| From: | NightRain nightrain@***.com.au |
|---|---|
| Subject: | Shadowrun and Butality (WAS: Getting nasty to your PCs) |
| Date: | Wed, 1 Sep 1999 13:08:26 +1000 |
From: Cybertroll <cybertroll@******.crosswinds.net>
To: The ShadowRN Mailing List <shadowrn@*********.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 01, 1999 12:29 PM
Subject: Shadowrun and Butality (WAS: Getting nasty to your PCs)
> Ok since I started that subject with my example I think I have to make a
> few comments here....
>
> First of all, RPG games (and especially SR which is a violent game) are
> supposed to be played by mature people. I never agreed with the 10 years
> old and up rule in most of RPG game books. RPG games deal a lot with
> death and brutality. Especially SR which is a darker version of our
Wrong. RPG games _can_ deal alot with death and brutaility. They don't
have to. I played lots of RPG's when I was younger and I didn't give two
hoots about 'darkness' and 'brutality'. I didn't care about my characters
history. I just wanted to roll 18's for my stats and have a good old
dungeon romp. I didn't get into the reality of such a situation or explore
the effects of my actions upon the poor surviving kobolds.
I just had some simple fun. And there was nothing at all wrong with it.
If that's how people want to play, be they 10 years old or 60. There is no
age limit.
You can say that there is an age limit on some of the themes that can and
should be explored, but that is an element of the players and gamemasters,
not the game itself.
> world. Look at the characters we are playing. We are not heroes. We are
> criminals. In the last session my Troll character actually killed 15
> Aztlan soldiers in no time. Even if I am fighting against Aztlan
> opression in Amazonia (that's our campaign) which is somekind of a noble
> cause, I still had to murder 15 innocent soldiers who had no idea about
> what's going on. I didn't kill monsters, I killed human beings.
Yep. And when you're young it has about the same impact as Bruce Willis
killing heaps of terrorists in Die Hard. Fun to watch, and no bearing on
reality whatsoever. There don't have to be themes explored.
Hell, I explore them with my games, but other don't. More luck to them.
> In the world of Shadowrun there is no such thing as censorship in the
> scenes described. It's a world full of criminality and filth. People are
I don't agree. How many times have you read a full scene in any Shadowrun
material that involved a full on rape scene or a sex scene. Jak Koke came
close in his first novel, but it didn't go all the way. It was scensored
because if it went too far into anything like that, it would drive people
away. Maybe even stop the author from writing it if he is uncomfortable
with it.
> raised in the gutter. Runners are people that tried to escaped from the
> gutter by enforcing the law of the jungle. The mighty will survive. When
> one walks in the streets of Seattle, he will see crimes happening all
> the time. Murders, robberies, rapes... he will see people wasted by
> drugs... he will see people leaving next to the garbage just because
> they are homeless... reminds you of something? At least where I live in
> Athens (Greece) seeing people dying from drugs in the subways is not a
> very rare sight. Why try to cover those scenes?
Because some people don't want angst. They want a good old action packed
romp. Who knows what they want, but the world that exists has to allow
people to play however they want. There is nothing stopping people playing
and exploring the drugs, and rape. But there shouldn't be stuff stopping
people from having a good time either, if it's not their cup of tea.
> I don't understand why some people are against describing rape scenes
> in an RPG game. Aren't these things happen in real life? If the group is
> mature enough to handle it (at least 18 and over) then why try to avoid
> such things?
For the same reason that people don't talk about rape IRL. They are
uncomfortable with it.
> I am not sick, nor do I enjoy rapes or murders. And I still insist on
> the fact that RPG is only a game. But as a GM I try to make my players
> feel like they are living in such a dark world (which is not much
> different than the one we are living now anyway). And the most important
More luck to you. But your bracketed comment brings to mind exactly what I
am trying to say. People play RPG's sometimes, because it is an escape
from the real world.
> thing is, that I try to make them feel really what crime and brutality
> is. To get a small taste of real world. Cause heroes and noble causes
> maybe true in our world, but most of the times, are achieved through
> many dirty acts, especially in a battle or war. Let's face it, our
> characters are not saints. They are criminals. My troll is a criminal.
> Your mage is a criminal. Your rigger, decker, whatever is a criminal. If
> u don't feel confortable, better stop playing this game to protect
> yourself. SR can damage your soul more than you can imagine, if you
> cannot handle violence.
Yep. Exactly, so why play with stuff that will harm you, if you can just
not play with it and still have a good time?
People don't have to be super mature in character role players to role
play.
> Cybertroll
>
> PS: this rant doesn't apply only to Shadowrun actually. It is almost for
> all RPG games. And as I said RPG games require a certain maturity to be
> played. If u lack such maturity and understanding of our world, leave
> RPGs alone for your own good. And if someone asks me if RPG games are
> dangerous, I will reply to him: "Yes they are if a player doesn't have
> the maturity to ditinguish reality from fantasy".
Exactly right. So again, why should people play RP things that are
dangerous or uncomfortable or whatever. They can if they can handle it or
want to handle it, but if they don't, you don't have the right to say they
should or that they should not play otherwise.
NightRain.
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