| From: | Augustus shadowrun@********.net |
|---|---|
| Subject: | Source Vs. Rule (was... MM on SOTA somesuchcrap) |
| Date: | Mon, 30 Oct 2000 22:54:17 -0800 |
From: NeoJudas <neojudas@******************.com>
>
>
> Not the back, the front.
You are refering to the history and brief overview... the actual sourcebook
for Seattle starts on page 313.
> Okay, now for the counter-argument.
>
> Those of us who started in First Edition had to use our imaginations.
Hmm... maybe you were living in a small town or something... in the first 7
months that SR1 was out there was 6 or 7 items released.
> We didn't have the internet (except for those of us who could gain
> email/newsboard access from University level stuff... which is where I
first
> encountered Lester Ward/Wordman now that I think about it).
Yep, I was there back then... I know just how it was. The internet has come
a long way since then... maybe if people today knew what it was like back
then, they'd have a greater appreciation for it today.
>
But I *DO* know that the
> development of SR3 is happening at almost exactly, verbatim to the
calendar
> dates of release, that happened in First Edition as well.
Nah... for SR3 the stuff is coming out at a snail's pace... SR3 is over 2
years old now... but if we look at the first 2œ years of SR3 development we
get this (I say 2œ years to take into account Rigger 3 and Tale of the Comet
should be out by then)
So for Shadowrun 3 we have:
Adventures in first 2œ years: 4
Sourcebooks in first 2œ years: 10
(This counts the main rulebook only once... not taking into
account
that there was both a hard and softcover edition. It
also counts
the "quickstart" book too)
And for Shadowrun 1 we had:
Adventures in first 2œ years: 10
Sourcebooks in first 2œ years: 15
>
> I can also tell you this.
>
> Anyone who is first coming into Shadowrun, 3RD Edition has a significant
> advantage over the rest of us. Can you figure out what it is yet???
>
> You have *US*. You have the Veterans to draw upon. We (again, speaking
> collectively) fell into a state of infatuation/love with the game.many
years
> and far more confusedly than the beginning player of the game has to go
> through now. You the Newbie (YTN) get the ability to ask the rest of us
> questions.
You know... when I first read this I had a flashback to about 2 months ago
in the IRC channel #shadowrun... this new guy came in and was asking about
some stuff cuz he wanted to play an adept and needed rules clarifications.
Anyhow eventually the topic of weapon came up and the whole channel pretty
much jumped all over the guy because he wouldn't take a magical dikote
coated katana as his weapon focus.
And I mean they really jumped all over him... For a bunch of people who
seem so proud of how they aren't munchkin, they really should stop and think
about it for a second (and yes, in the channel it was actually the regulars
that were hounding this guy into taking the weapon)
But anyhow... your point... the internet...
Firstly, you are assuming that everybody who plays shadowrun is on the
internet talking in here, the dumpshock forums and on the IRC channel... if
that was the case this list would be a hell of alot busier than it is...
that or if this is all the players Fasa better do something fast to drum up
more players.
But aside from that smart-ass comeback there are 2 points here I can make:
1) Why should players feel a need to come to the internet for help? Yes the
net is here... yes its big and covers alot of stuff... its great for sharing
ideas... but you shouldn't utterly feel compelled to log in to better enjoy
your game.
And the net is slow, to a degree... if I come in here and ask a question
about something from the old books... its a crap shoot if I get an answer...
let alone a correct answer. And even if I get an answer, it might come in
2 or 3 days later (I started playing shadowrun in 1989, I got all the
books... I still ask questions... and alot of them don't get answered in
here at all)
2) This one is hard to say delicatly enough... but oh well... so I'll just
say it outright... there is alot of really shitty politics going around the
online shadowrun community.
Obviously I can't go in to details since it would just get me kicked off
this list, banned from #shadowrun and probably unable to do anything in the
dumpshock forums... so I'll just leave this as enough and with a wink say
"you all know what I mean"
So no... the online community isn't a great one... there are lots of
resources and things to read... but again... downloading maps and info
doesn't earn any money for Fasa... and thats kinda the original thought
behind this whole conversation... Fasa wants to put out more sourcebooks and
make more money.... so that they can continue to put out more sourcebooks in
the future and make more money in the future...
> . And as such, he
answered those
> questions as any GM might do so in their own game as well.
>
> He made a GM Call.
Some GMs can do this... some can't. Its one of the skills that make up a
great GM.
But the problem with your answer there is... you are thinking only about
you... you are assuming everybody is like you... you are not the be all and
end all of Shadowrun GMs. Try to remember, there are novice GMs out
there... sure they might be too far below you for you to consider, but they
are the future of the game.
> If *I*, as a GM, can't find anything in one of the books about somewhere
in
> the World of Shadowrun-3, I go looking. Maybe I'm too lazy to look even..
> at that point I do what I've been doing now for 11 years or so.
This is like like good GMing... some can do it... some can't. To some,
trying to think of the whole world and all its NPCs it just too daunting a
task... they want it all spelled out...
For others they'd like something to tie it all together...
For some of the remaining few... they want something that will have some
semblance of cohesion and consistancy.
For myself... I play in my own shadowrun universe... I have things in it
that some might scoff at... lots of stuff that everybody will recognize...
but I just had my own specific wants and desires in the way of a game
world... and so I had to come up with my own setting.
But... that doesn't mean that everybody can do that... my world is well
layed out, lots of detail and the 4 sourcebooks I have total about 460
pages... but I had plenty of time to write it, and I have a great
imagination. Time and imagination isn't something everybody has to the same
degrees.
> I also have paid some very close attention to the books that have come out
> since the release of SR3. I have noted the sheer volume of "fluff" and
> "filler" that is in those books. What, you mean you have to have it
spelled
> out for you? You have to see the conflicts that are brewing on the Second
> Tier megacorporations that threaten the balance of power one of the megas
> has established for itself???
?
I can't see how you totally veered this off to another tangent... the point
here wasn't about how much people needed spelled out for them... if thats
the impression you got then go back and reread the previous posts.
The point was... some people want a new and updated sourcebook covering all
of North America.
Their 2 main points for why this should happen:
-Almost all the books are out of print and expensive on eBay
-Most of the info on North America is from 2050-2052, the current
timeline is 2061-2062.
And then there are some people who don't want a new sourcebook updating and
covering North America (You being the most vocal thus far)
Your 2 main points for why this shouldn't happen:
-People should make up the world on their own.
-People should just log into the net and ask old timers questions
about the
world.
So... I think we'll just leave it at that.
Augustus
