From:	Rand Ratinac docwagon101@*****.com
Subject:	Red Dot Sights
Date:	Tue, 6 Jul 1999 00:25:57 -0700 (PDT)

> >How fast? About one, one and a half seconds to line up on each NEW
target? About the same amount of time as a simple action for a person
>
> Quarter to a third of a second with a very large dot, unless they
are widely (>20 degrees) spaced.

Okay - next question. How often in the kind of combat Shadowrun is
supposed to represent are your targets all that close together?

Another question - do you really think you'd be standing still while
shooting the gun, turning slightly, shooting again, turning slightly
and so on in combat? C'mon! You've been in combat yourself, right,
Kevin?

It's all very well and good to say the best sports shooters can acquire
targets and shoot that quickly. How close is sport shooting to actual
combat?

That's what I'm trying to simulate to the best of my (admittedly
limited) knowledge.

> >I suppose you could say it takes one aiming action to line up, then
you
>
> You keep saying "aiming action". Do you require that characters
with laser or iron sights take an action to aim? If so, ignore what
I'm about to say.
> So long as the target is so small and/or far away that the sights
totally cover it, at a certain point you discover that you are aiming
automatically. You wrists and elbows and eyes all work together to
make the miute adjustments that you need within a tenth of a second,
becuase a proper sight picture is ingrained into your subconcious.

Again, not happening very often. I'm not talking about standing still
with your arms out and swinging around picking off targets. You've got
to bring the gun up to your eyes so you can look through the scope,
right? Whipping around and snapping off a shot is a lot quicker than
turning, raising the gun and firing it. The aiming action is not just
representing looking through the scope, it's representing a combination
of things. Sure, if your reflexes are fast, you can do it faster, but
that's why you get more actions if you have faster reflexes.

> >it's easier and faster to follow a target than to
> lock onto a new one -
>
> Depends on the tagets size, speed, range, relative dirrection and
the consistancy of the movement.

True - ON AVERAGE it's easier to follow a target than acquire a new
one. :)

> >which it would be, IMNSHO). Dodging or being hit
> hard would shake your
>
> You can't dodge a bullet. Even the slowest of them are moving at
830 feet per second, and that is from a handgun. From pistol range,
you can't move fast enough to dodge a bullet.
> If you mean bobing and weaving to make yourself a harder target,
forget it. Find some cover. It is more effective.

*sigh* I mean dodging as in using your combat pool to "dodge", as per
the SR3 rules. This can simulate anything from throwing yourself into a
roll, to diving behind cover, to whatever.

> >Also, be warned - anyone who wants to us a scope of ANY kind in my
games from now on (thermo, low-light, magnified, red dot), must now
>
> "Scope" specifically states that it is a magnifying sight. Most red
dots don't. Hell, the new ones don't eve use a tube body. Instead,
they project a dot on a little screen of glas that is about a
centimeter on a side. Raise the firearm to a proper firing position
for iron sights, and if you have any experince (say, Firearms 2), it
lines up instantly. Squeeze the trigger. Recover. Repeat.

I'm sure. I can do that myself...with arcade games. :) But nothing in
Shadowrun says that your average shot is a well-aimed shot. That's what
the aiming action is for. Cinematic, yes, but that's the game for you.
By scope, I mean any weapon mounted sight which you have to raise to
your eyes and look through to use. THAT'S what takes extra time, IMO.
That's simulated by requiring an aiming action before use. It makes you
take the extra time if you want to look through the sight, but you also
get the standard aiming advantages, which represents you taking extra
time over the shot.

Maybe not exactly realistic, but I think it's balanced.

*"I don't have TIME for this, damn it!"*
==Doc'
(aka Mr. Freaky Big, Super-Dynamic Troll of Tomorrow)

.sig Sauer
_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @*****.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com