest Male:
Robert Wadlow (with a height of 8 ft, 11 in [~2.7m] [at age 13 he was 7
ft 1 3/4 in {~2.2m} tall!] weighing about 491 lbs [~223 kg])

Tallest Female:
Zeng Jinlian (pronouced San Chung Lin) (with a height of 8 ft, 1 3/4 in
[2.5m])

Shortest Male:
Calvin Philips (with a height of 26 1/2 in [.67 m])

Shortest Female:
Pauline Musters (with a height of 23.2 in [.6 m] at age 19)

I would say these could represent (meta)human expression before the
awakening
BTW, both the Tallest Male and Tallest Female record holders died at an
early age (22 and 18 respectively, I think )
The Shortest Male/ Female, would represent, IMO, the (meta) human limits
...
BTW, The standard "diet" is 2000 calories (IIRC) and with a +50% increase
in height and a +150% increase in weight (he was thin), the Tallest Male
consumed 8,000 calories! (a 300% increase) So Imagine how much a Troll
eats!
I would say the Tallest Male and Tallest Female records represent height
limits for Elves and Orks ... Also, judging from the descriptions of the
very tall in the Guinness Book of World Records, I would say Trolls most
likely keep growing into their 20s.

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 07:21:23 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?

On Wed, 27 May 1998 11:19:14 +0100 Gurth <gurth@******.NL> writes:
>Ereskanti said on 23:17/26 May 98...
>> Just FYI, ther -IS- a way to figure out a MP in SR measurements.
Using the
>> "Universal Brotherhood" sourcebook, which has an exacting MP value,
you
>> could do a translation into "MP Measurements" from "Current
Memory"
>> format(s).

>You can also do it like this: we know a CD-ROM holds 640 MB. SR CDs hold
>500 Mp (says Shadowbeat), so 1 Mp = 1.28 MB. This would assume no
>breakthroughs in storage capacity, which is unlikely seeing DVDs hold a
>lot more; I don't have the storage capacity of a DVD handy, though, so I
>can't calculate how much an Mp would be when based on that. A lot less,
>that's for certain.

IIRC, DVDs hold 16 times what a normal CD holds so 1 Mp = 20.48 MB

<SNIP>
>Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html -
<SNIP Sig>

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 09:52:46 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Lehlan Decker <decker@****.FSU.EDU>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
In-Reply-To: <9c433285.356b8a1f@***.com> from "Ereskanti" at May 26,
98 11:35:58 pm
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

>
> In a message dated 5/26/98 10:11:15 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
> robert.watkins@******.COM writes:
>

> Talk about this brings up a heller of a question to me. When
> pawning/bargaining/trading in the SR realm, what kind of guarantees are viable
> options to ask for from a Fixer concerning stuff like this. Sure, I know, you
> should probably go to a Deckmeister, but for the samurai who just wants a
> code-breaker for a maglock or something similar, that option may not be an
> option.
>
> Basically, has anyone -really- thought out the Negotiations/Etiquette role-
> playing impact this could have?
>
Usually I handle this case by case, depending on the dice and if
the person actually role plays it worth a damn. :)
Usually I let better rolls lower the price, or throw in several small
things for free. I don't think any of my fixers would warranty anything
to the players. (They know better. :))


--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Lehlan Decker 644-4534 Systems Development
decker@****.fsu.edu http://www.scri.fsu.edu/~decker
--------------------------------------------------------------------
The universe doesn't have laws, it has habits. And habits can be broken.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 09:59:12 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ojaste,James [NCR]" <James.Ojaste@**.GC.CA>
Subject: Re: Server Prices (was Re: Hacking Security Tallies)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Erik Jameson wrote:
>>>I haven't priced a mainframe lately, but my last company's mainframe
>>>cost $3.5 Mil, and it was a small one.
>>
>>*Boggle*! What is it used for?
>
>Note the difference in terms; he said *mainframe* while you said server.

Well, given that the subject is "Server prices", and that a mainframe
is a server...

>You're probably right for a common server, but he's definitely right for a
>mainframe machine.

There's a difference between the average corp server and a machine used
for theoretical physics research...

>It really all depends on what you intend to do with that machine. If it's
>just a mail server, a P166 running NT 4.0 can service a 100 people no
>problem at all. My dad does that at his work. Says running the mail
>utilizes about 3-4%$ of the processor resources.

Well, most of that is probably just the OS - a P166 should be able to
handle 10k mail users without too much difficulty.

>But if you want your server to handle the firewall, the entire corporate
>database, all the mail, *EVERYTHING* then you need something bigger, like a
>mainframe.

Well, if you're insane enough to put your corp db on the same machine
as the firewall, you deserve what you get. Most people put the firewall
on a separate machine entirely, the email on another, the db on one or
more machines (depending on how critical the db is)...

>So make sure you are talking about the same thing here. That should solve
>half your problems with this discussion.

I don't think so. What's that P166 cost nowadays? $1000? Canadian!
So for $1M, you could get a cluster of 1000 of them. Now you're well
and truly into the realm of the supercomputer - far beyond what any
corp would need for general usage.

James Ojaste
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 09:57:03 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Lehlan Decker <decker@****.FSU.EDU>
Subject: Re: [ADMIN] Duplicates and the purge.
In-Reply-To: <12935.199805271014@******.teach.cs.keele.ac.uk> from
"Spike" at
May 27, 98 11:14:48 am
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

>
> And verily, did David Hinkley hastily scribble thusly...
> |The plan looks good. I would make an addition, when you know for sure when
> |this is going to happen. Post the approximate date and time (and the time
> |zone). That way the more fanactic or is it addicted members of this list can be
> |on line to get the final "I have started the purge" notice. So they can
set thier
> |on hour timer.
>
> I've just had a wonderful *ping* idea....
> <Pulls cord and lightbulb over head goes out>
>
> Is there any way to make elm DELAY posting a message for a set amount of
> time? 'cos if there is, when the date came through, I could set it to send
> the subscribe message automatically, while I'm away....
>
I don't think so, but if you have access to cron on the machine
you could probably get that to work. :)


--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Lehlan Decker 644-4534 Systems Development
decker@****.fsu.edu http://www.scri.fsu.edu/~decker
--------------------------------------------------------------------
The universe doesn't have laws, it has habits. And habits can be broken.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 10:03:54 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ojaste,James [NCR]" <James.Ojaste@**.GC.CA>
Subject: Re: Server Prices (was Re: Hacking Security Tallies)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Craig J Wilhelm Jr wrote:
>> A PC's limits nowadays are based more on the size of the case than on
>> the PC itself - a big tower with a set of 20G SCSI drives and hundreds
>> of megs of RAM will cover lots... Granted, PCs don't handle TB yet,
>> but that's far beyond what's required of most servers.
>
> I dunno about most, but let's take something as complex as a modern
>(1990's) car for example. From conception to production, the total data
>produced ranges between 20-40 terabytes.

How much of that data is ever used at once? Standard PCs can handle
well, let's say a SCSI system with 7 20G drives = 140G with, say, 512M
RAM. Not to be sneezed at. Then you decide to cluster them, add more
SCSI devices etc. Distributed computing tends to be much cheaper than
monolithic...

> In the 2050's, with people working on things like cyberdecks,
>cyberware, Banshees and other insanely complex things, the data
>handeling requirements are goint to push the limits of human
>comprehension. And how many exapulses of RAM does it take to run an AI
>on your server?

Pulses are ridiculous. Don't make me say it again. FASA might well
decide that you can get AI ratings at 1MP per.

James Ojaste
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 10:18:50 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ojaste,James [NCR]" <James.Ojaste@**.GC.CA>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Ereskanti wrote:
>> > Intel is going to begin selling chips to the consumer market sometime in
>> the
>> > year 2000 ...
>> >
>> That's if and a big IF they get the 2k bug squashed. Hell wont that be
>> funny. "we'll sell ya a chip that might work in the year 2000." But i
>> wonder what happened in SR to cope with the year 2k bug? any ideas?
>> --
>The solution to the 2K bug already exists and all Intel chips above the 200
>MHZ speeds are resolved beyond the problem already. Software that is before
>the year 97 is also in need of checking. Beyond that, I don't know if I
>care.

There's nothing 2k specific in the CPUs - CPUs don't deal with dates.
CPUs deal with data. The BIOS in the machine deals with dates, so old
machines may have incompliant BIOSes. The OS also deals with dates,
so they can be flawed.

Personally, I don't care. Y2K doesn't bother me one bit - sure, one or
two of my electronic appliances may stop working, but there's usually
a feature to set the date...

>I already know that the stuff I have is "2K Proof"...

The whole problem has been blown *way* out of proportion. I expect
that the most interesting thing happening on Jan 1, 2000 will be lots
of people getting drunk and watching the big apple drop. :-/

James Ojaste
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 10:15:07 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Tim Kerby <drekhead@***.NET>
Subject: Re: Shadowrun Quake
In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980527114845.007fb9a0@****.virgin.net>

On 27 May 98, at 11:48, Michael Cugley wrote:

> Any Quake players out there? Specifically anyone interested in Quake
> editing? I've often thought it'd be rather fun to have a Shadowrun-based
> Quake mod, maybe based around a Bug Hunt type scenario.

Thought about it, but if I did it I'd use the Quake II
or Unreal engine. Quake is outdated. Personally, I don't
think a first person perspective is the best choice for
Shadowrun. IMHO, the best Shadowrun game would use an
engine like the one in Diablo or Fallout (Top down 3/4
perspective).

> Obviously, we'd have to ask FASA nicely if we ever wanted to *distribute*
> a SR-based mod, but I don't see why we can't have a go in the privacy of
> our own hard-drives...

Yes, we'd definitely need permission, especially since
FASA Interactive is working on their own SR game.

--

=================================================================
- Tim Kerby - drekhead@***.net - ICQ-UIN 2883757 -
-----------------------------------------------------------------
"Reality is the only obstacle to happiness." - Unknown
=================================================================
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 10:23:59 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ojaste,James [NCR]" <James.Ojaste@**.GC.CA>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Justin Bell wrote:
># That's if and a big IF they get the 2k bug squashed. Hell wont that be
># funny. "we'll sell ya a chip that might work in the year 2000." But i
># wonder what happened in SR to cope with the year 2k bug? any ideas?
>
>you realise the 2029 bug was when the 32 bit time bug in UNIX hit

You mean 2038. By which time all *nix vendors will have switched to
64 bit times (yes, they're starting now). And it's not a 32 bit time
"bug", it's a 31 bit time limitation (they defined a time data structure
as a signed integer, instead of an unsigned long or something similar).

James Ojaste
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 07:25:26 PDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Matthew Waddilove <m_waddilove@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: Hardsuits
Content-Type: text/plain

Ereskanti wrote
>
>I just wanted to point out that in the Cyberpirates book, there is "Jym
Suit"
>used for deep diving. It mentions that if a "Rigger Adaptation" is
placed
>into it, it can function without modifiers, and even help the
individual out
>in the normal VCR ways...
>
>Just FYI...
>
>-K
>

The only problem is that the suit doesn't have legs, if I recall
correctly, after all what's the point of having legs at the bottom of
the sea.

-Matthew Waddilove

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 10:43:41 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ojaste,James [NCR]" <James.Ojaste@**.GC.CA>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Spike wrote:
>And verily, did Robert Watkins hastily scribble thusly...
>|It is stated repeatedly throughout the sourcebooks that a megapulse is a
>|measurement term that has no relation whatsoever to bits, bytes, nybbles,
>|dynners, plytes, or dysserts (a nybble is 4 bits, a plyte is 2 bytes, a
>|dynner is 4 bytes, and a dyssert is a checksum bit on the end of a byte).
>
>First time I've heard of them.

Ditto.

>I suppose it had to happen eventually though, what with Bytes and Nybbles
>though....
>
>I've always gone by the terms...
>Byte
>Word : 2 Bytes
>Longword: 4 Bytes.

Hmm. I've always used Bit, Nibble, Byte, Short, Integer/Word (2 or 4
bytes, depending), Long/Double Word. Then Float and Double, of course.

Why plyte, dynner and dyssert? Where have they ever been used?

James Ojaste
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 09:51:59 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Justin Bell <justin@******.NET>
Subject: Re: [ADMIN] Duplicates and the purge.
In-Reply-To: <12935.199805271014@******.teach.cs.keele.ac.uk>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 11:14 AM 5/27/98 +0100, Spike wrote:
# And verily, did David Hinkley hastily scribble thusly...
# |The plan looks good. I would make an addition, when you know for sure when
# |this is going to happen. Post the approximate date and time (and the time
# |zone). That way the more fanactic or is it addicted members of this list
can be
# |on line to get the final "I have started the purge" notice. So they can
set thier
# |on hour timer.
#
# I've just had a wonderful *ping* idea....
# <Pulls cord and lightbulb over head goes out>
#
# Is there any way to make elm DELAY posting a message for a set amount of
# time? 'cos if there is, when the date came through, I could set it to send
# the subscribe message automatically, while I'm away....

at 10:00
at> echo subscribe shadowrn|/bin/mailx -s" " listserv@********.itribe.net
ctrl-D

--
/- justin@****.mcp.com -------------------- justin@******.net -\
|Justin Bell NIC:JB3084| Time and rules are changing. |
|Simon & Schuster | Attention span is quickening. |
|Programmer | Welcome to the Information Age. |
\------------ http://www.mcp.com/people/justin/ ---------------/
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 10:58:10 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Paul Gettle <pgettle@********.NET>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...(OT, obviously)
In-Reply-To: <Pine.SOL.3.96.980527034040.3202B-100000@******>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

At 03:51 AM 5/27/98 -0400, Phil wrote:
>This changes with optical technology. Light travels much faster than
>electricity.

HUH? I was under the impression that electricity moved at near the
speed of light too. I'll grant that it's a tad slower than the 'speed
of light in a vacuum' but light traveling through fiber optics is also
slower than 'speed of light in a vacuum'. (IIRC, electomagnetics
traveling through any medium are impeded ever so slightly, which is
why they have to quote the speed 'in a vacuum')

I know it takes electricity one nanosecond to travel 11.something
inches (I think it's .82) through a copper wire. Anyone got good stats
on how long a light year is and is good at converting units of
measure?
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--
-- Paul Gettle (pgettle@********.net)
PGP Fingerprint, Key ID:11455339 (RSA 1024, created 97/08/08)
625A FFF0 76DC A077 D21C 556B BB58 00AA
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 10:48:43 +0000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <bxb24@**.opp.psu.edu>
From: Brett Borger <bxb121@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
In-Reply-To:
<cÊ%a=GOVMT.CANADA%p=GC+EC%lìNCR_EXCH2-980527141850Z-29897@***.ncr.ec.gc.ca>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

> >I already know that the stuff I have is "2K Proof"...
>
> The whole problem has been blown *way* out of proportion. I expect
> that the most interesting thing happening on Jan 1, 2000 will be lots
> of people getting drunk and watching the big apple drop. :-/

For the individual the problem has been blown out of proportion, but
corporations are panicing. a LOT of corporate Db's are
OLD....written in COBOL or proprietary languages, running on PDP-11's
or something older, held together with ducktape...They can't just
"change the date", and their DB's start dying left and right when
inventories etc. are screwed.

To bring this On-topic, here is my question: How much information,
assuming it was protected from the crash of '29, could be transfered
to the matrix?

Here's why: For most Y2K fixes, they can't change the Database, so
they cheat...they modify the program that interprets the database to
regard dates "before" a trigger date as 20xx, and after as 19xx.
(where I work, this is 39, but I imagine different places have
different dates). What if someone, say....BMW, had a huge database
of information regarding their design research over the last hundred
years...and when they "fixed" it, they chose a date of...."60".
Thus, in 2060, the bloody thing crashes again. And likely, only a
few people remember that this was built into their system. Anything
that nails S-K where it hurts sounds like great material for a run.

Potential Problems with this thought:
1) The info would have been trashed in the Crash
-Lots of companies didn't lose EVERYTHING...and if this was an old
database, I'm willing to bet it wasn't "connected". Since BMW was
still powerful after the crash, I'll assume this survived.

2) They couldn't transfer it to the Matrix
-Your guess is as good as mine. I say they did. Perhaps they hired
a special programming/hardware team to transfer it, because this
database was so important to them.

3) They would have fixed the problem when they transferred it
-No problem. Maybe they had too much trouble trying to get through
the spaghetti code of the Y2K fix on top of the original spaghetti
code. Maybe they only had executables that they didn't bother to
disassemble and examine in great detail beyond doing their job. This
is the kind of stuff that the players have to learn.

4) It would be easy to fix once it was on the Matrix.
-I'm GM, I say it wouldn't be. Complaints? (sound of a distant
"mooing" and whistling sound)

Comments?

-=SwiftOne=-
Brett Borger
SwiftOne@***.edu
AAP Techie
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 09:08:59 -0600
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: David Buehrer <dbuehrer@******.CARL.ORG>
Subject: Re: List T-Shirt Price Options
In-Reply-To: <199805270256.UAA01189@******.carl.org> from "Ereskanti" at
May
26, 98 10:54:45 pm
Content-Type: text

Ereskanti wrote:
/
/ Okay folks, listen up. I have information, price quotes no less.
/
/ 12.95
/ 15.95
/
/ 14.95
/ 16.95 (IIRC).

Add a couple bucks for shipping... well within my price range :)

/ They would probably be willing to take multiple personal checks and/or money
/ orders made out directly to them, thus removing the concept of someone else
/ having to collect the money then have anyone risk re-shipping.

Now that's a *great* idea. I would much rather someone set everything
up with a printer and let them take it from there.

Guess what Keith. You just volunteered manage the production of the
1998 ShadowRN T-shirt ;)

-David
--
"If I told you, then I'd have to pull a Shadowrun against you. Sorry."
--
email: dbuehrer@******.carl.org
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/1068/homepage.htm
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:19:09 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Tim Kerby <drekhead@***.NET>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...(OT, obviously)
In-Reply-To: <199805271456.LAA20399@*******.scescape.net>

On 27 May 98, at 10:58, Paul Gettle wrote:

> >This changes with optical technology. Light travels much faster than
> >electricity.
>
> HUH? I was under the impression that electricity moved at near the
> speed of light too. I'll grant that it's a tad slower than the 'speed of
> light in a vacuum' but light traveling through fiber optics is also slower
> than 'speed of light in a vacuum'. (IIRC, electomagnetics traveling
> through any medium are impeded ever so slightly, which is why they have to
> quote the speed 'in a vacuum')

Yes, you are right. The advantages to light over
electricity are integrity, and interference, not speed.
Light is not susceptible to EMF or RFI interference, so
is a more robust transfer medium. Plus, it maintains
signal integrity over a much greater distance.

--

=================================================================
- Tim Kerby - drekhead@***.net - ICQ-UIN 2883757 -
-----------------------------------------------------------------
"Reality is the only obstacle to happiness." - Unknown
=================================================================
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 08:17:02 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Jeremy \"Bolthy\" Zimmerman"
<jeremy@***********.COM>
Subject: Re: Shadowrun Quake
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

----------
> From: Michael Cugley <michael.cugley@******.NET>
> To: SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET
> Subject: Shadowrun Quake
> Date: Wednesday, May 27, 1998 3:48 AM
>
> Any Quake players out there? Specifically anyone interested in
Quake
> editing? I've often thought it'd be rather fun to have a Shadowrun-based
> Quake mod, maybe based around a Bug Hunt type scenario. I've got some
> map-designing and skinning experience (and a *small* amount of modelling
> experience)... anyone else interested?
>
> Obviously, we'd have to ask FASA nicely if we ever wanted to
*distribute*
> a SR-based mod, but I don't see why we can't have a go in the privacy of
> our own hard-drives...
>

Don't know if this is what you mean, but one of the deathmatch mods for
Quake 2 has a rigger as one of the types of characters you can play.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:36:40 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Paul Gettle <pgettle@********.NET>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
In-Reply-To: <199805270918.LAA25529@*****.xs4all.nl>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

At 11:19 AM 5/27/98 +0100, Gurth wrote:
>You can also do it like this: we know a CD-ROM holds 640 MB. SR CDs
hold
>500 Mp (says Shadowbeat), so 1 Mp = 1.28 MB. This would assume no
>breakthroughs in storage capacity, which is unlikely seeing DVDs hold
a
>lot more; I don't have the storage capacity of a DVD handy, though,
so I
>can't calculate how much an Mp would be when based on that. A lot
less,
>that's for certain.

The highest capacity version of DVD: double sided, double layered,
factory printed/read only, stores 15.90 gigabytes. IIRC the 500Mp CDs
in SR are recordable, but I'm sure that by 205x, the 'factory
printed/read only' bit will have changed. I imagine though, there will
have been more advancements that would have pushed the capacity up
even more, so that we can't make a Mp-->byte conversion table.

Right now, double layered DVDs have a layer that's transparent to one
wavelength of laserlight, and reflective to another, to allow about
twice as much data per side. Anyone care to speculate how many more
layers they'll be able to add?


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--
-- Paul Gettle (pgettle@********.net)
PGP Fingerprint, Key ID:11455339 (RSA 1024, created 97/08/08)
625A FFF0 76DC A077 D21C 556B BB58 00AA
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 16:35:20 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: [ADMIN] Duplicates and the purge.
In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980527095159.007d3100@***.iquest.net> from "Justin
Bell" at May 27, 98 09:51:59 am
MIME-Version: 1.0
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And verily, did Justin Bell hastily scribble thusly...
|at 10:00
|at> echo subscribe shadowrn|/bin/mailx -s" " listserv@********.itribe.net
|ctrl-D

Hmmm...
I'll give it a try, but how do you set the date in it?

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 10:55:00 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Justin Bell <justin@******.NET>
Subject: Re: [ADMIN] Duplicates and the purge.
In-Reply-To: <13437.199805271535@******.teach.cs.keele.ac.uk>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 04:35 PM 5/27/98 +0100, Spike wrote:
# And verily, did Justin Bell hastily scribble thusly...
# |at 10:00
# |at> echo subscribe shadowrn|/bin/mailx -s" " listserv@********.itribe.net
# |ctrl-D
#
# Hmmm...
# I'll give it a try, but how do you set the date in it?

try

[[CC]YY]MMDDhhmm[.SS]
--
/- justin@****.mcp.com -------------------- justin@******.net -\
|Justin Bell NIC:JB3084| Time and rules are changing. |
|Simon & Schuster | Attention span is quickening. |
|Programmer | Welcome to the Information Age. |
\------------ http://www.mcp.com/people/justin/ ---------------/
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:56:57 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Nexx3 <Nexx3@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
Mime-Version: 1.0
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In a message dated 98-05-27 07:47:12 EDT, u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK writes:

> In fact, as trolls are homo ingentis, that's where it got it's name from.
>
> I suppose someone transforming into an ork could be said to be undergoing
> Vulgarisation....

<buzzz>

Close but no potato (no smoking in the house... sorry). Trolls be H. sapiens
ingentis, not H. ingentis (at this point). Humans and trolls are still fully
cross-fertile, physical incompatiblity aside (I can imagine dermal armor is
very uncomfortable for the woman).

Nexx
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:46:43 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Mike Elkins <MikeE@*********.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization

When I was in High School, I was an elf: 6' tall, 120-130 lbs. (yikes!).
Then I married someone who can cook (unlike my mom), and now I'm
200lbs and no longer elfen in the least.

My daughter (not yet three years old) is a Physad: Pain Resistance for
sure, possibly improved speed as well. If your' trying to take a toy
away from her--is there a Phys Ad ability for "Kung Fu Grip"?

I'd probably end up corporate in 205x as well. Gee, I wonder who
"Dragon Systems, Inc." is secretly owned by? ;)

Double-Domed Mike
--Deal with a Dragon, it aint so bad!
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:57:23 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Nexx3 <Nexx3@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
Mime-Version: 1.0
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In a message dated 98-05-27 10:15:22 EDT, you write:

> I expect
> that the most interesting thing happening on Jan 1, 2000 will be lots
> of people getting drunk and watching the big apple drop. :-/

And celebrating the millenium a year early...

Nexx
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 17:04:10 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: [ADMIN] Duplicates and the purge.
In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980527105500.007f3180@***.iquest.net> from "Justin
Bell" at May 27, 98 10:55:00 am
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

And verily, did Justin Bell hastily scribble thusly...
|# Hmmm...
|# I'll give it a try, but how do you set the date in it?
|
|try
|
|[[CC]YY]MMDDhhmm[.SS]

thanks.
I skipped through the man pages just now, and it'll accept something like
at noon tomorrow....

So as long as the purge happens on Saturday morning....
Hmmmm. Then again, we're 5 -8 hours ahead, so a specific time might be
betterer....
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 17:06:18 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
In-Reply-To: <a4ae1909.356c37ca@***.com> from "Nexx3" at May 27, 98
11:56:57 am
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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And verily, did Nexx3 hastily scribble thusly...
|Close but no potato (no smoking in the house... sorry). Trolls be H. sapiens
|ingentis, not H. ingentis (at this point). Humans and trolls are still fully
|cross-fertile, physical incompatiblity aside (I can imagine dermal armor is
|very uncomfortable for the woman).

Oh, stop being pedantic...
So I forgot the Sapiens bit...

<Humanis>
It's not as if these trogs really ARE Sapient is it?
</Humanis>

:)
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 12:10:28 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Insect Totems
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In a message dated 5/27/98 12:44:00 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
dghost@****.COM writes:

> Hmmm...I think the "Worker Spirits" would be too close to the original
> Insect Spirits ... what I was just wondering was basically if anybody
> thought anything wrong with following an insect totem like a normal totem
> instead of like the standard rules ... (though if you say that Ant speaks
> to you, your gonna get a heap of trouble ... [though it'd be pretty funny
> if you said "Grasshopper says I have much to learn ..."])

NOT using the kind in the Voudon, the shells would have be specially prepared,
and the skills and/or other bonuses and Worker Insects get are a bit more than
a "Work Loa" IMO.

However, Grasshopper could get annoying...Toxic Variant, Locust...

> Hmmmm... making Insect Shamans Toxic? don't Toxics summon warped
> versions of what the normals summon? (I believe there is a mention in
> Grimmy about Toxic Insect Shamans...) I think if, this were done, Insect
> shamans should be a different tradition (ie, you have Hermetics,
> Shamans/Druids, and Insect Shamans)

They are given "Threat" ratings, and the section in the Grimoire is discussing
"Magical Threats" (ie; Insect Shamans and Toxic Shamans). However, the
"Druidic" forces, as well as ((*clears throat*)) -Other- organizations, might
very well have insect types amongst their numbers.

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 12:16:20 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Paul Gettle <pgettle@********.NET>
Subject: Millenium: '00 or '01? [was: Re: Real-Life Computing ...]
In-Reply-To: <1df9ff3d.356c37e4@***.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

At 11:57 AM 5/27/98 -0400, Nexx wrote:
>In a message dated 98-05-27 10:15:22 EDT, you write:
>
>> I expect
>> that the most interesting thing happening on Jan 1, 2000 will be
lots
>> of people getting drunk and watching the big apple drop. :-/
>
>And celebrating the millenium a year early...

I'm taking this aproach to the whole '00 or '01 issue:

New Year's for 99-00, I'm going to have a BIG ASS 'Rollover' party (as
in the rolling over of an odometer).

New Year's for 00-01, I'm going to have a BIG ASS 'New Millenium'
party (just as big and disgusting as the year before, but for an
entirely different reason)

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Version: PGP for Personal Privacy 5.5.3

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--
-- Paul Gettle (pgettle@********.net)
PGP Fingerprint, Key ID:11455339 (RSA 1024, created 97/08/08)
625A FFF0 76DC A077 D21C 556B BB58 00AA
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 12:15:24 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Nexx Many-Scars <Nexx3@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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In a message dated 98-05-27 12:07:13 EDT, you write:

> Oh, stop being pedantic...
> So I forgot the Sapiens bit...

I'm a teacher by both inclination and training, Spike... being pedantic is
what I _do_.

> <Humanis>
> It's not as if these trogs really ARE Sapient is it?
> </Humanis>

<rational bigot>
Who gives a damn if they're sapient or not? They get pissed if you say they
aren't, and I don't want one pissed at me.
</rational bigot>
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 12:19:36 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
Mime-Version: 1.0
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In a message dated 5/27/98 4:21:18 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
gurth@******.NL writes:

> Also be prepared to find out that if these methods were to give "right"
> values, people tend to write absurdly long essays in decker comments in SR
> books. Lots of times we see things like "12.5 Mp snipped" -- which would
> equate to a text several MB large. I dare you to write that much text in a
> few minutes, or even days :)
>
I know I snipped stuff on both sides of this paragraph, concerning sound, DVD
memory values, etcetera...

However, something that I should point out is that we as the gamer are only
barely getting the full impact of a truly *Interactive* medium. We have books
and text, what if -all- the material was in VRML or higher mediums? Every
written word actually becomes Phonic, with full color and frame-imaging
comparisons. Suddenly, the UB book(s) memory comparisons are NOT that out of
the ordinary in comparison to say, a DVD disk if we take this into thought.

Remember, "typing" does still exist in the SR universe, the but the vast
majority of stuff in symbolic representation and/or Full-X Interactive.
Everything IMO is a recording or a macro, and even macros can be direct guided
by voice/mental controls.

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 12:24:56 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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In a message dated 5/27/98 6:46:16 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK writes:

> And verily, did Ereskanti hastily scribble thusly...
> |It means that any -NEW- computer purchased now -SHOULD- be free and clear
> of
> |the year 2K virus.
>
> Y2K Virus?
> Something tells me you've been reading too many tabloid papers.
> Even if there is a virus set to go off on the year 2000, that's not what
all
> the current media panic is all about....
>
I know that, but I am using Media terminology, not truthsayers tongue okay???
-K
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 09:37:33 PDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Matthew Waddilove <m_waddilove@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
Content-Type: text/plain

Waffelmeisters
>
>Well, It's official. I'm turning into a troll. :] I visited the
>dentist, and that weird poking feeling in the back of my left upper jaw
>is my 33rd tooth coming in. There's a matching one on the other side
>waiting to join it. (that makes 34, two more than non-trolls should
>ever have, according to SR racial descriptions).
> Next thing you know, I'll bust out in warts and gain 350 lbs...
> Were there any reported cases of "spike UGE"? That could save
me a LOT
>in dentist bills (not to mention make me some good money as a circus
>freek). Actually, the dentist says these extra molars are not to rare-
>it happens to 1-2% of the population...

Yeah I had a whole extra set of canines that the dentist had to take
out, so the question is what does that make me? ;)

About Spike UGE I've done something like this. I played an Elven child
of the millenium. He was born at 00:00.01 01/01/2001. Cheezy I know but
what the heck and "goblinized" to an elf at the very start of the
Awakening. To simulate his age at the time we were running 2054ish I
just assigned low physical stats and lots to skills.
I know it's not BTB, it came about by not remembering the intro in BBB
right and by the time I remembered it seemed like to good an idea to
pass up.

-Matthew Waddilove

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 12:36:56 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: 'K' is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Hardsuits
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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In a message dated 5/27/98 9:26:25 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
m_waddilove@*******.COM writes:

> The only problem is that the suit doesn't have legs, if I recall
> correctly, after all what's the point of having legs at the bottom of
> the sea.
>
Start recalling. JYM suits have whatever their designs place them to have.
Combine a JYM with a Deep Sea Breathing Apperatus (sp?), and depth can become
LOADS of fun. Operating within that depth is even worse though.

=K
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 12:41:55 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: 'K' is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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In a message dated 5/27/98 10:37:43 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
pgettle@********.NET writes:

> Right now, double layered DVDs have a layer that's transparent to one
> wavelength of laserlight, and reflective to another, to allow about
> twice as much data per side. Anyone care to speculate how many more
> layers they'll be able to add?
>
I don't know, but if you could put a "Video Card Relay" into it, well, the
term "16 Million Colors" comes to mind....assuming of course precision vs.
blurring could be ruled out correctly.

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 09:51:04 PDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Matthew Waddilove <m_waddilove@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: Acers
Content-Type: text/plain

Gurth wrote
>
>Ubiratan P. Alberton said on 23:44/25 May 98...
>
>> IMHO, it's not practical to use R2 rules (altough I don't have
the
>> book, I have seen plenty of demonstration here :) ) to build powered
>> armor.
>
>Not unless you first design a chassis and probably an engine for it. I
>tried building a walker vehicle with room for one occupant once, but
>couldn't because of load restrictions -- basically, the resulting
vehicle
>wasn't strong enough to carry a bucket seats without overloading it. It
>would still be possible to add a bucket seat, but in essence the
vehicle
>would be permanently attempting to lift/pull something (namely, the
>driver) and suffer stress and other unwanted problems.

A way that I thought about getting around this is that the load cost for
a bucket seat includes a 100kg person sitting in the seat, the seat it's
self has no load cost. So once you have lopped off enough of the
'passenger' the load cost should not be a problem.

I don't have a page reference for the bit about the load cost of a
bucket seat but I think it's in the customization options.

-Matthew Waddilove


______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:05:29 -0600
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Mike Loseke <mike@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...(OT, obviously)
In-Reply-To: <199805271417.KAA29574@****.ctghub.com> from "Tim Kerby" at
May
27, 98 11:19:09 am
Content-Type: text

Thus spake Tim Kerby:
>
> On 27 May 98, at 10:58, Paul Gettle wrote:
>
> > >This changes with optical technology. Light travels much faster than
> > >electricity.
> >
> > HUH? I was under the impression that electricity moved at near the
> > speed of light too. I'll grant that it's a tad slower than the 'speed of
> > light in a vacuum' but light traveling through fiber optics is also slower
> > than 'speed of light in a vacuum'. (IIRC, electomagnetics traveling
> > through any medium are impeded ever so slightly, which is why they have to
> > quote the speed 'in a vacuum')
>
> Yes, you are right. The advantages to light over
> electricity are integrity, and interference, not speed.
> Light is not susceptible to EMF or RFI interference, so
> is a more robust transfer medium. Plus, it maintains
> signal integrity over a much greater distance.

I wouldn't say that light isn't susceptible to outside interference with
much confidence right now. It hasn't been used as densely as electrical
transmission lines to find out what kind of gremlins show up in these
kinds of situations. When you start pumping that much light through
gates in dense configurations, who knows what new quantum principle
might be uncovered.

However, I do agree with you as to the higher scalability of light over
electricity. I think that the amount of data, when described in the media
as states (levels of intensity, similar to voltage), is potentially much
higher when using photons rather than electrons.

--
| Even Einstein objected to the idea of
Mike Loseke | wave-function collapse, calling it
mike@*******.com | "spooky action-at-a-distance."
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 18:18:52 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
In-Reply-To: <19980527163734.29272.qmail@*******.com> from "Matthew
Waddilove"
at May 27, 98 09:37:33 am
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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And verily, did Matthew Waddilove hastily scribble thusly...
|About Spike UGE I've done something like this. I played an Elven child
|of the millenium. He was born at 00:00.01 01/01/2001. Cheezy I know but
|what the heck and "goblinized" to an elf at the very start of the
|Awakening.

Elves don't goblinise.
Either they're born an elf, or they're born human.
Same goes for dwarves.

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 13:22:43 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: BigDaddy <bigdaddy@*****.COM>
Organization: @**** Network
Subject: Re: Hey BigDaddy!!!
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

E
> Thanks a bunch MC!!! It worked now...nice Christmas shot....ooo LEGS!!! :P
>
> -K
thanx again mc23! no hard feelings eh? yeah nice set on her. hehehe!
--
Napalm Sticks to Kidz,
BigDaddy
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 13:30:01 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: BigDaddy <bigdaddy@*****.COM>
Organization: @**** Network
Subject: Re: Insect Totems
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

<snip> D. Ghost said:
>
> Hmmmm... making Insect Shamans Toxic? don't Toxics summon warped
> versions of what the normals summon? (I believe there is a mention in
> Grimmy about Toxic Insect Shamans...) I think if, this were done, Insect
> shamans should be a different tradition (ie, you have Hermetics,
> Shamans/Druids, and Insect Shamans)
>
> D.Ghost
> (aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

well in the UB there were many versions of the insect spirits beside the
drones(workers), why wouldnt it be possible to summon a warrior spirit.
Heck if a insect shaman now can summon a queen a "Insect Shaman" (the
one d.ghost is refering to i believe) should be able to summon a more
powerful spirit. Of course the risk of the spirit going balisic on you
goes up and so does the drain. But, if the GM and player plays it right
the character should last a very long time, perhaps a lifetime (in
runner years).
--
Napalm Sticks to Kidz,
BigDaddy
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 13:34:03 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: BigDaddy <bigdaddy@*****.COM>
Organization: @**** Network
Subject: Re: Ingentization
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

<snip all of the stuff Ghost wrote before this>

> Males of the list: how many of you would "go for" the different metatypes
> and which ones?
me hmmmm elves might be too snobby, dwarven women well they are 4ft tall
with a flat head....(ill quit while im ahead ;) ), humans of course,
orks not on the best day. But trolls, welllll thers something i like
about a woman that can put a hurtin on me and still want more! (besides
whats there not to luv about a 6'5" chik with horns and attitude!)

> Btw, do female dwarves have facial hair? The descript in the BBB doesn't
depends if they get a facial done that day or not. hehehehehehe


--
Napalm Sticks to Kidz,
BigDaddy
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 13:36:26 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Nexx Many-Scars <Nexx3@***.COM>
Subject: Re: music and gaming
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

Someone had a tape that was about half techno and half speed metal, which made
for really good background for Shadowrun games... though it could get annoying
as hell, sometimes.

One of the best times was against some Humanis Goons, I threw on some Meatmen
"Centurions of Rome", which led into "French People Suck" (amazingly
appropriate, because they were violently protesting UCAS support of a pro-
metahuman party in Quebec)... which worked out well, because soon after that,
we had a car chase start about the same time as "Turbo Rock" (if you've ever
heard that, you know its great for car chases). I just wish I could have
timed it so they met the Toxic Shaman the same time that "Nature Boy" came on
that CD... that would have been perfect.

Nexx
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 13:44:02 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Tim Kerby <drekhead@***.NET>
Subject: Re: List T-Shirt Price Options
In-Reply-To: <199805271508.JAA05887@******.carl.org>

On 27 May 98, at 9:08, David Buehrer wrote:

> Guess what Keith. You just volunteered manage the production of the
> 1998 ShadowRN T-shirt ;)

Alright! Thanks, Keith. Now can we get this ball rolling? Who wants
to collect votes for the art? Anyone?

No, wait, I wasn't... I mean....

Ahh, crap.

Ok, I will be happen to coordinate the voting of the artwork. I need
all artists to send me the URL of your submission. I will compile a
list of submission URL's into a link page, and then I will post to
the list the URL of the link page. Everyone will vote for the
favorite, and vote for an alternate. I will then post the results.
(Query: Should we have separate voting for front and back art, or
vote for complete front/back combinations?)

We should set a submission deadline, and a voting deadline. For a
submission deadline, I propose June 5th, and a voting deadline of
June 12th. Please let me know if these dates are unreasonable.

Finally, please send your submission URL's and votes to me privately,
and do not begin voting until the submission deadline has come,
please.

--


=================================================================
- Tim Kerby - drekhead@***.net - ICQ-UIN 2883757 -
-----------------------------------------------------------------
"Reality is the only obstacle to happiness." - Unknown
=================================================================
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 13:39:42 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...(OT, obviously)
In-Reply-To: <v03110701b1914362edab@[204.202.55.77]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 09:31 PM 5/26/98 -0700, you wrote:

>There's a whole new angle developing in computing technology though -
>Quantum Computers. They've actually successfully solved a problem
>using a device exploiting quantum theory stuff. It's mostly over
>my head, but the example used involved 4 "operations" to be performed
>to make a decision. ie: a comparison. The quantum computer
>solved all four possiblities at once... This is technology that
>probably won't see the light of day though until....2050? :)


Okay. Can someone, in relatively brief terms, explain what this is? Don't
get too technical, don't go too long. But this is something that has
piqued my interest, so I'd love it if someone could offer an explanation
suited for the layman who has a bit of knowledge about quantum mechanics.

Thanks.

Erik J.


"Forgive me FASA for I have sinned. It has been 6 days since I last played
Shadowrun and 15 days since I last bought a SRTCG booster pack."
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 13:40:17 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
In-Reply-To: <19980527.014414.11246.0.dghost@****.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 01:44 AM 5/27/98 -0500, you wrote:

>Actually, This could be a great Adventure idea ... Protect the Miss Troll
>(or Ork or whatever) UCAS pageant from the Humanis or sabotage the
>paageant ... Body Guard Duty for a Troll or Ork Trid/Simsense star (who
>insists on hitting on the PCs ;) As well as comic relief (an aging,
>goblinized Pamela Lee still on Buttwa--err -- Baywatch due the miracles
>of plastic surgery [go figure ;) ] )

Now this is a frightening thought. Thank you, but now I'll have nightmares
for a week about a troll Pamela Anderson..."No, please, just let me die, no
mouth-to-mouth!!"

>Males of the list: how many of you would "go for" the different metatypes
>and which ones?
>(To answer my own question: Dwarves, Elves and humans deffinately, maybe
>Orks, and on the very outside chance Trolls :)

Human/elf: oh yeah...

Dwarf: maybe. Would have to be more like a petite human than a short &
stocky human, so it would depend.

Ork/troll: not bloody likely. Got a major thing against tusks and warts
and dermal deposits and horns...

>Btw, do female dwarves have facial hair? The descript in the BBB doesn't
>say so IIRC, but Jett seemed to mention something about them having
>some... I recall somewhere that they did but I'm pretty sure that's from
>another RPG systems ...

Not from what I recall. I mean, why would dwarf women have beards, other
than that's what Tolkien said? Dwarf women might have an increased
likelyhood of having extra facial hair, but that's a rare genetic condition
that strikes humans now.

At least in my game they don't need to shave their faces every morning.

Erik J.


"Oh my God, they killed Dunkelzahn! You bastards!!!"
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 14:08:41 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Nexx Many-Scars <Nexx3@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 98-05-27 13:59:11 EDT, you write:

> Ork/troll: not bloody likely. Got a major thing against tusks and warts
> and dermal deposits and horns...

Too much like dating family, Erik? <g>

Nexx
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 14:10:20 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Lehlan Decker <decker@****.FSU.EDU>
Subject: New Books...
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

This might be old news, but amazon has a listing for New Seattle,
including Cover Art (very cool), due out in July, 176 pages.
There is also a picture of Smugglers haven, either though its due
date is May 98. :)
Later

--------------------------------------------------------------------
Lehlan Decker 644-4534 Systems Development
decker@****.fsu.edu http://www.scri.fsu.edu/~decker
--------------------------------------------------------------------
The universe doesn't have laws, it has habits. And habits can be broken.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 13:20:55 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization

On Wed, 27 May 1998 13:34:03 -0400 BigDaddy <bigdaddy@*****.COM> writes:
><snip all of the stuff Ghost wrote before this>
>> Males of the list: how many of you would "go for" the different
metatypes
>> and which ones?

<SNIP other meta types>
>But trolls, welllll thers something i like
>about a woman that can put a hurtin on me and still want more! (besides
>whats there not to luv about a 6'5" chik with horns and attitude!)

Uhm ...6'5"? you like your Trolls short doncha? average Ht is 2.8 meters
or about 9 feet tall...

>> Btw, do female dwarves have facial hair? The descript in the BBB
doesn't

>depends if they get a facial done that day or not. hehehehehehe

Uhm ... I prolly don't want to know ...

<SNIP Sig>
> BigDaddy

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 13:03:28 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization

On Wed, 27 May 1998 11:46:43 -0500 Mike Elkins <MikeE@*********.COM>
writes:
>When I was in High School, I was an elf: 6' tall, 120-130 lbs.
(yikes!).
>Then I married someone who can cook (unlike my mom), and now I'm
>200lbs and no longer elfen in the least.

Yup Yup I was 170 lbs throughout High School and at 6'5" that made me
slighty less skinnier than you ... then I stopped growing vertically ...
;)

>My daughter (not yet three years old) is a Physad: Pain Resistance for
>sure, possibly improved speed as well. If your' trying to take a toy
>away from her--is there a Phys Ad ability for "Kung Fu Grip"?

ROFLMCAO ... how .25 points per level with each level giving a die to
resist disarming (or distoying as the case may be ...;) attempts?

>I'd probably end up corporate in 205x as well. Gee, I wonder who
>"Dragon Systems, Inc." is secretly owned by? ;)
>
>Double-Domed Mike
>--Deal with a Dragon, it aint so bad!

Perhaps another corp to be owned by Dunkelzahn?

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)
"It okey to deal with a Dragon, just don't let him cut the cards"

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 13:14:53 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?

On Wed, 27 May 1998 12:19:36 EDT Ereskanti <Ereskanti@***.COM> writes:
>In a message dated 5/27/98 4:21:18 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
>gurth@******.NL writes:
>> Also be prepared to find out that if these methods were to give
"right"
>> values, people tend to write absurdly long essays in decker comments
in SR
>> books. Lots of times we see things like "12.5 Mp snipped" -- which
would
>> equate to a text several MB large. I dare you to write that much text
in a
>> few minutes, or even days :)

>I know I snipped stuff on both sides of this paragraph, concerning
sound, DVD
>memory values, etcetera...
>
>However, something that I should point out is that we as the gamer are
only
>barely getting the full impact of a truly *Interactive* medium. We have
books
>and text, what if -all- the material was in VRML or higher mediums?
Every
>written word actually becomes Phonic, with full color and frame-imaging
>comparisons. Suddenly, the UB book(s) memory comparisons are NOT that
out of
>the ordinary in comparison to say, a DVD disk if we take this into
thought.
>
>Remember, "typing" does still exist in the SR universe, the but the vast
>majority of stuff in symbolic representation and/or Full-X Interactive.
>Everything IMO is a recording or a macro, and even macros can be direct
guided
>by voice/mental controls.
>
>-K

YupYup, If we look at the 12.5 Mp snipped as plain text the Mp is really
small. If the snipped bit is Vrml or Rich Text with charts and diagrams,
MPs are pretty big... but what if what we are seeing is the transcripts
of a matrix conversation (recorded in all the detail the matrix allows)
and the 12.5 Mp snipped was snipped before it was transcribed ... The Mp
would be huge ...

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 12:40:13 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: 'K' is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: List T-Shirt Price Options
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/27/98 10:08:58 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
dbuehrer@******.CARL.ORG writes:

>
> Guess what Keith. You just volunteered manage the production of the
> 1998 ShadowRN T-shirt ;)
>
> -
I know that, sadly. I still don't know -WHAT- made me stop at the booth
either. I'll get more information from Mark, Ken or Kay (employee, owners) of
the place, and keep all informed.

LETS GET THIS SHOW ON THE ROAD!!!
=K
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:52:37 PDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: walker of shadows <wkr_shadows@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: Sense Link and Free Spirits
Content-Type: text/plain

>Also, ponder this...
>Could a reasonable PC be created with a character possessed by a Free
Spirit?


That would be a great role playing possiblility...it might be worth it
to try it.



Walker Of Shadows

---------------------------------------------------------

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
+In the shadows darkness reigns, +
+and I am the one walks the path +
+between both of these worlds. +
+ -Walker of Shadows +
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++


______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 14:49:33 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
In-Reply-To: <889ee38d.356c56aa@***.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 02:08 PM 5/27/98 EDT, you wrote:
>In a message dated 98-05-27 13:59:11 EDT, you write:
>
>> Ork/troll: not bloody likely. Got a major thing against tusks and warts
>> and dermal deposits and horns...
>
>Too much like dating family, Erik? <g>


Hey, I've never been to Appalachia OR the Deep South... ;-)

And besides, my family at least *looks* normal. I mean, we're nearly a
90's version of the fraggin' Cleaver family, or the family from Father
Knows Best...which in the 90s means we are serious freaks.

Erik J.

Who just didn't see the red laser sight dot dancing across the back of his
skull...
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 14:59:12 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ojaste,James [NCR]" <James.Ojaste@**.GC.CA>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...(OT, obviously)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Erik Jameson wrote:
>>There's a whole new angle developing in computing technology though -
>>Quantum Computers. They've actually successfully solved a problem
>>using a device exploiting quantum theory stuff. It's mostly over
>>my head, but the example used involved 4 "operations" to be performed
>>to make a decision. ie: a comparison. The quantum computer
>>solved all four possiblities at once... This is technology that
>>probably won't see the light of day though until....2050? :)
>
>Okay. Can someone, in relatively brief terms, explain what this is? Don't
>get too technical, don't go too long. But this is something that has
>piqued my interest, so I'd love it if someone could offer an explanation
>suited for the layman who has a bit of knowledge about quantum mechanics.

Really basic version:
By using radio signals to twiddle atoms and reading off results using
NMR (getting around uncertainty by doing the same thing to several
"units" and reading only one of them), some researchers managed to
create a 2-bit xor gate out of chloroform. They think that the max
is about 10-11 bits, and they don't seem to have much real knowledge
of actual computers (quoting O(n) for a simple database search, etc).

More complex version:
Basically, each of the atoms used has a spin (they added a neutron
to the C in the chloroform to get it spinning). By exploiting the
difference in spin, they can "set" the hydrogen's initial condition,
flip the whole thing 90 degrees, wait a bit, flip it back. Then they
read off the orientation of the carbon. If the H is spinning one way,
the C returns to its original position. If the H is spinning the other,
the C flips over.

Actual version:
If you're interested in more depth, check out the June Scientific
American, page 66-71.

James Ojaste
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 21:15:32 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: Re: Acers
In-Reply-To: <19980527165105.15556.qmail@*******.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

Matthew Waddilove said on 9:51/27 May 98,...

> A way that I thought about getting around this is that the load cost for
> a bucket seat includes a 100kg person sitting in the seat, the seat it's
> self has no load cost. So once you have lopped off enough of the
> 'passenger' the load cost should not be a problem.

The way I understood it, the Load cost is for the seat plus the occupant. Normal car
seats don't weigh 100 kg, I know that for certain :)

So yeah, you could rule that, say, 90 kg of that mass is the person sitting in it, and the
seat itself is only 10 kg. Then you _could_ build a drone with a bucket seat and put a
skinny person in it to pilot the thing, but IMHO it's getting very close to the edge of
munchkinism.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
At the bar down the Adios Lounge.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- + --+--
Version 3.1: | Incubated into
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N | the First Church of
o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ | the Sqooshy Ball
tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y? | 21 May 1998
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ + --+--
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 21:15:32 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: Re: Ingentization
In-Reply-To: <19980527163734.29272.qmail@*******.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

Matthew Waddilove said on 9:37/27 May 98,...

> About Spike UGE I've done something like this. I played an Elven child
> of the millenium. He was born at 00:00.01 01/01/2001. Cheezy I know but
> what the heck and "goblinized" to an elf at the very start of the
> Awakening. To simulate his age at the time we were running 2054ish I
> just assigned low physical stats and lots to skills.

IMHO that's one of the problems with playing spike babies. I've had one or two
players ask me about it, and well, my feeling is that if they really want to, sure -- but
the chars would be made using the normal creation rules. That, though, means they
in essence lack the 50+ years of experience and/or accumulated wealth such people
would have. (I feel it's sort of like playing Vampire and saying the char is 400 years
old; you'll still be only as powerful as a vampire that was embraced the day before the
campaign starts.)

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
At the bar down the Adios Lounge.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- + --+--
Version 3.1: | Incubated into
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N | the First Church of
o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ | the Sqooshy Ball
tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y? | 21 May 1998
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ + --+--
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 21:15:32 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: Re: Hijacking
In-Reply-To: <19980527.084104.-27002.2.dghost@****.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

Alfredo B Alves said on 7:35/27 May 98,...

> I think he was referring to group A takes plane hostage, group gets
> everyone's attention and describes threat posed by group B if demands
> aren't met by a certain amount of time ... to prove they are serious,
> Group A kills the passengers (and prolly suicides afterwards) ... Group B
> is the real threat ...

That's about the only thing that makes sense... Killing all your hostages usually
means signing your own death sentence. Commiting suidice right after means you
won't have to bother the authorities with it ;)

(BTW, I hope I'm not sending any attachments or weird formatting, am I? I just
installed a new version of Pegasus and I'm sad to say it's jumped onto the
HTML/RTF bandwagon. I think I've disabled it, but can't be sure until I notice the
carps remain holstered :)

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
At the bar down the Adios Lounge.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- + --+--
Version 3.1: | Incubated into
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N | the First Church of
o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ | the Sqooshy Ball
tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y? | 21 May 1998
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ + --+--
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 11:15:57 -0800
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Max Rible <slothman@*********.ORG>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
In-Reply-To: <356B4663.BB2C18A1@************.com.br>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 19:46 5/26/98 -0300, Ubiratan P. Alberton insinuated:
>With the recent computing discussion going around here, something has
>come to my mind. How much is a megapulse worth in today's "data
>measuring units (i.e bytes, megabytes, etc.). I'm using 8 megabytes
>based on a somewhat quick calculation for a byte in a quartenary system
>(64 bits, as oposed to 8 from todays binary computers).

I discuss a number of megapulse-related factors in my article
at <http://www.amurgsval.org/shadowrun/megapulses.html>;. A
friend dubbed me Rationalization Man after my explanation for
why a megapulse measures both memory and computing power...

--
%% Max Rible %% slothman@*****.com %% http://www.amurgsval.org/~slothman/ %%
%% "Ham is good... Glowing *tattooed* ham is *bad*!" - the Tick %%
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 12:57:08 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Steven McCormick <stardust@***.NET>
Subject: Re: Acers
In-Reply-To: <9b9f1b52.356b5cc3@***.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 08:22 PM 5/26/98 EDT, you wrote:
>> now what about one of these powered suits that is filled with robotics like
>> a drone and is controlled via remote control by a rigger? viable?? too
>> expensive?? what do you think?
>
>I think that'd be an anthropoid drone...
>
>- Disney Shaman
>
>
One question. What the HELL is an "anthropoid". Are you trying to say
anthroFORM and your typing fingers just went schytzo for a second or what? :)

BlueMule
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 14:24:04 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Steven McCormick <stardust@***.NET>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.16.19980526155638.08ff751a@****.fbiz.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 07:02 PM 5/26/98 -0400, Erik J. wrote:
>Hey, is there anyone out there besides me that thinks that if the Awakening
>were to occur right now they would probably remain a vanilla human? I just
>don't see anything in my body that indicates "troll" or "elf" or
anything;
>I'm pretty much well within statistical and cosmetic standards for an
>average male...
>
Well let's see here, I already have pointy ears, my night vision is
excellent and I'm Irish. I would have to go for the Fomori troll metatype.
<big toothy grin>

BlueMule
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 13:40:47 -0600
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: David Buehrer <dbuehrer@******.CARL.ORG>
Subject: Re: Hijacking
In-Reply-To: <199805271921.NAA17078@******.carl.org> from "Gurth" at May
27,
98 09:15:32 pm
Content-Type: text

Gurth wrote:
/
/ (BTW, I hope I'm not sending any attachments or weird formatting, am I? I
just / installed a new version of Pegasus and I'm sad to say it's jumped onto
the / HTML/RTF bandwagon. I think I've disabled it, but can't be sure until I
notice the / carps remain holstered :)

No HTML, but you column width needs to be reset. Right now it looks
like its around 85.

-David
--
"If I told you, then I'd have to pull a Shadowrun against you. Sorry."
--
email: dbuehrer@******.carl.org
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/1068/homepage.htm
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 14:33:37 -0500
Reply-To: bahwi@************.com
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Bahwi <bahwi@************.COM>
Organization: Bahwi's Emporium - (http://www.cityscope.net/~bahwi/home.html)
Subject: Tsimshian
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

I was wondering if anyone on this list has done stuff with the nation
of Tsimshian. Not the run in the front of NAN2, but more. The
campaign I'm running has (spontaneously) moved there and I'm not really
prepared. They have a place to hide from the government, they are in a
house owned(sorta) by a host who is helping them hide. Anyone have any
ideas for adventures, runs, fun things to do to them <EGM>, and whatnot?
Any help is appreciated, and any information is too. We are playing
behind the game I beleive, 2055 I beleive. Thanks.

-bahwi
email- bahwi@************.com - bahwi@*****.com
ICQ Name: bahwi UIN: 3328936 Pager: 713.642.9476
http://www.cityscope.net/~bahwi/home.html
^^ Security, Anti-Spam Procedures, UNIX, and more ^^
"Magenta: And our world...will do the Time Warp...again!"
-RHPS
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 16:09:58 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Jett <grota@*********.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
MIME-Version: 1.0
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> Actually, This could be a great Adventure idea ... Protect the Miss Troll
> (or Ork or whatever) UCAS pageant from the Humanis or sabotage the
> paageant ... Body Guard Duty for a Troll or Ork Trid/Simsense star (who
> insists on hitting on the PCs ;)


That's a GREAT idea. That just might be my next campaign, if'n you don't
mind! Or if someone who GMs on IRC can run the game better...


> BTW, by "larger Size" models do mean larger than a 12" waist? ;)
>
> Males of the list: how many of you would "go for" the different metatypes
> and which ones?
> (To answer my own question: Dwarves, Elves and humans deffinately, maybe
> Orks, and on the very outside chance Trolls :)
>
> Females of the list: Same question. (I felt if I didn't make the
> distinction, it wouldn't be apparent that I was asking both genders :)
>

I'd go for an elf, no problem, maybe a dwarf...an ork, POSSIBLY, if he
was fairly human-looking. A troll, doubtful, unless he was really
something special. I think, considering the conservative way I was
brought up (believe it or not!), I'd have biases. Friends with a troll?
Sure. DATE a troll? Probably not. Even though I do prefer that my guys
be taller than me...and I think 9 feet tall is just a bit taller...

--Jett


> Btw, do female dwarves have facial hair? The descript in the BBB doesn't
> say so IIRC, but Jett seemed to mention something about them having
> some... I recall somewhere that they did but I'm pretty sure that's from
> another RPG systems ...
>
> >> >cheers
> >> >Geoff


That was a joke, really...I was insinuating that I might have enough
facial hair to be a MALE dwarf. :> But of course, I was kidding. I
believe that in SR, female dwarves can be fairly attractive. Especially
with the "human-looking" edge.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 16:33:17 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: 'K' is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: List T-Shirt Price Options
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/27/98 12:52:03 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
drekhead@***.NET writes:

> Ok, I will be happen to coordinate the voting of the artwork. I need
> all artists to send me the URL of your submission. I will compile a
> list of submission URL's into a link page, and then I will post to
> the list the URL of the link page. Everyone will vote for the
> favorite, and vote for an alternate. I will then post the results.
> (Query: Should we have separate voting for front and back art, or
> vote for complete front/back combinations?)
>
> We should set a submission deadline, and a voting deadline. For a
> submission deadline, I propose June 5th, and a voting deadline of
> June 12th. Please let me know if these dates are unreasonable.
>
Okay TIM!!! Now that's more like it. I was -just- about to suggest this, but
you so happily came along. Anyway, go ahead and make a links site. Granite
has two sites for his, and I can't remember the Wafflemeisters' anymore.

I'll get information about payment options for everyone, and perhaps I can
harrass my roomie (one of the lists two options for "Postal Employees") about
shipping options they might be able to get.

Drek's suggestion concerning deadlines is a good one. I think the June 5th
for submissions is good, and perhaps June 17th (on the outside) for the
voting. This way it lets' everyone have a chance.

Remember, the shirt-place here was estimating a week after they receive their
shirts, so I need to know NUMBER of shirts ASAP!. We also need to know color
combinations. I think I wouldn't want to go beyond the 2 color 2 sided, but 1
color 2 sided would probably work just fine.

Also note that BLACK t-shirts are OUT at this place, as the option of Printing
bright colors is more difficult for them. I -AM- going to ask them about blue
printing on a black shirt however. Just for a thought.

Okay, while I'm at it. DOES ANYONE know the color of the upcoming 3rd ed book
yet? I am going to send out a dozen letters and make a phone call or two at
this point. IF possible, it would be cool to have the shirt colors match the
3rd ed book.

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 16:44:02 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Jett <grota@*********.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Spike wrote:
>
> And verily, did Nexx3 hastily scribble thusly...
> |Close but no potato (no smoking in the house... sorry). Trolls be H. sapiens
> |ingentis, not H. ingentis (at this point). Humans and trolls are still fully
> |cross-fertile, physical incompatiblity aside (I can imagine dermal armor is
> |very uncomfortable for the woman).


Here we go again...Would this have come up even if I DIDN'T do the (by
now infamous, I'm sure) Sex and the SIngle Shadowrunner post? :P Anyway,
that's a good question. IF a human woman gets pregnant by a troll, what
kind of kid does she have? Does she deliver a troll child, a human
child, or a human child that will goblinize later? Consider this more
research...

--Jett
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 14:43:32 -0600
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Karl Low <kwil@*********.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

From: Jett <grota@*********.COM>

<snip the dating game>


>I'd go for an elf, no problem, maybe a dwarf...an ork, POSSIBLY, if he
>was fairly human-looking. A troll, doubtful, unless he was really
>something special. I think, considering the conservative way I was
>brought up (believe it or not!), I'd have biases. Friends with a troll?
>Sure. DATE a troll? Probably not. Even though I do prefer that my guys
>be taller than me...and I think 9 feet tall is just a bit taller...


Actually.. a troll could be an awfully handsome looking fellow assuming:

A: some dental work.. make sure everything is straight at least.
B: evenly distributed dermal-layer.
C: Horns that go THE SAME WAY, Dammit..

Just think.. twice the size of Arnie and a REAL "hard-body"

A female troll just wouldn't work as well.. half the appeal of yer average
female is "softness"

-Karl
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 15:58:49 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Quicksilver <qwksilvr@*****.COM>
Subject: Re: List T-Shirt Price Options
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 10:54 PM 5/26/98 EDT, you wrote:
>Okay folks, listen up. I have information, price quotes no less.
>
>T-Shirts with single color, single side are 12.95
>T-Shirts with single color, two sided are 15.95
>
>T-Shirts with two color, single side are 14.95
>T-Shirts with two color, two sided, are 16.95 (IIRC).


Seems a bit expensive to me. I checked with our supplier for prices and I
have a sale flyer for another company. The sale flyer is only good 'til the
end of July, but I've included the prices anyway...

Prices are for 50 shirts up to XL (not including tax), they will drop
slightly as the number goes up, or rise slightly if the number drops. Sale
prices are in [brackets].

Single color, two-sided: $9.30 [$6.80]
Two color, single-sided: $8.55 [$6.30]
Two color, two-sided: $11.60 [$7.70]
Five color, two-sided: $18.50 [$10.40]

I feel comfortable dealing with the first company, expect Hanes t-shirts.
I've never worked with the other company, but time probably prohibits that
option anyway.

That's Omaha. I don't know what other towns are like. It would probably
pay to shop around.

Hg
....an analog person, stuck, in a digital world
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 16:57:24 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: New Books...
In-Reply-To: <199805271810.AA143212@*****.scri.fsu.edu>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 02:10 PM 5/27/98 -0500, you wrote:
>This might be old news, but amazon has a listing for New Seattle,
>including Cover Art (very cool), due out in July, 176 pages.
>There is also a picture of Smugglers haven, either though its due
>date is May 98. :)

I went and took a look at that. Everything coming out of FASA indicates
that New Seattle will be out after SR3, and that's August. So I don't
start thinking New Seattle will be out in July or August.

And looking at the "cover" for New Seattle it looks an awful lot like a
"placeholder" cover, artwork used to show off the book until the real cover
is done. At least *I* think so.

And I like I said before, you can probably start bugging your local game
store next Tuesday for Smuggler's Havens.

Don't know where Amazon got their info from, but it looks bad to me.

Erik J.


"Ladies & Gentleman, the newest member of the band, the one and only Spice
Boy, GRUMPY SPICE!!!" <and the crowd goes wild!!!>
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 17:03:24 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: 'K' is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: List T-Shirt Price Options
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/27/98 3:55:53 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
qwksilvr@*****.COM writes:

> Prices are for 50 shirts up to XL (not including tax), they will drop
> slightly as the number goes up, or rise slightly if the number drops. Sale
> prices are in [brackets].
>
> Single color, two-sided: $9.30 [$6.80]
> Two color, single-sided: $8.55 [$6.30]
> Two color, two-sided: $11.60 [$7.70]
> Five color, two-sided: $18.50 [$10.40]
>
ah, this is the information that I don't have just yet. Also, what about
payment options? As I mentioned before, I am working on getting multiple
receipts for the entire order, this way everyone has a receipt for the
actions.

The reason I am bringing this up is that this manner everyone can send
check/money order to the company, and purchase them "individually" and receive
a receipt accordingly. -I- don't become the recipient of what could
potentially become a thousand or more dollars (depending upon orders here).
This way we also can work on arrangements for everyone to make certain they
get their shirts and we have no problems.

Info folks, I/We need info...

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 17:29:25 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: 'K' is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: More T-Shirt Info (Mr. Imbriaco please)
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

Okay folks, I have a bit more here.

Shirts are "Screen Star Best", which is a 50/50 material (cotton/poly), like a
standard t-shirt. "Kay" (one of the two store owners) is definitely going to
lower the prices, those initial estimates I had are probably $2-3 off (as in
high) (Prices are U.S. btw), and quite possible lower (likely is gonna be a
better word I think).

We have the option of "transfers" or "screen prints", and I'm going to
get a
LOT of information this Saturday from the nice lady. I will be using copies
of Granite's and Wafflemeisters prints as samples for her to help me do
considerations.

I also asked about darker shirt fabrics (black, etc.). IF we go with those
colors, then Screen Prints are the only option this store has. IF we know how
many shirts we are gonna actually get into, then the price(s) will be adjusted
accordingly.

Regardless of what is going on, and which shirt offer we use (this one or
Quicksilvers), get us a list of names here folks.

As for names to use on the list. As the list is about to be subjected to a
major purging and reinvention here soon, could I or Quicksilver or whomever
-please- have a copy of the listmembers when such a time comes sent directly
to us?

-K (More Info on Saturday folks)
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 17:32:52 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: 'K' is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Heya Wafflemeister!!!
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

Guy, sorry to use this forum like this, but could you send me your T-shirt
logo idea page address again?

Thanks
=K
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 17:47:21 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Hijacking
In-Reply-To: <199805271914.VAA24170@*****.xs4all.nl>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 09:15 PM 5/27/98 +0100, you wrote:

>(BTW, I hope I'm not sending any attachments or weird formatting, am I? I
just
>installed a new version of Pegasus and I'm sad to say it's jumped onto the
>HTML/RTF bandwagon. I think I've disabled it, but can't be sure until I
notice the
>carps remain holstered :)

I'm using Eudora Pro 3.0, and it's coming through fine. Reading perfectly,
loud and clear.


> At the bar down the Adios Lounge.

Where is that line from? Actually, this is the real reason I'm replying to
this. For some reason the only thing I can think of is a song by
Thelonious Monster on their "Beautiful Mess" album that's a duet with Tom
Waits, but that's a very obscure reference from a band that never hit it
big (damn shame too...).

Anyway...

Erik J.


Resepected Elders Relaxation Resort, President of Operations
and Director of Activities

"Hey, how about a game of first edition using only the Blue Book?"
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 17:06:56 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization

On Wed, 27 May 1998 16:09:58 -0400 Jett <grota@*********.COM> writes:
>> Actually, This could be a great Adventure idea ... Protect the Miss
Troll
>> (or Ork or whatever) UCAS pageant from the Humanis or sabotage the
>> paageant ... Body Guard Duty for a Troll or Ork Trid/Simsense star
(who
>> insists on hitting on the PCs ;)

>That's a GREAT idea. That just might be my next campaign, if'n you
>don't
>mind! Or if someone who GMs on IRC can run the game better...

Go for it and tell me how it goes okie? :)

>> BTW, by "larger Size" models do mean larger than a 12" waist? ;)
>>
>> Males of the list: how many of you would "go for" the different
metatypes
>> and which ones?
>> (To answer my own question: Dwarves, Elves and humans deffinately,
maybe
>> Orks, and on the very outside chance Trolls :)
>>
>> Females of the list: Same question. (I felt if I didn't make the
>> distinction, it wouldn't be apparent that I was asking both genders :)

>I'd go for an elf, no problem, maybe a dwarf...an ork, POSSIBLY, if he
>was fairly human-looking. A troll, doubtful, unless he was really
>something special. I think, considering the conservative way I was
>brought up (believe it or not!), I'd have biases. Friends with a troll?
>Sure. DATE a troll? Probably not. Even though I do prefer that my guys
>be taller than me...and I think 9 feet tall is just a bit taller...
>
>--Jett

heh heh actually, that's a common trend (women prefering taller guys) I
wonder why that is ... and at 9 feet tall think of his ...uhm ... shoe
size! (that's what I was gonna say really ;) Doesn't that count for
something special ;) <j/k> actually at 9 ft he'd better be good at giving
massages because gonna give ya lotsa cricks in your neck ;)

>> Btw, do female dwarves have facial hair? The descript in the BBB
doesn't
>> say so IIRC, but Jett seemed to mention something about them having
>> some... I recall somewhere that they did but I'm pretty sure that's
from
>> another RPG systems ...
>>
>> >> >cheers
>> >> >Geoff
>
>
>That was a joke, really...I was insinuating that I might have enough
>facial hair to be a MALE dwarf. :> But of course, I was kidding. I
>believe that in SR, female dwarves can be fairly attractive. Especially
>with the "human-looking" edge.

Hey I like short stocky women ... and tall thin women ... and -- hey
waiatsec I just like women ;) actually, I knew a blond with a kinda
peach fuzz thing going on and she was very attractive (but we're not
talking bearded lady so ...) Actually as thinking fem dwarves might have
sort of exagerated sideburns to maybe bordering on mutton chops ... might
be attractive ... have to actually see somone like this to really make
the call :)

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 15:47:39 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Benjamin <benjamin@*****.COM>
Subject: Re: Oooppsie... I did something bad...
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 26 May 1998 21:19:58 PDT."
<199805270419.VAA24044@****.kerch.com>

Okay, since the list rejected my last two messages on this...

Could somebody please sned me, in private email, the instrucions for
removing myself from the list, because I accidentally deleted them
since I singed on several years ago? And the SRCARD list too, if you
haveit please.

Thanks in advance.
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 18:00:26 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: William Ashe <wmashe@***.NET>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

-----Original Message-----
From: Nexx Many-Scars <Nexx3@***.COM>
To: SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Date: Wednesday, May 27, 1998 11:19 AM
Subject: Re: Ingentization


>In a message dated 98-05-27 13:59:11 EDT, you write:
>
>> Ork/troll: not bloody likely. Got a major thing against tusks and warts
>> and dermal deposits and horns...
>
>Too much like dating family, Erik? <g>
>
>Nexx

You know your in trouble when your family tree is a wreath

-Bright Light
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 09:11:45 +1000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Robert Watkins <robert.watkins@******.COM>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
In-Reply-To: <12916.199805271009@******.teach.cs.keele.ac.uk>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Spike writes:
And verily, did Robert Watkins hastily scribble thusly...
> |It is stated repeatedly throughout the sourcebooks that a megapulse is a
> |measurement term that has no relation whatsoever to bits, bytes, nybbles,
> |dynners, plytes, or dysserts (a nybble is 4 bits, a plyte is 2 bytes, a
> |dynner is 4 bytes, and a dyssert is a checksum bit on the end of a byte).
>
> First time I've heard of them.

They're joke terms from the Hacker's Jargon File.

(oh, and by using longword, you're displaying your computer tendencies, you
know. But it's better than dword)

--
.sig deleted to conserve electrons. robert.watkins@******.com
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 19:33:42 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Mike Bobroff <Airwasp@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Distance Strike Signature
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/27/98 1:41:36 PM !!!First Boot!!!, decker@****.FSU.EDU
writes:

> > Actually yeah, and we even added "Elementality (Select)" for 2 points
to
> the
> > Killing Hands/Distance Strike option, giving the Killing Hands a true
> > elemental effect of some kind.
> >
> > Now -there- is a signature for ya.
> >
> Ouch so for a distance strike killing hands with fire, I just used
> all my starting magic points + some (don't have my books handy). Nice but
> ouch!

Ah, but with elementality Fire added onto the distance strike the attack
effectively has it's damage code raised one higher, just like the spell Flame
Aura from Awakenings, IIRC.

A note, has anyone put Distance Strike on nothing but themselves, and not
tying it to Killing Hands or an object?

Mike
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 18:38:12 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Character Background Help

I need help with the background for a character ... A Tiger Shapeshifter
that was a labrat that escaped from Aztechnology ... Originally, She was
a brainwashed undercover op (I hadn't decided where yet) posing with a
"Partner" (someone that kept her "in line") when he/she (the
"partner")
got killed and she started running the shadows ... the trauma of his/her
death (the shaper believed the partner was a romantic interest/good
friend or something along those lines because of the brainwashing) mucked
up the brainwashing and so the char has amnesia (and has no idea
Aztechnology is after her)

The problem is the shaper's bestial nature ... how could she be an
undercover op with a bestial nature ... possible solutions:

1) brainwashing overrode the bestial nature pay x build points to get rid
of the bestial nature

2) as 1) above except the bestial nature is resurfacing at the beginning
of play the bestial nature is in full swing

3) implanted cyberware controllers (I know alot of people don't allow
cyberware in chars/critters with regen, but this is a nifty solution ...
someone in Aztechnology has a little box that control her actions ...)

I prefer option 2 and really don't like option 1 I'm sure there are other
options I haven't thought of so if you think of one can you share it,
please?

Also, if you have any ideas on how to alter the background so that
everything gels better share them as well ... thanks :)

As it stands there chars flaws are:
Amnesia -2 (Represents backlash against
brainwashing / mental conditioning

and trauma from death of
"partner")
Hunted (Rank 4 Enemy) -4 (Aztechnology should be at least a
rank 5 or 6 Enemy IMO, but that
would result in WAY too many flaw
points)
Phobia (Aztechnology Logos / Mild) -3 (Represents bad feelings from time
as a
"lab rat")
----
-9 (ick, not good )
I'd like to get the number of flaw points lower but I think these flaws
represent her background very well :/ (though the phobia is more so than
the amnesia )

Any help /tips would be appreciated :)

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 19:44:21 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Mike Bobroff <Airwasp@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Acers
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/27/98 7:14:47 PM !!!First Boot!!!, gurth@******.NL
writes:

> The way I understood it, the Load cost is for the seat plus the occupant.
> Normal car
> seats don't weigh 100 kg, I know that for certain :)
>
> So yeah, you could rule that, say, 90 kg of that mass is the person sitting
> in it, and the
> seat itself is only 10 kg. Then you _could_ build a drone with a bucket
seat
> and put a
> skinny person in it to pilot the thing, but IMHO it's getting very close to
> the edge of
> munchkinism.

Guys, after rereading the R2 ... a seat weighs a total of 100 kg for the load
of the vehicle, but for purposes of holding a person, they can hold up to 225
kilos or so before the weight of the person comes into play with the vehicle
and it's load rating.

Mike
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 09:54:11 +1000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Robert Watkins <robert.watkins@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...(OT, obviously)
In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.16.19980527092049.0a271422@****.fbiz.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Erik Jameson writes:
> Okay. Can someone, in relatively brief terms, explain what this
> is? Don't
> get too technical, don't go too long. But this is something that has
> piqued my interest, so I'd love it if someone could offer an explanation
> suited for the layman who has a bit of knowledge about quantum mechanics.

Quantum computing, and quantum programming, is an experimental technique
that offers a lot of potential for increasing computer power, at the cost of
making it hideously more complex (I know that I would want much better tools
for quantum programming than are available now... even trying to understand
what's going on makes my brain hurt).

Basically, it uses probabilistic outcomes, and this causes all sorts of
funky effects. Instead of a simple XOR gate which follows one of two
outcomes, it follows _both_ outcomes simultaneously. As a result, a quantum
program is in all possible states of its execution at any given time (in
theory. In practice, it's a little harder).

The fundamental principle uses something which I _think_ is called a qubit.
A qubit is a quantum bit. A normal bit has two states: on or off, usually
represented by 1 or 0. A qubit can be represented as a sphere (well, an
ellipsoid in practice), with the two poles representing 1 or 0, and the
surface of the sphere representing the probabilistic range of the qubit.
This is then used as the basis of your computations, the way the bit is used
in normal computations.

Theoretical studies have showed quantum programming to be incredibly
powerful. As an example, it converts a decryption algorithm for cracking
_all standard encryption algorithms_ from an exponential problem to an Order
N problem (instead of taking n^n seconds, it takes n seconds). (Fortunately,
the same boffins who came up with this thing also designed quantum
encryption algorithms).

Now, imagine that the Crash of '29 was caused by an experimental quantum
program, and that was what enabled it to blow through all existing computer
security as if it wasn't there...

That's about the limit of my knowledge. Like I said, it makes my brain hurt.

--
.sig deleted to conserve electrons. robert.watkins@******.com
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 18:51:20 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Distance Strike Signature

On Wed, 27 May 1998 19:33:42 EDT Mike Bobroff <Airwasp@***.COM> writes:
>In a message dated 5/27/98 1:41:36 PM !!!First Boot!!!,
decker@****.FSU.EDU
>writes:
>> > Actually yeah, and we even added "Elementality (Select)" for 2
points to >> > the Killing Hands/Distance Strike option, giving the
Killing Hands a true
>> > elemental effect of some kind.
>> >
>> > Now -there- is a signature for ya.

>> Ouch so for a distance strike killing hands with fire, I just used
>> all my starting magic points + some (don't have my books handy). Nice
but
>> ouch!

>Ah, but with elementality Fire added onto the distance strike the attack
>effectively has it's damage code raised one higher, just like the spell
Flame
>Aura from Awakenings, IIRC.

Flame Aura is in Awakenings and increases the Power of the attack by 2.
However adding Elemental effect to distance strike & killing hands
wouldn't give this increase, instead having primary and secondary effects
as noted in Grimmy and Awakenings ... though the merit of certain
elemental effects in this context is questionable ("Hey, this knuckle
sandwich is soggy!")

>A note, has anyone put Distance Strike on nothing but themselves, and
not
>tying it to Killing Hands or an object?
>
>Mike

I originally was going to just that with my physad but opted instead to
go with combat sense instead :)

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)
"New Physad power: Distance noogie!"

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 19:08:05 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Acers

On Wed, 27 May 1998 21:15:32 +0100 Gurth <gurth@******.NL> writes:
>Matthew Waddilove said on 9:51/27 May 98,...
>> A way that I thought about getting around this is that the load cost
for
>> a bucket seat includes a 100kg person sitting in the seat, the seat
it's
>> self has no load cost. So once you have lopped off enough of the
>> 'passenger' the load cost should not be a problem.
>
>The way I understood it, the Load cost is for the seat plus the
>occupant. Normal car seats don't weigh 100 kg, I know that for certain
:)
>
>So yeah, you could rule that, say, 90 kg of that mass is the person
>sitting in it, and the seat itself is only 10 kg. Then you _could_ build
a
>drone with a bucket seat and put a skinny person in it to pilot the
thing, but
>IMHO it's getting very close to the edge of munchkinism.
>
>--
>Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html -
<SNIP Sig>

BTW, Gurth, I hope ya don't mind me mucking around with the formating of
your message so it looks nice :)

Uhm, Actually, R2 says that 100kg Load "cost" for a seat reflects 100 kg
alotment for the passenger so By-the-book, the seat itself is wieghtless
(doesn't make sense but that's the rules) so you just find a passenger
that can fit within the load restrictions of the vehicle (which prolly
means someone with a body of 1 or 2) or find a person and make them fit
...

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 20:30:55 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Craig J Wilhelm Jr <craigjwjr@*********.NET>
Organization: Afterlife Incorperated
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...(OT, obviously)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Paul Gettle wrote:
> I know it takes electricity one nanosecond to travel 11.something
> inches (I think it's .82) through a copper wire. Anyone got good stats
> on how long a light year is and is good at converting units of
> measure?

1 light year is 5,878,499,814,110.65447 Miles or
9,460,528,404,845.18187 Kilometers.

--
Craig "Knee Deep in the Blood of Swine" Wilhelm
The heavy wisdom that sorrow teaches is lightened by the pint,
and lost by the gallon
UIN: 1864690
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v3.12
GAT/$ d- s+:+ a- C+++ U--- P+ L- E-- W++ N++
o K- w+ O> !M-- !V PS+ PE Y+ PGP++ t--- 5+++
X-- R++ tv b++ DI-- D+(Q2++) G++ e++ h* r y++**
--------------END GEEK CODE BLOCK--------------
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 20:57:45 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Tim Kerby <drekhead@***.NET>
Subject: Re: More T-Shirt Info (Mr. Imbriaco please)
In-Reply-To: <fe4725ae.356c85b7@***.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

On 27 May 98, at 17:29, 'K' is the Symbol wrote:

> We have the option of "transfers" or "screen prints", and I'm
going to get
> a LOT of information this Saturday from the nice lady. I will be using
> copies of Granite's and Wafflemeisters prints as samples for her to help
> me do considerations.

Don't even think about transfers. They don't last over time, or even
several washings. Silk screen is the only way to go.

>I also asked about darker shirt fabrics (black, etc.). IF we go with
> those colors, then Screen Prints are the only option this store has. IF
> we know how many shirts we are gonna actually get into, then the price(s)
> will be adjusted accordingly.

I'm kinda of partial to black, myself, but any dark color will do.

> Regardless of what is going on, and which shirt offer we use (this one or
> Quicksilvers), get us a list of names here folks.

Ok, here's a problem. In the past, the list of names was almost the
last thing that was done, because only those that actually ordered a
shirt get their name on it, which means the list wasn't generated
until the money was sent. The problem here is that in the past, the
money went to one person, who compiled the names. We are considering
ordering the shirt direct, so how do we compile a list of names?
Putting the whole list subscription on there is one idea, but I think
there are what, over 200 people subscribed?
Another option is to include anyone who votes for a shirt design.
Since I am collecting the votes, I could also compile the names from
that.

> As for names to use on the list. As the list is about to be subjected to
> a major purging and reinvention here soon, could I or Quicksilver or
> whomever -please- have a copy of the listmembers when such a time comes
> sent directly to us?

See above. You may have to wait on the list of names.

Any other ideas, folks?

--

=================================================================
- Tim Kerby - drekhead@***.net - ICQ-UIN 2883757 -
-----------------------------------------------------------------
"Reality is the only obstacle to happiness." - Unknown
=================================================================
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 21:10:59 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: 'K' is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: A Message from Bull
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

Hey folks, i got this from Bull recently, so I thought I'd send it to ya'll.
I'm gonna toss my own comments in here as well.

-=-=-=-=-=-
Heya Kieth, how's it?

I'm mostly off line, which is why I'm so silent as of late... My compy died,
and my only access is through school. And this suckwad network won't let me
send mail, only recieve it, so I'm stuck using web mail :( I hate this
stuff...

(LAUGH)

Anyways, just to let you know wince you may be coordinating, I'll probably
order 2 shirts.

(Cool, that is up to 4 or 5 counting my own that are guarantees so far. Mike
told me he'd find out general mailing prices, as *mail* is more guaranteed at
lower prices to even international sites than UPS or others)

I'd like to point out to the list to be very careful in shirt selection...
Sometimes the cheapest place isn;t the best place. We just ordered some
shirts through CAB (Campus Activities Board) here at school, and they are
utter crap. they're made of a VERY thin material, and despite beings a 50/50
cotton blend, shrunk a LOT the first time washed...

(This is part of the reason I am going to go talk with Kay at the shop on
Saturday for a more in depth level. I'm gonna search things out a bit. I
know there is another store also that I'm gonna look into as well.)

Anyways, take it easy man...
Bull

-=-=-=-=-

Such was the message...
=K
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 21:57:34 -0300
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ubiratan P. Alberton" <ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Alfredo B Alves escreveu:
>
>
> >-K
>
> YupYup, If we look at the 12.5 Mp snipped as plain text the Mp is really
> small. If the snipped bit is Vrml or Rich Text with charts and diagrams,
> MPs are pretty big... but what if what we are seeing is the transcripts
> of a matrix conversation (recorded in all the detail the matrix allows)
> and the 12.5 Mp snipped was snipped before it was transcribed ... The Mp
> would be huge ...
>

That's what I imagine now... IMHO, there's no difference between you
holding a
SR sourcebook here in the real world and a decker "holding" a Shadowland
post in
the Matrix. It would present itself to all five senses, and thus it
would be huge...
It could look like a book or a simsense recording, or somethign like
that, but still huge.

Bira
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 21:28:15 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: 'K' is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: More T-Shirt Info (Mr. Imbriaco please)
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/27/98 7:59:31 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
drekhead@***.NET writes:

> Ok, here's a problem. In the past, the list of names was almost the
> last thing that was done, because only those that actually ordered a
> shirt get their name on it, which means the list wasn't generated
> until the money was sent. The problem here is that in the past, the
> money went to one person, who compiled the names. We are considering
> ordering the shirt direct, so how do we compile a list of names?
> Putting the whole list subscription on there is one idea, but I think
> there are what, over 200 people subscribed?
> Another option is to include anyone who votes for a shirt design.
> Since I am collecting the votes, I could also compile the names from
> that.
>
ah, but if we use Wafflemeisters option for the "list of names", we are gonna
have to have someone get that list as early as possible due to artwork
requirements.

=K
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 21:36:23 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Paul Gettle <pgettle@********.NET>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...(OT, obviously)
In-Reply-To: <356CB03F.97B488D2@*********.net>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

At 08:30 PM 5/27/98 -0400, Craig wrote:
>Paul Gettle wrote:
>> I know it takes electricity one nanosecond to travel 11.something
>> inches (I think it's .82) through a copper wire. Anyone got good
stats
>> on how long a light year is and is good at converting units of
>> measure?
>
> 1 light year is 5,878,499,814,110.65447 Miles or
>9,460,528,404,845.18187 Kilometers.

Using the value for kilometers, plugged into a handy spreadsheet, one
light-nanosecond is equal to 11.8026005850334 inches (so my estimate
from this morning, 11.82, wasn't too far off base. Not bad for that
being before my first cup of caffiene in the morning)

Oh, and in metric, thats 29.9786054859849 cm.

Either way, the speed of electricity through copper (which isn't the
best conductor, but it's still pretty good) is very close to
lightspeed.

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--
-- Paul Gettle (pgettle@********.net)
PGP Fingerprint, Key ID:11455339 (RSA 1024, created 97/08/08)
625A FFF0 76DC A077 D21C 556B BB58 00AA
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 21:43:02 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Jeff Loye <largo@****.KINGSTON.NET>
Subject: Re: Technobabel Teaser Q
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Thomas Berman wrote:

> At the end of Beyond the Pale... There's the usual teaser for the
> next novel in the series. This one happens to be Steve Kenson's
> Technobabel. The teaser starts off with a quote from Fastjack talking
> about the Ghost in the Machine... Does anyone have any idea what the
> hell he's talking about? It seems like the "Awakening" of the 'Trix
> has been foreshadowed since for years... but coming from Fastjack it
> just seems legit. Anyway, a clarification would be appreciated, if
> anyone can oblige...
>

I believe you'll find Fastjacks encounter with the "Ghost" in one of
the earlier SR novels. Can't remember which one off hand, might be the
3rd book in the Secrets of Power series.
Hope that helps.

Largo
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 22:15:08 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Geoff Morochnick <bodiam@**********.COM>
Organization: Heaven, Inc.
Subject: Re: Ingentization
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

>

<snip guy trolls>

> >
> >That was a joke, really...I was insinuating that I might have enough
> >facial hair to be a MALE dwarf. :> But of course, I was kidding. I
> >believe that in SR, female dwarves can be fairly attractive. Especially
> >with the "human-looking" edge.
>
> Hey I like short stocky women ... and tall thin women ... and -- hey
> waiatsec I just like women ;) actually, I knew a blond with a kinda
> peach fuzz thing going on and she was very attractive (but we're not
> talking bearded lady so ...) Actually as thinking fem dwarves might have
> sort of exagerated sideburns to maybe bordering on mutton chops ... might
> be attractive ... have to actually see somone like this to really make
> the call :)
>
> D.Ghost

My calculus teacher has a near-mutton chop thing going... trust me, it's not
a pretty sight on women. AD$D dwarf females have beards, but IMHO, in SR you
can count on dwarf females to have limited facial hair, maybe it'd be more
common for them to have endocrine misfunctions which causes the darkenings of
facial hair... but not all of them, or even a majority.

--
Stonebow
Friends: People who know you well, but like you anyway.
bodiam@**********.com
http://www.geocities.com/area51/corridor/8427
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 22:59:30 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: BigDaddy <bigdaddy@*****.COM>
Organization: @**** Network
Subject: Re: Ingentization
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Alfredo B Alves wrote:
>
> On Wed, 27 May 1998 13:34:03 -0400 BigDaddy <bigdaddy@*****.COM> writes:
> ><snip all of the stuff Ghost wrote before this>
> >> Males of the list: how many of you would "go for" the different
> metatypes
> >> and which ones?
>
> <SNIP other meta types>
> >But trolls, welllll thers something i like
> >about a woman that can put a hurtin on me and still want more! (besides
> >whats there not to luv about a 6'5" chik with horns and attitude!)
>
> Uhm ...6'5"? you like your Trolls short doncha? average Ht is 2.8 meters

9ft really? hmmm even better!
--
Napalm Sticks to Kidz,
BigDaddy
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 23:03:54 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Katt Freyson <katt@******.NET>
Subject: Re: Apologies and hkit link.
In-Reply-To: <356B6D82.143764CA@************.com.br>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Sir,
I am writing this in the public base because I believe it should be
read by all, if I have inadvertently broken list rules, I apologize.

You have violated a major rule here by sending that file. By being
negligent you made an error. However, this is not to belittle you or take
you to task, others have been quite vocal already.

No, this is to congratulate you. You have realized that you made an
error and have had the grace to apologize and accept the critiscm for you
act. I wish that those who responded to you had had that grace.

Many of the responses to your post I personally found MUCH more
irritating than yours. Especially that multi-twac post. I thought this
mailing list had Net security to handle events such as your post, but
apparently that is not what they are here for.

Thank you for having the grace to apologize and explain.

-M
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 23:10:01 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: BigDaddy <bigdaddy@*****.COM>
Organization: @**** Network
Subject: Re: Ingentization
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Erik Jameson wrote:
>
> At 02:08 PM 5/27/98 EDT, you wrote:
> >In a message dated 98-05-27 13:59:11 EDT, you write:
> >
> >> Ork/troll: not bloody likely. Got a major thing against tusks and warts
> >> and dermal deposits and horns...
> >
> >Too much like dating family, Erik? <g>
>
> Hey, I've never been to Appalachia OR the Deep South... ;-)
>


hey hey. i'm from the deep south(fl) and we breed em right down here.
Aint no bugger smaller than 6'2" without less than a 100 iq. YEEHAW!,The
taller we get the dumber we go! Get 'er done son!

<speaking in mild redneck accent>

--
Napalm Sticks to Kidz,
BigDaddy
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 23:13:08 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: 'K' is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Technobabel Teaser Q
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In a message dated 5/27/98 8:40:25 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
largo@****.KINGSTON.NET writes:

> I believe you'll find Fastjacks encounter with the "Ghost" in one of
> the earlier SR novels. Can't remember which one off hand, might be the
> 3rd book in the Secrets of Power series.
> Hope that helps.
>
> Largo
>
Not necessarily. IF you are talking about the Secrets of Power Trilogy, then
it was Dodger's encounters with Morgan. I do not recall Fastjack even ever
being in one of the actual novels, at least not as a main character.

=K
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 19:56:03 -0600
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Adam J <fro@***.AB.CA>
Subject: Re: New Books...
In-Reply-To: <199805271810.AA143212@*****.scri.fsu.edu>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 14:10 27/05/98 -0500, you wrote:
>This might be old news, but amazon has a listing for New Seattle,
>including Cover Art (very cool), due out in July, 176 pages.
>There is also a picture of Smugglers haven, either though its due
>date is May 98. :)

Steve told me a couple weeks ago that New Seattle has been pushed back
until after SR3 because it's a 'core' sourcebook.

*growl* Good business choice, bad choice for those who WANT NEW SEATTLE
NOW, DAMNIT!

-Adam J
Who still thinks Seattle is the most useful SB out.
-
http://www.interware.it/users/adamj \ fro@***.ab.ca \ ICQ# 2350330
ShadowRN Assistant Fearless Leader \ FreeRPG Webring \ TSS Productions
The Shadowrun Supplemental \ SR Archive Co-Maintainer \ RPGA Reviwer
"So Marilyn Manson is a criticism of gimmickry while being itself a gimmick."
--- Marilyn Manson
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 23:20:48 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: MC23 <mc23@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

Once upon a time, Jett wrote;

>Here we go again...Would this have come up even if I DIDN'T do the (by
>now infamous, I'm sure) Sex and the Single Shadowrunner post? :P Anyway,
>that's a good question. IF a human woman gets pregnant by a troll, what
>kind of kid does she have? Does she deliver a troll child, a human
>child, or a human child that will goblinize later? Consider this more
>research...

It would be a human or trog child 50/50 chance. Goblinization was an
early awakening trait but now for the most part they are born orks or
trolls. Goblinization by 2050 and beyond has become a rare phenomenon.
It's all in the BBB.

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

Ancient cultures believed that names held great power, personal names
more so and they were guarded very closely. To protect themselves, they
answered to another name, because if another discovered their real name,
it could be used against them.
History repeats itself.
Welcome to the Digital Age.
I am MC23
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 23:30:36 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: BigDaddy <bigdaddy@*****.COM>
Organization: @**** Network
Subject: Re: Ingentization
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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> > |very uncomfortable for the woman).
>
> Here we go again...Would this have come up even if I DIDN'T do the (by
> now infamous, I'm sure) Sex and the SIngle Shadowrunner post? :P Anyway,
> that's a good question. IF a human woman gets pregnant by a troll, what
> kind of kid does she have? Does she deliver a troll child, a human
> child, or a human child that will goblinize later? Consider this more
> research...
>
> --Jett

I'll put dollars to doughnuts that the kid goblinizes. Depends mostly on
the majority of genes, but if its a male goblinization for sure, due to
the father's genes most likely being dominant. But if its a girl i give
it a 50/50 shot.
--
Napalm Sticks to Kidz,
BigDaddy
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 23:38:38 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: NightLife <habenir@*****.UC.EDU>
Subject: Re: Technobabel Teaser Q
In-Reply-To: <356CCF35.875E7E07@****.kingston.net>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

> I believe you'll find Fastjacks encounter with the "Ghost" in one of
>the earlier SR novels. Can't remember which one off hand, might be the
>3rd book in the Secrets of Power series.
>Hope that helps.
>
>Largo

That was Dodger and it was a AI.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Nightlife Inc.
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

"I am telling you nothing - merely asking you to remember that death come in
many shades. Some are harsh and infinitely painful to look upon; others can
be
as peaceful and beautiful as the setting sun. I am an artist, and many colors
lie on upon my palette. Let me paint him a rainbow, and give you the means to
decide where it ends."

Erik from the book Phantom.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Document Classified
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 21:40:53 -0600
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Adam J <fro@***.AB.CA>
Subject: [Admin] Resubscribing
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Just a note for those of you that have said "Can you resubscribe me when
the list purge hits?".

The quick answer is: Maybe. Friday is the day that we're decorating for
grad, so I'll be doing that and slowly getting intoxicated. Saturday IS
the actual grad day, so I'll most certainly be getting intoxicated until
the early hours of Sunday. Oh yes, and attending the usual ceremonies and
stuff, but that's just the side show! >:)

So, I might not even be back on the list myself until Sunday, although I
imagine that I'll have time sometime Friday afternoon, depending on a pile
of stuff.

-Adam J
-
http://www.interware.it/users/adamj \ fro@***.ab.ca \ ICQ# 2350330
ShadowRN Assistant Fearless Leader \ FreeRPG Webring \ TSS Productions
The Shadowrun Supplemental \ SR Archive Co-Maintainer \ RPGA Reviwer
"So Marilyn Manson is a criticism of gimmickry while being itself a gimmick."
--- Marilyn Manson
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 23:18:27 -0300
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ubiratan P. Alberton" <ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR>
Subject: Re: megapulses for beginners
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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DisnyShamn escreveu:
>
> > The reason I was aking this is beacuse all my current players are
> > beginners, so I needed something to make them understand how
> > powerful those decks are... Never mind, tough, just forget I asked this.
>
> Oh! Well, I find it simplest to say "They could download your machine's entire
> hard drive faster than you can boot it up; and hold the contents it in
> memory..."
>
> - Disney Shaman


Thanks! To you and to all who also came up with things for me to tell
my players.
It will be useful :) .

Bira
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 23:15:05 -0300
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ubiratan P. Alberton" <ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Ereskanti escreveu:

> Service providers are something else that SR doesn't go into greatly. Major
> coverage and the like and how "crowded" are the bandwidths at any given
time.
> This could possibly effect a decker while doing their job.
>
> -K

Maybe there aren't any service providers... The Matrix just
integrates everything that used to be
a bunch of separate nets. You acess it from a legal jackpoint, you pay
to the corp who owns the
jackpoint, and, it you're a legitimate user, you might pay to the guys
whose servers you're acessing
also. No "monthly Matriz bill", Matrix use would be just like any phone
call (wich also would use the
Matrix), and charged as such. You could even acess the 'trix from a soda
machine, of all things... :)

Bira
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 13:49:18 +1000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Robert Watkins <robert.watkins@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
In-Reply-To: <356CDA5C.92C748CE@*****.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

BigDaddy writes:
> I'll put dollars to doughnuts that the kid goblinizes. Depends mostly on
> the majority of genes, but if its a male goblinization for sure, due to
> the father's genes most likely being dominant. But if its a girl i give
> it a 50/50 shot.

Where on earth did you get the idea that the father's genes are most likely
dominant in boys? Gender is only dependant on one chromosome, and the father
supplies the dependent chromosome for both cases.

Unless goblinisation is a Y-linked trait, the fact that the kid is male
wouldn't affect the chance of goblinisation.

Oh, and goblinisation, per se, is not rare in 2050+. The BBB states that it
is now rare for offspring of plain humans to goblinise, but it states that
orks and trolls occasionally give birth to apparently human children, who
goblinise at puberty.

Oh, and here's the chances of a human/troll mating (given no dominance of
genes):
Human: 50%.
Troll: 50%. Note that some instances of troll will appear human, but
goblinise at puberty.

So the chance of goblinisation would be somewhat lower than 50%.

--
.sig deleted to conserve electrons. robert.watkins@******.com
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 13:51:47 +1000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Robert Watkins <robert.watkins@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Technobabel Teaser Q
In-Reply-To: <9a800945.356cd647@***.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Ereskanti writes:
>
> Not necessarily. IF you are talking about the Secrets of Power
> Trilogy, then
> it was Dodger's encounters with Morgan. I do not recall Fastjack
> even ever
> being in one of the actual novels, at least not as a main character.

One of the later novels (not a Robert Charrette novel) has Fastjack as a
minor player. The main character has ties to the Denver Data Haven, and has
a Matrix meet with FJ. Can't remember which one, though. (Nosferatu?)

--
.sig deleted to conserve electrons. robert.watkins@******.com
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 22:46:08 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: More T-Shirt Info (Mr. Imbriaco please)

On Wed, 27 May 1998 21:28:15 EDT "'K' is the Symbol" <Ereskanti@***.COM>
writes:
>In a message dated 5/27/98 7:59:31 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
>drekhead@***.NET writes:
>
>> Ok, here's a problem. In the past, the list of names was almost the
>> last thing that was done, because only those that actually ordered a
>> shirt get their name on it, which means the list wasn't generated
>> until the money was sent. The problem here is that in the past, the
>> money went to one person, who compiled the names. We are considering
>> ordering the shirt direct, so how do we compile a list of names?
>> Putting the whole list subscription on there is one idea, but I think
>> there are what, over 200 people subscribed?
>> Another option is to include anyone who votes for a shirt design.
>> Since I am collecting the votes, I could also compile the names from
>> that.

>ah, but if we use Wafflemeisters option for the "list of names", we are
gonna
>have to have someone get that list as early as possible due to artwork
>requirements.
>
>=K

K, your the one coordinating the actual shirts, right? Didn't you say
that T-Shirt company had computer support or some such thing? Can you
find out if they can compile a list of everyone who pays and arrange the
names?

BTW ... how will we (you) know how much the shirst cost until all the
money is collected?

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 22:58:52 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization

On Wed, 27 May 1998 16:44:02 -0400 Jett <grota@*********.COM> writes:
>Spike wrote:
>> And verily, did Nexx3 hastily scribble thusly...
>> |Close but no potato (no smoking in the house... sorry). Trolls be H.
>> |sapiens ingentis, not H. ingentis (at this point). Humans and trolls
are
>> |still fully cross-fertile, physical incompatiblity aside (I can
imagine >> |dermal armor is very uncomfortable for the woman).

>Here we go again...Would this have come up even if I DIDN'T do the (by
>now infamous, I'm sure) Sex and the SIngle Shadowrunner post? :P

Actually, I don't think so ... I think he was just explaining the
significance of Trolls being Homo Sapiens ingentis instead of Homo
ingentis :) However, thanks fer reminding me about that post ... how's
that sourcebook coming? ;) ya think FASA will publish it? ;)

>Anyway, that's a good question. IF a human woman gets pregnant by a
troll,
>what kind of kid does she have? Does she deliver a troll child, a human
>child, or a human child that will goblinize later? Consider this more
>research...
>
>--Jett

I dunno what the precentages would be (the BBB might say but I don't want
to go check), but OTTOMH, I'd say the kid would have a large chance of
being a Troll, and smaller chance of being human and then an extremely
small chance of being an Elf, Dwarf, or Ork ... It's very hard to say ...
considering the rarity of metahumans (in most campaigns, included FASA's)
I'd guess that metahuman expression is controled by recessive genes ...

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 23:04:37 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Justin Bell <justin@******.NET>
Subject: Re: [Admin] Resubscribing
In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980527214053.0085b210@****.lis.ab.ca>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 09:40 PM 5/27/98 -0600, Adam J wrote:
# Just a note for those of you that have said "Can you resubscribe me when
# the list purge hits?".
#
# The quick answer is: Maybe. Friday is the day that we're decorating for
# grad, so I'll be doing that and slowly getting intoxicated. Saturday IS
# the actual grad day, so I'll most certainly be getting intoxicated until
# the early hours of Sunday. Oh yes, and attending the usual ceremonies and
# stuff, but that's just the side show! >:)
#
# So, I might not even be back on the list myself until Sunday, although I
# imagine that I'll have time sometime Friday afternoon, depending on a pile
# of stuff.

so when IS the list being reset?

--
/- justin@****.mcp.com -------------------- justin@******.net -\
|Justin Bell NIC:JB3084| Time and rules are changing. |
|Simon & Schuster | Attention span is quickening. |
|Programmer | Welcome to the Information Age. |
\------------ http://www.mcp.com/people/justin/ ---------------/
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 23:36:53 -0300
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Ubiratan P. Alberton" <ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Jett escreveu:
>
>
> Hear, hear! I volunteer to be the short, fat elf, the short, pretty ork,
> or the tall, average dwarf. :) Of course, barring the sudden appearance
> of warts, tusks, or a beard, I would most likely stay my old human self.
> In 2057, you could bet that I'd be a shadowrunner, maybe a neoanarchist,
> probably a shaman or a street sam (Hey, I could be a shamurai like
> Jett!)
>
> --Jett


If I were in 205x, I'd probably want to be a mage OR a decker... Hey,
If I live enough
I can become FastJack! >)

Bira
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 22:21:39 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <granite@**.net>
From: GRANITE <granite@**.NET>
Organization: Granite Forge Productions
Subject: Re: Character Background Help
In-Reply-To: <19980527.183815.-27002.9.dghost@****.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

> The problem is the shaper's bestial nature ... how could she be an
> undercover op with a bestial nature ... possible solutions:

A Bestial nature doesn't mean that a SS takes a crap wherever it is
and the need hits..Just as any dog can be well behaved in most every
situation sometimes the urge will strike and they just cannot keep
out of the trash..Or something more like they are more likely to go
overboard when in hand to hand combat..Afterall a wolf or bear
doesn't fight for fun they fight for life..

> 1) brainwashing overrode the bestial nature pay x build points to get rid
> of the bestial nature

Not if I were the GM..A bestial nature would be genetic not something
you can simply get rid of..THink more like Wolverine from the
X-men..THe comics not the cartoon..

> 3) implanted cyberware controllers (I know alot of people don't allow
> cyberware in chars/critters with regen, but this is a nifty solution ...
> someone in Aztechnology has a little box that control her actions ...)

Not a lot of people..the rules..Now if you want to create a house
rule..go for it..But leave me out of any discusion about it..

Now if you want something to calm the critter down..try mood altering
drugs..Make them very adictive..I personally don't like uing drugs in
my game..but this could be an easy answer for you..This would also
mesh better with the brainwashing stuff..make the drug long lasting
and now that the SS finds itself away from the source you have
withdrawl problems to contend with as well...
--------------------------------GRANITE
"Rock Steady"
===============================================
Lord, Grant Me The Serenity To Accept The Things I Cannot Change,
The Courage To Change The Things I Can,
And The Wisdom To Hide The Bodies Of Those People I Had To Kill
Because They Pissed Me Off.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ShadowRunner's Serenity Prayer
===============================================
Kind of a bummer. Gettin' your butt kicked by a dead guy.
- Lt Col McQueen
Understanding is a three edged sword. - Kosh
What is best in life?
To Crush Your Enemies,
To See Them Driven Before You,
To Hear The Lamentation Of Their Women. -Conan
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 22:30:24 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <granite@**.net>
From: GRANITE <granite@**.NET>
Organization: Granite Forge Productions
Subject: Re: List T-Shirt Price Options
In-Reply-To: <dc6ae038.356c7894@***.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

> Also note that BLACK t-shirts are OUT at this place, as the option of Printing
> bright colors is more difficult for them. I -AM- going to ask them about blue
> printing on a black shirt however. Just for a thought.

Try asking about White printing on a Black shirt..this should not be
a problem for them..
--------------------------------GRANITE
"Rock Steady"
===============================================
Lord, Grant Me The Serenity To Accept The Things I Cannot Change,
The Courage To Change The Things I Can,
And The Wisdom To Hide The Bodies Of Those People I Had To Kill
Because They Pissed Me Off.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ShadowRunner's Serenity Prayer
===============================================
Kind of a bummer. Gettin' your butt kicked by a dead guy.
- Lt Col McQueen
Understanding is a three edged sword. - Kosh
What is best in life?
To Crush Your Enemies,
To See Them Driven Before You,
To Hear The Lamentation Of Their Women. -Conan
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 22:35:57 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <granite@**.net>
From: GRANITE <granite@**.NET>
Organization: Granite Forge Productions
Subject: Re: List T-Shirt Price Options
In-Reply-To: <927bbcf1.356b8076@***.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

I just wanted to point out..I seriously doubt that the printer is
going to go for having to deal with the gathering of the money and
sending out individual receipts..that is an awful lot of
trouble for the business to go through for one order..Someone will
have to be -repsponsible- for that..whoever ends up being the person
to take care of the shirts is going to have to do this..that is whay
in the past we have had to rely on individuals that everyone trusts
to take care of the whole thing..
--------------------------------GRANITE
"Rock Steady"
===============================================
Lord, Grant Me The Serenity To Accept The Things I Cannot Change,
The Courage To Change The Things I Can,
And The Wisdom To Hide The Bodies Of Those People I Had To Kill
Because They Pissed Me Off.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ShadowRunner's Serenity Prayer
===============================================
Kind of a bummer. Gettin' your butt kicked by a dead guy.
- Lt Col McQueen
Understanding is a three edged sword. - Kosh
What is best in life?
To Crush Your Enemies,
To See Them Driven Before You,
To Hear The Lamentation Of Their Women. -Conan
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 00:43:11 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: MC23 <mc23@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: New Books...
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

Once upon a time, Lehlan Decker wrote;

>There is also a picture of Smugglers haven, either though its due
>date is May 98. :)

As FASA once said with a similar situation, May has 31 days in it.
There was a lot of growling fans in that seminar afterwards.

-MC23, who remembers their sales pitch for Grimoire and Universal
Brotherhood-
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 00:58:31 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Mark A. Imbriaco" <mark.imbriaco@*****.COM>
Subject: [ADMIN] List Reset: Final.
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

The list reset will take place on Saturday, May 30 at approximately
10:00 AM EDT. The Friday date had to be changed due to some conflicts
on my end. I _am_ willing to manually subscribe a limited number of
people who have legitimate reasons for not being able to do so themselves
(only access via a work computer, for example). If you fall into this
category, send me private email. As long as I don't get inundated with
requests I should be able to swing this.

-Mark
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 00:47:54 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: 'K' is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: More T-Shirt Info (Mr. Imbriaco please)
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/27/98 11:06:16 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
dghost@****.COM writes:

> K, your the one coordinating the actual shirts, right? Didn't you say
> that T-Shirt company had computer support or some such thing? Can you
> find out if they can compile a list of everyone who pays and arrange the
> names?
>
> BTW ... how will we (you) know how much the shirst cost until all the
> money is collected?
>
They do have computer support, but I get the massive impression they are NOT
the most computer literate of types running around. The cost(s) will be
determined this weekend, and i can let everyone know by then.

=K
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 00:49:20 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: 'K' is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Technobabel Teaser Q
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In a message dated 5/27/98 11:07:10 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
robert.watkins@******.COM writes:

> One of the later novels (not a Robert Charrette novel) has Fastjack as a
> minor player. The main character has ties to the Denver Data Haven, and has
> a Matrix meet with FJ. Can't remember which one, though. (Nosferatu?)
>
Uhm, NO, that wasn't Fastjack, no wait, he was an "arranger". The meeting was
actually between Shiva and Bash of the Denver Data Haven that I think you are
talking about (where two guys face off and comments about "who is the best"
are made). If that was it, then those are the guys in question. FJ is a
-major- guy, but a -minor- controller.

=K
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 00:52:43 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: 'K' is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: List T-Shirt Price Options
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In a message dated 5/27/98 11:30:37 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
granite@**.NET writes:

>
> Try asking about White printing on a Black shirt..this should not be
> a problem for them..
> -
Will do...

Guys, Gals, Esteemed colleagues...PLEASE direct any questions about the shirt
options that you may have to me at PRIVATE EMAIL please. I know the topic is
"List Related", but it's not truly GAME related. I apologize to the admin
guys for using it as an information source, but it's the only one I have for
this measure.

=K
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 14:59:25 +1000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Robert Watkins <robert.watkins@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Technobabel Teaser Q
In-Reply-To: <fa32814f.356cecd2@***.com>
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Ereskanti writes:
> Uhm, NO, that wasn't Fastjack, no wait, he was an "arranger".
> The meeting was
> actually between Shiva and Bash of the Denver Data Haven that I
> think you are
> talking about (where two guys face off and comments about "who is
> the best"
> are made). If that was it, then those are the guys in question. FJ is a
> -major- guy, but a -minor- controller.

No, that's not the one I'm thinking of. The one I'm thinking of has the main
character meet FJ in the Matrix. FJ uses a persona that is dressed in army
fatigues, and the resolution is particularly high.

Damn, why can't I remember which book it is?

--
.sig deleted to conserve electrons. robert.watkins@******.com
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 01:36:17 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Katt Freyson <katt@******.NET>
Subject: Re: [ADMIN] List Reset: Final.
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.3.96.980528005518.1463B-100000@********>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
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|> The list reset will take place on Saturday, May 30 at approximately
|> 10:00 AM EDT. The Friday date had to be changed due to some conflicts
|> on my end. I _am_ willing to manually subscribe a limited number of
|> people who have legitimate reasons for not being able to do so themselves
|> (only access via a work computer, for example). If you fall into this
|> category, send me private email. As long as I don't get inundated with
|> requests I should be able to swing this.

For those, perhaps myself included, who were too silly, ignorant, or
whatever, to recall them, could you post the information on how to
resubscribe? I, for one, would appreciate it.

Katt
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 00:42:46 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...

On Wed, 27 May 1998 23:15:05 -0300 "Ubiratan P. Alberton"
<ubiratan@**.HOMESHOPPING.COM.BR> writes:
>Ereskanti escreveu:
>> Service providers are something else that SR doesn't go into
>greatly. Major
>> coverage and the like and how "crowded" are the bandwidths at any
>given time.
>> This could possibly effect a decker while doing their job.
>>
>> -K

> Maybe there aren't any service providers... The Matrix just
>integrates everything that used to be
>a bunch of separate nets. You acess it from a legal jackpoint, you pay
>to the corp who owns the
>jackpoint, and, it you're a legitimate user, you might pay to the guys
>whose servers you're acessing
>also. No "monthly Matriz bill", Matrix use would be just like any phone
>call (wich also would use the
>Matrix), and charged as such. You could even acess the 'trix from a soda
>machine, of all things... :)
>
> Bira

It was my understanding that Matrix Access was included in certain
lifestyles (low and up) accessable with purchase of a telcomm unit
(Middle & up include this in their costs) other wise it works as Bira
described :)

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 02:44:48 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Waffelmeisters <evamarie@**********.NET>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
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>
> Re: Ingentization (Geoff Skellams , Tue 20:26)
>
> On Shadowrun Discussion, Karl Low[SMTP:kwil@*********.COM] wrote:
> > From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
> >
> >
> > >Hey, is there anyone out there besides me that thinks that if the
> Awakening
> > >were to occur right now they would probably remain a vanilla human?
> I just
> > >don't see anything in my body that indicates "troll" or
"elf" or
> anything;
> > >I'm pretty much well within statistical and cosmetic standards for an
> > >average male...
> >
> >
> > Just my luck, I'd remain your shorter than average human.
> > I don't have the stockiness to really qualify as going "dwarf", and at
> 5'3",
> > I'm just a shade too tall, to boot.
> >
> > -Karl

Your current aperance would likely have NOTHING to do with your
MetaType (or that of your children). AFAIK, you can't BECOME an elf or
dwarf- theres no reported instance. Bummer, I'm tall, and could really
use the charisma. :) But I'm assuming nobody is a "spikebirth" for
now, so UGE "goblinization" is the only way any of us would change, and
we'd all be OLD goblins. As for bocoming a troll, I'm not sure my
charisma could take the hit... I'm not ugly, but my people skills and
pressence could be better...

>
> What everyone seems to be forgetting is that these are all just
> stereotypes. In Shadowrun, it *is* possible to have a tall skinny dwarf
> (5'3" is probably where a dwarf would top out), just the same way as it
> is possible to have a short, fat elf. The figures in the book are just
> averages. There are probably elves as short as 5'3" as well.
> Let's see more short, fat, ugly elves. And ork or troll
> supermodels. It makes the world a more interesting place
>
> cheers
> Geoff


In our campaign, we DO have ork media stars (Trudy Garland, ork
reporterfor KSAF- and of course, Neil T.O.B. is FAMOUS, and quite
charismatic). Mongoose is an uncouth hulk of an elf, a total street
thug, mistakable at a distance for an ork, and I also played a very
small, cute, intellectual troll for a while. But genrally, we assume
racism plays a big factor in excluding metas from mainstream media
popularity as models and such (even elves- why torque off the japenese
market?).
We like to keep PC sizes within 15% of given norms, seeing as that's
the range from human norm we've had have in our PLAYER group (a motly
crew, statistics wise). People tend to go with characters that are on
the same side of the meridian as themselves. OTOH, there nothing
preventing FREAKS, like growth- stunted trolls or orks, unless those
characteristics are actually un-awakened aspects of meta-humanity.
Now THERES a question- would human's be as variable in 205x, having
"giants" and "dwarfs", ie growth "disorders", or would all
the genes for
those sorts of things turn out to be meta-human factors, tending to cull
the "5th%" folks off into other metahuman races? If so, "short, fat
elves" would (usually) be HUMANS.
-Mongoose
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 02:45:06 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Waffelmeisters <evamarie@**********.NET>
Subject: Re: Pool Use
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> Re: Pool Use (was; Summer Time) (rabiola , Mon 11:00)
>
Given that, does anybody else find it odd that having multiple
pools essentially makes it BETTER to divide you attention among multiple
task
types? The most common case is the mage who uses his magic pool for
magical offense (and maybe defense) while still getting his whole
combat pool for damage resistance. Why does he get to use ALL of BOTH
pools,
when clearly, his attention is divided? If a samurai (or eventhe same
mage) is using ONLY combat pool, why does he effectively get fewer pool
dice?
>
> What about applying a +2 modifier if trying to use two pools at once?
> Much simpler to implement, and similar to other situations when a
> character is trying to do another thing while already busy with the
> first.

That would make things pretty hard on mages using touch spells (unarmed
combat test needed) and for certain rigging tests (combat pool can be
used for some gunnery, I think). Maybe Its just me, but I find dice
adjustments less troublesomethen TN mods.
-Mongoose
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 02:28:18 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Stephen Delear <steved@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...(OT, obviously)
In-Reply-To: <199805271705.LAA03376@******.verinet.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 11:05 AM 98-05-27 -0600, you wrote:
>Thus spake Tim Kerby:
>>
>> On 27 May 98, at 10:58, Paul Gettle wrote:
>>
>> > >This changes with optical technology. Light travels much faster than
>> > >electricity.
>> >
>> > HUH? I was under the impression that electricity moved at near the
>> > speed of light too. I'll grant that it's a tad slower than the 'speed of
>> > light in a vacuum' but light traveling through fiber optics is also
slower
>> > than 'speed of light in a vacuum'. (IIRC, electomagnetics traveling
>> > through any medium are impeded ever so slightly, which is why they
have to
>> > quote the speed 'in a vacuum')
>>
>> Yes, you are right. The advantages to light over
>> electricity are integrity, and interference, not speed.
>> Light is not susceptible to EMF or RFI interference, so
>> is a more robust transfer medium. Plus, it maintains
>> signal integrity over a much greater distance.
>
> I wouldn't say that light isn't susceptible to outside interference with
>much confidence right now. It hasn't been used as densely as electrical
>transmission lines to find out what kind of gremlins show up in these
>kinds of situations. When you start pumping that much light through
>gates in dense configurations, who knows what new quantum principle
>might be uncovered.

God I can just see it know you're sitting at home writting E-Mail, windows
crashes and your computer takes off towards antares at superluminal velocity.

SteveD
>
> However, I do agree with you as to the higher scalability of light over
>electricity. I think that the amount of data, when described in the media
>as states (levels of intensity, similar to voltage), is potentially much
>higher when using photons rather than electrons.
>
>--
> | Even Einstein objected to the idea of
> Mike Loseke | wave-function collapse, calling it
> mike@*******.com | "spooky action-at-a-distance."
>
Stephen Delear
Freelance Photographer
Austin TX
Phone 512-388-0166
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 11:43:36 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: Re: Ingentization
In-Reply-To: <356CDA5C.92C748CE@*****.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
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BigDaddy said on 23:30/27 May 98,...

> I'll put dollars to doughnuts that the kid goblinizes. Depends mostly on
> the majority of genes, but if its a male goblinization for sure, due to
> the father's genes most likely being dominant. But if its a girl i give
> it a 50/50 shot.

Erm... I might not have paid too much attention in Biology class, but I do
know 50% of your genes comes from your father, and the other 50% from
your mother. You don't get more or less from one parent depending on you
gender, you just get one chromosome different, and therefore it's _always_
the father who "decides" what gender the child will be.

Furthermore, assuming the troll genes are dominant, it's still very possible
for a troll to have the genes that make a human, and thus for the child to
inherit them. If then the mother also passes on human genes to the child,
it'll be human regardless of whether it's a boy or a girl.

Sort of like the blue eye/brown eye thing: brown is dominant, yet two brown-
eyed parents can have a blue-eyed child, if they each have one brown-eye
and one blue-eye gene.

That said, let me state this is my interpretation based on what I remember
from a class I didn't much care for about 5 years ago, so I may be way off :)

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
At the bar down the Adios Lounge.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- + --+--
Version 3.1: | Incubated into
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N | the First Church of
o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ | the Sqooshy Ball
tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y? | 21 May 1998
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ + --+--
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 11:43:37 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: Re: Apologies and hkit link.
In-Reply-To: <000301bd89e5$41a9b900$3daa8bcf@****>
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Katt Freyson said on 23:03/27 May 98,...

> Many of the responses to your post I personally found MUCH more
> irritating than yours. Especially that multi-twac post. I thought this
> mailing list had Net security to handle events such as your post, but
> apparently that is not what they are here for.

It _is_ what GridSec is here for, but recently people seem to want to take
the right into their own hands again... Preventing those multiple "Don't do
[whatever]! Thwap! Zot!" postings is one of the main reasons why GridSec
was formed, AFAIK, but (un?)fortunately we can't really do anything against
people who decide to post those anyway, except for ask that they won't.

So once again, fellow listmembers, let GridSec handle these things. We _do_
send mail to people who post these things, we just don't do it via the list --
which means you don't get to see it if you're not directly involved, but trust
me when I say we can handle these things.

--
Gurth@******.nl, ShadowRN GridSec: Enforcer Division
The ShadowRN FAQ: http://coastnet.com/~dvixen/srnintro.html
Other GridSec members: David Buehrer <dbuehrer@******.carl.org>
Drekhead <drekhead@***.net>
Dvixen <on vacation>
List Administrator: Adam Jury <fro@***.ab.ca>
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 11:43:36 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: Re: More T-Shirt Info (Mr. Imbriaco please)
In-Reply-To: <fe4725ae.356c85b7@***.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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'K' is the Symbol said on 17:29/27 May 98,...

> We have the option of "transfers" or "screen prints", and I'm
going to get a
> LOT of information this Saturday from the nice lady.

Unless I'm mistaken, transfers are those iron-on things. We do NOT want
those -- they fade, can shrink when washed too hot, and do all kinds of other
stuff that means the shirt won't be readable after a while.

> As for names to use on the list. As the list is about to be subjected to a
> major purging and reinvention here soon, could I or Quicksilver or whomever
> -please- have a copy of the listmembers when such a time comes sent directly
> to us?

The idea is to only put on the names of the people who actually buy one of the
shirts, not the entire list. You'll never be able to fit 400+ names onto the back of
a T-shirt...

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
At the bar down the Adios Lounge.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- + --+--
Version 3.1: | Incubated into
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N | the First Church of
o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ | the Sqooshy Ball
tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y? | 21 May 1998
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ + --+--
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 11:43:36 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: [OT] Thelonious monster (was Re: Hijacking)
In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.16.19980527141602.0a8fe8a0@****.fbiz.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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Erik Jameson said on 17:47/27 May 98,...

> > At the bar down the Adios Lounge.
>
> Where is that line from? Actually, this is the real reason I'm replying to
> this. For some reason the only thing I can think of is a song by
> Thelonious Monster on their "Beautiful Mess" album that's a duet with Tom
> Waits, but that's a very obscure reference from a band that never hit it
> big (damn shame too...).

You're hit it right on the head... It is from Adios Lounge, track #4 on that CD,
right after "Body And Soul?" (best song on the album, IMHO). I think that makes
you the only person I know (next to myself) who's heard of Thelonious Monster.
Like you said, that's a damn shame...

Back to the regularly-scheduled blathering now...

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
At the bar down the Adios Lounge.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- + --+--
Version 3.1: | Incubated into
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N | the First Church of
o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ | the Sqooshy Ball
tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y? | 21 May 1998
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ + --+--
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 11:43:37 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: Re: More T-Shirt Info (Mr. Imbriaco please)
In-Reply-To: <199805280057.AAA36634@****.ibm.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

Tim Kerby said on 20:57/27 May 98,...

> Don't even think about transfers. They don't last over time, or even
> several washings. Silk screen is the only way to go.

I already mentioned something similar in another post, but "Agreed."

> Ok, here's a problem. In the past, the list of names was almost the
> last thing that was done, because only those that actually ordered a
> shirt get their name on it, which means the list wasn't generated
> until the money was sent. The problem here is that in the past, the
> money went to one person, who compiled the names. We are considering
> ordering the shirt direct, so how do we compile a list of names?
> Putting the whole list subscription on there is one idea, but I think
> there are what, over 200 people subscribed?

400+, I was told a little while ago.

> Another option is to include anyone who votes for a shirt design.
> Since I am collecting the votes, I could also compile the names from
> that.

I'm still in favor of only putting on the names of people who actually buy a
shirt. I don't really see any problem with this, it worked okay the past few
years so why should we change it for this shirt?

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
At the bar down the Adios Lounge.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- + --+--
Version 3.1: | Incubated into
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N | the First Church of
o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ | the Sqooshy Ball
tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y? | 21 May 1998
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ + --+--
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 11:43:37 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: Re: [ADMIN] List Reset: Final.
In-Reply-To: <000201bd89fa$89964d40$7eaa8bcf@****>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

Katt Freyson said on 1:36/28 May 98,...

> For those, perhaps myself included, who were too silly, ignorant, or
> whatever, to recall them, could you post the information on how to
> resubscribe? I, for one, would appreciate it.

Subscribing to the lists is fully explained in the FAQ -- see my .sig for the
URL -- but because this is a special situation, here's the info:

Send an email saying

SUBSCRIBE SHADOWRN <YOUR NAME>

to

LISTSERV@********.ITRIBE.NET

and then follow any instructions mailed back to you.

You can put multiple subscription requests into one message if you want to
subscribe to more than one mailing list, for example NERPS, ShadowTK, and
so on -- just substitute "shadowrn" for the list name in the instructions
above.
BTW, ShadowGM runs on a different server so it won't be affected by iTribe's
lists being reset.

--
Gurth@******.nl, ShadowRN GridSec: Enforcer Division
The ShadowRN FAQ: http://coastnet.com/~dvixen/srnintro.html
Other GridSec members: David Buehrer <dbuehrer@******.carl.org>
Drekhead <drekhead@***.net>
Dvixen <on vacation>
List Administrator: Adam Jury <fro@***.ab.ca>
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 11:43:37 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: Re: Ingentization
In-Reply-To: <356C7B12.45B0@*********.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

Jett said on 16:44/27 May 98,...

> Here we go again...Would this have come up even if I DIDN'T do the (by
> now infamous, I'm sure) Sex and the SIngle Shadowrunner post? :P Anyway,
> that's a good question. IF a human woman gets pregnant by a troll, what
> kind of kid does she have? Does she deliver a troll child, a human
> child, or a human child that will goblinize later? Consider this more
> research...

That's answered by SRII, page 34 IIRC. Basically when a metahuman is
involved, the child will usually be metahuman as well (i.e. elf + human =
elf); with two metahumans, it's about 50/50 (elf + dwarf = elf or dwarf)
unless one of them is an ork or troll, in which case that metatype is most
likely (elf + ork = ork; ork + troll = ork or troll).

In your example, it'd most likely be a troll child, although I can see a lack of
space developing pretty fast before the kid is born...

After birth (which probably happens much too soon), I have a feeling this
child will grow up as a human and goblinize around age 12.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
At the bar down the Adios Lounge.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- + --+--
Version 3.1: | Incubated into
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N | the First Church of
o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ | the Sqooshy Ball
tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y? | 21 May 1998
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ + --+--
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 11:08:14 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Bull's a down and out.... Official...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

:)

Only joking, but that's what he said...
His computer needs a full reinstall and is 3 1/2" disk drive is knacked, so
he can't.... He's still reading though... (Just can't reply)

Or... To quote..

<Bull>
Anyways, can you guys do me a favor?

Let the lists know I'm down and out... I still read the mail, but right now
I can't really reply.

</Bull>
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 11:09:33 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Oooppsie... I did something bad...
In-Reply-To: <199805272247.PAA28053@****.kerch.com> from "Benjamin" at
May 27,
98 03:47:39 pm
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

And verily, did Benjamin hastily scribble thusly...
|
|Okay, since the list rejected my last two messages on this...
|
|Could somebody please sned me, in private email, the instrucions for
|removing myself from the list, because I accidentally deleted them
|since I singed on several years ago? And the SRCARD list too, if you
|haveit please.

E-mail listserv@********.itribe.net
Subject <none>
Body text: Help.

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 11:11:17 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: What's a megapulse?
In-Reply-To: <000601bd89c4$d18399e0$5a5211ac@********.mincom.oz.au> from
"Robert Watkins" at May 28, 98 09:11:45 am
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

And verily, did Robert Watkins hastily scribble thusly...
|(oh, and by using longword, you're displaying your computer tendencies, you
|know. But it's better than dword)

Hey? I'm a computer science honours student.
Of COURSE I'm showing my computer tendencies....

:)

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 11:18:42 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Apologies and hkit link.
In-Reply-To: <000301bd89e5$41a9b900$3daa8bcf@****> from "Katt Freyson" at
May
27, 98 11:03:54 pm
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

And verily, did Katt Freyson hastily scribble thusly...
| Many of the responses to your post I personally found MUCH more
|irritating than yours. Especially that multi-twac post. I thought this
|mailing list had Net security to handle events such as your post, but
|apparently that is not what they are here for.

It does. But som of us have been on the list too long, and old habits die
hard. (gridsec is still a little baby, only about 3 months old...)

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 11:33:20 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
In-Reply-To: <199805280942.LAA10706@*****.xs4all.nl> from "Gurth" at May
28,
98 11:43:37 am
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

And verily, did Gurth hastily scribble thusly...
|In your example, it'd most likely be a troll child, although I can see a lack of
|space developing pretty fast before the kid is born...

Not too sure about that...
I think troll babies are a similar size to human ones.
They just grow one hell of a lot faster once they are born.

Besides, I imagine the mothers body would say "I've had enough of this", and
labour would start early if the baby was bigger, making it a premature
birth. (Not really much of a threat to the child in a hospital, but if it's
SINless.... Hmmmm.)


--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 06:36:32 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: MC23 <mc23@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: [OT] Thelonious monster (was Re: Hijacking)
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

Once upon a time, Gurth wrote;

>Erik Jameson said on 17:47/27 May 98,...
>
>> > At the bar down the Adios Lounge.
>>
>> Where is that line from? Actually, this is the real reason I'm replying to
>> this. For some reason the only thing I can think of is a song by
>> Thelonious Monster on their "Beautiful Mess" album that's a duet with
Tom
>> Waits, but that's a very obscure reference from a band that never hit it
>> big (damn shame too...).
>
>You're hit it right on the head... It is from Adios Lounge, track #4 on
>that CD,
>right after "Body And Soul?" (best song on the album, IMHO). I think that
>makes
>you the only person I know (next to myself) who's heard of Thelonious
>Monster.
>Like you said, that's a damn shame...
>
>Back to the regularly-scheduled blathering now...

Not quite yet.

I think I saw Thelonious Monster open up for Fishbone and Red Hot
Chili Peppers show about 10 years ago. But that was my only exposure.

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

Ancient cultures believed that names held great power, personal names
more so and they were guarded very closely. To protect themselves, they
answered to another name, because if another discovered their real name,
it could be used against them.
History repeats itself.
Welcome to the Digital Age.
I am MC23
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 21:22:27 +1000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: NightRain <nightrain@***.BRISNET.ORG.AU>
Subject: Re: Hardsuits
In-Reply-To: <356B6AC4.3B4B2D97@************.com.br>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Shadowrun Discussion [mailto:SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET]On
> Behalf Of Ubiratan P. Alberton
> Sent: Wednesday, 27 May 1998 11:22
> To: SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET
> Subject: Re: Hardsuits

> I was an ACCIDENT! I toght NightRain's msg was
> private!!! This tough
> me to pay attentio to
> msg headers...

Oops. I must apologise as well. I made a boo-boo and sent my reply
to the list, when it was meant to go privately. Sorry about the
misunderstanding.

NightRain.

----------------------------------------------------------------------
| The universe is a big place, |
| and whatever happens, you will not be missed |
----------------------------------------------------------------------

http://nightrain.home.ml.org

EMAIL : nightrain@***.brisnet.org.au
: macey@***.brisnet.org.au
ICQ : 2587947
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 14:16:10 +0000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <runefo@***.uio.no>
From: Fade <runefo@***.UIO.NO>
Organization: The University of Oslo
Subject: Re: Hardsuits
In-Reply-To: <27476.199805262330@*****.teach.cs.keele.ac.uk>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

Here's my take on it.

Wolf Combat Armor

Body: 3 (Weighs about 300 kilos)
Armor: 15 (Slightly heavier than medium military armor).
Speed: Quickness or Reaction of rigger.
Acceleration: N.A.
Signature: 5

This armor is, rules - wise, a vehicle-armor hybrid. It uses a bit of
the rules from each. The armor is designed to be used by both rigged
and normal infantry.

The rules that work as vehicles: The suit can only be targeted 'as a
vehicle' as a called shot, targeting subsystems. Targeting the
occupant works as vehicles as well, giving a +2 TN penalty.
Combat pool may not be used to resist damage, and if damaged, the
armor takes light damage as well. Control pool may be used to defend
both armor and wearer, while combat pool may, as with vehicles, be
used offensively. If the wearer is not rigged, combat pool may be
used defensively, but is halved.

The armor is an smart-metal exoskeleton with anemonic
pieso-musculature beneath the armor. (sp?). This musculature works
either by feedback pressure from the wearer's limbs, or else is
controlled in tandem with the wearer's body through a VCR. Feedback
control, while fast, does not confer any speed bonuses, while control
through a VCR does. (Using reaction instead of Quickness for base
speed.). Tandem control through a datajack may use whichever is
higher, does not confer a control pool, but does not halve combat
pool. The armor has an 'innate' strength of 9. Final strength is
calculated as for layered armor - the highest of wearer's and the
armor, add half the lowest.

Weapon support:
The armor's right hand is gyro-stabilized with 4 points of recoil
compensation in addition to whatever recoil compensation afforded
through strength and weapon mods. It may handle modified vehicle -
class weapons as heavy weapons. The suit has rating 6 sensors, which
may be used for sensor targeting if the weapon has an appropriate
modification.

Mobility support:
The armor has slightly elongated lower arms and lower legs, giving it
a predatory look. It uses the extra muscle power and the increased
leverage for an additional running multiplier.
It has a one - shot rocket pack mounted on the suit's back, which may
effectively quadruple jumping distance. The increased muscle
power increases the quickness by 50% in regard to
jumps. Calculate range and height as for regular jumps: (((modified
strength+(quickness(or reaction)*1.5)) - (Body+armor's body))*4.
(For a physically excellent specimen, that means jumps of almost 80
meters' length, or 40 meters high.). Redundancy systems makes sure
the armor maintains functionality even if it should take severe
damage. (6 pts damage comp.).


Impact support:
The armor uses LBA to oxygenate the user, as well as provide
unparallelled shock absorption. The armor provides additional 6
points of impact armor against collisions. (Same as armored
seating, IIRC). The armor should be able to survive unhurt through
one of its own boosted jumps, but might require athletics test.
(Check jump jacks for additional ideas.).

Maintenance:
The armor requires ammonium for its internal power supply and
musculature, as well as battery packs. Damage is not easily repaired,
as the musculature is fairly complex, and unless superficial can only
be repaired at the construction facility for now.

Other notes:
The LBA system makes the armor useable in extremely hostile
environments, and may sustain the wearer for about two days before
requiring divesting. It can support the user to almost any depth, as
well as in space, with either none or very minor modifications.
Investing in the armor is somewhat painful, as catheters and
biomonitors are inserted, but once done is painless.

The system has an autopilot robot brain which alerts the user, as
well as enables some overwatch for when the user is less alert.
(Asleep.). It can also operate any weapons.

Note that it can override the user at will, and operate the armor on
its own, if so is required. (But is then effectively only a very
expensive drone).

Its main uses are not well defined - it was originally designed as an
urban combat armor, but upon design requests from the 'Fire Brigade'
it was modified to be effective in extreme environments, for instance
Finnish Saunas, etc. etc.


--
Fade

And the Prince of Lies said:
"To reign is worth ambition, though in Hell:
Better to reign in hell than to serve in heaven."
-John Milton, Paradise Lost
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 14:16:10 +0000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <runefo@***.uio.no>
From: Fade <runefo@***.UIO.NO>
Organization: The University of Oslo
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
In-Reply-To: <13065.199805271036@******.teach.cs.keele.ac.uk>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

*SNIP 800MHZ chip by Intel year 2000*

This is on schedule with expected speed growth - about 60% P.A.
That means other server/heavy duty chips will be in the 2.5GHZ
range, same with experimental versions of the same chip.
(Intel ran a pentium chip at 600MHZ two years ago, water cooled.).

Memory and I/O is allready a bigger bottleneck to computing speed
than the chip's MHZ rating, and it increases at a slovenly 7% P.A.
(As Ereskanti pointed out, it's not the chips that keeps the Matrix
in the future, it's the WAN's.. and interface, of course.).

As for the 2K 'bug' (It's an undocumented feature! :) it should not
be a problem for any newer applications - an easy way to check wether
you'll be affected is to play around with the system clock. The most
likely errors is for programs where you supply only the last two
digits of the year - 98, 99, etc - and considers 00 as 'earlier' than
99. It's not system - halting errors, and should be possible to work
around, but it might be annoying and lead to extra work... ). Most of
the system problems should be fixable by a patch - database updating
might be a problem, depending on who made the base.

That's my take on it.
--
Fade

And the Prince of Lies said:
"To reign is worth ambition, though in Hell:
Better to reign in hell than to serve in heaven."
-John Milton, Paradise Lost
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 09:21:45 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Lehlan Decker <decker@****.FSU.EDU>
Subject: Re: New Books...
In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.16.19980527124055.091792a2@****.fbiz.com> from "Erik
Jameson" at May 27, 98 04:57:24 pm
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

>
> At 02:10 PM 5/27/98 -0500, you wrote:
> >This might be old news, but amazon has a listing for New Seattle,
> >including Cover Art (very cool), due out in July, 176 pages.
> >There is also a picture of Smugglers haven, either though its due
> >date is May 98. :)
>
> I went and took a look at that. Everything coming out of FASA indicates
> that New Seattle will be out after SR3, and that's August. So I don't
> start thinking New Seattle will be out in July or August.
>
> And looking at the "cover" for New Seattle it looks an awful lot like a
> "placeholder" cover, artwork used to show off the book until the real cover
> is done. At least *I* think so.
>
> And I like I said before, you can probably start bugging your local game
> store next Tuesday for Smuggler's Havens.
>
> Don't know where Amazon got their info from, but it looks bad to me.
>
I figured as much. But hey, I can always dream can't I. :)


--
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Lehlan Decker 644-4534 Systems Development
decker@****.fsu.edu http://www.scri.fsu.edu/~decker
--------------------------------------------------------------------
The universe doesn't have laws, it has habits. And habits can be broken.
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 07:40:34 -0600
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: David Buehrer <dbuehrer@******.CARL.ORG>
Subject: Re: Oooppsie... I did something bad...
In-Reply-To: <199805281010.EAA05967@******.carl.org> from "Spike" at May
28,
98 11:09:33 am
Content-Type: text

Spike wrote:
/
/ And verily, did Benjamin hastily scribble thusly...
/ |
/ |Okay, since the list rejected my last two messages on this...
/ |
/ |Could somebody please sned me, in private email, the instrucions for
^^^^^^^^^^^^^
/ |removing myself from the list, because I accidentally deleted them
/ |since I singed on several years ago? And the SRCARD list too, if you
/ |haveit please.
/
/ E-mail listserv@********.itribe.net
/ Subject <none>
/ Body text: Help.

Spike, Spike, spike, spike... <EG>

Step up to the line and stand at attention.




th
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thwapthwapthwpt
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-David
--
"If I told you, then I'd have to pull a Shadowrun against you. Sorry."
--
email: dbuehrer@******.carl.org
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/1068/homepage.htm
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 07:44:04 -0600
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: David Buehrer <dbuehrer@******.CARL.ORG>
Subject: Re: More T-Shirt Info (Mr. Imbriaco please)
In-Reply-To: <199805280058.SAA29263@******.carl.org> from "Tim Kerby" at
May
27, 98 08:57:45 pm
Content-Type: text

Tim Kerby wrote:
/
/ > Regardless of what is going on, and which shirt offer we use (this one or
/ > Quicksilvers), get us a list of names here folks.
/
/ Ok, here's a problem. In the past, the list of names was almost the
/ last thing that was done, because only those that actually ordered a
/ shirt get their name on it, which means the list wasn't generated
/ until the money was sent. The problem here is that in the past, the
/ money went to one person, who compiled the names. We are considering
/ ordering the shirt direct, so how do we compile a list of names?
/ Putting the whole list subscription on there is one idea, but I think
/ there are what, over 200 people subscribed?
/ Another option is to include anyone who votes for a shirt design.
/ Since I am collecting the votes, I could also compile the names from
/ that.

I'd suggest setting a deadline for getting your T-shirt order in to
the printers to have your name included on the back. Give the
printer instructions to create the back with all the names that they
have received by that date, and that's the back of the shirt.

-David
--
"If I told you, then I'd have to pull a Shadowrun against you. Sorry."
--
email: dbuehrer@******.carl.org
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/1068/homepage.htm
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 09:48:16 +0000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Quentin Milton <taslehof@*****.INTERNETLAND.NET>
Subject: I'm back
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

ok, after a few days, a long trip, an upgrade, and getting rid of a
virus, I'm back.......now I just have to replace my mp3s.......

Pantherr
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 10:04:35 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: BigDaddy <bigdaddy@*****.COM>
Organization: @**** Network
Subject: Re: Ingentization
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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> If I were in 205x, I'd probably want to be a mage OR a decker... Hey,
> If I live enough
> I can become FastJack! >)
>
> Bira

hmmmm, id either have to go with
a.) human decker or shaman ( i luv the totems and tribal stuff, check
out my room some time) by the way is there any oriental shamans, such as
summoning foo monsters or asian critters(if there are any!)

b.) troll sam (life expentancy=2 days. heehehe) never cross an armed
troll with a panther assualt rifle mounted to a viking ;)


--
Napalm Sticks to Kidz,
BigDaddy
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 15:02:36 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Oooppsie... I did something bad...
In-Reply-To: <199805281340.HAA08449@******.carl.org> from "David Buehrer"
at
May 28, 98 07:40:34 am
MIME-Version: 1.0
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And verily, did David Buehrer hastily scribble thusly...
|Spike, Spike, spike, spike... <EG>
|
|Step up to the line and stand at attention.

1> Ooops.
2> Better to send it to the list in these circumstances to prevent everyone
else from asking the same question....

(It does, after all, contain resub info as well as unsub info...)

<Snip carp>
HA! Missed me.
(I'm in the old peoples resort sitting under a carp-proof parasol.)
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 10:03:07 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Tim Kerby <drekhead@***.NET>
Subject: Re: I'm back
In-Reply-To: <199805281339.IAA13439@*****.internetland.net>

On 28 May 98, at 9:48, Quentin Milton wrote:

> ok, after a few days, a long trip, an upgrade, and getting rid of a
> virus, I'm back.......now I just have to replace my mp3s.......

Well, welcome back. Your just in time to get purged. The list is
being reset Saturday. So enjoy your couple of days!! :)

--


=================================================================
- Tim Kerby - drekhead@***.net - ICQ-UIN 2883757 -
-----------------------------------------------------------------
"Reality is the only obstacle to happiness." - Unknown
=================================================================
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 15:04:49 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: I'm back
In-Reply-To: <199805281339.IAA13439@*****.internetland.net> from "Quentin
Milton" at May 28, 98 09:48:16 am
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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And verily, did Quentin Milton hastily scribble thusly...
|
|ok, after a few days, a long trip, an upgrade, and getting rid of a
|virus, I'm back.......now I just have to replace my mp3s.......

Back just in time for the list clean-up and mass unsubbing....
Bad timing there...

:)

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 08:53:31 -0600
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: David Buehrer <dbuehrer@******.CARL.ORG>
Subject: Re: Oooppsie... I did something bad...
In-Reply-To: <199805281405.IAA09054@******.carl.org> from "Spike" at May
28,
98 03:02:36 pm
Content-Type: text

Spike wrote:
/
/ And verily, did David Buehrer hastily scribble thusly...
/ |Spike, Spike, spike, spike... <EG>
/ |
/ |Step up to the line and stand at attention.
/
/ 1> Ooops.

Apology accepted ;)

/ 2> Better to send it to the list in these circumstances to prevent everyone
/ else from asking the same question....
/
/ (It does, after all, contain resub info as well as unsub info...)

Ah, but I assume that the list members are intelligent individuals and
have either a) saved the latest issue of the FAQ or b) have saved the
URL for the FAQ, and know how to query the listserv for help :)

/ <Snip carp>
/ HA! Missed me.
/ (I'm in the old peoples' resort sitting under a carp-proof parasol.)

Now, if only you had thought to put a carp-proof straw in your drink...

<who's amazed at how easy it is to puree a 1000 year old carp, and a
touch of peanut butter, in a blender>

:):):):)

-David
--
"If I told you, then I'd have to pull a Shadowrun against you. Sorry."
--
email: dbuehrer@******.carl.org
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/1068/homepage.htm
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 10:39:53 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: If I was Awake... (Was Ingentization)

On Thu, 28 May 1998 10:04:35 -0400 BigDaddy <bigdaddy@*****.COM> writes:
>> If I were in 205x, I'd probably want to be a mage OR a decker...
Hey,
>> If I live enough I can become FastJack! >)
>>
>> Bira
>
>hmmmm, id either have to go with
>a.) human decker or shaman ( i luv the totems and tribal stuff, check
>out my room some time) by the way is there any oriental shamans, such as
>summoning foo monsters or asian critters(if there are any!)
>
>b.) troll sam (life expentancy=2 days. heehehe) never cross an armed
>troll with a panther assualt rifle mounted to a viking ;)
>
>
>--
> Napalm Sticks to Kidz,
> BigDaddy

I /have/ to be a decker ;) if the Otaku won't take me then just the
average decker :) Not being one to commit myself to one thing, I'd Ilso
prolly be a a PhysAd or if the Awakening doesn't find me Magically
Active, a rigger/samurai (for a total of decker/rigger/samurai :) ... no
obvious cyber though ... maybe Synaptic Accelerators + VCR 1 or 2,
Smartlink + Encephalon + Cerebral booster :) If I turned out to be a
(non-physical) Adept or full blown mage, I'd be Hermetic (with lotsa fire
elementals ... fire! fire! henh-heh fire! ;)

P.S.
1) I understand that mages have problems in the matrix (but nobody'll
`splain it to me or tell me where that's from) ... what about PhysAds
without Astral Perception?

2) Does anybody give someone with Mnemonic Enhancers any special
benifits? (aside from the extra dice.) like photographic memory or such?

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 12:01:24 +0000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Comments: Authenticated sender is <bxb24@**.opp.psu.edu>
From: Brett Borger <bxb121@***.EDU>
Subject: Re: Technobabel Teaser Q
In-Reply-To: <000c01bd89f5$6321e340$5a5211ac@********.mincom.oz.au>
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> No, that's not the one I'm thinking of. The one I'm thinking of has the main
> character meet FJ in the Matrix. FJ uses a persona that is dressed in army
> fatigues, and the resolution is particularly high.
>
> Damn, why can't I remember which book it is?

Arg. I know what you're talking about....the main character's chic
had died in a bug hunt. Fastjack was a buddy of his trying to snap
him out of it. It had to be Out of the Shadows.

-=SwiftOne=-
Brett Borger
SwiftOne@***.edu
AAP Techie
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 12:25:45 +0000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Quentin Milton <taslehof@*****.INTERNETLAND.NET>
Subject: Re: If I was Awake... (Was Ingentization)
In-Reply-To: <19980528.104118.4470.3.dghost@****.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

> >> If I were in 205x, I'd probably want to be a mage OR a decker...

I'd be a physad (or *maybe* a physmage), plain and simple :)

Pantherr
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 12:05:44 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Character Background Help

On Wed, 27 May 1998 22:21:39 -0700 GRANITE <granite@**.NET> writes:
>> The problem is the shaper's bestial nature ... how could she be an
>> undercover op with a bestial nature ... possible solutions:

>A Bestial nature doesn't mean that a SS takes a crap wherever it is
>and the need hits..Just as any dog can be well behaved in most every
>situation sometimes the urge will strike and they just cannot keep
>out of the trash..Or something more like they are more likely to go
>overboard when in hand to hand combat..Afterall a wolf or bear
>doesn't fight for fun they fight for life..

Actually, Yah know what? looking at the totem descripts might be
helpful... the Totems are based on the animal's characteristics so
checking them out might be good for insight ... unfortunately there is no
canon Tiger Totem (AFAIK) would Jaguar be similar?

Also, the way I saw the bestial nature interfering with undercover ops is
while undercover, you usually want to be inconspicuous and it's kinda
hard to that when ya shred the first twerp that steps on your feet ...
(I'm exagerating, but hopefully you get my point ...) ... of course that
depends on where you're going undercover ... I had a corp in mind ... :)

>> 1) brainwashing overrode the bestial nature pay x build points to get
rid
>> of the bestial nature

>Not if I were the GM..A bestial nature would be genetic not something
>you can simply get rid of..THink more like Wolverine from the
>X-men..THe comics not the cartoon..

Yeah, I agree, though Wolverine isn't really a good example ... Marvel
makes his abilities vary too much ;) However I had in mind something
similar to Wolvie after he went feral (although I hadn't thought of it in
those terms :)

>> 3) implanted cyberware controllers (I know alot of people don't allow
>> cyberware in chars/critters with regen, but this is a nifty solution
...
>> someone in Aztechnology has a little box that control her actions ...)

>Not a lot of people..the rules..Now if you want to create a house
>rule..go for it..But leave me out of any discusion about it..

I know ... that statement was refferring to that there are some people
allow cyber but AFAIK, most of the list members don't go for it :) ...
btw, I DID create a house rule and think I balanced it out but nobody
will tell me one way or another ... is this a touchy issue? (I notice you
seem to want to stay away from it :)

>Now if you want something to calm the critter down..try mood altering
>drugs..Make them very adictive..I personally don't like uing drugs in
>my game..but this could be an easy answer for you..This would also
>mesh better with the brainwashing stuff..make the drug long lasting
>and now that the SS finds itself away from the source you have
>withdrawl problems to contend with as well...
>--------------------------------GRANITE
<SNIP> Sig>

hmmm... drugs would have a very different results than cyber ... cyber
you could have the push of the button control ... those that are only
under control because they're under the effects of drugs tend to be
sluggish (AFAIK/IMO) ... Also the Azzies would prolly use something with
lethal withdrawl effects ...

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
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=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 12:22:38 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Wraith <wraith@************.COM>
Subject: Re: Technobabel Teaser Q
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
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-----Original Message-----


> No, that's not the one I'm thinking of. The one I'm thinking of has the
main
> character meet FJ in the Matrix. FJ uses a persona that is dressed in army
> fatigues, and the resolution is particularly high.
>
> Damn, why can't I remember which book it is?

Arg. I know what you're talking about....the main character's chic
had died in a bug hunt. Fastjack was a buddy of his trying to snap
him out of it. It had to be Out of the Shadows.

Hmm, I know this one too :) I believe it might have been one of the Short
Stories with Brandon Cross. Ahh, here it is "Into the Shadows" edited by
Jordan K. Weisman. The short story is "Plague of Demons" by Tom Dowd.

The other one that's been kicked around is from "Night's Pawn" where Chase
meets goes to the Nexus and meets Bash and Shiva. FJ later appears as
matrix oversight.

Wraith
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 13:07:34 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "David R. Lowe" <david@******.COM>
Subject: Re: [OT] Thelonious monster (was Re: Hijacking)
In-Reply-To: <199805281038.GAA02948@******.mindspring.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 10:36 AM -0000 5/28/98, MC23 wrote:

>
> I think I saw Thelonious Monster open up for Fishbone and Red Hot
>Chili Peppers show about 10 years ago. But that was my only exposure.
>

That wasn't at the Warfield in San Franciscio, was it? I think I was at
that show.

D.


David R. Lowe
Photography/Digital Imaging
(510) 654-5111
dlowe@****.com
http://www.lowephoto.com

"The avalanche has begun. It's too late for the pebbles to vote."
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 20:10:18 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Gurth <gurth@******.NL>
Organization: Plastic Warriors
Subject: Re: If I was Awake... (Was Ingentization)
In-Reply-To: <19980528.104118.4470.3.dghost@****.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

Alfredo B Alves said on 10:39/28 May 98,...

> P.S.
> 1) I understand that mages have problems in the matrix (but nobody'll
> `splain it to me or tell me where that's from) ... what about PhysAds
> without Astral Perception?

This is from the original Virtual Realities, where as an optional
rule, magicians would add either their Magic Attribute or their
Sorcery Skill to the TN of any test made in the Matrix. The
reasoning behind it was the difference in worldview between
deckers and magicians which caused magicians to experience
difficulties when trying to deck. As this rule didn't re-appear in
VR 2.0, it's generally assumed FASA decided to remove it for
some reason or other.

> 2) Does anybody give someone with Mnemonic Enhancers any special
> benifits? (aside from the extra dice.) like photographic memory or such?

I just use the rules in Shadowtech (in the mnemonic enhancer
section) when characters need to remember something
important, and apply the mods from the ME for that. Photographic
memory, no -- you need the edge with the same name for that in
my game.

--
Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html - UIN5044116
Your actions speak so loud I can't hear a word you're saying.
-> NERPS Project Leader * ShadowRN GridSec * Unofficial Shadowrun Guru <-
-> The Plastic Warriors Page: http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/plastic.html <-
-> The New Character Mortuary: http://www.electricferret.com/mortuary/ <-

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- + --+--
Version 3.1: | Incubated into
GAT/! d-(dpu) s:- !a>? C+(++)@ U P L E? W(++) N | the First Church of
o? K- w+ O V? PS+ PE Y PGP- t(+) 5++ X++ R+++>$ | the Sqooshy Ball
tv+(++) b++@ DI? D+ G(++) e h! !r(---) y? | 21 May 1998
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ + --+--
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 13:23:52 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Re: If I was Awake... (Was Ingentization)

On Thu, 28 May 1998 20:10:18 +0100 Gurth <gurth@******.NL> writes:
>Alfredo B Alves said on 10:39/28 May 98,...
>> P.S.
>> 1) I understand that mages have problems in the matrix (but nobody'll
>> `splain it to me or tell me where that's from) ... what about PhysAds
>> without Astral Perception?

>This is from the original Virtual Realities, where as an optional
>rule, magicians would add either their Magic Attribute or their
>Sorcery Skill to the TN of any test made in the Matrix. The
>reasoning behind it was the difference in worldview between
>deckers and magicians which caused magicians to experience
>difficulties when trying to deck. As this rule didn't re-appear in
>VR 2.0, it's generally assumed FASA decided to remove it for
>some reason or other.

<SNIP Querry number 2>
>
>--
>Gurth@******.nl - http://www.xs4all.nl/~gurth/index.html -
<SNIP Sig>

Danke Gurth, That was driving me bonkers when someone would talk about
that an wouldn't explain (except perhaps with "that's the rules") ... I
wish FASA had stated something explicity somewhere, especially
considering there were previous rules that penalized mages in the Matrix
:( ... a good place would have been the BBB section on changes to
previous SBs ... :(

BTW, Gurth is there anything (about SR) you /Don't/ know? ;)

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
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Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 14:47:42 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: [OT] Thelonious monster (was Re: Hijacking)
In-Reply-To: <v04003a00b192f1df0b63@[209.108.45.166]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 01:07 PM 5/28/98 -0500, you wrote:
>At 10:36 AM -0000 5/28/98, MC23 wrote:
>
>>
>> I think I saw Thelonious Monster open up for Fishbone and Red Hot
>>Chili Peppers show about 10 years ago. But that was my only exposure.
>>
>
>That wasn't at the Warfield in San Franciscio, was it? I think I was at
>that show.

Considering where the region where MC23 lives, I would doubt.

But those three bands came up together, out of LA and did a lot of shows
together. For a while, about 10 years ago, before the Peppers got huge,
those three bands plus a few more, were doing shows together in LA about
once a month.

Too bad I was too young and too broke to go see them at the time...

Anyway, back to SR, specifically SR1. Did anyone out there actually use
the "Rocker" archetype? Was it just me or was that the lamest possible PC
to take on a shadowrun? Sure, it might work for CP2020, but Shadowrun?

Erik J.


Resepected Elders Relaxation Resort, President of Operations
and Director of Activities

"Hey, how about a game of first edition using only the Blue Book?"
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 12:57:44 -0600
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: JD <germany@*****************.COM>
Subject: Re: [OT] Thelonious monster (was Re: Hijacking)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

>Anyway, back to SR, specifically SR1. Did anyone out there actually
use
>the "Rocker" archetype? Was it just me or was that the lamest possible
PC
>to take on a shadowrun? Sure, it might work for CP2020, but Shadowrun?
>
>Erik J.
>


I did once, but it wasn't really a useful character. He was there just
for flavor. I played a spoiled brat who caused lots of trouble. The
background was a rich kid looking for fun on the wild side. He died
quickly -- my choice.

Jon Doud
germany@*****************.com
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 15:34:24 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: MC23 <mc23@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: [OT] Thelonious monster (was Re: Hijacking)
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

Once upon a time, Erik Jameson wrote;

>>> I think I saw Thelonious Monster open up for Fishbone and Red Hot
>>>Chili Peppers show about 10 years ago. But that was my only exposure.
>>>
>>
>>That wasn't at the Warfield in San Franciscio, was it? I think I was at
>>that show.
>
>Considering where the region where MC23 lives, I would doubt.

Yep, except for one year in Raleigh, I've been a Charlotte boy my
whole life. Vacationed a lot around New Bedford as a small child but I
digress. The club here was the late Park Elevator club back when it was
in the old Park Elevator Building. Too bad the building burned down. This
town doesn't have too many historical sites left. Tear down, build up and
sprawl out (mostly sprawl out).

>Anyway, back to SR, specifically SR1. Did anyone out there actually use
>the "Rocker" archetype? Was it just me or was that the lamest possible PC
>to take on a shadowrun? Sure, it might work for CP2020, but Shadowrun?

Only considered it in conjunction with being a magicians but never
actually seen one played.

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

Ancient cultures believed that names held great power, personal names
more so and they were guarded very closely. To protect themselves, they
answered to another name, because if another discovered their real name,
it could be used against them.
History repeats itself.
Welcome to the Digital Age.
I am MC23
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 10:29:13 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: rabiola <rabiola@**.NETCOM.COM>
Subject: Re: More T-Shirt Info (Mr. Imbriaco please)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

>Regardless of what is going on, and which shirt offer we use (this one
or
>Quicksilvers), get us a list of names here folks.
>
>As for names to use on the list. As the list is about to be subjected
to a
>major purging and reinvention here soon, could I or Quicksilver or
whomever
>-please- have a copy of the listmembers when such a time comes sent
directly
>to us?
>


OK, I am in for a shirt. Also, I love the idea of coordinating with the
color of the SRIII book if we can find out the color scheme.

Tony Rabiola rabiola@**.netcom.com
Fourth and Sixth World Adept
Still working on the Fifth...
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 15:45:23 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: MC23 <mc23@**********.COM>
Subject: Re: If I was Awake... (Was Ingentization)
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

Once upon a time, Alfredo B Alves wrote;

>Danke Gurth, That was driving me bonkers when someone would talk about
>that an wouldn't explain (except perhaps with "that's the rules") ... I
>wish FASA had stated something explicity somewhere, especially
>considering there were previous rules that penalized mages in the Matrix
>:( ... a good place would have been the BBB section on changes to
>previous SBs ... :(

SR3 or the next big book O' magic will address it if it still exists
under 3rd edition. Steve asked the list a long time ago but he's kept his
decision to himself so far.

>BTW, Gurth is there anything (about SR) you /Don't/ know? ;)

At one time it was Grimoire 1st edition. I don't know if he has
yet tracked down a copy for his collection.

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

Ancient cultures believed that names held great power, personal names
more so and they were guarded very closely. To protect themselves, they
answered to another name, because if another discovered their real name,
it could be used against them.
History repeats itself.
Welcome to the Digital Age.
I am MC23
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 16:07:45 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Grahamdrew <grahamdrew@***.NET>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

> Personally, I don't care. Y2K doesn't bother me one bit - sure, one or
> two of my electronic appliances may stop working, but there's usually
> a feature to set the date...
>

<rant>
I whole heatedly agree. I don't know if there is some huge
earth-shaking concept I'm missing here but WHY IS THIS SUCH A BIG
PROBELM!?

Ok, so my computer thinks it's 1AD, I'm not sur about you guys but I
have one of those rip-off 365 days of duct tape a year calenders, I
don't know if I've ever actually checked the date on my computer...

I can see a few small problems with acounting records and such, but
nothing that would cause a "crash," and NOWHERE near the kind of
problems to define it as a virus (who ever coined that term for Y2K
should take some check thier medication)

CPUs don't deal with time and date anyway, that's a BIOS or an OS
function based on the kind of scomputer your looking at. A little
software patch or flash BIOS upgrade and your cleared, no problem.

Oh yea, and I wouldn't expect you would have trouble with most
apliances, as they don't usually keep track of the date, just time (my
microwave and oven don't, and my VCR is still flashing 12:00 12:00
12:00)

</rant>
--
DISCLAIMER: All grammatical and spelling errors are inserted
deliberately to test the software I am developing. In fact,
that is the only reason I am posting. Yeah, that's the ticket!
All my postings are just test data! Yeah!!
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Maze/1673/
=========================================================================
Date: Wed, 27 May 1998 17:20:13 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: John Penta <johndevil@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Ingentization

On Tue, 26 May 1998 19:02:11 -0400 Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM> writes:
>At 05:08 PM 5/26/98 -0500, Wyrmy wrote:
><snipped Wafflemeister's UGE story>
>
>>Well, I happen to be turning into an ork.Wierd HuH?I'm growing 2 new
>>teeth in the front of my mouth in the shape of fangs, and I have an
>>increased hunger for meat.Perfectly normal Ork :^).
>
>I dunno there Wyrmy, that could just be puberty hitting you upside the
>head...
Nope. That ain't hormones. If it was, then *why* haven't *I* started to
grow fangs? I'm already a carnivore.:) Though...puberty hits alla us
upside the head. Wyrmy just undergoes UGE instead of simple growing up.:)

John

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 14:22:29 -0600
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Adam J <fro@***.AB.CA>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
In-Reply-To: <356DC411.4524@***.net>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 16:07 28/05/98 -0400, you wrote:

><rant>
>I whole heatedly agree. I don't know if there is some huge
>earth-shaking concept I'm missing here but WHY IS THIS SUCH A BIG
>PROBELM!?

ERr... let's say your bank suddenly decides it's 1900 all over again.
Whoops! You don't exist then! Whoops! All your money in the bank is gone!

Whoops! Your house belongs to some guy that's been dead for 50 years.
Whoop! Your employer has no record of ever paying you, you can't claim your
tax returns!

I could go on and on -- your social insurance number, health care, etc,
etc, etc.

A bios upgrade won't do jack for a 20 year old program written in COBOL
that's passed through 3 generations of IT managers, all of whom have a
decreasing amount of skill in COBOL and more in Solitaire and WWW surfing.

It probably won't be as big as the media makes it out to be -- but it is a
problem.

-Adam J
Who remembers "Michoangelo"
-
http://www.interware.it/users/adamj \ fro@***.ab.ca \ ICQ# 2350330
ShadowRN Assistant Fearless Leader \ FreeRPG Webring \ TSS Productions
The Shadowrun Supplemental \ SR Archive Co-Maintainer \ RPGA Reviwer
"So Marilyn Manson is a criticism of gimmickry while being itself a gimmick."
--- Marilyn Manson
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 21:23:55 +0100
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Spike <u5a77@*****.CS.KEELE.AC.UK>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
In-Reply-To: <356DC411.4524@***.net> from "Grahamdrew" at May 28,
98 04:07:45 pm
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

And verily, did Grahamdrew hastily scribble thusly...
|Ok, so my computer thinks it's 1AD,

1900 actually.

One small problem with old BIOSes is the datestamp on files however.
Sometimes, the computer will look for the most recent file to use,
(especially if you're using a C compiler or something like that), and when
the date clocks over, all your new files will suddenly appear to be 100
years old...

:)

Not a problem for me. I deliberately speeded up my system clock once, just
to see how far it'd go before resetting, and I believe the date was
somewhere about 2036(ish). Then it reset to 1972.
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|u5a77@*****.cs.keele.ac.uk| Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| | graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
|Andrew Halliwell | operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
|Principal Subjects in:- |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company, that|
|Comp Sci & Electronics | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
|GCv3.1 GCS/EL>$ d---(dpu) s+/- a- C++ U N++ o+ K- w-- M+/++ PS+++ PE- Y t+ |
|5++ X+/++ R+ tv+ b+ D G e>PhD h/h+ !r! !y-|I can't say F**K either now! :( |
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 16:25:26 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: John Penta <johndevil@****.COM>
Subject: [ShadowRN] Re: [ADMIN] List Reset: Final.

Could ya resub me? my email access is limited, mostly cuz I share a line
with my brother...He's 16, and....well, he has a right to the phone, and
hence the net, on demand, at basically anytime, enforced by his massive
advantage in strength over me. Please, resub me. so I don't become a red
paste.:(

Thanks,
John

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 16:49:53 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Grahamdrew <grahamdrew@***.NET>
Subject: Human inhabitation by an ally spirit
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

> The Grimmy states that you can use a human host, but not a sentient host

Actually, this is wierd. I was reading the Grimore his morning and this
is what it says. Everybody, pull out your grimores and follow along...

page 67, right collumn, first paragraph

"The magician can provide an animal as well as a human host..."

ok, says you can use a human, next sentence:

"Paranatural animals are too magically powerful to be used as host, as
are sapient beings (such as people)"

umm, you can use humans but you can use people, that aplies to one of my
biology teachers but...

does this mean you can't use magically active people, or just full
magicians, or what?
--
DISCLAIMER: All grammatical and spelling errors are inserted
deliberately to test the software I am developing. In fact,
that is the only reason I am posting. Yeah, that's the ticket!
All my postings are just test data! Yeah!!
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Maze/1673/
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 16:50:41 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Mike Bobroff <Airwasp@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Hardsuits
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/28/98 12:17:11 PM !!!First Boot!!!, runefo@***.UIO.NO
writes:

> Wolf Combat Armor
>
> Body: 3 (Weighs about 300 kilos)
> Armor: 15 (Slightly heavier than medium military armor).
> Speed: Quickness or Reaction of rigger.
> Acceleration: N.A.
> Signature: 5

I take it this is something from R2 ? Or something cooked up using the RBB ?"

Mike
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 16:03:24 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "David R. Lowe" <david@******.COM>
Subject: Re: [Back OnT] Rocker Archtype
In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.16.19980528112702.1577303e@****.fbiz.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 6:47 PM -0000 5/28/98, Erik Jameson wrote:

>Anyway, back to SR, specifically SR1. Did anyone out there actually use
>the "Rocker" archetype? Was it just me or was that the lamest possible PC
>to take on a shadowrun? Sure, it might work for CP2020, but Shadowrun?
>

I even thought it sucked for CP2020. We have a character in our game who
has sort of turned into a rocker. Her budding music career has spawned a
few adventures and has allowed me to get the Yaks involved in her life.
Such fun.

D.

David R. Lowe
Photography/Digital Imaging
(510) 654-5111
dlowe@****.com
http://www.lowephoto.com

"The avalanche has begun. It's too late for the pebbles to vote."
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 17:07:58 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Phil Levis <pal@**.BROWN.EDU>
Subject: VR 2.0
In-Reply-To: <356DC411.4524@***.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Something tells me that this was discussed a long time ago, but I'd like
to hear the thoughts of the present denizens of the list.

In my opinion, Virtual Realities 2.0 is an excellent book; the rules and
systems described are robust and detailed, and the wealth of information
provided allows for campaigns set entirely within the Matrix, in which
every character is a decker.

One aspect of the book bothers me, however: the methods by which deckers
obtain their programs. Either they buy them, or they write them. Writing
them takes excessive amounts of time: the example given of a decker with a
computer skill of 8 (damn good) taking a base time of 128 days to write an
Attack-8S program. Buying them is extremely expensive: Hacker House sells
computer programs for three million nuyen. That Attack-8S could be sold
for 128,000 nuyen. That's a pretty amazing living, 1000 nuyen a day.

Both of these systems seem at odds with one of the aspects of deckers
which I have always thought to be important: the idea that deckers write
their own programs on a regular basis, indeed, use their own programs
almost exclusively.

Given good programming techniques, it seems reasonable to me that one
should be able to 'upgrade' existing programs that you own. For example,
one might buy an Attack-6M utility from some software house, hack it for a
while, upgrading it to Attack-8M, use it a bit, then hack it some more to
add DINAB capability. Eventually, the program will need an overhaul as the
additions begin to tax the design of the original program, but it I find
it quite reasonable that competent deckers should be able to write
programs which are not utterly from scratch.

I've been working on a rules system to allow this, but I'm wondering what
people on the list feel should be important considerations. For example,
when should upgrading a program be a losing proposition as opposed to
rewriting from scratch? Which options should be the most difficult to add?
For example, transforming a one-shot program into a full utility should be
very difficult; the one-shot option has a tremendous amount of
optimization and little tricks which allow it to fit in the smaller memory
space. Additionally, if it were not difficult, software houses couldn't
offer one-shot test programs. Upgrading a program to have an Area option
should be much more difficult than upgrading the Area to a higher rating.

Thoughts?

Phil
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 16:07:57 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "David R. Lowe" <david@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Human inhabitation by an ally spirit
In-Reply-To: <356DCDF1.40D3@***.net>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

At 8:49 PM -0000 5/28/98, Grahamdrew wrote:
>> The Grimmy states that you can use a human host, but not a sentient host
>
>Actually, this is wierd. I was reading the Grimore his morning and this
>is what it says. Everybody, pull out your grimores and follow along...
>
>page 67, right collumn, first paragraph
>
>"The magician can provide an animal as well as a human host..."
>
>ok, says you can use a human, next sentence:
>
>"Paranatural animals are too magically powerful to be used as host, as
>are sapient beings (such as people)"
>
>umm, you can use humans but you can use people, that aplies to one of my
>biology teachers but...
>
>does this mean you can't use magically active people, or just full
>magicians, or what?
>--


Um, I guess you could use a cadaver. That would be an interesting twist.
(hmmmmm Š I'm getting an idea for our next session).

D.

David R. Lowe
Frank Harrison Perez Design
665 Chestnut Street, Suite 300
San Francisco, California 94133
415.353.5752 (Voice)
415.474.0400 (Main)
415.474.0481 (Fax)

david@******.com
http://www.fhpnet.com
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 17:14:41 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Tim Kerby <drekhead@***.NET>
Subject: Thera anyone?

Here's an interesting article...
Enjoy.

http://cnn.com/TECH/science/9805/27/italy.mystery.map/index.html

--

=================================================================
- Tim Kerby - drekhead@***.net - ICQ-UIN 2883757 -
-----------------------------------------------------------------
"Reality is the only obstacle to happiness." - Unknown
=================================================================
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 14:16:46 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Jeremy \"Bolthy\" Zimmerman"
<jeremy@***********.COM>
Subject: Re: VR 2.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

----------
> From: Phil Levis <pal@**.BROWN.EDU>
> To: SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET
> Subject: VR 2.0
> Date: Thursday, May 28, 1998 2:07 PM
>
<snip>
>
> In my opinion, Virtual Realities 2.0 is an excellent book; the rules and
> systems described are robust and detailed, and the wealth of information
> provided allows for campaigns set entirely within the Matrix, in which
> every character is a decker.
>

Hey, this sounds familiar. ;)

> One aspect of the book bothers me, however: the methods by which deckers
> obtain their programs. Either they buy them, or they write them. Writing
> them takes excessive amounts of time: the example given of a decker with
a
> computer skill of 8 (damn good) taking a base time of 128 days to write
an
> Attack-8S program. Buying them is extremely expensive: Hacker House sells
> computer programs for three million nuyen. That Attack-8S could be sold
> for 128,000 nuyen. That's a pretty amazing living, 1000 nuyen a day.
>

One thing to keep in mind that's a programmer working under the bare
minimum's for programming... what I like to think of notepad, a cheap
compiler, and a ton of coffee. If he's got a nice little programming
package... Visual Z++ or the like on a pretty nice platform, he gets a +3
task bonus. So that 128 days becomes 42 days. Divided by the number of
successes. =) 4000+ nuyen a day for drek-hot programming? I don't see a
problem with that. The problem is finding a buyer, though, I think. How
many people can afford an Attack-8S program? The one that really hurts me
is the time/money involved in a Rating 10 MPCP chip with reality filters.
;)

> Both of these systems seem at odds with one of the aspects of deckers
> which I have always thought to be important: the idea that deckers write
> their own programs on a regular basis, indeed, use their own programs
> almost exclusively.
>
> Given good programming techniques, it seems reasonable to me that one
> should be able to 'upgrade' existing programs that you own. For example,
> one might buy an Attack-6M utility from some software house, hack it for
a
> while, upgrading it to Attack-8M, use it a bit, then hack it some more to
> add DINAB capability. Eventually, the program will need an overhaul as
the
> additions begin to tax the design of the original program, but it I find
> it quite reasonable that competent deckers should be able to write
> programs which are not utterly from scratch.
>

I do believe there's upgrading rules in the book. And purchased copies
come with the source code as part of their price. Without the source, it
costs about 25% less. I think you just have to subtract one size from the
other to determine cost/time to program.
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 17:19:52 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980528142229.008305b0@****.lis.ab.ca>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 02:22 PM 5/28/98 -0600, you wrote:

<stuff snipped>

>
>><rant>
>>I whole heatedly agree. I don't know if there is some huge
>>earth-shaking concept I'm missing here but WHY IS THIS SUCH A BIG
>>PROBELM!?

Okay, so for the average person's PC, Y2K probably isn't a big deal. And
if your VCR still works, who cares if it thinks it's taping Dharma & Greg
in the year 1900? As long as it works, right?

But you have to remember what's really at stake, and that's corporate and
governmental databases and enterprises. As Adam pointed out, stuff like
your bank account, your Social Security Number (or equivalent), all sorts
of vital information is in danger. And as Adam pointed out, much of this
was written in some language or other that there is a decreasing
familiarity with (like COBOL). And what about those huge ERP systems set
up by SAP or Baan or PeopleSoft? Those are nearly custom-written code for
each friggin' installation (which is why a SAP install can take months,
even with plug-ins and modules). Those sorts of program, which run major
corporations like IBM for example, have a serious problem with Y2K. A
simple BIOS upgrade won't do a damn thing for a SAP enterprise installation.

Can you imagine if all the Western governments and the Fortune 1000 all
shut down, because their enterprises and their databases glitch up?
Serious fraggin' problem, and that's a worst-case scenario for Y2K.

Will that happen? Not likely. But I can guarantee you that there will be
some fairly significant companies and governmental agencies that screw the
pooch on Jan 1, 2000, because they didn't implement a solution of some sort
fast enough. A recent study was released stating that many Department of
Defense and similar government agencies are behind on their Y2K fixes are
in major danger of not having an adequate solution in place in time.

So I'm not worried about my own computer (and my old one is a Mac, which
doesn't have the problem anyway), but I am worried about what'll happen
when I go to the ATM for money or when I file my tax return.

Yes, the media is guilty of a bit of hype here, but it doesn't bother me.
I can stand hype if it helps get the fraggin' problem solved.

Erik J.


"Ladies & Gentleman, the newest member of the band, the one and only Spice
Boy, GRUMPY SPICE!!!" <and the crowd goes wild!!!>
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 23:29:15 +0200
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Rune Fostervoll <runefo@***.UIO.NO>
Subject: Re: Hardsuits
In-Reply-To: <8a81796.356dce22@***.com> (message from Mike Bobroff on Thu, 28
May 1998 16:50:41 EDT)

Mike wrote:
>I take it this is something from R2 ? Or something cooked up using the RBB ?"

Nope. There's no Powered Armor chassis in R2.
(I guess you knew that, huh? :)

I made a few assumptions on how I wanted it, what seemed reasonable,
with little basis in R2 except that it could be fit in with that rule system.
I probably forgot a lot of necessary variables - PF's, economy, load, etc.

Make up your own for those, it's more an idea than a finished design.

--

ADVICE, n. The smallest current coin.
-Ambrose Bierce
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 17:03:15 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Waffelmeisters <evamarie@**********.NET>
Subject: Heya Wafflemeister!!!
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

> Heya Wafflemeister!!! ('K' is the Symbol , Wed 16:32)
>
> Guy, sorry to use this forum like this, but could you send me your T-shirt
> logo idea page address again?
>
> Thanks
> =K

Just for public info:
Http://concentric.net/~evamarie/RNSHIRTB.GIF

K: It would be nice to note in the "votelink" (my HTML editor isdown, so
I uploaded just the gif) that these are NOT thumbnails of finished
images- they are crude sketches done with much poorer tools than I
intend for finished art. I'll be working on an actual "page",
especially if I can post parts of the finished work.

The FRONT will be (is currently being) hand drawn, and should be a good
bit nicer than as represented in my crude computer sketch. A copy of
the finished art would be shipped by mail to the printer, as I'm not
going to subject good art to the indignaties of scanning (besides, the
file would be quite large). I will try to have finished art ready
inside two weeks, if the "vote" can hold a bit, and definately post it
for as a "final aproval" before printing if that front design is chosen-
I know one person didn't like the "bullet holes", for example. Xerox
technology would let me add and delete things like that , and is going
to cut my work by ~50%, as the design is rotationally symetric.

The BACK, in either case, would be done in Adobe Illustrator. Once I
had the actual basic back layout done, putting in the names would
literally be a "cut and paste" job, as the computer should do all the
text formating for me (leaving me to play with fonts for several hours
and otherwise waste time for no noticable improvement- does anybody know
the standard fonts used in FASA products?). So this can be handled by
E-mail, in the space of a few hours, I'd guess. The final result can be
E-mailed as an Acrobat file, which should not be hard for whomever
handles printing to find an output for.
To do that basic layout early, it would be nice to know what text
should be included BESIDES the names / adresses. Subscription /
cancelation info (micro FAQ / help)? Info about FASA / Shadowrun?
In any case, I see the back being a one or two day job, tops.

-Mongoose X Wafflemiester
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 17:03:26 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Waffelmeisters <evamarie@**********.NET>
Subject: Re: Hijacking
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

> Re: Hijacking (Gurth , Wed 15:15)
>
> Alfredo B Alves said on 7:35/27 May 98,...
>
> > I think he was referring to group A takes plane hostage, group gets
> > everyone's attention and describes threat posed by group B if demands
> > aren't met by a certain amount of time ... to prove they are serious,
> > Group A kills the passengers (and prolly suicides afterwards) ... Group B
> > is the real threat ...
>
> That's about the only thing that makes sense... Killing all your hostages usually
> means signing your own death sentence. Commiting suidice right after means you
> won't have to bother the authorities with it ;)

Yes, that basically the situation I expected to result. No competant
crew would expect to get away after that, even if (especially if) the
threat group b was weilding was HUGE (butits specifics unknown to
them). However, on reflection, the "proof of intent" stunt usually
demonstrates your ability to carry out a larger thret (say, a SMALL gas
attack as threat of a larger one).
So the situation this would most likely occur in would be where a
[terrorist] leader had the ability to influence the minds of followers
to get them to carry out acts like this, and wanted to prove it, as a
threat. Not the best use of that abilty, maybe, but the entire Great
Ghost Dance was a similar "proof of inmtent" involving self sacrifice...

-Mongoose
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 17:36:01 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Phil Levis <pal@**.BROWN.EDU>
Subject: Re: VR 2.0
In-Reply-To: <199805282120.OAA05822@*********.cobaltgroup.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Thu, 28 May 1998, Jeremy "Bolthy" Zimmerman wrote:

> I do believe there's upgrading rules in the book. And purchased copies
> come with the source code as part of their price. Without the source, it
> costs about 25% less. I think you just have to subtract one size from the
> other to determine cost/time to program.

Yeah... these rules seem a little too simple to me. I'd think that
updgrading a program should take slightly longer. Otherwise, there's no
reason to write things from scratch, because some Restrict-10 Area DINAB
targeting program is actually just the result of a slow improvement of
that Restrict-3 you had five years ago.

Phil
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 14:40:41 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: "Jeremy \"Bolthy\" Zimmerman"
<jeremy@***********.COM>
Subject: Re: VR 2.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
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----------
> From: Phil Levis <pal@**.BROWN.EDU>
> To: SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET
> Subject: Re: VR 2.0
> Date: Thursday, May 28, 1998 2:36 PM
>
> On Thu, 28 May 1998, Jeremy "Bolthy" Zimmerman wrote:
>
> > I do believe there's upgrading rules in the book. And purchased copies
> > come with the source code as part of their price. Without the source,
it
> > costs about 25% less. I think you just have to subtract one size from
the
> > other to determine cost/time to program.
>
> Yeah... these rules seem a little too simple to me. I'd think that
> updgrading a program should take slightly longer. Otherwise, there's no
> reason to write things from scratch, because some Restrict-10 Area DINAB
> targeting program is actually just the result of a slow improvement of
> that Restrict-3 you had five years ago.
>

I'm waiting for the bad part. I'm not a big programmer or anything, but
when I do do stuff, I tend to reuse my old code in some form or another.
Yup, I'm pretty lazy. But it totally makes my job go faster. Ultimately,
it comes down to this for me: I like simple rules. It makes me happy. As
it is, it takes me way longer than I'd really like to figure out how much
it is for such-and-such. My character creation process ground to a halt
while computing costs for all the programs. The last thing I would
ultimately want is to make that process any more complicated than it
already is. =)
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 17:42:33 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Erik Jameson <erikj@****.COM>
Subject: Re: VR 2.0
In-Reply-To: <Pine.SOL.3.96.980528164517.1515A-100000@*******>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 05:07 PM 5/28/98 -0400, you wrote:

>In my opinion, Virtual Realities 2.0 is an excellent book; the rules and
>systems described are robust and detailed, and the wealth of information
>provided allows for campaigns set entirely within the Matrix, in which
>every character is a decker.

Good book, but it still confuses me for some reason. Maybe it's because
I'm math-phobic, maybe it's because I simply don't allow deckers in my
games. But parts of that and Rigger 2 leave me scratching my head. Gimme
my Grimmy or Awakening or FoF anyday!


>Both of these systems seem at odds with one of the aspects of deckers
>which I have always thought to be important: the idea that deckers write
>their own programs on a regular basis, indeed, use their own programs
>almost exclusively.

Well, what does a decker do when they're not running? Sure, they're
playing Matrix Quake 23 part of that time. And probably some eating and
sleeping in there too. But I would imagine the bulk of their time would be
spent programming. That's what they do after all.

See, I imagine the bulk of a PCs off-time to be devoted to appropriate skills.

A street sam probably lifts weights, practices martial arts and does target
practice at least 20 hours a week.

A hermetic has his head in a magic book (or on MagicNet) and that sort of
thing at least 30-40 hours a week.

A decker would be programming 30-40 hours a week.

A rigger would be tinkering with their drones and vehicles 20-30 hours a
week, probably stuff like target practice also.

That leaves plenty of time for partying and shadowrunning.

So maybe the base time is a bit high, but not grotesquely high in my
opinion. A serious kick-ass attack program (which is what an 8 is to me)
should take a few weeks to a month.

Erik J.


"Ladies & Gentleman, the newest member of the band, the one and only Spice
Boy, GRUMPY SPICE!!!" <and the crowd goes wild!!!>
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 18:11:50 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: DrakkathX@***.COM
Subject: Sniping in SR
Mime-Version: 1.0
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the goal of this message is to get feedback on the "Sniper Shot." I do not
wish to address other issues of sniping in this post.

The "Sniper Shot" as i have dubbed it would allow PC's to combine several
skills into one roll for a hit.
ex. Jon rolls firearms + 1/2 demolitions + 1/2 biotech
against Dead
guy A.
but to keep things from going sploot too fast you've got to add lots of
limitations.

Here's my idea:
>>>>>>>a 3 point edge "Sniper's Accuracy"
If the character spends 5 actions Aiming, and
nothing else, no
movement; **no combat pool for defense**;
nothing-
allow them to make the shot using firearms + 1/2
demolitions(nonliving targets) or + 1/2 biotech(living
targets)
to their skill---- with a -2 to TN.

perhaps if this is overpowered, raise cost of the edge, or impose limits on
the maximum bonus from the other skills( +2 die), or increase the number of
actions to aim(6+ spent aiming). **Maybe allow the target a perception test
to see the sniper taking aim, and give them a chance to get out of sight.**
And do the reverse if it is underpowered.

----Hanuman


"This is Solid Snake. Respond please."
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 18:19:43 +0000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Quentin Milton <taslehof@*****.INTERNETLAND.NET>
Subject: Re: [Back OnT] Rocker Archtype
In-Reply-To: <v04003a01b19304a29f65@[209.108.45.166]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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> >Anyway, back to SR, specifically SR1. Did anyone out there actually use
> >the "Rocker" archetype? Was it just me or was that the lamest possible
PC
> >to take on a shadowrun? Sure, it might work for CP2020, but Shadowrun?

Actually, I have a blind physad rocker I'm waiting to play. IMO,
it'll be a blast (especially since Barbie will be GMing ;) )

Pantherr
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 16:21:42 -0600
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: JD <germany@*****************.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
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>So I'm not worried about my own computer (and my old one is a Mac,
which
>doesn't have the problem anyway), but I am worried about what'll happen
>when I go to the ATM for money or when I file my tax return.


I read a scenerio of what would happen at this time, based on problems
not associated with Y2K bug.

Dec. 31, 1999 is a Friday, making it Payday for approximately half of
the nation. It is arguably going to be the biggest party night of this
century and everyone will be going to the bank to cash checks that they
would have normally deposited and to remove extra money from their
accounts. With the media hype about the bug, someone will start a run
on the banks because an ATM just ran out of money. Nothing is wrong
with the ATM (it being made in the "safe" years), just a normal instance
of the ATM not having as much money as the people want it to.

Bringing this back On-Topic, the riots described in New York which lead
to the arming of corporations started because of such a simple
mistake -- the people did not understand what really was going on.

My opinion is that the media is to blame. There is a POTENTIAL problem
at hand. The vast majority of mission-critical enterprises, including
Social Security are safe from theis problem. Yes, some companies will
bite the dust, but that is the American way -- keep up with the SOTA or
you fail in the big leagues.

As for the DoD stating that they may have some problems... doesn't
everyone know that the DoD has problems? Will it change them to be more
efficient or more prepared in the future? Probably not. And this is
not just some half-baked opinion. I have relatives in each branch of
the military. The DoD will just wake up after the crash and declare
that it was a training exercise for terrorist insurgency against the
countries computer framework -- just another day at the office.

Jon Doud
germany@*****************.com
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 18:37:23 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: 'K' is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Technobabel Teaser Q
Mime-Version: 1.0
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In a message dated 5/28/98 12:02:59 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
robert.watkins@******.COM writes:

> No, that's not the one I'm thinking of. The one I'm thinking of has the main
> character meet FJ in the Matrix. FJ uses a persona that is dressed in army
> fatigues, and the resolution is particularly high.
>
> Damn, why can't I remember which book it is?
>
For some reason, I don't even remember this. Is it in Technobabel, as I
haven't actually read my copy yet?
=K
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 18:48:41 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: 'K' is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Hardsuits
Mime-Version: 1.0
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In a message dated 5/28/98 7:17:11 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
runefo@***.UIO.NO writes:

> Here's my take on it.
>
> Wolf Combat Armor
>
<snipped stats and descriptions.>

Rune, I must hand it to you. That is a -very- nicely considered piece of
work. Not overwhelmingly unbalanced in any fashion, and still functional as a
measured of "development" of merging cybertech with armortech.

I saved this one, CONGRATSKIES!!!!
=K
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 18:53:09 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: 'K' is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Technobabel Teaser Q
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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In a message dated 5/28/98 11:20:45 AM US Eastern Standard Time,
bxb121@***.EDU writes:

> Arg. I know what you're talking about....the main character's chic
> had died in a bug hunt. Fastjack was a buddy of his trying to snap
> him out of it. It had to be Out of the Shadows.
>
OH WAIT!!!! I know the one now. In the remake of "Into the Shadows", which
is the compendium, there is a "newer" story that involves the Mantids in
Seattle and the guy who'se girlfriend had changed into one (been
engulfed/transformed/whatever). FJ was the one who rigged the deck the guy
was using so as to cut out BTL activity for the upper torso (a sort of induced
paraplegia). The guy had wrapped the cord around his legs however, just so he
could make certain of such things.

-K
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 17:06:07 -0600
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Mike Loseke <mike@*******.COM>
Subject: Re: Sniping in SR
In-Reply-To: <8a7d2e9.356de127@***.com> from "DrakkathX@***.COM" at May
28,
98 06:11:50 pm
Content-Type: text

Thus spake DrakkathX@***.COM:
>
> the goal of this message is to get feedback on the "Sniper Shot." I do
not
> wish to address other issues of sniping in this post.
>
> The "Sniper Shot" as i have dubbed it would allow PC's to combine several
> skills into one roll for a hit.
> ex. Jon rolls firearms + 1/2 demolitions + 1/2 biotech
> against Dead
> guy A.
> but to keep things from going sploot too fast you've got to add lots of
> limitations.
>
> Here's my idea:
> >>>>>>>a 3 point edge "Sniper's
Accuracy"
> If the character spends 5 actions Aiming, and
> nothing else, no
> movement; **no combat pool for defense**;
> nothing-
> allow them to make the shot using firearms + 1/2
> demolitions(nonliving targets) or + 1/2 biotech(living
> targets)
> to their skill---- with a -2 to TN.
>
> perhaps if this is overpowered, raise cost of the edge, or impose limits on
> the maximum bonus from the other skills( +2 die), or increase the number of
> actions to aim(6+ spent aiming). **Maybe allow the target a perception test
> to see the sniper taking aim, and give them a chance to get out of sight.**
> And do the reverse if it is underpowered.

The simple house rule we use is that the sniper gets to make his shot
with all the normal modifiers (he is, after all, just shooting at a
target, moving or not) but the target doesn't get to use any combat
pool to resist the shot, only body dice. This is only if the sniper
was stealthy enough, or the target was otherwise oblivious to him. If
the target can see and react to the sniper then it goeas to normal
combat rules.

If the sniper is worth his salt, he'll drop almost any target with
target numbers of two and probably about 16 successes. Not many people
are going to be able to keep breathing after that.

--
| Even Einstein objected to the idea of
Mike Loseke | wave-function collapse, calling it
mike@*******.com | "spooky action-at-a-distance."
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 19:04:09 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: 'K' is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: VR 2.0
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/28/98 4:09:20 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
pal@**.BROWN.EDU writes:

> One aspect of the book bothers me, however: the methods by which deckers
> obtain their programs. Either they buy them, or they write them. Writing
> them takes excessive amounts of time: the example given of a decker with a
> computer skill of 8 (damn good) taking a base time of 128 days to write an
> Attack-8S program. Buying them is extremely expensive: Hacker House sells
> computer programs for three million nuyen. That Attack-8S could be sold
> for 128,000 nuyen. That's a pretty amazing living, 1000 nuyen a day.

Yes, but considering that an Attack Program is considered Illegal just to have
in your memory (any form), that's a pretty hefty thing. And having it in
"Active memory" is even worse IIRC. so the "1,000 Nuyen" a day seems
a fair
trade to me for jail.

=K
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 19:07:13 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: 'K' is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Heya Wafflemeister!!!
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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In a message dated 5/28/98 4:32:08 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
evamarie@**********.net writes:

>
> Just for public info:
> Http://concentric.net/~evamarie/RNSHIRTB.GIF

Coolsville, thanks a bunch.

> K: It would be nice to note in the "votelink" (my HTML editor isdown,
> so
> I uploaded just the gif) that these are NOT thumbnails of finished
> images- they are crude sketches done with much poorer tools than I
> intend for finished art. I'll be working on an actual "page",
> especially if I can post parts of the finished work.

YOU just told everyone, so that works. BTW folks, the "Voting" is being done
by Tim Kerby IIRC, at least he volunteered for it. -I- don't know Java or any
other interactive HTML enough to make such neat little applets. Send one of
us via -email- or whatever Tim comes up with to let us know your choices.

=K
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 09:12:23 +1000
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Geoff Skellams <geoff.skellams@*********.COM.AU>
Subject: Re: [OT] Thelonious monster (was Re: Hijacking)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain

On Shadowrun Discussion, Erik Jameson[SMTP:erikj@****.COM] wrote:
> Anyway, back to SR, specifically SR1. Did anyone out there actually
use
> the "Rocker" archetype? Was it just me or was that the lamest
possible PC
> to take on a shadowrun? Sure, it might work for CP2020, but
Shadowrun?
>
I ran a Spanish Minotaur drummer, Toro, in a campaign out here
a few years ago. The group took turns running games, usually only one or
two sessions long. Unfortunately, no one ever did anything with the band
Toro was in, so he ended up becoming the default security expert for the
group (burned a lot of karma adding new skills and stuff).

cheers
Geoff


--
Geoff Skellams R&D - Tower Software
Email Address: geoff.skellams@*********.com.au
Homepage: http://www.towersoft.com.au/staff/geoff/
ICQ Number: 2815165

"That rates about a 9.5 on my weird-shit-o-meter"
- Will Smith in "Men in Black"
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 19:09:00 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: 'K' is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Sniping in SR
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

I admit it, I -Snipped- EVERYTHING in that post. Where on earth did the idea
of merging Demolitions and Biotech into a "Sniper Shot" ever come from? What
did I miss here?

=K
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 16:26:19 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Sean Matheis <sean@****.NET>
Subject: Re: VR 2.0
In-Reply-To: <Pine.SOL.3.96.980528164517.1515A-100000@*******> from "Phil
Levis" at May 28, 98 05:07:58 pm
MIME-Version: 1.0
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<nice exposition on VR2 deleted>

> I've been working on a rules system to allow this, but I'm wondering what
> people on the list feel should be important considerations. For example,
> when should upgrading a program be a losing proposition as opposed to
> rewriting from scratch? Which options should be the most difficult to add?
> For example, transforming a one-shot program into a full utility should be
> very difficult; the one-shot option has a tremendous amount of
> optimization and little tricks which allow it to fit in the smaller memory
> space. Additionally, if it were not difficult, software houses couldn't
> offer one-shot test programs. Upgrading a program to have an Area option
> should be much more difficult than upgrading the Area to a higher rating.

One idea is to limit the upgradability of a program based on
either its rating, or its size. Something like you cannot
upgrade a program to more than 1.5* its initial rating. That
Attack-6M can now only go to Attack-9M before it is considered
incapable of being upgraded any further. Adding options would
reduce this multiplier. I don't have VR2 w/ me, and I don't
regularly play a decker, but you should be able to get a general
idea for this. (Perhaps: 1.5* is the max, reduce by one level
for each goodie you add to it)

-Sean (dba. Fieran, Elven PhysAd)
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 21:07:50 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Paul Gettle <pgettle@********.NET>
Subject: Sick thing to do to a dead Runner.
Mime-Version: 1.0
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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

This is a rather nasty idea inspired by the dream I had last night.

What if a corporation, through a nasty mix of Leonizaton, quickened
hybernation spells, cybermantic-like rituals, and good old fasioned
cryonics, perfected the art of practical suspended animation and
revival?

This could be downright wicked in the hands of an Evil GM [tm]. Just
develop rules and background material to run SR, say in 2170.
Stagering changes can happen in a century. Just take all the off the
wall speculation about the future of SR and run with it.

There's always that "oh that wasn't the _real_ Awakening, that was
just the warm up act" plot twist. Maybe the Horrors finally did
invade. Or perhaps a family of Great Form Light Elementals used their
inherent abilities to listen in on any fiber-optic transmission (not
to mention maniupulate those very same transmissions) to pull the rug
of power out from under the megas, replacing control of the world with
a benevelent dictatorship by Free Spirit.

Then once the Evil GM is properly prepared, they just tuck away all
this nice, pre-prepared background material in the back of their
binder, and then wait for the Players to do something stupid that
would get them very nearly geeked, en-mass.

After the last Runner falls unconcious from the hail of Sec Guard
bullets, Evil GM lets them sit for a minute or two while he flips to
the back of his binder. Suddenly it's 2173, and the shadowrunners have
just been brought out of cryosleep for [insert reason/plothook here].

What do you think?

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--
-- Paul Gettle (pgettle@********.net)
PGP Fingerprint, Key ID:11455339 (RSA 1024, created 97/08/08)
625A FFF0 76DC A077 D21C 556B BB58 00AA
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 18:12:51 -0700
Reply-To: Mark Imbriaco <mark.imbriaco@*****.com>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Mark Imbriaco <mark.imbriaco@*****.COM>
Subject: [ADMIN] Y2K Bugs.
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

This topic is closed. Take it offline. If you are really interested in
the problems that corporations and government are facing in legacy systems=

there is plenty of reference material on the 'net.

-Mark
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 03:24:30 +0200
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Rune Fostervoll <runefo@***.UIO.NO>
Subject: Re: Sniping in SR
In-Reply-To: <8a7d2e9.356de127@***.com> (DrakkathX@***.COM)

*snip the '3 point 'sniper's accuracy' edge.'.

Sounds like someone saw Terminator II and took to heart the comment that
the Terminator knew human anatomy so as to be more effective at killing.

It's an interesting thought as such but not, I think, realistic.
While the skills might be relevant, they would be so for identifying proper
targets for called shots or similar, not directly enhance the combat test.


If I wanted to have 'sniper edges' I'd have it as a physad power (or possibly
edge or both) and call it 'focused aiming' or some such, giving the sniper the
ability to get 1 more aiming level (ordinary max of skill/2) per level of the
ability.

Or rapid aiming, getting 2 levels of aiming per simple action.
(Highly unbalancing, I'd think, but hey, it's a thought.).

--

ADVICE, n. The smallest current coin.
-Ambrose Bierce
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 21:43:37 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Jett <grota@*********.COM>
Subject: Re: Sniping in SR
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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> If the sniper is worth his salt, he'll drop almost any target with
> target numbers of two and probably about 16 successes. Not many people
> are going to be able to keep breathing after that.

Exactly. Jett, for example, has a crossbow skill of 7. With a
Smartlinked bow, combat pool, rangefinder, etc, she can roll 14 dice
against a very low TN. And, with dikote bolts (expensive, but worth it),
base damage of 9D means that usually, one success is enough. I've had
Jett make some OUTSTANDINGLY impossible shots with one or two KP and all
those dice, and seen other characters with similar skills with rifles,
etc do the same. IMO, additional sniper mods really aren't necessary.

--Jett
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 21:44:26 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: 'K' is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Sniping in SR
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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In a message dated 5/28/98 8:38:15 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
grota@*********.COM writes:

> Exactly. Jett, for example, has a crossbow skill of 7. With a
> Smartlinked bow, combat pool, rangefinder, etc, she can roll 14 dice
> against a very low TN. And, with dikote bolts (expensive, but worth it),
> base damage of 9D means that usually, one success is enough. I've had
> Jett make some OUTSTANDINGLY impossible shots with one or two KP and all
> those dice, and seen other characters with similar skills with rifles,
> etc do the same. IMO, additional sniper mods really aren't necessary.
>
Smartlink, shmartlink...want something *really* fucking frightening, try
conning and/or scamming Mike out of his "Smart Arrows" he's made his new
Rigger/Archer. Oh yeah, NOW we are talking some hyper-nasty crap.

Sure, they're expensive, and he's only got 4 of 'em (IIRC), but they -really-
begin to set the stage for some nasty ideas.

=K
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 21:51:36 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Grahamdrew <grahamdrew@***.NET>
Subject: Re: Mood music
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

> i was planning a game the other day when i stumbled across some old 1492
> soundtrack. The music is excellent for mood setting (mostly mystery and
> a sense of intrigue). Any one else use music to enhance RP? What music
> do ya pick?

I've got a good response from some of the lighter NiN (The Perfect
Drug:Versions was OK) as general background music, and Stabbing westward
is pretty good if you put it down low as not to disrupt
--
DISCLAIMER: All grammatical and spelling errors are inserted
deliberately to test the software I am developing. In fact,
that is the only reason I am posting. Yeah, that's the ticket!
All my postings are just test data! Yeah!!
http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Maze/1673/
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 22:10:06 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: losthalo <losthalo@********.COM>
Subject: Re: VR 2.0
In-Reply-To: <Pine.SOL.3.96.980528164517.1515A-100000@*******>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

At 05:07 PM 5/28/98 -0400, you wrote:

<<snip>>

>Both of these systems seem at odds with one of the aspects of deckers
>which I have always thought to be important: the idea that deckers write
>their own programs on a regular basis, indeed, use their own programs
>almost exclusively.

Well, that is your perception of things (and it's not invalid, just not the
only possible take on decking). Ever read Neuromancer, or Count Zero, by
Gibson? Cowboys in Gibson's world frequently make use of progs provided by
their employer or bought from fixers. One character in the novels makes a
living selling both hardware and software for the purposes of cracking
systems.

>Given good programming techniques, it seems reasonable to me that one
>should be able to 'upgrade' existing programs that you own.

Not necessarily, again. Some things, in order to get significantly better
(a rating point's worth, here) have to change their approach or even the
basis of their function. Maybe beyond a certain point, "more" of a given
approach doesn't work, you have to start over if you want to get higher
than a 5 out of your Attack-5 program design. Sometimes what you've
already designed is more a liability than a help in the next stage of
improvement.

Or to put it another way, "Usually you just lose when you sell something
back."

losthalo
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 22:31:15 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: DrakkathX@***.COM
Subject: Re: Sniping in SR
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

>>>>>>The simple house rule we use is that the sniper gets to make his
shot
with all the normal modifiers (he is, after all, just shooting at a
target, moving or not) but the target doesn't get to use any combat
pool to resist the shot, only body dice. This is only if the sniper
was stealthy enough, or the target was otherwise oblivious to him. If
the target can see and react to the sniper then it goeas to normal
combat rules.

If the sniper is worth his salt, he'll drop almost any target with
target numbers of two and probably about 16 successes. Not many people
are going to be able to keep breathing after that.

--
| Even Einstein objected to the idea of
Mike Loseke | wave-function collapse, calling it
mike@*******.com | "spooky action-at-a-distance."<<<<<<




yeah that would save time.
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 22:41:53 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: DrakkathX@***.COM
Subject: Re: Mood music
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 98-05-28 21:53:19 EDT, you write:

<< > i was planning a game the other day when i stumbled across some old 1492
> soundtrack. The music is excellent for mood setting (mostly mystery and
> a sense of intrigue). Any one else use music to enhance RP? What music
> do ya pick?
>>

mmm.... Santana, most anything off a Hypnotic label, anything that has
ambient
audio samples that sound like they could be happening in game
(ie.
gunshots, banging of doors, Lost Highway Sdtrk- Mr. Eddy's theme
#1,
whenever the music sounds like it's performing an action.)
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 22:22:17 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Machine-gun Kelly <MgkellyMP5@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Sick thing to do to a dead Runner.
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

<SNIP>

THAT'S EVIL!!!!!

I love it ;] Wish I would've thought of it when I was GM'ing ;]

Mgkelly
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 22:51:33 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: BigDaddy <bigdaddy@*****.COM>
Organization: @**** Network
Subject: Re: If I was Awake... (Was Ingentization)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
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MC23 wrote:

> SR3 or the next big book O' magic will address it if it still exists
> under 3rd edition. Steve asked the list a long time ago but he's kept his
> decision to himself so far.
just out of curiosity folks. When is the SR3 sourcebook coming out. my
BBB is way outta date and since the 2nd will be obsolete soon i decided
why bother buying it.
>
> >BTW, Gurth is there anything (about SR) you /Don't/ know? ;)
>
> At one time it was Grimoire 1st edition. I don't know if he has
> yet tracked down a copy for his collection.
>
excellent book 1st ed Grimoire! a must for all colectors!
--
Napalm Sticks to Kidz,
BigDaddy
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 22:34:20 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Mike Bobroff <Airwasp@***.COM>
Subject: Re: Sniping in SR
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
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In a message dated 5/29/98 1:53:08 AM !!!First Boot!!!, Ereskanti@***.COM
writes:

> Smartlink, shmartlink...want something *really* fucking frightening, try
> conning and/or scamming Mike out of his "Smart Arrows" he's made his new
> Rigger/Archer. Oh yeah, NOW we are talking some hyper-nasty crap.
>
> Sure, they're expensive, and he's only got 4 of 'em (IIRC), but they
-really-
>
> begin to set the stage for some nasty ideas.

I took the Small UAV Fixed Wing, which is a Body 1 drone, and made it into a
Body 0 drone instead in the shape of an arrow, and since there is no power
plant, other than my pc in question, the limit on range is as per a standard
arrow.

The guy has a strength of 10 (Muscle Aug IV) ... and so has a range of 600
meters. The speed of the arrow is 10 times the damage of the arrow (14) which
means a Speed of 140, achieved immediately after launch, and still doing arrow
damage on impact (14M).

The Accel for the drone is a 10, and my pc can make the thing come to a halt
...

As for the skill with piloting the arrows, Pilot Fixed Wing (Remote Operations
/ Arrows) ...

And the drones still have Rigger Adaption, Remote Control Interface, and
nothing else for the moment ...

As for cost ... 14,200 nuyen each ... and he has 6 of the things ... almost
gave one or two up to make some contacts ...

Though, this is still the beginning for the pc ... I have plans to add in a
Tactical Computer and Sentry Gun System onto the Bow, this way all I have to
do is pull back the arrow, and let the sentry gun system do the firing ...
which can be accomplished via a remote bow trigger my pc has in his hand.
This is only the beginning ...

Mike
=========================================================================
Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 15:03:16 +1200
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Danyel N Woods <9604801@********.AC.NZ>
Subject: Re: If I was Awake... (Was Ingentization)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

Quoth BigDaddy (1457 29-5-98 NZT):

<<SLICE>>
>just out of curiosity folks. When is the SR3 sourcebook coming out. my
>BBB is way outta date and since the 2nd will be obsolete soon i decided
>why bother buying it.

*Supposedly* it's coming out at GenCon (August??). Whether or not it
*will* come out then is another question.

>> >BTW, Gurth is there anything (about SR) you /Don't/ know? ;)

Far as I know, if it's SR and Gurth don't know it, it ain't worth
knowin'. :-)

<<SLICE praise of 1st-edition Grimmy>>

Danyel Woods
9604801@********.ac.nz
'Are you deliberately trying to drive me insane?'
'The universe is already mad. Anything else would be
redundant.'
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 23:25:49 -0400
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Paul Gettle <pgettle@********.NET>
Subject: Re: Sick thing to do to a dead Runner.
In-Reply-To: <671597ef.356e1bda@***.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

At 10:22 PM 5/28/98 -0400, Mgkelly wrote:
><SNIP>
>
>THAT'S EVIL!!!!!
>
>I love it ;] Wish I would've thought of it when I was GM'ing ;]

Thank you. I try. :)

Maybe the best thing about putting your runners on cryosleep for a
century is that it gives you the chance to incorporate some items that
are classic elements of many cyberpunk stories, that aren't normally
available in SR. Cheap, consumer-level magnetic anti-grav in the form
of flying cars. Homing Bullets. Freestanding holograms.
Replicants/Clones. Space stations and off-world colonies. Particle
and/or energy pulse weapons. The Island of California. True AI and
cyborgs. Delta grade cyber for the streetpunks and guttertrash who
can't afford "the less invasive consumer-grade 'ware" and have to get
the cheap, third-hand antiques through their street docs.

Plus, I can just imagine the look on the players' faces about 5
seconds into this, when they realize that EVERYTHING they know NO
LONGER APPLIES.
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Version: PGP for Personal Privacy 5.5.3

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--
-- Paul Gettle (pgettle@********.net)
PGP Fingerprint, Key ID:11455339 (RSA 1024, created 97/08/08)
625A FFF0 76DC A077 D21C 556B BB58 00AA
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 22:26:49 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: William Ashe <wmashe@***.NET>
Subject: Re: [Back OnT] Rocker Archtype
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

>>Anyway, back to SR, specifically SR1. Did anyone out there actually use
>>the "Rocker" archetype? Was it just me or was that the lamest possible
PC
>>to take on a shadowrun? Sure, it might work for CP2020, but Shadowrun?
>>
>
>I even thought it sucked for CP2020. We have a character in our game who
>has sort of turned into a rocker. Her budding music career has spawned a
>few adventures and has allowed me to get the Yaks involved in her life.
>Such fun.


Actually one of the girls in our game (yes there are a few who role play ...
she's married already guys) plays a rocker. Albeit she beefed up her cyber
a bit. She's actually quite a well rounded character. Also check out my
fiction site; I'm writing a story (up to Ch 6 ... someday I'll finish with
Ch 7) The main character here is a rocker too (albeit a phys ad too)

http://freeweb.pdq.net/wmashe/shadowrun.html in the "fiction" section

Regards
Bright Light
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 22:32:06 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: William Ashe <wmashe@***.NET>
Subject: Re: Sick thing to do to a dead Runner.
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

applause as another has begun the climb to Evil GM'hood

Another good one is to send them back into time, but tell them if they kill
anyone, they change history and kill themselves (works really good against
certain munchies I used to know).

Regards

Bright Light
http://freeweb.pdq.net/wmashe/shadowrun.html
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 22:42:59 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Wyrmy <elfman@*****.NET>
Subject: Re: Ingentization
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

BigDaddy Saideth:
> hmmmm id either have to go with
> a.) human decker or shaman
<snip troll sammy>
I would have to be the decker(albeit a blackmarket-of-the-rack one), or
a Mage.I love elementals("Hey anyone want to see what happens when an
earth and fire elemnental fight?what about water and Air?":^)), and I am
naturaly more scientifficly oriented that a child my age should be.And I
can actualy say all those long words .:^)
--
-W
============================
If you are a dreamer come in,
If you are a dreeamer, a wisher,
A liar, a magic jelly bean buyer,
Come In!
-What should be the motto of all internet users.
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 16:38:51 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Bandersnacth as Astral Vampires?

In the description of the Bandersnatch, it says that there is the
possibility that they are Sasquatch's infected with a variation of HMHVV
but they don't have Essence Drain ... So how about this: Since the
Sasquatch was dual-natured, when it aquires the HMHVV, the virus feeds
off astral energies instead of draining essence ... a possible effect
that this could have is that places where Bandersnatches spend
considerable amounts of time would become Voids (an lair may be level 2
or 3)

Just a theory ... what do ya think?

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 16:30:49 -0500
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Alfredo B Alves <dghost@****.COM>
Subject: Horned God (idol from Germany SB [US version]) boo boo

on p 150 it says that the followers of the Horned god Idol must roll
against a T# of 10 - New love's Charisma to resist desiring said new
love... now unless, they're supposed to go for the "ugly" ones, I think
that's supposed to be (1 or 2) + New love's charisma ...

Is there an errata for the Germany SB anywhere?

D.Ghost
(aka Pixel, Tantrum, and RuPixel)

_____________________________________________________________________
You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 22:41:22 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: William Ashe <wmashe@***.NET>
Subject: While I was gone ... Bull -> wendigo
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
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I had to drop off the list before the end of that saga. How'd that all turn
out

Regards
Bright Light
http://freeweb.pdq.net/wmashe/shadowrun.html
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 23:49:09 EDT
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: 'K' is the Symbol <Ereskanti@***.COM>
Subject: Re: If I was Awake... (Was Ingentization)
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/28/98 10:27:08 PM US Eastern Standard Time,
bigdaddy@*****.COM writes:

> > >BTW, Gurth is there anything (about SR) you /Don't/ know? ;)
> >
> > At one time it was Grimoire 1st edition. I don't know if he has
> > yet tracked down a copy for his collection.
> >
>
Gurth wants a First Ed Grimoire? Damn man, why didn't anyone tell me. IF you
are going to GenCon and I make it there as well, I'll either sell it to ya
cheap or just give my old copy...dunno which...

=K
=========================================================================
Date: Thu, 28 May 1998 20:34:20 -0700
Reply-To: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
Sender: Shadowrun Discussion <SHADOWRN@********.ITRIBE.NET>
From: Robert Nesius <nesius@******.COM>
Subject: Re: Real-Life Computing ...
In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980528142229.008305b0@****.lis.ab.ca>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

>At 16:07 28/05/98 -0400, you wrote:
>
>><rant>
>>I whole heatedly agree. I don't know if there is some huge
>>earth-shaking concept I'm missing here but WHY IS THIS SUCH A BIG
>>PROBELM!?
>

When production systems work - systems such as transaction databases -
the trend is to let the box/software doing the work to sit in the corner
of a computing room and quietly suck bits off the network. These old
software packages have been proven to operate CORRECTLY. When faced
with the risk of rolling out a new system that may have bugs when you
all ready have a system that you KNOW doesn't screw things up, people
whose data represents other people's money tend to want to let the old
stuff sit there.

So what's the problem? The problem is this stuff is old. Even if a
corporate entity resopnsible for the code is around, the programmers
who WROTE it are long gone in most cases, and that knowledge base is
usually not documented. So, y2k (that term, btw, has been trademarked
by someone :/ ) - the problem is not hard to understand. But in some
cases, it's damn hard to fix. And the systems that need to be fixed
have exacting standards - transaction databases are one example.
In otherwords, it's not the nodes (like personal computers ) that are
at risk - it's the *infrastructure.*

-Rob